Wife says she doesn't know if she wants to stay

[Chuck66]

I hope this isn't foul. But I have been posting my thoughts/grievances on another site. I'd like to tell my story here but don't want to re-type the whole darn thing. Here is the url.

 

 

http://fortysixty.invisionzone.com/index.php?showtopic=9328&st=0

 

Just give me your opinion on what my options or just clarify what is happening to me and I will greatly appreciate it.

 

Chuck

[habs53]

I hope this isn't foul. But I have been posting my thoughts/grievances on another site. I'd like to tell my story here but don't want to re-type the whole darn thing. Here is the url.

 

 

http://fortysixty.invisionzone.com/index.php?showtopic=9328&st=0

 

Just give me your opinion on what my options or just clarify what is happening to me and I will greatly appreciate it.

 

Chuck

Hey, our stories are very similar. New clothes, everything. Read the tread by whats next. Follow those footsteps.

Edited July 3, 2010 by habs53

[hopesndreams]

You've suffered long enough.

 

Pack her bags.

[spriggig]

Copy and paste:

 

I am the 44 year old H been married for 21 years on June 16, also my B'day, still waiting for my present :>( We have twin 6 year olds; Zoey and William. I just retired from the Air Force and gave my 39 year old W a 1966 Chevy Corvair (that she always wanted) during the retirement ceremony and told her because of all the times I uprooted her and her career as we moved around the world. I owe her everything I am to her support. We moved into a new retirement home. The past few months she goes to work earlier stays later, works weekends to. She bought new clothes daily, wears them, takes them back to the stores. She said she had not time for family because work is so hectic but took 2 hour lunches (every single day) to buy the clothes, new underwear, push up bras, etc. Told her mom that work isn't as busy as she lets on and that its an escape from kids/husband. Uses the store as her personal closet and can buy the most expensive stuff knowing that she is going to return the items. She detached from the kids. Zoey made a picture for her at school and mom through her picture in the trash. Zoeu asked why she did that since she worked so hard on it with her mom replied oh well. Mom is a calorie restricter. A step up from being anorexic. She takes in about 700 -1000 calories a day. Never eats breakfast. Bag of chips for lunch. A beer or wine cooler and nachos for supper (never with the family) every night. Been doing this for weeks. Bleach blond hair and tans constantly. New clothes show more skin. Last outfit is called Baby doll and looks like dance club wear. She has an accounting degree and is in charge of all the finances for an enterprise that owns apartment complexes, a truck stop, daycare, a bar etc. She works upstairs at the truck stop down the hall from the bar. Got a work phone (prepaid tracfone). I thought the bar manager was the OM since he taught her how to play the guitar at work. She showed an interest in April and I bought her one. She practiced every night at home and has gotten pretty good. There were rumors about her and him and I may have jumped the gun on overtly snooping. She plays Bob Dylan songs night and day and this guy loves Dylan. Named his son Dylan and did an article about his love for Dylan in the local newspaper. She says 100% that they are not seeing each other. She took to many headache pills last week and I took her into the ER and they gave her fluids for 3 hours and handed her pills back to her and told her to be more careful. I got the I dont need any many or anyone speech and its not about you its about me. She said she had looked up apartments online at one time. Went for our first MC and he said we both need individual counseling before he will try MC. Her parents wanted to me to relay a message to her which was they retired to the same town as us to be a happy family. they don't like the changes in her or how she treats her children ad then are sick of it and placing their hoe up for sale so they don't have to watch any more. Nothing seemed to effect my W except that comment and she declared "Thats it! I am DONE!" She points at me and says you can have the house and the money I just want two pieces of furniture and I am through. I said you say things that you dont mean. She screams "I GUARANTEE IT"! The counseling did get us both to schedule for individual counselling with other people and he said if you attend you do and if you dont thats each of your call too. Her first appointment is 12 July. I have been going overboard and have done some scorched earth this week. Told her she wants out to go get her apartment. She can tan when she wants, wear as little clothes to work as she wants, work as much as she wants, and then her kids and I wont be ignored to. I talked with a lawyer who said he sees 100's of these and they just drag on and to just cut the losses now. Then he said he is not a counselor. Said he could draw up legal separation papers and then its my decision if I want to take her back and I have leverage because its my choice. I ignored her phone calls all day yesterday and sent her a few emails that stated working 10 hour days and weekends, being mean to the kids, and looking like a girl on spring break are all issues. She said she would try with the kids. For the first time in weeks she tucked them into bed and even talked to them. I have been a single parent in this marriage. Get them up and dresses, give them baths, read stories every night. She has been void/absent. Well she reconnected with the kids last night for the first night in weeks but ignored me all night. I told her that picking one are to try in will not work. Being nice to the kids will not help if we are not treating each other nicely. We can't act that way toward each other in front of the kids. It just wont work. I said I thinks its still best that you get your own place. What is going on inside of you I can't fix and you need to work out yourself. You said you don't need a man or anyone right now. You said you have had enough and want out. I am helping you make it happen. This morning she left 30 minutes later than usual, go the kids up and dressed. Gave them breakfast for the first time in weeks. Made their beds and our bed while I was in the shower. Gave me a small kiss and said she would call me this afternoon and then left for work. Our sex life has always been low. 3x per month for most the 21 years. She has never been an affectionate person, if I hold her hand or put my arm around her she is okay with that but she NEVER initiates either affection nor Sex...and I mean never. She says its been awhile lets do it tonight is how she goes about telling me she wants sex but its always hours in advance and never initiated through action. My self esteem has always been low in this relationship and it has taken a toll for the worst. The day she said she had enough and wanted out I went down and had plastic surgery on my face. I am still recovering from a nose job and a chin implant. My thought process was that I was never happy with my nose and was going to talk to her about the expense. When she said I could have all the money then I did not need to ask her for permission to use our money for the surgery. Even if things don't work out with her and I I will have some elf confidence with a nose I like for the next woman. is also what I was thinking. I had to get her parents to take me and pick me up from surgery. I still have a taped nose and a numb lip right now. So that's where we stand. Her parents called her 100 times yesterday to tell her to try. And then they called me and told me to stop pushing her to her own apartment and that they cant believe I gave up so fast. I told them its an internal problem with her that I cant fix and until that is resolved the marriage fixes will never take hold. any advice on this sitch?

