FWB/Relationship... !

[Madilyn09]

So I've know this guy "Will" forever, he went to school with my sister and is 7 years older than me. I am 19 he is 25. He's the kind of guy that know's he's good looking, and is a little on the cocky side, but also very honest and genuine. We hung out for the first time in February, on a houseboat. After making out the first time we hung out, we didn't talk for about three weeks, until I texted him and said I wanted to see him again and that I liked him. He explained right then that he had broken up with his girlfriend of one year in January, and was serious about not wanting a relationship. He told me that he had never hung out with a girl he was so physically attracted to and not had it turn into something sexual, and that he did not want me to think that he was using me. I agreed that I didn't really want a relationship either, and that we should try to hang out and just stay platonic. He agreed, and we decided to hang out.

 

 

I went to his house, and the first 3 hours were fine, we just watched tv and talked and got to know each other a little better. We have a serious sexual chemistry, and are both very physically attracted to each other. I started to get a little horny and asked him how the whole platonic thing was working for him, long story short, we started making out, had amazing sex, and I ended up staying over. We kept hanging out about every other day, and I went with him to the lake to watch him wake board (he's really good =) Everything was fine the first two weeks until we didn't talk for about 5 days, and I started to miss him, and think about him all the time. So I called him, and we hung out again, he said that he was worried I was going to get attached to him and he didn't want me to think anything had changed...we had sex, and then a week went by, with no word.

 

 

I texted him last monday and told him that the whole situation was too hard on me, and that I thought it was best that I back off, because every time I had sex with him, I grew more attached. He said that that was exactly what he was afraid of, and that he didn't know what to say or do. Somehow, our conversation turned around and I ended up going to his house that night. We started making out like 10 minutes after I got there and I could tell he wanted to have sex, so I asked him if he wanted me to want him more, and fall for him, he couldnt answer...after we had sex, a friend "Nate" called him, and was talking asking for advice because he liked a girl that one of their friends "Jake" had previously had a thing with. Will replied that it didn't matter because Jake wasn't interested in the girl, and that he knew that Jake wouldn't mind because he had had his chance with her, and turned her down. After they got off the phone, I asked Will (figuratively) if he would mind if I started talking to Jake....again, he had a hard time responding...he asked me why I would ask such a question, and seemed really bothered by it, even a little jealous. He said that first of all, Jake wouldn't do that, because he would know to ask Will if it was alright first....but that he wouldn't mind if I talked to Jake and got in a committed relationship with him, because Will has already told me that he can't give me that "right now". He said that he needed a few months of being single to think about things because he was so unhappy about his last relationship (not that he misses her, just how it turned out) I told him I understood...but really, I was soo confused with all of his mixed messages.

 

I also deleted him from facebook, when I texted him and said we shouldn't talk anymore, because I didn't want to see what he was doing and be hurt...and he was upset that I had done that. He said it was "cute" and immature...and teased that hes never going to accept a friend request from me again...I told him that it didn't matter because he probably never looked at my page anyway, and he said that he had probably 50 times, because he always looks at profiles of people he is "interested" in...

 

I am legitimately confused, I know that he says he doesn't want a "committed" relationship, but he is sending me so many mixed messages and double standards. I don't know if I should wait it out and see if maybe we could have something in the future, or if I should just stop, because I don't want him to loose respect for me. It's so confusing and it sucks. I want him sooo bad, but I don't know what to do!

 

I'm sorry I wrote so much, and thank you SO much for reading, I seriously need help!

Edited April 7, 2010 by Madilyn09

[Lecturer]

I'm sorry you're in this confusing/troubling situation. I think this is a good example of the dangers of FWB situations. Many, many people, especially women (but certainly not exclusively women) cannot have a sexual relationship without wanting it to develop.

 

The motivations for the foundation of your relationship with him was based on strong attraction.. that is already a bad sign for what would come. I think most FWB start on a foundation of friendship, and evolve into something sexual without much, if any, chemistry.

 

One thing I like to mention to people confused about why women have become 'attached' in this situation has to do with hormones. During sex, specifically orgasm, the hormone Oxytocin is released in the woman's body. This is a bonding hormone that also occurs during the final stages of labour (so the mother bonds with her offspring), and breast feeding (so the mother desires to feed her offspring). The purpose for bonding with a mate is obvious. People don't always like to accept it, but our emotions and thoughts are completely influenced by chemicals and hormones - increase the right ones and I can make you feel anything. This bonding effect is not something that one can easily overcome with "mind over matter". Some people/women don't experience the effect as much... while for others it can be very powerful.

