It's Just Amusing at This Point

[randall]

I'm not going to address your last reply to my post as it wouldn't be productive. I just wanted to add that apearlfromgrit's advice is an excellent starting point. It's what many people have been trying to get at, although in perhaps less direct words.

[silverfish]

I would love to know the response to her post too

Edited February 8, 2010 by silverfish

[purgatori]

I would love to know the response to her post too

 

My reply, you mean? Apearlfromgrit has given me a lot to mull over, and I will continue to do so. I am immsensely grateful for her (and others) efforts, but I do not judge that a reply, beyond what I have already written, to be prudent.

 

Even now I struggle to elabore further without making statements which will be perceived as being negative/self-defeating/whatever, so I think that it is best to just leave it there.

[silverfish]

My reply, you mean? Apearlfromgrit has given me a lot to mull over, and I will continue to do so. I am immsensely grateful for her (and others) efforts, but I do not judge that a reply, beyond what I have already written, to be prudent.

 

Even now I struggle to elabore further without making statements which will be perceived as being negative/self-defeating/whatever, so I think that it is best to just leave it there.

 

That's absolutely fine, I was just curious! Actually I copied it for myself as I think I could do well to read that every now & then...and maybe a few other people I know too. Its hard to walk the line between over / under confidence on a daily basis

[apearlfromgrit]

I just want to tell you, Purgatori, how flattered I am that you have chosen to act on my advice by considering what you say not just in terms of expressing yourself, but in terms of how you will be perceived by others. I do, however want to assure you that I didn't ever mean to advocate or imply that you should censor yourself or keep yourself from expressing your feelings or opinions. Your intelligence is obvious to anyone who had read this thread and it's been remarked on several times. I am confident that with a mind like yours, you can find a way to express yourself in a way that others don't find confrontational. I hope that before long we hear from you again at length with all of your insights and less of (what is perceived as) your aggression. Please, don't simply go silent, it would be a tremendous loss.

[purgatori]

I just want to tell you, Purgatori, how flattered I am that you have chosen to act on my advice by considering what you say not just in terms of expressing yourself, but in terms of how you will be perceived by others. I do, however want to assure you that I didn't ever mean to advocate or imply that you should censor yourself or keep yourself from expressing your feelings or opinions. Your intelligence is obvious to anyone who had read this thread and it's been remarked on several times. I am confident that with a mind like yours, you can find a way to express yourself in a way that others don't find confrontational. I hope that before long we hear from you again at length with all of your insights and less of (what is perceived as) your aggression. Please, don't simply go silent, it would be a tremendous loss.

 

Thankyou apearlfromgrit, that is very kind. I know that one of the things that you, and others, took issue with though, was my negativity, and I have very little to add that will not be perceived as being negative. In all honesty, although I am still processing what you have written, I really do think that it highlights several key areas that I need to work on in order to be a better person, particularly with regard to how I interact with others.

 

The question I ask myself, though, is do I really want to be a better person? And the answer at the moment is: I'm not so sure. I certainly can censor what I say about, for instance, 'the objects of my desire, and the objects of their desire', but I am unwilling or unable to let go of the resentment that gave rise to those comments in the first pace.

 

Perhaps it is because I am still as conviced as ever that my situation is hopeless, and the hate makes me feel somewhat less helpless, while also acting as an antidote to the attachment and longing (since it devalues that which I long for). Needless to say that this is not the only contributing factor, and I think that I may have even touched on some of the others in previous posts, or at least furnished enough material for readers to make their own inferences.

 

As for my conviction that my situation is hopeless, well, I know that other posters (in fact, the majority, it seems) seem to believe otherwise, and I wish to make it clear that I do not think this is owning to a lack of intelligence, or even blind-optimism, on their part. Rather it is most likely due to a combination of not having access to as much data about me as, well, me... as well as the deficiency in my ability to convey said data.

