Views on marriage

[climbergirl]

In my personal experience you can be strongly committed to someone without being married. As I mentioned previously, my bf had these views prior to us being together, so I don't take a personal afront to his stance and don't think his views have anything to do with his ability to commit to one person.

 

It's also my experience that being married in no way guarantees a commitment. You don't have to look any further than the infidelity/divorce/OW forums to realize that. A piece of paper solidifies nothing, IMO, but how committed you are falls upon the general makeup and dynamics of the two people involved.

[notmarriageminded]

Eyore79 and Aerogurl87, you both seem like very insecure women.

 

Do you really, TRULY attach THAT much importance to the word "wife?" Can you give any practical reasons (practical, ladies, NOT emotional) why, if you're given everything you want (love, commitment, cohabitation, coupling etc) that the DEAL IS OFF if it doesn't include the word "wife?"

 

Seems like a trivial reason to dump somebody who desires to make you happy.

[notmarriageminded]

Mr. White said:

 

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"I believe in marriage and want to get married, but I feel that men are shut out of the whole process, before and after - getting married (and for that matter - being married, or getting divorced) is all about the girl, and I don't find that acceptable. So, I will get married, but my gf certainly won't find that to be a fairy tale concept. The money for the wedding will not come out of thin air, and I expect to have a say in the things that matter to me (which does not include the bridesmaid's dresses, but does include the issue of when and on what terms to buy a house).

 

I feel that too many men just hand their lives over after getting married and get the double whammy - they are robbed of their lives, and their wives don't respect them. I intend to be a good husband, which includes rocking the boat when necessary, and being a calm harbor - also when necessary.

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The wisdom in this post is extremely pertinent. Not to mention overdue!

[aerogurl87]

Eyore79 and Aerogurl87, you both seem like very insecure women.

 

Do you really, TRULY attach THAT much importance to the word "wife?" Can you give any practical reasons (practical, ladies, NOT emotional) why, if you're given everything you want (love, commitment, cohabitation, coupling etc) that the DEAL IS OFF if it doesn't include the word "wife?"

 

Seems like a trivial reason to dump somebody who desires to make you happy.

 

Let's see,first off I'm not insecure but I was raised in a very traditional and loving household, marriage is important to me. And if not being married ever makes me unhappy, then why should I lower my standards for one person? With that said, you ask what would be the practical reasons for being married, well that's obvious the laws associated with married couples. There are things that married couples are entitled to that non married couples aren't. If it was all the same and equal I don't think most gay and lesbian couples would be fighting so hard for the right to marry one another.

[BlackLovely]

I want to get married. Even if a man offered a permanent commitment and a legal contract similar to marriage, it still wouldn't be enough - I want to get married. I want the social proof of my man standing up in front of everyone and making a public commitment to me, I want to show off my ring and have other women ooh and ahh and say how wonderful my partner is, I want us to be an official couple, I want to call him my husband and have him call me his wife, I want our children to be legitimate. I want everything to be "proper" in the eyes of society; I want everyone to be clear about the status of our relationship.

 

If I say he's my husband, everyone knows what that means. If I say he's my legal partner, it doesn't sound as good and doesn't carry any obvious status, and people are bound to wonder why he doesn't want to marry me - in fact I'd wonder that myself; if he's prepared to make a permanent commitment then why can't he just do it properly and marry me? It would be humiliating for me to have to explain that I'm in a committed relationship but my partner doesn't want to actually marry me; it makes it look like he isn't really committed to me and wants a quick escape route.

 

I wouldn't want to coerce a man into marriage though; if a particular guy doesn't want to marry me, well, there are more fish in the sea! He's supposed to want to marry me and commit to spending the rest of his life with me. If a guy didn't propose marriage within a few years, and didn't seem to want commitment, I'd probably dump him and start looking for a man who does want to commit before I reach my expiry date.