 

Back to your specific situation: no, I don't think he wants or will want a relationship with you. He wants sex. He would like to be honest about things, but some things he'd like to believe may overpower the truth; don't succumb to the idea that if you wait long enough, he'll want that meaningful relationship with you.

[Calendula]

It doesn't sound to me like you are anywhere near a 'friends-with-benefits' situation. It also sounds to me like he doesn't have that much respect for you to begin with, and is, himself, fairly immature when it comes to relationships. You obviously have feelings and a strong physical attraction to this guy, and he isn't in a position to have a relationship with you, for whatever reason. In my opinion, your best course of action would be to immediately end the relationship completely and stop having sex with him regardless of how attracted you are to him. If you don't, it is highly likely that you're just going to end up even more confused and hurt than you already are.

 

In the future, if you do want a FWB relationship with someone, the best way to make one work is to NOT be strongly attracted to the person, physically or emotionally. FWB or NSA relationships are about being essentially platonic friends who also happen to have sex because you can and you fully trust that person. Once romantic emotions, or 'making love' enters the picture (kissing, lots of petting, snuggling, spending lots of intimate romantic time together), the relationship is no longer FWB or NSA. I would suggest you check out the following ground rules and keep them in mind whenever you again consider having sex with someone outside of a romantic relationship:

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showpost.php?p=2585451&postcount=19

 

Not everyone is suited to a FWB or NSA type relationship, and those who are usually know themselves and what they want much better than most people. These rules will seem highly analytical and un-emotional, but that is intentional; FWB or NSA is supposed to be unemotional, and without emotional strings.

[Madilyn09]

Calendula: Which part seems like he doesn't respect me? We both did everything we could to not have sex. Our initial idea was to hang out and have a fun summer at the lake together. But we are BOTH extremely attracted to each other, and we ended up having sex. I am very comfortable with him, and he ACTS like we are in a relationship when I am with him. I don't want to stop being friends with him. Stop having sex, maybe. But how do you end an intimate relationship and still stay friends? I don't want a FWB or NSA relationship...hell i don't even know if i want a relationship at all! This just happened, and we are both getting feelings for each other...

 

 

Lecturer: I heard that on Dr. Oz the other day lol. And I believe it. I didnt know what you meant about

 

"but some things he'd like to believe may overpower the truth"

 

 

 

What I don't understand about the whole thing, is if he doesn't want a relationship, then why does he act like we're in a relationship when we're together, and why does it seem like he's really into me...he has told me that he would rather us be platonic...do you think maybe I should like, hangout with him, and just not have sex? and see how that works? If he's so worried about me wanting a relationship, and I told him that sex makes me more attached to him, then why does he still want sex? It's so confusing lol. But I really appreciate both of your time =]

[Madilyn09]

also, If it's not FWB then what is it?

 

 

and I know that I am beautiful and smart and have a lot going for me, and that I shouldn't settle for less. I know that in my head, but my feelings are SO strong that I am not sure how to over power them.....it is probably because I am a Pisces lol.

Edited April 7, 2010 by Madilyn09

[mitchell]

 

 

What I don't understand about the whole thing, is if he doesn't want a relationship, then why does he act like we're in a relationship when we're together, and why does it seem like he's really into me...

 

As a guy, it's easy to understand. He's doing these things so he can have sex with you, and it's working. The problem here is that you want this to be a relationship and he just wants a F#*k buddy.

[Madilyn09]

Mitchell, then why does he try so hard not to have sex? Like, he can get sex from anyone he wants, its not like I'm his last resort or anything. So why would he say he really wants to be platonic if he just wants a **** buddy? And why does he get jealous when i talk about other guys?

[mitchell]

Mitchell, then why does he try so hard not to have sex? Like, he can get sex from anyone he wants, its not like I'm his last resort or anything. So why would he say he really wants to be platonic if he just wants a **** buddy? And why does he get jealous when i talk about other guys?

 

I don't get the sense that he's trying too hard to not have sex. In your story you relate that you meet and have sex 10 minutes later despite the desire to not have sex! He's using you. You did say the sex was great, so at least you are getting some pleasure out of the situation.

[Calendula]

It doesn't seem like 'just hanging out' is possible for the two of you. You've tried it multiple times now and both of you have lost self-control and ended up having sex or making out each time. Your actions (from your perspective) say you two are in a romantic relationship, but what you are doing doesn't jive with what you have both said that you really want (platonic/ no sex/ friends). You need to make up your mind about what you really want and stick to it. If you decide you want a real relationship with this guy (which I wouldn't advise at this point) then you should tell him this and see what he says. If he sticks to his line that he would rather just be friends, then end the relationship and absolutely don't sleep with him again (it will only hurt you further if you do). If he says he is willing to try and build something with you, then you could stick around and see what happens, but I would still advise avoiding having sex with him for at least a few weeks of time spent together. That is, unless you are content with just having sex with him when he wants it until he finds his next girlfriend.

