For the record...

[JustJoe]

One thing that I wish someone would teach me is how to live in the "Here and now". Something that you, FA, and others have adapted to. One of the basic arguments we (MW and I) had, she was always asking why we couldn't live in the present. Why I couldn't accept things as they are. She still wants us to have a relationship, even now. She tells me that I'm the only man she has ever truly loved and loves. I know that many will say that she is the one betraying her H and I'm not responsible for her marriage, but for the life of me, I can't be her man (what she calls me) unless I'm the ONLY one!!! Believe me, I've tried. When we are together, there isn't anyone else in the world, but in the back of my mind, there is always the knowledge that in a few days or weeks she will go back to him, to claim another payment. How can she be so loving, intelligent, passionate and warm to me and so mercenary and dishonest with him? AND WHY CAN'T I LIVE WITH IT!! Sometimes it drives me crazy!!

[jennie-jennie]

FA, you and I have gotten to know each other pretty well and I will say that you have a relationship very UNLIKE any one else on this board.

 

Perhaps unlike your former affair, but not unlike my relationship. I don't understand the need of some posters to single out FA's relationship. As we often point out here on LS, there are patterns in extramarital relationships, and FA's relationship fits into the pattern of many others, mine included.

 

You do not make excuses for your sweetheart You do not condone what he is doing and you by NO MEANS are a "LOOK AT ME, I am the OW" type of person.

 

As FA has clearly stated, she too believes in the split self affair theory, which some LS posters term "excuses".

 

You go about your business and your sweetheart has NEVER once diminished you to his wife, when she was faced with the COMPLETE knowledge of your relationship. THAT is key, IMHO. He didn't minimize you, he didn't downplay you and he doesn't HIDE you.

 

FA's MM claimed to his spouse on Dday that the extramarital relationship was over when in fact it was not.

 

You know, and I have said this to you many times, I wish for you a FULL relationship with him - where you can meet his kids, spend your days growing old with him (or someone). You even at one point earlier this year decided to date and infact, had a challenge with one of your friends

 

You DO live in the moment, and don't waste your days sitting and waiting for communication.

I too do not "waste my days sitting and waiting for communication". But just like FA is in communication very frequently with her MM by telephone when he is not around, so am I frequently in contact with my MM.

 

You also SEE your man regularly. You and he in a way "play house" (please take that in the way I mean it) by doing family night, paying bills, cleaning house, etc. Life doesn't stop for you when he is over, when he is on the phone, etc. You do carry on with your life and I believe he sees that and realizes you are in independent woman who waits for no one.

 

Some of us are due to obligations of our own, not as fortunate as FA, being able to move in the vicinity of our MM. My children need to continue their education in the town we live, and they are old enough to have relationships of their own which I do not desire to break up. FA's children are younger than mine, so luckily for her it has been easier to take them with her and move closer to her MM.

 

I hope FOR YOU that he does give you what you want. I hope that he does stay true to his word.

 

Just like my MM, FA's MM is very careful not to make promises. In the rare cases they do, you can trust them, since they have been so carefully considered.

 

I do DISAGREE with something you said on page 1 about men who divorce...the way I read it, you implied that men who do divorce don't stand by their commitments. As you know, I am married to a man who was previously married. While there was no adultery in his marriage, he did choose to divorce because he no longer loved his wife and was willing to risk being alone for the rest of his life vs being in a relationship where there was no love, no friendship, no passion, no nothing.... He DID love his wife at one point, I know that and respect that. I am glad he had that first marriage (like I am glad I had mine) because it helped both of us know what we would and wouldn't want in a future.

No 2 marriages are alike, no 2 people are alike. I personally don't believe in the self split crap - and yes, it is crap to me. People like to throw labels on everything these days -- ADHD, ADD, split self, etc..... About the only label I do agree with, as I have seen it first hand, is bi-polar, but again, that term is thrown around by so many people (in general, not here) that it looses its meaning. Just because someone is a jerk doesn't mean they have a mental handicap or disorder.

 

If you like I had once suffered of a mental condition, you would know the power and liberating force of a label. To understand that it is something that others have to deal with as well, something that has an explanation, something that you can get help with, is so incredibly helpful.

