BW asked for sep, MM devastated

[bentnotbroken]

From my own experience I know it is important to respect the boundaries of how much other posters want to reveal on LS. I had to ask Tony to delete half a thread to protect my anonymity after I finally gave after for the pressure from other LS posters and revealed what country I was from. And I can tell you that Tony was furious about it. He imprinted the importance of not giving out TMI (Too Much Information).

 

I found Bent's post distasteful, not funny. Since when do we make jokes about people's medical conditions/handicaps?

 

 

I don't have a problem with you ignoring my posts. I often find most of yours distasteful...ignoring works wonders. I didn't make a joke one way or another. But I view him the same way as I view all people who act as if they don't know how to be an adult(not telling their spouse they want out and creeping on the side)....NO backbone.

[bittersweet memories]

.

 

hense split self... Ready... set... ATTACK!

 

hahaha..you are hilliarious! You even make fun of it!! Can't blame you, I crack up everytime someone mentions it.

[jennie-jennie]

No need to be sorry.

But while we're slightly off topic, I don't see why anyone knowing your country is so bad. If your country is as liberal as you say it is, surely you're not the only unapologetic other woman living there. I'm sure I'm not the only other Reformed Other Woman from Texas. I'm just confused why you think you invaded your own privacy, but that's neither here nor there. It's nice of Tony to remove the posts for you.

 

All you had to do was google LS and my country, and you came directly to my posts AND at that time I had my real photo as an avatar as well.

 

My exSO, who has at times been abusive towards me, did come upon LS once on my computer and understood I was posting here but does not know my screen name. The BS knows my nationality, that is pretty much all she knows about me. My best friend knows I post on some kind of OW/OM forum, but I have not been willing to reveal which since I do write about very personal stuff here. Thus it is very pertinent for me not to be associated with my country, since while you are not the only OW/OM posting on LS from Texas, I am pretty much the only OW posting from my country, so revealing that information IS enough to threaten my anonymity.

 

Yes, it was nice of Tony to remove the posts, I just wish he hadn't yelled so at me for giving out TMI.

Edited June 4, 2010 by jennie-jennie

[RedDevil66]

Another example of how differently we react to other people's posts.

 

It's no secret you "react" to reality in such a ":sick:" way

[jennie-jennie]

It's no secret you "react" to reality in such a ":sick:" way

 

I am so glad your "reality" is not my reality.

[jennie-jennie]

hahaha..you are hilliarious! You even make fun of it!! Can't blame you, I crack up everytime someone mentions it.

 

Here is an online discussion from Washington Post with therapist Emily Brown, the author of Patterns of Infidelity and Their Treatment. Perhaps learning more about her and her perspective on affairs will make you appreciate what she says instead of laugh about it.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/zforum/national/infidelity0901.htm

[MizzBlue72]

I really don't think that a M can work if there is another person involved ever. Same with marriage counselling.

I know he is hurting and it hurts you to see him hurt.

 

Hopefully they can work this out. And then you guys can decide to end it. Or - he stays separated and Divorces her and you can make a go of it.

 

Good luck either way.

[NoIDidn't]

Here is an online discussion from Washington Post with therapist Emily Brown, the author of Patterns of Infidelity and Their Treatment. Perhaps learning more about her and her perspective on affairs will make you appreciate what she says instead of laugh about it.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/zforum/national/infidelity0901.htm

 

I read the link. Disagreed with her reasoning that basically said that affairs stem from childhood pain, as if people aren't just selfish and greedy regardless of their childhoods.

 

I'm going to do more research on Emily Brown. She seems to be doing a great job at handing out excuses instead of answers, IMO.

[bentnotbroken]

I read the link. Disagreed with her reasoning that basically said that affairs stem from childhood pain, as if people aren't just selfish and greedy regardless of their childhoods.

 

I'm going to do more research on Emily Brown. She seems to be doing a great job at handing out excuses instead of answers, IMO.