 

That said, even given the paucity of the data I have been able to provide, other people on these forums, yourself among them, have demonstrated to me that I am not cognizant of every fact pertaining to myself (and not just when it comes to those things which are hidden away in unconscious processes). Still, the notion that any amount of self-improvement would increase my chances with the likes of, say, Sarah Michelle Gellar (I wish I could say that I was picking her at random, but the reality is that she is my biggest crush, and the one around whom my fantasies have orbited during my most lonesome moments -- yes, that's how sad I am), is still a bit of a reach for me.

 

So there you have it. Disappointing, I know.

[apearlfromgrit]

Don't give a thought to my disappointment, I don't factor into this. We're talking about your life here.

So, I want to make sure I've got this right...

Is the TL;DR of this that you want to keep what you have by not changing, even if it's pain and anger because you don't know if changing will get you what you want?

Have the people here failed in their efforts to convince you that it is the change itself that is the reward and that a new you, freed of that pain and anger by your own effort, will attract your very own Buffy? If so, is this because it just sounds preposterous or is it because you're hesitant to give up the pain and anger that you know so well because it's become the part of you you recognize most?

 

Because I really empathize with you if this is the case. And just as I know very little about you, you know very little about me so I guess you'll just have to take my word for it. And you seem like a very detail-oriented and fact-based decision-maker so I'm sure it's frustrating to defend your choices without being able to point to specific examples to support them. (I'm a law student so boy do I grok that.) But what I know best is my own case. And I tell you that relinquishing the idea I had of myself as being a victim of my own life was frightening and painful because it was my identity. It was what I knew about myself and giving it up was walking into mystery unarmed with the certainty of knowing myself. It felt like an unforgivable sacrifice, like I was conceding to the demands of people who never understood me in the first place. But it was only when I did give it up that I realized that it was I who misunderstood. Not others, but myself. And it was I who had made myself a victim by devaluing myself, counting myself out and assuming that the rest of the world "got it" while I was just too much of an outsider to even begin to understand. I'm still a little pissed about it to be honest because I hate being wrong and I'm still a little lost sometimes without my angry compass telling me who I am.

 

But the rewards. Oh, the rewards. I won't bore you with specifics but suffice it to say that I feel now like a hot commodity instead of a dented can in the discount bin, swelling with botulism and wondering why no one wants to take me home. And life is still a struggle in many ways, but it's not the kind of struggle that leaves me breathless and crushed at the thought of another day, it's more like the kind of struggle I mentioned in my first post: the struggle of doing something that feels impossible until I chip away at it piece by piece until I can point to a mountain turned to dust by efforts.

 

You've heard what I have to say and I'm sure I'm on the verge of repeating myself ad nauseum. So here's my last pitch: changing the way you relate to other people and to yourself is like speaking a new language because while at first you have to consciously translate from negative to positive, eventually it becomes second nature and it will change your life. I was poisoning myself with my anger and everyone around me could smell the stink of it and kept away. I rid myself of it and now I attract the kind of people who are drawn to the most beautiful flowers. Stupid metaphor, clearly time for me to quit.

 

I've spent way more than my two cents on this conversation so I'll try to keep my over-sharing, too-talkative self on a leash from now on. Good Night, Good Luck and Keep in Touch.

Edited February 9, 2010 by apearlfromgrit

[purgatori]

Don't give a thought to my disappointment, I don't factor into this. We're talking about your life here.

So, I want to make sure I've got this right...

Is the TL;DR of this that you want to keep what you have by not changing, even if it's pain and anger because you don't know if changing will get you what you want?

Have the people here failed in their efforts to convince you that it is the change itself that is the reward and that a new you, freed of that pain and anger by your own effort, will attract your very own Buffy? If so, is this because it just sounds preposterous or is it because you're hesitant to give up the pain and anger that you know so well because it's become the part of you you recognize most?

