Author kkat Posted February 22, 2004 Author Share Posted February 22, 2004 I spent another day with MM today, nothing new - I still see him constantly. I broke down in tears today over my pain, and now he is saying perhaps we should break things off - he's sorry to see me in pain and feels he is making things worse not better. The irony is that I've been pushing him away - having sex with him today I was so not into it; I've been saying and doing things to try and get him to end it - but when he goes there and takes the bait in the least bit, I literally start to panic, in the form of a panic attack. I'm losing my mind, correction, perhaps have lost it. Link to post Share on other sites
Skittles Posted February 22, 2004 Share Posted February 22, 2004 The irony is that I've been pushing him away - having sex with him today I was so not into it; I've been saying and doing things to try and get him to end it - but when he goes there and takes the bait in the least bit, I literally start to panic, in the form of a panic attack. Oh kkat....... Your approach-avoidance in trying to end this is alot like pulling a band-aid off slowly....that hurts worse than just yanking it off! I am not sure I agree with the theory that you should see him until you feel capable of moving on...I am curious to hear what your therapist would say about your meeting with him today. I don't think weaning yourself off this guy is working too well... I would bite the bullet and cut him out now...It would kill me to think I was begging him to keep seeing me... Oh, I wish I could crawl inside you and make you angry and prideful enough to just kick him to the curb. I hope you have girlfriends who are dragging you away from him... Link to post Share on other sites
meanon Posted February 23, 2004 Share Posted February 23, 2004 You have not lost your mind - this is life changing stuff and it's natural to get cold feet and panic at the thought of coping alone. The writing is on the wall for this affair - it sounds as though even the sex is turning sad. Stop trying to push him into ending it and do it yourself as soon as possible but when you are ready to follow through. Until then continue the process of emotional withdrawal. By relying on him to finish it you are giving him emotional control and you need that control for yourself to be sufficiently positive to create a life without him. You will make it and you'll look back on this phase as the beginning of the end. Link to post Share on other sites
moimeme Posted February 23, 2004 Share Posted February 23, 2004 The analogy to addiction has been made elsewhere and it's apt, IMHO. Some people can quit addictions gradually, but they are few. Most find that the best way to get out of the grip of the compulsion is to shut the door in its face and then take the 'one day at a time' approach. If it's too difficult to contemplate 'forever' without him, start each day planning to avoid him for that day. Then decide how you will otherwise occupy yourself. Days will turn into weeks and his hold over you will lessen. I swear we can get addicted to pheremones. Stay out of range of his and let the addiction wane. You'll be glad you did! Link to post Share on other sites
Arabess Posted February 23, 2004 Share Posted February 23, 2004 Lets say it's s few decades down the road....retirement time. The wife decides she wants to spend her last days in sunny Florida....Arizona....California.....just pick a place the furtherest away from you. And he moves away with his wife. And there you are. ALONE....for the rest of yours. As long as you stay where you are at.....this is as good as it's ever gonna get. With every passing day, another day has been erased, with the chance of you finding someone who DOES love you enough to introduce you proudly to his family, put his last name on the mailbox you share, make financial plans for your golden years, wake up with you Christmas morning......you know...the NORMAL things which accompany a REAL relationship between TWO people....not THREE. Just something to consider. Link to post Share on other sites
Author kkat Posted February 26, 2004 Author Share Posted February 26, 2004 His wife has been at their vacation place for a week, so I've seen him everyday and every night. Way too much togetherness, its like we both are trying to fit a real relationship into 10 days time when he has more "freedom". But, every single time we are together, I get upset, and bring up the things I'm unhappy about. Generally, our time together ends with me crying. I want out. I want the pain to stop. I want to rip off the bandaid, but I don't do it. I do feel like, as referenced by some posters, that I have a sick addiction that I have lost control to. I am so ashamed of myself, I feel so much shame. Link to post Share on other sites