 

Chuck

[spriggig]

I think she's going through a Mid-Life Crisis.

 

I think she's cheating with Dylan's dad or at least really wants to, he may be holding her off.

 

I think she should move out and you should initiate strict LC (Limited Contact). LC might turn her around, but probably not. Most likely she'll find someone to have an affair with, maybe Dylan's dad.

 

In the very likely event that she cheats when she moves out, file for divorce immediately. You're absolutely right, she's broken and only she can choose to get help to fix herself. She's not ready to do that yet.

 

I think your marriage is much farther gone than What_Next's was when he started here. But you can hope, if you want to.

 

I'm going through a divorce with a cheating wife and we have one son together. I feel for your kids, this will be hard on them, but such an unhappy marriage is no better for them than divorce, and at least you all can start getting some sleep again.

[Steadfast]

The life she wants does not include you...well, the life she *thinks* she wants anyway. That'll change. She has another man on her mind and that puts you in a bad place. Everything will hurt now, no matter what is decided but waiting around for her to decide isn't the best thing for you and your kids. Your lawyer is right; being kept in limbo (or being a safety net) is cruel and unfair. Like can be unfair, but you do have a say in this. Right now, she's calling the shots. Time to find your balls, reattach them and get on with your business. Old saying; if she loved you, she'd be there. She isn't. Say goodbye.

[MR2U]

You must read Love must be tough by Dobson. It talks about EXACTLY this thing.

[Chuck66]

I will read Dobson. I am half way through What_Next's posts. I think I may have messed up either an EA or a PA with Jack (Dylan's dad). My snitch says ever since I confronted Jack's girlfriend W has no longer taken 2 hours lunches like clock work. W's menstrual cycle has been messed up since her procedure in Oct and she takes b/c pills. She takes all the pills except the week placebo ones. Instead she opens a new pack and starts on them always skipping the last week. She has had extra periods each month and she has this thing about no sex during that tie so that hurts the chances of a PA but it is still possible. She still calls me from work. She still says I love you after I leave a pause before hanging up. I still get a grandma kiss on the lips and a hug when she leaves for work.

 

Today she went to the store and bought a $60 hand-vac and cleaned the whole house. She worked several hours putting things away and doing everyone's laundry. So I am thinking this new domestic nesting is a good sign. Out of the blue she asks how much money do we have? I tell her $100k in a thrift savings plan and $80k in money market account. She says she didn't know because she didn't have access to either account...which is true. She has access to our joint credit card with her 31 separate clothing store purchases/returns in June alone. Because she returns things she is in the hole only a $100-200 so its not like she is running up debt. She also has access to our joint checking account with $10k in it. I figure her lawyer asked her about the finances. She said she never talked with one but her work snitch said he called and she talked behind closed doors for an hour. That is the only provable lie I've got her on. I know she is lying about other things but damn if she isn't the best person at covering her tracks. When she closes her door at work she even turns the radio on so no one can overhear.

 

I digress. She nests...I'm happy. She brings up accounts. I'm sad but don't let it show. We have the first sit down meal as a family in weeks and talk to the kids but not each other unless its chit chat..."did you want the last piece of pizza" that kind of crap. Her family comes over and I shoot off $125 worth of fireworks and the neighbor shoots of a bigger display at the same time a W proclaims they are facing the wrong direction for the good fireworks. I'm mad again but its dark no one knows.

 

We get the kids to be and she asks if I'm getting on the computer of coming to bed. I said coming to bed. I lay next to her for a half hour in the dark and nothing is said. No happy 4th...I know its a day early but she could say something. No goodnight no nothing.. I get up and get on the computer to type this.

 

Mixed signals: She buys a vac and cleans the house she proposes to give up to move into an apartment.

 

Bad note. I went out to mow the yard for 2 hours while she cleaned house. I left a piece of note paper with two suspicious calls on her cell. A missed call by someone at 6:02 am and she called that number back a few minutes later! I left that out and she new I was snooping. She cleaned the entire room. No clutter whatsoever but she left that piece of paper right where I left it. She never mentioned it. I know it breaks the 180's rules to snoop but old habits die hard.

 

Proof of OM would make all of this easier. Should I just go to the dude and say "what is up"? The guy cheated on his wife in 2004 and they divorced same year. He has two boys one in HS and one in college. He cheated on his wife with his current biker chick girlfriend. W still proclaims no OM either EA or PA and snitch says they just say hey to each other at work and do not have any extended looks or talks.

 

She still acts the part. High heels Friday and laid out and tanned today. She is back to playing the guitar but I told her how I'm a little touchy with Dylan songs right now. All the songs she played were current Rob Thomas songs...so I do appreciate her changing her song-list for me.

 

I'm off to read the rest of the previously mentioned forums.

 

Chuck

[tojaz]

Chuck, I'll be honest. Its late, I'm beat but I can see your hurting.

 

I think it stems from the life she has lead to this point. She was a wife at 18 and to a military man at that. That is a lot of responsibility to undertake (see some of Gunnys views on the military wife) she has spent the last 21 years keeping the homefires burning and is wondering what is left besides being a wife and a mother. Shes looking for HER!

 

I will be blunt and say that from what you have shared so far, it does not sound very promising at this point, but she is still there and that means a lot.

 

I think what she will need most from you is support. You had said that you owed everything to her support over the years, well look at it as a way of repaying that debt. Encourage some of her new interests, become part of her life rather then just her being an accessory to yours (that sounds harsh but thats kind of the mindset you need to be in) The material isn't going to do that, that Corvair amounts to nothing more then a bribe right now (once again harsh and i understand how it was intended)

 

Listen to her guitar playing, maybe encourage her to join a band if she has the chops. Let her find ways to define herself and be there to support her from the sidelines.

 

Thats my take at this late hour, hope it does some good, there are many threads here that share stories like yours, including my own. You have a lot to learn and your way behind.

 

Good luck and keep posting.

 

TOJAZ

[Chuck66]

Difference between Gunny and I is that he deployed all of and was in combat. My Air Force career very different. Was in the states 18 of my 20 years and did one year in Korea and one year in Japan and I took the twins/wife to both countries. I never left her home and went overseas. We are extremely pampered compared to Gunny. Even worse, I am a prior-enlisted officer. I went to the dark side and became an officer and tried my darnedest not to become a snob.