 

In very few cases is it possible to end a strong intimate relationship and remain friends, and when it is possible, it is never easy and requires a complete re-definition of what your relationship dynamic is. Once you cross that fine line between 'friends' and 'lovers' you can't really go back, especially not while hanging around the person and continuing to spend time with them in potentially intimate settings (being alone with him). It sounds like he needs some space to get his head straight about his most recent relationship and figure out what he really wants, and the same could be said for you.

 

You're only 19. Do you really know for sure what it is that you want from a long term relationship? Take some time to seriously think about it. Great sex and a strong physical attraction is nice, but there is a lot more that goes into making a strong healthy relationship that lasts than just sex. You have time. If this guy can't get his act together, and quickly, you're better off moving on before he really ends up hurting you further. You will find someone else that you are just as strongly attracted to in the future.

 

I would argue that if he truly respected you and cared for your feelings then he would find the strength of character to say no to having sex with you in spite of his physical attraction to you and any come-on's you may give him. He's older, he should be more mature and know better. While it may not be something you would like to believe, it is quite possible that he acts like he does when the two of you are together entirely because he knows he is going to get laid if he does so. In all likelihood, you're the "rebound." How many guy's do you think are really out there, who are hurting from a recent break-up, who would be likely to say 'no' to an offer of sex from a girl he knows and is even somewhat attracted to? I agree with Mitchell, he's using you, and you're letting him.

 

Whatever the two of you told each other, your actions are saying that YOU really want a relationship with this guy (you miss him, call or text him, go hang out with him, and are posting on LS about him), and his are saying that he'll take what he can get (not calling you for weeks at a time, repeating that he'd rather be platonic but having sex with you anyway). Listen to the actions, both good and bad, and not just what he tells you.

 

I know this is redundant with what I said above, but I can't stress it enough. You also need to decide exactly what it is that YOU WANT from him and ask him directly if what you want is something that he can give you. You said above that you don't want FWB, and I don't think it is something you could truly have at this point anyway. What you've described of your feelings fit with wanting a real relationship with this guy regardless of what you may be telling yourself and if he can't or won't give you that it won't end well. Hopefully he will have enough respect for your feelings, and knowledge of his own emotional situation, that he will give you an honest answer.

 

As a side question, how likely is it that your degree of desire for this guy is related to your monthly hormone cycle (sexual desire and attraction tend to be heightened for women during ovulation)? Also, is it possible that you are subconsciously magnifying the degree of desire you have for this guy because he makes you feel good (sexy, attractive, wanted) in spite of other more negative things that are going on in your life?

[Madilyn09]

Okay, I am starting to understand...and I think that you are right about the levels of consciousness and hormone effects.

 

I was in a relationship for 4 years, and it was so miserable, and we did nothing together, and with this guy, he makes me laugh, and is always down to go do crazy fun stuff...thats another thing that attracts me to him...but it's not enough, and he's going to hurt me.

 

I think that I probably should end it with him...but how do I do this? Just stop talking to him?

 

And just for the record...this is totally his loss lol, I am SO much prettier than his last girl friends and I have WAY more going for me. But whatev....this sucks!

[Calendula]

Stop talking to him is a start. For one it shows that you have better things to do with your life than pine over him and hang on his every action and word. While you might miss the attention at first, you'll adjust and find someone else fun to spend time with who doesn't have hang-ups about a recent break-up and who doesn't want you mainly because you let him have sex with you.

 

Ending things is never any fun, but it sounds like you've got your head on straight and would be up to it. For one thing, you already seem to know that you deserve way more than this guy can likely currently give you.

 

The first thing I would suggest would be to work on ending it in your own head. Talk yourself out of wanting to have anything to do with him. Start being highly critical of his actions (or lack, there-of). If you don't make any move to contact him or do anything with him, does he call you? And if he does, what does he really want (not just what does he say he wants)? If he says he wants to 'hang out and watch a movie and not have sex' and you get to his place and he comes on to you less than 30 min after you get there (without you doing anything to instigate it, of course), than what he really wanted was SEX and not to hang out. If he does this, tell him flat NO and just leave, no discussion. Set your standards high and if he doesn't measure up to each of them, cross him off your list time and time again. Eventually you'll be able to move on from him completely.