 

While I think it is dishonorable to lie, cheat, steal, etc., I think everyone in life has something and isn't perfect. I think it is wrong of your sweetheart to be doing what he is doing -- not only to you, but to his kids and to his wife. I wish he were more honorable and honest -- for his sake, your sake, etc. I think his kids would actually respect him more if he was honest about his feelings instead of lying and manipulating them to believe mom and dad are fine. It will hit them like a ton of bricks when/if he does eventually leave.

 

As I tell my son all the time, all we have in this life is our word. It is one thing to mess up and correct it, it is another to live a lie and to not respect those around you to be able to trust them and respect them enough to tell the truth.

 

But if YOU are happy, then that is what I wish for you. I wish that your situation resolves its self one way or another -- sooner rather than later -- we never know what is in store for us each day. We could be struck by lightening, hit by a car, shot in a drive by, etc. I hope I go to my grave knowing I did everything in my power to live each day as honorably as I possibly can. That doesn't mean I don't screw up...I do. And as soon as I do, I do my best to make amends for that.

 

No one is perfect -- no person is without sin. We all learn new things each day and each relationship - good or bad - brings knowledge to us. If you are happy today with your situation, and you personally are not being dishonest, disrespectful and all that stuff..... then you do not have anything to be ashamed of. I know you wish your situation was different and you are not short changing your kids by ignoring them, being too preoccupied with your sweetheart when they need you (as I believe one of your kids is still pretty young). You are showing your children that you are an involved and loving mom.

 

Kids will be okay with just one involved biological parent .... take one look at my son and you will see clearly that he didn't suffer because of his absent father. Kids SURVIVE divorce and even flourish, especially when they are given a loving, caring and attentive step parent. I can't image the harm that my son would have suffered had I stayed in my first marriage.

 

I wish you happiness, love and passion for each and every day of your life. And I hope YOU get your happy ending.

I sincerely hope you extend your well wishes to all of us other OW who are in similar situations as FA.

Edited April 8, 2010 by jennie-jennie

[jennie-jennie]

As proof, I spent today doing four loads of laundry; finished unpacking my kitchen which includes rewashing, by hand all the dishes(I moved last week); called and yelled at the schools about not getting the buses sent to pick up my kids this morning (they sent a taxi to come pick them up ); spoke with the daycare about the change of address and new drop off times; scubbed the toilets and bath tubs again (the people who moved out apparently never did ); called and cancelled the utilities at my former house; spoke with my sweetheart numerous times; posted on LS off and on all day; played farmville on facebook ; washed cat poop off the cat, and my hands (don't ask!!!!); signed two report cards; filled out a permission slip for my daughter to go to a local water park to celebrate academic achievement; filled out forms for my son to donate blood to the Red Cross; spoke to the church youth leader about my son's upcoming mission trip; cooked dinner and ate it with my kids; scraped the dishes, and got them soaking to wash in the morning, and will be meeting my sweetheart on the game we play together online in about an hour.

 

This is my day off. Tomorrow will be just as busy, and will include as an addition, four hours of volunteer work and a shift at one of my two jobs.

 

Sounds pretty much like my day!

[jennie-jennie]

FA, I am very happy you wrote your original post. That is how I live as well and it is a working way to be the OW. I hope others who read it do understand that there is a way to be happy as the OW if this is what you choose to be.

 

There are alternatives to No Contact!

[JustJoe]

I sure wish that I could do what FA and Jennie do. I've tried to ignore her marriage situation, but it doesn't work for me.

[jennie-jennie]

FA:

 

You don't have to explain, you know? If someone calls you out in a thread etc, you can just report it.

 

I say this because I want you to realize that you don't have to explain yourself.

 

I remember that I hadn't been here very long and WWIU made a post basically telling me that my man would never make an honest woman of me (in paraphrase). It was in the heat of a post war between the BS's and the OW (which I have to admit, I don't see here anymore). I basically said it was none of her business.

 

In reality, your R is none of our business. I only post now when I think I can help or have a different perspective on the topic (or if if think there's a troll sniffing around). But I want you to realize that you don't owe anyone here. Your R is yours. We don't know you or your MM. Only you do. When I give you advice, I give it to you from heart, and in your best interest. But only you know your circumstances. Never feel like you have to answer anyone's questions.