jester Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 Yes, kkat, you're addicted, now get in line. Recent studies show that the part of the brain primarily responsible for love feelings is also the site responsible for obsessive compulsive disorders. Love can be addictive. It sounds to me like your relationship with this MM is on a downward trajectory. An affair is like many love relationships. At the beginning its hurricane force sex and off-the -charts pleasure. Things settle down in the middle phase to good companionate sex. Towards the end the contradictions , which inhere in every affair, surface once the sex and passion cease being enough or stop working their anaesthetic effect. It's at the end when one party realizes that love IS not enough. You're there. As hard as you both try, you cannot go back to those fantastic early days when it was all hormones, endorphins and love's delight. It's time for you to go, kkat. You know it. Your heart knows it. The thrill is gone, the happiness a memory and the intimacy burdened by your sadness. Cut the cord... Link to post Share on other sites
meanon Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 I so wish there was something I could do to help - to witness such distress is awful, I can't imagine what it must be like to suffer it. You want out and just can't make that final step. Maybe the addiction analogy applies to you. When people suffer great pain and feel powerless to do anything about it they often suffer from learned helplessness. It saps the self confidence and the will to change. The only way to combat it is to seek some degree of control over what is happening to you - you need a plan and some robust mental strategies to get out. Please see your therapist, maybe they can help you achieve this. The mind is an amazing thing - you need yours to work for you not against you. Don't be ashamed - you need to believe in yourself. You are a good person in a dreadful situation and you are trying to do the right thing. Link to post Share on other sites
FreeMe Posted February 26, 2004 Share Posted February 26, 2004 Originally posted by kkat he is CLEAR about the fact that he does not see himself ripping his little comfy life apart to have more with me. This guy is so incredibly selfish. He's got it made. He got you back (Didn't you go for a couple of years with no contact?) and he's got his comfy life, but look what this is doing to you. You're sick with shame and you know you're damaging your own self-respect. You end up crying every time you're with him. I think he's cruel to continue this. He should care enough to want you to have a full life with someone else. If he really loved you he'd let you go. Instead he has all the benefits of being married and you, whom he is turning into an addict - addicted to every pitiful little scrap he throws you. He might as well stick you with some needles full of herione. Kkat, I'm in sympathy with you. I wish I could help you get away from him. Link to post Share on other sites
Author kkat Posted February 29, 2004 Author Share Posted February 29, 2004 MM left today for 10 days with his family in Florida. I am leaving in the morning for a trip alone to Mexico, which I booked in desperation thinking I would be too distraught being here when he left on his trip with them/her. I declined to get together with him Friday and Saturday despite his repeated attempts. I had seen him even more than I normally do over the past ten days - since his wife was already down in Florida and he had more "freedom" - and seeing him so much brought alot of things into perspective for me. Namely, that I can't continue this way - I'm not cut out for it. I just can't be happy with him (or anyone) sharing them with someone else. So...I told him on Friday I really couldn't continue, and I told him specifically what I need him to do in order for me to continue seeing him at all. I did talk to him on the phone yesterday, continuing the same conversation, but didn't see him. It was hard for me to say no to him two nights in a row, knowing I wouldn't be seeing him for at least 10 days. He went for my weaknesses - first of all, after I told him that I just couldn't continue, I couldn't take the pain, and if he doesn't value our relationship ENOUGH to do the admittedly difficult tasks involved with ending our marriage, that I had to move on -- he actually started telling me how in love with me he is, and said "I know that one day we will be together. I know I have caused you so much pain and I am so sorry. I regret all of it more than you can know. But, I know that one day we will be together". I think this was a little cruel for him to say- and he added to it by asking me to see him the day he gets back, and the day after, telling me he'd find a way to be free for the evening so we could go to the ballet or opera or a very special restaurant or whatever I wanted to do, instead of a quicky dinner out which is our normal routine. It didn't occur to me at the time because I was so emotional on the phone, but this was really crappy, wasn't it - him making it even harder for me to let go. Today is the first day I haven't spoken to him, and its hard. But, I am going with the one day at a time approach, in trying to end the addiction. I do love him, and I know he loves me, and yes we are very compatible, and yes, the two-plus years we lived together had many wonderful moments, but I can't continue being the gal on the side. This is not what I signed up for, and I know the shame I am feeling is because I have let it continue all too long. As always, any thoughts appreciated.... Link to post Share on other sites