 

Because I really empathize with you if this is the case. And just as I know very little about you, you know very little about me so I guess you'll just have to take my word for it. And you seem like a very detail-oriented and fact-based decision-maker so I'm sure it's frustrating to defend your choices without being able to point to specific examples to support them. (I'm a law student so boy do I grok that.) But what I know best is my own case. And I tell you that relinquishing the idea I had of myself as being a victim of my own life was frightening and painful because it was my identity. It was what I knew about myself and giving it up was walking into mystery unarmed with the certainty of knowing myself. It felt like an unforgivable sacrifice, like I was conceding to the demands of people who never understood me in the first place. But it was only when I did give it up that I realized that it was I who misunderstood. Not others, but myself. And it was I who had made myself a victim by devaluing myself, counting myself out and assuming that the rest of the world "got it" while I was just too much of an outsider to even begin to understand. I'm still a little pissed about it to be honest because I hate being wrong and I'm still a little lost sometimes without my angry compass telling me who I am.

 

But the rewards. Oh, the rewards. I won't bore you with specifics but suffice it to say that I feel now like a hot commodity instead of a dented can in the discount bin, swelling with botulism and wondering why no one wants to take me home. And life is still a struggle in many ways, but it's not the kind of struggle that leaves me breathless and crushed at the thought of another day, it's more like the kind of struggle I mentioned in my first post: the struggle of doing something that feels impossible until I chip away at it piece by piece until I can point to a mountain turned to dust by efforts.

 

You've heard what I have to say and I'm sure I'm on the verge of repeating myself ad nauseum. So here's my last pitch: changing the way you relate to other people and to yourself is like speaking a new language because while at first you have to consciously translate from negative to positive, eventually it becomes second nature and it will change your life. I was poisoning myself with my anger and everyone around me could smell the stink of it and kept away. I rid myself of it and now I attract the kind of people who are drawn to the most beautiful flowers. Stupid metaphor, clearly time for me to quit.

 

I've spent way more than my two cents on this conversation so I'll try to keep my over-sharing, too-talkative self on a leash from now on. Good Night, Good Luck and Keep in Touch.

 

 

I guess that's sort-of the TL:DR, although I'd probably rephrase it in the following way: "I want to hold on to the anger because it helps me deal with the pain (albeit in a maladaptive way) that I know will still be there even if the anger was dissolved." I have been suffering from this pain for quite a long time, but the anger is a more recent invention.

 

Yes, people here have failed in their efforts to convince me of this, and it is because it sounds preposterous to me. This is largely because in all my 28 years I've never really even come close to attracting my own Buffy (although I won't lie and tell you that never, ever, did a pretty girl who wasn't completely bonkers show *some* interest in me). Perhaps you're right and I have been "radiating" negativity and other similarly unappealing vibes, and that this is why women give me a wide berth; my studies certainly leave me open to that idea. The other problem I have, though, is that I never see girls like her with guys like me. Once again this could be confirmation bias on my part, but at the moment, I remain unconvinced.

 

As for it being the part of me that I recognize most... well, it's quickly becoming that way, but at first it felt like a foreign body in my system. Not to say that I was ever was ever a completely serene being whose nature was complete devoid of pollutants (that, I believe, is not possible within the confines of human nature), but the anger and resentment played second-fiddle to the better parts of my nature. Now, I fear, that very-nearly the reverse might be true.

 

So while it may not have quite become the defining element of my identity just yet, I can certainly relate to what you describe as your "angry compass", and why the fear of letting go of such a device is very real. My anger doesn't necessarily point the way forward (at least not to a degree that I consciously appreciate), but it is something of a "security blanket" (to trot out a severely worn cliche), without which I would feel even more vulnerable than I do now.

 

If you came back from feeling crushed at the thought of another day, then I commend you for a strength that I haven't managed to find yet. I am still at that point, and although I am reasonably "high functioning", I still fail to see how confronting all the challenges that each day brings are really worth it when my 'reward' at the end of the day is retiring to an empty bed. Such an attitude may strike people as petty, excessively needy, entitled, or I don't-know-what, but that is the way I feel.