 

I am seeing a trend with the same story on here. I guess the biggest difference is each spouse who is unsatisfied is their own person and no one knows how any of these techniques will work. And the car was given before I heard the rumor about her and the co-worker that got me up to her work that started this whole "It's not you, it's me" and "I think I may move out" routine. It is late and I have to stain a concrete patio before heading off to a St Louis Cardinal game. I asked W Friday and today if she is going to the game to which she hasn't made up her mind. Nice of me to be in the lurch for the last ticket when she decides not to go....can't even invite a neighbor kid that way.

 

Chuck

[whichwayisup]

If you really want to know, hire a PI or ask a trusted friend that she doesn't know or wouldn't recognize, to follow her. You already know she's up to no good, cleaning up and hiding stuff from you.. Her actions scream of it.

 

Be tough and let her know you WON'T put up with it. She can stay, go to marriage counselling with you and end whatever it is that is going on with the OM, or she can move out and you two can divorce, then she can go off and do whatever she pleases.

 

Sorry for your pain.

[Eye of Hourus]

Chuck, I read your thread on the MLC board and noted that your snitch never reported closed door meetings with the bar dude but, that she had a long closed door meeting with the company lawyer.

 

It has been my experience that the company finance and legal depts. usually have frequent contact. I would look a little more closley at the lawyer.

[Gunny376]

Be for warned~ my spelling / typing may be a little off as I've seriously damaged my left index finger ~ and I', left handed to boot.......

 

That being said, its sounds as though you've got a mixture of MLC ~ (Mid-life Crisis) and "Attention Syndrome"

 

You don't hear too much about men having eating disorders? But you hear about them all the time with women.

 

The worse case I've seen was in a woman who was a HBX10 (Hot Babe X's 10) back in the day, and forty years later ~ forty years of marriage and three sons later was out scrogging any and everything that she could find.

 

That's a lot of what being a "Cougar" ~ a lack of self esteem and self validation ~ is about. They (The so-called "Cougars" need outward validation.

 

This is also akin to "I've got the ***** ~ so I make the rules! That's only true if you've got some fool of man that subscribes to such.

 

Take a 'fool's advice" if she doesn't care about you, the money and the kids? You can't bail out fast enough.

 

IOW's? "Run Forrest run!"

 

As described by you? She doesn't care about the money ~ means she doesn't want half of your retirement, cares less about commissary, PX, MWR, Space-A benefits, Delta Dental, TriCare Prime. (Trust me ~ Tricare Prime alone is enough reason to do twenty in the military)

 

Bail and get the Hell out of this marriage ASAP! You can always re-marry her later once she's got a dose of the the "real world"

 

Except ~ with a pre-nump agreement that your military retirement and such (along with other things) are hands off.

 

I say that with qualification. In some states pre-nups don't hold the light of day ~ in that one cannot "sign away" their rights ( most commonly no fault states)

 

The "Difference" between the four branches of Military Service hinges on the word "secure"

 

When the Marines are told to "secure" a building? They call in Naval gunfire, artillery, air support, gun-ships, drones. ~ assault the building ~ kill everyone in the building, bulldoze and raze the building and salt the Earth so nothing will ever grow there again.

 

When the Army is told to secure a building? They fill sandbags around the place, put up razor wire and claymore mines and post a guard?

 

When the Navy is told to secure a building? The close and lock all of the windows, doors and secure the safe and go to the club to have a beer?

 

When the Air Force is told to secure a building?

 

They take out a five year lease with an option to buy?

 

Just kidding there are some serious Billy-Bad-@zzess in the USAF. Forward Combat Air Controllers, Para Rescue personal. Kid yourself not?

 

Ditto with and for the United States Coast Guard.

Edited July 4, 2010 by Gunny376

[Gunny376]

I've seen that some have posted since my last post.

 

Children first and foremost.

 

Securing your retirement and financial security first.

 

Women get full custody of the the children 90% of the time ~ the primary reason being that men don't seek custody ~ but of the 10% of the fathers that do seek full custody? They get it 90% of the time.

 

Per your initial post? Your the more stable and responsible parent.

 

Your spouse ~ like mine ~ dominates the benefits of military and retirement. It cost me $6.45 per child ~ per birth compared to the thousands of dollars it cost civilians to have a child in a civilian hospital.

 

Buying name-brand groceries 30% less than at WalMart without sale taxes at the Commissary.

 

My monthly medical premium is $19.72 a month compared to $475 after tax for Blue Cross/Blue Shield at where I currently work. My co-pay is $12 per doctor's visit.

 

With you and your children alone? Where I currently work at? You premium would be around $800 a month after tax. With TriCare Prime? $66 a month.

 

With Delta Dental? The receptionist looks at me and have the expression of "What?" I've yet to pay anything out of pocket.

 

I've one prescription that cost $137 a month! I pay $3 out of pocket.

 

The nut I've got to crack each month over and above my military retirement is around $300.

 

To sum it up? You can't get rid of her fast enough, (Mine you I'm retired enlisted ~ and your a retired commissioned officer? )

[tojaz]

Difference between Gunny and I is that he deployed all of and was in combat. My Air Force career very different. Was in the states 18 of my 20 years and did one year in Korea and one year in Japan and I took the twins/wife to both countries. I never left her home and went overseas. We are extremely pampered compared to Gunny. Even worse, I am a prior-enlisted officer. I went to the dark side and became an officer and tried my darnedest not to become a snob.

 

I am seeing a trend with the same story on here. I guess the biggest difference is each spouse who is unsatisfied is their own person and no one knows how any of these techniques will work. And the car was given before I heard the rumor about her and the co-worker that got me up to her work that started this whole "It's not you, it's me" and "I think I may move out" routine. It is late and I have to stain a concrete patio before heading off to a St Louis Cardinal game. I asked W Friday and today if she is going to the game to which she hasn't made up her mind. Nice of me to be in the lurch for the last ticket when she decides not to go....can't even invite a neighbor kid that way.

