REACTANT! OUR LDR FRIEND!! Start a new thread and we will follow you!

[Sparkling]

Just tell us where to go to follow your topic! You still needed us, and we are still here to help you LDR!!!! Be sure to read where you left off so you know what is happening. We look forward to your updates on your LDR with your gf.

 

We are here to help you with your LDR...always!

 

Sparkling

[Sadgati]

Just tell us where to go to follow your topic! You still needed us, and we are still here to help you LDR!!!! Be sure to read where you left off so you know what is happening. We look forward to your updates on your LDR with your gf.

 

We are here to help you with your LDR...always!

 

Sparkling

 

 

I agree! We are here for you. It was disrespectful to him how that worked out, especially considering the source.

 

How is your LDR going sparkling? They want you to discuss LDR, but LDR between your gf AND how it works out in the family together doesn't seem to count, and he was dealing LDR with both of them...even though he was SHARING HIS EXPERIENCES...which is what LDR also states up there you are to be able to discuss. "Share your experiences and questions here." .... along with the effect it had with his relationship with his gf LDR.....

 

So, we are to discuss LDR, and I read someone asking you if you were LDR and you said yes...so

 

How are you doing in your LDR? Are there any experiences you want to share about your LDR while we wait for Reactant? Do you have any problems?

 

I will SHARE MY EXPERIENCE....!! Mine is frustrating while he is away at school, and I get lonely sometimes. I read on here so many people getting all insecure about LDRS, and bottom line is he will cheat or he won't and there really won't be much you can do to stop it or prevent it if he decides to or decides not to cheat. You have no control over what they do when they aren't with you. You can't put a guard on them 24/7. If you did, what kind of relationship would that be locking them up in a box?

 

I think most often people get insecure when their SO stops showing you their love or they change their behaviour to you or act evasive. I know my guy loves me and he misses me a lot so I don't worry about that.

 

Reactant, come back soon! Our hearts are with you in your troubled LDR with YOUR GF and YOUR FAMILY...the triangle.

[Rollercoasterr]

Reactants thread really needs to go in the Family section.

 

So perhaps you can look for him there.

[Karena]

Just tell us where to go to follow your topic! You still needed us, and we are still here to help you LDR!!!! Be sure to read where you left off so you know what is happening. We look forward to your updates on your LDR with your gf.

 

We are here to help you with your LDR...always!

 

Sparkling

 

I hope the boy returns. He was treated poorly. He asked for help and should be able to get it...the help he asked for, not someone with control issues. Imagine ignoring the issues he asked help about or his needs to make them into her own! Someone wasn't reading carefully because they sure missed it. Why would they allow someone to go into a thread and cuss out at a whole group of posters because they listened to the OP's needs instead of hers? Especially since he was happy with the "thorougnesss" of the advice.

 

That other person just lurked around and picked at everyone about quotes. ..

even  picked on the quotes used which are a legitimate tool used in here.

like this one were complained about.. Not one bit of helpful advice was ever given to Reactant, just nit-picking.

 

You have an LDR Sparkling and Sadgati? How do you cope with it? Do you have any suggestions?

 

Sadgati, you are a wise girl! I will "share some of my experiences" with LDR too. Years ago my man was in the war. It took months to get any letters from him or to him from me. We called it snail mail. I still have those letters and I treasure them. In this day and age you hear these LDR posters complain, yet even with their impatience they have instant text messages and internet in most cases. If you love someone, focus on the homecoming when they can be in your arms. We once sent him candy bars among other things in a package. They were rancid by the time he received them four months later. You had to learn how to pack things and choose things with more care.

 

A lot of LDR posters today might eventually have to delete the text messages to make room for more, but I will always have those letters and words of love to treasure...snail mail. Sometimes distance isn't as difficult as you make it. It provides treasured memories.

Edited January 21, 2010 by Karena

[Reactant]

Why did they close the thread?

I'm very sorry for late responses. Med school started fast and I dont understand and remember things as quick as majority of my classmates. I 'm also physiology TA this semester, but I quit the position recently because I found myself having no time to breathe.

 

I did come last week and wrote below, little by litte. I didn’t paste it because I wanted to give myself time to read it over, digest it before sending it. I should have posted it when I wrote it.

 

 

"then she says your brother can make his own choice AFTER she made her opinion and position very clear about wanting him to distance himself from R."

>>>Yup, it was decided a long time ago to that my brother will try to distant himself. The last thing they would want is him to go back, feel guilty and get regrets. Its so much easier to ignore for them.

 

 

"Question: Have you considered when you ask your brother some question to taunt him a little bit and tell him now, before you answer you better go ask mom to see what she wants you to say? Because clearly, he can't form his own opinions unless he gets mama's ok?"

That is pretty funny. I have noted it down on my notebook. thank u.

 

"What reasons does she give for turning her back on a girl in a coma to use as an excuse for your brother not to see her?"

>>>She doesnt. She made a few pauses but got really angry when i asked her these questions. She began asking me questions about how it wasnt my business (she knows it is my business). Later on the conversation became more of her shouting. after getting very angry she handed the phone to my brother.

 

"Question: Did you tell your mom her attitude toward a girl who is sick SHAMES YOU? You can't feel proud of her? You are shamed of your brother?"

I dont remember saying the word shame but i think i said something along those lines, tihs is before she began shouting nonstop

 

"Suggestions: Tell your mom how bad this makes her look, and how it shows you everything she says to you about how nice Indians are and how they help the fallen, and how good they treat people are lies. Yes, use the word lies! "

Thank you. i've added this to my list.

 

"Question: You said she wants your brother to distance himself away from R. What reasons does she give you for that? What does she say to your brother regarding this?"

>>My mom is questioning even if R is sick. My mom says she hasnt seen any photos or any proof. Just letters from R's mother. I got realyl angry about this. I replied asking our relatives in india should give us copies of marriage certificates when they get married cuz all we hear are words on the telephone. She didnt like this and told me i cant make that comparison because (translated) 'we hardly know R's family." I asked her why believe anything someone tells you. i dont remember what her reply was at that ppint

 

"Question: So, your brother has been ordered to keep his distance from R?

What is his response?"

I dont know the details, i wasnt there when this decision was made. I dont know if after he broke up with her that he told them this or if they instructed him this. Either case they are all in agreement to distance

 

"Question: Have you also been ordered to keep your distance from R and her family? "

>>>Yes, many many times.

 

"Question: What does your dad do? Does he just agree with whatever your mom or is he just a silent figure quoting what she has already said?"

>>In the past my dad would get very angry and say things that didnt make much sense because he was so angry. He wouldnt listen what you were saying. But the last time i was back home i noticed a transition in him in that hes a lot more calmer. He's the most calm person in the house when we have a fights usually. I think he's doing this because of his high blood pressure. Anyway, when he got on the phone he was mainly telling me to stop thinking about random drama issues and to focus on school. I told him he has a point that school is priority but that i was doing this because i love my brother and my 'older sister.' That if he made this decision and she eventually passes away how can he live with himself. That ther are no 2nd chances. My dad isnt the best listener and kept repeating his view point that i should stop fighting and start studying. Of course he has the view that my family should stay as far as possible from R's family.

 

"Did your brother get on the phone later and start yelling at you too or was it your mom or dad or all of them?"

>>>My brother got angry that i'm getting my parents angry and told me to focus on my school and not this.

 

 

"Question: Did your parents know he intended to marry R?"

>>>Although my dad forgot, they remember their son speaking about it.

 

"Question: Your brother keeps saying things such as it doesn't concern you...or it is none of your business? How does he justify that when he sticks his nose into YOUR personal business?"

>>>I think i mentioned this before.

 

"Suggestion: Are you able to mock your brother? Make fun of him for hanging onto your mom's apron strings? Having to do everything mama tells him? He is VERY prideful and narcissistic, several of us have noticed, which is why we keep saying to hit him in his pride. That is why he is planning to marry brown...PRIDE. So, keep hitting him in his pride?"

>>>he does mock me by speakign in a higher pitch tone and saying stuff like "i'm so self rightous, you shouldnt do that, and u shouldnt do that, and i've got truth on my side" then break out of 'character' and would say something like 'you think your suddenyl a saint?" I never like to mock people this way. I can and its not hard to poke fun at them but i feel i'd be going down to his level. I feel its playing dirty, and i dont like being dirty.

 

"Did you ask your brother why he wouldn't want to see R or did he say?"

>>>I cant remember.

[Reactant]

Just tell us where to go to follow your topic! You still needed us, and we are still here to help you LDR!!!! Be sure to read where you left off so you know what is happening. We look forward to your updates on your LDR with your gf.

 

We are here to help you with your LDR...always!

 

Sparkling

 

I am touched you guys cared so much that you made another thread for me. Thank you so much. Sadgati brought up a point that didnt grace my mind, all of you have visited the Long distance relationship thread for a reason. Each of you have a loved one far away. You read my plea for help and answered to my cry. I dont know how but i want to show u guys my gratitude some way.

 

I apologize for my lateness, it was surprisingly easier to post at home than at school. I thought i would have more control here but i feel like a hamster on wheels trying to slow down to get a sip of water. I want to say i will post everyday to every reply but i really cant guarantee that. I am in debt to you all. thank you.

[Reactant]

J suggested that i try reading this book she found:

Emotional Blackmail When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation and Guilt To Manipulate You by Susan Forward.

 

She ordered it online and in the mean time i found a free notes on the book if anyone is interested in reading it also.

 

Here is the link:http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=2&ved=0CAsQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.frumi.com%2Fimages%2Fuploads%2Femotionalblackmail.pdf&ei=ZudcS6S3DcuVtgej2MTTDg&usg=AFQjCNEubD9zf3L_mS1er0z6Dtnr_TWOZQ&sig2=nS5AB3nh8ONGuN7R_wBqrg

 

Here are notes from the author:

"Emotional blackmail is a powerful form of manipulation in

which people close to us threaten to punish us for not doing what they want.

Emotional blackmailers know how much we value our relationships with them. They know our vulnerabilities and our deepest secrets. They can be our parents or partners, bosses or coworkers, friends or lovers. No matter how much they care about us, they use this intimate knowledge to win our compliance. This books offers a method to break this cycle for good by giving blackmail targets the tools they need and steps they can take."

