180 Support Thread

[wrencn]

I thought I would start a thread for everyone who is currently doing the 180. I started almost 3 weeks ago but I had a minor slip today. I asked my husband for a hug- told him I missed human interaction I guess there isn't any point in dwelling on it now. He was nice about it and gave me a hug no questions asked but I can't allow myself to be weak around him again. I also don't go out much, but I did go to a friends house yesterday when he got home from work until about 10:30 just so he would miss me, but other than that I am at home. Maybe I should go out more- I don't know if it will send the wrong impression.

 

Ok so post here when you are having trouble and need support.

 

 

The 180's list

 

This is from Michelle Weiner Davis' book Divorcebusting:

Quote:

 

 

1. Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or

implore!

 

2. No frequent phone calls

 

3. Do not point out good points in marriage

 

4. Do not follow him around the house

 

5. Do not encourage talk about the future

 

6. Do not ask for help from family members

 

7. Do not ask for reassurances

 

8. Do not buy gifts

 

9. Do not schedule dates together

 

10. Do not spy on spouse

 

11. Do not say "I Love You"

 

12. Act as if you are moving on with your life

 

13. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive

 

14. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get

busy, do things, go to church, go out with friends,

etc.

 

15. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start

the conversation) be scarce or short on words

 

16. If you are in the habit of asking your spouse his

whereabouts, ASK NOTHING

 

17. You need to make your partner think that you have

had an awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you

are going to move on with your life, with or without

your spouse

 

18. Do not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull

back and wait to see if spouse notices and, more

important, realize what he will be missing

 

19. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show

your spouse happiness and contentment. Show him

someone he would want to be around.

 

20. All questions about marriage should be put on

hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which

may be a while)

 

21. Never lose your cool

 

22. Don't be overly enthusiastic

 

23. Do not argue about how he feels (it only makes

their feelings stronger)

 

24. Be patient

 

25. Listen carefully to what your spouse is really

saying to you

 

26. Learn to back off, shut up and walk away when you

want to speak out

 

27. Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh &

focus on all the other parts of your life that are not

in turmoil)

 

28. Be strong and confident and learn to speak softly

 

29. Know that if you can do 180, your smallest

CONSISTENT actions will be noticed much more than any

words you can say or write

 

30. Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you

are hurting more than ever and are desperate and needy

 

31. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with

your spouse

 

32. Do not believe any of what you hear and less than

50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in

absolute negatives because he is hurting and scared

 

33. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad

you feel

 

34. Do not backslide from your hard earned changes

[tojaz]

I thought I would start a thread for everyone who is currently doing the 180. I started almost 3 weeks ago but I had a minor slip today. I asked my husband for a hug- told him I missed human interaction I guess there isn't any point in dwelling on it now. He was nice about it and gave me a hug no questions asked but I can't allow myself to be weak around him again. I also don't go out much, but I did go to a friends house yesterday when he got home from work until about 10:30 just so he would miss me, but other than that I am at home. Maybe I should go out more- I don't know if it will send the wrong impression.

 

 

Don't beat yourself up over what you call a slip, It isn't. The 180 or any of the other advice given here is not written in stone. You have to mold it to your own situation. Take what works and leave what ever is left. The 180 is a series of guidelines to help you along. You know your husband best and you will know what he will respond to and what he will not. Above all trust your instincts and use the guidelines to help you along.

 

 

TOJAZ

[wrencn]

Thanks Tojaz- I do know my husband and asking for hugs is not good, because later he'll say I'm pressuring him and he doesn't know how to say no to me. He fights dirty and will throw this in my face later. The last two times we had sex he initiated it but found a way to say it was my doing. Oh well-

[tojaz]

You cant control what he thinks, what he sees or what he perceives. Its pointless to try. Work the 180, but you have to be true to yourself. If you need a hug and its not ok to him for you to ask, then thats on him. Seen on this forum so often, the 180, NC are supposed to be for you, if he should pick up on it is just a happy side effect.

 

I know it hurts, is counter intuitive, and a heck of a lot harder then it sounds, but if you are sacrificing yourself and your emotional health... is it worh it? A lesson I'm still learning.

 

Need to read your thread.....

 

TOJAZ

[wrencn]

I actually haven't posted my story and probably never will because it is so very long and complicated and I'm sure every person on here would say we need to divorce, lol. And they would probably be right. Thanks again though for the support, I really appreciate it.

