unconventional relationship

[vodkafan]

For those who are still interested, we are 6 weeks into this thing now. Everything is pretty relaxed now, it's working out fine.

[Distant78]

It may be working out for you now, but I this will not end beautifully.

[TaraMaiden]

That may not be so. It will end, that is for sure. But whether it can be described as beautifully or otherwise, only time will tell.

We cannot know, we can never predict the outcome of anything.......

[Distant78]

That may not be so. It will end, that is for sure. But whether it can be described as beautifully or otherwise, only time will tell.

We cannot know, we can never predict the outcome of anything.......

 

Yes, only time will tell and we can only hope this guy doesn't get hurt.

[crazycatlady]

Thanks for the update, Vodka.

 

If you don't mind some questions.....Feel free to answer or not, I'm just curious and nosy.

 

- Do you think this is a need or a want in your wife? (I think its both in my H which is why I'm asking)

- Is she happier now that you all three seem to be settling into your routines?

- Is sex better or worse or the same?

- Is the guy settling down as well?

- How's the communication between you and her?

- Still texting the guy on the side or talking to him?

 

I'm just curious how things are starting to shake down for everyone. How are you explaining to whichever parent it is that stays with the kids on the nights you work?

 

CCL

[vodkafan]

Hi CCL.

OK I will try to answer your questions.

 

- Do you think this is a need or a want in your wife? (I think its both in my H which is why I'm asking)

 

I think it's a need. In her own words she has told me she needs us both anyway.

 

- Is she happier now that you all three seem to be settling into your routines?

 

yes, she is happy we are both secure and not jealous of each other.

 

- Is sex better or worse or the same?

 

sex was always pretty good anyway. Quantity wise it got way more frequent straight away because she used that to show me and reassure me that she wanted me still. She has worked very hard at that in all ways not just sex. She did let slip that I was having way more sex than the other guy was. Eventually I realised I didn't really need it twice a day during my 4 days.

I think the main difference is that there are no power games about sex. It is a a gifted, given thing.

 

- Is the guy settling down as well?

 

Yes he has been fine.

 

- How's the communication between you and her?

 

Excellent. We really LISTEN to each other now. Also we enjoy romantic stuff, texting, cards, flowers. We have date nights.

 

- Still texting the guy on the side or talking to him?

 

At the end of the first month we had a meeting. That helped both of us a lot. Just this week we have decided to try ditching the no contact rule and see how that goes. But, out of courtesy, if he wants to talk to my wife he will not ring her phone direct, he rings me first and asks if he can speak to her. I give him the same courtesy when it is his 3 days.

 

I'm just curious how things are starting to shake down for everyone. How are you explaining to whichever parent it is that stays with the kids on the nights you work?

 

I have been able to alter my hours slightly which obviates the need for her mother to stay, she was getting too curious. My eldest daughter is legally old enough anyway to babysit and is pretty level headed. I am only ever a phone call away. Last week we told her and her sister the full truth. It turns out they knew anyway that she was going to stay with OG at weekends but they were frightened we were going to divorce.

Now they understand they are happy that we are not.

The eldest son, who is away working in London, knows there was another man but he does not want to discuss it.

 

That's about it. For my part, when she is not there I don't beat myself up over it, I just get on with stuff, jobs round the house, time with the kids. My life is full and my marriage is safe. She likes the fact she can come and go between two strong, independent men, that gives her a buzz. She didn't like it at the beginning when she had two insecure whingers.

[lilbunny]

If you and all concerned are genuinely happy with your situation then who am I to judge? There are always going to be people who automatically jump to criticise any unconventional relationships. It honestly doesn't appeal to me.

 

It is amazing what children are able to absorb and accept if they feel loved and happy.

 

Good luck to you, keep us posted.

[Distant78]

Hi CCL.

OK I will try to answer your questions.

 

- Do you think this is a need or a want in your wife? (I think its both in my H which is why I'm asking)

 

I think it's a need. In her own words she has told me she needs us both anyway.

 

- Is she happier now that you all three seem to be settling into your routines?

 

yes, she is happy we are both secure and not jealous of each other.

 

- Is sex better or worse or the same?

