"Thrown under the bus"

[donnamaybe]

You already KNOW he's a liar as you posted above (therefore, lacking in integrity), yet you don't think he says bad things about you to placate his wife?

[JustJoe]

Nobody really EXPLAINS cheating , do they? They make excuses for it, lie about it, or evade it, but EXPLAIN IT.......Almost never! To be intelligent, you have to realize that BOTH the cheater and his/her partner are probably lying, so all you can do, is only believe what you can prove.

[donnamaybe]

Interesting that you state this' date=' when it is White Flower that is here "standing by [i']her[/i] man" in believing all that this man is claiming that his W is saying.

 

Yup. I think most MM expertly play both the BS and the OW like a fiddle.

[greengoddess]

Yup. I think most MM expertly play both the BS and the OW like a fiddle.

 

Yep. They have to to keep them both happy and where they want them.

[NoIDidn't]

I didn't say I believe she knows. I said she knows my number but she doesn't call me (and stay on the phone long enough to leave a message or wait for me to answer) but she has called me at least twice. If she would have asked me to call her back I would have called her back. I also said if she wants the truth she should call me.

 

People should really follow their gut instinct if they really want to know what is going on. Don't just trust someone on their word, espcially after D-day.

 

Currently, as I'm told, she follows him wherever he goes to make sure he is not with me, lol, same routine as always. Saw him today though. I guess today was one of those 'marriage is built on trust' days.

 

I don't say that to be tongue-in-cheek. I tell you to make you aware.

 

There is no denial here but I don't need to convince you.

 

Not a "marriage built on trust"? LOL. Of course not, you KNOW he's cheating on her WITH YOU. This is really getting silly, WF. How are you going to slight her for not trusting him when you know the reason why? When you ARE a huge part of the reason why?

 

If you are willing to talk to her if she calls you and you truly want her to know the details, then why don't you call her? Why don't you tell her? You obviously have her number as well, if you know its her calling and not leaving a message.

 

You speak so strongly here about her putting all the responsibility on you, but you fail to see that it is you doing exactly that here to her. And she isn't the one out of order here, its you. She's married to him. You are not.

 

Your quarrel isn't with his W, its with him. He is the one feeding you the BS and claiming its coming from her. He likely knows exactly what buttons to push on you to get you to focus on her, instead of him. And he knows exactly what to tell you to get you to have hope that he is actually going to leave her.

 

If anyone was doing begging and pleading in their home, I'm willing to bet he did it just as much as he claims she did. He IS still married to her afterall. And he did have you waiting for him when he had the perfect opportunity to do what he's been telling you he wants to do: leave. So her begging and pleading wouldn't have changed that if its really what he wanted.

 

I've read your posts for the years you have been here. Its a new thing for you to be so openly negative and critical of his W. Its also a new thing that you decided to try again with this serial cheat that you once wanted nothing more to do with. It seems like you think its her that has thrown you under the bus. Where just whom is she getting her information from? Hmmm? From him. But you keep saying its her, her, her. She isn't in a R with you. He is. You have heard none of these things from her mouth. Only from his.

 

He's the one that threw you under the bus. No talk about EQ vs. IQ is going to change that. No blaming her for staying in her marriage while he claims he wants out and stays as well, is going to change that.

 

Everything you've said about her applies to you. Everything. But somehow she is the enemy in your eyes. Don't we always say that what we say about/to others here say more about us than about them?

[White Flower]

I sooo totally agree. The wife doesn't know it's the cheaters slant. It is the slant of her husband over a woman she doesn't know. To the ow she knows he's cheating and lying daily but she believes his every word. Odd that.

Yet since we are discussing intelligence why doesn't the W know it is the slant of her H when she had suspicions and even has a cell record a mile long??? Come on!

[donnamaybe]

Some people can actually reason in that way.

And then the personal insults.

 

You mean like reasoning that if a person is a habitual liar to one supposedly important person in their life, that they probably lie to the rest?

 

their beliefs seem to be stronger than their thought process.

And yet ANOTHER attempted swipe.

 

It's just common sense based on everything we read on LS and see IRL every day; even on TV in celebrities' screw ups.