 

I suppose it has something to do with the fact that a man's value increases with age (he gets more wealthy and powerful etc, and is attractive to younger women) while a woman's value decreases (she becomes less attractive and eventually can no longer bear children). I want to snag a decent man and have him commit to me while my value is still high - I want him to commit to staying with me and raising a family, I don't want him to vanish and leave me holding the baby. Marriage is the most secure status I can aspire to; if a man marries me he's obviously committed to staying together and having kids, plus the status of being married is a very clear "Hands off" sign to other women. Apart from anything else, marriage makes me a respectable woman, as opposed to being a slut who is banging some guy out of wedlock and popping out illegitimate children.

 

I find it rather troubling that you place so much value in what others think of you. The confidence and self love has to come from within, not from society's approval.

 

There are a lot of married women who are not very "respectable". Would you say that a woman who cheated on her husband is respectable? I'm willing to bet that you would not, you seem to have a very traditional mindset. This is your choice of course, but please remember that traditional attitudes rob women of power.

 

I'm living with my fiance and we love to have sex, so I guess that makes me a slut. Who knew? Me and the other millions of women that cohabit before marriage are all dirty whores!

[allina]

I find it rather troubling that you place so much value in what others think of you. The confidence and self love has to come from within, not from society's approval.

 

There are a lot of married women who are not very "respectable". Would you say that a woman who cheated on her husband is respectable? I'm willing to bet that you would not, you seem to have a very traditional mindset. This is your choice of course, but please remember that traditional attitudes rob women of power.

 

I'm living with my fiance and we love to have sex, so I guess that makes me a slut. Who knew? Me and the other millions of women that cohabit before marriage are all dirty whores!

 

I had a similar reaction when I first read that post. But the more I thought about it, the more I realized that I sort of feel the same way.

 

It's not that I think pre-marital sex is wrong. I absolutely don't, I'm actually quite a fan But when it comes to loving a man, fully committing to a man and having a children, I want marriage. I would not feel happy having a child out of wedlock, I don't want to be someone's baby's mom. I want, and feel like I deserve the title of wife.

[Woggle]

Though I am happily married I feel that marriage for the most part is a losing bet for a man. Many women are only commited until the wedding and then their commitment level goes down until they give the I love you but I am not in love with you speech. It seems that many women are more interested in having a magical wedding instead of actually building a life as a couple.

[BlackLovely]

I had a similar reaction when I first read that post. But the more I thought about it, the more I realized that I sort of feel the same way.

 

It's not that I think pre-marital sex is wrong. I absolutely don't, I'm actually quite a fan But when it comes to loving a man, fully committing to a man and having a children, I want marriage. I would not feel happy having a child out of wedlock, I don't want to be someone's baby's mom. I want, and feel like I deserve the title of wife.

 

Me too. I wouldn't have a baby unless I was married, but not because of society disapproving.

 

I just don't think that sex before marriage makes a woman a slut.

[allina]

Though I am happily married I feel that marriage for the most part is a losing bet for a man. Many women are only commited until the wedding and then their commitment level goes down until they give the I love you but I am not in love with you speech. It seems that many women are more interested in having a magical wedding instead of actually building a life as a couple.

 

What irritates me about this point of view is that you act as if these marriages don't work out at random. Like marriage is some lottery, completely out of our control. It absolutely isn't. I think there are clear predictors of a sh*tty marriage. Even among acquaintances it is evident to me who deeply loves each other and really bonds and has fun together and who is just miserable going through the motions of a relationship.

[Woggle]

What irritates me about this point of view is that you act as if these marriages don't work out at random. Like marriage is some lottery, completely out of our control. It absolutely isn't. I think there are clear predictors of a sh*tty marriage. Even among acquaintances it is evident to me who deeply loves each other and really bonds and has fun together and who is just miserable going through the motions of a relationship.

 

I agree but it is hard to find a woman that actually wants to build a life instead of just having wedding fever.

