How important is education in your SO?

[sweetjasmine]

Intelligence is more important to me than the number of degrees someone has. However, I would feel awkward dating someone who did not at least have a bachelor's.

 

Me too, although one of my most intelligent friends never went to college, and had other circumstances been different, I would've considered dating him.

 

I have my MA and am dropping out of my PhD program for a long, boring list of reasons. I will likely never date someone with a PhD in anything other than science/engineering for another long, boring list of reasons.

 

I got my BA from a top school, but in my experience, people from that school and schools like it have a tendency to be absurdly pretentious, closed-minded, and clique-y, so I actually tend to shy away from them.

 

As for the money thing, I would much rather date someone with a Bachelor's who makes a decent living than someone who's getting his PhD in the humanities/social science. Getting that PhD shows drive and ambition, but it's only valuable in that narrow field in academia, and the truism that you don't get a PhD for the money is absolutely accurate these days. As it stands, a PhD is a ticket to earning chump change as a lecturer/departmental-work-horse and switching jobs every five to six years unless you hit the jackpot and land a tenure-track position that actually has health benefits.

[Shakz]

Especially with this sh** economy, it can come down to who know or who you blow to get the top positions. Generalizing about people is simply prejudice that shows limited insight. Sorry.

 

Generalization based on anecdotal evidence, as evidenced by the words "to me...," and confirmed by the caveat, "not in all cases." I have no problem with someone wanting to "find themselves" before deciding what career path to take, or even changing career path;s midstream if that's what they want. I just don't want to date them, necessarily.

[Crazy Magnet]

I will be achieving my doctorate, and -will- not date anyone who does not atleast have their Master's/PhD... or could atleast provide a significant contribution to our income. In both cases, the debate of "intelligence" and "smartness" rings true. I work very hard to earn my degrees and maneuver myself into a profitable, enjoyable lifestyle- I expect the same in return... and most importantly: my diligence will provide me comfortable lifestyle, will his?

 

In reference to the bold portion--YES! For me it's also a diligence thing, but there can be too much of a good thing.

 

I've dated a lot of men with PhDs, MBAs, and MDs but in the end that was too much education for me. The ones I met and dated expected me to sacrifice my career for their career b/c they viewed theirs as more important than mine, despite the fact that I'll be Crazy Magnet, PhD too. Ugh!

 

I swear I've actually had this conversation.

 

Me: Would you alternate taking days off when the kids were sick?

Guy: No, I'm a doctor.

Me: Yeah, I'll be a Dr. too, what's that got to do with anything.

Guy: My job is more important than you job so I shouldn't have to miss.

Me: ??????

 

It was that conversation that made me rethink my entire engagement to that man. About two weeks later I gave the ring back after almost 3 years together. Sorry, I'm not much LESS important because I have a vagina.

 

The most recent attempt to date an MD (last summer) he busted out with "I could never date a woman who was smarter than me."

 

Next.

 

For those reasons, I don't say I have to date a man with post graduate education. I rather have a man who is willing to let me be the bread winner and who is willing to take a career back seat to me and who wouldn't be afraid to be a stay at home dad one day. <---Not an easy find even with the changing gender roles in modern society but I found one anyway! Perhaps I hear distant weddings bells in 2011.

[Crazy Magnet]

one with a Bachelor's who makes a decent living than someone who's getting his PhD in the humanities/social science. Getting that PhD shows drive and ambition, but it's only valuable in that narrow field in academia, and the truism that you don't get a PhD for the money is absolutely accurate these days. As it stands, a PhD is a ticket to earning chump change as a lecturer/departmental-work-horse and switching jobs every five to six years unless you hit the jackpot and land a tenure-track position that actually has health benefits.

 

Those people are crazy. The market is completely saturated. Welcome to lectureville at Podunk State Community College.

 

No thank you!

[sweetjasmine]

Those people are crazy.

 

You have no idea. I could write several books on the kinds of crazy I've seen.

 

A lot of it is the same arrogance in that conversation you had with your ex-fiance, except the person talking down to you has spent 10 years working on something only 30 people in the world care about. Hugely inflated but very fragile egos.

[TaurusTerp]

marsle85:

 

I would like to note that college is EXPENSIVE and not everyone can attend grad school.

 

I went to an Ivy League undergrad school -- so I only have a BS -- but had to pay my way through with little financial aid, for example. Lathering on more school would just be so expensive. I would hope that if I were to try to date anyone with a Masters/etc, they would see the hard work ethic and intelligence as a plus.

