X mentioned a lot at dinner in front of me

[delia88]

Hi,

 

It's me again with another question.

 

I'm the one dating the separated man who is now getting a divorce. We have been dating for a good 3 months now and I went to dinner with the guy and another couple (his friends). I had already met the guy alone but this was the first time meeting the guy friends girlfriend. I didn't know this but she still sees the ex of the guy I'm dating. So her name was mentioned a few times during dinner for example, Do you do this..yes...Really? The ex had me trying it (She's an instructor) but I couldn't do it...then did you know she accidentally did this (directed to the guy I'm dating) etc. Then then asked me if I had met her. Why would I meet her? (they have a child together) So finally he (The guy I'm dating said) "enough". My mood had changed and he sensed I was uncomfortable. When he dropped me off at home he said sorry for the uncomfortable moments. When I got home into bed it was really bugging me. The next night he called me and I mentioned how I didn't sleep well and when he asked why I said I was aggravated. He didn't say a word and changed the subject.

 

Question...should I assume he doesn't want to talk about this further? Or that he doesn't care that it was inappropriate for them to keep bringing her up? Am I going to have to continually go through this? He mentions her name as well. They are getting a divorce. My friends didn't bring up old boyfriends when I brought him out to dinner. Wasn't the point of us all going out to dinner so that they could get to know me. And lastly, now I feel like the girlfriend at dinner will go back and give the ex the scoop on me and I don't feel comfortable with that. I didn't want to say too much because If he (the guy I'm dating) goes back to them and says' "don't mention the ex" It could get back to her and she might like that. I've never been in this situation so I'm not sure how to handle it.

 

Thanks.

[Sweetartedcoco2002]

everything u just stated here u should say to him, let him know how u feel about it, if he really cares u to will talk it out n he will understand....

[delia88]

I am going to talk to him tonight. I don't want to come off as insecure about her I know they are getting divorced and that he cares for me. But, then why are the friends and him bringing her up? I don't want to dictate what people say around me but I can't imagine that anyone could not see that this behavior (Stories about her) would be acceptable by the new girlfriend. It's not even as though they are stories about how great she is they are random and have no purpose. I can't imagine why his friends girlfriend would tell a story about how she accidentally did something with the pet. Telling my boyfriend that in front of me what was the point? I don't know how to phrase this request to have him and others stop mentioning her. He just mentioned her last night. Another stupid comment nothing here or there.

 

How do I present this without having him and the ex seeing this as a insecurity issue and just a courtesy issue?

 

Any divorced guys have any thoughts on this?

 

Thanks.

[cdn]

How do I present this without having him and the ex seeing this as a insecurity issue and just a courtesy issue?

 

Since you've only been dating for 3 months and this is the first time it has happened, I think you might want to let it go. If the ex's name was mentioned just "a few times during dinner," then it's not an issue of courtesy, which leaves open the issue of insecurity.

 

Having said that, I do understand that it is uncomfortable to have to listen to stories about your bf's ex and presumably this will lessen as you and he become more established in your relationship. It could be that you are the new player in an existing foursome and everyone is adjusting. This is not always a smooth process, especially if the other gf and the ex were close. But unless you feel that your bf is harboring inapporpriate feelings for his ex, I don't know that you gain much by making heavy weather of this.

 

Finally, please keep in mind that since your bf and his ex have a child in common, they will (sanity prevailing) do all that they can to maintain friendly relations as they will be forever linked by this child. Your bf, assuming he is not a heel, will want to be involved in his child's life and, especially if this is a young child, this will require frequent communication with his ex. The friends may have assumed that you've met the ex by virtue of the fact that you will have occasions to be together -- school plays, piano recitals, soccer games and the like.

[delia88]

Hi,

 

Thanks for your response. His is a great father and very involvd with his daughter. That's one of the things I admire about him. The ex was mentioned many times during dinner. And the thing is he mentiones her almost evrytime we talk. Again not about how wonderful she is but still I wonder what this means. I know he has known her half his life but do I need to know she makes soap and that she can explain her dreams in detail? We were talking about soap a nd dreams when he came up with this. I am expecting too much? I don't expect her to never be mentioned but why does everything tie back to her. I could do the same with all the ex bf I have had but I don't. My friends could have done the same but didn't.