 

Chuck

 

Has little to do with the physical Chuck, she was supporting you in your career be it stateside or otherwise. Facts you will find have little place in this, it is more about her perception and how she sees her life. Same with the car, I have no doubt that it was given with the best of intentions.

 

TOJAZ

[Chuck66]

I know you're right.

 

 

Tonight's update:

 

I'm almost ready for it to be done. It may have been one big power play to get me to notice her unhappiness.

 

Still re connected with the kids is shocking. She never even went in the 6 year olds room for 2 or 3 weeks. Tonight she played several games with each. She let them come into her sanctuary office and watch her play the guitar. She made them supper. She bought a $60 had-vac for this house that wont be used if we will have to sell if divorced or if she moves into an apartment. I cleaned out the entire garage now both her cars fit in it and mine sits outside. She is nesting but just barely speaking to me. Still says love you at then end of each phone call... I had my home builder drive by the possible OM's house while I was in St Louis. Said he saw nothing. Still would like to try the key. This is the key that fell out of her purse when I dumped it after her over-dose. When I aksed what the key wnet ot she said she didnt know. I've been wanting to use it on the OM house but I have freind on the police force that say that is not a good idea. It's not like I want to go in I just want to see if it works.

 

Additonally, I may use a GPS tracker. A Cheap one doesn't show real time and you have to retrieve them every night and download the days driving onto your desktop computer every single night then reload the GPS back into the card.. without it being seeing...usually in the trunk.

 

It may very well be over. She seems more relaxed since I told her I told my attorney I didn't not want any paperwork drawn up for either a legal separation or a divorce until she can go to counseling. 21 years of marriage I owe her the benefit of the doubt for a week or so. Those comments seemed to have relaxed her. I have slowly started to change my mind on drafting the D paperwork up.

 

She waited until the last 10 minutes before the baseball game and said she wasnt going. I said if she would have told me sooner I wouldn;t have to waste a ticket and could have taken our nephew or someone else. She said she just felt ill but may go to her mom's in an hour.

 

3 Hours later I called her mom from the game who said she never made it and went to work instead but she was still going to go over the a 3 pm.

 

I call wife at her work and say I thought you were going to your moms in an hour. She said no I said work then mom's at 3pm. I said you never said work. I also said we need to write all this down because it keeps changing.

 

We left the game after the 7th inning and got back at 5 pm and her dad called. I happened to be close and asked do you want to see the grandkids. He said sure. I drive up and W is there and has been there since 3 pm. Her dad never mentioned she was there. I tell everyone there hi except her and after an hour she tells everyone there (an aunt was there too) goodbye except me.

 

I'm about ready to take off the ring and place it on our dresser.

 

PA would quickly stop me from being wishy-washy.

[Chuck66]

whichwayisup,

She is either the best cover up agent in the business or there is the possibility that she is actually telling the truth and this guy was just in the wrong place at the wrong time. If not, then she has NO REMORSE/GUILT. For she still plays the guitar that this guy taught her...albeit without any more Dylan songs...thank god. She has backed off a little on the most provocative clothes. Tanned yesterday. So if she was seeing an OM and it was called out by these rumors you'd think she tone it down a lot...I never accused her of having an affair. I did ask about PA and EA since a rumor from her work got back to me. but her vanity has only come down a smidge. She always says its for herself and no one else. With her calorie restricting I never know what to believe about her self esteem. My snitch said the OM and her were never behind closed doors ever that she saw. Even the 2 or 3 lessons they left the door open. This guy did take her to lunch because he wanted a job offer that W had placed for a different department. The constant 2 hour lunches could very well be clothes only shopping which is ALL over town. And she has told me on several occasions she has always had a low libido and has never really shown anyone much affection...that's how I've always been...I'm just not touchy-feely she says. In April she gave me a card stating that she knows she doesn't tell me and show me she loves me enough.

 

Eye of Hourus,

Definitely not the company lawyer. He is 60 and when he CALLED, my W got up closed the door and turned up the music for an hour. I think she has been onto my snitch for awhile but other than blocking eavesdropping I am aware f work-times and lunch hours.

 

 

Gunny376,

Tell me more about attention syndrome? Today was out of this world for her menu. She ate eggs for breakfast. First breakfast I've seen her eat in 3 months!!! Lunch was not potato chis but chicken wings at her moms house. She ate pizza and a salad last night WITH the family!!! She usually eats by herself EVERY night. While all of those changes are occurring she still has 3 words for me all day. And no good night. etc and we still sleep in the same bed. For 2 years now she places a pillow between us on our king size bed and always falls asleep facing away from me. That has been going on for quite a while and still continues.

 

Can't see my W as a Cougar scroggin anything and everything. Aunt Flo is back again tonight. Seems to be here 3 out of ever 4 weeks every month!! My W does not like sex during this time. I still say this would make a PA harder but not impossible for her.

 

Oh she cares about the money. I think she just said that to lash back at her parents who said they were moving because they did not like the changes they have seen in her or how she treats the kids...both statements that would bode well for me at a custody hearing.

 

Nearest Air Force base is 100 miles away. Tricare Prime ($400+ annual premiums) locks us into a PCM 75 miles away in a little town no one goes to. Tricare Standard (similar to Champus) has no premium and lets me pick an doctor locally and we can still use the family doctor we have but have to pay 20% of all bills.

 

Her salary and my retirement pay are close enough. I have been seeing a Dr about depression for over a year for a non marriage related reason. I applied for disability and will find out in Aug if I get one or not. Should get something since I have sleep apnea and have a CPAP machine. But disability is not usually touched in a divorce but retirement pay is. I have a job offer end of June to teach an online course for $10k per year. Retirement, with disability, with the part time teach from home might make it possible for me to afford the home (and be able to raise two kids without having to put them in before and after school programs/summer school too and picking them up at 6 pm like current W is doing) after she gets all the cash from e having to buy her out of her half of the property. We shall see. Or this whole thing is a cruel power play joke for me to pay more attention to her and reconnect with her in a more emotional way...Then again I may just me in OZ.

 

BTW,

My father got custody of me in 1972 while he was in the Air Force. Additionally he got custody of my brother and two sisters that were from my mom's previous marriage and were no blood relation to my dad. They had to prove my mom as unfit and they did it and all my brothers and sisters said they wanted to live with their step dad instead of their real mom. So I have had a life long role model on how to raise kids as a single father.