-Susan Forward

[Reactant]

"Question: Will you take the next step now and confront your brother VERY SOON IN FRONT OF THE BROWN GIRL telling her Your brother said he was only marrying her to self-sacrifice himself but he loves someone else? I tell you' date=' it really does need to happen and THE SOONER THE BETTER. He can complain, but since he did this first to you and your gf...you could call him a hypocrite. He behaves one way toward you, and has other rules for himself. It doesn't work that way. You say you are gone for four months to med school...REACTANT!! YOU NEED TO DO THIS NOW! YOU DON'T HAVE TIME TO SPARE. Four months will make the April ring ceremony you talked about." [/quote']

 

>>>How can i contact the brown girl when my parents have now resorted to hanging up on me? They are afraid what i might say to her and wouldnt let my say a word. I have called my parents today and my dad warned me that if i speak anything about J or R or my brothers new girlfriend that they will hang up becasue they dont want to hear it.

 

J has said its not really my business to contact and warn my brother's new girlfriend. I forgot what her reasons were but i remember feeling convinced.

 

 

"Question: Have you told your mom the ONLY REASON SHE DOESN'T WANT HIM TO HAVE CONTACT WITH R IS BECAUSE SHE KNOWS HE STILL LOVES HER AND YOUR MOM WANTS YOUR BROTHER TO SACRIFICE HIMSELF FOR HER?"

>>>no

 

"Question: Have you told your mom you think it is an evil thing she is doing to your brother forcing him to marry a colour?"

>>Yes.

 

"I believe she knows he loves R...knows it with every fiber of her being and it even scares her for him to go see her while in a coma........what an incredibly evil woman."

>>>I dont know if its fair to say that because i can see my mom is in denial that R is in a coma, and i think part of it is played by my brother. He has fed them lies and i bet my mom would rather believe lies from my brother than to accept the truth from the letters. If she knew and saw the truth, i dont think she would act this way.

 

 

"As for your original doubt whether you love this girl. i think you are feeling this because if you lead yourself to believe you don't then it wont hurt as much if your parents end up getting there own way.

 

What do you think? Have you figured out the true feelings you have for J? "

 

>>>I took me a while to see this, but u are absolutely right. When i felt guilty for the sadness i would bring the family, i actually (unknowingly) tried to find reasons/excuses to see the relationship wasnt working. Not to say those points i mentioned earlier werent true (J only focusing on negative perspecitve, making me her sole provider of happiness, directing her frustration of losing her best friend on me) this is all true, but dont think i helped it.

 

Even though i fought for J and me, it wasnt until i let go majority ofl the guilt that my family has bestowed on me for being with her did i realized how much loved her.

 

I do love her, i know that now. If i had kept up with this sinister cycle of guilt, i doubt the relationship would have lasted long. A large part of this realization and letting go of guilt was because of the advice of extraordinary people in this thread. thank you.

[Shark]

My experience with LDR has been that they work if you want them to. I have been married to the same man for almost forty years, a lot of those years in an LDR. So, any time you see someone posting in a thread saying they NEVER work, that is a blatant lie.

 

Why did they close the thread?

You had one person with control issues who yelled at all the posters, and a lurker who didn't contribute except to critique quotes who undoubtedly reported it as off topic LDR. They want you to move this topic to a different forum on here.

 

I want to briefly comment about this. You seldom see a topic on LDR which doesn't have a third party interference or a verbally harassing issue of some kind, which is what is happening to yours. I skimmed back through the LDR's, and you have a woman whose SO is verbally abusing her and harassing her ...continually harassing her because he put down the quality of the camera she gave him at Christmas, you have a woman who is being harassed and her relationship is trying to be broken up by the guys mother and the mother of his child who are teaming up against her, you have a parent refusing to allow his daughter contact with her LDR, you have a guy who broke up with another girl and his ex is sending him nude pictures on his cell and harassing him, you have an LDR where the guy kissed a third person who was married...there are hundreds where you have some third party interference or verbally abusing someone, or interfering in the LDR whether it is a parent or an ex, or another person. The trick is to figure out how to deal with that intruder, or mimimize damage control, or how to eliminate them from interfering...it happens ALL of the time on an LDR forum...which was what we were working on...third party damage control. You weren't being physically abused, just harassed and verbal like hundreds of others in here.

 

Your very first post...you said your post was all over the place and WHAT SHOULD I DO? :" My parents don’t make it easy on me as they try to lock me in the house and tell me what a terrible son I am, how I've brought shame to the family, and how they’ve disowned me. My life feels like a mess. Part of me feels if I love her I should keep trucking through. Other part wonders why bother when it seems all I’m doing is making her life terrible. We’ve only been 1.5 years out of 8 more years to go. I don’t know how much she can handle. ..and you said: "What should i do?"

 

We looked at your issue as a whole from your first post on where you said how your parents were interfering....first post..., we are on task.

 

But, since you have some vengeful person flagging it, you might want to think about finding a new spot for it. I will go ahead and reply...because you are still LDR with your gf, and your parents are still causing third party interference. Anything you decide is important to your issue and bring to the table is also, as someone else stated, up to be discussed...it also happens all of the time throughout the forums.

 

>>>Yup, it was decided a long time ago to that my brother will try to distant himself. The last thing they would want is him to go back, feel guilty and get regrets. Its so much easier to ignore for them.

 

Do you think your brother feels regrets? I assume your parents decided this for him, or your mom most likely.

 

 
>>>She doesnt. She made a few pauses but got really angry when i asked her these questions. She began asking me questions about how it wasnt my business (she knows it is my business). Later on the conversation became more of her shouting. after getting very angry she handed the phone to my brother. 

 

...hope you tell her it is your business..., and again they bring your brother to do their own talking for them.

 

 
I dont remember saying the word shame but i think i said something along those lines, tihs is before she began shouting nonstop

 

I think most of us think you should tell them they shame you because that is what they are constantly saying to you. They are shaming you with their behavior so it is the truth.

 

 

>>My mom is questioning even if R is sick. My mom says she hasnt seen any photos or any proof. Just letters from R's mother. 

 

So now they have resorted to demanding someone take a picture of a girl in a coma? This is crazy. Quite clearly the girl can't steal their son away in a coma. It was your suggestion your brother go see her, ( a great suggestion I think on your part) and ours feeling sorry for her... That poor girl isn't doing anything, and clearly they have no contact now. Your parents find excuses at their convenience. You mentioned previously the white girl was sad but gave up. So, she clearly isn't interfering now so why are they so afraid of her? ...they know he loves her or they wouldn't be afraid. I think that is low demanding a photo as proof when the girl isn't doing anything. Were there more letters from R's mom, or just that one you told us about before? That happened quite awhile back, not recent right?

 

I dont know the details, i wasnt there when this decision was made. I dont know if after he broke up with her that he told them this or if they instructed him this. Either case they are all in agreement to distance

 

They dont want to lose control of their son.

 

 >>In the past my dad would get very angry and say things that didnt make much sense because he was so angry. He wouldnt listen what you were saying. But the last time i was back home i noticed a transition in him in that hes a lot more calmer. He's the most calm person in the house when we have a fights usually. I think he's doing this because of his high blood pressure. Anyway, when he got on the phone he was mainly telling me to stop thinking about random drama issues and to focus on school. I told him he has a point that school is priority but that i was doing this because i love my brother and my 'older sister.' That if he made this decision and she eventually passes away how can he live with himself. That ther are no 2nd chances. My dad isnt the best listener and kept repeating his view point that i should stop fighting and start studying. Of course he has the view that my family should stay as far as possible from R's family. 

 

Is there anything your family is brave about, or is it always live your life afraid and hiding? I love your comment about loving your brother and older sister..., that was incredible to say to your parents. GOOD JOB!! You showed them your love for her. They told you they loved her and they treat her like this. Sadgati mentioned how huge it is in an Indian culture for them to love or approve of a white girl......her character speaks for itself or they would have given you all the reasons they don't like her just like they do your white gf. They can't find anything to use against the white girl or you would hear it. So, now they are grasping at straws. This is a defenseless person they are picking at.

 

 

>>>he does mock me by speakign in a higher pitch tone and saying stuff like "i'm so self rightous, you shouldnt do that, and u shouldnt do that, and i've got truth on my side" then break out of 'character' and would say something like 'you think your suddenyl a saint?" I never like to mock people this way. I can and its not hard to poke fun at them but i feel i'd be going down to his level. I feel its playing dirty, and i dont like being dirty. 

 

Nobody wants you to be dirty or mock the way your brother does. I think most people were thinking of the way that Indian comic someone mentioned is what they would like to see.

 

 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparkling  
"Question: Will you take the next step now and confront your brother VERY SOON IN FRONT OF THE BROWN GIRL telling her Your brother said he was only marrying her to self-sacrifice himself but he loves someone else? I tell you, it really does need to happen and THE SOONER THE BETTER. He can complain, but since he did this first to you and your gf...you could call him a hypocrite. He behaves one way toward you, and has other rules for himself. It doesn't work that way. You say you are gone for four months to med school...REACTANT!! YOU NEED TO DO THIS NOW! YOU DON'T HAVE TIME TO SPARE. Four months will make the April ring ceremony you talked about." 
>>>How can i contact the brown girl when my parents have now resorted to hanging up on me? They are afraid what i might say to her and wouldnt let my say a word. I have called my parents today and my dad warned me that if i speak anything about J or R or my brothers new girlfriend that they will hang up becasue they dont want to hear it. 
J has said its not really my business to contact and warn my brother's new girlfriend. I forgot what her reasons were but i remember feeling convinced. 

 

I am rushed today but spotted your post so took time to respond. You might have to email her.

 

Why do you think it isn't your business? Maybe in a white family it wouldn't be but in your family IT IS YOUR BUSINESS BECAUSE YOUR FAMILY TELLS YOU IT IS. Your OWN PARENTS continually tell you that YOU MARRY THE FAMILY. This means this brown girl will be YOUR FAMILY YOU ALSO MARRIED... You are supposed to approve of her and give her your blessings. They have told you to. If you keep quiet, you have dishonored her and enabled your parents and brother to do deceive her, lie to her, and some day give birth to his children and you will watch that knowing how he really felt and the pressure your parents put on him to do this... Your brother is sick reactant and brainwashed. He thinks it is better to die and sacrifice himself than marry the woman he loves because of your mom. He needs an intervention.

 

Your brother did an intervention on you when he interrogated your gf. They made this your business...

 

Since you are marrying her too, do you want to spend the rest of your life knowing the deceptions and cruelty your parents have displayed toward her and R with their malicious con-games, or looking her in the eyes for the rest of your life knowing the truth but you did nothing? You have a heart, and you are going to feel guilty for the rest of your life if you keep your mouth shut and let your brother and parents deceive her this way. She is being used for their status and pride and shouldn't be treated as an object or possession used for a status symbol. She deserves to have the freedom to choose a man who wants her for herself not some man who wants and loves another woman. Even if it hurt me, I would want to know rather than be the object of pity for the rest of my life by people who knew the truth or a husband who sacrificed himself by marrying me. Think about it.