[donnamaybe]

If you are willing to talk to her if she calls you and you truly want her to know the details' date=' then why don't you call her? Why don't you tell her? You obviously have her number as well, if you know its her calling and not leaving a message.[/quote']

 

Maybe because she knows what the outcome would likely be?

[White Flower]

:laugh:You do realize you are putting the blame on her, the victim of yours and his lies, that this affair continues. Would you like her to know the truth? Why don't you call her? You sound suprisingly angry with her for her not getting to the truth. Why is that?

I have been advised by many a BW here at LS not to call because that would make me look spiteful and hurtful. I have since develped the belief that if someone wants the truth they should seek it. I am ready when she calls and she has my number.

 

She is only a victim as long as she chooses to be. Burying her head in the sand makes her a victim.

 

I am not angry with her. I feel sorry for her.

[herenow]

I said that actions like hers were small and ignorant because BW like her tend to believe what they want rather than being bigger than that and digging for the truth including getting it straight from the source. It is just easier I suppose to believe in the lying H who minimizes a full blown A to just a few phone calls even when you have years of calls on the bill. This signifies a real desire to believe in someone rather than 'manning up' and looking at the truth.

 

It reminds me of the flock who believe their pastor and refuse to check his word against the Bible. Pretty soon they're all drinking Cyanide.

 

I never claimed that he didn't say anything bad about me; however, I do believe he wouldn't. There are things that I know that I can't say just yet but if you're really interested stay tuned.

 

Her actions are her choice, just like your actions belong to you. I'm sure if she knew the truth about you, she would have some words to describe your actions as well. She may or may not believe her H, but all you have is what you can see from the outside. You have no idea what she is thinking or why she does what she does. Yet, you talk about people who "tend to believe what they want rather than being bigger than that and digging for the truth including getting it straight from the source". Have you spoken to the source (the BW) before judging her actions?

 

Her H is the one serving the cyanide. He is the pastor who is misquoting the Bible. He is the one that minimizes his relationship with you. The question is, why does he do what he does?

 

Why is she responsible for "digging" for the truth? She is married to the man and maybe it works for her to stay that way. You want her to know, then give her a call.

[greengoddess]

Yet since we are discussing intelligence why doesn't the W know it is the slant of her H when she had suspicions and even has a cell record a mile long??? Come on!

 

Because she has been married to him a long time and loves and trusts what he tells her. Because oftentimes he will actually make HER feel guilty for questioninghim and not trusting him. Because he will hold her in his arms and say I am right here with you, I come home to you why can't you trust me ? -and she does...She sees the warning signs but he continually reassures her he is right there with her. Her reality is he is there. Your reality is he leaves to go home to her.

[donnamaybe]

Her actions are her choice, just like your actions belong to you. I'm sure if she knew the truth about you, she would have some words to describe your actions as well. She may or may not believe her H, but all you have is what you can see from the outside. You have no idea what she is thinking or why she does what she does. Yet, you talk about people who "tend to believe what they want rather than being bigger than that and digging for the truth including getting it straight from the source". Have you spoken to the source (the BW) before judging her actions?

 

Her H is the one serving the cyanide. He is the pastor who is misquoting the Bible. He is the one that minimizes his relationship with you. The question is, why does he do what he does?

 

Why is she responsible for "digging" for the truth? She is married to the man and maybe it works for her to stay that way. You want her to know, then give her a call.

 

I know, huh?! All this preaching about what the BS should do when the MM is SO CULPABLE for all that is going on! Oh, but let's not hold him accountable for anything.

[White Flower]

Not a "marriage built on trust"? LOL. Of course not, you KNOW he's cheating on her WITH YOU. This is really getting silly, WF. How are you going to slight her for not trusting him when you know the reason why? When you ARE a huge part of the reason why?

 

If you are willing to talk to her if she calls you and you truly want her to know the details, then why don't you call her? Why don't you tell her? You obviously have her number as well, if you know its her calling and not leaving a message.

 

You speak so strongly here about her putting all the responsibility on you, but you fail to see that it is you doing exactly that here to her. And she isn't the one out of order here, its you. She's married to him. You are not.

