What is she looking for from me?

[lovesick74]

I've been reading the forums and different posts trying to find answers. I've posted my story on another site but I'm hoping to maybe reach some new eyes: Here goes...

 

Ok, here's my story....My wife and I have been married for about 6 years. We have a three year old daughter together. We've gone through a period of mutual neglect both emotionally and physically since about January of this year. Back in August, we had gotten into a big fight and it got to the point where we both agreed that maybe we shouldn't be married. I moved into a spare room and she stayed in the bedroom. Usually after a fight, we're both able to step back and work things out. Not this time.....About 3 to four weeks later, she filed papers. Since then, my mindset was to work things out. We had so much to lose to throw it away now. She told me that for too long she's felt like she hasn't been heard and her feelings seemed not to matter to me. I admit, I would counter her feelings with evidence that to me, proved her feelings were unfounded. She's moved into an apartment with our daughter and left me with the house. I've since done the marriage counselor thing and continue to do so. I now realize what effect this had on her. I've talked to her about this and have apologized for reacting this way. I'm grateful for the fact that we're able to talk amicably about our relationship. I've seen her go from a one way course to divorce to being able to sit down and talk about things. So much so that she had delayed the initial divorce date to January. It was kind of ironic that on our inital day of divorce (Dec 3rd) we were sitting down for dinner instead of standing in front of a judge dividing our assets.

Where we currently stand, is that she's starting to open up emotionally to me. We can call each other, talk about our day at work, talk about our daughter, even just hang out together. Last night she said that she's still feeling blocked on the physical side of things. Meaning she'll give me a kiss when we meet and when we leave but nothing else. We can cuddle, but as soon as things start to heat up, she'll stop me and say she's not ready.

My question is, could this just be a temporary thing? Is this part of the healing process? Or is she feeling that our relationship is so damaged that physical intimacy is just not emotionally possible? She tells me that she's still unsure if the changes she needs to see are possible or if they would be long lasting. I do my best to try and convince her that I'm committed to her and understanding her feelings. I recognize the mistakes I've made in our past and don't want to repeat them. I know whether it's a relationship with her or someone new these are changes I need to introduce. Still, I sense reluctance on her part to give me a shot at proving this. Is there anything I can do to help quell her fears? Will it just take more time? Or is our relationship so poisoned that there's no coming back??

 

Well, I wanted to post an update on my situation. My wife and I still seem to talk quite often. She'll send me a funny e-mail or call out of the blue to tell me a funny story about my daughter. She's even invited me to join her along with our daughter for dinners. There are times we can hang out and just talk about all sorts of stuff like her job, family, and whatever. There are other times, where I'll try and ask her about us. She responds very open and honestly (it seems anyway) She still contends that she's not sure what she wants out of life. That she's enjoying the freedom of being single and that she's not sure why her feelings are so numb when it comes to us. When I ask her what she's looking for in the future, whether it's to remain single, date or something long term with someone, she responds that she wants to look for something long term. I then asked her if she feels the freedoms that she's enjoying now would go away once she had a long term partner would go away, she responded by saying that she knew they would eventually.

I guess I'm just so confused by all of this. I feel that I'm the one that can meet her needs, dreams and desires if given a 2nd chance. She just doesn't seem to want to be open to anything else but friends. My question is, is there a possibility for her feelings to come back in regards to us? She recognized that I've done the work to change my attitudes toward our relationship. It just doesn't seem to be enough though. What is it that she needs to see in order for her to realize that our marriage is worth giving another shot?

[Brooke79]

It sounds to me that there is still hope for you guys, she may need a little time to sort things out but it seems like her heart is not completely closed off to you. It will probably just take some time and patience and counseling, wish you the best stay positive.

[Cranialrupture]

Ok, here's my take on your situation. She might be enjoying the single life but also is scared of it. It's really common for people to leave then try and keep the old partner around just enough to subdue that fear. To me that is exactly what she is doing. You are a back up plan.

 

She cuddles you but is numb at the same time??? WTF. Seriously man, it really sounds like she's keeping you on the back burner.

 

Is it over? Only god knows.

 

Attraction is something that is not chosen nor can it be forced. You are a comfy teady bear to her right now but there is no attraction.

 

Wether you have a chance or not you need to quit being a stuffed animal for her. As you are right now you will not get her back and only delay your own healing.

