Wife's affair is still "strong".

[nap]

My wife and I have been married for 20 years. It hasn't been a bed of roses but then again what marriage is...you are led to believe that every relationship has its problems. I've always believed in the vows of marriage and have tried very hard to lead a clean life, respect my wife and avoid the many pitfuls that can damage marriages.

 

We've always had fights over money, going-out solo, child rearing values, etc. Maybe I'm too-fashioned but when my wife wants to go out with friends to singles night clubs, I got very annoyed with that and insisted on several occassions that she should not go - she went anyway. This was a sample of the issues we fought over. I learned to tolerate her ways and wishes and essentially became more tolerable - although never quite comfortable with it all. For the benefit of saving the marriage and providing a stable home for the kids - I made it tolerable.

 

In January this year, my "content" life came crashing down when my wife admitted to a sexual affair some 10 years ago. I know it was quite some time ago and a lot of water has gone under the bridge but as hard as I try, a big empty void still exists. I can' forget about it. I remember that time in our life and all the things that I was doing for the family and its future and I just feel so betrayed by it all. Photos, projects, trips away, family get-togethers all bring back memories of that time and betrayal of trust. I can't trust her anymore - I'm very negative and bitter. I don't believe she loves me, I don't believe she wants to. I'm trying to forgive and forget but I'm losing - my emotions fall back to the same level as they were when my wife told me about the affair. A TV program or article or friend's experience brings back all the thoughts of the betrayal. I'm not sure if I'll ever forget - it may never happen. If only I could flick a switch to forget it.

 

Maybe our love was never strong enough to withstand an impact like this. I'm eating myself alive with what to do. My wife claims it was all an accident but yet she admits it wasn't spur of the moment - it happened over several weeks and the only reason she told me (after 10 years) was because she owed it to me to know the truth. She tells me that she still wants the marriage to work and I'm desperately looking for signs that tells me she wants to make it work - I have difficulty seeing them. Signs that she is remorseful for what she did. Signs that she respects me and the marriage. I don't see these signs. She still goes on those night out to singles clubs and other "tempting" places.

 

How to get my mind right on this major point in my life? I don't know what to do. I feel that if I forget now it will always come back to haunt me and I'll be back to where I started. I've tried to it forget over the 11 months but it hasn't worked. It may have happened a long time ago but to me it seems like yesterday. I'm going round the bend. My gut tells me that the only way forward is to move on our seperate ways. Please, your feedback I'm sure will help.

[truckee]

Hello,

 

I am very sorry for your pain. Based on your message it sounds like there apparently were not any consequences to your wife's actions. She told you that she had a sexaul affair years ago and she continues to go out to singles bars.

This is known as being a cakewoman or cakeman. In short, your wife enjoys acting as if she is single and coming home to the materialistic benefits of a marriage. What are you getting out of it? If you do not have children then think long and hard why you would want to spend the rest of your life with someone who seems to have very little respect for you or your marriage? Imagine yourself in the future with someone who loves, respects and enjoys your company. Can this be your wife or is it totally unthinkable. If it is unthinkable then it is time to move on and do not allow yourself to be a doormat. Your wife sounds like she is emotionally abusing you by going to meat markets and leaving you at home. If you don't respect yourself then nobody else will. If you are both into rebuilding your marriage and going to counseling then this is something to consider. If she refuses and continues to go to singles bars then it is time to see lawyer. You are alive on this planet for a very short time. Do not waste it on someone who does not love or appreciate you. I wish you luck.

[mjk]

I'd hate to be the first one to say it, or cast judgement, but i think your wife is out "shopping" and it seems like it's just a matter of time before she finds something that is a "perfect" fit.

[reservoirdog1]

I'm with the previous two posters. As the cheater, your wife's obligation -- if she has any interest in saving the marriage -- is to completely cease all behaviour that understandably gives you a cause for concern. Going to singles events is pretty blatant -- she's all but throwing her thoughts of future infidelity in your face.

 

Of course, you have some work to do as well -- if you want to save the marriage, you need to focus on that and do what you can to make her "fall in love with you again". You want to create an atmosphere in which she -- or, at least, any reasonable person -- would not stray or do things that suggest she's trolling.

 

But you don't have to go it alone: as long as you are making an effort, and some positive changes are resulting, then you have every right in the world to demand that she stop going to singles clubs, etc. It's all about respect and compromise. You don't have to move heaven and earth in the hopes that she might deign fit to come down off her perch and act like a faithful spouse; the efforts must be simultaneous, by both parties. And if she won't at least show you that basic level of respect, then you may just have to kick her sorry ass to the curb. You don't deserve to be sh*t on like that. Remember, SHE's in debt to YOU -- not the other way around. Never forget that.

