Author trippi1432 Posted June 27, 2010 Author Share Posted June 27, 2010 No I understand the context Trippi, it just makes little sense to look at it that way. Whats the point of the list? Is the message to be warry of the list rather then following your instincts and your own desires in order to keep a man/woman then? How many good relationships might end due to being over cautious? What if the man has the same list? There are far to many scenarios where a list becomes to constrictive. #2 Man... "we've been going out for awhile but she seems to be holding back, maybe shes not that into me. Woman... "Wow a great guy, I really want to know where his head is at because i think this could be going somewhere, but if I ask the list says I'll sabotage my relationship so i'll wait for him to bring it up. #10 Man... " I seem to be doing all the work here, I love spending time with her but she doesn't really seem to return that" Woman... " I'd like to add some romance of my own, but I don't want to go overboard! i would hate to mess this up." Seems to me constantly evaluating and reevaluating every step of the relationship would just become a roadblock to any kind of closeness and communication. Thats why they call it "FALLING" in love and not carefully planning an orchestrated course with designated stops and goals to love. TOJAZ :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: Grrrrr.....exactly!!! The entire point of posting this list here on this thread is to show how absurd this thinking is from the male perspective!!! LOL!!! Read back....I think that for the most part (expect for someone who said they do live under a rock), men and women here are saying that the list is BS. But, for the record....this information is out there on websites for people to look up (many relationship websites) to sway the ways of thinking about relationships. This type of information is not just on sites for women, but for men as well. Link to post Share on other sites
tojaz Posted June 27, 2010 Share Posted June 27, 2010 :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: Grrrrr.....exactly!!! The entire point of posting this list here on this thread is to show how absurd this thinking is from the male perspective!!! I'm not the one that bought the book.:rolleyes: The male female perspective has nothing to do with why the whole thing is absurd. Who were the men? Where the women nuts? Where the men? There is no mention of the context in which these answers were given or the situations the people that made the list were in. It could be taken point by point any number of scenarios that would take the list to play on either side. Taking my previous example of number 2 what was too soon that made the man give this answer? Did she talk about marriage and kids on the first date, second date meeting the parents? Was he a commitment phobe and this came up after 6 months a year? Only person that knows is the guy who checked a box or scribbled it on a note pad, post break up, and only his side of the story. To an average person reading it and picturing a reasonable scenario it becomes an absurd and unreasonable conclusion. That man killed his wife with a butcher knife. What is your opinion of this man?????? TOJAZ Link to post Share on other sites
tojaz Posted June 27, 2010 Share Posted June 27, 2010 But, for the record....this information is out there on websites for people to look up (many relationship websites) to sway the ways of thinking about relationships. This type of information is not just on sites for women, but for men as well. Yes it is, and it is out there with little regard for what it is doing to relationships. Many of these sites and many of these books are manipulative by nature, an easy escape route out of a relationship, providing justification to the WAS (of both sexes). The most damaging part is people believe it! There are woman who will read this list and others like it and blame themselves for a break up they had no control over, or assume that it speaks of all men and destroy trust. Google up what can constitute emotional abuse. I was terribly shocked to find that my cat was emotionally abusing me! How could I be so blind!!!! That is a trap that i have fallen into myself http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t192211/ and with so much out there to support the claims, its hard to not believe this things as fact and many people who have "educated" themselves via books like this and the internet sights that do not give a well rounded view that are all too willing to support that. TOJAZ Link to post Share on other sites
tojaz Posted June 27, 2010 Share Posted June 27, 2010 Oh, and for my purposes, the man with the knife was acting in defense of his endangered child. (sure you all saw that coming but try that on someone random and see the range of responses. TOJAZ Link to post Share on other sites
Author trippi1432 Posted June 27, 2010 Author Share Posted June 27, 2010 (edited) I'm not the one that bought the book.:rolleyes: TOJAZ You are entitled to your opinion, but I think that you are taking this way too far....please...now we are talking about a guy who killed someone with a butcher knife over a relationship thread?? Isn't that a bit of a slippery slope? Edited June 27, 2010 by trippi1432 Had more to add. Link to post Share on other sites