[tojaz]

Fair enough. If you should change your mind, we all learn the most from the long and complicated, and in my experience the cases where divorce is the only answer are few and far between (although they do exist).

 

No thanks necessary, support is what this place is all about and I just try to give as good as I get. Good luck to you.

 

TOJAZ

[trippi1432]

I actually haven't posted my story and probably never will because it is so very long and complicated and I'm sure every person on here would say we need to divorce, lol. And they would probably be right. Thanks again though for the support, I really appreciate it.

 

Hi wrencn - I know you were posting on my other thread and I still haven't had a chance to look over that link you left...but when you get your post count up to 50 (I think), you should be able to PM if you would like to talk more about your story.

 

I will go ahead and add you to my contacts if I am able.

 

Hugs and hang in there.

[habs53]

Well im doing the 180 now as well. A few minor slips but im keeping to it. My case its LC and i only talk about the child. Nothing else. I think shes scared to talk to me right now. lol In my case i dont know if the 180 is the right thing to do. Still researching this depression thing. But for now im sticking to it.

[tornandmarried]

180 sounds tough....minor slips sound ok actually....why not show u care a bit amoungst all the space?

[habs53]

180 sounds tough....minor slips sound ok actually....why not show u care a bit amoungst all the space?

 

Well, from what i can say from experience is that you can show you care but dont use the love word. Only show you care by being positive. Very short conversations.

[habs53]

Well, from what i can say from experience is that you can show you care but dont use the love word. Only show you care by being positive. Very short conversations. Oh, and agree with everything that he or she has told you. It effectively takes her out of the drivers seat. They have nothing to hold against you then. What the 180 has done for me is restore my confidence in myself. Living alone really is not all that bad. Maybe the other person is more misserable than you. They really could be. Remember, they are the one with the guilt not you.

[tojaz]

Well, i think that the 180 counters our natural instinct, which is to fix it, but acting towards that will more likely then not put pressure on the other party and push them away. A way to put yourself in a positive light without doing things that would make you seem needy, pushy, or desperate. It keeps you from falling into a cycle of reinforcing the negative things (in their eyes) that we all do in an attempt to retrieve our relationships.

 

As for saying you love them, I think moderation is best where words are involved, let your actions speak for you. That means more anyway.

 

TOJAZ

[What_Next]

First, applying the 180 while living under the same roof is nearly impossible. It's not a bible, it's not an absolute. Read my thread for some VERY personal experiences that I went through. Asking for a hug is not the end of the world. It's a normal human reaction. I did so, I received some and was told other times to go pound sand

 

Now, here's a slice of life for you. Find something that you can focus on. It has to be something that you can COMPLETELY focus on. In my case it was exercise. Particulatrly bike riding. Whenever I wanted to go upstairs and ask for a hug or bark at the moon I jumped on the bike and rode, and rode hard! It got me out of the house, it burned off that nervous energy I had. You'll have to find your own diversion.

 

Also I found that talking to myself helped. Yup that sounds odd to admit in the open, but it did help. I would have conversations with myself going over the pro's and con's of my actions.

 

Break the 180 down into things you CAN accomplish,things you CAN'T accomplish and things you MIGHT be able to acomplish. Work on the ones you think you might be able to accomplish and then you might have an insight into those you believe you can't accomplish.

 

Above all else, get comfortable inside your own headspace. Get to know the REAL you. The 180 is really meant as a personal journey that will first mold your own self and then eventually your partner will notice it and begin to respect you for it.

 

Good luck, and tell us of your ups and downs. Most of us have been there.

[habs53]

First, applying the 180 while living under the same roof is nearly impossible. It's not a bible, it's not an absolute. Read my thread for some VERY personal experiences that I went through. Asking for a hug is not the end of the world. It's a normal human reaction. I did so, I received some and was told other times to go pound sand

 

Now, here's a slice of life for you. Find something that you can focus on. It has to be something that you can COMPLETELY focus on. In my case it was exercise. Particulatrly bike riding. Whenever I wanted to go upstairs and ask for a hug or bark at the moon I jumped on the bike and rode, and rode hard! It got me out of the house, it burned off that nervous energy I had. You'll have to find your own diversion.

 

Also I found that talking to myself helped. Yup that sounds odd to admit in the open, but it did help. I would have conversations with myself going over the pro's and con's of my actions.