 

sex was always pretty good anyway. Quantity wise it got way more frequent straight away because she used that to show me and reassure me that she wanted me still. She has worked very hard at that in all ways not just sex. She did let slip that I was having way more sex than the other guy was. Eventually I realised I didn't really need it twice a day during my 4 days.

I think the main difference is that there are no power games about sex. It is a a gifted, given thing.

 

- Is the guy settling down as well?

 

Yes he has been fine.

 

- How's the communication between you and her?

 

Excellent. We really LISTEN to each other now. Also we enjoy romantic stuff, texting, cards, flowers. We have date nights.

 

- Still texting the guy on the side or talking to him?

 

At the end of the first month we had a meeting. That helped both of us a lot. Just this week we have decided to try ditching the no contact rule and see how that goes. But, out of courtesy, if he wants to talk to my wife he will not ring her phone direct, he rings me first and asks if he can speak to her. I give him the same courtesy when it is his 3 days.

 

I'm just curious how things are starting to shake down for everyone. How are you explaining to whichever parent it is that stays with the kids on the nights you work?

 

I have been able to alter my hours slightly which obviates the need for her mother to stay, she was getting too curious. My eldest daughter is legally old enough anyway to babysit and is pretty level headed. I am only ever a phone call away. Last week we told her and her sister the full truth. It turns out they knew anyway that she was going to stay with OG at weekends but they were frightened we were going to divorce.

Now they understand they are happy that we are not.

The eldest son, who is away working in London, knows there was another man but he does not want to discuss it.

 

That's about it. For my part, when she is not there I don't beat myself up over it, I just get on with stuff, jobs round the house, time with the kids. My life is full and my marriage is safe. She likes the fact she can come and go between two strong, independent men, that gives her a buzz. She didn't like it at the beginning when she had two insecure whingers.

 

Wow...just wow. (*sighs*)

[Distant78]

It is amazing what children are able to absorb and accept if they feel loved and happy.

 

I don't think the children were happy, at least the son wasn't.

[aerogurl87]

So vodkafan you like being cuckolded? That's interesting, I mean I'm not judging because I know lots of men who don't mind the concept or who actually enjoy it. I know for me it wouldn't work but if you're genuinely happy with this and not just doing it to keep your marriage intact and wife in your life, then enjoy.

[TaraMaiden]

I don't think the children were happy, at least the son wasn't.

The children already guessed, but were only unhappy because they feared a divorce. Now there's no divorce on the cards, they have peace of mind, so yeah, they're happy.

The eldest son (who lives away from home) 'doesn't want to discuss it'. That's his problem, not the OP's. he's a grown-up, and has to deal with this on his own terms, for himself.

No matter what we do, we can logically, calmly and realistically explain it all to someone else, and even if we're content and happy with what's happening, we cannot expect them to be, or change their perception for them.

 

The same thing would have happened with a divorce.

 

When a couple divorce, other people are in the battle zone, it can't be helped, and not everyone will be happy about the divorce, even if the couple concerned, are. But they have to focus on themselves. Every other adult in the scenario has to deal with their own emotions.

[TaraMaiden]

So vodkafan you like being cuckolded? That's interesting, I mean I'm not judging because I know lots of men who don't mind the concept or who actually enjoy it. I know for me it wouldn't work but if you're genuinely happy with this and not just doing it to keep your marriage intact and wife in your life, then enjoy.

Yes, I think you are judging....

That's a subtle little dig there....

 

It may be what is being described but it's a derogatory term, and I think you know that....

Why not call it polyandry, which is, in effect, what it is?

 

"So Vodkafan, you're in a polyandric relationship?"

 

Sounds more non-judgemental, don't you think?

if it works for him, why knock it?

Simply because it wouldn't work for you, it doesn't make it wrong..... (A PA would be wrong, but that's not what's happening here).

[xxoo]

Maybe the better question is:

 

Vodka, do you like being in a poly relationship?

 

I don't judge poly relationships. Lots of people like them, and that's cool. But it doesn't seem like Vodka was seeking one, so it is difficult for some of us to understand his current acceptance.