 

I feel that this is a bit much so I should say something...But what?

 

Thanks.

[Kay]

Hi, Delia. Are you absolutely certain that he is getting a divorce? I don't want to rain on your parade, but it sounds to me like he is still invested in his wife and family. I'd hate for you to be hurt, like so many others on this forum have been. I can see how hearing about his STBX constantly would be quite uncomfortable and it makes me wonder how seriously his friends take his "new" relationship with you.

 

Would it be impossible for you to back away and tell him not to contact you until his divorce is final? If he is the great guy that you say he is, this should not be difficult, but only you can decide for yourself what you're willing to put up with in the meantime.

 

Take care. Kay

[cdn]

[ The ex was mentioned many times during dinner. And the thing is he mentiones her almost evrytime we talk.

 

Ok, this is a different perspective from what you first posted. And it puts things in a different light.

 

It could be that, since he has known her for half his life, she is his frame of reference for many things. It may take a while for him to break this habit. It could be that he simply admires her. Or it could be that he's not over her.

 

So yes, you should talk to him about it.

[EnigmaXOXO]

Delia, I know this must be a very awkward situation for you. But your relationship with your boyfriend is so new compared to the time he has spent married. It's unlikely that his social circles will change and it can be very difficult for the new romantic interest to integrate their self into the mix when all the people involved still have a mutual friendship with the ex-wife in common. Certainly, they should be more aware of your presence and avoid discussing topics which involve the ex-wife, but old habits die hard and it will mean constant vigilance on everyone's part. I’m sure, as your relationship develops that will come in time.

 

My own partner has been in your situation. I still maintain some old friendships with people who befriended my ex-husband and I when we were married. Although we have been divorced for quite some time now, these friends still associate with both of us. I have introduced my partner into my social circle, and every now and then, someone will ask: "How's K**** doing", or "how's your daughter doing?" Even during family gatherings, the ex-husband's name will be mentioned sometimes while we converse about my daughter and her well-being.

 

While my family and friends absolutely LOVE my partner, as long as my daughter is a part of our family, her father will always be part of that equation.

 

To my partner's credit, he has never been bothered by such things...I've asked him directly on numerous occasions and even apologized to him in my family and friend's behalf. It seems to bother me more than it bothers him. He understands that my old marriage constituted 15 years of my life and is a part of my past as well as being responsible for the person I am today. But he also knows EXPLICIATELY that there are no lingering feelings or attachments to my ex-husband. We haven't even spoken to each other in over a year.

 

I even made the terrible mistake early on in our relationship by accidentally calling him by my husband's name. I was so mortified I wanted to melt into the floor and disappear. It was "habit"... and that's all. Something I said without even thinking. And if my partner had been insecure at all, he could have easily turned that little "slip-up" into a hullabaloo and used it to rake me over the coals. Instead, he said absolutely nothing and pretended not to even hear it so as not to embarrass me.

 

God, how I love and respect that man!!!

 

We all have insecurities Delia, nothing to be ashamed of. Just don’t let them consume your thoughts and jeopardize this new relationship. Your boyfriend is aware of how uncomfortable you were and I’m sure he’ll be more vigilant in the future. If not, he’s a knuckle-head. Meanwhile, don’t let the little things get to you.

[delia88]

Hi,

Thanks for the feedback.

 

The divorce will be final soon since everything was already filed for the legal separation agreement. Now it's just a matter of refiling as a divorce decree. So not seeing him during that time won't be for very long and I don't see what difference that would make.

 

In terms of how I am seen. I read christmas cards at his house where I was mentioned by family..."Hope things are going well with (me) and I hope to meet her when I'm in town next." Then the other card was from the couple we went to dinner with the other night. It said, "The four of us have to get together when the holidays are over." When we went to dinner with them he held my hand throughout the entire meal and he shows me a lot of affection he evens holds my hand in the house when we are alone. I can't imagine why they would not take us seriously as a couple.

 

I don't understand why they would bring her up in front of him as well. At one point he was very hurt over her and both of them have moved on and the friend of his told me he was happy he thought it was way overdue for him to move on. They also told me about the ex and her new boyfriend which I also think was inappropriate. I don't want to know about her personal affairs.

 

He has said that even if the ex wanted to try again and even though they have a small child he could not go back. It doesn't appear as thought he admires her either. They are civial and everything works out pretty well but he feels he is a better parent than she is because he considers the daughters well being more of a priority that she does.