 

Of course, I could say the same about undergrad, obviously. Not everyone can attend undergrad, either, but I suppose this does not necessarily mean they'd still be compatible matches to those that could. Personally, I came out of undergrad and almost immediately found work that is now paying me six figures a year out of school -- I'd feel very conflicted if someone still "looked down" on me for not having had a certain degree even if everything else in life is going well.

 

I'd be curious to see how certain statistics relate between undergrad and grad schools... I know the jump is pretty massive from high school, but I suspect there are somewhat significant diminishing marginal returns past that point.

 

Anyways, my point is that education does correlate to a lot of other demographic factors that are likely conducive to compatibility (intelligence, work ethic, lifestyle, financial background, attitudes, etc), and I am more likely to find success among those who share those traits with me, but again I consider the end-traits to be the important factors and not necessarily the "indicators" of said traits.

 

College is expensive, grad school is not (other than md/jd/masters programs). Usually you get a stipend. Just FYI.

[Jersey Shortie]

Since when do women use critical thinking to logic to win arguments?

 

While men often state how "logical" they are, it's not necessarly logical in terms of what is fair and logical to both sexes. It's usually logic based on what would be best suited ideally to a man, or "man logic" if you will. Women are gulity of the same thing. When it comes to the opposite gender, there will be a certain level of emotion invovled in both. But to insinuate that women do not use critical thinking and logic when it comes to arguments is pretty undermining to women as human beings and egotistical to men and their own level of importance. Hogwash like what you stated above gets old..

 

To answer the OP, education is not important to me. Intelligence is. I've dated men with Ivy league educations and men that didn't go to college and an education at prviate insituations does not make for a better man. My own father never went to college and ran his own business remarkably successfully and was very intelligent. Any monkey can get a 4 year degree. Or even a masters. It's not that hard.

[sweetjasmine]

Any monkey can get a 4 year degree. Or even a masters. It's not that hard.

 

Actually, it is difficult, but the point is that you can do it without being particularly intelligent overall and without having much common sense, if you rely on hard work and book smarts. And what you did to get that piece of paper, how well you did it, and how much you got out of it are factors that vary greatly.

 

Someone who barely graduated with the lowest GPA possible from a not-so-great school has the same piece of paper as someone who graduated with a 4.0 from a better school, but the fact that the former managed to get the degree doesn't mean that what the latter did was easy.

[Jersey Shortie]

SweetJasmine, I'm confused what you think you are explaining to me. We all gave our personal opinion in this thread. I stand by mine regardless of your additional comments. I'm well aware of what that little piece of paper means and what it takes to get it. Any monkey can do it.

[Crazy Magnet]

Actually, it is difficult, but the point is that you can do it without being particularly intelligent overall and without having much common sense, if you rely on hard work and book smarts. And what you did to get that piece of paper, how well you did it, and how much you got out of it are factors that vary greatly.

 

Someone who barely graduated with the lowest GPA possible from a not-so-great school has the same piece of paper as someone who graduated with a 4.0 from a better school, but the fact that the former managed to get the degree doesn't mean that what the latter did was easy.

 

I totally agree.

 

I didn't make anything less than a 4.0 ever until well into my second MA degree. My Mom died in the middle of the semester and frankly I ceased to care. Even then my GPA only dipped to like a 3.95 or something equally ridiculous. At that level who even cares anymore!?! Now that I'm in my terminal degree program I really don't care what grades I end up with.

 

Yes, I know people who took 10 years to finally get through college, but you can ascertain their lack of intelligence with the amount of times they failed a class based on how long it took to get through school. It was in fact difficult for this girl to get through school.

 

School is a cake walk for me, but that doesn't mean it's "easy" necessarily.

[sweetjasmine]

SweetJasmine, I'm confused what you think you are explaining to me. We all gave our personal opinion in this thread. I stand by mine regardless of your additional comments. I'm well aware of what that little piece of paper means and what it takes to get it. Any monkey can do it.

 

I just disagree that 'any monkey can do it' and find that suggestion a little insulting, especially after having jumped through dozens of hoops and having worked my butt off to get my MA. You don't have to be all that intelligent to do it, but that doesn't mean people aren't going to take it the wrong way when you say that something they worked hard on is something that any monkey can do.