 

Vodka, honestly, wouldn't you be thrilled if your wife said, "Yeah, that was a mistake. I realize now I only love, want, need you. Let's be mono again."

 

What if she falls in love with another man?

[vodkafan]

I know for me it wouldn't work but if you're genuinely happy with this and not just doing it to keep your marriage intact and wife in your life, then enjoy.

 

Did you read from the beginning aerogurl? I AM just doing this to keep my marriage intact, at least I was originally.

You can call it what you want. The fact is, my marriage has changed; my wife has said, as much as she loves me and wants me in her life, she would not want to live with me for 7 days a week. She has also told the other guy she does not want him for 7 days a week either.

In fact she told him if he was not happy with 3 days he could walk.

We did the conventional marriage thing for twenty years. I was lucky, I had that. Neither of us want to throw away that.

She doesn't want ANY man for 7 days a week. She wants both of us.

We just happen to think this particular woman is worth sharing. Many are not.

[vodkafan]

Maybe the better question is:

 

Vodka, do you like being in a poly relationship?

 

I don't judge poly relationships. Lots of people like them, and that's cool. But it doesn't seem like Vodka was seeking one, so it is difficult for some of us to understand his current acceptance.

 

Vodka, honestly, wouldn't you be thrilled if your wife said, "Yeah, that was a mistake. I realize now I only love, want, need you. Let's be mono again."

 

What if she falls in love with another man?

 

Hi xxoo,

 

I like some aspects of what has happened in my marriage. For instance , 4 days of getting on good and enjoying being together is better than 7 days of a mundane marriage ; we were in a rut for a couple of years before and things were not so good.

I just accept the other things and will see how things turn out. It is still early days.

I would be thrilled if she said that about being mono but I feel it won't happen; we HAD that at its best so nobody can take that away. I ain't going to moan and pine and live in the past.

Things have changed for ever, but change doesn't have to be bad.

 

If things dont turn out between her and this other guy, I would not accept her doing this again- that would be her looking for somebody to fit in a poly lifestyle; she has insisted all long this is NOT that.

[GorillaTheater]

It would be interesting to see how the dynamics change if you decide to begin dating. In fact, I'd like to see you consider doing just that. You have settled for half a wife. Fine. Your decision. But I see no reason to settle for half a life.

[Toodamnpragmatic]

It would be interesting to see how the dynamics change if you decide to begin dating. In fact, I'd like to see you consider doing just that. You have settled for half a wife. Fine. Your decision. But I see no reason to settle for half a life.

 

This is just so selfish.... What is dating? You see someone, develop emotions, but also do your own thing, which can mean dating others, and heck sleeping with other people, which seldom is with the approval of the person you are dating.

 

Does your spouse not have enough interests, hobbies, and things to do those three days that are too much time to be with you? How about girlfriends to visit, books to read, courses to take, being there for her children?

 

No...... What she has the sexual and emotional support of another male..... Call a spade a spade.....

 

But we're not going to change your mind and I guess for some this works..... I just watched a few minutes on TLC a show called "Strange Sex", where they did look at a polyamorous relationship and I just thought ewww...... But that's just me.....

 

So Vodkafan, you are a 7-day parent and she is a 4 day parent...... Something to think about......

[xxoo]

So Vodkafan, you are a 7-day parent and she is a 4 day parent...... Something to think about......

 

This is exactly what would bother me the most. I'd be so resentful if I were left alone to parent half the week while my partner was off "playing house" (in my perception) with another woman.

 

What responsibilities does she have, and avoid, during her 3 days a week with him?

 

Do the kids conclude that mom doesn't want them 7 days a week?

[Toodamnpragmatic]

This is exactly what would bother me the most. I'd be so resentful if I were left alone to parent half the week while my partner was off "playing house" (in my perception) with another woman.

 

What responsibilities does she have, and avoid, during her 3 days a week with him?

 

Do the kids conclude that mom doesn't want them 7 days a week?

 

and emotional attachment..... Plain and simple..... Can't convince me otherwise. Now if that is okay with all partners I just will shake my head and in amazement and keep my distance.

 

If it is not about sex, it is about emotions, which is a psychological issue if it is not enough from her, her children or friends.....