 

Break the 180 down into things you CAN accomplish,things you CAN'T accomplish and things you MIGHT be able to acomplish. Work on the ones you think you might be able to accomplish and then you might have an insight into those you believe you can't accomplish.

 

Above all else, get comfortable inside your own headspace. Get to know the REAL you. The 180 is really meant as a personal journey that will first mold your own self and then eventually your partner will notice it and begin to respect you for it.

 

Good luck, and tell us of your ups and downs. Most of us have been there.

I became an expert at talking to myself lol Even caught myself doing it at the supermarket.

[Gunny376]

NO! No, NO!!

 

"Buy you books and pencils send you still don't know nothin"

 

The 180's aren't about bringing the SO back into the fold/marriage/relationships ! the 180's are about YOU and your becoming a self autonomous, self validating, self sufficient, self supporting individual.

 

Its about identifying your weaknesses daily and seeking self improvement daily.

 

There about self-improvement, and seeking such each and everyday for the rest of your life.

 

There about becoming self autonomous and about accepting yourself and who and what you are are as person. Warts and all ~ its about making the validation statement of "You know what? There are parts of me that are pretty freaking awesome (sit down and make the Pro and Con list out ~ the Pros are going to out number to cons) ~ and the rest? I'm working on.

 

Think about the actress that played the lead role in "Fried Green Tomatoes"

 

The 180's are about completing your childhood, getting rid of all the BS and crap that you were taught by your parents (just because they were your parents doesn't make the 100% right about any and everything) your church that you were raised in? (Oh yeah Catholic Priest molesting little boys, Baptist Minsters having affairs with married women of their congregation ~ they've got it all spelled out. BTW the worse is Joyce Meyers who has a $25,000 gold toilet seat in her private office bathroom! Or Ken Copeland who's "Ministries" Lear jet flew him and the DW to Hawaii and Tahiti? The guy I work for has one and it cost $6K just to fire that baby up!)

 

The 180's are about improving yourself and not being dependent ~ mentally, emotionally, psychologically, sexually, financially on anyone for anything.

 

The 180's are about becoming self autonomous, self validating ~ its getting to the point to where you can say to someone you love?

 

"I love you because I want you to be a part of life ~ and in my life ~ not because I need you to be part of my life!

 

Women and men come and go?

 

Ain't no one monkey makes a show!

[wrencn]

Morning everyone.

 

I actually like the 180 exactly as it is written and think it works well with my situation (except I don't go out-I prefer to be home with the kids). Although we live together still, it is only due to financial reasons. If my husband could have moved out he would have. I've only been doing this for about 3 weeks. He said he needed space- the 180 gives lots of space

 

Our marriage is quite nice now, we are like roomates. We don't fight or argue- we even watch TV together every night. We don't go out as a family though- if we do things with the kids it is separate.

 

I am doing this for me and only me. I've been married since I was 19 so I'm trying to gain my autonomy at 30 and I think I'm doing well, except at nights when I get a bit sad and scared, but I'm fine once I'm up and moving around. My hope is by the time we actually separate physically I will have detached for long enough that it isn't this life shattering event. I have one more year left in my masters program so I'm trying to mentally prepare for the worst so I can keep it together.

 

Right now I can accomplish all 34 of the items without any difficulty except for wanting a darn hug- but my youngest son gives me all the hugs and kisses I ask for and he's a lot cuter than my husband haha

[What_Next]

What is your mindset as to the marriage and attempting to make it work? The 180 is inward focused and will help you stay inside your own skin.

 

Part of it though will be to process what you want out of the marriage, or whether you want OUT of the marriage.

[wrencn]

My mindset is that my marriage is over. The letter my husband wrote me made that very clear and I have no desire to hang on to something that is dead. I still love my husband and if he has a change of heart I will work towards making my marriage the best it has ever been. I have changed so much in the last 10 weeks or so- so even if my marriage doesn't make it, I'm so thankful for all this mess that actually got me to change for the better. I'll just be a better wife for my next husband.

[habs53]

My mindset is that my marriage is over. The letter my husband wrote me made that very clear and I have no desire to hang on to something that is dead. I still love my husband and if he has a change of heart I will work towards making my marriage the best it has ever been. I have changed so much in the last 10 weeks or so- so even if my marriage doesn't make it, I'm so thankful for all this mess that actually got me to change for the better. I'll just be a better wife for my next husband.

