Is An Affair A Horrible Thing?

[Imagem]

I have read so many of your postings and I feel they are a help to me right now. I feel so much differently I am widowed, do not want to remarry but like the idea of having someone that cares. I have met a guy who is married and the marriage is OK but has had some rough spots.

 

He has been flirting with me for some time now and at first I backed away. I am now to the point where I wonder if an affair would help the both of us but I can't seem to justify it as I do not want his marriage to end and I am sure he does not want that.

 

His flirting has helped me come alive again and I think our friendship is a good one. Would this ruin it? He must have some need as he keeps finding excuses to come over etc. He has taken me to eat on occasion

and I find we are so much alike. Other people have noticed his attention to me and kid him but we both know there is something there yet have not openly discussed it.

 

Is an affair a horrible thing?

[Nameless]

well.... if u guys make a great couple..u have got to remember that he has a wife. I'm a bit old fashioned and have traditional beliefs on marriage and the phrases "till death do us part" and "through better or through worse". It isn't "till we get tired of each other" for a reason . So my answer would be yes, an affair with this man would be a pretty bad thing. U should probably confront him later and ask him about his feelings towards u and ask him wut he sees between the two of u in the future. But having an affair with him wud b pretty selfish. Yes, he is helping go through bad emotions, but like i said b4, their is always the wife.

[befuddled11]

Originally posted by Imagem

 

Is an affair a horrible thing?

 

How do you think his WIFE would answer that question?

 

He is married. Whether he's flirted with you or not, whether his marriage has rough spots to it (what marriage doesn't?), whether he's made you feel alive......none of this matters: he's married. Taken. Not available. Has committed his life and faithfulness to his wife.

 

I'm sorry but I have to seriously shake my head everytime I read posts like this...asking "is it wrong to have an affair?" (or "is it wrong to be part of an affair?")

 

I think it's really sad when right and wrong is so fuzzy to some people.

[Imagem]

Nameless thank you for your kind reply I do understand where you are coming from.

 

Befuddled, I was a wife once and do know how the wife would feel in this situation. That is my biggest problem with this whole scenario.

 

Am I fussy? no not at all! Many articles you read in the world today suggest an affair can be a healthy thing.

 

We go down many roads on this journey of life we just have to make sure we are strong enough to find our way back should we take a wrong turn along the way.

 

I have never been one to sit n the pedestal of judgement I believe that should be handled in court rooms. I do know that I have to be wise here

and be able to hold on to a good friendship or be strong enough to lose it. That is the part I am having trouble with as I do cherish this friendship.

Would it grow stronger or would it wither away.

 

Now the wife here is a very nice lady I am sure she is aware of his infatuation but I have to ask myself why doesn't she do anything to stop this? She sure has the power. She has also told me should anything happen to her for me to look out for him so that sort of made me wonder as well. Who knows I just have to stand back for a bit and really think this thru.

[jester]

If boundaries can be maintained, and expectations balanced, an affair, as to you, could be beneficial. Affairs, contrary to Hollywood and the moral ministry of mental health, are not always injurious to people or marriages.An affair , for the participants, can be exciting, intense, exhilarating and quite sexy--not just tawdry encounters in cheap hotel rooms.

 

Affairs and mind blowing great sex and white hot emotions frequently go hand-in-hand.

 

Affairs are the crack cocaine of sexual relationships--at least early on.

 

Affairs are best when symmetry exists: both parties are involved in long term marriages, which they do not want to end, but who enjoy one another immensely. I call those bilateral marital outlet affairs. These are much preferable to the "cakeman" affairs: married man strings along the single "other woman" forever so he can have his cake and eat his ice cream, too.

 

So, an affair is not always a horrible thing.

 

Now, let's sit back and watch the "morality" sparks fly.

[quankanne]

ask yourself this: Do you really want to be this kind of person?

 

I'll be honest here: Yes, there's something exciting about someone wanting you so much that he's willing to set aside propriety just to be with me, but it all boils down to whether or not I want to identify myself as someone who can easily walk away from my beliefs about marriage and morality to just reach out and grab that bit of excitement, no matter how much better I perceive it to look than my present situation.

 

Looking at it from that viewpoint, I'd have to say no each and every time I even entertained the thought of anything past casual flirting, because it's just not how I see myself.