 

Heck my spouse has often opined how great life would be if we bought her the house across the street...... We'd still be a family, sleep together every night and spend huge amounts of time..... But it would be her retreat and she'd not have to see the clutter or the things that drive her batty.....

[Distant78]

The children already guessed, but were only unhappy because they feared a divorce. Now there's no divorce on the cards, they have peace of mind, so yeah, they're happy.

The eldest son (who lives away from home) 'doesn't want to discuss it'. That's his problem, not the OP's. he's a grown-up, and has to deal with this on his own terms, for himself.

No matter what we do, we can logically, calmly and realistically explain it all to someone else, and even if we're content and happy with what's happening, we cannot expect them to be, or change their perception for them.

 

They have peace of mind?LOL!!!

 

The same thing would have happened with a divorce.

 

When a couple divorce, other people are in the battle zone, it can't be helped, and not everyone will be happy about the divorce, even if the couple concerned, are. But they have to focus on themselves. Every other adult in the scenario has to deal with their own emotions.

 

True. But should focusing on themselves always lead to the disintegration of family?

[TaraMaiden]

This is just so selfish.... What is dating? You see someone, develop emotions, but also do your own thing, which can mean dating others, and heck sleeping with other people, which seldom is with the approval of the person you are dating.

But in this case, there is approval. What's your issue here, exactly?

 

Does your spouse not have enough interests, hobbies, and things to do those three days that are too much time to be with you? How about girlfriends to visit, books to read, courses to take, being there for her children?

Sounds like a typically conventional marriage to me. 50% of which by the way, end in divorce.

This isn't happening here, so again, what's your gripe?

 

No...... What she has the sexual and emotional support of another male..... Call a spade a spade.....

Yup, and the OP has spoken about that. Seems everything is fine in that department too. At least, none of the three is complaining.....

 

But we're not going to change your mind and I guess for some this works..... I just watched a few minutes on TLC a show called "Strange Sex", where they did look at a polyamorous relationship and I just thought ewww...... But that's just me.....

Precisely. You've hit the nail on the head. All this griping is simply your disagreement and slant towards what has hitherto been portrayed as a conventional relationship. And as we know from these forums, conventional relationships create their own problems.

What is it with people, exactly?

These people have found a compromise that suits them all, and has prevented a divorce. Everyone seems happy with the arrangement - but those on LS condemn this as being 'ewww' simply because it's defiant of convention. I really thought LSers were more open-minded.

 

So Vodkafan, you are a 7-day parent and she is a 4 day parent...... Something to think about......

Don't talk rot. A parent doesn't stop being a parent because they're absent for a set period of time.

Do you think guys on an oil rig are less of a parent because they're away for weeks? Or how about truckers? Nurses away on long shifts?

How about divorced fathers and mothers who have joint custody? They see their kids erratically. Does this make them less of a parent?

My ex- worked in another country for 5 days of the week and came back for 2. he was no less of a father than I was a mother. I'm sorry, this argument is idiotic. This is just throwing contentions to the wind for the sake of it.

 

They have peace of mind?LOL!!!

 

The same thing would have happened with a divorce.

That was kind of the point I was making. But if you read the OP's post again, he states:

 

Last week we told her and her sister the full truth. It turns out they knew anyway that she was going to stay with OG at weekends but they were frightened we were going to divorce.

Now they understand they are happy that we are not.

Wouldn't this indicate that the children are happy knowing their parents are not divorcing?

Remember: our ideology of what makes up a society is learnt and absorbed entirely through conditioning. If these girls are being conditioned to understand that it is possible (I personally would say even completely natural) to love more than one person at a time, this cannot be doing them any harm. They are merely being given a demonstration of the fact that horizons are not as narrow as one might have first thought.

 

True. But should focusing on themselves always lead to the disintegration of family?

Disintegration of the family is far less likely in this scenario, than in the divorce.

[xxoo]

Don't talk rot. A parent doesn't stop being a parent because they're absent for a set period of time.

Do you think guys on an oil rig are less of a parent because they're away for weeks? Or how about truckers? Nurses away on long shifts?

.