 

Thanks again -- I just feel guilty that you've had to repeat yourself so many times, and yet here I still am, not getting it

[altonjone]

This is so disappointing. I wish that some positive aspects must come up within .

[apearlfromgrit]

If you came back from feeling crushed at the thought of another day, then I commend you for a strength that I haven't managed to find yet. I am still at that point, and although I am reasonably "high functioning", I still fail to see how confronting all the challenges that each day brings are really worth it when my 'reward' at the end of the day is retiring to an empty bed. Such an attitude may strike people as petty, excessively needy, entitled, or I don't-know-what, but that is the way I feel.

 

Thanks again -- I just feel guilty that you've had to repeat yourself so many times, and yet here I still am, not getting it

 

If you "got it" after a few posts on an internet forum, I would doubt your sincerity. And guilty? Please. I clearly love to shoot my mouth off so you've just given me a chance to do that.

 

You ask: What's the point if you go home to an empty bed? Well, you're going home to an empty bed now. And I can pretty much guarantee that you will continue to go home to an empty bed if you stay this course. Yes, I go home to an empty bed but I (a) don't mind as much because it no longer feels like it's evidence that the universe hates me and I'm cursed to a life of loneliness and (b) know now that it won't be empty forever because I attract people now instead of repelling them. Changing isn't like running a race. There's no line to cross so you know when you're done, you don't get handed a trophy immediately upon finishing. Changing is, like I said before, learning a new language. At first you have to consciously think about it and you're left, sometimes, without the words to express yourself. But eventually your vocabulary grows and you no longer have to translate your thoughts into something other people can understand, it all becomes seamless, effortless. It gets easier as you go along. And there's no trophy. So single reward. Instead it's all reward. All of it. Literally.

 

Let's just say you put in the effort, drag yourself kicking and screaming into a new way of being and a year from now everything changes, except you still don't have a girlfriend. You may ask now, from this side of it, "well, what's the point, then?" All I can do is assure you that the point is the change itself. And that the girlfriend, like the trophy, will cease to be the only goal you care about. And the girlfriend will become just one piece of the larger reward. And the girlfriend will happen. The girlfriend will happen.

[soup]

Nice that you are getting somewhere with this thread.

 

I just wanted to add something fairly tangential but maybe useful to you: that it is possible to be a masculine male without being an abuser, a football hooligan, a bad dad etc etc.

 

I'm not suggesting you should aspire to be that way. I just don't want you to go around hating a large group of people just for being themselves. It is so important to you to be YOURself after all.

 

I want you to know that there are men in the world who are strong, outwardly-confident etc, who also love art/music, are caring, have inner insecurities etc.

 

I think it's a shame for you to hate half the men in the world for any reason, whether it's to do with "competition" for female attention, or your dad or whatever, the reason doesn't matter.

 

I have a friend who's a 6 ft skinhead, looks like a policeman, fantastic painter and warm loving guy. I have another friend who is a successful rapper with all the silly image that entails, who views it as a fun career and is passionate about architecture and design and all kinds of music.

 

I am a straight, non-macho guy maybe outwardly something like you.

 

I know it's not totally relevant but it's something to think about when you are apparently so antipathetic towards so-called masculine men. They are not the reason for you unhappiness. It's perhaps one thread of your tangle that you can fairly easily discard and help simplify your thoughts.

[purgatori]

If you "got it" after a few posts on an internet forum, I would doubt your sincerity. And guilty? Please. I clearly love to shoot my mouth off so you've just given me a chance to do that.