 

You need to focus on YOURSELF. Live life to its fullest everyday. Sure you can talk to her, go to dinner with her but I would NOT do anything physical what so ever and I wouldn't talk about the past or what you want from her or your unsolved feelings.

 

The past is the past, what are you going to do about it? change it? ha, good luck with that. Whats done is done and there's nothing you can do about it. Learn from it, sure, but don't live in it. Here's an idea...keep digging up old wounds and rehashing all those bad moments and dream about repeating the good ones to try and win the love of your life back....pfft please. You can talk till your blue in the face and all you will accomplish is wasting oxygen and excercising your jaw. woohoo. Ok I will stop with the sarcasm. My point is leave the past alone, quite predicting the future and live life NOW. That's all you have is now. If there's any chance of winning her back, its living in the now and focusing on yourself.

 

I promise you nobody wants someone who lives in the past. I sure as hell wouldn't.

 

I have gone on quite a few dates that she will start talking about old relationships or bad dates and the first thing I want to do is run. Fast.

 

Prove to her your the man she should be with by actions not words! You don't have to say one word to her. I promise she will notice. Starts running your mouth about what your doing or about your relationship and it will all be a waste.

[lovesick74]

Cranial, I think you're dead on. I believe she is scared of the single life. She's always told me she feels the comfort in security of being in a relationship. I do believe there are two things going on.

One being that she's needing to believe that any changes that I'm promising are going to be permanent. I've done a lot of reading on why I feel our relationship has failed. Much of it derives from the classic case of me not understanding her feelings. She would tell me she feels a certain way and I would counter them by citing examples of why she shouldn't feel a certain way. This made her feel neglected and unimportant. To this day, she asks me why it took getting to a divorce in order for me to realize any of this? We did the counseling thing and yeah, I didn't put in the effort I should have. I kept looking at her as being the cause of everything. This made her feel "blamed" all the time. That she wasn't good enough. We're at a point now where we're still going to counseling, albeit separately. I've learned a lot about what I did to contribute to our marriage failing. I kinda wish we did the separate sessions sooner but in reality, I don't think I was in a place to look at myself, I wanted to blame her.

The other thing I think she going through, is that she's trying to decide who she is and what she wants in life. Since we've split, she's tried a lot on new things such as skiing, going to football games by herself and hanging out in bars. She's told me that she doesn't know what she wants right now, and she's trying to figure it all out. I think I've been putting too much pressure on her by saying to her that us mending our marriage would make her happy. Reality is, it's what would make me happy.....

So where do I go from here? Do I continue to give her space and face the possibility that all of this could be for nothing? Do I focus on just being her "friend" right now? Or do I go the "no contact" route and hope it works out for the best?

[Brooke79]

Its so crazy how so many marriages with people who are so different parAllel one another. I am learning now that even though my husband and I now have much bigger issues the problems I have with him emotionally will likely repeat should I move on because guys in general handle things in a similiar fashion, how I felt was never justified to my husband, he would always pick my feelings apart some how like you said. Even if things don't work out at least you can grow from this and do better next time, my hubby still thinks the same.

[lovesick74]

Just wanted to post an update on my sitch..... For the past two weeks or so, I've tried to pull back some. I don't go out of my way to e-mail jokes or call or ask her out to dinners. I've been leaving it up to her to reach out. It kills me no doubt, but after trying everything else, it's all I can do. Anyhow, she still will call me out of the blue. She'll tell me a funny story about our daughter or talk to me about what's going on at work. I try to be there for her when she calls, if nothing else just to listen. There have been some days where she'll call me two or more times a day. I am so confused as to the meaning behind all this (if there is a meaning that is) Could it be that she's just establishing a friendly relationship or does it mean something else. I do enjoy the times that we speak. The mood is light and like I said, for the past two weeks, I haven't brought up anything in regards to our situation. I guess all I can do is see where it all leads.....

 

Any advice is always welcomed and appreciated!

[Ronni_W]

What is it that she needs to see in order for her to realize that our marriage is worth giving another shot?

It's possible that she hasn't crystallized that yet...and that what she's (subconsciously) wanting/needing to see is something impossible -- some type of *guarantee* that you won't go back to your old, complacent ways that left her feeling unheard, discounted, unimportant.

 

What you might consider doing, is regularly talk about your NEW knowledge and the NEW relationship skills that you have acquired and are still acquiring. Talk in general terms about how you're so glad it is impossible for you to ever again "not know" what you've learned, so it is also impossible for you to ever be that type of partner again (you DO believe that, yes? And you made this vow to your Self, to NEVER AGAIN be that type of partner?)

