Passion vs in love

[wheelwright]

Wheel,

 

My question to you is this.. will what you have now, be enough to sustain you for a lifetime?

 

The thread seems to be focusing on sex, but I think that what you are feeling has very little to do with the sex act, and much more to do with the connection of your heart.

 

All marriages are NOT like that, though many are. It is up to each couple to decide when/if their marriage gets to that point, if it is something they can live with. For some, the 'comfort' of what is known is enough. For others it never will be.

 

I am sorry you are feeling like this. My sister just confided to me last night that she is in the same place as what you describe, and she asked me for my opinion. I am telling you what I told her, "Love yourself the most. When you do that, the answer will be evident...." ((hugs to you))

 

Thank you FA. Yes it is about more than the sex.

 

I think but am afraid of the fact that it will not be enough to sustain a M.

 

I find this so hard.

 

I am someone who never really learnt to love themself first. It feels like a whole big deal to learn what that means now I am 40, Especially as I no longer trust my feelings (cf under a bus stuff). My H and my sisters/aunt are the only people I can say have never abandoned me.

 

I think your advice is good for all here on LS, love yourself first and action follows.

 

There have been many sweet and honest responses to this thread, and previous ones.

 

I don't know how to break it to myself or my H that it is over.

[MizzBlue72]

You know, so many people on here have described Affair sex as 'the best sex they have ever had'.

I'm not sure I have ever heard anyone who is married on here say that.

 

I don't think you are settling. Sex, passion fades over time. You become comfortable with each other. Sometimes it's not making love, but do you ever feel like you ARE making love?

 

I never EVER made love with my xH. We barely had sex (maybe 10 times in 10 years - none in the last 4). So - yeah. I was married to a roomie, cut and dry. The Affair partner?? OMG sex is FANTASTIC!!!!! And even better now ... going on 2 yrs.

 

I always try to isolate what has made the affair sex so fantastic. It is passion, it is hot. It's not that it is taboo. He really does go slow and listens. He gets off by getting me off - and vice versa. This is something I never experienced in previous relations. And him being kinky is a HUGE bonus for me!!

 

I guess I am trying to say - no relationship is perfect. But if you guys do love each other, maybe you can try to 'spice it up' a bit in bed.

 

Being in bed with a comfortable friend isn't that bad. At least you don't cringe each time he wants to touch you ....

[Fallen Angel]

Thank you FA. Yes it is about more than the sex.

 

I think but am afraid of the fact that it will not be enough to sustain a M.

 

I find this so hard.

 

I am someone who never really learnt to love themself first. It feels like a whole big deal to learn what that means now I am 40, Especially as I no longer trust my feelings (cf under a bus stuff). My H and my sisters/aunt are the only people I can say have never abandoned me.

 

I think your advice is good for all here on LS, love yourself first and action follows.

 

There have been many sweet and honest responses to this thread, and previous ones.

 

I don't know how to break it to myself or my H that it is over.

 

With as much compassion as possible. ((Hugs))

[Samantha0905]

I do feel like a liar and am a liar for the most part. I do still love my H. It is a big deal for me and have contemplated D, but then I think of the kids and the fact that I still love my H. I just do not feel a powerful passionate kind of love for him. I never have. I don't think I have the same chemistry with my H that I had with my XOM. I also know that my XOM would not have been an ideal person to have a long-term relationship with.

 

I feel the same as you except even knowing that -- I still want to be with XOM. I guess so we can have what we have and then split up. lol I don't know what's going on in my crazy head.

 

Thank you FA. Yes it is about more than the sex.

 

I think but am afraid of the fact that it will not be enough to sustain a M.

 

I find this so hard.

 

I am someone who never really learnt to love themself first. It feels like a whole big deal to learn what that means now I am 40, Especially as I no longer trust my feelings (cf under a bus stuff). My H and my sisters/aunt are the only people I can say have never abandoned me.

 

I think your advice is good for all here on LS, love yourself first and action follows.

 

There have been many sweet and honest responses to this thread, and previous ones.

 

I don't know how to break it to myself or my H that it is over.

 

I like the love yourself first and action follows advice also. I'm in the same boat as you and I think I put myself in that boat by not doing that.

 

It is so difficult to break it to your spouse. If you figure out a way to do that, let me know. I keep thinking we should have "the talk" and I can't seem to make myself do it.

 

I hope things work out for you. It's a terrible place to be.

 

 

I never EVER made love with my xH. We barely had sex (maybe 10 times in 10 years - none in the last 4). So - yeah. I was married to a roomie, cut and dry. The Affair partner?? OMG sex is FANTASTIC!!!!! And even better now ... going on 2 yrs.

 

I always try to isolate what has made the affair sex so fantastic. It is passion, it is hot. It's not that it is taboo. He really does go slow and listens. He gets off by getting me off - and vice versa. This is something I never experienced in previous relations. And him being kinky is a HUGE bonus for me!!