 

Now the wife here is a very nice lady I am sure she is aware of his infatuation but I have to ask myself why doesn't she do anything to stop this? She sure has the power. She has also told me should anything happen to her for me to look out for him

 

maybe she has resigned herself to the fact that her husband has these impulses, and has identified you as someone who she feels is decent enough to be her replacement ... when the time comes. at this point, she's placing her trust in you to do "right" by both of them, is my theory.

[Imagem]

Jester, Thank you Thank you!! I was beginning to think I had lost my mind. You said it very elequently and I do agree with the part about expectations and boundaries. My problem is I really don't know what my expectations are other than having someone that cares in my life wheather living with me or separtely. I do not want to re-marry. We get along very well and have so much in common I think that is where this all started. Of course the harmless flirting didn't help.

 

Quankanne, What kind of person am I ? I am a good person who never thought she would be in this situation? Am I lonely as I have been a widow so long? I do not know. I know I miss someone in my life that cares and makes me Smile.

 

As for the mortality will I be hung from a cross if I make the wrong judgement? Look at the mess the moral community is in right now.

Do I listen to them or listen to my heart. I have to live with the consequences I know and that is what I have to decide.

 

I thank you all for your wonderful input it has helped me. I plan to stay away for a few days so I know in my heart whatever I do decide I have made a conscious right decision. Thak you all!!

[quankanne]

no, we won't be trotting you out to the "Hang 'em High" tree should you decide to do something that goes against a perceived set of morals, even if some of us (*ahem*) tend to squawk loudly about morality in these kinds of scenarios ... I just hate to see someone beat him- or herself for making decisions they normally wouldn't make.

 

I plan to stay away for a few days so I know in my heart whatever I do decide I have made a conscious right decision

and that's the best thing you can do for now -- mull it over until you come up with a decision YOU feel comfortable with. The "is this the kind of person I want to be" question is more about putting on the brakes so that a person seriously thinks things through, rather than acting rashly ...

[supermom]

I am a wife and just found out my husband cheated on me while I was preg and just found out about it (our daughter is 15mos old) I was and still am a WONDERFUL WIFE AND MOTHER and there was nothing I did wrong.

 

If you are willing to jepordize someone else's marriage and feelings then you need to take a long hard look at yourself. I am in depression right now being the wife cheated on and I want to beat up the OW still. I know its immature, but when you are betrayed like that it's hard.

 

DO NOT HAVE AN AFFAIR WITH THIS MAN AND BREAK UP THE MARRIAGE. THINK ABOUT THE WIFE. I'M SURE SHE LOVES HIM AND WOULD BE HEART BROKEN. You never know how someone will react. It could cause her irrepairable damage or worse. THINK BEFORE YOU LAY DOWN with a married man please. And if the friendship dies because you want to make a moral decision, LET IT DIE! Maybe you should meet his wife if you want to be so much of friends with her husband. DO NOT CROSS THE LINE.

[Thinkalot]

Well, you know my view. Yep- an affair is wrong, and flys against my moral beliefs. It is always complicated, and while it may provide short term gratification, it cause longterm harm.

 

Jester....can you see my morality sparks flying??

[jester]

Thinkalot, I respect your sparks because you never make it personal.

 

That I like.

[Papillon]

I'm not a moral person. I'm not IMmoral, just Amoral. So I don't judge people who have affairs, I've been in that boat myself, most probably BECAUSE of my amorality.

 

The problem with modern society is that the focus is on self-gratification, that's why we get euphemisms like "bilateral marital outlet affairs" [sic] . The focus has shifted from "what is best for the relationship" to "what is preferable to the person in the relationship". The relationship has to play second fiddle to the participants. Now, that's fine, I mean, relationships are ABOUT the people in them, but not when it shifts from "I am commited to your happiness, first" to "I am commited to my OWN happiness, first".

 

It's kind of an evil cycle....many affairs start because a participant starts to put his/her happiness first, most often because the OTHER person put theirs first in the first place.

 

Can you see what I'm getting at?

 

If only people were more commited to each other...then affairs would not even be necessary.

 

Imagem...don't fool yourself with this guy. If he was commited to you then he'd leave his wife. If he was commited to his wife then he wouldn't flirt with you. It's even possible that he's not commited to her because she's not commited to him. The whole lot reeks of selfishness, you included, and, from my own experience, I would personally not want that stink on myself ever again.

[tphillip]

Originally posted by Papillon

I'm not a moral person. I'm not IMmoral, just Amoral.

Wow, Papillion. I'd disregard ANY advice coming from you. Admitting that you have no morals makes me not trust any advice you give, regardless of what you say. I can only wonder from what POV you're coming from.