 

Say how you're looking forward to putting your new insights and knowledge into practice with whomever is the next woman who will give you the chance and also that you'd like it to be a true collaboration 'next time', where you and your lover will each help and support the other's continuous growth and development. Thank her for helping to teach you these absolutely amazing and wonderful lessons.

 

You cannot, of course, give her a 100% guarantee of anything future-related...but I'll bet you sure could make your case that YOU are about as much of a guarantee of long-term happiness that she is ever likely to get her hands on. Right? Market your self!

 

And. When it feels like the right moment, ask her if it is possible that she might be looking for a carved-in-stone guarantee of how her future life and love relationship, with anybody, will look. If she's open to that idea, offer sympathy for her desire/need -- it's because you effed up so badly, and you're sorry for that -- but you really do have to ask if she thinks what she's looking for is reasonable and realistic.

 

Something like that. Take your time with it. Build it into a longer-term plan...4 or 8 weeks. Whatever time-frame. Just don't be in too much of a rush or it may come off disingenuous and/or inauthentic.

 

Best of luck.

[2.50 a gallon]

LS74

 

I think you are right in backing off for awhile. I know you are anxious to know which way she is going to jump, you have stated your case you want it to work, so she knows what you want. But it might take awhile for her to decide, by pushing the issue, in her eyes she sees it as pressure and controlling.

 

Show her that you are making changes, let her see them herself. Somehow put the fun back into you two being together. Many on this board would give their right arm to be in your shoes, as she is listening to you and you do have a chance.

 

Something to think of. I got the impression in your first post that you had this thing about being right. She would give you a contrary view and you would have to show her that you were right. I had this same problem when I was younger, I honestly did not get it that others could have a different view, I always had to be right. Learn to listen

 

Also from her P. O. V., think of it this way, Imagine you have a box, and on the inside you know there is honey. You think that all of the bees are gone, so you reach in to get a handful of honey, only to get stung. So you think that had to have been the last bee, so you stick you hand back in and get stung again, and again. It could be that she is afraid if she sticks her hand back in she will get stung again

[tnttim]

LS74

Also from her P. O. V., think of it this way, Imagine you have a box, and on the inside you know there is honey. You think that all of the bees are gone, so you reach in to get a handful of honey, only to get stung. So you think that had to have been the last bee, so you stick you hand back in and get stung again, and again. It could be that she is afraid if she sticks her hand back in she will get stung again

Wow what a great way to put it. 2.50 is 100% right IMO. My only advice is you can't erase the past, and you can't make up for it. All you can do is start from day 1 with her and try to just have fun. I think a big fat dose of Gunny logic will help you out immensely. You still have her in your grasp, and yes most would chop off an arm to be you. The ball is in your court and you seem to have a plan. Just try to be the best man you can be, read a book about women. You'll never understand them, but the insight in how their mind works will help you out.

[Gunny376]

What you need to do is withdrawal completely. Your her emotional, financial, mental safety line. She's got nothing. She's got nothing but you! And your feeding her "line" and as long as she's got that ~ she's got you.

 

The one that cares the least is the one that controls the relationship. And that would not be you. Your more emotionally dependent/addicted to her than she is to you!

 

Women feed upon that. (I'm going to catch some flak for that one for sure) But that is one of the 'tools' that women use on men, making them mentally and emotionally dependent upon them, their friends, family and social network. That's why a lot of women? The first thing they do is to try and isolate men from friends and their social network.

 

So the first thing you need to do is to re-establish your own personal and independent social network and circle of friends.

 

That is to say you need to regain your self confidence of living a life without her. That is to say, that with or without her? Life goes on!

 

This is nothing more than a power play other than who wears the pants and who wears the panties. This is nothing more than about whether your going to be the man or she is?

 

Its not just my opinion, but my life experience that women want it all their way. There is no compromise. Its their way or the highway. "If Mama's not Happy ~ then NO ONE is happy!"

 

For most women its their way ~ or no way.

 

That's the reason I got rid of my last LTR GF. It was all about her, her son, her family, her mother, her friends, her career, her job, her, her, her.

 

FT!

 

And that's why I'm divorced! And not married!

[You Go Girl]

lol...now that gunny has given you his rather bitter take control of the situation by pretending you have no feelings for your wife...

may I suggest that that may just backfire.