Skittles Posted February 29, 2004 Share Posted February 29, 2004 So...I told him on Friday I really couldn't continue, and I told him specifically what I need him to do in order for me to continue seeing him at all. kkat you are doing good. I know it hurts like hell. If this guy loves you like he says, kick back and let him do the work...he needs to make a decision regarding his marital status and act on it. If I were you, and I could be you as easily as anyone else, I would focus all my energies on myself. There is an excellent post by cariel, succinctly explaining why mm don't leave their wives in general..I'm sorry, I don't have the link available..But you can find her post either at the infidelity or om/ow forums. Men will hang on to their wives, usually, for dear life no matter how miserable they are, if they are indeed, and no matter how much they "love" you, if that, as well...Money, status, social acceptance, children, the known over the unknown are all factors for the death grip of the "unhappy" man...He clings to his marriage and his other woman with determination, and will juggle Volkswagens to maintain his precarious equilibrium. Even the appearance of another suitor in the picture might not inspire him to take action. One of my tortured g/f's has introduced another man into her triangle, and her mm has gone beserk with jealousy..but this temporary manipulation solves nothing. I am trying to extricate her from her affair with him and I am failing miserably. But imo, you are doing all you can at this point. Enjoy your trip to Mexico...wish I was going with you.. Link to post Share on other sites
meanon Posted February 29, 2004 Share Posted February 29, 2004 but this was really crappy, wasn't it - him making it even harder for me to let go. Yes it was. If the positions were reversed and he was in great pain wouldn't you let him go? Wouldn't you try and ease the distress for him? I'm sure he loves you but the bottom line is that his needs are more important than yours to him - that's a selfish, destructive love that you can do without. When differences between lovers become irreconcilable and they can't let go, the whole affair becomes sadder and more painful - save yourself before you suffer anymore. Well done for taking that all important first step - you will be happy without him sooner or later. Make it sooner. Link to post Share on other sites
jester Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 kkat, I honestly believe you've hit that point of no return, which exists in every dissolving relationship. That doesn't mean you won't back slide, you probably will. But even after a great evening with your MM, the positive energy won't be there. The lows are lower and the highs not as high in any relationship that's losing its fizz. Love is no longer enough. Intellectually, you knew that rather early on, but now you feel it at a cellular level. There's knowing and then there's KNOWING. You KNOW that so long as you are an adjunct to your MM's life that you'll never reach that state of grace we all seek in our intimate lives. You know that you were the best lover he has had, and this was the relationship of both your lives, but that flattering knowledge is no longer enough to sustain your heart and soul. You need more, much more, than what your MM can offer you or, quite frankly, is willing to give you. It is now time to move onwards, kkat. Your MM is history. Greet the new day. Link to post Share on other sites
Author kkat Posted March 7, 2004 Author Share Posted March 7, 2004 Back from Mexico with a suntan and remarkably, slightly better outlook on things. I came very close (actually dialed) to calling him but I quickly hung up. I had told him that the soonest I would talk to him would be on Wed when he's back from Florida. He did not call me while I was away (he didn't have my number in Mexico but I mean he didn't leave me any voicemails). It was good for me to be without seeing or speaking to him for (who's counting) eight days. Right now, I feel more anxious than anything about what I think is going to happen come Wednesday... my instinct tells me that after 10 days with his entire family he'll be ready to end things completely with me. But, I don't miss him as much as I thought I would. That could all change before I'm unpacked, but so far, so good. Link to post Share on other sites
Skittles Posted March 7, 2004 Share Posted March 7, 2004 Right now, I feel more anxious than anything about what I think is going to happen come Wednesday... my instinct tells me that after 10 days with his entire family he'll be ready to end things completely with me. But, I don't miss him as much as I thought I would. kkat ...glad you tanned and hope you had some cool drinks down there! Why wait for him to end it........Break it off with him! Spare yourself feeling rejected...Go out, if not intact, on top and do not get sucked in again if he does come back from Fl. with the missing you bull****. Tell him not to call you , not to think about you, to erase you from his memory because you are erasing him My wish for you is to be angry enough and indignant enough to hammer that final nail ... Link to post Share on other sites
meanon Posted March 7, 2004 Share Posted March 7, 2004 so far, so good. That's great - it's been hard but you are coping. Try not to focus on what he may do on Wednesday, but rather on what you will do. I want out. I want the pain to stop ..... I have a sick addiction that I have lost control to. The pain is worse when you have no control, isn't it? So...I told him on Friday I really couldn't continue, and I told him specifically what I need him to do in order for me to continue seeing him at all. I think you should be focusing on this: your plan to find a way you can live with the affair or to end it. Good luck Link to post Share on other sites
