stillafool Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 If it is so unattractive why do men who make this switch see their success with women improve drastically? They may see an improvement but the real them will come out sooner or later and then they will wonder why the woman strayed. Link to post Share on other sites
stillafool Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 agreed It's a defense mechanism that works. It's not that the man is pretending to be someone he's not. He has in fact changed. Yes changed to a bitter person who wants revenge. If he didn't he would be sure of who he was, just not the woman he chose, and move on to someone more compatible. He would be far too secure with who he is as a man and wouldn't change his style for anybody. That's a real man. Link to post Share on other sites
Woggle Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 They may see an improvement but the real them will come out sooner or later and then they will wonder why the woman strayed. Nice guys who stay nice get betrayed all the time as well. I think that women in general with some exceptions just can't be trusted and nice guys turned players have caught on to that fact. Link to post Share on other sites
skydiveaddict Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Yes changed to a bitter person who wants revenge. If he didn't he would be sure of who he was, just not the woman he chose, and move on to someone more compatible. He would be far too secure with who he is as a man and wouldn't change his style for anybody. That's a real man. No revenge or bitterness involved. It's just that women dont go for "nice guys". So they (we), change. Link to post Share on other sites
stillafool Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 No revenge or bitterness involved. It's just that women dont go for "nice guys". So they (we), change. Yeah, to someone he is not. Real 'playas' are born not made and again, they go through great lengths to hide it. They don't enjoy hurting people, they just do and are not proud of it. On one hand you depise these guys for getting and doing what you can't, and then you turn around and try to be just like them. Link to post Share on other sites
Woggle Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Yeah, to someone he is not. Real 'playas' are born not made and again, they go through great lengths to hide it. They don't enjoy hurting people, they just do and are not proud of it. On one hand you depise these guys for getting and doing what you can't, and then you turn around and try to be just like them. Actually most players are made. Experience is the best teacher and players have learned from experience what truly works with women. I don't despise these men. I have great respect for them in fact. Link to post Share on other sites
bayouboi Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 They may see an improvement but the real them will come out sooner or later and then they will wonder why the woman strayed. I'm gonna reword this a bit hang on: The Nice-Guy-Turned-Player may see an improvement but their true Nice-Guy will come out sooner or later and then the Nice-Guy-Turned-Player will wonder why the woman strayed. So you're basically proving their point that women don't go for nice guys. So I guess the trick is to find a way to keep your inner nice guy from coming out sooner or later. Link to post Share on other sites
Woggle Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 I'm gonna reword this a bit hang on: The Nice-Guy-Turned-Player may see an improvement but their true Nice-Guy will come out sooner or later and then the Nice-Guy-Turned-Player will wonder why the woman strayed. So you're basically proving their point that women don't go for nice guys. So I guess the trick is to find a way to keep your inner nice guy from coming out sooner or later. This is why it has to be real. After my divorce the basic core of who I was changed and that is why it works for me. Link to post Share on other sites
bayouboi Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 This is why it has to be real. After my divorce the basic core of who I was changed and that is why it works for me. Yeah, I'm still trying to figure out how and if I really want to go down that path. Right now I don't desire a woman strong enough to change who I am. But at least I recognize the way to be successful from this point forward. Link to post Share on other sites
phineas Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 They may see an improvement but the real them will come out sooner or later and then they will wonder why the woman strayed. The women never stray. They don't get a chance. Those guys get what they want them broom them for the next one. And for some reason it puts the woman they dumped into booty call territory. Even if they have a boyfriend at the time. Link to post Share on other sites
stillafool Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 I'm gonna reword this a bit hang on: The Nice-Guy-Turned-Player may see an improvement but their true Nice-Guy will come out sooner or later and then the Nice-Guy-Turned-Player will wonder why the woman strayed. So you're basically proving their point that women don't go for nice guys. So I guess the trick is to find a way to keep your inner nice guy from coming out sooner or later. No dear, the trick is to be who you are and find a woman 'nice girl' who you are compatible with. Otherwise you will never be happy. Link to post Share on other sites