 

And yes I know the Air Force is the wussiest service....but that's also why I joined it....that and my dad did it for 20 years.

 

 

I think she is trying hard to reconnect with the kids. She is starting to have interest in our new home. And she is cruise control with me and not starting fights nor wanting any movement on improving communication. I think she thinks the IC will be some kind of a-ha moment. We've had disagreements in the past where we haven't talked to each other for days.... This is actually not that difficult for us. Kids sure like having their mom back.

 

What a rambling mess I wrote tonight.

Chuck

Edited July 5, 2010 by Chuck66

[Gunny376]

First off the TriCare issue. I live in a town that is a University town, and forty miles either direction of any other town.

 

Thus I am also forty miles or so from the nearest military base. I was Tricare Extra. The difference between TriCare Standard and Extra is that with Extra your seeing a Dr. that has agreed to take TriCare patients and accept TriCare payment schedules for services rendered.

 

In essence its pretty much like Medicare, in which you pay 20% and TriCare Extra pays 80% for the agreed upon fees (as agreed upon by the Dr. in question and Tricare) You can cover the difference by purchasing a "supplemental" insurance to cover your 20%.

 

With TriCare Standard there are higher out of pocket expenses than with TriCare Extra.

 

I've just recently switched to TriCare Prime with monthly premiums of $19.72 a month, and $12 co pays for office visits, $11 a day co-pay if admitted to the hospital.

 

For family coverage under TriCare Prime you would have to pay premiums of about $66 a month / $792 a year but your co-payments would be substantially less with an annual cap of out-of-pocket of no more than $3000 a year. (That is to say that your maximum out of pocket co-payments for any and all medical services would be no more than $3000 be it for hospital admissions, doctors visits, lab tests, etc ~ for the entire family)

 

Should it come down to divorce, I would offer at least a portion of your military retirement even if it wasn't more than 10% or less. That way she gets to keep her military dependent ID card, commissary privileges, PX, MWR privileges. (In so long as she doesn't remarry) along with being eligible for TriCare and Delta Dental.

 

In so far as TriCare and your PCP being 70 miles away, you need to travel to the nearest military facility and speak with a TriCare rep about what is the best plan for you and I'm willing to bet good money that its going to be TriCare Prime ~ you just need to find a Dr. closer to where you live that accepts TriCare patients ~ which many do because their the same as Medicare patients.

 

(Sidebar ~ what many Dr's do not accept are Medicaid patients which is why the so-called "Health Care Reform Act" is such a joke ~ because in order to get the 20 to 30 million so-called medically "uninsured" they're going to have to be placed on Medicaid, which is funded by the states themselves.)

 

Anyway getting back on track, I see the Dr of my choice here locally under TriCare Prime. I'm single, my Mother lives in Texas, my estranged children (Bitch of their Mother) live fifty miles away. I get sick I cannot be driving forty or fifty miles to see a Dr. (And neither can you should end up being single.

 

While we're talking about insurance ~ you didn't or haven't mentioned how long you've been retired. If its less than two years (there's a two year window I believe) run not walk to your nearest VA rep in your county, (there's one in every country in every state ~ most of them disabled Vets themselves ~ one of the preferences for getting the job in the first place) and have your SGLI converted to VGLI ~ your not going to get $200,000 + for less than twenty dollars a month anywhere. (One of the top stupidest things I ever done ~ but it wasn't explained properly to me to begin with)

 

Understand this and understand it well. The VA is just like the state employment office. There job is to disqualify and screen you out of and for your earned your benefits.

 

I don't know about other states? I don't know what all those people at the State Employment Office do? But I do know its not helping you find a job.

 

Another one of the top stupidest thing I've ever done (right up there with having married the XHEX) was to let the three year window lapse to becoming a JMCROTC instructor at a HS.

 

You basically draw you retirement pay, BAS, BAQ, and a teacher's salary without having to go to school to get a degree in educastion. Hell I did two tours on the drill field at Parris Island ~ Being a "Major Paine" to a bunch of snot-noze Marines want-abe's would a walk in the park? Plus you get a second State retirement.

 

Speaking of which, here in Alabama? If you get a state job of any kind, and contribute $20K to your state retirement account, you could potentially reitre from the State within five years. (Un-fortunately right now? Because of the Great Recession they're not hiring ~ except for correctional officers ~ and I'm too old,, (53) don't have the patience nor the time to go through another boot camp. ( I could pass the physcial fitness test ~ I just don't want to deal with the BS)

 

Even if the nearest local military base is sixty or seventy miles away? You need to invest in a couple of Coleman electric coolers, a frezzer. You know and I know we use to shop for groceries every two weeks ~ because we got paid every two weeks. (Aside from the occassional gallon of milk)

 

You can get groceries 30% without sales tax cheaper at the commissary than you can at ChinaMart.

 

With that said ~ gettting back to your problem at hand? AKA the wife?

I don't think she's having a EA or a PA? I think from what you've described is she's having a MLC and wanting the attention of other men finding her attractive ~ and that's it! She just wants to know as she's grown older, that she's still "got it"

 

That's a woman thing ~ and your never going to understand it as a man. She's wanting validation that she's still attractive and has what it takes to attract a man?

 

Doesn't mean she's out being a cougar (as way to many women do) ~ it just means she's an "attention hog"

 

After I retired from the Corps I visited an old HS friend thast I hadn't seen in years. (A woman BTW) Her 15-16 year old daughter was jumping and shouting with glee that she had caught the attention of a young buck?

 

"Someone cares about me?"

 

Having gone through it and been through it? I would care less about where she goes, who she goes with, what she does, or who she does it with?

 

That will get her to thinking about what your doing, with whom, and why isn't he calling me, checking up on me, asking about what I'm doing, and with whom.

 

Hell if it were me? I'd get to packing and boxing up her stuff! Pay down the deposit and first month's rent, even the first six month's rent, pay the deposit for the electrical, the gas, the water?

 

And then as I walked out the door I would tell her, "Root Hog or die" (A Southern expression for really, really hard times!)

 

A woman walks out on you? It means one thing and one thing only!

 

You've got to find yourself another woman!

 

And there's not a shortage of them by any measure!