What women want! (Mel Gibson doesn't know) What women do want is honesty. If you are feeling scared and want to cry...then cry and speak about how you are scared of losing her.

Pretend you are the tough guy like gunny says to do..and that's the best chance that you will lose her forever.

Your wife calls you frequently because she still cares for you. She's also assessing just how much you have changed. She is probably smarter at honest psychology--women are better communicators by nature--

and trying to one up her as gunny suggests with a reverse-psychology play isn't going to work at all.

Be yourself! Be your honest self! Share the things you feel.

Why can't men get it that what women want is honesty? Why do so many men spend so much energy on lying? Get real! Pretending that you feel one way when you feel another...blah blah blah she will see right through it and find you immature, or worse--she will believe it and think yeah, it is time to move on, obviously he is trying to.

Don't get pushy. Don't neglect the relationship either.

Don't sit around and mope though--do something you've always wanted to do, or a hobby you've neglected, or something you have wanted to do to better yourself.

Then do something for her out of the blue.

Then do something for your daughter out of the blue.

Can't promise you will save this marriage--but you've been doing the right things since you got that wake up call of divorce papers.

[seanocasey]

lovesick 74,

I think that you are on the right track by pulling back. Let her initiate the contact. Let her decide when the time is right to get closer. Be kind, Be friendly, Listen when she calls and ask questions about what she talking about. Stay focused on bettering you for you and your child.

[tnttim]

[quote=You Go Girl;2643913 If you are feeling scared and want to cry...then cry and speak about how you are scared of losing her.

 

Are you f*cking kidding me? Yea go ahead cry and beg for her back, because That works 0% of the time. If you want to come off as a needy, whiny, 5 year old then follow her advice.

[carhill]

I gotta say I often laugh at Gunny's delivery but he stuck that 198 right in the pickle barrel.

 

OP, what do you want for your life? I see a whole post about how you want to give her what she wants. What about you? Do not sacrifice yourself at the altar of a woman. There is no reward nor dignity in surrendering your soul. A marriage takes two people who care equally about making it healthy. What is she doing to make it healthy?

 

Right now, this minute, what's your most pronounced fear?

 

Have you and she had MC? You say you have. How about her? Remember, it takes two.

[lovesick74]

I need to thank each of you for your responses and input. My life is still a rollercoaster right now. I've been trying to limit contact with her which is utterly painful. Yet in some ways it may be paying off....

 

Since going LC, she seems to be initiating more contact. Monday was a rough one for me. I mean really REALLY rough! I had typed up an e-mail which was basically going to tell her that I want her to be happy. If her happiness means not having me as a husband in her life, then so be it. I had it. I felt so sad and angry at the same time. We've gone through two divorce date extensions and I can do no more. Which ever way she goes, I just want to get it over and done with....

 

I never sent it....

 

Just after typing it up, I saved it to drafts and noticed that she had e-mailed me TWICE! One e-mail asked me how my weekend was and the second was just a funny link. I put off responding for a bit and finally just sent her a trite response saying that I had a "fun" weekend. To put a long story short, she ended up sending me four more e-mails throughout the day. Seemingly random bits, pictures of my daughter, sappy songs she's heard. Then the last one came.....She basically described how she was going through an emotional rollercoaster (no sh*t, really?) She said that she had cried for two hours straight over the weekend. She said, she felt like this was a good thing, because she's finally dealing with some of her emotions that she hadn't been before. I sent her a response saying that yes, I go through the same thing on certain days. I told her I understood how she feels and that I know she can get through it. I sense this was Big Mistake #1 saying this to her!

 

The next day, she sent me more e-mails, more sappy songs and even posted on her Facebook page that she's in a confused emotional state right now. We're still going to our MC separately. The MC had asked her if she thought a joint session would help us, to which she replied that she didn't think it would help yet. To me, it seems that the desire for her to want to work on our marriage is not there yet. She's still going through emotional issues.

 

Gunny! I've read a lot of your posts and replies to others as well as your replies to mine. When I first started going through this whole separation bit, I would read your posts and scoff at how cold seeming some of your advice had been. However, after reading many books and posts on here, I'm seeing parallels in what your saying. I wish that I had heeded your advice earlier on. I know what they say about 20/20. I'm ready to start listening! I just hope I'm not too late in the damage I've done....