[Bubbles]

Delia88,

 

Here's my view on this........talk to him. Never hold back on your feelings. You sound like a level-headed woman so that's my advice. Tell him that you were not comfortable, don't ask him to answer for his friends actions or words - that's not fair. You said that you told him already that you were upset and made to feel uncomfortable so as a man they take in the information and process it. Here's probably what he thought: we are never going to get together with or go to dinner with "said couple" again.

 

Also; don't be too quick to have dinner with this couple again. Wait for them to ask the two of you out to dinner and tell them that you are sorry, you already have plans. Force the "female" to think about what might have been said - she'll either figure it out and call to ask you two out again for another time(in an attempt to make-up with you, realizing that if she doesn't they may not get together with your boyfriend again)

 

Women will be women! Of course she gave a "report" to his ex.......wouldn't you if the shoe was on the other foot? I would and I'm not afraid to tell the truth, I definatly would. But I am also honest enough to tell the ex if I thought she was a "nice girl" weather the ex likes it or not. Normally, woman are fine with getting along with their ex boyfriends/husbands until...............the new girlfriend comes along! and then look out!!! All hell breaks loose!

 

I have been in your shoes and it's not a nice place to be. I am speaking from experience........trust me, my theory works if......your b/friend means anything to them.

 

Good Luck, stay true to your feelings and true to your boyfriend. I'm sure you must mean a lot to him if he took you to dinner to introduce you to his friends.

 

Bubbles

[delia88]

Hi,

 

I had a talk with him and he said he could see how that would make me uncomfortable. He said that he thinks the couple sees him and naturally thinks of the ex and since they are co parents and get along well enough he thinks they just weren't thinking. So I brought up specific comments that were made and how it made me feel as if she was out to dinner with us. I asked if he thought the comments about her were inappropriate and he said, "some". I was disappointed in that and said If it were reversed I would never do that out of respect for the new person and that my friends didn't talk about my old boyfriend in front of him. I brought up how he mentions her with specific examples and he said he was with her for over ten years and that he was relating the topic I was talking about back to her because they were not discussed or did not happen with anyone else. He said he understood and would watch what he says.

 

But, I'm still wondering. I asked him if I have done anything that upsets him and he said, "no". I said I found that strange since we have been dating three months and I would have thought something would have come up by now. He said "no" again and that was the end of it.

 

He told me in the beginning that he can talk about anything but his feelings. He sends me text messages all the time telling me he misses me or that he can't wait to see me. He is very affectionate towards me and is not seeing anyone else. But no real solid feelings about me have been expressed. He has introduced me to all of his friends and part of his family.

 

Is it possible that this is as far as it will go? He has very little free time since the daughter and his job take up most of it. The free time he does have he spends with me.

 

If he was so crazy about me wouldn't he be able to say so?

[jenny]

what strikes me more than anything is how tacky it is. divorce is a fact of life now, and it comes with its own set of manners and protocol. the parents are way out of line.

 

i agree with advice above; avoid them for awhile and don't kill yourself trying. you're in the social right here, and they will probably come around after being indignant for awhile. if not, that's their problem, not yours. you are being hurt by rebuffs, and that you do have some control over - do not extend to people who cannot reciprocate. be generous to them - they are hurting too - but don't let them get to you.

 

your guy sounds like he is willing to alter his behaviour when he knows it hurts you, and he is the one who counts.

[delia88]

I'm not sure but,. I think I'm hitting the end of the road. Since our discussion I have felt like I am on unstable ground. I'm second guessing every word out of his mouth and now our conversations on the phone even though are still every day they are much shorter and he hasn't text messaged me at all in the past 5 days. That is where I would get all the "I miss you" or "thinking of you" or "can't wait to see you" stuff. Is this how it starts? The beginning of the end. Since we have discussed so many sensitive things lately I thought I'd just see if he changes back to sending messages etc before talking to him. It's going on four months now so maybe he just changed his mind about me.

 

I don't know what advice I'm looking for I just am now scared to be in this situation from everything I've read on here he will undoubtedly dump me sooner or later because he is about to be divorced.

 

I'm very frustrated and wonder if I should have taken the risk at all. If he does dump me I will feel used. I'm still some what in control of my feelings since I haven't fallen in love with him yet.