 

You ask: What's the point if you go home to an empty bed? Well, you're going home to an empty bed now. And I can pretty much guarantee that you will continue to go home to an empty bed if you stay this course. Yes, I go home to an empty bed but I (a) don't mind as much because it no longer feels like it's evidence that the universe hates me and I'm cursed to a life of loneliness and (b) know now that it won't be empty forever because I attract people now instead of repelling them. Changing isn't like running a race. There's no line to cross so you know when you're done, you don't get handed a trophy immediately upon finishing. Changing is, like I said before, learning a new language. At first you have to consciously think about it and you're left, sometimes, without the words to express yourself. But eventually your vocabulary grows and you no longer have to translate your thoughts into something other people can understand, it all becomes seamless, effortless. It gets easier as you go along. And there's no trophy. So single reward. Instead it's all reward. All of it. Literally.

 

Let's just say you put in the effort, drag yourself kicking and screaming into a new way of being and a year from now everything changes, except you still don't have a girlfriend. You may ask now, from this side of it, "well, what's the point, then?" All I can do is assure you that the point is the change itself. And that the girlfriend, like the trophy, will cease to be the only goal you care about. And the girlfriend will become just one piece of the larger reward. And the girlfriend will happen. The girlfriend will happen.

 

I guess I can give it another year...

 

Nice that you are getting somewhere with this thread.

 

I just wanted to add something fairly tangential but maybe useful to you: that it is possible to be a masculine male without being an abuser, a football hooligan, a bad dad etc etc.

 

I'm not suggesting you should aspire to be that way. I just don't want you to go around hating a large group of people just for being themselves. It is so important to you to be YOURself after all.

 

I want you to know that there are men in the world who are strong, outwardly-confident etc, who also love art/music, are caring, have inner insecurities etc.

 

I think it's a shame for you to hate half the men in the world for any reason, whether it's to do with "competition" for female attention, or your dad or whatever, the reason doesn't matter.

 

I have a friend who's a 6 ft skinhead, looks like a policeman, fantastic painter and warm loving guy. I have another friend who is a successful rapper with all the silly image that entails, who views it as a fun career and is passionate about architecture and design and all kinds of music.

 

I am a straight, non-macho guy maybe outwardly something like you.

 

I know it's not totally relevant but it's something to think about when you are apparently so antipathetic towards so-called masculine men. They are not the reason for you unhappiness. It's perhaps one thread of your tangle that you can fairly easily discard and help simplify your thoughts.

 

My best friend through primary school and into my high-school years towered above everyone else, and yet he was a deep thinker and extremely creative (also a bit of a ruffian, though ). He is but one of many such men I have encountered in my life who were very masculine, but ultimately "good guys", so I do take your point.

 

I still hate them, regardless, though. It's not even so much because of who they are, but what women see in them, and a lifetime of bad associations that outweigh the good many times over. I'm not about to sit here an pretend that my reasons are legitimate or fair, but to deny the hatred would be dishonest.

 

When you are constantly bombarded with the message that you are not really a man (this part I am ok with), and so are not perceived as attractive/worthwhile by women (this part I am not ok with), you soon become resentful; unless of course you are a better person than I, which I assume you must be if you do not also harbor such resentment.

 

Anyway, thanks for your input.

[Eeyore79]

I'm a reasonably attractive and feminine girl, and I don't particularly like overly masculine men. I can't help thinking that you're tarring all women with the same brush and assuming they all like the same thing, which isn't true.

 

Of course I want a man to be somewhat confident and have some self esteem, but being all butch and loud and cocky is incredibly off-putting. To be honest I tend to associate that sort of behaviour with low intelligence, which is why I find it off-putting. But then again, I also find the same type of behaviour to be off-putting in girls and it makes me not want to be friends with them. In both friendships and relationships, I prefer to spend my time with quiet and intelligent people like myself.

 

I can't help wondering if your aversion to overt masculinity is simply the natural tendency of the intelligent to feel repulsed by the unintelligent? Do you also feel somewhat put-off by cocky and loud women, regardless of their looks? I will admit that the majority of women are attracted to butch and cocky men, but let's face it: at least half of those women necessarily have a below average IQ, and few of the remainder are going to fall into the top few percent where you are. The curse of being extremely bright is that the vast majority of people seem somewhat coarse in comparison; perhaps men more so than women, given their often coarse behaviour. Perhaps the undesirable traits you define as "masculine" are simply the coarse, unintelligent and animalistic traits? I have no desire to exhibit those traits any more than you do, or to be in a relationship with someone who exhibits them.