 

Different, Tara. Oil workers, truckers, nurses are away doing something for the kids (supporting them financially). Divorced parents have little choice.

 

I guess that is what is bugging me, here. If he is a second husband, what is he doing for the family? Poly families can pool resources and have mutual benefits (shared childcare, additional income, shared companionship, etc). From what I've read, I just see this guy taking...and the wife stepping out....not the wife and new husband adding to the family. It seems like this new relationship is taking much more away than it is adding for the OP and his kids. But that is just my perspective, and the OP obviously thinks she is worth sharing.

[TaraMaiden]

Different, Tara. Oil workers, truckers, nurses are away doing something for the kids (supporting them financially). Divorced parents have little choice.

I knew somebody would play the 'having little choice' card....the circumstances are immaterial, and such arguments are a red herring. The fact is, that for whatever reason, a parent is absent,, whether by accident or design. It's the absence which creates the issue, not the reason. And I know plenty of people who have children with them all the time, but this doesn't make them better parents, necessarily.

 

I guess that is what is bugging me, here. If he is a second husband, what is he doing for the family?

But he's not a second husband. This stage hasn't even been broached, and these children existed before he came along. Why should he have any responsibility for them, or even TO them?

 

Poly families can pool resources and have mutual benefits (shared childcare, additional income, shared companionship, etc). From what I've read, I just see this guy taking...and the wife stepping out...

Precisely.

Fraom what you read.

We can't know what goes on behind their doors or between their ears. They walked into this arrangement eyes wide open, but if I read right (Note that I am making assumptions here, just as much as anyone else might be) Vodkafan would probably be extremely resistant to this guy having anything to do with his children at this stage - until such a time as perhaps one of his children asks to meet the guy.

Who knows?

 

This is still very much in the embryonic, formative and dare I say it, experimental stage. It's unknown territory - for everyone.

In actually think Vodkafan might even consider writing a book about this.

 

It seems like this new relationship is taking much more away than it is adding for the OP and his kids. But that is just my perspective, and the OP obviously thinks she is worth sharing.

The children still have their mother, they have their father, and they have them together still. They also know about the relationship, so there is an openness and clarity here, many people do not afford children in any other kind of relationship.

I think the OP truly feels she is worth sharing, because the marriage is worth keeping, and the cohesion worth fighting for. If they seem to have found a formula that works better than the alternative - why knock it?

[Distant78]

Remember: our ideology of what makes up a society is learnt and absorbed entirely through conditioning. If these girls are being conditioned to understand that it is possible (I personally would say even completely natural) to love more than one person at a time, this cannot be doing them any harm. They are merely being given a demonstration of the fact that horizons are not as narrow as one might have first thought.

 

It can't do them any harm? But yet his wife tells him that she doesn't even want to spend time with him seven days a week (as if he's some type of irritant)? This guy didn't even want this to happen, so how about you tell me where are the boundaries regarding entitlement.

 

 

Disintegration of the family is far less likely in this scenario, than in the divorce.

 

Disintegration of the family is more likely in this scenario, and divorce is also, when someone is giving themselves to someone else physically and emotionally. One has already checked out, and I wouldn't be surprised if the girls were harboring deep resentment in this situation.

[xxoo]

But he's not a second husband. This stage hasn't even been broached, and these children existed before he came along. Why should he have any responsibility for them, or even TO them?

 

The op described him as a "husband":

 

We do identify much more with the polyandry model, basically a wife with two husbands.

 

I'm not dictating what responsibility he should have. I just don't see how a "husband" can have no responsibilities to the existing family. My mind isn't grasping it.

 

That brings up another question I have (yes, Vodkafan, I find your situation fascinating! ). She had no dating relationship with this man, and then it was instant live-in 3 days a week. That alone seems....rushed. And probably unwise, for any relationship (poly or not). Why did everything need to move so fast?

 

I think the OP truly feels she is worth sharing, because the marriage is worth keeping, and the cohesion worth fighting for. If they seem to have found a formula that works better than the alternative - why knock it?

 

Because, from what I'm reading, it doesn't sound like the OP is thrilled with the situation. It sounds like he is settling for what he can get, and I wonder, why? It must be a helluva 4 days at home!