 

Also, be careful about someone who comes sniffing with questions. You never know who is who here. TMI will get people discovered. Always be wary of anyone who wants to know your personal circumstances.

 

I thought I should put that out there because the OG's aren't here anymore. And anonymity seems a given. It's not. The world wide web is the world wide web.

 

I hope that your R goes the way that you want it to. Remember, that YOU hold the power here. Don't ever settle for less than you want. I'm SURE that you can get it.

 

GEL

 

Great post, GEL! Thank you! Valuable information for me too.

[jennie-jennie]

One thing that I wish someone would teach me is how to live in the "Here and now". Something that you, FA, and others have adapted to. One of the basic arguments we (MW and I) had, she was always asking why we couldn't live in the present. Why I couldn't accept things as they are. She still wants us to have a relationship, even now. She tells me that I'm the only man she has ever truly loved and loves. I know that many will say that she is the one betraying her H and I'm not responsible for her marriage, but for the life of me, I can't be her man (what she calls me) unless I'm the ONLY one!!! Believe me, I've tried. When we are together, there isn't anyone else in the world, but in the back of my mind, there is always the knowledge that in a few days or weeks she will go back to him, to claim another payment. How can she be so loving, intelligent, passionate and warm to me and so mercenary and dishonest with him? AND WHY CAN'T I LIVE WITH IT!! Sometimes it drives me crazy!!

 

Very honest and heartfelt post, Joe.

 

(((Joe)))

[pureinheart]

One thing that I wish someone would teach me is how to live in the "Here and now". Something that you, FA, and others have adapted to. One of the basic arguments we (MW and I) had, she was always asking why we couldn't live in the present. Why I couldn't accept things as they are. She still wants us to have a relationship, even now. She tells me that I'm the only man she has ever truly loved and loves. I know that many will say that she is the one betraying her H and I'm not responsible for her marriage, but for the life of me, I can't be her man (what she calls me) unless I'm the ONLY one!!! Believe me, I've tried. When we are together, there isn't anyone else in the world, but in the back of my mind, there is always the knowledge that in a few days or weeks she will go back to him, to claim another payment. How can she be so loving, intelligent, passionate and warm to me and so mercenary and dishonest with him? AND WHY CAN'T I LIVE WITH IT!! Sometimes it drives me crazy!!

 

Ya, but what if she wanted to nest....Just Joe, I couldn't help myself...hey I read one of your other replies in another thread...I had to laugh because my parakeets just had babies...which is called a clutch, so do you want a clutch?

 

Everyone is different, you have to be true to you....

[JustJoe]

Thaks Jennie and PIH. It's nice to hear a friendly voice, once in a while. Many people here think that because I'm the OM, I'm an evil homewrecker, and all I have to do is walk away from the A, to "redeem myself". Do people actually think that I WANTED to fall in love with a married woman and a "Goldigger", at that? Are the only choices I have is to "live for today", and accept her continued marriage, or, leave her for good. WTF kind of choices are those? I keep telling myself that it's only because of the passion, that I'm still here, but I'm really only fooling myself. I really, truly love her....so much.

[pureinheart]

Hi Jennie,

 

Once again I am amazed at how well you handle yourself, I saw it too...

[Hazyhead]

FA:

 

You don't have to explain, you know? If someone calls you out in a thread etc, you can just report it.

 

I say this because I want you to realize that you don't have to explain yourself.

 

I remember that I hadn't been here very long and WWIU made a post basically telling me that my man would never make an honest woman of me (in paraphrase). It was in the heat of a post war between the BS's and the OW (which I have to admit, I don't see here anymore). I basically said it was none of her business.

 

In reality, your R is none of our business. I only post now when I think I can help or have a different perspective on the topic (or if if think there's a troll sniffing around). But I want you to realize that you don't owe anyone here. Your R is yours. We don't know you or your MM. Only you do. When I give you advice, I give it to you from heart, and in your best interest. But only you know your circumstances. Never feel like you have to answer anyone's questions.

 

Also, be careful about someone who comes sniffing with questions. You never know who is who here. TMI will get people discovered. Always be wary of anyone who wants to know your personal circumstances.

 

I thought I should put that out there because the OG's aren't here anymore. And anonymity seems a given. It's not. The world wide web is the world wide web.