[TMCM]

Consider calmly, quietly and respectfully informing her that her present behavior of going out with friends to singles nights clubs does NOT show that she is truly serious about working on the marriage, and that while you can't stop her from continuing said behavior, you will reach a point where you WILL finally move on without her. This is not an ultimatum but a statement of fact, and one which, at her own risk, she can chose to either accept or ignore.

 

In the meantime please consider avoiding the following 'love busters' (Dr Willard Harley from his book 'Love Busters'):

 

1. Angry Outbursts - Who wants to live with a ticking timbe bomb?

2. Selfish Demands - Who wants to live with a dictator?

3. Disrespectful Judgements - Who wants to live with a critic?

 

And Michelle Weiner Davis's divorce busting 180 degree list:

 

1. Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or

implore.

2. No frequent phone calls.

3. Do not point out good points in marriage.

4. Do not follow her around the house.

5. Do not encourage talk about the future.

6. Do not ask for help from family members.

7. Do not ask for reassurances.

8. Do not buy gifts.

9. Do not schedule dates together.

10. Do not spy on spouse.

11. Do not say "I Love You".

12. Act as if you are moving on with your life.

13. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive.

14. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get busy, do things, go to church, go out with friends, etc.

15. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation) be scarce or short on words.

16. If you are in the habit of asking your spouse her whereabouts, ASK NOTHING.

17. You need to make your partner think that you have had an awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you are going to move on with your life, with or without your spouse.

18. Do not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull back and wait to see if spouse notices and, more important, realize what she will be missing

19. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment. Show her someone she would want to be around.

20. All questions about marriage should be put on

hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may be a while).

21. Never lose your cool.

22. Don't be overly enthusiiastic.

23. Do not argue about how she feels (it only makes their feelings stronger).

24. Be patient

25. Listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you.

26. Learn to back off, shut up and walk away when you want to speak out.

27. Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil).

28. Be strong and confident and learn to speak softly.

29. Know that if you can do 180, your smallest

CONSISTENT actions will be noticed much more than any words you can say or write.

30. Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you are hurting more than ever and are desperate and needy.

31. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse.

32. Do not believe any of what you hear and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives because she is hurting and scared.

33. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel.

34. Do not backslide from your hardearned changes.

 

These can help you become an attractive person by showing her that you do not need her in order to be a happy person.

[JustBeinBlonde]

Buddy,

 

The last post gave some excellent advice. I completely agree that you should get busy with things you enjoy doing. Enjoy today, it is all we have, that is why its called the "present." What happened 10 years ago is but a memory.

 

When she wants to go out with her friends tell her its OK, because you've made plans of your own. Tell her not to wait up because your'e not sure what time you'll be in. Go out, even if you just go to a movie, the bookstore or the 24 hr walmart. Take this time to consider what you really want out of life.

 

Sounds like your wife has it made, she has her "stay at home Mr." then her "have fun Mr-ess." Make it a rule, everytime she goes out you go out. Just smile and do it!

 

Hugs and Gentle Breezes - Blonde

[nap]

Thanks guys for the feedback.

 

Its amazing how something like this really kicks you the guts. I always thought of myself as a "mentally tough" individual. I'm also a one woman man - I'm no angel - but I respect the decent life and try to do things that will let me sleep at night - many believe I'm too boring - too clean. I always wondered that if ever I "relented" to temptation (I'm a businessman who undertakes regular interstate & os trips) how could I live with myself - I'd have to admit it straight away to my wife and then accept the consequences. I haven't done a thing - much to the disgust of my more "macho" work colleagues, whose antics would be enough for 100s of divorces - and yet they are still going strong.

Yet my wife had the affair 10 years ago - in hindsight made no real changes to her respect towards me and the marriage - in fact went out more often, spent more, became more independent, etc, etc. I also blame myself in this - maybe I should have been more insistent, firmer, demanding that she change her ways. At the end I gave in, I got tied fighting, I started to reason that I was married to an adult and as an adult she should be responsible and I must trust her unconditionally - she is not a kid and I'm not her father - as she would remind me in the early days of my constant demands not to go out too often. As I should have known, my gut was right. Did I do something wrong? If I did, what was it? I didn't drink, I didn't go out "with the boys", I didn't flirt, I was always at home (unless on a business trip), I phoned if I was going to be late, I insisted that the kids have a parent at home ( I got ignored on this one too), I respected her parents, I tried, I tried, I tried and I tried. And this whole thing is eating me. Why? She says that it wasn't wasn't cheating - a planned, multi meeting and a 69 er at a booked caravan is not an affair? She says it wasn't sex? She says that I should forgive her. Easier said than done. She says that I'm mad for preparing to "give everything away". She said that she regrets that she ever did it. I might be able to forgive ( I do feel for her) but as hard as I try I doubt if I'd be able to forget.