 

I guess I was wondering is it at all possible for a man in his situation to really move on to a long term relationship even though he started dating before the divorce was final?

 

Goodness. I guess I'm looking for reassurance and no one here can give me that.

 

Thanks.

[Bubbles]

I guess it's safe to say this......reassurance is not exactly what you are going to find here - opinions only. If you want reassurance on YOUR actions.....yes ABSOLUTLY! You did the right thing by talking to him about how you feel after the dinner party and not AT the dinner party.

 

I myself will not (after reading your most recent post) reassure you and tell you that everything is going to be great. That would be falce - especially in light of his actions over that past 5 days. Unfortunatly it sounds as though your boyfriend was insulted by your comments and took it personally. Honestly! what else would he expect from you? My opinion? He's still going through the emotional changes now and he is obviously not ready for you. Do yourself a favour, cut yourself loose from him. Do it for yourself and your pride in who you are.

 

I am so very sorry to be so frank with you but this just doesn't look good from where I am standing.

 

Take care delia88, feel free to private message me if you would like. I'm sure that this is very painful for you and if you need a friend....... we are ALL here at the Loveshack.

 

Bubbles

[delia88]

I'm very upset now. I feel like a fool. Why doesn't he just break up with me? Doesn't know how? If he was still feeling the same why no test messages saying he's thinking about me?

[Bubbles]

delia88,

 

He's not text messaging you because he has just recently gone through a "break-up" with his wife (and probably didn't even want that one) so he is not dealing with this situation very well. Think about it.....you rejected him with your words. You did not point your comments AT him but as I said in an earlier post, he took it personally.

 

He is in denial that anything "out of line" was ever said. He is not dealing with YOUR feelings because it's as though he doesn't want to. Remember when I said that he is going through a lot a emotions already? Speaking from experience, it took me at least 1 1/2 years to be emotionally healthy enough to persue a "New" relationship or even date for that matter.

 

Bubbles

[delia88]

I understand but why did he even start up with me then? I talked about all of this stuff with him in the beginning.

 

Why doesn't he just walk away instead of dropping the text messages and keep calling me everyday?

 

So he really does not have the ability to deal with me or my feelings at all? He seemed to do just fine with it until now.

 

I feel awful and used.

[Bubbles]

My heart is breaking for you delia88

 

I would like to point another thing out to you though, in an earlier post you said, "He told me that we could talk about anything, except his feelings" do you remember that? Is it at all possible that he may be taking time to sit back and reflect? I think that statement alone points directly to his non-actions towards you.

 

Bubbles

[cdn]

I had a talk with him and he said he could see how that would make me uncomfortable. He said that he thinks the couple sees him and naturally thinks of the ex and since they are co parents and get along well enough he thinks they just weren't thinking. So I brought up specific comments that were made and how it made me feel as if she was out to dinner with us. I asked if he thought the comments about her were inappropriate and he said, "some". I was disappointed in that and said If it were reversed I would never do that out of respect for the new person and that my friends didn't talk about my old boyfriend in front of him. I brought up how he mentions her with specific examples and he said he was with her for over ten years and that he was relating the topic I was talking about back to her because they were not discussed or did not happen with anyone else. He said he understood and would watch what he says.

 

Sounds reasonable.

 

But, I'm still wondering. I asked him if I have done anything that upsets him and he said, "no". I said I found that strange since we have been dating three months and I would have thought something would have come up by now. He said "no" again and that was the end of it.

 

Why did you do this? Sounds like you may have planted a seed without intending to, i.e., suggesting to him that something *must* be wrong and how come he hasn't realized it.

 

Is it possible that this is as far as it will go? He has very little free time since the daughter and his job take up most of it. The free time he does have he spends with me.

 

What more are you looking for?

 

If he was so crazy about me wouldn't he be able to say so?

I'm still some what in control of my feelings since I haven't fallen in love with him yet.

 

Not necessarily. He may be proceeding cautiously. Or, like you, he may not be in love yet. Or...

 

Since we have discussed so many sensitive things lately I thought I'd just see if he changes back to sending messages etc before talking to him.

 

You may be pushing him to move too quickly and he is reacting to your "push" with a countering "pull."