 

I hope that your R goes the way that you want it to. Remember, that YOU hold the power here. Don't ever settle for less than you want. I'm SURE that you can get it.

 

GEL

 

I agree with this. FA, I always admire you for firmly and wholeheartedly sticking up for your beliefs, but in doing so you are bound to gather unfortunate animosity. I feel you shouldn't have to defend yourself to those posters; their views are their views, not those of everybody.

 

In relation to your sweetheart, he is an incredibly lucky man to have you and I wish for you to someday soon have your dreams fulfilled.

 

Please don't let negative posters put you off - you're needed here!

[Fallen Angel]

Hi FA, I'm baaaaaaaaaack

 

Welcome back, my friend. You have been missed.

 

Then why, in this discussion, are we going to take the ONE THING you most desire out of the discussion? The one, and most blatantly obvious, glaring and open honor he can give is not on the table so to speak. That one omission completely invalidates this and turns this "discussion" into some celebration of all the needs he meets. Except the one he won't.

 

It is a celebration of all the needs he does meet. That is what a good relationship should be. A constant celebration of the things that you do to enhance your partner's life.

 

I take his divorcing, right now, off the table for discussion, because it is something he feels he can not do right now.

 

It clearly pains you FA. It has, in some form, been a fairly constant theme for you. You and MM have had more than a few discussions on it. Each time, the answer, however cleverly or "nobly" or gently given is no. In fact, he has made it perfectly clear the answer will forever be no.

 

It does pain me, and is a constant theme for me, because that is the one area in which he "fails" me. But he has certainly NOT made it clear that the answer will forever be no. The answer is no, right now.

 

Might one say that you are settling? To accept less than what you want and deserve.

 

Do you believe this to be true FA?

 

JW

 

If you want to call it settling, then that is your interpretation. I do not see it that way. I see it as accepting the relationship as it stands today, and seeing it for what it is. And today, while I am not getting everything I want, I am getting enough to make the wait worthwhile. Especially since I know that if tomorrow I feel differently, I can change the dynamic, by either ending the relationship, or renegotiating the terms.

 

((hugs)) Glad to have you back.

[NoIDidn't]

I agree with GEL that you don't owe anyone any explanations, even when called out in a thread.

 

I didn't think it was good form for whoever called you out in the previous thread as well.

 

Also, this thread is about you, not anyone else. So I am a little confused about the posts where what others said they felt about your with your MM differed from other situations had anything to do with them, or needed to be defended against in this thread.

 

My only concern, FA, (and you don't owe me any explanation or clarification on this point) is that living in the present only can be to the detriment of the future. I admire people that are able to live in the present and enjoy "what is". But I wonder if they are at all concerned about "what will be" as the result of "what is". And this has nothing to do with a final d-day, or the affair in general. Its about the final effects of the A on everybody that it touched. I am not a believer that "love conquers all" (not that anyone has said that).

 

I do agree with GEL. We had many a row "back in the day". And I was very much a part of them, shamefully so. So don't feel the need to explain your R in its own thread. We might not agree with all that you do and say, but you don't have to answer us as its none of our concern truly.

[jennie-jennie]

Hi Jennie,

 

Once again I am amazed at how well you handle yourself, I saw it too...

 

Also' date=' this thread is about you, not anyone else. So I am a little confused about the posts where what others said they felt about [i']your[/i] with your MM differed from other situations had anything to do with them, or needed to be defended against in this thread.

 

I am confused why some posters who are obviously referring to me and my relationship do not mention me by name. It couldn't be to avoid the possibility of being reported to the mods, could it?

 

This thread is about Fallen Angel and all OW/OM who identify themselves with her. We are many. Even when/if the circumstances are not identical the basic patterns are, and FA's words are of great help to us.

 

Why point out the differences at all? What purpose does that serve? It is the difference in the OW's/OM's attitude that matters, not the difference in circumstances.

Edited April 8, 2010 by jennie-jennie

[Hazyhead]

I am confused why some posters who are obviously referring to me and my relationship do not mention me by name. It couldn't be to avoid the possibility of being reported to the mods, could it?