 

Ultimately I think that the shortage of women who are attracted to you is simply related to the shortage of women who appreciate refined intellectual traits rather than the base animalistic traits which so many masculine men exhibit. That doesn't mean that such women don't exist though - but you should be aware that you're probably looking for a woman of rather high intelligence and should not be discouraged when those who do not fit that criteron reject you.

 

I do sense a great deal of negativity and unhappiness in you though, and perhaps a feeling of low social worth; traits which are not attractive in anyone. Your general negative attitude and lack of acceptance (hatred?) of other people is incredibly off-putting despite your other positive qualities. My mother always told me that just because you are a certain way, that doesn't give you the right to hate others who were born a different way - whether that's a different skin colour or religion, or a different level of intelligence or masculinity. You're extremely lucky to have been born intelligent and refined, but you shouldn't dislike other men who weren't as fortunate as you. OK, perhaps the majority of women don't like you, but statistically the majority of women (in fact people in general) aren't that bright anyway.

 

One more comment: Perhaps your crush on Sarah Michelle Gellar derives somewhat from the fact that in Buffy she plays an extremely capable and somewhat masculine woman who can take care of herself; she has a feminine appearance but masculine behaviour. What do you think? Perhaps you're looking for a relationship with a woman who is assertive and a little masculine in her behaviour? Such women do exist (me being one of them - alpha males annoy me because they don't do what I tell them to ).

[soup]

I still hate them, regardless, though. It's not even so much because of who they are, but what women see in them, and a lifetime of bad associations that outweigh the good many times over. I'm not about to sit here an pretend that my reasons are legitimate or fair, but to deny the hatred would be dishonest.

 

Perhaps you can concede that since your hatred is neither legitimate nor fair, it might be a positive step to try and get over it or at least look beyond it as a reason for your own unhappiness.

 

Prejudice is not an attractive quality.

 

As the above poster pointed out, lots of women, even really hot ones, are attracted to sensitive guys, skinny guys, guys with big ears... but nobody is attracted to people who are full of hatred.

 

you are constantly bombarded with the message that you are not really a man

 

Are you really? I have always been skinny, underweight, useless at sport, maybe average looking. I have had all kinds of problems and ups and downs but do not feel bombarded with this message. I get on OK with different kinds of people although I prefer those who can speak interestingly.

 

You seem able to consider things with quite an open mind, so how about this: Is it possible that you are creating a kind of straw-man reason for why women don't find you attractive? You think it's because of your lack of sportiness or machismo but maybe it's more to do with your lack of empathy for others and your readiness to hate and blame? If they just wanted macho men you wouldn't have had any "near-misses" at all would you? It was after they spent time with you that they got scared off, wasn't it?

 

AAAAAND.....

 

You want a woman who is intelligent enough to not enjoy the company of goons, but stupid enough to want to dress sexy / do hair and make-up designed to attract YOU on a simple animal basis. There's a contradiction there. You want a stereotyped "hot" girl who is intellingent, no compromise, but you're only prepared to offer intelligence in return. You're not prepared to make yourself "hot" in a similar way by going to the gym or whatever because that would be being untrue to yourself. It's a very one-sided view of how things ought to be. It's classic "yes but I'm ME!" foot-stamping.

[purgatori]

Eeyore, you're quite right about my aversion to people who are loud, cocky, and so-on, crossing the gender divide. Once I encounter this sort of behaviour from a woman, she instantly becomes unattractive to me, regardless of how attractive I thought she was from a distance.

