carhill Posted March 7, 2010 Share Posted March 7, 2010 James, happy to read of your improvements and my sympathies regarding your wife's pain management regime. That's got to be tough. I understand the dynamic you speak of only too well, even if from the perspective of dearth. You still have the connection. It keeps you in the game and invested. Hope the OP can find his way Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted March 7, 2010 Author Share Posted March 7, 2010 I hope he is not either. From what I have read, there are many similarities between us, but there are some significant differences. My wife does show quite alot of physical affection towards me...plenty of hugs and kisses, plenty of caresses and touches. I may be wrong, but even the tactile expression of love is missing with Giotto and his wife. When we do have sex, my wife chooses to do so out of love and not out of giving in to demands. And lately it has been more than before. Since there have been no ultimatums by me, I can only believe that it is her choice. As I have found and Giotto has found, ultimatums show great improvement in the short run but little improvement for the long run. Just as in dieting, little changes which are motivated by desire are much better motivators than a radical change "inspired" by fear. I can say that I have chosen to stay for more than the kids. I stay because I do love her deeply and she is my best friend. And our sex life has been better (as far as quantity and some improvement in quality). I stay because being with her far outweighs life without her. Giotto does not have that connection with his wife. He does not feel that his wife wants to change for him. I believe that most of my wife's troubles stem not from psychological pain but from physical pain caused by her fibromyalgia. My wife does not have to face any past horrors...she has done that. She simply has times where the pain erases any desire to feel sexual pleasure. She is on pain meds every day and every hour for pain. Some day are great, others are not. Most are in between. Attitude is what makes the difference. The only way that I see satisfactory improvement for Giotto is if his wife begins to change out of a true desire for him and their marriage...and not out of the fear of losing her marriage and husband. Time will tell. yep, there is no connection anymore... and time will tell indeed... I'm fed up with ultimatums, so my next step will be concrete action... Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted March 7, 2010 Author Share Posted March 7, 2010 I don't think she is a bad person either...but without actions, her words are empty and worthless. She is not a bad person at all... she is just very selfish because all her life she had to protect herself. Her safety and protection are her priorities, unfortunately. She has to change, but she doesn't want to face her past. I'm sure she is promising because she wants to keep the family together. She doesn't want to hurt the children and, if we didn't have any children, I doubt very much we would still be together (as she told me once driving back from MC...), although she claims she loves me... Link to post Share on other sites
WalkInThePark Posted March 7, 2010 Share Posted March 7, 2010 When we do have sex, my wife chooses to do so out of love and not out of giving in to demands. And lately it has been more than before. Since there have been no ultimatums by me, I can only believe that it is her choice. Is sex not something people also do out of pleasure? Is that not how one feels loved most of all? If you feel that your partner really desires you, feels lust for you, gets sincere pleasure out of having sex with you. You say that you can only believe it is your wife's choice to have sex with you? Why don't you ask her? I believe that most of my wife's troubles stem not from psychological pain but from physical pain caused by her fibromyalgia. Again you say that you "believe". Does that mean that you and your wife are not talking about this? You say that there is more sex now. Don't you ask your wife why there is more sex? Don't you ask her if she feels better physically? What I find maybe most mindboggling about the "not enough sex" situations that are described here, is that although people have been together for so long, sex is something where assumptions instead of open conversations rule. It's almost like it is a taboo because the non-willing partner will feel pressured if the willing partner says that he/she is not happy with the frequency. I think that if it is possible to talk about it, then you already have half of the solution. Because then you can indicated what is the right frequency for both of you and try to find a compromise which is acceptable for both. Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted March 7, 2010 Author Share Posted March 7, 2010 What I find maybe most mindboggling about the "not enough sex" situations that are described here, is that although people have been together for so long, sex is something where assumptions instead of open conversations rule. It's almost like it is a taboo because the non-willing partner will feel pressured if the willing partner says that he/she is not happy with the frequency. I think that if it is possible to talk about it, then you already have half of the solution. Because then you can indicated what is the right frequency for both of you and try to find a compromise which is acceptable for both. When dealing with a low libido partner, he or she will at some point feel pressurized... we talked for a bit, but the answer was usually "I have no libido". If the high libido partner keeps "pestering", the situation collapses. People do talk about sex - we did and I'm sure JamesM did also - but there is a limit. I didn't know that limit (because I didn't have other information), so I went overboard. In couples with highly mis-matched libidos, tension is inevitable and you get to the point where you don't really want to talk about it anymore, because it becomes counterproductive... funnily enough, reading other low libido threads here on LS, the low libido spouse has almost always communication problems (well, apart form Mem's spouse, obviously )... but I find this normal... it's defense mechanism. It's a difficult issue to resolve, so it goes under the carpet... Link to post Share on other sites