 

I guess I am trying to say - no relationship is perfect. But if you guys do love each other, maybe you can try to 'spice it up' a bit in bed.

 

Being in bed with a comfortable friend isn't that bad. At least you don't cringe each time he wants to touch you ....

 

My XAP and I had sex like you describe. It's difficult to give that up.

 

I'm in bed with a comfortable friend but don't want that friend to touch me because I have zero attraction for him in that way.

[GreenEyedLady]

You know, so many people on here have described Affair sex as 'the best sex they have ever had'.

I'm not sure I have ever heard anyone who is married on here say that.

 

It is passion, it is hot.

 

Well, I guess there's a first time for everything.

 

Married sex beats affair sex any day, and is the best sex I've ever had.

 

You can be kinky as you wanna be and know he'll still respect you the next day.

 

Ironic that so many people in A's want their AP for keeps, yet make such rude remarks about M in general.

 

I can honestly say that I married my best friend who is also my own personal porn co-star.

 

GEL

[awkward]

 

Ironic that so many people in A's want their AP for keeps, yet make such rude remarks about M in general.

 

I can honestly say that I married my best friend who is also my own personal porn co-star.

 

GEL

 

I agree with both. I don't know what affair sex feels like but I'm 99.99% sure it wouldn't beat the sex in my marriage. Seriously.

[jennie-jennie]

For me it is about having a compatible partner, one who enjoys sex as much as I do. I am no different whether I am in a long term affair or any other long term relationship. The difference is who my partner is.

 

The sex I had with my first SO and the sex I have with my MM are both incredible. The difference being that when I got in contact again with my MM I had been sexually starved for decades with an incompatible partner. And also I am older now and wiser and therefore value intimacy higher than sexual variance.

[seren]

I've never had affair sex, but can see that after a long time together and with the day to day pressure of life, work, kids, responsibility that sex can become routine. I can also see that any 'new' relationship brings the benefit of fantastic sex, the planning for meeting, the looking your best, the anticipation etc. Most long term relationships are based on far more than sex.

What I can say is that there are more opportunities in an exclusive or open relationship for impromptu sex, the long weekend lie ins sex, and the lying on the sofa watching telly and oh here you are sex (if that makes sense). There have been times in our 20 year plus relationship where sex has taken a back seat and times where it has been routine which has been balanced by intimacy and affection.

What I can also say is that after D day and way past hysterical bonding (whatever that means) rediscovering sex is a whole lot of fun, especially now that our son has flown the nest, we have no money worries and life is good. Just like the early days in our relationship. As an aside, I also think that the dynamics of a relationship are far more than just hot sex, well in the long term anyway - I am sure there are some affairs that are sex based, some that start out as just sex and become more. To assume that all married people have crap sex, adopt the missionary position and the end of lust and passion is as stereotypical as assuming that all affairs are just about sex IMHO

[NoIDidn't]

Well, I guess there's a first time for everything.

 

Married sex beats affair sex any day, and is the best sex I've ever had.

 

You can be kinky as you wanna be and know he'll still respect you the next day.

 

Ironic that so many people in A's want their AP for keeps, yet make such rude remarks about M in general.

 

I can honestly say that I married my best friend who is also my own personal porn co-star.

 

GEL

 

I agree on all points.

 

It is pretty ironic.

[White Flower]

I have been careful here on LS recently to not post to the heart of the issue for me. Reasons? Maybe I don;t want to bore people. But things have moved on enough to post this, and I don't find it easy to post.

 

Last night I had good sex with my H. No thoughts of xAP. This morning I woke up with that feeling you have when you know you have just had sex as opposed to making love.

 

So nights with my H feel like passionate nights with an old friend I am comfortable with.

 

It throws me off my day after, because I don't actually want to have sex on those terms, though I may feel horny enough and close enough at the time. Friends with benefits?

 

I really think this is my future too, a M of friends with benefits.

 

Is that setling, or is that M?

Sweetie that would be settling. That is, as long as you desire more than having FWB sex. I'm sorry. I'd suggest D if you can't get the intimacy that you need from your H. Life is too short.

[White Flower]

CCL - this is a great post and so accurately describes physical and emotional chemistry at its highest level.

 

When MM and I make love, we have this visual connection that is so intense. It's like the world just stands still and all we want is to take each other in and not break the eye contact. This is something that he nor I never experienced with anyone else. After experiencing this level of love and physical intimacy, I was never able to fully connect emotionally with my H again.

You could be me speaking here. That look in his eyes reminds me of the night he asked me for that first dance. Wow, I was hit by Cupid's arrow that night and every time we made love after by that very look in his eyes.

 

ExH always had his eyes closed.