 

I'm very frustrated and wonder if I should have taken the risk at all. If he does dump me I will feel used.

 

Why will you feel used? Isn't this what dating is about -- seeing whether or not you are compatible/ From what you have posted he hasn't made any false claims or promises. It could be the your recent conversations have forced him to look at your relationship in a more critical light and perhaps this is making him question the "rightness" of the two of you as a couple. But this is no different from what you've been doing. It is far, far better for the questioning and realizations to occur when you are dating than after a commitment has been made.

[EnigmaXOXO]

When we went to dinner with them he held my hand throughout the entire meal and he shows me a lot of affection he evens holds my hand in the house when we are alone. I can't imagine why they would not take us seriously as a couple.

 

I don’t think the awkward conversation at dinner indicates that anyone isn’t taking you seriously as a couple. It was just a lack of forethought, tact and/or manners on the other woman’s part. The fact that they mention going out to dinner again…”The four of us,”…means you are being acknowledged as the current girlfriend. You also mentioned reading the Christmas cards sent to his house, and said that you were mentioned by both family and friends. This alone indicates that everyone has graciously acknowledged you to your boyfriend….but were you reading his cards hoping to find something in particular?

 

But, I'm still wondering. I asked him if I have done anything that upsets him and he said, "no". I said I found that strange since we have been dating three months and I would have thought something would have come up by now.

 

Why would you find it strange that he would answer “no” to this question? Why would you find it strange that nothing has come up in the three short months you’ve been dating?....Are you looking for problems where none exist?

 

He is very affectionate towards me and is not seeing anyone else. But no real solid feelings about me have been expressed. He has introduced me to all of his friends and part of his family.

 

Is it possible that this is as far as it will go?

 

What is it, exactly, that you want him to express? Are you waiting to hear “I love you?” You said yourself that you were not yet in love. And three months is a relatively short time to be together, particularly if you are not seeing him every day. I would think, since he’s already introduced you to friends AND family, that he must already think highly of you. But it’s a little premature to expect any long-term, solid commitments from him at this point. Especially since his divorce isn’t even final yet.

 

I'm second guessing every word out of his mouth and now our conversations on the phone even though are still every day they are much shorter and he hasn't text messaged me at all in the past 5 days.

 

I think the dinner conversation inadvertently brought to surface some insecurities you were already having regarding this relationship. Now you are at risk of being hyper-sensitive to anything said…or even ‘unsaid.’ Don’t let your worries run away with you and make you too paranoid, or you’ll risk pushing him away.

 

I'm very upset now. I feel like a fool. Why doesn't he just break up with me? Doesn't know how? If he was still feeling the same why no test messages saying he's thinking about me?

 

Perhaps he’s already sensed your nervousness and apprehension, and has gotten the impression that you are pushing for a more serious relationship. Maybe he isn’t ready to take that step yet, having just come out of a bad marriage (not even out of it yet.)

 

If I were in your situation, I would first decide whether or not this guy is worth the wait. It may be some time before he’s caught his breath and is ready to settle down again. If you decide you are okay with dating him for awhile, then you must slow down and stop worrying yourself into a tizzy. A little patience and perseverance goes a long way.

 

Just relax…AND BREATH!

 

 

Shoot!...CDN beat me to the punch!

 

Sorry to repeat what's already been said.

[delia88]

Thank you very much for all of the feedback. I asked him if I did anything to upset him because he said he had trouble with his feelings so I wanted to make sure he was voicing concerns of his to me as well.

 

Since most of his feelings for me were communicated via text messages and I haven't gotten one for 5 days I can't breath easy because I feel he's had a change of heart and since that dinner did send me into the insecure mode I'm trying to just be upbeat when we do talk. I feel if I ask him now if everything is OK with us it will just put more pressure on him.

 

I have given him all the room to feel comfortable yet I have voiced reasonable concerns to protect and educate myself. He has always been open when we discussed them.

 

I just have a bad feeling now and guess I have to wait to see what he does next. I still feel that it was in my right to stand up for myself with the ex being mentioned all during dinner. If he can't handle that well it's best to find out now your right.

 

I guess I wonder where we stand right now all the other signs that he was interested are in the past. I understand that the about to be divorcee will just have a change of heart quickly so I'm trying to prepare myself for that.

 

I never ask for more time because I feel it's very important that he spend time with his daughter and I respect that.