 

A woman threatens to walk out on me? That's all well and good, but understand this and understand it well!

 

Once I hear the closing of the door?

 

There's no coming back!

 

Anything you've got to offer? I can find just as good as ~ if not better?

 

Anything you've got to give? I can find just as much if not more?

[Chuck66]

Good reading on all the military stuff. I will have to re-read that when I am not bleary eyed at 2 am.

 

That's a woman thing ~ and your never going to understand it as a man. She's wanting validation that she's still attractive and has what it takes to attract a man?

 

The strange thing about her dressing up is her working 55+ hours a eek in her own office. Her outer office is two girls and then her boss is at work only 50% of the time. There is a bar 50 feet down a hallway but it pens at 4 pm and 95% of the time when I call her after hours she is at her desk with silence in the background....The bar has a live band and I never hear it. I talked to her about dressing to get a man when she already has a man and she said she does it for herself.

 

On the cheating list she has a whole bunch of items. I'll delete the non applicable ones.

 

 

3) Your cheating husband or wife stops confiding in you and seeking advice from you.

 

4) Sets up a new e-mail account and doesn't tell you about it. Has wok email so this one counts!

 

5) He leaves the house in the morning smelling like Irish Spring and

returns in the evening smelling like Safeguard. No but there was 3 times when she came home and took a shower in the past 6 months. Hadn't seen hr do that before.

 

8) He sets up a separate cell phone account that is billed to his office. Gets her boss to agree to buy her a phone and pay for charges and SHE selects a prepay phone that does not have phone records.

 

14) He buys himself new underwear. No thongs but new bikinis and lot of bras to include push up and sequined hearts on the outside so it can be seen through thin tank tops.

 

20) He/she fairly suddenly stops having sex with you.

 

22) Supposedly works a lot of overtime, but it never shows up on the

pay stub. 7am until 6 pm. Some nights 8 pm. Weekends at least 4 hours Eight months ago at her work it was 7:30 -4:30 pm.

 

25) Shows a sudden interest in a different type of music. 1960-1970s with Bob Dylan. Learned how to play the guitar since April.

 

27) Has a sudden preoccupation with his or her appearance. That's and under statement. We used to have one shampoo and one conditioner in the shower. There are no less than 10 products in our shower now.

 

34) Your spouse seems less comfortable around you and is "touchy"

and easily moved to anger.

 

36) He/she loses attention in the activities in the home. Moved into new house 3rd week in May. She just went ape and put stuff away last weekend and yesterday for hours... otherwise this new home went untouched.

 

37) Your intuition (gut feeling) tells you that something is not right.

 

38) He/she has a definite change in attitude towards everyone in the

home. We did not exist. Now its just me who does not exist.

 

40) She has a "glow" about her.

 

41) Atypical erratic behavior.

 

43) She sleeps with her purse by the bed. YES...What the hell does this mean? I still check her cell phone but it moved from a certain spot and went to the floor next to her nightstand. I told her about it and it's back in the bedroom closet...and she knows I am still checking her calls.

 

44) She goes to the store for groceries and comes home 5 hours later.Makes excuses to get out of the house. I forgot this or that. I have to go to the pharmacy. Turns in two prescriptions on different days instead of taking them up both o the same day... Called up to her work one day and they said she had just left for lunch at 1100. I told her to call me back when she got in. She called me at 2pm and I asked how she was able to take a 3 hour lunch because she was supposed to be behind at work and would she have to work late...she said yes until 8 pm!!! I asked where she was. She said she had a bad day and just walked around the mall... My wife buys clothes EVERY single day. She didn't that day!

 

45) He tells you can get hold of him at a different telephone number.

Never set up her voice mail and just shuts phone off when not wanting to be disturbed.

 

46) He or She comes straight home and takes an immediate shower. 2x in past 6 months...very rare to do this.

 

47) Your spouse seems bored. Bored with you, with job, with kids, with hobbies, with life in general. Yes

 

49) Your spouse deletes the internet history and cookies on the computer to cover his or her tracks. Used to. I think she now uses her office at work as command central. I took her keys and went up there Feb 09 because she was wasting away. She is a calorie restrictor and eats about 400-700 calories per day. I found diet pills in her desk. A 5'8" woman weighing 105 lbs should not be taking diet pills.

 

50) Your spouse is indifferent to family events like birthdays and holidays. My anniversary card (16 June) is hidden in our closet unsigned and never given. My birthday present (same day) is in her trunk and she drives it to and from work everyday.

 

 

You'd pack her bags and sign a lease for her apartment...you enabler :>) I'd rather just hand her the D paperwork and tell her, "there's some attention!"

 

For years I've been bugging the low libido/non affectionate wife for just such a thing. I finally get off her azz the past couple of years and figure if thats the ind of person she is I guess I will have to accept it. She is still my est friend. We have fun together. We have great twins. she' a hard worker and we've saved out pennies for over 20 years and she is pretty darn frugal.. So knew that accepting your wife she would feel like, "you don;t love me anymore because you don't grope me and cling on me like a leach like I've been telling you all these years that I dislike. Sheesh!

 

I'm still on the fence about an EA or a PA. Her firewall will not let my key-logger attached to her CPU. I have sent that thing in word docs, zip files, you name it. Money wasted. Trying to figure out an inexpensive GPS tracker logger. One that you have to remove from the car each night and download where it has been that day. And still like to try the key that was in her purse that she does not know where it goes to... And if there was somehow to bypass the Windows login I could check her email. I know you can open it up as administrator and change the password but then when she logged on it would deny her access and the jug is up.

 

So you think she just wants attention?

 

Chuck

 

PS I am in Columbia, Mo a huge college town and Tricare Prime has NO doctors here!!! That is per the Tricare folks at Whiteman AFB 100+ miles away. And I retired 4 days ago.

[Gunny376]

Good reading on all the military stuff. I will have to re-read that when I am not bleary eyed at 2 am.

 

That's a woman thing ~ and your never going to understand it as a man. She's wanting validation that she's still attractive and has what it takes to attract a man?

 

The strange thing about her dressing up is her working 55+ hours a eek in her own office. Her outer office is two girls and then her boss is at work only 50% of the time. There is a bar 50 feet down a hallway but it pens at 4 pm and 95% of the time when I call her after hours she is at her desk with silence in the background....The bar has a live band and I never hear it. I talked to her about dressing to get a man when she already has a man and she said she does it for herself.