 

Good luck!

 

btw, I do strongly think this topic is where it belongs but if you change it, please post so we know where to find you.

 

In my own experience with LDR's....when we were first married we worked different shifts. He worked swing, I worked days. Later on he worked graveyard and I still worked days. We made the most of the time we had together. Later on his job took him throughout the country and we became LDR. I still love that man no matter where he is, and he still comes home happy to see me. You make the adjustments and enjoy the time you have together. Too much time is spent dwelling on the negative aspects of it and you make it harder than it has to be. Spend your time looking for ways to make it easier, not more difficult. You might surprise yourself.

[Shark]

J suggested that i try reading this book she found:

Emotional Blackmail When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation and Guilt To Manipulate You by Susan Forward.

 

She ordered it online and in the mean time i found a free notes on the book if anyone is interested in reading it also.

 

Here is the link:http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=2&ved=0CAsQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.frumi.com%2Fimages%2Fuploads%2Femotionalblackmail.pdf&ei=ZudcS6S3DcuVtgej2MTTDg&usg=AFQjCNEubD9zf3L_mS1er0z6Dtnr_TWOZQ&sig2=nS5AB3nh8ONGuN7R_wBqrg

 

Here are notes from the author:

"Emotional blackmail is a powerful form of manipulation in

which people close to us threaten to punish us for not doing what they want.

Emotional blackmailers know how much we value our relationships with them. They know our vulnerabilities and our deepest secrets. They can be our parents or partners, bosses or coworkers, friends or lovers. No matter how much they care about us, they use this intimate knowledge to win our compliance. This books offers a method to break this cycle for good by giving blackmail targets the tools they need and steps they can take."

-Susan Forward

 

Thank you. I will try to look at this when I have time. I believe that is also EXACTLY what many people posting on here tried to convey to you, that your parents, brother...and your gf too Reactant don't forget that..., ...were indulging in emotional blackmail on you trying to manipulate you. It is interesting your gf gave you the book when she had been guilty of manipulating your emotions too.

 

It is good you have broken the guilt cycle! Now, it would be great if you could break the guilt hold they have on your brother since you love him.

 

Your family tells you things aren't your business, but THEY are the ones who made all of this your business since they continue to use it against you to manipulate you. Remember that. They were the FIRST ones who brought ALL of those issues into the argument to be used against you...your brother's brown gf, the martyrdom they gave him for dumping a white girl and you are supposed to emulate him...the whole works have been used to manipulate you so YOUR PARENTS AND BROTHER MADE THIS ALL YOUR BUSINESS!

 

I would suggest if they tell you it isn't any of your business that you REMIND THEM they were the ones who first brought all of these issues up to use against you in their discussions to make you feel guilty and become compliant and follow in what they seem to consider...your 'sacred' brother's footsteps.

 

About the drama they accused you of causing...again...these are all areas they used against you first. They don't like it and call it drama when you bring up topics they introduced against you first. Wasn't your mom pushing food bowls in your face and accusing you of being the issue why she couldn't eat and why she cried all of the time?

 

Again, LDR's can work, I know for a fact, but you need to find a way to get the issues your parents and brother have created out of the picture because THEY are trying to disrupt it with THEIR drama...(come on now, they tried to blackmail you..how dramatic was that?..your parents had NO life(drama brother)...remember your dramatic brother who is self sacrificing (more drama) himself?)

 

Also, you need to make sure your gf isn't the one creating drama of her own. You caught her this last time, so be watchful about the next time. Your first posting you said this LDR and the guilt manipulation on both sides was killing you....., so stand up to all of them for yourself.

 

How are you feeling and doing with the after effects of your surgery? Are you healed or still suffering?

 

My LDR works!

[Sadgati]

My LDR is still going great. We stay online together as much as possible and it makes it feel like we are together in the same room...not as good as the real thing but still good. Karena is right, look for the good and not the bad. Thank God for the internet!

 

Shark...40 years!.. that should still the mouths of some of the nay sayers about LDRs.

 

Karena, is your LDR man still with you? I detect a sadness in your words.

 

>>>How can i contact the brown girl when my parents have now resorted to hanging up on me? They are afraid what i might say to her and wouldnt let my say a word. I have called my parents today and my dad warned me that if i speak anything about J or R or my brothers new girlfriend that they will hang up becasue they dont want to hear it.

 

J has said its not really my business to contact and warn my brother's new girlfriend. I forgot what her reasons were but i remember feeling convinced.

 

So, your decision you have made is you are going to do nothing and you intend to help support your family with this sordid scam against this girl?...because J said it isn't your business? ...because your family isn't making it easy? Where there is a will, there is a way. Your gf is WRONG. It became YOUR business as soon as your brother told you his intentions. Now you can't hide behind ignorance because it is your business...he made it so.

>>>They are afraid what i might say to her and wouldnt let my say a word.

Do you hear yourself? They won't "LET YOU SAY A WORD"...

You don't need their permission to speak your mind. Are you always going to let your family and your girlfriend do your thinking for you and tell you what to do?

 

I understand you probably more than anyone else on here because you and I lived a sheltered life where we have always been ordered and told what we are to think or do. Our lives are planned down to the wire when we are to marry, what career we are supposed to have, when we are to give them grandkids....isn't it time to think for yourself instead of being lazy and letting them do it for you, or letting them scam and use someone because it is easier on you to do nothing? You said it was easier for your brother to sacrifice himself than for him to marry the girl he loved. Is it easier for you to sit by and watch... and let him use and scam the life of still another girl after he has already destroyed the life of one girl?

 

When you see someone with the intentions of playing or using another person like a playing piece on a game board, ...that is wrong to let them play games with them like that. They are people, not a game piece to manipulate or use. Why do you think it is ok to sit by and let them use a person like that?

 

If someone tells you they intend to rob a bank and you don't warn someone and someone ends up hurt or dead....you are responsible too. It is your business as soon as you learn about it.

 

>>>>>>I dont know if its fair to say that because i can see my mom is in denial that R is in a coma, and i think part of it is played by my brother. He has fed them lies and i bet my mom would rather believe lies from my brother than to accept the truth from the letters. If she knew and saw the truth, i dont think she would act this way.

 

Your mom wants to believe so she doesn't have guilt. Your brother IS sick and he plays games with the lives of people. He admitted it to you. In fact, he proudly bragged about it to you and wanted you to copy him. Your parents play games with the lives of people. You have caught all of your family telling lies.

 

>>>I took me a while to see this, but u are absolutely right. When i felt guilty for the sadness i would bring the family, i actually (unknowingly) tried to find reasons/excuses to see the relationship wasnt working. Not to say those points i mentioned earlier werent true (J only focusing on negative perspecitve, making me her sole provider of happiness, directing her frustration of losing her best friend on me) this is all true, but dont think i helped it.

 

Even though i fought for J and me, it wasnt until i let go majority ofl the guilt that my family has bestowed on me for being with her did i realized how much loved her.

 

I do love her, i know that now. If i had kept up with this sinister cycle of guilt, i doubt the relationship would have lasted long. A large part of this realization and letting go of guilt was because of the advice of extraordinary people in this thread. thank you.

 

If you love her that is fine and you deserve to be happy. But I want you to think about and be watchful about some areas of concern with her that are still out there because your gf played a large part in the "SINISTER CYCLE OF GUILT" and EMOTIONAL BLACKMAIL AGAINST YOU herself. If you have forgotten think back to your original posts. There are several of us who still have concerns about your gf.

 

At first when she was feeling she didn't have control over you she used emotional blackmail against you. She knew what she was doing when she told her friends and got them involved...it wasn't an accident. When we got you to see she was guilting you, blaming you, and shaming you just like your family was, then she shifted her position since it didn't work on you anymore.

 

She does still play you, she does still control you, and she does use emotional blackmail on you. When you started thinking about the present to your parents you realized she had planted the idea in your head and made you believe it was your own and you had been the one to talk her into doing it. There were other instances as well. We can see what she is doing...so watch out. At this point she feels she has control over you again since she controlled you and you did what she planted in your head, so things are going better for you with her but she is still playing you for her own benefit ..for herself. Love you or control of you for HER ego...which is it?

 

I also thought it was odd J got a book talking about emotional blackmail when in your first post she was the one upsetting you the most with her own emotional blackmail against you. You had your parents and brother on one side saying their lives would be over if you don't do what they demand, and you have your gf on the other side clinging to you like she is barely alive and you are the only one able to keep her alive and her life would be over without you. They are all sick and needy, all need some professional help. You are surrounded on both sides by control freaks who play games with people's (yours and others) lives.

 

You have been so used to accepting everything your family said as truth for so many years that you didn't look beyond their words. Now you are listening to and watching them and you are seeing and catching them up in all of their lies..., don't be lazy and let them do your thinking for you. Watch out for your gf too.

 

Also, emotions used for blackmail aren't necessarily bad...intimacy and se* can be used as a means to control you or emotionally blackmail you too...or even sidetrack you. I suspect you didn't have a lot of experience with intimacy until this gf...don't confuse that with love.

 

I am saying prayers for you.

 

I had a nice talk with my LDR this morning so I am feeling happy!

[Karena]

J suggested that i try reading this book she found:

Emotional Blackmail When the People in Your Life Use Fear, Obligation and Guilt To Manipulate You by Susan Forward.

 

She ordered it online and in the mean time i found a free notes on the book if anyone is interested in reading it also.

 

Here is the link:http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=2&ved=0CAsQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.frumi.com%2Fimages%2Fuploads%2Femotionalblackmail.pdf&ei=ZudcS6S3DcuVtgej2MTTDg&usg=AFQjCNEubD9zf3L_mS1er0z6Dtnr_TWOZQ&sig2=nS5AB3nh8ONGuN7R_wBqrg

 

Here are notes from the author:

"Emotional blackmail is a powerful form of manipulation in

which people close to us threaten to punish us for not doing what they want.

Emotional blackmailers know how much we value our relationships with them. They know our vulnerabilities and our deepest secrets. They can be our parents or partners, bosses or coworkers, friends or lovers. No matter how much they care about us, they use this intimate knowledge to win our compliance. This books offers a method to break this cycle for good by giving blackmail targets the tools they need and steps they can take."

-Susan Forward

 

Sadgati, You have a good head on your shoulders. You are also very astute for your age. Yes, my husband passed away. The pain eases with time, but it never goes away. There are still times I walk into a room expecting to see him sitting there. Time or distance or death, that love never faded away, not for one single moment.