 

Why admit to it after 10 years? Interesting question. Well approx 5 years ago she picked up a bad rash of sorts and this got her really worried and her mind went into overload thinking that she had picked AIDs or something similar. At the same time - but she made sure that I could not link it to the AIDS scare - she admitted that she had an affair BUT and big BUT - she said that it was only a kiss of the lips and thats it - "swear on my kids" type of convincing. Back then this was a huge killer to me - how dare my wife kiss another guy BUT, once again, the good samaratian, concerned about his kids, I kept at it with the hope that it would all be forgotten and we could get on with our life. Then the blow I get in January 2003 - that it was a planned, meet a few times and have a 69er...and that is her story - which I'm not prepared to believe - it could be worse - I'm only getting bits - and I'm getting older, more tolerant and less sensitive. One thing I'm learning is that if you accept these things and live with them you become more tolerant and less sensitive - a good thing?- not likely and a bad example to my kids.

I'm stuffed as what to do. Do I love her? Not sure know? What about the kids? As a traditionalist believer in the family system this is the part that hurts me the most and giving me the most grief in my final decision. How will this affect my kids?

 

Sorry to spill my guts again - but I need help.

[SoleMate]

Hey nap -

 

First point - don't search your behavior for "reasons" why your wife cheated. The motivation is much more likely to be found in her head than in your behavior.

 

I must trust her unconditionally

 

Why? Trust is earned. She had your trust once - then she did things that caused you not to trust her. I agree with other posters that she must meet you halfway+ in rebuilding the trust that was between you. A counselor can help the two of you set up livable ground rules, which certainly should include an end to her singles bar visits. As a possible compromise, the two of you might start clubbing on a couples basis, perhaps with friends. That way, she can have her evenings out, but she's having her fun with you in a way that doesn't cause you to wonder what's going on.

 

I insisted that the kids have a parent at home

 

You mean 24 hours? I hope not, because it means that the two of you would never go out as a couple. How about getting the in-laws to enjoy some grandkid time while the two of you go out and have FUN. Fun is essential to a happy marriage. See <URL removed>

 

I haven't [cheated in the slightest] - much to the disgust of my more "macho" work colleagues, whose antics would be enough for 100s of divorces - and yet they are still going strong.

 

Well, we're all individuals. I actually think the faithful guys are the manliest. They are adults - not little boys grabbing candy off the counter while Mommy's not looking (many of them scared to death that Mommy will see and they will get swatted). And you really can't know what's going on in other people's heads or marriages. I wouldn't waste my time on this line of thinking if I were you.

 

One thing I'm learning is that if you accept these things and live with them you become more tolerant and less sensitive...

 

I don't think you can accept "these things" without making changes in your marriage. This is really hurting you, and you don't deserve a life filled with anger and distrust, which prevent real intimacy and love.

 

I might be able to forgive ( I do feel for her) but as hard as I try I doubt if I'd be able to forget.

 

Well, nobody ever truly forgets. But you can get to a point where it just doesn't stab at you anymore - perhaps just a dull twinge now and then.

[figuringitout]

Nap -

 

The one thing that strikes me in all of this is your wife's somewhat smug attitude about it. I get the sense from your writings that she feels like "hey dude, it was ten years ago...get over it...and quit giving me crap about it...after all, I admitted to it."

 

You are absolutely entitled to be POed. 10 yrs...1 yr...whatever the time it sucks. I also infer from your writings that you may not have been very comfortable with her going out to singles events because this very thing could happen. Now, you have confirmation that your fears were on base for all of those years. Plus, she still puts herself in those situations (looking for opportunities ?).

 

The rash thing five years ago is a little strange too. Do you know what her GYN said it was? I don't want to dump more on you, but that sure seems suspicious. Think about other situations that could have happened. Could it be easiest to admit to one 10 years ago to test the waters?

 

This is all inference from your posting. However, a good test is to set your boundaries and stick to them. If she won't respect your grounds for moving forward, you should consider TMCM's advice...even if the event 10 years ago was the only time.