 

Could I find another women? Certainly! Is that what I want right now? No... I've got too much invested in our relationship including a 3 year old daughter. and reading other posts on this board, I see hundreds of cases like mine. Whether it be the man or woman, the stories always the same! I can't tell you how many posts I read and think "That's us! that's what we're going through! Now all I need is that happy ending of reconciliation...It helps knowing that my wife and I have problems that are no different from others. I know we could lead a happier life should we both invest in it. I seek that magic spell that will open her eyes to all this.

 

Valentine's day is coming up. I'm trying to figure out how to handle this. She's always viewed it as a big day for us. I'm wondering if I should get her a small gift or nothing at all.... I have fears or either. If I get her something small, will it re-enforce her idea that she has me where she wants me? Or, if I get her nothing at all, will it be proof in her mind that I'm the a**hole she thinks I am?

 

Again, I'm thankful for all input!

[lovesick74]

Just as I'm ready to get off this train, the conductor tells me, it's not my stop yet......

 

Was out last Friday, my wife had texted me saying that she wasn't going to our niece's party thus wouldn't need to pick up our daughter from me on Saturday liked we had planned. She also texted me asking me if we should sign our tenants for another year. Though this was a bit odd...since our agreement is going to be that she takes the rental house as part of our split.

Turned out she went on a skiing trip. She stayed over her friend's Friday and Saturday. Talked with her on Sunday which is when she told me of this trip. She told me that she went up with three others. During the course of our talks, it came out that the others were her friend and her friend's boyfriend and some other guy... I didn't ask about the other guy at that point. She said she had a great time. I initially had thought they had all stayed over up there. I told her I was proud of her for wanting to pursue skiing after her last trip. She appreciated the fact that I was supportive of it. She ended the call with her agreeing to pick up our daughter at 5PM.

The more I thought about her weekend, the more angry I started to get. Who was this other guy, why did the whole trip sound like a date? I know something had been going on on the side, just not sure with whom. Anyhow, I planned to voice my concerns and quite possibly bring an end to everything. I poured myself a drink and wrote down all of the questions I needed answered. I dug myself in for a fight...

She came by at 5 (she was next door) and she came in and gave me a hug, wished me a Happy Valentine's Day and gave me a bag of M&Ms. I gave her a candy filled heart that I said was from our daughter. We sat down on the couch and I asked her more about her trip. She seemed genuinely excited about it and was happy to tell me. Then, I asked her...so tell me more about this other guy...are you and he an "item." She laughed and said "no" that he was a hyper acting weirdo. I was a little taken back by this response. Not what I thought. She said no, they weren't an item and that he was just a friend of her friends. I told her how it looked on the outside and voiced my reasoning.

The conversation progressed to us....I asked her where we are at. She surprised me by saying that her feelings were starting to open up. That she's been doing a lot of work and she's thinking that she's at a place now where she'd like to try dating. She said that she asked herself if we were to meet today, would she still be interested and she said "yes." She's been surprised at the attention from other guys but that it's just not what she's looking for. She's been appreciative of the work I've done and the space I've given her. She made a comment saying that it would be crazy to know that now she has the opportunity to have a great husband only to give him away to someone else...

Since then, I've asked her out on a few "dates." We've done the dinner and a movie thing. She's also asked me to hang out with her and watch movies. A couple times, things became a bit more "intimate."

I've asked her if she's been enjoying the time we've been spending together and she says she has. She says she sometimes feels awkward dating but that it would be that way with anyone. I told her that I sometimes felt the same way especially that I'm dating my wife lol. She says she pressures herself because she can't help but to think that if things don't work out that all of this would be for naught. I've tried to assure her that she shouldn't put so much pressure on things as we'll always be able to say we had given it a shot.

I feel positive about things right now. Although there's still a lot of work to be done and I still want her back living at home, I'm comforted knowing that just a few weeks ago, neither of us thought this would be possible.....

[You Go Girl]

Wow lovesick, kudos to you and her! A story that seems to be turning around..terrific, it doesn't seem to happen on here often.

 

Somebody tfttn or something close to that attacked me for saying show your true feelings, lol

well, I've been married to a tough guy. And I find it a big turn off and so do most women, not some women, MOST, maybe even all women.

 

It sounds like you are doing the right thing--taking it slow, don't let the conversations get too heavy at this point, good.

There will be a time and a place for heavy conversations, just like a time and a place when it is right to be intimate again.

Keep listening to what your gut is telling you.