 

The rest of what you say makes a lot of sense to me as well, except that I have observed a preference for high degrees of masculinity among even very intelligent women; women, who were, far more intelligent than me, in fact. Dialoguing with such women is always great until the moment when you are swallowed up by the shadow of some great lumbering hulk who she introduces as her boyfriend. At that point, said boyfriend usually exclaims 'MEAT!' at the top of his voice while thumping the table, requiring her to suspend the discussion in progress so that she can assure him that the fried steer he ordered will be along shortly, and that the nice waiter man didn't eat it for himself (this accountmay be subject to some amount of exaggeration ).

 

On a more serious note, however, I do take the point that both you and soup are making with regard to my negativity/prejudice/what-have-you not being particularly attractive qualities. I should point out, though, that the extreme lack of tolerance shown quite openly to me by members of the "jock" class during my highschool years never seemed to put much of a damper on their love lives, so I don't quite understand how my comparatively mild intolerance that I don't ordinarily disclose to anyone should have relegated me to this monastic existence I've got going.

 

My near misses... well, who knows if they were really near-misses or just wishful thinking on my part, but my lack of continued contact with the women in question certainly wasn't due to my blurting out 'oh and by the way, I totally hate macho guys; yep, scum of the earth. What do you think of the band?' So who knows... I'm more inclined to think that they found my girly manner off-putting, or at least an indicator that they might have been barking up the wrong tree

 

Sorry, soup, but I see no contradiction in wanting a pretty/feminine girl who is also intelligent. Grooming actually isn't as much of a priority for me as individual style; in fact, I often find a pretty girl with no makeup and wearing only casual attire far more attractive than someone who is 'done up to the nines', as they say (do they say?). I also have a real thing for girls with dreadlocks and "oddball" attire (oh, and I have dreadlocks myself). Another slight correction is that I am prepared to make myself 'hot in a similar way', as long as that way is really similar. In fact, I already go to a lot of trouble to wear nice/interesting clothes, smell nice, keep my weight down (actually, this part isn't so much trouble because I am a vegan with a small appetite ), and I'd even wear makeup if I didn't think this would result in the rather counter-productive outcome of having my face cosmetically restructured by boot, fist, and pavement. If I thought that going to the gym and so on would make me 'hot' then I'd do it, but the results would not conform to my perception of hotness.

 

I think you're quite right about the source of my attraction there, Eeyore. I too have made similar speculations, especially given that the types of women I am drawn to (whether they be real or fictional) tends to fall into a pretty reliable pattern. Even my user handle on this site is borrowed from an extremely "kick-ass" female character. What I liked about Buffy so much was precisely the mixture of traits of which you speak. My only point of departure from what you describe is that I wouldn't so much characterize her behavior as being 'masculine' as such, as her mannerisms, interests, and so on were all very feminine as well, but her assertiveness, self-reliance, and courageousness all made for what I think of as a kind of 'unshackled' femininity. Not only do I desire a relationship with someone like that, as you quite rightly identify, but women like that are also an inspiration to me, as they represent a way of being that is very much in accordance with my 'ideal self.'

 

I must also admit that I am very pleased to hear that alpha males find you annoying

[TouchedByViolet]

Since you are vegan have you tried meeting women who work for PETA? They will fall for your feminine side, intelligence, beliefs and communication skills. You could have those ladies hook, line and sinker.

 

Also, hate is a destructive word. Ironically, a person using the word usually gets hurt more than the person being hated on. I feel like hate is created from suffering in our past. People like schoolmates, friends, and family may have been a bad example and treated you poorly and now you have a prejudice towards a certain type of personality because you associate it with wrong doings done to you. This is not productive or accurate. I think growing up and being mature is to accept the past and move on without transferring dislike from past figures to current and future ones. I think if a person spreads less hate they will like themselves more and others will like more as well.

[purgatori]

Since you are vegan have you tried meeting women who work for PETA? They will fall for your feminine side, intelligence, beliefs and communication skills. You could have those ladies hook, line and sinker.