Author trippi1432 Posted June 27, 2010 Author Share Posted June 27, 2010 (edited) Ok...I've written the author at her website. I will let you know when I get her response. "On page 124 in your paper back book, Boot Camp for the Broken Hearted - you state that men answered the 12 Things Women Do to Sabotage Relationships....where is the statistical information that this was gathered from? Or do you have any supporting documentation? According to a man I have been speaking with, there is no proof that your list is valid and that this IS NOT how most men think....in fact, by spouting this information as untrue, this leads to a breakdown in relationships as this becomes what women expect from men...eventually leaving what might in fact be a good relationship due to fear of doing one of these items to sabotage the relationship. Thanks." Looking at the information in the book and the bibliography, it appears that this information came from AskMen.com....interesting website....with what I am sure is millions of men's comments about their girlfriends, spouses...SO's. Edited June 27, 2010 by trippi1432 Link to post Share on other sites
Author trippi1432 Posted June 28, 2010 Author Share Posted June 28, 2010 Author of the book Boot Camp for the Broken Hearted: From: TheAccidentalExpert [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Sunday, June 27, 2010 7:24 PM To: Trippi1432 Subject: Re: The Accidental Expert contact form The source of this list and the one prior to it is stated on page 123. The list also corresponds with some of the reasons I found when talking with women who were having a hard time in relationships. Obviously this list was meant for readers to simply examine their own roles in their relationships, as stated on page 123, and is also non-exhaustive. ----- Original Message ----- From: Trippi1342 To: Audrey Valeriani Sent: Sunday, June 27, 2010 5:55 PM Subject: The Accidental Expert contact form Yes, this list and a subsequent list of the Top 10 types of women to avoid was taken from AskMen.com. The author does make note in her book that a small percentage of women most likely represent the items on the lists. Essentially, the author states the these are amusing things for women to consider and asks if any women see themselves in the items on the list. These came from articles written by MEN on ASKMEN.com......so there you have it. Again, the whole point of putting the list out here on this thread was not to instruct anyone to take the list and apply it to their life.....then run. It was posted in jest to poke fun at (debunk) and show how stupid it was .......I think that there was a lot of good feedback from men and women alike on here who do not agree with the research or articles that were written on Askmen.com. I do hate that anyone took offense at the posting...honestly, any advice on these forums is just as contradictory as the self-help books, counselors and therapists out there in my opinion. I paid $250 by Michelle Weiner Davis' divorce busting coach last year....didn't do me any good. (Be nice, be sincere, get him back in the house and into marriage counseling...that was basically what I got...oh and to defer any decision-making until we had time to see the counselor). 3 marriage counseling sessions with him attending only one of these....no good....took advice of the 180 and the NC/LC....better myself....look like I've moved on (wasn't even dating anyone).....pulled his OW out and said.."Hey, since you've moved on can I bring her around the DS now?"....like a little boy with a new toy. As Tanbark notes, cheating should be the #1 thing on the list...notice that is not???? Link to post Share on other sites
Gunny376 Posted June 28, 2010 Share Posted June 28, 2010 The trouble with these self help books, counseling (be it IC or MC) is the dynamics of each individual and relationships? They're all the same and all different? Then factor in men being men, and women being women? Then factor into the equation of individuality? Then add in anxiety, depression, childhood sexual molestation, gender variances, depression, OCDO, ADHD, PTSD? ` yada ~ yada. Not to mention the number of hundreds of thousands of Combat Vets coming back from Iraq and Afghanistain? trippi1432 you need not have served in the Marines nor MikeYMad ~ not Togaz to suffer from anxiety, depression nor PTSD. You each and everyone have your own personal version of it ~ and your own personal version of HELLL! I got FORCED to get pyschogiocal help or lose my job? And during these economic hard times? Being a 53 year old Marine is hard to come by in rural Alabama. Just finding a job at my age during good times are hard? trippi1432 Quit beating yourself up and get busy living your life! Link to post Share on other sites
sumdude Posted June 28, 2010 Share Posted June 28, 2010 (edited) 1. Picks the wrong man. 1. Picks the right man then decides he's not 'exciting enough' once he actually commits 100%. IOW more interested in the thrill and the chase.. once the 'goal' (marriage, commitment) has been reached she loses interest. I'll call it hollywood-itis. As if happily ever after is the wedding... 1. Related to 2. Treats love as a drug. Love is a verb not a noun. 1. Entitlement complex. Upgrade upgrade upgrade... 1. Actually it's all related and the same as what Gunny was saying. My favorite quote about love is from Joseph Campbell. "Love is a friendship set to music." Yes there has to be some sexual chemistry but trust, companionship and wanting to be there are 90% of a relationship. Yet I meet women in their 40's and beyond that still fall for the rakes, cads the alleged bad boys. Meanwhile surrounded by the real men who actually give a flying f&^%? C'mon, you're supposed to outgrow that crud at some point. Edited June 28, 2010 by sumdude Link to post Share on other sites