 

This thread is about Fallen Angel and all OW/OM who identify themselves with her. We are many. Even when/if the circumstances are not identical the basic patterns are, and FA's words are of great help to us.

 

I'm with you here, Jennie. I think it's so important to have the differences of opinion and that should be appreciated more instead of criticised. Empathy is a powerful tool to personal growth and maybe if folks were less shut down to the opinions and choices that differ from their own a lot more learning and far less bitterness would be the result.

 

We may not agree with everybody's choices and opinions but we should learn to respect them.

 

Peace out!

[jennie-jennie]

Pointing out in which ways FA's relationship differs from others' only serves to confuse us and draw our attention away from the important point she is trying to make:

 

I see it as accepting the relationship as it stands today, and seeing it for what it is. And today, while I am not getting everything I want, I am getting enough to make the wait worthwhile. Especially since I know that if tomorrow I feel differently, I can change the dynamic, by either ending the relationship, or renegotiating the terms.

[Fallen Angel]

FA:

 

You don't have to explain, you know? If someone calls you out in a thread etc, you can just report it.

 

I say this because I want you to realize that you don't have to explain yourself.

 

I remember that I hadn't been here very long and WWIU made a post basically telling me that my man would never make an honest woman of me (in paraphrase). It was in the heat of a post war between the BS's and the OW (which I have to admit, I don't see here anymore). I basically said it was none of her business.

 

In reality, your R is none of our business. I only post now when I think I can help or have a different perspective on the topic (or if if think there's a troll sniffing around). But I want you to realize that you don't owe anyone here. Your R is yours. We don't know you or your MM. Only you do. When I give you advice, I give it to you from heart, and in your best interest. But only you know your circumstances. Never feel like you have to answer anyone's questions.

 

Also, be careful about someone who comes sniffing with questions. You never know who is who here. TMI will get people discovered. Always be wary of anyone who wants to know your personal circumstances.

 

I thought I should put that out there because the OG's aren't here anymore. And anonymity seems a given. It's not. The world wide web is the world wide web.

 

I hope that your R goes the way that you want it to. Remember, that YOU hold the power here. Don't ever settle for less than you want. I'm SURE that you can get it.

 

GEL

 

GEL,

 

Thank you.

 

I do realize that I am not obligated to respond. However, I feel that because I am willing to speak from my heart not only about other people's relationships, but about my own, I can be more effective in helping someone than if I were to come here and speak without being willing to speak to my own personal experiences.

 

I find it very frustrating, personally, when people who have never been any part of an affair relationship (not WS,BS, or Other) come here and make blanket statements about how those relationships work.

 

They know nothing about what they speak to, because they have no experience. It is because I have had experience on all sides of the triangle (I was BW for 15 years, I was WS while in my EA, and I am currently OW) that I can sympathize and empathize with people here, and make a connection with them, hopefully providing some insight to help people heal.

 

If I allow other people to push buttons, and I crawl upon my high horse and ignore valid questions because I do not want to speak openly and honestly about my expereinces, then I invalidate my reason to be here and possibly lose the chance to help someone who may have benefited from my experience.

 

I well understand that anonimity is not a given. But yet I choose to not allow that to stop me from speaking freely. I go so far as to use my real pictures, as even though this is not a path I would have chosen to walk, it is the path that i am on, and I feel I should not have to hide that fact. I am not ashamed of loving or of accepting the love that is freely offered to me.

 

If my posting here were to cause problems in my relationship, then perhaps I would take a different view of things. However, my sweetheart is well aware that I post here, that I post very personal information about myself, and in the process him. I try not to give details that would lead anyone straight to me, but occasionally it has happened.

 

My sweetheart is very open about our relationship on some sites as well. Openly discussing how he feels about me, speaking about the fact that he is in a relationship with me, that he knows me intimately etc. Those accounts are a direct link to him, he uses his own picture, name and his personal email address there. While our relationship is not common knowledge with his children (one of them is aware of it) or his extended family, it is common knowledge to his wife and he is obviously not too concerned about it being out there on the world wide web. *shrug*

 

If the details of our relationship were to become common knowledge with his extended family and children and cause problems with our relationship, then it perhaps would be proof that our relationship is not as strong as we both seem to think it is, and it would be the catalyst for us both moving on.

