Who should be apologizing?!

[Teffy79]

The trip is a destination wedding of some mutual friends. We've both sunk a lot of money into tickets, clothes, accommodations, gifts. So has the happy couple. They paid for many things for us in advance. I guess we could split the cost of everything and pay my friends back. And I could pay him back and go on my own. They were my friends first, after all. Also, I need to get away.

[Woman In Blue]

But now that he's had time to think, he's mad. I apologized and explained why I feel the way I do. (his anger and past lying) He's now saying that he wishes I'd just left. He's unsure if i'm going to "put him through this again." I feel bad because I believe him (is that dumb?) and think I may have falsely accused him.

Wow - this guy is quite the master manipulator. He's actually got YOU apologizing to HIM.

 

Unreal.

 

You've been given numerous insights into this guy's inability to be honest and devoted to only you. I honestly consider this as being given the gift of "sight." Someone up there was looking out for you and GAVE you the gift of sight so you could make a decision based on what you know - not what you DON'T know. And that's a gift, Teffy. You may not see it as such right now, but one day you will.

 

I'm sorry things had to take such a wrong turn for you but I still say someone was looking out for you - better to find out now instead of years down the road. Good luck to you.

[Green]

The trip is a destination wedding of some mutual friends. We've both sunk a lot of money into tickets, clothes, accommodations, gifts. So has the happy couple. They paid for many things for us in advance. I guess we could split the cost of everything and pay my friends back. And I could pay him back and go on my own. They were my friends first, after all. Also, I need to get away.

 

The trip sounds like a nightmare I would figure some way out of it, like telling him its over and going by yourself... or just letting him go by his self. Get away from this guy, and end it already.

[Teffy79]

Wow - this guy is quite the master manipulator. He's actually got YOU apologizing to HIM.

 

Unreal.

 

You've been given numerous insights into this guy's inability to be honest and devoted to only you. I honestly consider this as being given the gift of "sight." Someone up there was looking out for you and GAVE you the gift of sight so you could make a decision based on what you know - not what you DON'T know. And that's a gift, Teffy. You may not see it as such right now, but one day you will.

 

I'm sorry things had to take such a wrong turn for you but I still say someone was looking out for you - better to find out now instead of years down the road. Good luck to you.

 

I've made up my mind and am finished. I finally talked to him about everything last night, and he let me know that he never thought he was wrong nor was he ever sorry for lying to me several months ago about hiding his "friendship" with his coworker. That's all I needed to hear to decide I was done once and for all. He still insists that he didn't lie to me in this current situation. But what does it matter? I feel like I should be really outraged, but instead I'm just sad.

[donnamaybe]

Do go on the trip - but alone. It will do you good.

 

And I'm proud of you for making that difficult decision to end things. It will save years of your life.

[Green]

I've made up my mind and am finished. I finally talked to him about everything last night, and he let me know that he never thought he was wrong nor was he ever sorry for lying to me several months ago about hiding his "friendship" with his coworker. That's all I needed to hear to decide I was done once and for all. He still insists that he didn't lie to me in this current situation. But what does it matter? I feel like I should be really outraged, but instead I'm just sad.

 

I wouldn NOT give him a second chance... even if he comes back saying "I WAS WRONG" ... .DO NOT GIVE HIM A SECOND CHANCE NO MATTER WHAT

[SoConfusledandHurt]

I second that : DONT GIVE HIM A SECOND CHANCE!!!!

 

He is a manipulator, dont let him be a "mastermanipulator".

 

Trust me Telly, there are men out there who will show you much more respect than that! You deserve much better!

[Reality Drip]

What is there to feel bad about really? He is clearly not being completely forthright with you.

 

There ARE men out there that don't pull these shenanigans. Few, but they exist. The sad thing is you already know he has this tendency yet you're sticking it out.

 

Make an investment in your future happiness by leaving this guy behind for now. Maybe he'll change, maybe he won't. But in the meantime, you don't need him towing you along this roller coaster while he figures out if he wants to flirt around and put himself in compromising situations or be with you.

