A Fork In The Road

[califnan]

I have noticed that a few are hesitant to stay with their marriages, even with a willing BS, because they feel that the marriage wasn't started for the right reasons.

 

Another has shown a determination to make the marriage work, after the affair - even though it was felt the marriage may not have been good even before the affair..

 

Another has felt that being with a MM after a relationship - is still meeting her needs, more.

 

It would seem that these different perspectives do have the common denominater of: Hope .. And each choose how they would wish to live their lives in hope for a better future..

 

I have my own ideas of the best route.. Any others?

[You Go Girl]

All hope is good, if it makes logical sense.

What I see too often is desperation shielded in denial.

[ComputerJock]

I think that no matter what our personal views are, we are not the people we are advising. It may be very easy for me to tell someone I think they need to cut their losses and head for divorce, but I am not the one who will have to go to the lawyers, file documents, tell my family, pack up my household, on and on and on...

I could tell someone all day what to do, but at the end of the day, it's them that has to make the choice that's right for THEM.

 

I've read threads where I think no way what they are doing is gonna work. But I respect them and applaud them for trying, and wish them the best.

 

There is an old saying "Walk a mile in another man's shoes." I think it applies here. We will never know what anyone else is thinking inside or what their reactions to the situation will be. Reacting to situations is base on a lifetime of experience. Each will react differently and each will have to make their on decisions because they will have to live the rest of their lives with the decision they make.

 

All that can be done here is to give advice based on our own experiences, not be judgemental, and to tell it the way we see it. And as you have said give them HOPE!!!

[califnan]

If there is a willing spouse after a betrayal, I have a hard time in letting the marriage go.

[Samantha0905]

If there is a willing spouse after a betrayal, I have a hard time in letting the marriage go.

 

But shouldn't both be willing and for the right reasons? Or is it just a matter of sticking with it and hoping you made the right choice as life goes on?

[califnan]

Hang in there.. I'm trying to bring in a few guest speakers who have had success at marriage re-building ..

[califnan]

I think they may be enjoying their Sunday.

Meanwhile, califnan, may I ask a related question?

You and I posted heavily on a BS's thread a couple months ago. I won't mention her name, because Im not sure that's allowed.

Did you agree with her moving away from her WS?

 

-------------------

 

I had to think a minute.. Yes absolutely J .. I considered that abuse, and she was pregnant - He was into the affair (not repentant) and while shutting her out.. he had started to threaten her regarding keeping the children, should she leave .. With being 8 mos. pregnant and having small children - I felt time was of the essence .. And I couldn't get her out of Calif fast enough .. and with also the concern that he could keep her here in order to even see her children, should there be a divorce.. - w instate visitation and all that..

 

Right now I'm talking about spouses who have left the affair and the BS is willing to try to make it work .. I know it's the more difficult route rather than the world of "fresh starts/new beginnings" etc .. But I know there are LS members out there whom I think could be helpful in this discussion because they have made it work after an affair.

[crazycatlady]

Hope.....

 

 

We do a great many things on hope.....but for me personally, I did not stay because of hope.

 

I am not hopeful this will work, and he won't do it again behind my back hidden away and then lie to me about it. I know he won't do it again. I know the feelings we have for each other is strong, the feelings were always strong, they never waivered, he just was selfish for a while, and stupid, and scared, and a great many other things but he always loved me and never planned on leaving.

 

Now 7 or so years ago....I was hopeful. We were struggling, I was hopeful that the love we both allowed to burn down to embers could be stoked back into a good flame. Then his almost ONS was a wakeup call to the state of our marriage. Changing the marriage around then was difficult but worth it.

 

I was very hurt, and still am hurt by what happened but staying wasn't a hard decision. I would have let him go, if that was where he wanted to be. I was not going to force him to stay, or beg, or even ask. He had to tell me he wanted to stay and that he wanted me. I did not threatened, afterwards I told him I had been researching apartment prices trying to figure out what I could afford to get. I was close to leaving by the time he confessed.

 

The lies were getting to me more then anything else. And due to the type of relationship we have, an open marriage and our talking about poly relationships, the fact that he hadn't come clean during that really hurt me. And made me wonder if he didn't love me and just didn't know how to tell me. I wasn't staying without love. He was very scared when he realized how close to leaving I had been. I think it was the nail that drove him to him that I can take a great many things, but lying to me about it, never good.