 

I agree with you about his gf. I know without a shadow of a doubt Reactant is not in love with his girlfriend just by hearing what he says about her and how she has treated him; but he will have to figure that out for himself. You can read the forums and predict the outcomes based on the same scenarios being played out over and over again, different people, same scenario. You see it happening in real time as well. His is not a deep-rooted love for her. He keeps trying to convince himself he loves her, but it isn't happening despite what he claims...and now he claims and uses his guilt as his excuse for doubting his love.

 

Real love isn't something you HAVE to talk yourself into feeling or something you forget or stop feeling when they are out of sight or when you are working. Real love doesn't go away because you are LDR or because you feel guilty or someone makes you feel guilty. Real love is a constant just like your love for your child, love for a grandparent, love for a parent regardless if you get mad at them or move away for years. When you have experienced that love, the difference is astounding. The guilt he felt isn't the real more deeply rooted reasons he was doubting his love for her or trying to talk himself into loving her again. Reactant is, or was, an innocent, and it is clear to me she is more worldly. I would also hazard a guess and say she is his first romantic involvement, and she uses sex as a tool to have a hold over him.

 

Reactant, your gf manipulated and tricked you into pushing her to go to your parents house. Do you approve of that deception or do you feel gullible and used? She wanted herself in their face as your gf. She got what SHE wanted. Has she also done this with your friends?- wanted herself in their face so they would know she owned you? Has she ever done something which took you out of your comfort zone and forced you to show your friends she had you or she owned you without first discussing it with you or making sure it was ok with you? Does she involve herself in friend's relationships when they haven't asked for her involvement, or does she make/ask/push you to involve yourself in her friend's relationship issues to discuss it with them even if they haven't asked for your help or hers? In other words, does she stick her nose into other people's business and pressure you to as well. Why am I asking? Because she has control issues and I want you to think about how she behaves because there are patterns of behavior people like that follow. They may not be the same as my examples, but they will be there in some form. Generally, they like to take over the relationship and manipulate it to where they want it to go and you are forced along for the ride.

 

Reactant, when you read the article about emotional blackmail, do you see only how it pertains to your family or are you open enough to see how it also speaks directly to your girlfriend and her actions as well? You see how it relates to your parents and brother, but I want to show you a few examples how it relates to your gf.

 

She did this, note the high drama and excessively needy and dependent:

"High drama, hysteria and an air of crisis (precipitated by you, of course) surround self-punishers, who are often excessively needy and dependent. They often enmesh themselves with those around them and struggle with taking responsibility with their own lives. The ultimate threat self-punishers can make is frightening in the extreme: It’s a suggestion that they will kill themselves."

 

While you didn't say she made that last ultimate threat, she insinuated it with a veiled threat when she made you feel you were the only person who kept her clinging to life.

 

She did this. She was miserable, sick, unhappy, suffering, unlucky with her jobs and it was your fault:

"Sufferers are talented blamers and guilt-peddlers who make us figure out what they want, and always conclude that it is up to us to ensure they get it. Sufferers take the position that if they feel miserable, sick, unhappy, or are just plain unlucky, there’s only one solution: our giving them what they want – even if they haven’t told us what it is. They let us know, in no uncertain terms, that if you don’t do what they want, they will suffer and it will be your fault. Sufferers are preoccupied

with how awful they feel, and often they interpret your inability to read

their mind as proof that you don’t care enough about them."

 

and this:

"One of the fastest ways for blackmailers to create undeserved guilt is to use blame, actively attributing whatever upset or problems they’re having to their targets. Once blackmailers see that their target’s guilt can serve them, time becomes irrelevant. There is no statute of limitations. Guilt is the blackmailer’s neutron bomb. It can leave relationships standing, but it wears away the trust and intimacy that makes us want to be with them."

 

She enlisted her friends:

"Enlisting Allies

When single-handed attempts at blackmail are effective, blackmailers call in reinforcements (family members, friends), to make their case for them..."

 

When you read the section about the inner world of the blackmailer, it also shouts your gf's name.

 

The article says blackmail takes two, so why are you letting her manipulate you? Think through some things or issues for yourself FIRST instead of running to hear what she has to say first. Decide how you think before asking her opinion. Remember your brother? He has to first find out what your mom thinks he should think before he speaks. This is very immature, needy behavior. Your gf wants what is best for herself. She really isn't putting you first.

[Sparkling]

Reactant, this topic I made was flagged last week ONLY because I put your name in the topic subject and each thread started is to be directed to the whole forum not individuals. They said they could edit it or delete it, so I hope they EDIT the topic name because I can't edit the topic myself now or I would. You could also start a new topic and ask for help with your LDR triangle between parents, you and your gf. It would be easier on us if they edited my topic name rather than starting over again.

 

Karena, I am sorry for your loss, the tears came. Your love is the kind of love all of us should be striving for. You experienced LDR in your past and your love didn't falter. Shark, congratulations on your decades long LDR! It just goes to show what true love can do even in a LDR! You can give the skeptics of IF LDR's work a big raspberry!

 

Reactant, what is it you want now? What you told us you wanted to fight for and how you are acting now go two different directions. You haven't been taught or shown any honest way to love anyone by your family. You really haven't. It has always been what you have to gain from a relationship or what you can get out of it. Your girlfriend seems exactly like your own parents. Why are you always playing out the submissive role and being the one pushed around and controlled by family and girlfriend? The artificial marriage your brother intends to make to use someone and sacrifice himself for your parents is sick and disgusting, and they have plainly told you they intend for you to do the same thing. If you do not stand up against this farce of a relationship of your brothers, you won't be able to stand up for yourself. Your gf IS wrong. If you want to fight for your right to be with a white girl, this is part of the battle like it or not. You will gain strength of character, and you have nothing to lose. Your values and morals fighting against their lies and deceit will make you stronger, not weaker.

 

>>>How can i contact the brown girl when my parents have now resorted to hanging up on me? They are afraid what i might say to her and wouldnt let my say a word. I have called my parents today and my dad warned me that if i speak anything about J or R or my brothers new girlfriend that they will hang up becasue they dont want to hear it.

 

J has said its not really my business to contact and warn my brother's new girlfriend. I forgot what her reasons were but i remember feeling convinced.

 

Your heart KNOWS it is wrong for your brother to use this girl like that but you will let him, and you will enable him, and you will help him con her and scam her and deceive her, and cheat her won't you? Why? Would you warn someone if you heard they intended to steal from a friend or would you help enable them to steal from your friend?.....or would you listen to your gf say it isn't your business so go ahead and let them steal from your friend? It IS your business. They have told you their malicious plans. They have told you and ordered you that these malicious plans are also going to be YOUR future plans because they ORDER IT. Also, YOUR relationship with God is at stake here too Reactant, don't forget that. You enable your brother and parents to do and play this controlling, manipulative and sinister deception on this girl, and God will know. If you let them do this to her you will be just as low down dirty as they are by allowing them to play their sinister con-games against real live people because you knew their planned out deceptions and you did nothing to stop it.

 

After this last comment of yours I have visions of you apologizing to your family and saying, "Ok mom, sorry for the drama I have caused. I wouldn't want to have anyone hang up on me. So what can I do now to help plan my brother's superficial wedding where he lies to everyone and how can I help him use, deceive, manipulate and lie to the brown girl, and yes I am ok with that because using and lying to people is ok with me since my whole family does it all of the time,...also, I will now suck up to everyone and be very nice no matter how many times they lie to me or anyone else, and no matter how many times they use emotional blackmail on me or play me or anyone else for a gullible fool?"

 

You do realize your parents and brother have controlled and mastered you yet again? You had your parents and brother on the defensive for valid, honest TRUTHFUL reasons...FINALLY! but, now you have been beaten down into submission again. They gain complete control over you time and time again using more threats against you. Now you say your girlfriend is on their side helping them out against you. They slammed a wall down in front of your face. They have told you what you can talk about, what you cannot talk about. They have a punishment ready for you if you don't OBEY their commands. They will hang up on you...slam the wall down between you. So, you are back underneath their thumb again, in their control again, right back where you started. UNLESS, you stop worrying about their punishment and talk about whatever you want to talk about. Slam down the wall on them sometime and out maneuver them. You could choose to tell them you WILL speak to them about this issue because it is IMPORTANT TO YOU! You COULD tell them if they want to hang up on you then they won't get to talk to you anymore either but you will still be discussing it.

 

-How many times did they hang up on you?

-Why are they afraid of what you might say to the brown girl? Have you said anything to them to suggest you would speak to her?

-Have you said anything negative to your parents about the brown girl or your brother's malicious, deceitful con-man game of a relationship with her?

-Are you sucking up and being helpful and encouraging toward your brother with his planned out scam, lies and deceptions to his future bride?

-Are you going to continue to help your family scam her?

 

I read the emotional blackmail article you pasted, and I wonder why you read that but don't seem to see how you are helping your parents and girlfriend to blackmail you emotionally. It said, "It takes two ; Blackmail cannot work without the target’s active participation. The target gives it permission to occur."

 

It also gives this list of reasons why you allow it, so you might want to ask yourself that question...Why do you allow it? It says the blackmailer takes queues from their testing of you. You need to switch your reactions to your families blackmail schemes so they can NOT predict what blackmail will work on you. When you called your families bluff about taking away school funding...IT WORKED! You need to continue to call their bluff because in the end they only hurt themselves along with you by using or trying to use their emotional blackmail on you.

 

It says, "Emotional blackmailers take their cues from our responses to their testing, and they learn from both what we do and what we don’t do."

It also gives a list of protective qualities that leave you open to emotional blackmail. You should Read that list and think about what you can do so you don't keep getting caught in their emotional blackmail traps. I would be interested in hearing which cues in the list you believe you give to your family so they have your permission to blackmail you emotionally.

 

This other section refers to the impact of emotional blackmail.

It says, "Emotional blackmail may not be life threatening but it robs us of our integrity. Integrity is that place inside where our values and our moral compass reside,clarifying what right and wrong for us"

 

Do you notice that your family is manipulating you AND THE BROWN GIRL and that DOES rob you and them of your integrity, morals and values just as we have been trying so hard to tell you? You also keep "rationalizing and justifying" the actions of your family, your girlfriend and yourself. You even claim it isn't your business when it most certainly is.

 

It also says "...YOU MAY BETRAY OTHERS TO PLACATE THE EMOTIONAL BLACKMAILER. " This is exactly what you have done!! You are willing to betray the white girl, the brown girl and all others in order to placate the people responsible for USING this emotional blackmail, lies and manipulations on everyone. So, don't kid yourself by saying it isn't your business...you ARE betraying others to placate your blackmailers.