 

IMO an affair is bad not primarily from the sex, but from the broken bond of trust between two people. Imagen, if you have any respect for yourself, you would end your marriage before starting up another.

 

Think of it from the flip side too. Would you trust someone who you know does not value intimate relationships?

[dyermaker]

Originally posted by tphillip

Wow, Papillion. I'd disregard ANY advice coming from you. Admitting that you have no morals makes me not trust any advice you give, regardless of what you say. I can only wonder from what POV you're coming from.

 

Funny how judgemental people could be. I'd *rather* take advice from an amoral person. I know that I'd be judged based on consequences rather than offences. Papillon didn't say "I have no morals", he said he leaves morality out of his judgement of complex situations and people. That's an admirable POV, and is really more deserving of respect than condescending morality of little practicality.

[Papillon]

tphillip,

 

well said, but obviously you don't know me well enough to be that judgemental, do you?

 

I believe that morals are artificial (just consider the impact of bikini's on a 1890's beach to see my POV)...but ethics aren't. Now I know that's just semantical nit-picking, but I classify actions not according to their morality but by their ethicality.

 

Example:

Is it immoral to have sex with a person of the same gender? Quite possibly, but I don't give a ****. Is it Unethical? Not in the least. There simply is no way to classify the act but with "morality". But seeing as morality is artificial and flexible, any judgement based on it is artificial as well.

 

Capisce?

[tphillip]

Originally posted by Papillon

tphillip,

 

well said, but obviously you don't know me well enough to be that judgemental, do you?

I don't have to know much about you; I just have to take you at your word. You said that you're amoral. That means that you do not care about right or wrong. In other words, BY YOUR OWN ADMISSION, you have no ethics or morals. Why should I, or anyone for that matter, take your advice?

 

YOU can play semantic games all you want, but your words are quite plain and very clear. You cannot be amoral and have ethics.

 

Originally posted by Papillon

Capisce?

Very well.

[Imagem]

Tphillip you must not have read from the beginning or you would have seen that I am not married. He is... I have no desire to re-marry at all. I also have no desire to go into the world of dating. This friendship started over a year ago and has grown to a wonderful one. I would have much preferred it if he would have been single but that is not how the cards were played and I for one do not want to break his marriage up. That is why I was considering the affair in the first place.

 

Papillon, as for the modern society and the need for self gratifcation I want to tell you that my belief is modern society changes every day, look at how people are walking around today. As for the self gratification I know there are many ways to obtain that but that is not what I was looking for. If I wanted self gratifation you and I both know there are many ways to acheive that.

 

I was looking for a warm caring person that cares. One that I could curl up to now and then.Sex would not be the issue, just someone to hold me at times to say it is allright my friend. But I am sure sex would eventually come to play that is where the big "Affair" word comes to surface.Should we or shouln't we?

 

As of today I have decided no we should not. I am going to keep him close to my heart as a good friend and hope that we both can maintain ourselfs in a manner that will be acceptable to all involved. BUT IT WILL BE TOUGH! So be it...

[tphillip]

Originally posted by dyermaker

Papillon didn't say "I have no morals", he said he leaves morality out of his judgement of complex situations and people. That's an admirable POV, and is really more deserving of respect than condescending morality of little practicality.

Being amoral, by definition, means having no ethics or morals.

 

Would you really take advice from someone who has no principles? Does advice from someone who admits to having no moral or ethical compass at all make it somehow special? If so, how?

 

I know that I'd take advice from someone who's moral compass I disagree with long before I took advice from someone who has NO moral compass whatsoever.

[tphillip]

Originally posted by Imagem

Tphillip you must not have read from the beginning or you would have seen that I am not married.

My apologies.

 

But you do make the most important point:

 

Originally posted by Imagem

...and I for one do not want to break his marriage up.

From there, the answer is easy and you, IMO, make the right decision:

 

Originally posted by Imagem

As of today I have decided no we should not.

I have no doubt that it will be difficult given the feelings that the two of you have for each other. In fact, there may come a point where in order not to have an affair you have to have no contact at all.

 

It's important to find out where the line that you will not cross is. Most people don't know where that line is until they've crossed over it. And then they not only have to deal with the consequences of crossing that line, but also be unable to look in the mirror for a long time afterwards (Which IMO can be a lot more painful).

 

Good luck.

[VivianLee]

Yes if you are the one being cheated on...