 

Your quarrel isn't with his W, its with him. He is the one feeding you the BS and claiming its coming from her. He likely knows exactly what buttons to push on you to get you to focus on her, instead of him. And he knows exactly what to tell you to get you to have hope that he is actually going to leave her.

 

If anyone was doing begging and pleading in their home, I'm willing to bet he did it just as much as he claims she did. He IS still married to her afterall. And he did have you waiting for him when he had the perfect opportunity to do what he's been telling you he wants to do: leave. So her begging and pleading wouldn't have changed that if its really what he wanted.

 

I've read your posts for the years you have been here. Its a new thing for you to be so openly negative and critical of his W. Its also a new thing that you decided to try again with this serial cheat that you once wanted nothing more to do with. It seems like you think its her that has thrown you under the bus. Where just whom is she getting her information from? Hmmm? From him. But you keep saying its her, her, her. She isn't in a R with you. He is. You have heard none of these things from her mouth. Only from his.

 

He's the one that threw you under the bus. No talk about EQ vs. IQ is going to change that. No blaming her for staying in her marriage while he claims he wants out and stays as well, is going to change that.

 

Everything you've said about her applies to you. Everything. But somehow she is the enemy in your eyes. Don't we always say that what we say about/to others here say more about us than about them?

Nope. Not really.

 

I'm sorry you believe so much in everything you just posted. It really took a lot of effort I'm sure.

 

I merely state that a BW wife is wrong to denigrate a woman she doesn't even know and you produce all these slants and thoughts. I never said she was an enemy. I'll let you all creat this energy while I bow out for a while. If the subject ever gets back on 'the bus' and the actions relating to it I'll check back in but for now I have some homework to do for MM's counselor.

 

Enjoy.

[JustJoe]

So , White Flower, I take it that you are the other woman? Who else on this thread is? And isn't it a sin by omission, for you not to tell his wife? I mean that, if you saw a crime being committed, and didn't report it, you would be an accessory, wouldn't you? Wouldn't the same idea apply here? I don't wanna pi** anybody off, or anything.

[donnamaybe]

It seems like it would be easier to understand a BS making harsh judgments on someone she thinks is f'ing her H than the person doing the cheating with the H making harsh judgments on the BS she is participating in hurting.

[greengoddess]

Nope. Not really.

 

I'm sorry you believe so much in everything you just posted. It really took a lot of effort I'm sure.

 

I merely state that a BW wife is wrong to denigrate a woman she doesn't even know and you produce all these slants and thoughts. I never said she was an enemy. I'll let you all creat this energy while I bow out for a while. If the subject ever gets back on 'the bus' and the actions relating to it I'll check back in but for now I have some homework to do for MM's counselor.

 

Enjoy.

 

She knows of you what her husband has told her.

[herenow]

Nope. Not really.

 

I'm sorry you believe so much in everything you just posted. It really took a lot of effort I'm sure.

 

I merely state that a BW wife is wrong to denigrate a woman she doesn't even know and you produce all these slants and thoughts. I never said she was an enemy. I'll let you all creat this energy while I bow out for a while. If the subject ever gets back on 'the bus' and the actions relating to it I'll check back in but for now I have some homework to do for MM's counselor.

 

Enjoy.

 

Bottom line, she is his wife and she has decided to remain his wife. Sounds like the ball is in his court if that is going to change. She can say or feel however she wants about you just like you can about her.

 

She may or may not know about you or the affair, but she is still his wife. He can tell you what ever he tells you, but she is still his wife. You can judge her actions, but you are still the OW. Facts are facts and if the you, the BW or the MM have no desire to change the facts, then that is how it shall remain. If it makes you feel better to put the responsibility of discovery on the BW, then so be it. I wish you well with that.

[NoIDidn't]

Maybe because she knows what the outcome would likely be?

 

Considering that we are dealing with a serial cheat, I think I know what the outcome will be.

 

They generally choose the W. No matter how they make her out to be to the MANY OWs, they choose the W. Just like they did when they married her the first time.

 

I know women that found out on the day before the marriage that the W was being chosen to be the W, and still stayed with him. I could have been one of those women. A girlfriend was even with her man one night and found out that he was getting married THE NEXT DAY via text. But she dumped him right then and there. The guys are still married to the Ws, and still cheating with every willing woman they can find.