 

-"The Impact of Blackmail

Emotional blackmail may not be life threatening but it robs us of our integrity. Integrity is that place inside where our values and our moral compass reside, clarifying what right and wrong for us"

-"We may betray others to placate the blackmailer"

-"Rationalizing and justifying"

-3. The demand involves a major life issues, and/or by giving in would be harmful to you or others. – "

 

So, Reactant... Your choice, are you going to give in and allow them to get away with causing harm to these people with their lies and deceptions? Are you going to try to placate them? Are you going to rationalize and justify why it is ok for your them to use, LIE to, deceive and manipulate people? ARE YOU GOING TO LET THEM ROB YOU OF YOUR INTEGRITY? This is a serious because it involves not just your life but the lives of all these other people they are scamming and intending to scam more in the future.

 

You rationalized once and said it was easier on your brother to scam and lie to the brown girl than fight racism etc. I hope you don't choose to follow in your brother's footsteps and allow him to scam away his life or your own.

 

>>>I dont know if its fair to say that because i can see my mom is in denial that R is in a coma, and i think part of it is played by my brother. He has fed them lies and i bet my mom would rather believe lies from my brother than to accept the truth from the letters. If she knew and saw the truth, i dont think she would act this way.

 

>>>My mom is questioning even if R is sick. My mom says she hasnt seen any photos or any proof. Just letters from R's mother. I got realyl angry about this. I replied asking our relatives in india should give us copies of marriage certificates when they get married cuz all we hear are words on the telephone. She didnt like this and told me i cant make that comparison because (translated) 'we hardly know R's family." I asked her why believe anything someone tells you. i dont remember what her reply was at that ppint

 

How could you ask someone for a photo of someone in a coma? That is unreasonable because that just isn't something someone would make up. You said previously that you considered R a better person than your own brother so you had good valid reasons for thinking that way. You know your brother lies and makes up things, and you love R like a sister. One letter telling your family she is in a coma, so they find excuses to TURN THEIR HEADS FROM HELPING THE FALLEN or the GIRL THEY SAID THEY LOVED. Your mom is queen of deceptions and lies and you can see she taught your brother well. They use emotional blackmail on everyone to excuse their horrible actions and everything mean or cruel they do is always someone else's fault not their own. As far as I know from what you have stated, R's family doesn't even know you tried to get your brother to go see her, do they?

 

>>> Not to say those points i mentioned earlier werent true (J only focusing on negative perspecitve, making me her sole provider of happiness, directing her frustration of losing her best friend on me) this is all true, but dont think i helped it.

 

Your girlfriend's emotional blackmail she used against you to manipulate and control you.

 

Once again, I am glad to see there are a lot of successful LDR's in the forum. Karena, my heart goes out to you~

Edited February 7, 2010 by Sparkling

[Monkeeman]

>>>How can i contact the brown girl when my parents have now resorted to hanging up on me? They are afraid what i might say to her and wouldnt let my say a word. I have called my parents today and my dad warned me that if i speak anything about J or R or my brothers new girlfriend that they will hang up becasue they dont want to hear it.

 

J has said its not really my business to contact and warn my brother's new girlfriend. I forgot what her reasons were but i remember feeling convinced.

 

Bro, you are whining. You are rationalizing and making excuses for your emotional blackmailers.

 

Your bro got flat out in your face screaming at you about how he intended to self-sacrifice himself so your parents don't get yelled at. Your bro screamed in your face how he had to sacrifice himself and he intends to marry a brown girl he doesn't love. Like we told you over and over, if he loved her he wouldn't use the TERM SACRIFICE HIMSELF to you when he speaks of marrying a brown girl. He does NOT love her, he is USING her, tricking her, scamming her, conning her, lying to her.

 

Now your bro is standing up there at the top of the volcano hanging onto the brown girls hand ready to sacrifice her too when he takes the plunge and jumps into the volcano. He already sacrificed and pushed his white gf he loves into the raging volcano of doom.

 

Your bro screamed at you, raged at you in your face why you need to sacrifice yourself and your white LDR girlfriend and COPYCAT him because he is superior to you. Your parents screamed and raged at you to sacrifice your white gf TOO LIKE YOUR BRO DID, so they don't lose their status or have relatives yell at them and they told you YOUR BROTHER IS SUPERIOR TO YOU because he intends to sacrifice himself for them.

 

Dude, your bro used the term sacrifice so he feels he is sacrificing himself. If you keep your mouth shut about this you are an accessory to their crime. You know your bro's intentions to sacrifice himself because he screamed it in your face and ordered you to sacrifice yourself too. So you can't say it isn't your business. Sacrificing the lives of innocent people is a crime. Your brother and your parents are conning innocent people. Your bro used this con he is committing against you to try to break up you and your LDR gf's relationship.

 

If you sit here now claiming it is NOT your business, you are a liar! You are rationalizing and making excuses for your emotional blackmailers and for yourself. You intend to contribute to the success of this crime before and after the fact and live the rest of your life knowing you participated and helped with it? I have met selfish, self-centered people before but I have never come across a family as narcissistic as your own. They don't give a dam* about anyone but themselves and all that matters is what they can get out of them. I bet R would have given more to your family than this brown girl your brother is using but they are too blind to see it. You said she was a better person than your bro, so they could have used her morality to improve themselves.

 

The brown girl is your brother and parent's "mark"....the person they are conning, scamming and using. Are you going to turn your back?

 

http://www.criminal-law-lawyer-source.com/terms/accessory.html

 

"An accessory to a crime is any individual who knowingly and voluntarily participates in the commission of a crime. An accessory is not typically present at the scene of the crime, but contributes to the success of the crime before or after the fact. A person charged as an accessory to a crime before the fact is one who incites, abets, or aids a person in the commission of a criminal act. An individual who is an accessory after the fact receives, shelters, comforts, relieves, or assists a felon after the crime has been committed. A person can be an accessory if they provide any support or assistance, whether financially, emotionally, or factually. By law, an accessory can be held as liable as the principle actor who carries out the criminal act."

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confidence_trick

Vulnerability to confidence tricks

Confidence tricks exploit typical human qualities such as greed, dishonesty, vanity, honesty, compassion, credulity and naïveté. The common factor is that the mark relies on the good faith of the con artist.

Edited February 7, 2010 by Monkeeman

[Sadgati]

Sadgati, You have a good head on your shoulders. You are also very astute for your age. Yes, my husband passed away. The pain eases with time, but it never goes away. There are still times I walk into a room expecting to see him sitting there. Time or distance or death, that love never faded away, not for one single moment.

 

Thank you! I am so sorry. He must have been a wonderful man to keep and hold your love for all those years!...and same goes for you too! Thenk you for sharing this with us. Plus, again like others have said...LDRS WORK!!

 

LDRs are hard but when you have family or friends or ex's interfering and harassing you, they can drive you crazy with their interference. You have to push them away somehow.

 

 

Bro, you are whining. You are rationalizing and making excuses for your emotional blackmailers.

 

Your bro got flat out in your face screaming at you about how he intended to self-sacrifice himself so your parents don't get yelled at. Your bro screamed in your face how he had to sacrifice himself and he intends to marry a brown girl he doesn't love. Like we told you over and over, if he loved her he wouldn't use the TERM SACRIFICE HIMSELF to you when he speaks of marrying a brown girl. He does NOT love her, he is USING her, tricking her, scamming her, conning her, lying to her.

 

Now your bro is standing up there at the top of the volcano hanging onto the brown girls hand ready to sacrifice her too when he takes the plunge and jumps into the volcano. He already sacrificed and pushed his white gf he loves into the raging volcano of doom.

 

Your bro screamed at you, raged at you in your face why you need to sacrifice yourself and your white LDR girlfriend and COPYCAT him because he is superior to you. Your parents screamed and raged at you to sacrifice your white gf TOO LIKE YOUR BRO DID, so they don't lose their status or have relatives yell at them and they told you YOUR BROTHER IS SUPERIOR TO YOU because he intends to sacrifice himself for them.

 

Dude, your bro used the term sacrifice so he feels he is sacrificing himself. If you keep your mouth shut about this you are an accessory to their crime. You know your bro's intentions to sacrifice himself because he screamed it in your face and ordered you to sacrifice yourself too. So you can't say it isn't your business. Sacrificing the lives of innocent people is a crime. Your brother and your parents are conning innocent people. Your bro used this con he is committing against you to try to break up you and your LDR gf's relationship.

 

If you sit here now claiming it is NOT your business, you are a liar! You are rationalizing and making excuses for your emotional blackmailers and for yourself. You intend to contribute to the success of this crime before and after the fact and live the rest of your life knowing you participated and helped with it? I have met selfish, self-centered people before but I have never come across a family as narcissistic as your own. They don't give a dam* about anyone but themselves and all that matters is what they can get out of them. I bet R would have given more to your family than this brown girl your brother is using but they are too blind to see it. You said she was a better person than your bro, so they could have used her morality to improve themselves.

 

The brown girl is your brother and parent's "mark"....the person they are conning, scamming and using. Are you going to turn your back?.

 

I agree with you. He is making excuses and rationalizing this for himself and his family, and he is lying to himself. He knows it is his business, just as he knew it was his business about the white gf and how they treated R like dirt and turned their backs on the fallen.

 

The thing is, Reactant said his brother even knows it is wrong...BUT HE IS DOING IT ANYWAY because he doesn't have the guts to be the first one to step up to the plate and stop it. They can't even claim they are naive because his brother admitted it is wrong but he is going to do it anyway because he doesn't want to be first to marry white so he sacrificed R and himself...and now he is sacrificing a brown girl. Like you said, if Reactant doesn't TRY HARD TO stop it, he is aiding and abetting it.

 

His brother would be more honourable if he didn't rush into marrying anyone at all since he isn't being honourable using and scamming this brown girl. He shames his whole family.

 

You are also right about his family being narcissistic because all that stuff his mom was saying about all other priests, religions, cultures, people being inferiour to them. She ONLY thinks of what is best for HER. The whole scenario is one huge con game for self status and profits. It is completely narcissistic and all about greed and power. They ARE deceiving everyone, and they admit it.

 

My family has some of those traits too, but I have been working on them and they are actually coming around some to a different way of thinking. Not huge progress but some. They have spent their lives hearing how everything an Indian does is better than any other culture and they didn't realize just how wrong that was. I showed them the stats about Indian wife burnings, murders because of arranged marriages, divorce rates aren't accurate, and all that other stuff a little at a time, and they can't deny it anymore. Mom cried when I confronted her about my aunt and she felt guilty...because she didn't realize she was also a victim of backwards thinking. She went to my aunt and visited her, took her out to lunch and she intends to ask her if she would like to come live with us. They are thinking differently, but they are still scared to make big changes so keep us in your prayers! YOU HAVE TO KEEP EDUCATING THEM!~~ SHOW THEM TREATING PEOPLE THIS WAY IS WRONG!!!