[Mme. Chaucer]

Why do so many men post that marriage is a dangerous and unnecessary risk for men? Why is it more dangerous and risky for men than for women? In my case, I have more assets than my boyfriend does; I had more income than my ex husband did as well. Of course, the man is traditionally the "bread winner" but in my own circle of family and friends I have seen just as many woman with more to lose than the man in couples.

 

 

Agreed! I am totally against everything marriage stands for...yet my woman WANTS to get married so here I am. I am actually against everything marriage stands for though I love her-so I want to make her happy. However, yeah So I have a ring on my finger...If I see a woman (or man) I want to get with, I will hook up with him/her no 2nd thoughts so whats the point.

 

 

Is this free sex deal also going to make your woman happy? I hope she is on the same page as you are with that.

[Woggle]

It is more dangerous for men because women initiate 75% to 80% of divorces. The walkaway wife epidemic is very real. Men tend to be much more commited after the vows are exchanged.

 

Combine this with the fact that courts are biased in favor of women and you see why it is a much bigger risk for men.

[Mary3]

It is more dangerous for men because women initiate 75% to 80% of divorces. The walkaway wife epidemic is very real. Men tend to be much more commited after the vows are exchanged.

 

Combine this with the fact that courts are biased in favor of women and you see why it is a much bigger risk for men.

 

This is absolutely True ! Its because we CAN . We are able to provide for ourselves unlike in the 1960's when women stayed home and the husband provided for the family...

[Woggle]

This is absolutely True ! Its because we CAN . We are able to provide for ourselves unlike in the 1960's when women stayed home and the husband provided for the family...

 

You pretty much admitted that without money a man is pretty much seen as useless yet women get mad when men don't want to get involved with an independent woman for this very reason we are wrong. You are proving my point for me.

[Pyro]

You pretty much admitted that without money a man is pretty much seen as useless yet women get mad when men don't want to get involved with an independent woman for this very reason we are wrong. You are proving my point for me.

 

you are either a moron or just choose to ignore the valid points.

 

She means that women no longer have to stay in a bad marriage because she can't afford to make it on her own. Before the 1960s a man could pratically get away with whatever he wanted and the wife couldn't leave him because she stayed at home and had no money.

 

Women initiate divorce for many reasons: abuse of all kinds, infidelity, and a smaller portion of what you are scared of.

 

Men initiate divorce for the same reasons as well.

[Disillusioned]

All the single women I've asked about what they think of marriage, have pretty much said they want to party and be carefree until they're well into their old age, with no commitment at all (because it cramps their style).

 

As for the men, those I've asked who do want to get married, just want a woman who'll stop being a party girl and become their best friend... while the men I know who don't want to get married, just seem to want one sex buddy after another until they're well into their old age (they have a rep to protect).

 

Looks like there's going to be a lot of smug, lonely old people in this country in the next couple of decades...

[Tayla]

Disillusioned, your online name is befitting.

 

Where does this incessant desire to overgeneralize come from when you do the studies or information gathering? When speaking factually so very many factors come into play. Study statistics, polling,geographic area, and ratios then when you get your degree, seriously use it for objective relay. Currently I think most of your opinions are bias from the start and only serve to validate the outdated mindset that is unyielding to new information. Yes times change and then so does the data...

 

Pyro stated accurately in the interpretation.

[florence of suburbia]

Marriage is the best scenario for raising children.

 

If a woman doesn't want kids and can generate her own income I don't think it is necessary and she's probably better off without it.

[aerogurl87]

Disillusioned, your online name is befitting.

 

Where does this incessant desire to overgeneralize come from when you do the studies or information gathering? When speaking factually so very many factors come into play. Study statistics, polling,geographic area, and ratios then when you get your degree, seriously use it for objective relay. Currently I think most of your opinions are bias from the start and only serve to validate the outdated mindset that is unyielding to new information. Yes times change and then so does the data...