 

-Max

[Teffy79]

He is definitely looking for a second chance.

 

But I can't go forward with him knowing how much he's lied to me. He's maintained his innocence through the end, saying that he'd tell me anything he's hiding in order to save the relationship, but that there's nothing more to tell. He's "so sorry" for lying, and he's "begging." He said he'd even copy me on an email he sends to this girl ending their relationship because "our relationship means so much more than her and her friendship" and it's not worth lying about ... anymore.

 

We're still talking about splitting our stuff. And he's calling and texting to ask "why" and say "please don't do this." I just want to maintain the strength I'm feeling right now about the situation.

[Green]

He is definitely looking for a second chance.

 

Don't give it to him

 

But I can't go forward with him knowing how much he's lied to me.

 

Even with out the lies he has done enough to lose you forever

 

He's maintained his innocence through the end, saying that he'd tell me anything he's hiding in order to save the relationship, but that there's nothing more to tell. He's "so sorry" for lying, and he's "begging."

 

Is he innocent of making you feel less like yourself and making you cry so much? Its funny that he is like I'm innocent... and oh yeah "so sorry" for lying.

 

He said he'd even copy me on an email he sends to this girl ending their relationship because "our relationship means so much more than her and her friendship" and it's not worth lying about ... anymore.

 

The fact that he even suggests doing this should tell you a lot about the guy and why you should never be with him again.

 

We're still talking about splitting our stuff. And he's calling and texting to ask "why" and say "please don't do this." I just want to maintain the strength I'm feeling right now about the situation.

 

He knows why, and yes you need to do this.

[donnamaybe]

Don't let him get to you, hon. It's more than just whether he lied or not. It was his whole demeanor toward you. You deserve better. Don't let him make you feel sorry for him. That's just pathetic. He needs to find some gal who is willing take his crap, and trust me - she's out there.

[Teffy79]

It's true; I know someone else will take his crap. And I'm sure now that person is NOT me. I think he senses that.

 

Guess that's why he copied me on an email to "the girl" today, saying that his relationship with her has shattered the relationship with me and that I'm the most important thing to him, and he's committed to me, so he wants absolutely nothing to do with her anymore.

 

He's still trying.

[donnamaybe]

It's true; I know someone else will take his crap. And I'm sure now that person is NOT me. I think he senses that.

 

Guess that's why he copied me on an email to "the girl" today, saying that his relationship with her has shattered the relationship with me and that I'm the most important thing to him, and he's committed to me, so he wants absolutely nothing to do with her anymore.

 

He's still trying.

 

I'd block his e-mail and phone as soon as the split is complete. Now that you've finally decided to stop taking his crap, he copies you about "the girl" on e-mail.

 

I hope this whole episode is over for you soon so you can begin to enjoy the free feeling that is sure to come.

[stace79]

Bottom line? He does not sound like a guy who is taking good care of you now, and you're in therapy before you've even gotten married? Not good signs.

 

You deserve someone who does not play these types of games. Someone you feel confident and can say 100% loves you and wouldn't cheat on you. Someone who works to help you through issues, not create more issues!

 

I think you should break this off.

[CrayonAngel]

BIG HUGS TEFFY!!!! I feel for you and I read this post front to back. He is manipulating you, gaslighting you and LYING! It probably hurts like hell right now but in a few years you will look back and thank GOD you weren't a doormat and didn't follow through with a future filled with pain. You don't have to divorce, you don't have to worry about custody. You are going to be alright, you will find a man who is worth it, a man who would move mountains to make you smile. You will be happy. Good luck!

[Teffy79]

THANKS! I really need to hear that. It's been so hard to stick to my guns, but I have been! No matter the abuse I've taken. He's come to me in every way possible. Calling my decision ridiculous. Yelling at me. Using the sympathy angle. Being calm and loving and pleading with me. Telling me he flushed this other "friendship" down the drain for me for nothing, because I still don't want to be with him. Telling me he'll give me anything I want and then getting angry that he put himself in that position only for me to tell him no.