 

Reactant, will your conscience really be clear if you do nothing? You know darn well it is your business!

 

..and about that coma again. That would be one stupid thing to make up because she can't speak to your brother or go to him, she is out of the picture and has nothing to gain because the door to communication would be shut in her face. That is just stupid for your mom to say something like that. R couldn't even go running to your brother's side. Your mom is a cruel woman.

[Sadgati]

How is R? Is she still alive?

[Cobra]

I have been following this discussion for the last few months. Excuses, blame and denials flow like a river full of lies from this whole family. Your brother blames his relatives why he is sacrificing himself to marry a brown girl. He blames his white girlfriend for why he had to break up with her because she was born with white skin, not brown. You blame your parents for why you fell out of love with your girlfriend. You blame your girlfriend because you don't want to confront your brother because she (gf) decided something you can't remember so it must be right because it gives you an excuse not to do anything. Your mom blames, well hell..your mom blames everyone for everything because they aren't as good as she is. If it isn't your business, who the hells business is it? The neighbors? Who gets punished, beaten or whipped because of your indifference? The white girl. The brown girl. The aunt.

 

You are wasting your breath trying to help him because he doesn't give a damn. He is going to stall and make up excuses and he is going to blame everyone else just like his mom does until time runs out and then he has that as an excuse...oops I ran out of time. His brother will be sacrificed, the brown girl will be used, his white sister he loves (sarcasm) will possibly be dead. But, it isn't his business is it? He and his parents will be happy they left a trail of wounded, sacrificed or dead behind because they got their own selfish way and they don't get yelled at by relatives! Being yelled at is worse then sickness, death or sacrifices~??..But, it isn't their fault,-someone else made them do it, and you don't want them to be yelled at so that makes a valid excuse. Hanging up on you is more important than people being used or sacrificed, or sick, is it? God forbid you get sick or you get attacked for that as well.

 

I have no tolerance for excuses or blame games. You are going to let them screw over the lives of all of them and you won't stop it.

 

>>>How can i contact the brown girl when my parents have now resorted to hanging up on me? They are afraid what i might say to her and wouldnt let my say a word. I have called my parents today and my dad warned me that if i speak anything about J or R or my brothers new girlfriend that they will hang up becasue they dont want to hear it.

 

J has said its not really my business to contact and warn my brother's new girlfriend. I forgot what her reasons were but i remember feeling convinced.

 

You sound blasé about this with no sense of urgency. Time is running out and the lives of all of them will be sacrificed-and for what? - Lies so your parents don't get yelled at.

 

>>>>>>I dont know if its fair to say that because i can see my mom is in denial that R is in a coma, and i think part of it is played by my brother. He has fed them lies and i bet my mom would rather believe lies from my brother than to accept the truth from the letters. If she knew and saw the truth, i dont think she would act this way.

Yes, it is fair to say. Don't make excuses for your mom!! Your mom felt that way BEFORE your brother fed them with the new lies- back when your mom said she LOVED the white girl and felt sorry for her but your brother should still avoid her, especially now because she was sick. Your mom believed R was sick when she said that and your mom still sh^t on the white girl. As soon as your mom found out she was sick you said she jumped all over using her sickness as another reason and excuse to validate why your brother can't have R now. The girl got sick so she was beneath them. Now you defend your mother and say she was indenial? What the hell was her problem BEFORE she heard your brothers lies? She still turned her back on the fallen.

 

 

>>>When i felt guilty for the sadness i would bring the family, i actually (unknowingly) tried to find reasons/excuses to see the relationship wasnt working. Not to say those points i mentioned earlier werent true (J only focusing on negative perspecitve, making me her sole provider of happiness, directing her frustration of losing her best friend on me) this is all true, but dont think i helped it.

 

Even though i fought for J and me, it wasnt until i let go majority ofl the guilt that my family has bestowed on me for being with her did i realized how much loved her.

 

I do love her, i know that now. If i had kept up with this sinister cycle of guilt, i doubt the relationship would have lasted long. A large part of this realization and letting go of guilt was because of the advice of extraordinary people in this thread. thank you.

 

You are blaming your parents for how you felt. True, they made you feel guilty later on, but -This is how you felt before the guilt, and it was not about your parents giving you guilt, see below:

 

>>>In the beginning of medical school I was struggling because I would constantly think of her. Overtime I had to suppress my feelings of longing for her and focus on work. Overtime, I became really good at it. This eventually had its toll when at some point last semester, I started to wonder if I really love her since I don’t think of her often nor do we meet up often when I return for 2 week break. I didn’t know 100% and I kept convincing myself that I did love her completely and kept telling her on the phone that loved her to really believe it myself. Overtime I gained my love for her back but this took some time.

 

I told her yesterday there were a couple of weeks where I wasnt sure if I loved her and she broke down. She thought it was never possible for either of us to doubt our love for each other.

 

I pulled this out of your other thread. Your parents are not to blame for you falling out of love with her at all. You are. It didn't have anything to do with guilt at all. You forgot her.

 

I think it is the opposite. I think it is your family trying to make you feel guilty and break you up that keeps you chained to your gf.

[Karena]

I have been following this discussion for the last few months. Excuses, blame and denials flow like a river full of lies from this whole family. Your brother blames his relatives why he is sacrificing himself to marry a brown girl. He blames his white girlfriend for why he had to break up with her because she was born with white skin, not brown. You blame your parents for why you fell out of love with your girlfriend. You blame your girlfriend because you don't want to confront your brother because she (gf) decided something you can't remember so it must be right because it gives you an excuse not to do anything. Your mom blames, well hell..your mom blames everyone for everything because they aren't as good as she is. If it isn't your business, who the hells business is it? The neighbors? Who gets punished, beaten or whipped because of your indifference? The white girl. The brown girl. The aunt.

 

You are wasting your breath trying to help him because he doesn't give a damn. He is going to stall and make up excuses and he is going to blame everyone else just like his mom does until time runs out and then he has that as an excuse...oops I ran out of time. His brother will be sacrificed, the brown girl will be used, his white sister he loves (sarcasm) will possibly be dead. But, it isn't his business is it? He and his parents will be happy they left a trail of wounded, sacrificed or dead behind because they got their own selfish way and they don't get yelled at by relatives! Being yelled at is worse then sickness, death or sacrifices~??..But, it isn't their fault,-someone else made them do it, and you don't want them to be yelled at so that makes a valid excuse. Hanging up on you is more important than people being used or sacrificed, or sick, is it? God forbid you get sick or you get attacked for that as well.

 

I have no tolerance for excuses or blame games. You are going to let them screw over the lives of all of them and you won't stop it.

 

 

 

You sound blasé about this with no sense of urgency. Time is running out and the lives of all of them will be sacrificed-and for what? - Lies so your parents don't get yelled at.

 

 

Yes, it is fair to say. Don't make excuses for your mom!! Your mom felt that way BEFORE your brother fed them with the new lies- back when your mom said she LOVED the white girl and felt sorry for her but your brother should still avoid her, especially now because she was sick. Your mom believed R was sick when she said that and your mom still sh^t on the white girl. As soon as your mom found out she was sick you said she jumped all over using her sickness as another reason and excuse to validate why your brother can't have R now. The girl got sick so she was beneath them. Now you defend your mother and say she was indenial? What the hell was her problem BEFORE she heard your brothers lies? She still turned her back on the fallen.

 

 

 

 

You are blaming your parents for how you felt. True, they made you feel guilty later on, but -This is how you felt before the guilt, and it was not about your parents giving you guilt, see below:

 

 

 

I pulled this out of your other thread. Your parents are not to blame for you falling out of love with her at all. You are. It didn't have anything to do with guilt at all. You forgot her.

 

I think it is the opposite. I think it is your family trying to make you feel guilty and break you up that keeps you chained to your gf.

 

You have a good point about the girlfriend and guilt. I agree with you. I also completely agree about his mother and the white girl. Reactant annoyed me too defending and rationalizing his mom's cruelty when his mom had clearly told them before his brothers new lies that since the white girl was sick that gave her another good reason to have his brother stay away from her. We got angry with him first time around after he said his mom felt the white girl being sick was a good reason for his brother not to be with her. That WAS before the new lies his brother told about it being real, and we were angry then because his mom had bragged about how Indians...and herself...helped the fallen when they clearly do not unless they can get something out of them.

 

I worry about those boys because they are never going to be free at this rate. Reactant and Sadgati said their whole lives are planned out for them from the day they are born right down to what profession they are in or when and who they marry. They have never experienced freedom to make their own choices. They are told what they can choose from inside one box only but they have to ignore all of the other boxes. That isn't a choice, it is an ultimatum. They are slaves but I don't think he realizes just how enslaved and brainwashed they actually are. He catches them lying constantly, but he still goes back to believing the very next lie out of their mouths. It doesn't seem to occur to him to even listen for the lies and he should. He conveniently forgets the lies and believes them all over again. So, until or IF they ever learn to break free they will always ONLY be what other people expect them to be. They will never learn who they really are or be their own person but always puppets on a string.

 

His brother is throwing his life away and he told Reactant he was in no uncertain terms. I don't know why that FACT his brother clearly told him doesn't seem more important to Reactant than it does or why he acts like he doesn't care about his own brother. His brother said he had to self-sacrifice for his parents to marry brown and he would rather die. That horrifies me how a parent could do that to their own child. It horrifies me Reactant doesn't care about his own brother. If someone told me my child or my brother was going to sacrifice himself, I would step right in and fight for him. But, Reactant won't and he said it isn't his business if his brother sacrifices himself or not...what?? It is HIS brother and he told Reactant his intentions were to sacrifice himself so his parents won't be yelled at. Again, that horrified me too. They just don't seem to care deeply about each other in this family, just superficially, and superficial is all they care about the brown girl too or they wouldn't be using her like this either. This whole thing is abhorrent.

 

The boy follows orders blindly from his parents, brother and his girlfriend..., and I really don't think he can see he is doing this because he is too programmed not to do any of his own thinking. I don't believe he knows how to think for himself because someone else has always done his thinking for him.

 

I hope we aren't wasting our breath. I still have hope. You are right too, time is running out. If he lets his brother take that brown girl down as his sacrifice too I am going to be completely disgusted with him. I have no tolerance for people who USE people or keep their mouths shut when they know someone else is.