mem11363 Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 Oldest child = temporarily insane Wife = borderline clinically depressed Wife = rational and communicative has made it clear that: - she does not miss me at all - I went away for a 3 day weekend (this has never ever ever happened - she always misses me) - her libido is truly zero - she WILL humor me when asked but it is solely for me. I think I can suck it up for a while. Increasing my meds as we speak - my libido is reduced partly by being in synch with her emotionally and partly via meds - but it isn't zero - knowing she will if I ask makes it easier to ask less There is nothing that great about communication when the message is so ***ked up. When dealing with a low libido partner, he or she will at some point feel pressurized... we talked for a bit, but the answer was usually "I have no libido". If the high libido partner keeps "pestering", the situation collapses. People do talk about sex - we did and I'm sure JamesM did also - but there is a limit. I didn't know that limit (because I didn't have other information), so I went overboard. In couples with highly mis-matched libidos, tension is inevitable and you get to the point where you don't really want to talk about it anymore, because it becomes counterproductive... funnily enough, reading other low libido threads here on LS, the low libido spouse has almost always communication problems (well, apart form Mem's spouse, obviously )... but I find this normal... it's defense mechanism. It's a difficult issue to resolve, so it goes under the carpet... Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted March 8, 2010 Author Share Posted March 8, 2010 Oldest child = temporarily insane Wife = borderline clinically depressed Wife = rational and communicative has made it clear that: - she does not miss me at all - I went away for a 3 day weekend (this has never ever ever happened - she always misses me) - her libido is truly zero - she WILL humor me when asked but it is solely for me. I think I can suck it up for a while. Increasing my meds as we speak - my libido is reduced partly by being in synch with her emotionally and partly via meds - but it isn't zero - knowing she will if I ask makes it easier to ask less There is nothing that great about communication when the message is so ***ked up. hey, mem, this is a bit of a dramatic change... what happened? Maybe you should start your own thread... BTW... wife last night told me we are going to have sex tonight... don't know if I should be happy or not... Link to post Share on other sites
Toodamnpragmatic Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 I can hardly wait for tomorrows post..... Hope all goes well...... To mem11363 and Giotto, life really is f@#$ed up..... Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 Oldest child = temporarily insane Wife = borderline clinically depressed Is there a connection between these two issues? Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 BTW... wife last night told me we are going to have sex tonight... don't know if I should be happy or not... Reminds me of the line about women must be psychic, they always seem to know in advance if we're having sex ... Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
BettyBoop Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 Reminds me of the line about women must be psychic, they always seem to know in advance if we're having sex ... Well that is very interesting since I never know that in advance. I only know which nights I am *not* having sex. Giotto, doesn't this mean that your wife is trying though? I will be interesting to hear an update on if you did or not and how it made you feel... Link to post Share on other sites
Toodamnpragmatic Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 Well that is very interesting since I never know that in advance. I only know which nights I am *not* having sex. Giotto, doesn't this mean that your wife is trying though? I will be interesting to hear an update on if you did or not and how it made you feel... Wondering when the kids will get to bed and whether it will happen. To think after 20 years there is anxiety, trepidation and anticipation about sex and whther all will be good is pretty sad (and something men in sexless marriages feel)...... Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 Well that is very interesting since I never know that in advance. I only know which nights I am *not* having sex. . Me too! As for Giotto and his wife...gosh, I've never been so excited about a stranger possibly having sex tonight Hope you have a good night together, whatever happens. Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 Oldest child = temporarily insane Wife = borderline clinically depressed I'm really sorry to read both of these As a mother, I am pretty sure I'd be "checked out" sexually for a bit if I were in those shoes. Surely there are times in a marriage when it is appropriate to take a break from sex? No? What about after childbirth? What about (god forbid) when dealing with cancer treatments? For clarification, I'm not asking about taking a break from sharing affection and touch--just sex. Link to post Share on other sites
BettyBoop Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 To think after 20 years there is anxiety, trepidation and anticipation about sex and whther all will be good is pretty sad (and something men in sexless marriages feel)...... I know...normally you only have those feelings the first time you have sex with somebody! Link to post Share on other sites