 

I've been confused, but it feels like the decision to get back with him would be worse than the decision to leave. That's how I know I can't waiver.

 

It's extremely hard after being with him for four years. Feels like such a waste.

[stace79]

THANKS! I really need to hear that. It's been so hard to stick to my guns, but I have been! No matter the abuse I've taken. He's come to me in every way possible. Calling my decision ridiculous. Yelling at me. Using the sympathy angle. Being calm and loving and pleading with me. Telling me he flushed this other "friendship" down the drain for me for nothing, because I still don't want to be with him. Telling me he'll give me anything I want and then getting angry that he put himself in that position only for me to tell him no.

 

I've been confused, but it feels like the decision to get back with him would be worse than the decision to leave. That's how I know I can't waiver.

 

It's extremely hard after being with him for four years. Feels like such a waste.

 

Honestly, if he wanted a chance to be with you again, the grown-up thing to do is to leave you alone and understand that you made your decision. If he really wanted to show you he could be different, he wouldn't be having a tantrum like a big fat baby.

 

Yes, it is very hard, but you have to take care of yourself. After reading more of your thread, it's clear he was emotionally abusive. My family always tells me that any problem you have with someone prior to marriage will only get harder, never easier.

 

Be strong for yourself!

[Ilovecake]

Gaslighting

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For other uses, see gaslight.

Gaslighting is a form of intimidation or psychological abuse in which false information is presented to the victim, making them doubt their own memory and perception.

 

The term derives from the 1938 stage play Gas Light (originally known as Angel Street in the United States), and the 1940 and 1944 film adaptions. The plot concerns a husband who attempts to drive his wife to insanity by manipulating small elements of their environment, and insisting that she is mistaken or misremembering when she points out these changes. The title stems from the husband's subtle dimming of the house's gas lights, which she accurately notices and which the husband insists she's imagining.

 

"Gaslighting" has been used colloquially, since at least the mid 1970s, to describe psychologically upsetting manipulations of the type depicted in the play and film. Lee Majors, playing the character of Steve Austin in the series The Six Million Dollar Man, uses the term early in the episode "The Seven Million Dollar Man" (which first aired in November, 1974) when he complains that his boss, physician, and a nurse are conspiring to convince him that something he's witnessed did not, in fact, transpire as he believes it did. In her 1980 book The Best Kept Secret: Sexual Abuse of Children[1] Florence Rush summarizes George Cukor's 1944 film version of Gas Light, and writes, "even today the word [gaslight] is used to describe an attempt to destroy another's perception of reality."

 

Examples

The classic example of gaslighting is to change things in a person's environment without their knowledge, and to explain that they "must be imagining things" when they challenge these changes.[2] Similarly, the Manson Family, during their "creepy crawler" burglaries of the late 1960s, would enter homes and steal nothing, but would rearrange furniture to upset and confuse residents.[3]

 

According to psychologists Gass and Nichols,[4] another relatively frequent form of gaslighting occurs when a husband has cheated on a wife. The husband may strenuously deny the affair and insist "I'm not lying; you're just imagining things." Further "male therapists may contribute to the women's distress through mislabeling the women's reactions. [...] The gaslighting behaviors of the husband provide a recipe for the so-called 'nervous breakdown' for some women [and] suicide in some of the worst situations."

 

Psychologist Martha Stout[5] explains how sociopaths frequently use gaslighting tactics. Sociopaths are often cruel, manipulative, or conniving, and are often convincing liars who consistently deny wrongdoing. When coupled with the personal charm that can characterize sociopaths, many who have been victimized by sociopaths may doubt their perception.

 

Jacobson and Gottman[6] report that some physically abusive husbands may gaslight their wives, even flatly denying that they have used violence.

[ADF]

Your husband is lying to you. He is a cheater, period. He will cheat on you throughout the entire course of your marriage. I'd bet my life on it. Also, I am sure he's cheated on you many times already. Keep in mind, the incidents you described are just the ones you know about. I bet he's been up to a lot more stuff you don't know about.