 

He can't trust anyone in his family because they have all lied to him continually. I bet that they guilt that boy and he apologizes to them but they never apologize back for one single lie he catches them in.

Edited February 11, 2010 by Karena

[Monkeeman]

I have been following this discussion for the last few months. Excuses, blame and denials flow like a river full of lies from this whole family. Your brother blames his relatives why he is sacrificing himself to marry a brown girl. He blames his white girlfriend for why he had to break up with her because she was born with white skin, not brown. You blame your parents for why you fell out of love with your girlfriend. You blame your girlfriend because you don't want to confront your brother because she (gf) decided something you can't remember so it must be right because it gives you an excuse not to do anything. Your mom blames, well hell..your mom blames everyone for everything because they aren't as good as she is. If it isn't your business, who the hells business is it? The neighbors? Who gets punished, beaten or whipped because of your indifference? The white girl. The brown girl. The aunt.

 

You are wasting your breath trying to help him because he doesn't give a damn. He is going to stall and make up excuses and he is going to blame everyone else just like his mom does until time runs out and then he has that as an excuse...oops I ran out of time. His brother will be sacrificed, the brown girl will be used, his white sister he loves (sarcasm) will possibly be dead. But, it isn't his business is it? He and his parents will be happy they left a trail of wounded, sacrificed or dead behind because they got their own selfish way and they don't get yelled at by relatives! Being yelled at is worse then sickness, death or sacrifices~??..But, it isn't their fault,-someone else made them do it, and you don't want them to be yelled at so that makes a valid excuse. Hanging up on you is more important than people being used or sacrificed, or sick, is it? God forbid you get sick or you get attacked for that as well.

 

I have no tolerance for excuses or blame games. You are going to let them screw over the lives of all of them and you won't stop it.

 

 

 

You sound blasé about this with no sense of urgency. Time is running out and the lives of all of them will be sacrificed-and for what? - Lies so your parents don't get yelled at.

 

 

Yes, it is fair to say. Don't make excuses for your mom!! Your mom felt that way BEFORE your brother fed them with the new lies- back when your mom said she LOVED the white girl and felt sorry for her but your brother should still avoid her, especially now because she was sick. Your mom believed R was sick when she said that and your mom still sh^t on the white girl. As soon as your mom found out she was sick you said she jumped all over using her sickness as another reason and excuse to validate why your brother can't have R now. The girl got sick so she was beneath them. Now you defend your mother and say she was indenial? What the hell was her problem BEFORE she heard your brothers lies? She still turned her back on the fallen.

 

 

 

 

You are blaming your parents for how you felt. True, they made you feel guilty later on, but -This is how you felt before the guilt, and it was not about your parents giving you guilt, see below:

 

 

 

I pulled this out of your other thread. Your parents are not to blame for you falling out of love with her at all. You are. It didn't have anything to do with guilt at all. You forgot her.

 

I think it is the opposite. I think it is your family trying to make you feel guilty and break you up that keeps you chained to your gf.

 

His mother is a VIRUS. Unless they install some anti-virus software the virus will comsume him and destroy him like it did his brother. The virus is reprogramming their way of thinking and writing over their ability to think coherently or independently of it. They need to reformat their hard drives so the virus isn't doing all of their thinking or making their moves for them. He is sending his brother off to hell. (What happened to his religion and his belief it was a sin? Did the virus kill that too?) Since he is allowing the virus to take over on this one, just wait until he sees what his family does to him on his next visit home. He is going to be easily broken because he won't fight it aggressively. His hard drive is going to be trashed and crashed. He needs to fight this virus aggressively now instead of being so lackadaisical about it. If the virus was on his computer would he wait until it takes over complete control of his computer, like he is letting it do to his brother and himself, or would he aggressively try to stop it? These are real life people he is ignoring the plight of. You can't fight a virus trying to be nice to it or appease it. It won't work, and it Will take over complete control of you. Each germ they send out you need to cut off and stop before it spreads. You can't ignore any one of them.

 

For Shark, Karena, Sadgati, Sparkling and anyone else I missed, congrats on your successful LDR relationships. I am in a successful one too. Karena, sorry for your loss.

 

The emotional blackmail book suggestions are good, but not if he doesn't see how he is allowing them to be a virus in his life and the life of his brother.

[Sadgati]

His mother is a VIRUS. Unless they install some anti-virus software the virus will comsume him and destroy him like it did his brother. The virus is reprogramming their way of thinking and writing over their ability to think coherently or independently of it. They need to reformat their hard drives so the virus isn't doing all of their thinking or making their moves for them. He is sending his brother off to hell. (What happened to his religion and his belief it was a sin? Did the virus kill that too?) Since he is allowing the virus to take over on this one, just wait until he sees what his family does to him on his next visit home. He is going to be easily broken because he won't fight it aggressively. His hard drive is going to be trashed and crashed. He needs to fight this virus aggressively now instead of being so lackadaisical about it. If the virus was on his computer would he wait until it takes over complete control of his computer, like he is letting it do to his brother and himself, or would he aggressively try to stop it? These are real life people he is ignoring the plight of. You can't fight a virus trying to be nice to it or appease it. It won't work, and it Will take over complete control of you. Each germ they send out you need to cut off and stop before it spreads. You can't ignore any one of them.

 

For Shark, Karena, Sadgati, Sparkling and anyone else I missed, congrats on your successful LDR relationships. I am in a successful one too. Karena, sorry for your loss.

 

The emotional blackmail book suggestions are good, but not if he doesn't see how he is allowing them to be a virus in his life and the life of his brother.

 

Thanks! Congratulations back at all of you who have had successful LDR's too.

 

I came in to see if Reactant had updated us yet, but he hasn't commented since Jan. 24th. In just a few more days it will have been one month since he last updated us. How disappointing, and I can't help but be concerned about the white girl, R.

 

Yes, a virus is a good description of his mom monkeeman! Man I hope he realizes it IS his business to confront or stop it. He can't afford to ignore his brother's engagment or Indian girl. What goes around comes around and Reactant's turn is coming next. Who will be there to help him? If all of us lose interest in trying to help him when he doesn't seem to care himself anymore..., he will be completely on his own later on.

 

He said this makes him feel dirty:

>>>he does mock me by speakign in a higher pitch tone and saying stuff like "i'm so self rightous, you shouldnt do that, and u shouldnt do that, and i've got truth on my side" then break out of 'character' and would say something like 'you think your suddenyl a saint?" I never like to mock people this way. I can and its not hard to poke fun at them but i feel i'd be going down to his level. I feel its playing dirty, and i dont like being dirty.

....BUT...!! This doesn't make him feel dirty?? Why not? >>>> When you put R (the white girl they all claim to love, his brother's real love - who they turned their backs on while she battled cancer and is now in a coma) -VERSUS- Brown Girl (the one his mom is forcing him to marry because of her colour and he does not love but is USING to make his mom's self status increase and hopes to USE to make relatives envy her...I keep recalling his brother's statements about he "would rather die than...", and how he doesn't have the courage to be the first one to marry white..)..who does Reactant choose to protect and defend? He turns his back on the white girl and sides with his family and the brown girl because he doesn't want to hurt the brown girl's feelings? But...it is ok to hurt the white girl and treat her like this? Reactant, IMHO you are down at their level and playing dirty right along with them since you know the truth and are ignoring it. You are helping, aiding, abetting, enabling, using someone for self gain, and that would make all of you so dirty that you reek from the fumes, toxic. Note the emotional blackmail statements from your book about how you help them!! You are giving them permission to treat people like this, so why doesn't this make you feel dirty?

 

I had hopes for him at first. My only conclusion would be he doesn't actually care what happens to anyone. There IS a time limit with the white girl in a coma and his brother's ridiculous engagement coming up. While thinking about this in an Indian mind frame context, his mom is completely totally selfish. She has been jealous and envious of her own family for years and it has eaten into her soul. If Reactant looks at her actions he will see she was VERY resentful and angry at those she felt were above her and she had to pay respect to in the past. So she SHOULD realize that the ones she 'thinks' are beneath her now won't be respecting her either. They will be forced to pretend, but it won't be real respect either, just more anger and resentment being passed down through the ages in typical Indian fashion. His mom has been the one who ENVIED because someone had a higher position in the Indian family than she did. Now she is consumed with jealousy and greed and has eaten up herself and her sons, and the white girl. She thinks her family will envy her but they won't. Not at all, they will dislike and resent their supposedly lower position just like she hated hers. You hear it all the time behind their backs. It is like kids in school trying to get the first new game console or game before anyone else, or wear only name brand clothes to show off, and it is IMMATURE!

 

You said your mom was scared she would lose control of your brother to the white girl he loves so she banned you, your brother and the rest of your family from communicating with R's family. Now that she has BANNED AND FORBIDDEN ALL OF YOU from speaking to any of them, YOUR MOM attacks them because they haven't furnished photos or other proof from anyone other than R's mom who notified you about the white girl, her daughter, in the coma. Your mom turns her back on them, demands and forces all of you to do the same, then she blames them for not communicating with her. She is the one who shut off the communication, but now she acts as if it is their fault she hasn't seen a photo. Do you see how twisted and conniving your mom really is? You are ok with that?

 

If you asked and R's family gave you a photo of R in a coma, would you even have the courage to show it to your mom or brother? If you showed your mom then you would be in trouble for communicating with R's family wouldn't you? Your mom has you so tightly controlled and tied up and you don't see it. But, you keep helping her play her evil games with people. She won't stop unless you see through it and make her. You feel dirty for standing up to your mom or brother, but you don't feel dirty for helping them use and hurt people.

 

When does a person wanting to be a doctor not realize that a life/lives is/are on the line and they need tended to ASAP. Do doctor's say wait, put your life on hold because my life is busy so I have to wait months to treat or help you IF EVER??

[Sparkling]

Thanks! Congratulations back at all of you who have had successful LDR's too.

 

I came in to see if Reactant had updated us yet, but he hasn't commented since Jan. 24th. In just a few more days it will have been one month since he last updated us. How disappointing, and I can't help but be concerned about the white girl, R.

 

Yes, a virus is a good description of his mom monkeeman! Man I hope he realizes it IS his business to confront or stop it. He can't afford to ignore his brother's engagment or Indian girl. What goes around comes around and Reactant's turn is coming next. Who will be there to help him? If all of us lose interest in trying to help him when he doesn't seem to care himself anymore..., he will be completely on his own later on.