 

Obviously the fact that we are still together, he loves me. That's what I needed. I hoped 7 years ago.....this time, I know.

 

CCL

[califnan]

Thank you for your story CCL. I think there is a lot to be said for the perseverance of staying in a marriage and the reward at the end ..

[jnj express]

Let me ask you this----Do you think there is ever a "clean" R.---By that I mean the BS is always looking over his/her shoulder----always worrying when her/his partner is out on their own running errands----social life with others the B, is always wary, about what partner is doing.

 

The WS--much of the time is walking on eggshells

 

I know that things eventually do settle in---but it never is the same---the carefree days are totally gone, and will never comeback.

 

Real question becomes how do you wanna live the rest of your life. The one poster who is here now---is a good example---20 years later---the memories won't go away, and he lives in torment.

 

A better question might be---In HONESTY--what has the mge been like after the R.

[crazycatlady]

Let me ask you this----Do you think there is ever a "clean" R.---By that I mean the BS is always looking over his/her shoulder----always worrying when her/his partner is out on their own running errands----social life with others the B, is always wary, about what partner is doing.

 

The WS--much of the time is walking on eggshells

 

I know that things eventually do settle in---but it never is the same---the carefree days are totally gone, and will never comeback.

 

Real question becomes how do you wanna live the rest of your life. The one poster who is here now---is a good example---20 years later---the memories won't go away, and he lives in torment.

 

A better question might be---In HONESTY--what has the mge been like after the R.

 

If this is really the case for the marriage, then I don't think it should be recovered. Its not fair to either partner.

 

I don't think that is the truth for every recovered marriage though.

 

Its to expect the occassional blip back but for the most part it should be not a part of every day life.

 

I feel if before someone decides to recover their marriage with the spouse (and both partners need to be on the same page) they need to be honest if they can let it go in the end. Some people can't let things go such as the poster you mentioned. That's not a marriage that's a point of torture for both parties. If you know you are the type who can't let go, don't try.

 

I don't believe in saving a marriage if at all possible. I don't believe in just giving it up either. But both parties need to be honest about where they are at and what they can put up with and what will send them over the edge.

 

CCL

[reboot]

Let me ask you this----Do you think there is ever a "clean" R.---By that I mean the BS is always looking over his/her shoulder----always worrying when her/his partner is out on their own running errands----social life with others the B, is always wary, about what partner is doing.

 

The WS--much of the time is walking on eggshells

 

I know that things eventually do settle in---but it never is the same---the carefree days are totally gone, and will never comeback.

 

Real question becomes how do you wanna live the rest of your life. The one poster who is here now---is a good example---20 years later---the memories won't go away, and he lives in torment.

 

A better question might be---In HONESTY--what has the mge been like after the R.

 

Every one of us is different. The memories HAVE almost gone away. And when they surface, they barely cause me any pain now. My WS no longer walks on eggshells. No, things might never be "the same", but is that truly a bad thing? The way things were prior to the A weren't very good, why go back to that?

[seren]

I have been married 3 times, my first when I was way too young lasted 9 months, I left when I realised that I couldn't commit to being the person my then H needed and wanted me to be. We are still friends. My second marriage lasted 5 years, I left because we had totally different view regarding child rearing, I am a laid back person, 2nd H a disciplinarian. he is not so nice and we don't speak. My relationship to my H is now 23 years strong, he is a lovely, beautiful person, he also had an A that lasted 8 months, we are 2 and a half years past D Day. I don't stay because I hope it will work, I stay because I want it to, if it doesn't, I will leave, but not before we have explored every which way to see if we can fix any problems. I stay because I love my H, absolutely and totally. I have never, ever looked over my shoulder and thought he might do it again, I trust him. from the moment D day occurred I trusted him not to cheat again. I don't live with fear, I don't check his phone, emails anything. This was and has never been my way.