 

But, I refuse to live in fear and secrecy. And deny myself the outlet that LS has afforded me by hiding details about myself or my relationship.

Edited April 8, 2010 by Fallen Angel

[Fallen Angel]

This thread is about Fallen Angel and all OW/OM who identify themselves with her. We are many. Even when/if the circumstances are not identical the basic patterns are, and FA's words are of great help to us.

 

Why point out the differences at all? What purpose does that serve? It is the difference in the OW's/OM's attitude that matters, not the difference in circumstances.

 

I think that by comparing and contrasting my relationship with the relationships of others who post here, people are using me in order to try to get a few digs in to other people, and the thought of that hurts me.

 

I posted this thread not only to clarify my feelings but also in an effort to try to help people see that not all affair relationships are inherently harmful to the OW/OM, as often I see that come up in threads as a "given". It is not a given.

 

My situation is unique not because of it's dynamic, but because of the people involved. The dynamic appears to be one that many posters seem to feel parallel their own relationships. And while the details may be unique to my situation, the general dynamic of my relationship seems to be more common than people believe.

 

Jennie, I will be the first to admit that I do not hold a patent on a healthy affair relationship. I was able to reach the point where my relationship turned from being unhealthy for me, because I was bogged down in looking for an end result; into a healthy relationship where I feel free and whole again because you were able to point the way. Once I was able to learn that the journey is much more important than the destination, I was able to find a peace I had been lacking.

 

I wish that people would be able to see that if they can be open and understanding and even supportive of me on my journey, that it would be okay to offer the same to someone else on theirs'.

 

I do not own exclusive rights to the path I am on, of discovering daily what I need, and how I am going to go about meeting those needs. In fact, I feel blessed that it is not a path I have to walk alone.

 

I see the love you have for your MM, and I see you walking beside me on the path to discovery, and I am grateful for your company.

 

My hope is that while the things we say here may never change the world, that perhaps someone who is able to see my story and wish me well, will someday be able to look beyond past hurts and sqaubbles and be able to offer that same compassion to someone else. If that happens for even one person to be able to soften their heart to one other person, then my time here has not been wasted.

 

I think if we could all stop the bickering and pettiness that perhaps we could open a line of communication in which it is possible for us all to find healing.

 

Now I am hi-jacking my own thread.. lol

 

((hugs))

[NoIDidn't]

I'm with you here, Jennie. I think it's so important to have the differences of opinion and that should be appreciated more instead of criticised. Empathy is a powerful tool to personal growth and maybe if folks were less shut down to the opinions and choices that differ from their own a lot more learning and far less bitterness would be the result.

 

We may not agree with everybody's choices and opinions but we should learn to respect them.

 

Peace out!

 

Nothing in my statement showed a lack of empathy. Nothing. I am very annoyed with the constant usage of the word "empathy" to imply "agreement" in this forum. And how when it isn't shown (agreement), its used to insult others as having not grown or being close-minded.

 

I only stated the obvious. This thread is about FA. She started it in defense of herself. Any poster that appreciated the fact that she didn't make excuses for her Sweetheart was not necessarily referencing posters that needed to rush to their own defense.

 

I don't know who brought up FA in the other thread (and I'm too lazy to check), but I do feel it was in poor taste and not fair to FA at all to be used in such a way.

 

Its one thing to bring up a situation that seems similar, and address that. It quite another to bring up a specific poster's situation, assume things about it, and proceed to knock down those assumptions.

 

And I don't say any of this to insult that poster either. To some extent, if we are honest, we've all done it in here. GEL specifically mentioned the posting wars that used to go on in here. And they were doozies. I would not want this forum (or any forum) to return to that madness.

 

Its important that FA (sorry to keep addressing you in the third person) defends against being used in such a way, but its not necessary that she post all of her feelings and business as there are lurkers and others that would be happy to use it against her IRL (if they could).

[Fallen Angel]

I sure wish that I could do what FA and Jennie do. I've tried to ignore her marriage situation, but it doesn't work for me.

 

I do not just "ignore" his maritial status.

 

I just refuse to allow his maritial status to define ME!!!

 

I am a woman, in love with a man, who offered his love to me. My relationship with him is independant of his relationship with his wife.

 

He knows that I will not always be willing to look beyond his maritial situation, and maintain our relationship as it stands today.

