Moral indignation is jealousy with a halo. ~H.G. Wells

[NancyBotwin]

Remember too...all of this is OF COURSE dependent upon age/maturity levels of the kids involved.

Not to mention the maturity levels of the parents!

[pureinheart]

It sounds to me like you're confusing (or trying to confuse) the difference between being aware that one parent is cheating on/betraying another, and "details" around parental sexuality.

 

I don't think anyone is talking about details or graphic descriptions here, Jennie.

 

Again...the 'focus' is the fact that one parent BETRAYED another.

 

Not graphic details around the actual event of sex.

 

Doesn't matter...it didn't need to be said.

[donnamaybe]

You're right. It is a different thing.

 

It's called parental alienation. And if the couple divorces and a parent can prove that another parent tried to alienate their R with the child, the custodial parent can lose custody.

 

Telling the children such things has one goal: to turn the children against the other parent.

 

If the adult cannot deal with the infidelity, why in the world would you want to throw that on a child?

 

EEG

Telling the truth in a forthright manner to an adult is "alienation?" Sorry. Not so.

 

If people are so concerned about their children being "alienated" perhaps they should think with their brains rather than their genitals.

[Owl]

Doesn't matter...it didn't need to be said.

 

And here you and I will ABSOLUTELY have to agree to disagree, simply because I believe the complete opposite of this statement.

 

It DOES have to be said.

[Owl]

Not to mention the maturity levels of the parents!

 

Great point...but that probably got called into question simply because of the infidelity in the first place! :)

[xxoo]

Where did this come from?

 

JJ's kids do know her intimate partner.

 

And it is wrong (and quite frankly gross) to tell children about your sexual relationship. Also, teenagers don't even want to THINK about their parents having sex.

 

I can't imagine a responsible parent sharing sexual escapades with a child or teenager for that matter. It is inappropriate and they are not developmentally ready for it.

 

Adult issues should remain between adults. They are the only ones capable of handling them.

 

It says that you are making the right choice to not involve children with every issue in your life.

 

EEG

 

It was a general "you", referring to people who expect secrecy to be maintained. I wasn't speaking about Jennie's kids, but replying to her post on the subject in general.

 

The expectation of secrecy is simply unreasonable. The truth WILL come out; it always does. If you don't want your children to know that you are a cheater, don't be one.

[sadintexas]

I think there's a big difference between telling minor children and telling adult children. I have not ever said anything derogatory about my ex to our daughter. When she becomes an adult and asks me questions, I don't know what I will or won't reveal to her. I will cross that bridge when I get there.

 

However, someone telling an adult, even if that adult is the offspring of one of the cheaters, is not even close to parental alienation. Again, exposure is one of the risks of having an A. If you don't like the fact that an A will be exposed, don't have an A.

 

I'm not preaching. I had the same considerations in my A, only professionally. I would have been upset, had we been discovered, if I had been exposed to people I am professionally affiliated with, but I couldn't blame the BS for exposing me. She didn't put me in that position...I DID.

[jennie-jennie]

Ideally you don't share details of anyone's sex life with others, but in an A situation, the rules change. They changed when you guys decided to have an A. When you decide to become a part of someone else's M (and you DO by getting involved with their spouse) then the third person has rights as well. Public outing and embarrassment is just a risk you to take to be with your "love". People being given the opportunity to see your and the WS's true colors (since it's all been a secret before) is just par for the course. Being an unoplogectic OW, I wouldn't think ANYONE knowing of the "love" in an A would be an issue for you.

 

Being an unapologetic OW of course everybody I know, relatives and friends alike, know of my relationship, but that is because I have told them. Not the BS.

 

Imagine I decided to reveal the existence of our relationship not only to the BS, but to everybody else my WS knows. That is going a bit too far, isn't it?

[pureinheart]

Ideally you don't share details of anyone's sex life with others, but in an A situation, the rules change. They changed when you guys decided to have an A. When you decide to become a part of someone else's M (and you DO by getting involved with their spouse) then the third person has rights as well. Public outing and embarrassment is just a risk you to take to be with your "love". People being given the opportunity to see your and the WS's true colors (since it's all been a secret before) is just par for the course. Being an unoplogectic OW, I wouldn't think ANYONE knowing of the "love" in an A would be an issue for you.