mem11363 Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 Sorry - I should have written: Oldest child is temporarily insane and doing very self destructive things which is causing my wife to be incredibly depressed. My wife does not get depressed often but when she does she withdraws. And yes this is a very rapid change. Everything was fun/happy/physically satisfying until just over a month ago when child went off track causing wife to follow along. And it is a very specific situation - which I won't post about other than to say a normal parent would be VERY upset with this child. Wife has been connecting with me during the last month but has not let me get her to the finish line even once during that time. AND we have had more conflict in the last month than we have had in the last year. During one of our conflicts she made the mistake of telling me she wanted space. So I went online the next day and planned a long weekend away. Until this situation gets resolved - this is just a sad / angry place for all 3 of us, father, mother, daughter - to be. Sexually I am going to minimize my requests. Is there a connection between these two issues? Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted March 8, 2010 Author Share Posted March 8, 2010 wife not back from evening out yet... I do feel like... "tense"... Link to post Share on other sites
Toodamnpragmatic Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 Sometimes it's best that she's out for the evening and you aren't around to say or do something to ruin it.... Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 And yes this is a very rapid change. Everything was fun/happy/physically satisfying until just over a month ago when child went off track causing wife to follow along. And it is a very specific situation - which I won't post about other than to say a normal parent would be VERY upset with this child. Wife has been connecting with me during the last month but has not let me get her to the finish line even once during that time. AND we have had more conflict in the last month than we have had in the last year. During one of our conflicts she made the mistake of telling me she wanted space. So I went online the next day and planned a long weekend away. Until this situation gets resolved - this is just a sad / angry place for all 3 of us, father, mother, daughter - to be. Sexually I am going to minimize my requests. Keep us posted and I hope you guys weather the storm. I have 4 kids, one of which has had more trouble and caused us more parental grief than the other 3 put together. I think it's especially hard on Mom as, perceived as the more sympathetic ear, she's more involved in the drama. I hope things return to normal soon... Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted March 8, 2010 Share Posted March 8, 2010 So she's getting herself in the mood????? Is there liquor involved? Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
BettyBoop Posted March 9, 2010 Share Posted March 9, 2010 wife not back from evening out yet... I do feel like... "tense"... Exciting! ^^ Hope it goes well. Link to post Share on other sites
missmanagement Posted March 9, 2010 Share Posted March 9, 2010 I am in a sexless marriage. I've read the threads, and while there are lots of opinions, I'm not sure any of us have answers as to your wife's situation. I can give you some perspective though as a woman on the other side. I love sex. But, the conflict with my husband and the lack of intimacy have driven me away. I think much of sex for women has to do with the quality of the relationship and the day to day interaction. I find that it feels safe for me right now to reject my husband and keep him at arms length. If I let him in and give him sex then I am very vulnerable to all the ways that he hurts me and I don't want to be there. Not having sex is a form of protection. I am not having an affair and have no other men in the picture. I guess I would ask if your wife ever tells you what she needs or wants. Perhaps there are some looming clues to how you might get closer to her and ultimately she would feel less vulnerable and more comfortable. For me, I would need to feel safer around my husband. He is so much kinder to strangers and people at work and I tell him this often, but he doesn't change. He can go days without hugging me or touching me. He can go months without saying he loves me. These things may seem small but to me they register like small deposits in the bank. I'm very aware of his interactions with me and how he changes when others walk in the room. I sink into the background every time. i can only say that there must be something between the two of you that is creating a barrier. I hope you find your answers and can restore your marriage. Miss Management Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted March 9, 2010 Share Posted March 9, 2010 I am in a sexless marriage. I've read the threads, and while there are lots of opinions, I'm not sure any of us have answers as to your wife's situation. I can give you some perspective though as a woman on the other side. I love sex. But, the conflict with my husband and the lack of intimacy have driven me away. I would gently respond that in your post I see much delineation of his actions, faults and failures but very little discussion of your part in either creating or fixing the disconnect. What are you doing to make things better? I wonder what changes you'd see in him if you willingly partnered in any sex he wanted over the next 90 days? I'd bet there'd be less conflict and more intimacy. Just a perspective from the "other" side... Mr. Lucky BTW - I don't mean to minimize the damaging effects of his behavior. Has he always been like this? Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted March 9, 2010 Author Share Posted March 9, 2010 I'm here at last to get you lot out of your misery... I must say it went very well, not the longest of sessions, because the wife climaxed when giving me oral , but very satisfying nevertheless! I think she really enjoyed and was very turned on and I enjoyed too... let's hope it doesn't stop here... Link to post Share on other sites
Toodamnpragmatic Posted March 9, 2010 Share Posted March 9, 2010 And today the count starts again at 1..... Link to post Share on other sites
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