What next

[Steadfast]

 

...some of us, and this might be a gender issue, as it seems to run mostly with the men, need all of the details and questions answered before they are able to move the rebuilt relationship forward.

 

...those who need the details want to know exactly what we are forgiving them for.

 

....most WW think that the details will only deepen his hurt, and make make matters worse, so they hold back most of the details, but eventually with time, as he continues to question more and more details come to light, and each new revelation takes him back to d-day. What he needs is the whole story now, so he can digest it and begin the healing process.

 

 

2.50, you've put into words the exact feelings I've been struggling with for the past three years. For me, personally, this is most profound. It is more than that; it's nothing short of an epiphany. Thank you so much. Really.

 

W_N, not all of my advice has been in error but I do apologize for not recognizing this need. Mine wasn't met but here's hoping yours will be.

 

Speaking again personally, I can now say that it wasn't my ex-wife's cheating or lying that drove me away, it was her secrecy. Yes, I say drove me away because now she's saying that she misses me. Misses us. The part that only 'him' and 'her' know about has killed my love and dimmed my attraction. What was said and shared between them are things I deserved to know. See, even if the cheater dumps the other person and never talks to them again, the affair remains alive; if only in the mind of the betrayed. In that sense, it's unforgivable, because we cannot forgive what we don't know about. So tell me; tell me you loved him more than me, tell me goodbye, but have the decency and respect to let me know what happened.

 

It still angers me that there's some guy out there, carrying the other half of the secret that destroyed my marriage. He knows, she knows, but I -her husband of nearly 20 years and the father of her children- doesn't. That's the ultimate betrayal, I believe. That's the gift that keeps on giving.

 

At least I've pinpointed the source of my anger. All of the times I've logged in here have now been justified, for I found what I was searching for.

 

Keep us posted W_N. I'm in your corner too-

[HopelessinDTW]

2.50, you've put into words the exact feelings I've been struggling with for the past three years. For me, personally, this is most profound. It is more than that; it's nothing short of an epiphany. Thank you so much. Really.

 

W_N, not all of my advice has been in error but I do apologize for not recognizing this need. Mine wasn't met but here's hoping yours will be.

 

Speaking again personally, I can now say that it wasn't my ex-wife's cheating or lying that drove me away, it was her secrecy. Yes, I say drove me away because now she's saying that she misses me. Misses us. The part that only 'him' and 'her' know about has killed my love and dimmed my attraction. What was said and shared between them are things I deserved to know. See, even if the cheater dumps the other person and never talks to them again, the affair remains alive; if only in the mind of the betrayed. In that sense, it's unforgivable, because we cannot forgive what we don't know about. So tell me; tell me you loved him more than me, tell me goodbye, but have the decency and respect to let me know what happened.

 

It still angers me that there's some guy out there, carrying the other half of the secret that destroyed my marriage. He knows, she knows, but I -her husband of nearly 20 years and the father of her children- doesn't. That's the ultimate betrayal, I believe. That's the gift that keeps on giving.

 

At least I've pinpointed the source of my anger. All of the times I've logged in here have now been justified, for I found what I was searching for.

 

Keep us posted W_N. I'm in your corner too-

I retract what I said yesterday W_N. I think for you this information is necassary to move on & forgive. In my case, I knew what lead to the emotional affair, and what happened right before the physical. I was standing outside the hotel room door when they were having sex for the first time, and heard everything...and yes that day will be forever in my head. I feel fortunate to know pretty much the whole story that lead to my situation, so I guess the nitty gritty details are not as important. Plus I am not in recon mode, and don't want it. I know many divorced men/women don't know as much as I do now, adn I can see how not knowing what happened can be so tough. But, sometimes I wish I didn't know so much, and it does hurt to know as much as I do because it's another thing I need to overcome.

[What_Next]

Last night I called her and laid it all out. She said right from the beginning of the conversation that if I reached out to her AP that she would walk away. I still think that was a VERY dangerous thing for her to say. I understand it though she says she has left that behind her. She said it is in her past and she wants to leave it there. Fine enough.

 

I let her know in no uncerstain terms what she must do if there is any chance at all in the long term. She listened to it all and said she not only understands but she will do whatever she needs to.