 

 

I've read some of here work for a class a while back. My mind hasn't changed by looking at that link. I still think she is a joke.

[MizzBlue72]

 

hense split self... Ready... set... ATTACK!

 

OMG - I will not attack you for having a split self - you or the OM!!

I get this - completely get this.

 

It's pure hell to be split - you love him, and aren't sure where it is going. He understands you yet stays with wife, or is thinking of trying to make it work.

I was there last year. I get it COMPLETELY.

 

No hatred from me here. All I can say - take care of you. You can worry about him, but remember - you come first with you. Prepare for the worst - that he will go back to his W. If he does leave - he will be confused for a long time - sorting things out. Well - at least that's what happened with STBDMM I am with.

 

I mean - it - good luck. And you can still respect and love yourself while loving a MM. Don't forget that - no matter where these side conversations go.

[NoIDidn't]

you make a valid point. THis is what makes his decsiion so difficult. He can only let his real self out with me... The deep emotions he feels about his condition have never been shared with anyone other than me.

 

To all others, he is an amazing, powerful man, who is unphased by his condition. He has a successful career despite what he goes through and lives his life, and inspires others to overcome adversity as well. He is still that man, that others see, but with me, he is allowed to feel vulnerable.

 

hense split self... Ready... set... ATTACK!

 

Big contradiction in this short post. He's afraid to live alone, but you claim he's "unphased" by his condition.

 

I doubt very seriously that he is only his real self with you. Its a common fallacy believed by OW/OM alike. Its how they hook their OPs into the affair by making them feel they know things that the betrayed do not. Its never surprising after a d-day and a bus trip to read from an OW that she is seeing a different person in the MM.

 

The way this thread started off and where it is now is interesting. Is he still devastated?

[pureinheart]

Here is an online discussion from Washington Post with therapist Emily Brown, the author of Patterns of Infidelity and Their Treatment. Perhaps learning more about her and her perspective on affairs will make you appreciate what she says instead of laugh about it.

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/zforum/national/infidelity0901.htm

 

This was really good and confirmed most of my personal theories.

[jennie-jennie]

Big contradiction in this short post. He's afraid to live alone, but you claim he's "unphased" by his condition.

 

I doubt very seriously that he is only his real self with you. Its a common fallacy believed by OW/OM alike. Its how they hook their OPs into the affair by making them feel they know things that the betrayed do not. Its never surprising after a d-day and a bus trip to read from an OW that she is seeing a different person in the MM.

 

The way this thread started off and where it is now is interesting. Is he still devastated?

 

Did you miss the words "to all others"?

 

To all others, he is an amazing, powerful man, who is unphased by his condition.

 

It is interesting what you say about OW/OM believing that the MP only is his/her real self with them. I just realized this is another way of saying what the Split Self theory states as the MP having lost touch with his/her emotional self until the OP comes along. No wonder the BS have to fight the split self so hard.

[silverplanets]

you make a valid point. THis is what makes his decsiion so difficult. He can only let his real self out with me... The deep emotions he feels about his condition have never been shared with anyone other than me.

 

It sounds like you're his personal support system - isn't that what a therapist does???

To all others, he is an amazing, powerful man, who is unphased by his condition. He has a successful career despite what he goes through and lives his life, and inspires others to overcome adversity as well. He is still that man, that others seeut with me, he is allowed to feel vulnerable.

 

Surely we all "present" differently in different settings. It's what humans do ... it's called .. well, being human.

 

 

hense split self... Ready... set... ATTACK!

no - hence human being ... and therefore able to present differently according to surrounding environment (social, physical, emotional etc)

 

 

Just my thoughts above ...

 

not sure what any of it matters though, as I remember you don't want to be with him .. and that's what you need to tell him.

 

He'll cope, trust me.

 

I'd be asking myself why I have ended up in the position of being someone's free therapist/support when I don't want to be with them ...