 

And there is another thing not being discussed in this thread, that I think is on topic. Why the W is burying her head. My former step mom got so many phone calls from OWs saying my dad loved them bestest, that she learned to ignore them. She wasn't ready to divorce and obviously neither was he, so she ignored it while quietly taking notes and making her own plans. She followed my dad around, and he told me about it deriding her as if I was one of his OW. I found it sad on both parts. That she had to do it, and that he joked about it when he gave her every reason to do so. She was collecting evidence. She knew what he was up to. It was his own arrogance that kept HIM from seeing what right in front of his as well.

 

The W is tired of catching him in another lie and calling him on it. Tired of finding about yet another OW. They get tired of confronting it. So they let subsequent d-days slip by with barely a mention. Now the MM tells the OW that the BW is ignoring it, that she has her head in the sand. But this same MM tells the OW that BW is following him and checking through his cellphone, etc., etc.. Which is it people?! Is the BW a pansy that's ignoring it, or is she an untrusting shrew that follows him around? This right here is why the OW gets called on not knowing what is really going on. Its so obvious that they are only repeating what they have been told by the person invested in lying to everyone.

 

Now, this, is being thrown under the bus in grand fashion. These MM throw everyone under the bus, including themselves.

[JustJoe]

Bottom line, she is his wife and she has decided to remain his wife. Sounds like the ball is in his court if that is going to change. She can say or feel however she wants about you just like you can about her.

 

She may or may not know about you or the affair, but she is still his wife. He can tell you what ever he tells you, but she is still his wife. You can judge her actions, but you are still the OW. Facts are facts and if the you, the BW or the MM have no desire to change the facts, then that is how it shall remain. If it makes you feel better to put the responsibility of discovery on the BW, then so be it. I wish you well with that.

This is really what it's all about, isn't it? In a JUST world, it would be the cheater who gets "thrown under the bus", the other woman/man and the spouse, aren't to blame, as much.

[NoIDidn't]

Nope. Not really.

 

I'm sorry you believe so much in everything you just posted. It really took a lot of effort I'm sure.

 

I merely state that a BW wife is wrong to denigrate a woman she doesn't even know and you produce all these slants and thoughts. I never said she was an enemy. I'll let you all creat this energy while I bow out for a while. If the subject ever gets back on 'the bus' and the actions relating to it I'll check back in but for now I have some homework to do for MM's counselor.

 

Enjoy.

 

So because I took the time to post a response to you I've created a lot of energy and took a lot of time to do so? Funny. Now I'm being blamed for being thoughful in my response, and in an insulting way at all.

 

You are just as wrong to denigrate a woman you don't know. Like I said, everything you post about her, a woman that you don't know, applies to you. Everything.

 

I'll refrain from responding to you further in this thread as well, as I know the posters that disagree with me and agree with you will likely be hitting that infamous "Alert Us" button right about now....

[herenow]

So because I took the time to post a response to you I've created a lot of energy and took a lot of time to do so? Funny. Now I'm being blamed for being thoughful in my response, and in an insulting way at all.

 

You are just as wrong to denigrate a woman you don't know. Like I said, everything you post about her, a woman that you don't know, applies to you. Everything.

 

I'll refrain from responding to you further in this thread as well, as I know the posters that disagree with me and agree with you will likely be hitting that infamous "Alert Us" button right about now....

 

WF says she wants us to get back to the "bus", so let get back there shall we:

 

WF's MM doesn't have a bus. He is driving a shiny sports car that sits low to the ground and goes real fast. He isn't throwing anyone under anything. He has his BW who, for reasons none of us know, stays married to him. He also has WF and has successfully been able to convince her of whatever he is telling her. This guy has it made. Or at least he thinks he has it made. No bus needed when you have two women (or maybe more) that choose to believe you.

[greengoddess]

WF curious and I may be way off base. Are you by chance his counsellor?

[MizFit]

My opinion of being thrown under the bus is being treated by the MM any differently as the WS was...let me explain.

 

If a MM is going to sit and badmouth his W then you can expect the same on DDay when he's trying to keep life as he knows it together. If he has never spoken poorly of his W then you should expect that same respect from him.