 

He said this makes him feel dirty:

 

....BUT...!! This doesn't make him feel dirty?? Why not? >>>> When you put R (the white girl they all claim to love, his brother's real love - who they turned their backs on while she battled cancer and is now in a coma) -VERSUS- Brown Girl (the one his mom is forcing him to marry because of her colour and he does not love but is USING to make his mom's self status increase and hopes to USE to make relatives envy her...I keep recalling his brother's statements about he "would rather die than...", and how he doesn't have the courage to be the first one to marry white..)..who does Reactant choose to protect and defend? He turns his back on the white girl and sides with his family and the brown girl because he doesn't want to hurt the brown girl's feelings? But...it is ok to hurt the white girl and treat her like this? Reactant, IMHO you are down at their level and playing dirty right along with them since you know the truth and are ignoring it. You are helping, aiding, abetting, enabling, using someone for self gain, and that would make all of you so dirty that you reek from the fumes, toxic. Note the emotional blackmail statements from your book about how you help them!! You are giving them permission to treat people like this, so why doesn't this make you feel dirty?

 

I had hopes for him at first. My only conclusion would be he doesn't actually care what happens to anyone. There IS a time limit with the white girl in a coma and his brother's ridiculous engagement coming up. While thinking about this in an Indian mind frame context, his mom is completely totally selfish. She has been jealous and envious of her own family for years and it has eaten into her soul. If Reactant looks at her actions he will see she was VERY resentful and angry at those she felt were above her and she had to pay respect to in the past. So she SHOULD realize that the ones she 'thinks' are beneath her now won't be respecting her either. They will be forced to pretend, but it won't be real respect either, just more anger and resentment being passed down through the ages in typical Indian fashion. His mom has been the one who ENVIED because someone had a higher position in the Indian family than she did. Now she is consumed with jealousy and greed and has eaten up herself and her sons, and the white girl. She thinks her family will envy her but they won't. Not at all, they will dislike and resent their supposedly lower position just like she hated hers. You hear it all the time behind their backs. It is like kids in school trying to get the first new game console or game before anyone else, or wear only name brand clothes to show off, and it is IMMATURE!

 

You said your mom was scared she would lose control of your brother to the white girl he loves so she banned you, your brother and the rest of your family from communicating with R's family. Now that she has BANNED AND FORBIDDEN ALL OF YOU from speaking to any of them, YOUR MOM attacks them because they haven't furnished photos or other proof from anyone other than R's mom who notified you about the white girl, her daughter, in the coma. Your mom turns her back on them, demands and forces all of you to do the same, then she blames them for not communicating with her. She is the one who shut off the communication, but now she acts as if it is their fault she hasn't seen a photo. Do you see how twisted and conniving your mom really is? You are ok with that?

 

If you asked and R's family gave you a photo of R in a coma, would you even have the courage to show it to your mom or brother? If you showed your mom then you would be in trouble for communicating with R's family wouldn't you? Your mom has you so tightly controlled and tied up and you don't see it. But, you keep helping her play her evil games with people. She won't stop unless you see through it and make her. You feel dirty for standing up to your mom or brother, but you don't feel dirty for helping them use and hurt people.

 

When does a person wanting to be a doctor not realize that a life/lives is/are on the line and they need tended to ASAP. Do doctor's say wait, put your life on hold because my life is busy so I have to wait months to treat or help you IF EVER??

 

He seemed like a nice boy and my heart went out to him. Now, I don't know, it is wait and see.

 

Well, the emotional blackmail article he posted said it takes two and he is certainly doing what the article said...helping them do their dirty work for them.

 

Reactant, Decent people don't PRETEND everything is all right. Decent people don't act all nicety-nice to the perpetrators in situations like this. Those "nice qualities" are the qualities they use against you to control you. There comes a time when you need to take a stand and realize what is going to make you dirty is helping them and allowing them to do this. If it takes challenging them, mocking them, or fighting directly back to protect and defend these people and you, so be it. The scenario your family has created IS DIRTY. You need to scour away the dirt and sometimes being abrasive is the only thing to do and the only way to get rid of it.

 

-"Blackmail cannot work without the target’s active participation. The target gives it permission to occur."...>>>>>>>> You are actively helping your family, and giving them your permission to use, lie, hurt... What you may not realize is this is the direction they want you to go, so you are STILL IN THEIR CONTROL BEING MANIPULATED. If you help them do this with your brother, you are also giving them permission to do it TO YOU. If you aren't fighting against it, you are FOR it. This weakens you because you are approving it.

 

Think about it.

Edited February 22, 2010 by Sparkling

[Shark]

He seemed like a nice boy and my heart went out to him. Now, I don't know, it is wait and see.

 

Well, the emotional blackmail article he posted said it takes two and he is certainly doing what the article said...helping them do their dirty work for them.

 

Reactant, Decent people don't PRETEND everything is all right. Decent people don't act all nicety-nice to the perpetrators in situations like this. Those "nice qualities" are the qualities they use against you to control you. There comes a time when you need to take a stand and realize what is going to make you dirty is helping them and allowing them to do this. If it takes challenging them, mocking them, or fighting directly back to protect and defend these people and you, so be it. The scenario your family has created IS DIRTY. You need to scour away the dirt and sometimes being abrasive is the only thing to do and the only way to get rid of it.

 

-"Blackmail cannot work without the target’s active participation. The target gives it permission to occur."...>>>>>>>> You are actively helping your family, and giving them your permission to use, lie, hurt... What you may not realize is this is the direction they want you to go, so you are STILL IN THEIR CONTROL BEING MANIPULATED. If you help them do this with your brother, you are also giving them permission to do it TO YOU. If you aren't fighting against it, you are FOR it. This weakens you because you are approving it.

 

Think about it.

 

Great points! I agree!

 

What passes through my mind is when or if the white girl, R, wakes up, what is she going to see?? Will she see his brother engaged or even married by then?? Will she see that Reactant himself helped support his brother and his parents and feel even further betrayed? Will she know while she lay there fighting for her life none of them cared or bothered to help her even though they all, even his brother and his mother, say they love her?

 

She is the one my heart aches for, suffering and fighting a disease only to be betrayed by all of them because they can't be bothered because it might interfere with their plans for increased status and envy? I can't even begin to put myself in her shoes, or comprehend what her family must be feeling or suffering through.. Yet, Reactant concerns himself with something trivial as making him feel dirty in comparison to this abhorrent thing they are doing to this girl???????

 

Also, if I were Reactant, I would start telling his family his personal life, what he says or does is none of their business. They are busy bodies who stick their noses into other people's business, but they are the first to yell at him and tell him things are none of his business when he feels something is important enough to warrant being discussed. If they can't answer his questions or concerns without hanging up on him, he shouldn't feel obligated to respond to any of theirs. They only want information which they can use to harm people with or use against them, whereas Reactant was originally claiming he wanted to help. I hope he still does want to help. He needs to slam the phone down on them himself.

[Sparkling]

Great points! I agree!

 

Thank you Shark. It has been a month now since we received an update from him. I believe he said the ring ceremony was in April, and his first post was on Dec 1st. Look at how much time has passed he has allowed them to continue to play this depraved, immoral game with the lives of these people.

 

What passes through my mind is when or if the white girl, R, wakes up, what is she going to see?? Will she see his brother engaged or even married by then?? Will she see that Reactant himself helped support his brother and his parents and feel even further betrayed? Will she know while she lay there fighting for her life none of them cared or bothered to help her even though they all, even his brother and his mother, say they love her?

 

She is the one my heart aches for, suffering and fighting a disease only to be betrayed by all of them because they can't be bothered because it might interfere with their plans for increased status and envy? I can't even begin to put myself in her shoes, or comprehend what her family must be feeling or suffering through.. Yet, Reactant concerns himself with something trivial as making him feel dirty in comparison to this abhorrent thing they are doing to this girl???????

 

I worry about this too but it looks more and more like Reactant doesn't care at all. Strangers care more about her and show more concern for her than the family who claims they love her. Time is quickly passing by, I believe his term will be up, and the ring ceremony is around the corner. He has given more bonding time to the brown girl without consideration for how his family is using her either. It should have been stopped before she got sucked further into this sick, malicious game.

 

Cobra pointed out how in Reactant's last update he was back to making more excuses for his mom's cruelty and basically defending her treatment of R. I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw that Reactant had said that, as his mom clearly did use R's illness as an excuse for why they should ignore her even though they 'loved' her. His mother's actions had nothing to do with his brother or his lies at that time. His mother is pompous. Why, oh why does he keep making excuses for her, especially when he has caught her lying multiple times about everything. I love my mom, but if she behaved like that I would call her on it each time because I wouldn't want to help enable her or encourage her to get away with it.

 

Sometimes at night this topic goes circling through my head. It is completely frustrating to me. You want to shake some sense into all of them. I recall his brother said he HAD to marry a brown girl because he didn't have the courage to be the first one to marry his white girlfriend. (whom he loved) He said he can't..., but he wanted to if someone else in the family would do it first. That was also why they refused and demanded Reactant not to marry his white gf because he can't be the first one in the family to marry white. His brother also said he had to marry brown or his parents would be sacrificed, their lives would be NOTHING, and he would rather die than sacrifice his parents. But, his parent's 'big' dramatic sacrifice would simply be their family might? yell at them, they would be cast out like his aunt, and they wouldn't be envied like they want to be. Then that dramatic story fizzled out to nothing because Reactant really didn't see much difference in the treatment of his aunt at all, and in fact had noticed nothing different until his brother convinced him otherwise. He only had his brother's word on it. ..and we all have seen how many lies his brother has told to Reactant.

 

But, the reality is, his aunt still shows up at family events, he sees her interacting and having fun with other relatives, and she has NOT been cast out of the family at all.

 

So, the question is, who is really being sacrificed, and that leaves R, not his parents.

 

They have emotionally blackmailed his own brother, (and Reactant is helping to allow them) Just look at the emotions which came pouring out of his brother when he said he would rather die than sacrifice his parents so he HAD to marry a brown girl. His OWN mom has done this to him!!!!! His brother is being manipulated and made a fool of. He looks like a big dope, but his mother has played on his ego like a finely tuned instrument; the brown girl will be made a fool of and end up being used and marrying his brother's parents (his dad said she is there to marry the family because they chose her and want her), not his brother who loves someone else; and Reactant, if he CHOOSES TO go along with it and play their game of control and manipulation, plus emotional blackmail... are being led like sheep to the slaughter.

 

The worse thing they are doing by far is what they are doing to R. They have no heart, they have no shame.

 

I was thinking about this. His parents use Reactant trying to be nice as a tool against him to emotionally blackmail him with, and they also use his naivete against him. With his brother, they use his pride and ego as the tools to emotionally blackmail him with as those seem to be his weakest areas. They continue to play both of those boy's.

Edited February 26, 2010 by Sparkling