 

I am realistic enough to believe that if H was in love with OW or met another OW then he would leave, and it would be with my support. This because I believe this is just one life and has to be lived to it's fullest, for me that means living with the person I love, and if H was unhappy, then I would want him to be with someone who filled that need. If I met someone and thought for even a moment that, that person could make me happier than H, I would leave. I don't do sharing, I don't do A's.

 

On D day I just felt sorry for H, because he had compromised his values, I understand why our marriage was rocky, I understand why H was different for a while, I don't understand why he chose to fix his problems by the A. D Day and beyond has seen us set new boundaries, absolutes, expectations of each other. R is so not easy, especially in the early days, most BS look to place the blame on themselves - if only I had (insert whatever). The OW/OM often think people stay because of kids, dogs, money, houses (insert whatever), but really I think people are inherently self serving and stay for themselves, yes I know the kids argument, but there are plenty of people who D and still make it work with kids.

If on D Day H had said that he loved OW then we would be on a different road in a different country by now. If on D Day I even for one moment contemplated throwing H out, then I would not be here - it just didn't come into it.

 

Not sure if I have answered the question posed, but JMO and experience of decisions after an A.

[seibert253]

If there is a willing spouse after a betrayal, I have a hard time in letting the marriage go.

 

I did too.

 

I've never been one to take the easy road. I knew that R would be emotionally more difficult than D, but the words "for better or worse" actually ment something to me.

 

Now, if she didn't also want to work to fix this, and wasn't 100% remorseful and committed to our M, then the road to D was the only conclusion in my mind.

 

I didn't want to give up, and thankfully she didn't either.

 

Some are not as blessed as I was.

[califnan]

Let me ask you this----Do you think there is ever a "clean" R.---By that I mean the BS is always looking over his/her shoulder----always worrying when her/his partner is out on their own running errands----social life with others the B, is always wary, about what partner is doing.

 

The WS--much of the time is walking on eggshells

 

I know that things eventually do settle in---but it never is the same---the carefree days are totally gone, and will never comeback.

 

Real question becomes how do you wanna live the rest of your life. The one poster who is here now---is a good example---20 years later---the memories won't go away, and he lives in torment.

 

A better question might be---In HONESTY--what has the mge been like after the R.

 

---------------------

 

Speaking of a "clean" relationship.. Is there any such thing.. I could get married tomorrow, and not feel certain that he would not stray .. I don't know if there is such a thing as a clean relationship.. I was naive enough to think that my husband would not have strayed.. I don't know that a brand new relationship has more guarantees that the old model..

[califnan]

I did too.

 

I've never been one to take the easy road. I knew that R would be emotionally more difficult than D, but the words "for better or worse" actually ment something to me.

 

Now, if she didn't also want to work to fix this, and wasn't 100% remorseful and committed to our M, then the road to D was the only conclusion in my mind.

 

I didn't want to give up, and thankfully she didn't either.

 

Some are not as blessed as I was.

 

---------------------

 

Thanks Seibert, you are Both blessed.

[califnan]

Thank you for your encouraging testimony Seren ..

[crazycatlady]

I have been married 3 times, my first when I was way too young lasted 9 months, I left when I realised that I couldn't commit to being the person my then H needed and wanted me to be. We are still friends. My second marriage lasted 5 years, I left because we had totally different view regarding child rearing, I am a laid back person, 2nd H a disciplinarian. he is not so nice and we don't speak. My relationship to my H is now 23 years strong, he is a lovely, beautiful person, he also had an A that lasted 8 months, we are 2 and a half years past D Day. I don't stay because I hope it will work, I stay because I want it to, if it doesn't, I will leave, but not before we have explored every which way to see if we can fix any problems. I stay because I love my H, absolutely and totally. I have never, ever looked over my shoulder and thought he might do it again, I trust him. from the moment D day occurred I trusted him not to cheat again. I don't live with fear, I don't check his phone, emails anything. This was and has never been my way.

 

I am realistic enough to believe that if H was in love with OW or met another OW then he would leave, and it would be with my support. This because I believe this is just one life and has to be lived to it's fullest, for me that means living with the person I love, and if H was unhappy, then I would want him to be with someone who filled that need. If I met someone and thought for even a moment that, that person could make me happier than H, I would leave. I don't do sharing, I don't do A's.