stillafool Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 This is why it has to be real. After my divorce the basic core of who I was changed and that is why it works for me. Woggle, I have to agree with you on this. I could never see you as being a 'nice guy' because the way you feel about women. Not that you would mistreat a woman purposely, but you are just "suspicious" of women and present somewhat of a challenge to capture your heart. You are of a different type. Some guys just are players from the kindergarten on. You remember the guy in the first grade that all the girls wanted to hold his hand or be paired with him in events. Link to post Share on other sites
DustySaltus Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 of a challenge to capture your heart. You are of a different type. Some guys just are players from the kindergarten on. You remember the guy in the first grade that all the girls wanted to hold his hand or be paired with him in events. For me it was kindertgarten and his name was Giuseppe. My first GF left me for him because he has twinkies with his lunch and my mom only gave me an orange. Apparently, he's a fat mess now and she's dancing somewhere...go figure Link to post Share on other sites
stillafool Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 The women never stray. They don't get a chance. Those guys get what they want them broom them for the next one. And for some reason it puts the woman they dumped into booty call territory. Even if they have a boyfriend at the time. Of course they will stray. The 'nice guy' pretending to be a 'player' will fall for the girl where a real player will not. Then the real him will surface and she will stray. It always pays to just be yourself. Link to post Share on other sites
GoodOnPaper Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Yes changed to a bitter person who wants revenge. I don't think it's as extreme as it may look on the outside. I think the bitterness comes from the "nice guy's" preception that some or all of his core principles and personality traits that he truly values (whether he realizes it or not) must be sacrificed or transformed in order to get sex and companionship. I don't know about revenge -- for me, it's just wanting a taste of the rock star treatment that most other guys seem to get. Nerdy, geeky, shy guys want satisfying sex lives just like everyone else. If he didn't he would be sure of who he was, just not the woman he chose, and move on to someone more compatible. He would be far too secure with who he is as a man and wouldn't change his style for anybody. That's a real man. But of theme of this thread is one of the paths that a "nice guy" can take to become surer about who he is! Granted, I understand that women are only concerned about the end product, but the process doesn't happen overnight and on LS you get to see the ugly details of that process. When you are popular and attract women left and right, it's easy to become sure of who you are. It's hard to generate that confidence when external validation is rare. Link to post Share on other sites
BettyBoop Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 I just wanted to discuss a trend i've noticed. It seems when the 'nice guy' is dumped, he metamorphosises into a player or bad guy. Happened to my ex-fiancé. But he was just hateful and wanted revenge and to inflict pain. He even tried to make my friends and family see me as a horrible person. I think "nice guys" who turn bad are men with extremely low self-esteem who just "flip out" when they're dumped. Truly nice guys without low self-esteem wouldn't do that I think. They'd be better than to sink low. Link to post Share on other sites
In_Repair Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 I've been accused of it a couple of times recently, and it's actually funny considering where I am in my life... mid 30s, soon to be divorced, two small children, very little expendable income... I couldn't run a game anymore if I tried, but I would still probably get lumped under the category of the men that the OP was trying to describe. I'm not a player at all, I've just been with what some people consider a lot of women since my marriage broke up. Moving from one woman to another does not make you a player. A player is a liar and a manipulator. Their game is about quantity, not quality. I'm as honest as I can be, brutally sometimes. Anything else is just too much work, and it will come back later to bite you in the ass anyway. Link to post Share on other sites
stillafool Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 I don't know about revenge -- for me, it's just wanting a taste of the rock star treatment that most other guys seem to get. Nerdy, geeky, shy guys want satisfying sex lives just like everyone else. Is your idea of a satisfying sex life sex with a lot of women or just one good girl who loves you? But of theme of this thread is one of the paths that a "nice guy" can take to become surer about who he is! Granted, I understand that women are only concerned about the end product, but the process doesn't happen overnight and on LS you get to see the ugly details of that process. When you are popular and attract women left and right, it's easy to become sure of who you are. It's hard to generate that confidence when external validation is rare. I don't know how old you are but if you are in your 20's I can understand your attitude. However, if you are not in your 20's are you looking for a girlfriend or attention from alot of women? Link to post Share on other sites