[White Flower]

Well, I guess there's a first time for everything.

 

Married sex beats affair sex any day, and is the best sex I've ever had.

 

You can be kinky as you wanna be and know he'll still respect you the next day.

 

Ironic that so many people in A's want their AP for keeps, yet make such rude remarks about M in general.

 

I can honestly say that I married my best friend who is also my own personal porn co-star.

 

GEL

Yes but we are comparing the sex with the MM with an old or dead M. If I were M to MM, I would LOVE married sex!!!

[moaningmyrtle]

Yes but we are comparing the sex with the MM with an old or dead M. If I were M to MM, I would LOVE married sex!!!

 

If a marriage is dead - well then I'd have to agree. Presumably there's no passion or love left.

 

If by "old' you mean a long marriage then I have to disagree.

 

My H had an A, but after d-day we have really rediscovered both love and passion with each other. All I can say is it is simply wonderful for both of us. We have been together as a couple for more than 20 years and I'm post-menopausal so you would think that would tell against us.

 

Obviously there were problems during and before the A, but since it was all brought out in the open things have gone from strength to strength in the bedroom department. It is genuine for both of us. This is one thing I have no doubt about whatsoever. After all I do know what sex/love/passion/intimacy/affection was like during my H's affair and none of it was good.

 

The rest of our life together is still a work in progress. We both want it to work for us and our family, but understandably we both still have issues from the A and the betrayal that went with it.

 

I consider that we are fortunate that we have repaired the physical/intimate side of our relationship. When I see people posting that they are no longer physically attracted to their partner I fear that sustaining a long-term relationship will be very difficult for them.

[White Flower]

If a marriage is dead - well then I'd have to agree. Presumably there's no passion or love left.

 

If by "old' you mean a long marriage then I have to disagree.

 

My H had an A, but after d-day we have really rediscovered both love and passion with each other. All I can say is it is simply wonderful for both of us. We have been together as a couple for more than 20 years and I'm post-menopausal so you would think that would tell against us.

 

Obviously there were problems during and before the A, but since it was all brought out in the open things have gone from strength to strength in the bedroom department. It is genuine for both of us. This is one thing I have no doubt about whatsoever. After all I do know what sex/love/passion/intimacy/affection was like during my H's affair and none of it was good.

 

The rest of our life together is still a work in progress. We both want it to work for us and our family, but understandably we both still have issues from the A and the betrayal that went with it.

 

I consider that we are fortunate that we have repaired the physical/intimate side of our relationship. When I see people posting that they are no longer physically attracted to their partner I fear that sustaining a long-term relationship will be very difficult for them.

I suppose I simply meant dead or dying. If it can be revived more power to you. I feel for those who cannot revive their passion and intimacy.

 

Kudos for you MM! Did you read any books on this that you found helplful? Or was this something that evolved from your other work in repairing the R?

[moaningmyrtle]

I suppose I simply meant dead or dying. If it can be revived more power to you. I feel for those who cannot revive their passion and intimacy.

 

Kudos for you MM! Did you read any books on this that you found helplful? Or was this something that evolved from your other work in repairing the R?

 

I read quite extensively both on the internet and also from borrowed library books but nothing springs to mind that was a stand out.

 

To be honest I'm not really sure that our revived love life evolved out of anything, other than so called "hysterical bonding" ('HB') post d-day (blushes and at this point). There is scant literature on HB so I don't know much about it other than that it happened to us, and it felt "real". What I did read suggested it would settle down from anywhere between a few days to a few weeks (or occasionally months). Here we are nearly 18 months later though, and still going!

 

While our intimate life had dropped off in the A years and before, it had never completely stopped, and was always satisfying to us both when it did happen.

 

I would like to know others' experiences of HB and how long it lasted.

[White Flower]

I would like to know others' experiences of HB and how long it lasted.

That is quite incredible and wonderful for you.

 

I have often wondered if it happens in As when one or the other broke up only to end up together in HB. I felt that with MM after ending it then subsequently reunited. I'm not too sure many OPs even know what it is (HB is Hysterical Bonding after a break up) so they might not recognize it other than 'hot sex' when they are experiencing it.

[moaningmyrtle]

That is quite incredible and wonderful for you.

 

I have often wondered if it happens in As when one or the other broke up only to end up together in HB. I felt that with MM after ending it then subsequently reunited. I'm not too sure many OPs even know what it is (HB is Hysterical Bonding after a break up) so they might not recognize it other than 'hot sex' when they are experiencing it.

 

I guess when I said it felt "real", another way of expressing that would be to say it was "hot sex". I have had enough of that in my life to know what it is all about (more blushes and ).

[White Flower]

I guess when I said it felt "real", another way of expressing that would be to say it was "hot sex". I have had enough of that in my life to know what it is all about (more blushes and ).