 

At present, I understand and accept his need to remain in his marriage. But, like any relationship, ours grows and the dynamic changes to fit the growth. When I no longer see the dynamic staying true to the circumstances as they exist, we will renegotiate our relationship. This may include my demand that he leave his marriage, or it may include my chosing to end the relationship.

 

But as it stands, today, I am content in my relationship with him.

[Hazyhead]

Nothing in my statement showed a lack of empathy. Nothing. I am very annoyed with the constant usage of the word "empathy" to imply "agreement" in this forum. And how when it isn't shown (agreement), its used to insult others as having not grown or being close-minded.

 

I only stated the obvious. This thread is about FA. She started it in defense of herself. Any poster that appreciated the fact that she didn't make excuses for her Sweetheart was not necessarily referencing posters that needed to rush to their own defense.

 

I don't know who brought up FA in the other thread (and I'm too lazy to check), but I do feel it was in poor taste and not fair to FA at all to be used in such a way.

 

Its one thing to bring up a situation that seems similar, and address that. It quite another to bring up a specific poster's situation, assume things about it, and proceed to knock down those assumptions.

 

And I don't say any of this to insult that poster either. To some extent, if we are honest, we've all done it in here. GEL specifically mentioned the posting wars that used to go on in here. And they were doozies. I would not want this forum (or any forum) to return to that madness.

 

Its important that FA (sorry to keep addressing you in the third person) defends against being used in such a way, but its not necessary that she post all of her feelings and business as there are lurkers and others that would be happy to use it against her IRL (if they could).

 

You've misunderstood me, NiD; I wasn't referring to you at all. In fact, I've found your posts really helpful to me in the past. I was speaking generally and I'm sorry I offended you, but the couple of posters I did have in mind (whose views I also appreciate, just thing they can be a little harsh at times), didn't include you.

[NoIDidn't]

You've misunderstood me, NiD; I wasn't referring to you at all. In fact, I've found your posts really helpful to me in the past. I was speaking generally and I'm sorry I offended you, but the couple of posters I did have in mind (whose views I also appreciate, just thing they can be a little harsh at times), didn't include you.

 

My apologies. I did take offense to what I thought implied I lacked personal growth or empathy and was bitter, when I am none of those things. Thanks for setting me straight. (slinks off)

 

Sorry FA. I'll be taking my personal issues and triggers elsewhere now.

[Hazyhead]

My apologies. I did take offense to what I thought implied I lacked personal growth or empathy and was bitter, when I am none of those things. Thanks for setting me straight. (slinks off)

 

Sorry FA. I'll be taking my personal issues and triggers elsewhere now.

 

Come back! No harm done. For what it's worth, when you've posted on issues I've had in the past you've always shown a great deal of empathy, NiD.

 

So, wanna get your personal issues and triggers out and we'll slog them to death too? Then I'll do mine? (We could be here all day.)

[Joobi]

While I agree that it shouldn't become necessary for someone to defend themselves on a forum, I am glad you posted, thanks. It is useful (imo) to see the different points of view on offer, and openess and honesty about the struggles people go through makes me realise that I am not alone.

 

What I like so much about your situation is that you seem to have found a balance that works reasonably well for you and the others involved in your life. While not everything is perfect (as you say), also noone is desperately unhappy, being hurt or being forced to do something against their nature (I am particularly thinking here of your Sweetheart having to leave his marriage when he obviously feels it would be wrong right now for his own valid reasons- he is fortunate to have your understanding in this).

 

Having had my fair share of 'unpleasant' relationships. I am so glad you and all the others involved have found happiness in the situation you are in.

Edited April 8, 2010 by Joobi
realised some bit could be misinterpreted so reworded it

[NoIDidn't]

Come back! No harm done. For what it's worth, when you've posted on issues I've had in the past you've always shown a great deal of empathy, NiD.

 

So, wanna get your personal issues and triggers out and we'll slog them to death too? Then I'll do mine? (We could be here all day.)

 

You start the thread, and I'll certainly post in it.

 

To be somewhat on topic in this thread (LOL), I do admire FA's stance and respect her a great deal for it. I don't agree with her choices, but that has nothing to do with respect for the way she handles herself most of the time.