 

Besides that, I've met people who weren't cut out for college because they had a different type of intelligence and set of skills better suited for work that didn't involve sitting at a desk and writing essays. My brother was never cut out for higher education, but he got the "any idiot can get a degree" speech on a regular basis from my parents when he was struggling with community college. The suggestion that any monkey can do it implies that people like my brother are even dumber than that and probably need someone to dress them in the morning.

[Crazy Magnet]

JS----I'm a bit insulted by the monkey comment too. 99% of people in this world can't accomplish what I have academically at the standard that I have maintained. No, not any monkey can do what I do.

[USMCHokie]

Education is important, but I don't need the girl to have lots of advanced degrees. It's a nice bonus though.

[torranceshipman]

SweetJasmine, I'm confused what you think you are explaining to me. We all gave our personal opinion in this thread. I stand by mine regardless of your additional comments. I'm well aware of what that little piece of paper means and what it takes to get it. Any monkey can do it.

 

I think that SweetJasmine was responding because you made a really offensive statement to a lot of people who have sweated hard, studied like crazy and taken 3 jobs to pay their way through their education-and are still paying off the loan. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, sure, but when it is an opinion spat out in vitriol, then people are going to address what you said.

 

I do agree with you though that some degrees are WAY easier than others, but so what...some people aren't that clever (not a crime) so may find them hard - or - will end up with a degree that, by virtue of not being so hard - will not earn them much money.

[carhill]

No, not any monkey can do what I do.

I found one. It looks a lot like George Burns

 

Seriously though, I agree. Theoretical math whipped my ass, though I'm an instinctive engineer, so I decided to pursue that passion practically. I have a lot of respect for those who chose to continue their education and pursue degrees. Good on 'em. If they (women) discriminate against myself and other men who have no university degrees wrt dating or being healthy and compatible 'SO's', that's their prerogative. Different path

[Els]

Err, I think what JS is saying is that if 'a degree' is one's requirement for a partner, it is way too easy to just get 'a degree, any degree'. I have known people who have gone through degree courses and graduated without knowing horse****. Of course, there are also people who have earned theirs through sweat and blood. But then how does the 'a degree' requirement separate the former from the latter? The answer is that it doesn't.

[Lakeside_runner]

I think I could pass as pretty well educated (1 PhD, 3 Masters) yet the best compliment I get from my friends is that I don't act according to the stereotypes usually associated with highly educated people. It doesn't matter how many titles you can put before/after your name. What matters is who you are and how you treat other people and how you can function among others.

 

On another note, a couple of weeks ago I was hosting a group of prospective graduate students at our university and I don't know how but we started talking about dating etc. Now, imagine a bunch of overweight math majors saying that they couldn't date anyone who doesn't understand calculus! Talking about shooting yourself in the foot or natural selection for that matter.

 

As long as the girl is shy, mature, sporty, and has that certain inexplicable something in the way she looks in my eyes - she's a keeper. She doesn't have to know a lot about the world, history or math/physics - who cares about that.

 

Why would you discriminate potentially the most wonderful person in the world just because (possibly) they could not afford to go to college?

 

P.S. I've attended an Aikido seminar this week, thus I'm full of "be in harmony with the surrounding world"... again...

[Jersey Shortie]

Funny picture Carhill.

 

Thanks Elswyth, that's what I was trying to say. I wasn't trying to insult people with degrees. By saying "any monkey can get a degree", doesn't mean other people don't work hard for them and shouldn't be proud of that.

 

And SweetJasmine, the comment that "any monkey can get a degree", suggests nothing of the kind about your brother. If it did, then it would also suggest something about my own father who also never went to college and who I referenced before.

 

Just because I said "any monkey can get a degree", doesn't equate to "everyone with a degree is a monkey".

[sweetjasmine]

I see what you mean now, JS. Sorry I misunderstood.

[Jersey Shortie]

No worries. I am not the most bashful, soft spoken poster so I can understand the misunderstanding.

[Engadget]

Education is overblown, some of the smartest people I know never went to college, and some of the dumbest people I know got straight A's.

 

Fundamental intelligence is far more important than memorization of pointless facts and numbers, I know because I have a degree and despised college beyond anything.

 

The girl I'm seeing now didn't go to college and is very smart, owns her own house and is very ambitious. College isn't for everyone.

[OceanTropic]

Its not superficial, its preference.

 

I would prefer that my man have an education, simply because should anything happen, he has something to fall back on. Not only that, but I think intelligence is a turn on.

 

Then again, you don't need a degree to be smart. There are many successfull people out there who did it without papers. As long as my man has ambition and is smart, the paper doesnt matter all that much.