 

The issue is telling the kids, grown or not...in the case described, what was the motive behind the motive?

[jennie-jennie]

It sounds to me like you're confusing (or trying to confuse) the difference between being aware that one parent is cheating on/betraying another, and "details" around parental sexuality.

 

I don't think anyone is talking about details or graphic descriptions here, Jennie.

 

Again...the 'focus' is the fact that one parent BETRAYED another.

 

Not graphic details around the actual event of sex.

 

Betrayed by having sex with someone other than the spouse. I fail to see the difference here. Of course I am not talking about details or graphic descriptions.

[sadintexas]

Being an unapologetic OW of course everybody I know, relatives and friends alike, know of my relationship, but that is because I have told them. Not the BS.

 

Imagine I decided to reveal the existence of our relationship not only to the BS, but to everybody else my WS knows. That is going a bit too far, isn't it?

 

If you told the BS and everyone else your WS knows, you would almost assuredly guarantee the end of your relationship. Your motive to keep it quiet is to keep it together. Her motive for exposing is to destroy it (and probably revenge as well, won't deny that). I think trying to compare the two is completely irrelevant.

[pureinheart]

Being an unapologetic OW of course everybody I know, relatives and friends alike, know of my relationship, but that is because I have told them. Not the BS.

 

Imagine I decided to reveal the existence of our relationship not only to the BS, but to everybody else my WS knows. That is going a bit too far, isn't it?

 

I would ask what is the agenda...to rally supporters? To bring condemnation down on the individual you hate?

 

Especially the setting involved...a funeral? And this behavior is actually being defended...wow....

[Owl]

Betrayed by having sex with someone other than the spouse. I fail to see the difference here. Of course I am not talking about details or graphic descriptions.

 

Why does it have to be having sex? An emotional affair is every bit as devestating and destructive to the marriage as a physical one...and equally a betrayal to the BS as well.

[lolapalooza]

I missed the memo. Is this the week for all threads to go OFF TOPIC?

[jennie-jennie]

Cross posted, but this is exactly what I was saying.

 

I think the attempt to confuse the issue is intentional. It changes the thrust of all arguments to something that IS morally wrong for a parent to do: tell a child about sexual details. And that's not at all what is being spoken about here.

 

If I as an adult choose to have more than one sexual partner at a time (which often is the case with a WS), I might find that too much information for both my children and my parents.

 

My adult daughter is very sensitive when it comes to discussing my and her father's former relationship. She doesn't want to get involved in any discussions about it. And I certainly am not talking about sexual details here. You should never impose a discussion on a child (whether adult or not) about their parents' relationships.

 

I am not intentionally trying to confuse any issue. In my opinion you are intentionally trying to confuse the issue by saying that I am doing that very thing.

[jennie-jennie]

No one wants to know the details of a parent or child's sex acts, but it is normally accepted and expected that we acknowledge our intimate relationships. An expectation of secrecy seems unrealistic and inappropriate.

 

If you don't want your children to know about your intimate partner--what does that say about the choices you are making?

 

So if I make bad choices, like breaking the law, the law enforcement should take it upon themselves to inform my adult children and my parents?

[xxoo]

So if I make bad choices, like breaking the law, the law enforcement should take it upon themselves to inform my adult children and my parents?

 

No, but you shouldn't be outraged when the police put it in the papers, and the neighbors gossip about it. That is to be expected, and should be considered BEFORE breaking the law.

[complicatedlife]

You're right. It is a different thing.

 

It's called parental alienation. And if the couple divorces and a parent can prove that another parent tried to alienate their R with the child, the custodial parent can lose custody.

 

Telling the children such things has one goal: to turn the children against the other parent.

 

If the adult cannot deal with the infidelity, why in the world would you want to throw that on a child?

 

EEG

Umm...Actually, EEG is correct. Ask any person husband/father who went through a VERY difficult divorce; there's a reason why there are attorneys who specialize in father's rights. Also, ANY family and marraige therapist/counselor will tell you that:

 

1. If the children are not already aware, it's better not to share the infidelity

2. If you do decide to tell, it should be when they are of an "adult" age so that they can understand the problems that infidelity can cause when they are better equipped emotionally to handle it.