Author kkat Posted March 28, 2004 Author Share Posted March 28, 2004 So, update --- he came back from Florida and I spent 14 long days with an average of (not kidding) 5- 6 hours a day on the phone with MM trying to sort out some solution. Listening to his issues, listening to his excuses, and him trying to find a way to make the reality disappear... I continued to refuse to see him (so it's been over 4 weeks now since I saw him) and he kept trying to find a way to have another phone call, another discussion, leave the door open, how can we stay in each other's life - anything- but never any changes regarding him and his marriage. So, I did it. I broke it off, completely. I asked him to have no contact with me. I haven't called him and I haven't heard from him since Tuesday...( almost broke down once and called but then I stopped) and realized I don't even want him anymore. I'm just sick with myself for having disrespected myself to have been in this. I feel rejected, I feel stupid, I feel sad, I feel mad - but I am moving on. Thanks for being there for me. Link to post Share on other sites
meanon Posted March 28, 2004 Share Posted March 28, 2004 That's such good news - well done kkat!!!! The next task is to forgive yourself. You are not stupid, you just fell in love and you hoped that would be enough to make you happy, it wasn't. You made a mistake, now you've corrected it. The mad and sad feelings will fade and you will feel a peace that you haven't felt for a long time. Happiness will come - you deserve it Link to post Share on other sites
Author kkat Posted March 28, 2004 Author Share Posted March 28, 2004 I am starting to feel my depression pulling me under again - I was afraid this would happen. I think the first few days I felt the liberation and the freedom from the anxiety and stress. Now the reality of it all is sinking in and I'm not doing great. I'm thankful he hasn't called, but it bothers me at the same time, you know? And the anger, plus the sadness, which is understand from all of my reading, is a normal part of the process, is becoming pretty intense. I am having a hard time keeping a lid on that.... I guess I'm going through the normal stages of the loss of love, plus all the other junk tied to having let myself be in this situation. When I go back and read some of my posts from January, I can't believe how I focused on his side of things - actually felt badly for him - its truly a sickness. Link to post Share on other sites
Arabess Posted March 28, 2004 Share Posted March 28, 2004 It's the same feeling you would get if you went to Vegas and played slot machines for months. In the end, you've used up everything you have and there still isn't any big pay off in your bucket. Oh sure, there was the occasional little wins here and there, but you put it right back into the hungry machine and it kept all that too. So, now here you sit....with an empty bucket. You are mad at yourself, made at the hungry machine and have come to the realization that you are emotionally broke. Making contact again after deciding the game was over.....would be like taking a loan so you could play some more. It becomes a destructive cycle. Hang in there my dear friend......you can do this! Link to post Share on other sites
zarathustra Posted March 28, 2004 Share Posted March 28, 2004 That it is. That it is. Love bears some similarities to obsessive-compulsive disorders. And the affair structure, with its inherent limitations and compensatory hyper-intensity, aggravates the OCD. You're grieving, now, for him and all that you remember feeling when you and he were peak lovers. But you'll never get that back. You've climbed down. You're back at sea level, now. But it does get better, kkat. It does. When you finally emotionally, intellectually and existentially liberate yourself from this dead end relationship you will feel so happy, revitalized , unburdened and filled with a lightness of being. You'll make it through this hellish withdrawal, through these nightmare "love jones." What you need, kkat, what many of us need, is a detox of the heart. Hang in there, girl. Were here for you. Link to post Share on other sites
Arabess Posted March 28, 2004 Share Posted March 28, 2004 There's an idea Z, maybe we should open up the first 'Zara-Ara Clinic' for revovering OW's. Link to post Share on other sites
zarathustra Posted March 28, 2004 Share Posted March 28, 2004 There's an idea Z, maybe we should open up the first 'Zara-Ara Clinic' for revovering OW's. We'll do it together, Arabess. You can "counsel" the OM, and I'll "counsel" the OW. Link to post Share on other sites
Arabess Posted March 28, 2004 Share Posted March 28, 2004 'Revovering'????? Too bad I can't spell HAHA! I don't know......putting us in such a position would be much like putting an alchoholic in charge of the bar. Link to post Share on other sites
zarathustra Posted March 28, 2004 Share Posted March 28, 2004 Yeah, but my darling, what a way to go! Link to post Share on other sites
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