 

HOWEVER, if my man IS smart, he would know that having a paper makes things a lot easier in the job field.

[marsle85]

Well, there you go. I would be intimidated to date a woman with your amount of education, not simply because your earning power might surpass my own, but because you would be so much more experienced at critical thinking that I wouldn't be able to win a single argument.

 

I find that the tools I use to debate/win arguments are based on an eagerness to learn, unyielding bond to my values, thrill of a challenge and ability to articulate myself... neither which you seemingly lack.

 

My attraction to a man with an expansive education is specifically heightened due to my desire to live comfortably... I wouldn't limit my romantic life should he be intellectually suited to me and say, own a successful business.

 

This may be snooty- but it's a certain value I particularly find very important.

 

 

I would like to note that college is EXPENSIVE and not everyone can attend grad school.

 

I went to an Ivy League undergrad school -- so I only have a BS -- but had to pay my way through with little financial aid, for example. Lathering on more school would just be so expensive. I would hope that if I were to try to date anyone with a Masters/etc, they would see the hard work ethic and intelligence as a plus.

 

Of course, I could say the same about undergrad, obviously. Not everyone can attend undergrad, either, but I suppose this does not necessarily mean they'd still be compatible matches to those that could. Personally, I came out of undergrad and almost immediately found work that is now paying me six figures a year out of school -- I'd feel very conflicted if someone still "looked down" on me for not having had a certain degree even if everything else in life is going well.

 

I'd be curious to see how certain statistics relate between undergrad and grad schools... I know the jump is pretty massive from high school, but I suspect there are somewhat significant diminishing marginal returns past that point.

 

Anyways, my point is that education does correlate to a lot of other demographic factors that are likely conducive to compatibility (intelligence, work ethic, lifestyle, financial background, attitudes, etc), and I am more likely to find success among those who share those traits with me, but again I consider the end-traits to be the important factors and not necessarily the "indicators" of said traits.

 

I mean no offense to you, but your choice to attend an Ivy-League school (with little to no financial aid) was not a economically sound one if you desired to pursue graduate school after. I know how hard school is, and I understand an Ivy-League college would probably pose much more difficulty. Yet considering how a good majority of people are enrolled in undergraduate studies (regardless of their intelligence or hard work) to me, a BA is only a little above average. Should you have preformed stellar at a less accredited school, you could be using the money you would have spent on an Ivy-League college for your graduate studies... with increasing likelihood that you would have some sort of stipend or financial aid.

 

Furthermore, you were still successful- even with a BA. I measure compatibility on success, not directly on education.

[WintersNightTraveler]

I am interested to hear how important it is to otheres. Is it an age thing? I know that when I'm online dating, the first thing I check (after their picture) is their education, is that so awful?

 

I hate talking about education early on when meeting women. I am very well educated, and I find if that if they are less so it sometimes puts them on the defensive, needlessly. I can evaluate someone's intelligence without having to ask about their alma mater.

 

In the long term, intelligence and education are very relevant to me, but it is not the first thing I check.

[VertexSquared]

I mean no offense to you, but your choice to attend an Ivy-League school (with little to no financial aid) was not a economically sound one if you desired to pursue graduate school after. I know how hard school is, and I understand an Ivy-League college would probably pose much more difficulty. Yet considering how a good majority of people are enrolled in undergraduate studies (regardless of their intelligence or hard work) to me, a BA is only a little above average. Should you have preformed stellar at a less accredited school, you could be using the money you would have spent on an Ivy-League college for your graduate studies... with increasing likelihood that you would have some sort of stipend or financial aid.

 

Furthermore, you were still successful- even with a BA. I measure compatibility on success, not directly on education.

 

It was economically sound in the sense that I saw it as an investment, since I know what kind of student and worker I am. The top-tier schools are well-endowed and have amazing faculty and resources that you simply won't find anywhere else. Many firms only recruit from Ivies, to boot. Had I gone to a lower-tiered school, I'd have to work harder to stand out in the really competitive job pools (3.9 from a state school is a decent cry from 3.9 at an Ivy). The networks are so strong and the opportunities are so numerous as well.

 

Granted, going to a cheaper school would have saved a lot on the upfront costs and loans, and would have made going to grad school infinitely easier, but again, I figure if I can hit the same goals with strong undergrad compared to weaker undergrad + grad, then all the better.

 

My overall point is that everyone's financial situations are different, and they may or may not coincide with desired goals and educational opportunities.