 

On the cheating list she has a whole bunch of items. I'll delete the non applicable ones.

 

 

3) Your cheating husband or wife stops confiding in you and seeking advice from you.

 

4) Sets up a new e-mail account and doesn't tell you about it. Has wok email so this one counts!

 

5) He leaves the house in the morning smelling like Irish Spring and

returns in the evening smelling like Safeguard. No but there was 3 times when she came home and took a shower in the past 6 months. Hadn't seen hr do that before.

 

8) He sets up a separate cell phone account that is billed to his office. Gets her boss to agree to buy her a phone and pay for charges and SHE selects a prepay phone that does not have phone records.

 

14) He buys himself new underwear. No thongs but new bikinis and lot of bras to include push up and sequined hearts on the outside so it can be seen through thin tank tops.

 

20) He/she fairly suddenly stops having sex with you.

 

22) Supposedly works a lot of overtime, but it never shows up on the

pay stub. 7am until 6 pm. Some nights 8 pm. Weekends at least 4 hours Eight months ago at her work it was 7:30 -4:30 pm.

 

25) Shows a sudden interest in a different type of music. 1960-1970s with Bob Dylan. Learned how to play the guitar since April.

 

27) Has a sudden preoccupation with his or her appearance. That's and under statement. We used to have one shampoo and one conditioner in the shower. There are no less than 10 products in our shower now.

 

34) Your spouse seems less comfortable around you and is "touchy"

and easily moved to anger.

 

36) He/she loses attention in the activities in the home. Moved into new house 3rd week in May. She just went ape and put stuff away last weekend and yesterday for hours... otherwise this new home went untouched.

 

37) Your intuition (gut feeling) tells you that something is not right.

 

38) He/she has a definite change in attitude towards everyone in the

home. We did not exist. Now its just me who does not exist.

 

40) She has a "glow" about her.

 

41) Atypical erratic behavior.

 

43) She sleeps with her purse by the bed. YES...What the hell does this mean? I still check her cell phone but it moved from a certain spot and went to the floor next to her nightstand. I told her about it and it's back in the bedroom closet...and she knows I am still checking her calls.

 

44) She goes to the store for groceries and comes home 5 hours later.Makes excuses to get out of the house. I forgot this or that. I have to go to the pharmacy. Turns in two prescriptions on different days instead of taking them up both o the same day... Called up to her work one day and they said she had just left for lunch at 1100. I told her to call me back when she got in. She called me at 2pm and I asked how she was able to take a 3 hour lunch because she was supposed to be behind at work and would she have to work late...she said yes until 8 pm!!! I asked where she was. She said she had a bad day and just walked around the mall... My wife buys clothes EVERY single day. She didn't that day!

 

45) He tells you can get hold of him at a different telephone number.

Never set up her voice mail and just shuts phone off when not wanting to be disturbed.

 

46) He or She comes straight home and takes an immediate shower. 2x in past 6 months...very rare to do this.

 

47) Your spouse seems bored. Bored with you, with job, with kids, with hobbies, with life in general. Yes

 

49) Your spouse deletes the internet history and cookies on the computer to cover his or her tracks. Used to. I think she now uses her office at work as command central. I took her keys and went up there Feb 09 because she was wasting away. She is a calorie restrictor and eats about 400-700 calories per day. I found diet pills in her desk. A 5'8" woman weighing 105 lbs should not be taking diet pills.

 

50) Your spouse is indifferent to family events like birthdays and holidays. My anniversary card (16 June) is hidden in our closet unsigned and never given. My birthday present (same day) is in her trunk and she drives it to and from work everyday.

 

 

You'd pack her bags and sign a lease for her apartment...you enabler :>) I'd rather just hand her the D paperwork and tell her, "there's some attention!"

 

For years I've been bugging the low libido/non affectionate wife for just such a thing. I finally get off her azz the past couple of years and figure if thats the ind of person she is I guess I will have to accept it. She is still my est friend. We have fun together. We have great twins. she' a hard worker and we've saved out pennies for over 20 years and she is pretty darn frugal.. So knew that accepting your wife she would feel like, "you don;t love me anymore because you don't grope me and cling on me like a leach like I've been telling you all these years that I dislike. Sheesh!

 

I'm still on the fence about an EA or a PA. Her firewall will not let my key-logger attached to her CPU. I have sent that thing in word docs, zip files, you name it. Money wasted. Trying to figure out an inexpensive GPS tracker logger. One that you have to remove from the car each night and download where it has been that day. And still like to try the key that was in her purse that she does not know where it goes to... And if there was somehow to bypass the Windows login I could check her email. I know you can open it up as administrator and change the password but then when she logged on it would deny her access and the jug is up.

 

So you think she just wants attention?

 

Chuck

 

PS I am in Columbia, Mo a huge college town and Tricare Prime has NO doctors here!!! That is per the Tricare folks at Whiteman AFB 100+ miles away. And I retired 4 days ago.

 

Back before the Internet, Cell Phones, Computers, DSL, keyloggers etc ~ I knew!

 

JUST LIKE YOU KNOW!

 

"Fourteeen Days since I don't know when"?

[Chuck66]

I really don't know! Some days I just want to go up to the guy and ask him?

 

A lot of my questions about her clothing she says has to do with summer. Also makes for a convenient excuse.

 

My grammar and spelling on the last posts are horrid...right down to the "jig" instead of the "jug" being up.

Edited July 5, 2010 by Chuck66

[What_Next]

Chuck, first off I am deeply sorry for what you are going through. I am going to take the tact of looking at differences and similiarities between our situations.

 

The first one that comes to light is the treatment of your children by your spouse. Simply unacceptable, no matter the circumstances. My wife NEVER EVER treated our daughter like that and if she did; honestly I'd have thrown her right out of the house. Yes that sounds blunt, but it is. MLC or not there is NEVER an excuse to treat young children like that. If it were me, above all else I'd call her out on that and say it ends TODAY. Yes she has made an effort as of late, but that does not change her past behavior.