 

I feel that getting more attached to him and his daughter (loving them somewhere down the line) and then having to break it off would be more that I could bear if it went on for too long so I feel I have a right to ask what is going on. This isn't all about him I am the other half as well.

 

All he has to do is go back on-line and find someone It will take me much longer and I have been through the "starting over routine" for 28 years that's how long I have been dating. Never married no children. I'm getting tired of this.

 

I'm a very nice person who thinks of others am a good listener, I'm fun and funny smart and stable and also attractive. So, I'm getting a little tired of always ending up alone. Granted all of the relationships I have had I have ended because I didn't think they were going to last long term for good solid reasons. This is the first guy that I felt it was worth taking the risk given his situation to find out if maybe it could be something.

 

I don't feel I did anything wrong. You should be able to communicate your thoughts so if I pushed him away well I guess I 'll have to deal with it and so will he. My fear is when he starts to date someone else he will see that not many women will put up with the dinner situation etc. and when he realizes that it will be too late like so many others have said.

 

I know I 'm rambling and I appreciate all of the support. I don't want to feel used but I do, like he had brought me around so everyone could see how he got the attractive women ( they all told him how "hot" I was so I'm sure that was good for his ego) after it didn't work out with his wife, but when it comes down to the nitty gritty I'm not worth the effort.

 

I am worth effort.

[Bubbles]

delia88,

 

You are very level headed! Good for you for being true to yourself first!

 

Hang-in there girl.......I'm sure Mr. Wonderful is out there.

 

Bubbles

[cdn]

Delia -

 

I do not want this to sound harsh so let me say at the outset that this is not my intent.

 

Do you see that you are creating a self-fulfilling prophesy? You have been concerned since the start that your bf would pull back once his divorce became final. Even though there has been no evidence that this will occur in your relationship, you have persisted in this belief. Today, you wrote:

I understand that the about to be divorcee will just have a change of heart quickly so I'm trying to prepare myself for that.

 

It does not seem to me that your bf has lost interest in you nor that he does not take your relationship seriously. As Enigma pointed out, he has taken several actions, such as introducing you to his family and having diner as a couple, that show he does take the relationship seriously. In fact, he seems to be a rather decent guy. But... it seems that you are pushing him away with your insecurities. You said earlier that you were upset at the mentions of his ex as a matter of courtesy not insecurity, but your subsequent posts suggest quite a lot of insecurity on your part. Just how much of this is being conveyed to him I can't say, but I would imagine that he is well aware of it, especially since you mention that you have discussed many sensitive things lately and that you are currently "second guessing every word out of his mouth." Let me ask you: How would you react if you were on the receiving end of your recent behavior? Notice I am not asking whether you would happily refrain from mentioning an ex boyfriend at dinner but how you would feel if your bf saw as a much bigger deal than you did some behavior of yours and that, in spite of your agreement to work on it, persisted in probing you to ascertain your feelings, asked whether you had complaints about him, questioned everything you said, etc., etc. To my way of thinking, it is not surprising that he would start to perceive you as somewhat high maintenance and possibly start pulling back.

 

If you are interested in this man, why don't you see if you can relax a little and just let events unfold. Sometimes the truth can't be hurried but simply has to be revealed. My concern is that you are so worried about what he might do that you are instigating it into becoming a reality.

[delia88]

Thanks so much for your all of your responses. I think I just got so wound up after that dinner. I read all of the horror stories of the person in my position on this website I was trying to protect myself and be aware of what I was getting myself into. I never have dated a about to be divorcee before.

 

Now it may be too late I may have pushed him away already.

 

Thanks.

[EnigmaXOXO]

I read all of the horror stories of the person in my position on this website I was trying to protect myself and be aware of what I was getting myself into.

 

Don't get sucked into the paranoia!

 

While we get to see the worst-of-the-worst when it comes to dysfunction on this site, it by all means DOES NOT represent the majority of people and their relationships.

 

Their ARE some of us in healthy, happy relationships who come here to try and share what we've learned, and those who have learned to be happy with or without one. And there are even some 'divorces' like myself, who have been lucky enough to find love a second time around.

 

So, don't let all the horror stories mess with your head. Just because it may have happened to someone else, does not mean it will happen to you.

 

Chin Up!!