 

Pyro stated accurately in the interpretation.

 

I don't believe he was overgeneralizing, but stating what is common where he lives. There's nothing wrong with that, and I see the same thing where I live also. Lots of people I know don't want to get married now or ever. They just wanna party it up and go clubbing all weekend, till they can't do it anymore. It's a sad, sad sight but lots of people today (young people I know at least) have a big fear of commitment.

[Disillusioned]

I don't believe he was overgeneralizing, but stating what is common where he lives. There's nothing wrong with that, and I see the same thing where I live also. Lots of people I know don't want to get married now or ever. They just wanna party it up and go clubbing all weekend, till they can't do it anymore. It's a sad, sad sight but lots of people today (young people I know at least) have a big fear of commitment.

 

Consider also how SoCal kids from the '80s onward were brought up; taught by their parents never to accept failure or second best, and to keep up with the Joneses at any cost. They want to stay single because they've been taught to be the king or queen of their own little kingdom. It was nothing like growing up in the '70s... if I'd been raised like the '80s kids were, I'd have thought I'd died and gone to heaven! Parents used to beat kids up for wanting the sort of nice treatment that kids get now. Child abuse was not considered wrong until '78 or so.

 

Heh, I doubt anyone born since 1980 would last long in the Depression of the '30s.

[Mary3]

You pretty much admitted that without money a man is pretty much seen as useless yet women get mad when men don't want to get involved with an independent woman for this very reason we are wrong. You are proving my point for me.

 

So should women stay with hateful mysoginist men ?

 

I know NO men that won't get involved with a independant women....well maybe except you....

[Tayla]

Staying in a marriage verses this topic of *getting* married are two entirely different issues (topics).

 

Simply put , a lady will jump into a vast sea of water without asking what the depth is, a guy will most often not only ask how deep is it, but where is the life preserver if he cant swim. One is a whimsical attitude the other is a planner.

Both have their positive charm yet each mindset is on opposite ends of the rational spectrum.

 

I personally have more ease in grasping the contractual side, and its not very man friendly should it dissolve....SO I get it when a guy doesnt want to go there...there is little incentive to go into a deal that should it fall thru, he gets the burdens....(editors notes: just my two cents version)

[Woggle]

So should women stay with hateful mysoginist men ?

 

I know NO men that won't get involved with a independant women....well maybe except you....

 

Independent women claim all the men that men are intimidated by then and the attitude you expressed is why. You claim there is no good reason for a woman to be married to a man if she makes her own money so why shouldn't a man be weary of marrying a woman that can support herself.

[Mary3]

Independent women claim all the men that men are intimidated by then and the attitude you expressed is why. You claim there is no good reason for a woman to be married to a man if she makes her own money so why shouldn't a man be weary of marrying a woman that can support herself.

 

At this present time I have no desire to get married to anyone.

 

If you want 5 wives tomorrow or want NO wife next month that is your choice.

 

My choice is to stay free.

 

You have women out there that marry men just for money.

 

Better she marry him for great sex. ( it might last longer )

 

You have women that marry because they don't want to be alone .

 

Women that marry to get away from their parents.

 

Yes , she should marry him if she loves him but they need to wait a minimum of two years courtship lest their feelings have gone away from eachother.

 

You do what you want. Millions of women will do what they want.

 

You can't fight for 1962 Woggle...Its gone...

[aerogurl87]

Yes , she should marry him if she loves him but they need to wait a minimum of two years courtship lest their feelings have gone away from eachother.

 

2 years?!?!? Sheesh! Ok, wait a sec cause I can't agree with this. As I said before, I believe it depends on the situation of the couple. This is like saying one size fits all. For some people 2 years is perfect, for others not so much. If a couple have lived together previous to being married, and they've lived together for 6 months let's say, I don't find it unreasonable for them to get engaged or married after one year of dating. It makes sense, cause more than likely they know each other pretty well.