 

One thing i have learnt is that dont believe anything the other is saying. I agree 100 percent that the time away changes yourself. Makes you realize that you do not need the other person. Basically puts you in the same boat of the person that left.

[habs53]

Morning everyone.

 

I actually like the 180 exactly as it is written and think it works well with my situation (except I don't go out-I prefer to be home with the kids). Although we live together still, it is only due to financial reasons. If my husband could have moved out he would have. I've only been doing this for about 3 weeks. He said he needed space- the 180 gives lots of space

 

Our marriage is quite nice now, we are like roomates. We don't fight or argue- we even watch TV together every night. We don't go out as a family though- if we do things with the kids it is separate.

 

I am doing this for me and only me. I've been married since I was 19 so I'm trying to gain my autonomy at 30 and I think I'm doing well, except at nights when I get a bit sad and scared, but I'm fine once I'm up and moving around. My hope is by the time we actually separate physically I will have detached for long enough that it isn't this life shattering event. I have one more year left in my masters program so I'm trying to mentally prepare for the worst so I can keep it together.

 

Right now I can accomplish all 34 of the items without any difficulty except for wanting a darn hug- but my youngest son gives me all the hugs and kisses I ask for and he's a lot cuter than my husband haha

If he didnt want to be there he would be gone. Money would not be an issue. Just ask my wife. I figured her financial situation for last month and she was actually 300 bucks in the hole. Thats not including anything she may have bought for her apt or clothes and stuff. Within 6 months she will be screwed.

[wrencn]

One thing i have learnt is that dont believe anything the other is saying.

I am inclined to agree with this because this isn't the first time my husband has said he wanted a divorce, but it is the first time he has told his family, although he had to because he was supposed to fly down to see them but couldn't because I couldn't watch the kids.

 

long story short-he tried to push me out of his truck, I slapped him in the mouth, tooth cut lip, he called cops, I got arrested for assault and had a 15 day protection order against me, his push didn't leave a mark so he doesn't get in trouble- I love the justice system-this all happened the day I found out he was having an EA with a girl at work who he tried to say was just a friend) He tried to use the law to get me put out of my home the easy way- but the judge told him he couldn't get a two year protection order for something so minor.

 

I know my husband is going through something right now, so making me the villain justifies all these feelings he has for this other girl- the letter was brutal. He said I was mentally unable to hold a job - because I'm a student in gradschool and before that I was a SAHM, now he holds it against me- although we met in the military- he said in the past that I didn't have to work unless I wanted to. He works for the federal government, but he acts like there are tons of jobs out there to be had.

 

The thing is, he said he hated being around me and wanted space- I say fine, but for the last 3 weeks, he's always around me and when I take the kids somewhere without him he makes comments like "I didn't know where y'all were." He tells me when he's going to the store, he watches movies like "Sweet Home Alabama" and "The Family Man" on Netflix on his own. I just don't know. All I can do is keep living my life like my marriage is over and done with, but this living situation makes it hard.

[What_Next]

wrencn that is a truely horrible situation to be in. I can tell you that if it is completely over and it definitely seems like it is, then the 180 is only a portion of what you need to be doing. You need to make a plan for the rest of your life, and your children. Living together under the same roof like this will eventually lead nowhere.

 

In fact it might lead somewhere you simply do not want to go. You've made up your mind, so I would be looking forward. Changing yourself is a REALLY positive step. I can empathize; I've been there, in fact I am there. However, I also realized that I MUST plan for the possibility that our marriage does not survive. I have done that and it allows me to at least keep focused on the "new" me.

[wrencn]

wrencn that is a truely horrible situation to be in. I can tell you that if it is completely over and it definitely seems like it is, then the 180 is only a portion of what you need to be doing. You need to make a plan for the rest of your life, and your children. Living together under the same roof like this will eventually lead nowhere.

 

In fact it might lead somewhere you simply do not want to go. You've made up your mind, so I would be looking forward. Changing yourself is a REALLY positive step. I can empathize; I've been there, in fact I am there. However, I also realized that I MUST plan for the possibility that our marriage does not survive. I have done that and it allows me to at least keep focused on the "new" me.