Author trippi1432 Posted June 28, 2010 Author Share Posted June 28, 2010 Hi Gunny - I agree 100%, the dynamics of the relationship, the individuality, the differences between men and women....there are many, many different things that contribute how and what people take from any self-help, counseling...etc. 20 people can read one book and take away 20 different opinions on how to apply that to their life, circumstances or their marriage (hence, perhaps, our own personal versions of Hell), but it is also the uniqueness of each of us. Not always appreciated, but it is what it is. Not beating myself up anymore....he made his choice, and it was HIS choice. As for getting busy living my life....working on that....just taking slow....sometimes life can get overwhelming. Link to post Share on other sites
Author trippi1432 Posted June 28, 2010 Author Share Posted June 28, 2010 Yet I meet women in their 40's and beyond that still fall for the rakes, cads the alleged bad boys. Meanwhile surrounded by the real men who actually give a flying f&^%? C'mon, you're supposed to outgrow that crud at some point. All very good points....just wondering...since I know I have a "bad people picker" :rolleyes: Where are the real men who actually give a flying f&^%? The pool where I live seems to be swimming with a lot of "crud". :confused: Link to post Share on other sites
sumdude Posted June 28, 2010 Share Posted June 28, 2010 All very good points....just wondering...since I know I have a "bad people picker" :rolleyes: Where are the real men who actually give a flying f&^%? The pool where I live seems to be swimming with a lot of "crud". :confused: LOL don't know where your pool is. But the men are somewhere around. They're more low key. They're not like the sharks ready to pounce and strike. They'll take their time to maybe even get to know you but usually move a bit too slow because the sharks will swoop in and make the big moves to get their 'kill'. They seem to make really good friends. Because they're low key they confuse your attraction radar so that's all they usually end up being unless both open their eyes to what a really good relationship is. Link to post Share on other sites
Author trippi1432 Posted June 28, 2010 Author Share Posted June 28, 2010 LOL don't know where your pool is. But the men are somewhere around. They're more low key. They're not like the sharks ready to pounce and strike. They'll take their time to maybe even get to know you but usually move a bit too slow because the sharks will swoop in and make the big moves to get their 'kill'. They seem to make really good friends. Because they're low key they confuse your attraction radar so that's all they usually end up being unless both open their eyes to what a really good relationship is. :sick::sick: OMG!! No!!!! The only male "friend" I was allowed to be around was the ex's drinking buddy.....all I need!! <vomiting starting now!!!!!> That does explain the Jaws nightmares I've been having lately SumDude....thanks. LOL!! :rolleyes: Link to post Share on other sites
sumdude Posted June 29, 2010 Share Posted June 29, 2010 :sick::sick: OMG!! No!!!! The only male "friend" I was allowed to be around was the ex's drinking buddy.....all I need!! <vomiting starting now!!!!!> That does explain the Jaws nightmares I've been having lately SumDude....thanks. LOL!! :rolleyes: Yeesh, what the heck does your ex's "friend" have to do with anything? I'm talking about someone who is a true blue friend to YOU! The ideal mate is someone who is your best friend AND your lover too. Link to post Share on other sites
Author trippi1432 Posted June 29, 2010 Author Share Posted June 29, 2010 Yeesh, what the heck does your ex's "friend" have to do with anything? I'm talking about someone who is a true blue friend to YOU! The ideal mate is someone who is your best friend AND your lover too. Well, I can totally agree with that.....unfortunately, all my friends are women and I don't go there. Only male friend I was allowed to associate with was the ex's drinking buddy....ick. lol! I do know what you mean though, been there, thought it was that and then we got divorced because he had a lot of female "friends" it seems. :mad: Link to post Share on other sites
sumdude Posted June 29, 2010 Share Posted June 29, 2010 Well, I can totally agree with that.....unfortunately, all my friends are women and I don't go there. Only male friend I was allowed to associate with was the ex's drinking buddy....ick. lol! I do know what you mean though, been there, thought it was that and then we got divorced because he had a lot of female "friends" it seems. :mad: Yep, know where you're coming from. My ex had an awful lot of male 'friends' too. At least I know more now than I did. Had a woman the last year I was interested in and she seemed interested. Left it at friends for a while, had a couple romantic moments. But my radar kept flashing red... too many male 'friends' so I never took it further. Link to post Share on other sites
Author trippi1432 Posted June 29, 2010 Author Share Posted June 29, 2010 Well, I can say that one self-help book that I hope helps shed some light on the road to the healing process is one that was just mentioned here last week....Runaway Husbands - The Abandoned Wife's Guide to Recovery and Renewal by Vikki Stark. I haven't gotten far, but have had to put it down a couple of times to have a good cry....:( Link to post Share on other sites
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