 

We spent last night together and it was very emotional for me again, a common occurance lately. She did just about everything right that she could.

 

I am trying to take things one day at a time, that's all I can offer.

 

Goingstrong, you are VERY wrong, and FanFan is right. There is no way I'd do this just to hurt her or purge her. I will openly admit and have told her so as well that I do have thoughts about cheating on her to show her how it feels, but that is unlikely. I was not hard wired to cheat.

 

Steadfast thanks for your post and I in no way thought you meant any harm, far from it. We all have different ways of processing something like this. Mine isn't perfect but it is what I feel I need.

 

I have no idea whether or not we will be together in the long run, there is as much chance of not being together as being together. All we can do is be honest, open and see where it leads.

[FanFan]

Last night I called her and laid it all out. She said right from the beginning of the conversation that if I reached out to her AP that she would walk away. I still think that was a VERY dangerous thing for her to say. I understand it though she says she has left that behind her. She said it is in her past and she wants to leave it there. Fine enough.

 

Why do you LET HER have the POWER over you? She should be on her knees thanking you for taking her cheating ass back. Why do you let her treat you like that? She should let you do anything (within legal limit and reasonableness) you want to heal in your own way!

 

Goingstrong, you are VERY wrong, and FanFan is right.

 

Stating the obvious!

[trippi1432]

Why do you LET HER have the POWER over you? She should be on her knees thanking you for taking her cheating ass back. Why do you let her treat you like that? She should let you do anything (within legal limit and reasonableness) you want to heal in your own way!

 

 

 

Stating the obvious!

 

There should NEVER EVER be a time in a relationship where one person holds that much power over another individual...regardless of what they have done. To wield that type of power due to guilting is beneath a person with morals..W_N..I know you know this already.....in addition, to wield that power gives the other party rights to martyr-hood...and justly so.

 

Just a lesson Fan Fan.

[goingstrong]

Goingstrong, you are VERY wrong, and FanFan is right. There is no way I'd do this just to hurt her or purge her. I will openly admit and have told her so as well that I do have thoughts about cheating on her to show her how it feels, but that is unlikely. I was not hard wired to cheat.

 

 

I said nothing about cheating or getting even. But what is not obvious is why would you take her back anyway? Just an outside point of view question.

[2.50 a gallon]

W-N

 

I forgot to add with my last post, I don't think it is a good idea to contact the OM.

 

First and foremost, do you really think that he is going to tell you the truth? Highly unlikely!

 

If it appears that you have this scum out of you life, leave him out of your life for good, just flick the flush handle.

 

Also, should someone a few years down the road take this scum aside and lay some whop butt on him, you won't be suspected.

[2.50 a gallon]

HinDTW

 

I know what you are going through, I got to listen as my XW got drunk and stripped for her OM and several associate OM's a couple of days after our break up. Devastating

 

She spent the next 3 - 4 years wondering why I did not want to reconcile.

DUH

[Steadfast]

In my opinion, full disclosure is asking a lot from a person with obvious emotional and moral issues. That's why successful recons are so very rare. It takes tremendous courage to come clean. We're talking about someone acting at their very worst here...in some cases, the low point of their life.

 

But that nonetheless, may be exactly what's needed.

 

In any case, she is clearly hiding something from you W_N; something that she is afraid might drive you away for good. My ex once said that she didn't want to talk about her affair because she was afraid of what I'd think of her if I knew the truth. This was confusing, because at the same time she was also telling me she didn't know if she wanted to be married anymore. It took me a long time to realize that she simply wanted what she wanted. Her cake, and the chance to eat it while keeping me available for things she might need in the future. These included money (or my ability to save her the same) advice, a shoulder to cry on, and ultimately a place to land if everything came apart/change of heart. When I could think straight, I decided for myself that wasn't a good option and divorced her. She's still upset about that, but I honestly do not know what else I could have done.

 

Well, with a shred of dignity left anyway.

 

I'm saying this might be less about power and more about fear and humiliation. She *is* however, using your love towards her as a lever to have certain things go her way. Common, but no doubt damaging to your chances of living a happy life together. You've got some decisions to make, and so does she. Ultimately, your love will be tested. Pass or fail?

[tank]

WN, I have been absent for a while, just read the entire post. Great work my friend. I will be in the Hammer around the first week of December if your still up for that drink!