 

On D day I just felt sorry for H, because he had compromised his values, I understand why our marriage was rocky, I understand why H was different for a while, I don't understand why he chose to fix his problems by the A. D Day and beyond has seen us set new boundaries, absolutes, expectations of each other. R is so not easy, especially in the early days, most BS look to place the blame on themselves - if only I had (insert whatever). The OW/OM often think people stay because of kids, dogs, money, houses (insert whatever), but really I think people are inherently self serving and stay for themselves, yes I know the kids argument, but there are plenty of people who D and still make it work with kids.

If on D Day H had said that he loved OW then we would be on a different road in a different country by now. If on D Day I even for one moment contemplated throwing H out, then I would not be here - it just didn't come into it.

 

Not sure if I have answered the question posed, but JMO and experience of decisions after an A.

 

Seren - Your words really speak to me. Some things I found to be extremely profound and I think every person looking to figure out what to do should read them. I've bolded the ones that really stand out to me.

 

Thankyou.

 

CCL

[silktricks]

the BS is always looking over his/her shoulder----always worrying when her/his partner is out on their own running errands----social life with others the B, is always wary, about what partner is doing.

 

The WS--much of the time is walking on eggshells

 

I know that things eventually do settle in---but it never is the same---the carefree days are totally gone, and will never comeback.

 

A better question might be---In HONESTY--what has the mge been like after the R.

 

Our marriage is recovered - fully - I do not worry at all when my H is out running errands or going on trips when I cannot accompany.

 

He does not walk on eggshells.

 

The happy carefree days do not need to be gone, the problems just must be worked through.

 

IMO many people are too enamored of the easy "fix" to really work out problems. In some cases this leads to affairs, in others divorce. But where truly is love, at the most basic level, with good communication, a lot of endurance, and a ton of compassion (on both sides) a marriage can be not only fully recovered but actully improved post trauma.

[califnan]

Thank you Silktricks ..

[jnj express]

I agree that mge.,'s can rise out of the dust, and be excellent vehicles into the golden years----But------how much latitude do you give your Xwandering partner, and if anything does seem out of the ordinary, or your gut tells you something is not right --how do you deal with it.

 

I guess what I am getting at is----You put boundaries in, during the recovery period into the R.----How long do those boundaries stay in place????

[seren]

I agree that mge.,'s can rise out of the dust, and be excellent vehicles into the golden years----But------how much latitude do you give your Xwandering partner, and if anything does seem out of the ordinary, or your gut tells you something is not right --how do you deal with it.

 

I guess what I am getting at is----You put boundaries in, during the recovery period into the R.----How long do those boundaries stay in place????

 

 

I don't give H latitude, it really is not my place to put restrictions on what he does, I don't own H. However, the boundaries set are an affirmation of what is acceptable in our marriage for me. They are my absolutes, first off, no lies, ever. If H wanted to be with someone, honesty before an A takes place. To not, ever take each other for granted, to never doing behind my back what he wouldn't be comfortable doing in front of my face.

I don't and have never set times for when he has to come home, I have never wondered if he was with someone else, if I had to be constantly looking over my shoulder I just wouldn't be married.

 

As stated, I understand the problems that led up to us taking our marriage for granted, I don't understand fixing them with an A. Now I am sure that some people have an A for love, it just wasn't the case for H, if it was, he wouldn't be here. The problem lay with H and his conflict avoidance behaviour and his lack of self esteem. We have discussed this and he has changed, he is beginning to step up and admit his faults (not the A) and I have stepped back and not enabled that behaviour ( I am a doer, a fixer and a face up to stuff type). My boundaries have never changed, I have just reinforced what works for me with H and he has reinforced what works for him.

We truly are in a fab place in our marriage and long may it continue.

 

I liked the fork in the road analogy. During the gaslighting stage, I used to try to get H to talk about what was going on, I didn't have a clue about his A. I used to say it was like we had both been travelling down the same road, toward a shared destination. On the journey there were roadworks with different filter lanes for getting passed the problem, normally we would take the same one - during the A, H went one way and I the other, still both chugging along, but H on one path and me the other. D day saw him and I meeting up on the same road again and deciding the journey ahead was better if we both shared the driving.