 

The vows were said between the husband and wife, and it is their problem; why tell the children about their marital issues? Would you share with children the fact that you and your spouse haven't been physically intimate for over 5 years because their mom and dad no longer find each other attractive? Of course not.

 

Therapists will say that if something is not educational or helpful to a child, it's better not to share the information. Such information can cause the child unnecesaary pain, as well as problems within the relationship with the child and the cheating spouse. And, yes, I can provide information/psychological links to back all of this up; you can also check out divorce forums on this same topic...my fMM and I have done much research on this.

[sadintexas]

The issue is telling the kids, grown or not...in the case described, what was the motive behind the motive?

 

You would have to ask her what her motives were as I can't speak for her. In my case, if my DD ever asked me and I decided to reveal (once she was an adult) it would only be to show her, by example, that we don't let people mistreat us no matter how much we love them. In a sense, I think she does deserve answers as to why her family broke apart when she was so young. On the other hand, there are other ways to convey the same messages, so I don't really know what I would personally do.

 

I don't know that her motive really matters anyway. An OP helped caused tremendous damage to her M. If the BS chooses to expose the OP, that is the BS's right. It is a risk we take in becoming OP. I think it's a bit odd to consider that it shouldn't be exposed to certain people for their protection or whatever. We didn't think about their protection or wellbeing when we decided to interfere in their family in the first place.

[donnamaybe]

Umm...Actually, EEG is correct. Ask any person husband/father who went through a VERY difficult divorce; there's a reason why there are attorneys who specialize in father's rights. Also, ANY family and marraige therapist/counselor will tell you that:

 

1. If the children are not already aware, it's better not to share the infidelity

2. If you do decide to tell, it should be when they are of an "adult" age

We ARE talking about an adult child.

[xxoo]

The issue is telling the kids, grown or not...in the case described, what was the motive behind the motive?

 

I don't know the details, but can easily imagine an honest motive: sparing the grown child the pain of bonding with with mom's "new man" (who was present at dad's funeral) only to find out years later that he was sleeping with mom throughout the whole marriage. Secrets come out, and they bring pain with them. Honesty now spares him that greater pain later.

 

Being an unapologetic OW of course everybody I know, relatives and friends alike, know of my relationship, but that is because I have told them. Not the BS.

 

Imagine I decided to reveal the existence of our relationship not only to the BS, but to everybody else my WS knows. That is going a bit too far, isn't it?

 

Personally, I think the 5 year affair is a bit too far. Now, hiring a skywriter to publish it over MM's house? That sounds fair

[complicatedlife]

We ARE talking about an adult child.

Really - where? The posts are about children of various ages as "children" "teenagers" were specifically mentioned...I did see OWL say something about maturity and age dependency.

[jennie-jennie]

If you told the BS and everyone else your WS knows, you would almost assuredly guarantee the end of your relationship. Your motive to keep it quiet is to keep it together. Her motive for exposing is to destroy it (and probably revenge as well, won't deny that). I think trying to compare the two is completely irrelevant.

 

Perhaps the BS does not want her relatives and friends to know she has been betrayed. This could be a way for the OW to get revenge on the BS. I would have been very ashamed if the other women in my exSO's cases would have informed my parents.

 

So the BS needs the additional help of society to destroy the extramarital relationship since obviously the love the WS has for her is not enough in and by itself?

[jennie-jennie]

The issue is telling the kids, grown or not...in the case described, what was the motive behind the motive?

 

Exactly. This is what I want to know. What is the benefit for the adult child and the parents of the WS in finding out about the affair? What good does this information do them?

 

I would ask what is the agenda...to rally supporters? To bring condemnation down on the individual you hate?

 

Especially the setting involved...a funeral? And this behavior is actually being defended...wow....

 

Worth repeating.

[Owl]

So if I make bad choices, like breaking the law, the law enforcement should take it upon themselves to inform my adult children and my parents?

 

Nope...but they wouldn't be 'wrong' if they did so, either.

 

It's all consequences of your bad choices.