 

Also, hate is a destructive word. Ironically, a person using the word usually gets hurt more than the person being hated on. I feel like hate is created from suffering in our past. People like schoolmates, friends, and family may have been a bad example and treated you poorly and now you have a prejudice towards a certain type of personality because you associate it with wrong doings done to you. This is not productive or accurate. I think growing up and being mature is to accept the past and move on without transferring dislike from past figures to current and future ones. I think if a person spreads less hate they will like themselves more and others will like more as well.

 

No, I haven't tried meeting women who work for PETA. I don't much like PETA, and they don't much like me (I am part of an institution which does use live animals in medical research). There are other animal-welfare organizations out there which I have much more respect for, however, and so it may be worth my becoming involved with them, and seeing if I meet any nice girls in the process (even though I must confess that I STILL don't hold up much hope that -- so thanks for your suggestion!

 

You're probably right about the whole hate thing too... and I the psychoanalyst in me especially appreciates the reference to 'transference.' It's so much easier to hate than deal with the pain which underlies it in my case, though, and I really can't imagine what else I could put in its place. It used to be that I could live by the code of Chaucer's heroes, wherein the agony of unrequited love, however unbearable, was also a source of strength and inspiration. Such a code was impossible for me to maintain, however, when I could no longer hold back from conscious awareness the fact that the object(s) of my admiration gave themselves (and at least to some degree: subjugated themselves) to men who were not worthy of them. My longing and devotion would be a source of great amusement for both parties, and the knowledge of this stirred a great deal of resentment in me. Of course, none of this changes the fact that you are right, I merely wish to convey that I am somewhat dependent on the hatred at this point in time, and so I do not find it easy to discard, regardless of any rational considerations.

[purgatori]

Add another woman, whom I seemed to be getting along with, suddenly ceasing all contact with me. What is the point of even trying to reach to other people anymore? So goddamned sick of this $#|t.

[Beccakeil]

Add another woman, whom I seemed to be getting along with, suddenly ceasing all contact with me. What is the point of even trying to reach to other people anymore? So goddamned sick of this $#|t.

 

I believe I understand you. I used to be like you.

You know a lot. Perhaps too much. I perhaps the same problem as you do... Or had it anyway. I am not ugly in any way, and before, it seemed all the other girls got the boys. And all the boys I got were way too stupid for me, therefore I have not had a boyfriend. Because I have denied everysingle one of them. Well perhaps I only said yes to one... But that ended soon enough and by my hand. Realising that being alone is way better than being with a complete jackass.

 

If you do not mind I would like to be your friend.

It's not that hard to make friends. Shall we try? ^^

[purgatori]

I believe I understand you. I used to be like you.

You know a lot. Perhaps too much. I perhaps the same problem as you do... Or had it anyway. I am not ugly in any way, and before, it seemed all the other girls got the boys. And all the boys I got were way too stupid for me, therefore I have not had a boyfriend. Because I have denied everysingle one of them. Well perhaps I only said yes to one... But that ended soon enough and by my hand. Realising that being alone is way better than being with a complete jackass.

 

If you do not mind I would like to be your friend.

It's not that hard to make friends. Shall we try? ^^

 

I am very flattered that you would like to be my friend; especially given that some of my posts on this forum do not necessarily show me at my 'best.'

 

Do you use any instant-messenging clients like MSN/Yahoo/Google Talk, etc.? If not, it's no problem, but I just find it a somewhat easier way to communicate than exchanging messages on a forum.

 

PS: I tried to send this as a private message, but received an error message, for some reason.

[Beccakeil]

I am very flattered that you would like to be my friend; especially given that some of my posts on this forum do not necessarily show me at my 'best.'

 

Do you use any instant-messenging clients like MSN/Yahoo/Google Talk, etc.? If not, it's no problem, but I just find it a somewhat easier way to communicate than exchanging messages on a forum.

 

PS: I tried to send this as a private message, but received an error message, for some reason.

 

In fact I do ^^ I also find it easier to communicate that way as well. I'll try to send a private message. ^^

[Beccakeil]

I couldn't find a way... So here it goes... [email protected]