 

I also believe if the BS starts verbally abusing the OW face to face or over the phone then the MM should step in...if he would not allow the W to be treated in a derogatory or demeanig fashion then he should not allow the OW to be treated that way. Do I think the BS should have every opportunity to verbalize her rage to her H, absolutely. I think she should be able to rage against him and to rage against the OW to him, but I think the OW should be protected from direct rage. He's created the mess and it's up to him to do what he can to protect both parties...if he doesn't then he has thrown you under the bus.

 

One note here...I firmly believe if a BS comes to an OW at any time with questions then the OW should answer honestly and openly. At that point it is between the two women, not the H/MM. I realize at this point they both could have vested interest in the H/MM, but I truly believe at that point he is irrelevent.

[NoIDidn't]

My opinion of being thrown under the bus is being treated by the MM any differently as the WS was...let me explain.

 

If a MM is going to sit and badmouth his W then you can expect the same on DDay when he's trying to keep life as he knows it together. If he has never spoken poorly of his W then you should expect that same respect from him.

 

I also believe if the BS starts verbally abusing the OW face to face or over the phone then the MM should step in...if he would not allow the W to be treated in a derogatory or demeanig fashion then he should not allow the OW to be treated that way. Do I think the BS should have every opportunity to verbalize her rage to her H, absolutely. I think she should be able to rage against him and to rage against the OW to him, but I think the OW should be protected from direct rage. He's created the mess and it's up to him to do what he can to protect both parties...if he doesn't then he has thrown you under the bus.

 

Agreed, mostly. I think the MM should not continue to throw his W under the bus by telling the OW what the has said about her in anger. Too much of what is being discussed here is what the MM tells the OW to make himself look better. He's throwing both under the bus to save himself the trouble of having to make any changes in his life.

 

One note here...I firmly believe if a BS comes to an OW at any time with questions then the OW should answer honestly and openly. At that point it is between the two women, not the H/MM. I realize at this point they both could have vested interest in the H/MM, but I truly believe at that point he is irrelevent.

 

I think the H/MM is still revelant to the conversation. The W is only talking to the to get the truth about events, she doesn't care, nor does she have to, about the OW's feelings. The W wants facts, details, truth, not a whole bunch of talk about the OW's feelings, or the assumed feelings of the MM.

 

The MM is very much going to be a part of that conversation. As witnessed by many a thread in this forum, he can't be taken completely out of it. He is the reason for the conversation, unless the two women were friends before the A.

[herenow]

My opinion of being thrown under the bus is being treated by the MM any differently as the WS was...let me explain.

 

If a MM is going to sit and badmouth his W then you can expect the same on DDay when he's trying to keep life as he knows it together. If he has never spoken poorly of his W then you should expect that same respect from him.

 

I also believe if the BS starts verbally abusing the OW face to face or over the phone then the MM should step in...if he would not allow the W to be treated in a derogatory or demeanig fashion then he should not allow the OW to be treated that way. Do I think the BS should have every opportunity to verbalize her rage to her H, absolutely. I think she should be able to rage against him and to rage against the OW to him, but I think the OW should be protected from direct rage. He's created the mess and it's up to him to do what he can to protect both parties...if he doesn't then he has thrown you under the bus.

 

One note here...I firmly believe if a BS comes to an OW at any time with questions then the OW should answer honestly and openly. At that point it is between the two women, not the H/MM. I realize at this point they both could have vested interest in the H/MM, but I truly believe at that point he is irrelevent.

 

Very interesting and I can agree with almost all of it. The only exception being that, IMO, the MM is allowing the OW to treat his wife poorly as soon as she (the OW) knowing engages in the affair. Let me explain.

 

I know that may OW believe that they don't owe the BW anything since they (the OW) didn't break any vows, I'm cool with that. However the MM does owe his wife what he promised in those vows. In allowing the affair to happen, the MM is allowing the OW to treat his wife in a demeanig fashion.

 

When it comes to how the BW treats the OW, she (the BW) owes the OW the same, nothing. If the MM didn't protect his wife from the pain that the affair could cause her, how can you expect him to protect the OW?