 

Make a list of the things that you like about him and the things that you don't like about him or which have upset you with the current situation you're in with him. Add to the lists things you've learned from your previous 4 yr relationship about what you do and do not want or like. Take the list of things you like or want, and start looking for those traits in the guys you meet. Decide what things are deal breakers for you: a guy who has a recent, old girlfriend should probably be high on the Avoid List for you, along with guys who say they just want to be friends, but who are willing to still make out or have sex with you.

 

The bottom line ends up being this: figure out what you want and what you don't want, and don't let any guy you're with give you any less than you know you deserve.

[Madilyn09]

Calendula, is there some way that I can like directly contact you? I'm new to this forum thing. But I want to be able to ask you for advice and stuff as I go along, because it has seriously helped me.

 

Let me know if thats okay =]

 

Thank you for everything.

[Calendula]

I'm glad I've been of help to you . After you've been on here for a bit (certain # of posts or active time on the site) you get private messaging (PM) capabilities which are more direct, but I think you've got a little while to go yet. You can find more info on it in the LS Questions threads.

 

The nice thing about posting in the forums as opposed to PM, is that if I'm not around right then to give you advice, some one else might be who has great ideas too. You're completely anonomyous so you shouldn't have to worry about what other people think of you or about what you write in your postings about yourself (as long as you don't give away too much personal info). If you share, you might be pleasantly surprised at what people will give you as advice and encouragement. Also, it's sometimes nice to have more minds helping you work on your problem than just one - multiple perspectives and experiences on the same thing can be quite valuable when you're trying to figure out what works for you. I've also been known to disappear from LS for weeks to months at a time (I just recently logged back in after being off-site for about 2-3 months) but there will always be someone on the forum who will try and give you feedback. For the time being, I will try to keep checking for your posts and threads, though .

 

If you read around a bit on LS you can also learn about a lot of other people's experiences which may help you find insight into your own situation. The archive goes years back, and if you look for a bit I know you'll find something that relates to your situation. Posting your own thread and getting feedback can be really helpful, but there is nothing quite like the feeling when you find someone else on LS (even if it was years ago) who has experienced and survived what you're currently going through. It is like all of a sudden you know you're not alone, and that you'll be able to survive no matter how bad things get, because that person went through the same thing. Reading the feedback they got also lets you tap into the minds of a whole group of people who may not even see your current postings for one reason or another. LS is a great community, and the more you read, the more I think you'll see that.

 

A few other LS pointers: To find out more about a person, their temperment, ideas, experiences, you can click on their username in a thread and select "find more posts." You can also go to their statistics page in their user profile and select "find all threads started by" to get a sense of what they usually post about. If you want to see more of how I think and the kind of advice I've given people in the past, that would be a good place to start (if you haven't done it already, that is ).

[Lecturer]

I didnt know what you meant about

 

"but some things he'd like to believe may overpower the truth"

 

I'm saying he may SAY he doesn't want to hurt you (moreover, he doesn't want his own desires/interests to be put before your happiness), but that doesn't mean he will always be able to do that.

 

 

do you think maybe I should like, hangout with him, and just not have sex? and see how that works?

 

NO! What would be the goal for this? The problem here is that YOU want something, and he wants something different. He wants all the advantages of a relationship (more than just sex), but none of the responsibilities. He wants to have sex, and cuddle, and feel those exciting and powerful emotions that come with a relationship (yes, guys like it too ).. but he doesn't want to have to dedicate his free time to you if he doesn't want to. He doesn't want to have to be there for you if he is otherwise busy. I don't think either of you want a FWB situation.. you want a relationship and he wants a worry-free, responsibility-free, part-time GF.

 

I advise you to stay NC (no-contact) with him and start getting over him. I know it won't be easy to stop thinking of him, but you should start that process immediately.

[SouthernSunshine]

One thing I like to mention to people confused about why women have become 'attached' in this situation has to do with hormones. During sex, specifically orgasm, the hormone Oxytocin is released in the woman's body. This is a bonding hormone that also occurs during the final stages of labour (so the mother bonds with her offspring), and breast feeding (so the mother desires to feed her offspring). The purpose for bonding with a mate is obvious. People don't always like to accept it, but our emotions and thoughts are completely influenced by chemicals and hormones - increase the right ones and I can make you feel anything. This bonding effect is not something that one can easily overcome with "mind over matter". Some people/women don't experience the effect as much... while for others it can be very powerful.

 

Well I guess I'm a different kind of woman. I had a baby through Traditional Surrogacy.. where I was the surrogate. I handed the baby right over to her parents. No bonding, no nothing. I did what I set out to do. Journey accomplished. As with my personal relationships. When I start feeling vulnerable I take a step back. But that's just me...

 

To the OP: I'm sorry you're feeling confused. Men (and women) can be very selfish. Maybe now is a good time for you to take a few steps back. Good luck!