 

I am happy to see that you and your wife are at least making the attempt to reconcile. I agree with your needing to all the information about the affair. Its a secret and for trust to be rebuilt that secret needs to told. I hope your wife has enough faith in you that she can tell you what you need to know. My question to you is, are you going to be able to hear what she has to say and really not let it cloud your desire to make this work? I certainly hope so, i also hope you are fully aware of the pain it will cause you to hear what she has to say.

 

This post has had many ups and downs, and i am happy for you that you have had the support of all these great people on this site. I see that it has helped you on your journey.

 

2.50, I read your post about the need to know and it floored me. It answered alot of questions about my own situation.

[What_Next]

WN, I have been absent for a while, just read the entire post. Great work my friend. I will be in the Hammer around the first week of December if your still up for that drink!

 

You bet, drop me a line and we'll sit and talk.

 

This post has had many ups and downs, and i am happy for you that you have had the support of all these great people on this site. I see that it has helped you on your journey.

 

You have no idea bud. It's been absolutely without a shadow of a doubt the worst period in my life. I am content now in many senses. I realize that I can continue without her if I need to. I will survive. I will find someone if I choose to let this go. I also realize that I have to soul search in order to really give my marriage a chance.

 

Day by day.

[What_Next]

Last night was a night that we both knew would come along sooner or later. It was parent teacher night at our childs school. As expected this has been effecting her in school in terms of her behavior. Nothing too bad but enough that her teachers noticed.

 

Now her behavior is not entirely due to the friction in our marriage but it is a large part of it. Of course we moved from the only place our daughter knew as home, she is turning into a young woman (she's almost 12) we almost were forced to give up her dog (the dog was not adjusting well) so to say the least the poor thing has been going through her own hell.

 

It does make me angry that my wife's selfish behavior is a large part of what our child is going through and I told her that. However, part of that responsibility lies with me as well since my behavior attributed to all of this mess.

 

The bottom line is that we set some ground rules that will help our child recover from this.

 

I'd like to post that I am confident our ability to reconcile successfully, but I cannot. I am not highly confident, but my wife is and she is doing everything in her power to help that along. I am doing my best as well.

 

Boy how this has changed everyone involed. It is simply amazing. A marriage is like a living breathing organism and when it doesn't get what it needs to survive it dies and that usually effects everyone around it. Most definitely true.

[tank]

"Boy how this has changed everyone involed. It is simply amazing. A marriage is like a living breathing organism and when it doesn't get what it needs to survive it dies and that usually effects everyone around it. Most definitely true."

 

WN, you are absolutly correct in the above statement.

 

I hope everything is still going well.

[What_Next]

Tank, things are going OK. I have to classify them as OK because things are up and down. Not that it is unexpected, but that's par for the course I guess.

 

I will say that I am greatful that I have my own place should I need it. Now I'll admit that I've not been spending much time there but should we need to take some time to ourselves it'll be much more comfortable to do so.

 

A lot of the insecurities etc that have driven my wife to do what she did still manifest themselves from time to time, but this time around we are able to communicate about them and deal with them right on the spot. No more hiding feeling and lettting them fester etc.

 

I still have little to no trust in her, but again that is not unexpected and that must be left to grow over time.

 

Our bond is still very strong and now that we are focusing on each other as opposed to the rest of the world we do have a shot at it.

 

Like it or not she still had an affair and I had my revenge affair (I am coming to terms with what it really was) and that will have to be dealt with, but that can mean a new dynamic.

 

She is confident we will be able to make it through this, I am not so much but I am trying to live in the here and now. I still have a foot planted in the past, but that will slowly change.

[debtman]

What_Next,

 

Just read through all of this. Good job on trying so hard to work things out. I know how difficult it is to make time for the relationship as well as work, kids, house, etc. Wish I could have done that with my stbx, but I didn't work hard enough on it when she was "there" and told me things weren't working and then she moved on with an EA before she told me that she wanted to split, and now we're racing down the divorce road.

 

If it were just the two of us, it wouldn't be bad. But we've got a 5 and 3 year old and it just kills me to lose out on time with them and suddenly have to face the fact that I've just lost half my time with them. On the plus side, the time I spend with them is ALL about them and I spend the rest of my time just on me, but it's changed our future as a family and, even though the marriage was far from perfect, I would have stayed in it for the kids.