I've tried to make a plan but it is a bit impossible at the moment. My only plan is that I finish graduate school and find a job. I have to bite the bullet and live with him while he pays down the debt we have accumulated over the last 11 years (he has agreed to do that). We live in Virginia because he got a job here, I don't have any friends or family here for support. Luckily we won't argue over the community property- we are being civil in that respect. We get along great right now- just living as roommates- and that will have to do for the moment.

 

I will never again place all my trust in a man, I should have been putting money aside all these years but I was young and stupid. This damn recession is killing me- I graduated in August 2008 with a degree in Business (real estate & land development) lol- worthless. Now I'm getting my masters in urban and regional planning but cities and the state of Va are so broke right now they are cutting positions and having hiring freezes. I'm actually considering going back into the army- which I don't want but I may have no choice.

[Gunny376]

I've tried to make a plan but it is a bit impossible at the moment. My only plan is that I finish graduate school and find a job. I have to bite the bullet and live with him while he pays down the debt we have accumulated over the last 11 years (he has agreed to do that). We live in Virginia because he got a job here, I don't have any friends or family here for support. Luckily we won't argue over the community property- we are being civil in that respect. We get along great right now- just living as roommates- and that will have to do for the moment.

 

I will never again place all my trust in a man, I should have been putting money aside all these years but I was young and stupid. This damn recession is killing me- I graduated in August 2008 with a degree in Business (real estate & land development) lol- worthless. Now I'm getting my masters in urban and regional planning but cities and the state of Va are so broke right now they are cutting positions and having hiring freezes. I'm actually considering going back into the army- which I don't want but I may have no choice.

 

I come from a long line of poor white people (aka poor white trash) here in Alabama. Few of my Aunts and Uncles graduated HS, most made it through and working for the military in one form or the other. Either outright making careers in the military or working for military contractors)

 

Some of the their off-spring ~ aka my first cousins graduated HS ~although not many.

 

I didn't realize it at the time but my doing 20 years + in tha' Marine Corps was the smartest thing this poor boy ever did.

 

Damn glad I did it! Damn proud I did and made it over 20+ years and just as damn glad its over.

 

I live in rural LA (Lower Alabama) which has time and time again been listed as one of the best possible places to retire (low property taxes, state income taxes, housing costs, rental costs etc ~ you can rent a two bedroom apartment for around $300 a month if you shop around)

 

I'm four to six months out from being completely out of debt (aside from my student loan) and being able to live off of my military retirement (mind you that's covering the basics ~ no thrills or frills)

 

But with my military retirement, and a minimum wage job? I'm still earning more and/or the equivalent of the medium average family income here in Alabama.

 

With Delta Dental and Tricare Prime Medical insurance I have a $12 co-pay per visit, and a $3 co-pay medications that I have to pay for. My premiums for medical are $19.00 a month.

 

I can buy name brand groceries 30% cheaper at the commissary than I can at WalMart. With no sales tax.

 

I live in a university town ~ and I know of plenty of people with college degrees working jobs they could have gotten without having gone to college.

 

Here in Alabama its more about who you know, the family you were married into and/or born into than what you know? Or how much education or degree you hold?

 

That's true for the better part of America.

 

Hindsight being what it is ~ I would have never gotten married ~ nor had children. I would have lived, breathed, dreamed of, 24/7/365 the Marine Corps.

 

I have two children ~ a son and a daughter ~ their mother has done any and everything she could and can to estranged me from them. My having been deployed the last four years of my career than all the other sixteen combined didn't help,

 

I screwed up and "re-bounded" with a woman that was "re-bounding" out a ten year marriage. Got tangled up in that for six and half years.

 

To quote Chris Rock ~ "Relationships? Easy to get into, can be hard to maintain, and even harder to get out of?"

 

I'm not even "studying" women ~ forget that!

 

I'm working on ME!

 

Becoming the best "Me" that I can be.

 

Becoming the best "Me" that I can be! Becoming self autonomous, self validating, self supporting, self sufficient.

 

Its been a "mother-trucker" for sure and certain ~ but I'm getting there!

[wrencn]

Gunny I don't think I could put 20 active years in, I would be able to handle the constant deployment and I also can't imagine marrying another soldier haha but I might use it to get back on my feet and out from under my husband.

 

 

---------------------

 

I found lice shampoo in the bathroom hidden. Not for me or my kids. How does a grown man get lice or maybe he has crabs- ugh. I haven't initiated conversation and I'm not going to. I'm staying out of the rooms he's in. I just don't want to deal with this man anymore.