I'm sure you have. I think both M couples and A couples have hot sex but not all in either kind of R have intimate sex where there is no fear of exposure, baring the soul, complete trust, and the feeling that you just can't get closer to the other person.

 

I think HB can only occur if these conditions exists, and of course the strong desire and dedication to reunite.

[boomboom63]

I'm with MM on this one - 18 months since DDay and still going strong - the honesty that we have with each other now has made it so much easier to really let go and make ourselves vulnerable. I discovered some delightful things that my wife likes :love: and searching for some more could be a lifetimes adventure!!

[Spark1111]

I'm sure you have. I think both M couples and A couples have hot sex but not all in either kind of R have intimate sex where there is no fear of exposure, baring the soul, complete trust, and the feeling that you just can't get closer to the other person.

 

I think HB can only occur if these conditions exists, and of course the strong desire and dedication to reunite.

 

I think HB, also referred to as reclaiming, is a huge indication of the future success of a reconciliation.

 

Our sex life HAS always been amazing, even during his affair, and I know that was not the crux of his reason to have one, although he did lie to his OW about the frequency.

 

I know too many couples in long-term relationships who have let this slide, and they miss the intimacy and passion they once knew. But I really believe they do not make enough of an effort to sustain it or get it back.

 

I do not know why.

[NoIDidn't]

I think HB, also referred to as reclaiming, is a huge indication of the future success of a reconciliation.

 

Our sex life HAS always been amazing, even during his affair, and I know that was not the crux of his reason to have one, although he did lie to his OW about the frequency.

 

I know too many couples in long-term relationships who have let this slide, and they miss the intimacy and passion they once knew. But I really believe they do not make enough of an effort to sustain it or get it back.

 

I do not know why.

 

I really don't want to turn this thread into a recovered marriage sex vs. affair sex thread, but this post reminded me of this period during my marriage.

 

During my H's A (brief EA), the sex was some of the most imaginative we'd had from his end. I think the A reignited his sexual curiosity in ways our marriage and his feelings about the state of our marriage, simply did not.

 

And after the A was finally over, he came to me with even more intensity as if he was grateful I was still there even though he royally effed up. This was even before he decided to commit to the marriage again (or at least he hadn't told me yet). Maybe it was testing the sexual part of the relationship to see if there was still spark?

 

That said, we both learned, that the passion he felt was missing in the marriage was missing because he wasn't bringing in himself.

 

I think the main difference between affair and marriage sex is the expectations the partners have going into it. Its too common for marrieds to take their sexual encounters for granted, while affair partners really look to spice it up each time. But I'm sure that affair partners have so-so sex too.

[OWoman]

Well, I guess there's a first time for everything.

 

Married sex beats affair sex any day, and is the best sex I've ever had.

 

You can be kinky as you wanna be and know he'll still respect you the next day.

 

And this differs from the sex you were having with him before you were M... how?

 

Our M sex is white hot - but so was our A sex. It's the pairing that matters, not the piece of paper, IMO....

[crazycatlady]

And this differs from the sex you were having with him before you were M... how?

 

Our M sex is white hot - but so was our A sex. It's the pairing that matters, not the piece of paper, IMO....

 

I think that has something to do with it. But not all.

 

A sex doesn't have the baggage that M sex has (debt, kids, old fights, In laws, chores, worries, fears etc etc), so I can understand why A sex can be intense for simply for the lack of pressure outside the bedroom. Plus its probably frequent enough both sides learn each others buttons, and far enough apart that both sides are really yearning for it. I know time apart from my H makes it that much better when we are back together, so I would imagine it would be similar for A sex. Also A sex has anticipation built into it. And anticipation is so hot and can make finally having sex very hot.

[GreenEyedLady]

And this differs from the sex you were having with him before you were M... how?

 

Our M sex is white hot - but so was our A sex. It's the pairing that matters, not the piece of paper, IMO....

 

I get it all the time now...

 

GEL

[moaningmyrtle]

I'm with MM on this one - 18 months since DDay and still going strong - the honesty that we have with each other now has made it so much easier to really let go and make ourselves vulnerable. I discovered some delightful things that my wife likes :love: and searching for some more could be a lifetimes adventure!!

 

Yet it's much more than just hot sex. It really is re-claimed intimacy.

Whatever it is I'm not complaining about it. I hope that it does give us a better chance of "saving" our marriage. If not I suppose we'll have fun trying.

 

To the extent that I can tell, it feels like love/passion/intimacy/affection/honesty rolled into one.

 

My H, the wayward one, says that it beats A sex for several reasons, that I wont repeat. But one is because of the genuine honesty - ie he no longer has to sneak around pretending and lying to somebody.

 

Just so I'm not accused of gloating, the pragmatist in me says if he'd decided to leave to be with the OW then he would be able to say exactly the same thing.