 

It also really bothers me that she's already brought her new boyfriend into our house to have dinner with our kids several times while I'm living with my parents for now.

 

My advice to you is to keep working on it, keep trying to rebuild what was lost, or, better yet, create something new that works better, but, also realize that the most important thing is the kids and the best thing you can expose them to is a happy, healthy relationship.

[FanFan]

 

She is confident we will be able to make it through this, I am not so much but I am trying to live in the here and now. I still have a foot planted in the past, but that will slowly change.

 

How's your ex-girlfriend doing after the break up? Have you heard anything about her from mutual friends after the break up?

[What_Next]

How's your ex-girlfriend doing after the break up? Have you heard anything about her from mutual friends after the break up?

 

FanFan, I appreciate your posts, but you seem to have a 1 track mind

 

After the morning I ended it with the woman I had met (no I wouldn't call her a girlfriend) there was no contact, nothing. We have no "mutual" friends. She was from a different walk of life.

[FanFan]

 

After the morning I ended it with the woman I had met (no I wouldn't call her a girlfriend) there was no contact, nothing. We have no "mutual" friends. She was from a different walk of life.

 

Did she accept your apology when you broke up with her? Did she cry?

[What_Next]

FanFan, sorry but I fail to see what this direction adds to this thread? Why are you concerned about this aspect of my story?

 

Why should I have "apologized"?

[goingstrong]

Goingstrong, you are VERY wrong, and FanFan is right. There is no way I'd do this just to hurt her or purge her. I will openly admit and have told her so as well that I do have thoughts about cheating on her to show her how it feels, but that is unlikely. I was not hard wired to cheat.

 

 

Like it or not she still had an affair and I had my revenge affair (I am coming to terms with what it really was) and that will have to be dealt with, but that can mean a new dynamic

 

Bummer being right all the time. Do you see where fanfan is going now?

[What_Next]

Goingstrong, no I don't understand where he is going. Why he is focusing on me "apologizing" to the person I was dating and how she took the break up etc? Not sure.

 

Do I realize now that what I did was wrong? Yes I do, but it was a survival tactic of sorts.

[goingstrong]

G Why he is focusing on me "apologizing" to the person I was dating and how she took the break up etc? Not sure.

 

I guess the hump and dump is what is called collateral damage.

 

It's always best to conduct oneself with honor and integrity, but I'm not in your shoes.

[Steadfast]

 

Do I realize now that what I did was wrong? Yes I do, but it was a survival tactic of sorts.

 

 

W_N, you don't need a lecture from me or anyone else. What's done is done. Still, it *is* important to realize that what you did was the emotional equivalent to holding someone down so you wouldn't drown. See, what's been left out of this conversation is the (innocent, I'll presume) third party that comforted you when you and your wife were separated. Those of us in your shoes knows what it feels like, but there is no justification for using someone else to ease your own pain. Not even a cheating spouse.

 

Worse yet to advise others to follow suit: ('Wife left, says shes not happy' ).

 

In addition, the use of someone else to make a cheater jealous isn't a motivation I'd be comfortable with. I would rather base my recon on feelings of genuine love, a shared sense of loss (the realization of continued pain) and a desire to reconnect. Emotional blackmail might work for awhile, but I have serious doubts in its ability to sustain long term.

 

Take it for what it's worth. Despite this long thread few of us know what's really going on, what was said, or felt. It's never too late to turn right!

[2.50 a gallon]

W-N

 

Don't let the posters beat you up, you did nothing wrong. Your new squeeze was told of the circumstances from day one, it was her choice to go for the ride and knowing what the odds were.

[goingstrong]

Nobody is beating anyone up. Just because I pointed out something a week ago that happened to be true, and the OP didn't want to hear it doesn't mean we are beating him up. It is merely a different perspective that adds to the chorus of voices here. If we were all yes men, said the exact same thing,and only told the OP what he wants to hear, then we really are not helping anyone. Wrong is wrong no matter how you want to spin it. It sucks to be in his shoes, but an man shows his honor and integrity not when it is easy and convenient, but he shows it when it is difficult and not on public display for all to praise.