[jennie-jennie]

I read the link. Disagreed with her reasoning that basically said that affairs stem from childhood pain' date='[/b'] as if people aren't just selfish and greedy regardless of their childhoods.

 

I don't agree with your comment above about Emily Brown's reasoning. This is what she said in the online discussion:

 

"Columbus, Ohio: What is it we are looking for when we are unfaithful in a relationship?

 

Emily Brown: An easy solution to our pain, whether it's pain we carry inside from childhood, or current pain."

[jennie-jennie]

Just my thoughts above ...

 

not sure what any of it matters though, as I remember you don't want to be with him .. and that's what you need to tell him.

 

He'll cope, trust me.

 

I'd be asking myself why I have ended up in the position of being someone's free therapist/support when I don't want to be with them ...

 

Chris, you are smarter than that. Isn't that what we usually recommend the WS on LS, to spend time on his/her own after separation/divorce, instead of directly moving in with the OP?

 

Lila has made it perfectly clear that her dream is that she and her MM will end up together.

 

I believe Lila mentions the split self because her MM is sharing his emotional self only with her, not even with his wife, and most likely he has had problems getting in touch with this part of himself before entering the extramarital relationship. (Correct me if I am wrong, Lila.)

[RedDevil66]

I am so glad your "reality" is not my reality.

 

My reality is that living in a web of sadness, lies and deception is a horrible place to be. My reality is being healthy is a better option that living in drama.

My reality is making my life better by filling my life with productive things like work, med school and charities and not posting day and night on a msg board trying to tell others being an accomplice to a cheater is A OK!

 

Now tell me, your reality of living for a man you will never have, being second being sad and alone all the time is a reality you like?!

 

Please, correct me if I am wrong about your reality

[jennie-jennie]

My reality is that living in a web of sadness, lies and deception is a horrible place to be. My reality is being healthy is a better option that living in drama.

My reality is making my life better by filling my life with productive things like work, med school and charities and not posting day and night on a msg board trying to tell others being an accomplice to a cheater is A OK!

 

Now tell me, your reality of living for a man you will never have, being second being sad and alone all the time is a reality you like?!

 

Please, correct me if I am wrong about your reality

 

You are wrong. You obviously have no clue about my reality. I can tell that from your post above.

[RedDevil66]

You are wrong. You obviously have no clue about my reality. I can tell that from your post above.

 

obviously......

[NoIDidn't]

I don't agree with your comment above about Emily Brown's reasoning. This is what she said in the online discussion:

 

"Columbus, Ohio: What is it we are looking for when we are unfaithful in a relationship?

 

Emily Brown: An easy solution to our pain, whether it's pain we carry inside from childhood, or current pain."

 

I didn't issue my comment for anyone's validation, so we can agree to disagree on her reasoning and on whether or not we accept it.

 

The excuse that people do everything because of some sort of pain wears thin when you have someone trying to shove it down your throat - which is what is being done here with that Split Self theory. Its an interesting theory, but that's about it, IMO. Does it really have to be rehashed in every thread?

 

The key to the quote you have of hers above is "an easy solution". "Easy" is the operative word, IMO, NOT pain. The cheater is looking for an easy solution, the OP is it. The false reality created in the A is the easy solution, until it becomes too hard to maintain.

 

And, no, no one has to agree with me. I can accept that without the constant need to defend/explain my position (unless asked to do so).

[jennie-jennie]

I didn't issue my comment for anyone's validation, so we can agree to disagree on her reasoning and on whether or not we accept it.

 

The excuse that people do everything because of some sort of pain wears thin when you have someone trying to shove it down your throat - which is what is being done here with that Split Self theory. Its an interesting theory, but that's about it, IMO. Does it really have to be rehashed in every thread?

 

The key to the quote you have of hers above is "an easy solution". "Easy" is the operative word, IMO, NOT pain. The cheater is looking for an easy solution, the OP is it. The false reality created in the A is the easy solution, until it becomes too hard to maintain.