 

I think like others here have said you have a combination of a walk away wife/MLC. Her behavior is pretty classic actually. In my case it I think it was a combination of both, but heavily influenced from the side of a walk away wife. You did not get into your level of compassion, affection, conversation in your marriage up to this point. Would you consider it warm and loving? Or is it is cold and distant. That has a MASSIVE impact on her state of mind. I know it did in my case and once I realized this I changed myself and will continue to.

 

You sound financially secure, at least reasonably so, therefore you have some more options than we did. First, we were pretty much stuck with living together. In your case it doesn't appear that way. Up to this point whenever she mentioned moving out have the children be discussed?

 

In your case doing a 180 may provide some change in her perspective but unless we can get inside the dynamic of the marriage history it would be hard to guess how effective it might be.

 

If I were in your shoes I might be tempted to suggest she does leave. Or if you are not ready for that, get seperate rooms and try and show her how life would be without you.

 

For the record I really feel her behavior seems to suggest an ongoing PA, although it might only be a EA at this point.

[Chuck66]

She has never been one to talk about her feelings or get all mushy as she calls it. She doesn't like to cuddle. She's tall and boney with very long arms its hard to get close to her without accidentally taking an elbow. Sometimes she likes me to rub or scratch her back softly for as long as I can on then once in awhile we spoon.

 

We have been best friends for 20 years. We have no friends. We don't invite anyone over. We just hang out with each other. We talk today but its only in the moment. Affection has never been great. I am very affectionate and she has complained in other MC's years ago that I am always there wantig to hold her or rub her back or hold hands and she says its constant and annoying. I have backed off that a lot over the years because I am tired o rejection. She always said love you/good night before we went to be and same in the mornings when we went to work and got home. Right now she is the only one initiating the I love you 's and they are still forth coming. The pauses are getting larger on the phones where she wants me to say I love you and I have been refusing so she says love you then I will then hang up. she has been initiated kisses before heading out anywhere right now too but they are grandma kind and I reciprocate but I never initiate since this mess has started. I told her if I find out there is an OM = D and she says there isn't one. And does not looked stressed about it. Compassion...I think right now we are in the "other person needs to suck it up" mode...not sure why we are there.

 

 

I keep seeing the WAW, or MLC, or do the 180's. How does anyone know what ingredients to use? I'm getting tired and still afraid of the OM unknown. I still just want to go ask the guy.

 

 

Your last sentence makes me nauseous!!!

Edited July 5, 2010 by Chuck66

[Gunny376]

IMH I think she's an "attention hog" and may perhaps be wrapped up in a EA and could even be a PA. Her low limbo with you could be because she's getting her 'needs' meet elsewhere ~ but you've stated this as being such over the last 21 years.

 

Women dress to "over-dress" and "out-dress" other women ~ its a competition as to has the best, most costliest, most 'in' current fashion in so much as they do to impress men.

 

A big 'red flag' would be new lingerie? That which only the most intimate of persons could see and appreciate. The coming home and heading straight for the shower would be another ~ I mean who does such other than working a hard labor job such as laying asphalt or construction?

 

As I said back before the Internet, key loggers, GPS trackers and such? I knew and even before such or having read anything on the subject told the XHEX that at the very least she was having an emotional affair ~ because in my gut I could sense the complete and total emotional withdrawal of affection (the pillow between the two of you sleeping in the same bed would be a Hugh 'red flag' marker)

 

Per my experience? I trust and depend upon no one except me, myself and I~ I depend upon no one except me myself and I!

 

Once your parents are gone? All you've got is yourself.

 

Thing to keep in mind?

 

Is that you've got more to offer your average typical woman? Than she's got to offer you!

 

I'm four to six months away from being able to live off of my military retirement ~ Kids are grown and on their own, I'm out of the child support, child rearing business, I've all the benefits and such from being on active duty in the military?

 

I've an easy "low stress ~ no stress" job with easy "low stress ~ no stress bosses and co-workers"

 

I'm making more money than I ever made in my life ~owe less~ and about to get completely out of debt (Save my student loan)

 

You know what? The World and everyone in it can just kiss my ever loving @zz!

 

I realize my last statement is rude and crude ~ but its true.

 

A woman leaves you ~ dumps you for another it means one thing and one thing only?

 

You've got to get off your dead @zz and find yourself someone else?

 

Damn the Bad Luck!

 

Personally I will probally never re-marry? I've got more to offer your typical woman than they have to offer me? You see my picture in the Sunday newspaper? That's one wedding you want to attend !

[Chuck66]

Hard to reconcile her being an attention hog. She doesn't flirt... I'm not even sure she knows how. Yes that is probably an understatement, but her personality is pretty low key. I miss her and I sleep in the same bed with her every night. But the attention probably does feel good. One of our mutual friends we ordered window coverings for the new house (W picked everything out) called me over to her desk and whispered in my ear that look 29. I told her that her husband was 40 feet away working the register but Thank you very much and said I hadn't had a compliment on my looks in months and months... Plastic surgery IS paying off I guess. Still not sure whose attention she's getting with new underwear or trimming habits. All new underwear bottoms are replacement ones. New bras are smaller cups since she has clamped down on the caloric counting and made it more restrictive. Not much boobs left. Zero on the lingerie. The showers she explained by saying she had a killer headache and thought that would distress her after work. I may never know if I was temporarily dumped for another man. With her still discussing an apartment it may not be temporary.

 

 

 

Either she thinks she is entitled and "it's her turn" in life to have what she wants or it may be an emotional affair to which she thinks as long as it' not physical it ain't cheating. She just seems pretty darn happy after someone said their is a rumor about you and a co-worker having sex. If your lover teaches you how to play the guitar do you keep playing it every night and invite your husband in to listen to the new song she learned. That is not likely the actions of a cheater...But I may be drowning in denial. Of course parent's are going side with their daughter which is what I said to her dad. I told him you have to trust her...what choice do you have?

The more she denies the more I will lack trust. I should just ask Jack. The night she had her overdose I dumped her purse and a key fell out. I asked her what the key went to and she said she couldn't remember. Do I try the key on Jack's door or not? The reason why its more important about knowing if she did or didn't because I am not trying to quell my curiosity, it is important because if there is an OM = a D for me..... The ball to stay in this relationship is not just in her court.

Edited July 5, 2010 by Chuck66