GoodOnPaper Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 As much as I wanted to be, I was never well-suited for the numbers game. I didn't really mind because I had the naive impression that finding one woman for a committed relationship would more than make up for the excitement I was missing out on because I couldn't attract women for ONSs and FWB relationships. Unfortunately, that hasn't been the case. So in accordance with the theme of this thread, playing the nice guy role -- marriage, kids, the whole nine yards -- has not been something I would care to repeat. Link to post Share on other sites
phineas Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Of course they will stray. The 'nice guy' pretending to be a 'player' will fall for the girl where a real player will not. Then the real him will surface and she will stray. It always pays to just be yourself. I agree about that. I thought we were talking about nice guys that become jerks & never go back. Link to post Share on other sites
Woggle Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 Woggle, I have to agree with you on this. I could never see you as being a 'nice guy' because the way you feel about women. Not that you would mistreat a woman purposely, but you are just "suspicious" of women and present somewhat of a challenge to capture your heart. You are of a different type. Some guys just are players from the kindergarten on. You remember the guy in the first grade that all the girls wanted to hold his hand or be paired with him in events. Believe it or not I used to be the nice guy and I was even an Alan Alda feminist type. When I realized that feminists simply hate men and will never a man as one of the good one I switched my game up. I actually don't lie to women because I have huge issues with betrayal and deceit in any form. I will insult a person to their face but I will not stab them in the back. I think I win with women because I am brutally honest with them. I might keep some of my truly hateful feelings from my wife but she knows that the minute she betrays me she is out on the street. There will be no counseling and no begging her to stay or any of that. She can pack her bags and get the hell out of my life and she knows I already did it once so I will do it to her if need to be. I think that is what the jist of this thread is about. A player can easily settle down for a woman if she is worth it but if she is not then chuck her in the not worthy bin. Link to post Share on other sites
skydiveaddict Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 (edited) Yeah, to someone he is not. Real 'playas' are born not made and again, they go through great lengths to hide it. They don't enjoy hurting people, they just do and are not proud of it. On one hand you depise these guys for getting and doing what you can't, and then you turn around and try to be just like them. No No Not true. Nice guys learn the game and become players it's a survival thing Edited March 12, 2010 by skydiveaddict Link to post Share on other sites
CLC2008 Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 Johny, he's a player http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5oLR5AW70zU Link to post Share on other sites
Author Nikki Sahagin Posted April 3, 2010 Author Share Posted April 3, 2010 These are men who learn their lesson well. They learn fast that treating a woman well gets them nowhere in life and just gets them walked all over so they switch up their approach and have much success. If women don't like it they should have appreciated these men when they were nice guys. I agree with the other poster who says that almost every player was once a nice guy and almost every time when they became a player they saw their success with women vastly improve. See players don't have success with me because I am a very proud and stubborn person. I can't bear to be the 'submissive' one to a cocky player and I hate the thought of being 'played'. In fact I am probably TOO conscious of this fear, I assume every man will mess me about, but rather than being attracted to that I am afraid of it and so for the time being, I stay away from men altogether until I can try to get over this 'fear' and stop assuming everyone will mess me around. Link to post Share on other sites
dazzle22 Posted April 3, 2010 Share Posted April 3, 2010 After you get burned, I think it is human nature to swing to the opposite extreme before settling back more towards middle ground. I think players are people who have swung to the other side. Some eventually settle back to middle ground. Some are perpetual users, but I believe, if you analyze their relationships, they use men and women alike, just in different ways (ie JFKennedy -horrible womanizer, but just a cold person all round, getting what he wanted from everyone.) I think Meerkat is spot on. Most people who learn from these experiences actually settle in at some point to being people who check out their options, don't close deals too soon, and don't take crappola off anyone. They give off this air of, "I dont give a rat's azz what you think, this is the way I am, take it or leave it;, we'll see if you deserve to be in my inner circle", and people gravitate to those who demand respect. That is the way I have become. Works really well. Also at work. I told my new employer, "I've more than paid my dues. Just so you know, I don't work Fridays any more. Ever"....got the job. Link to post Share on other sites
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