 

And, no, no one has to agree with me. I can accept that without the constant need to defend/explain my position (unless asked to do so).

 

You were misrepresententing ms Brown's reasoning by stating that she "basically said that affairs stem from childhood pain". That is what I reacted against.

[Owl]

Lila, I think you need to consider matching your words, your emotions, and your actions.

 

You've been telling him to go home and work on his marriage. But then at the same time, you're hoping this fails and he comes back to you. And the bottom line is that you know full well that continued contact with you is sabotaging any possible reconciliation attempts that could be made.

 

Personally, I think you need to face some reality.

 

What you want can only come at the destruction of his marriage and his family.

 

Don't be wishy-washy on that point. Recognize it. Realize it. And either embrace it or walk away.

 

Either match your wants with your words with your wants and actions (as in tell him that you want him to stay with him, admit that you're part of the "issues" that they're going through and proceed to try to "win" him over), or change your expectations of him and his wife.

 

Seriously...think about what you're saying and doing.

 

You want him with you...that can only happen if he breaks up his family and emotionally devestates his wife.

 

Recognize that as the 'cost' of what you want. Accept it...or not.

[Confused4Now]

Lila, I think you need to consider matching your words, your emotions, and your actions.

 

You've been telling him to go home and work on his marriage. But then at the same time, you're hoping this fails and he comes back to you. And the bottom line is that you know full well that continued contact with you is sabotaging any possible reconciliation attempts that could be made.

 

Personally, I think you need to face some reality.

 

What you want can only come at the destruction of his marriage and his family.

 

Don't be wishy-washy on that point. Recognize it. Realize it. And either embrace it or walk away.

 

Either match your wants with your words with your wants and actions (as in tell him that you want him to stay with him, admit that you're part of the "issues" that they're going through and proceed to try to "win" him over), or change your expectations of him and his wife.

 

Seriously...think about what you're saying and doing.

 

You want him with you...that can only happen if he breaks up his family and emotionally devestates his wife.

 

Recognize that as the 'cost' of what you want. Accept it...or not.

Exactly OWL's point....this was so me early on....being wishy washy.....walk the talk baby!!!!

[Dexter Morgan]

I have no fears if MM and W separate. It is exactly what I hope for. I in no way feel I am to blame for the breakup of their marriage... Being torn has nothing to do with not wanting him in my life - or the challenges he faces... I would be happy to welcome him into my life 100%.

 

then what was all that talk about breaking it off with him and not letting a man live with you for the sake of it and saying your kids don't need that racket?

 

you are flip flopping

 

 

 

Whose a narcisist now?

 

uh, you still. Saying that one can stand by their convictions is not narcissism. Telling a forum that one would be hard pressed to find a better person in the world than yourself is narcissistic.

 

 

You are so much better - must be nice not to have your own inner struggles and live your life morally correct.

 

I just said some of us can stand by our convictions and have the will power to exert our choices. The above you came up with, not me.

 

 

I never asked anyone to walk in my shoes. I simply said that I don`t judge people. If someone wrongs me, It allows me to make my assumptions then about the kind of people I want in my life. Do I judge people who I really don`t know... that I don`t understand what motivates them to do the things they do.. no... I don`t do that.

 

no, you just sleep with someone's husband and then say "don't judge me" as if any amount of judgement you get compares in any way what you and the MM are doing to his wife. get real.

[jthorne]

Exactly OWL's point....this was so me early on....being wishy washy.....walk the talk baby!!!!

I don't think she's being wishy washy at all. I (respectfully) think she is covering her arse. Should things go bad, she can always say that she was the one that encouraged him to work on his marriage.

So what if she's sabotaging it at the same time. MM is allowing it to be sabotaged, and is complicit in it. If she really wanted him to work on his M, she could back off, but doesn't. If he really wanted to work on his M, he could back off but doesn't. However, this doesn't move the ball any closer to a resolution IMO.

Edited June 4, 2010 by jthorne