 

Yes if you are related or friends with the one being cheated on...

 

Yes if you are related or friends with the one that is cheating..

 

Yes when you get caught and see how much the affair hurts those around you!

[Imagem]

Tphillip,

 

 

It's important to find out where the line that you will not cross is. Most people don't know where that line is until they've crossed over it. And then they not only have to deal with the consequences of crossing that line, but also be unable to look in the mirror for a long time afterwards (Which IMO can be a lot more painful).

 

Very well said! I could carry this on by looking at the saying of" No pain no gain" but I am not. So untill my next major issue I bid you all farewell and thank you for your objective opinions.

[Papillon]

Originally posted by tphillip

Being amoral, by definition, means having no ethics or morals.

 

Would you really take advice from someone who has no principles? Does advice from someone who admits to having no moral or ethical compass at all make it somehow special? If so, how?

 

I know that I'd take advice from someone who's moral compass I disagree with long before I took advice from someone who has NO moral compass whatsoever.

 

Heh...if you believe that not adhering to a moral code makes one incapable of distinguishing The Right Thing from The Wrong Thing, then you have a seriously narrow-minded view of the world. And trying to win an argument by quoting from dictionary.com is the sure mark of a loser. Good thing I don't misspell all that often, otherwise my personality would have even taken even MORE of a beating...

 

I'd like to put things into a little bit of perspective for you. The 9/11 terrorists adhered to a strict personal code of morals. Does that mean that they properly distinguished bewteen The Right Thing to do and The Wrong Thing to do?

 

Eh?

 

Heh...didn't think so. You probably don't go around bombing people, but their mindset is just a more extreme version of yours.

[tphillip]

Originally posted by Papillon

Heh...if you believe that not adhering to a moral code makes one incapable of distinguishing The Right Thing from The Wrong Thing, then you have a seriously narrow-minded view of the world. And trying to win an argument by quoting from dictionary.com is the sure mark of a loser.

If you have a problem with the English language, that's not my problem. You said that you were amoral, which means by any reasonable definition of the word that you do not care about right or wrong. If you disagree with the dictionary meaning of the word it's up to YOU to explain why your definition (Whatever that is since you haven't really said what the word means to you) is more accurate than the dictionary. That you refuse to explain your "definition" of the word amoral doesn't say much about you.

 

I also didn't say that not you did not KNOW the difference between right and wrong, I said that by your own admission that you do not CARE. In other words, by your own admission that you're amoral, if someone was being murdered it would make do difference to you if someone tried to prevent the murder or not. You would not care, because you're amoral. You can stop beating on that poor straw man you decided to drag into this argument now.

 

Originally posted by Papillon

I'd like to put things into a little bit of perspective for you. The 9/11 terrorists adhered to a strict personal code of morals. Does that mean that they properly distinguished bewteen The Right Thing to do and The Wrong Thing to do?

Their actions make them IMMORAL, not AMORAL. Again, I recommend that you firm up your grasp of the English language before you try to argue the meaning or words.

 

Originally posted by Papillon

Heh...didn't think so. You probably don't go around bombing people, but their mindset is just a more extreme version of yours.

Wow...Now you know how I think, when you can't understand the difference between immoral and amoral, or feel the need to misrepresent what I wrote in a forum message. Absolutely stunning.

 

When you're ready to actually argue what I wrote and explain to me how amoral in your mind is different from how the generally accepted definition of amoral you can PM me. I'm not going to waste my time agruing with someone who is unable to present their argument without the need for gratuitous personal attacks and inventing strawmen to beat up on.

[jester]

Being the "bilateral marital outlet affairs" [sic] guy, I believe that a case could be made for Imagem to have had an affair with this married guy. Imagem is lonely, widowed and does not want to re-marry. The MM finds her attractive, and would most likely take her as his lover while maintaining his marital and family responsibilities.

 

Imagem disclaims any intention of breaking up MM's happy household. All she wants is for him to hold her, to touch her, to relieve her loneliness. While there's a risk the wife will discover the affair, there's no likelihood. That risk is acceptable given Imagem's limited goals as to this affair.

 

If the affair happens, two people gain and no one is harmed absent disclosure or the marriage falling apart. In this case, the risk is acceptable so long as discretion is maintained. And there's one less lonely heart on this planet.

[EnigmaXOXO]

Imagen, you already have his ‘friendship,’ so why do you want more? If you take it to the next level, then where do you expect to go from there?

 

You ask:

 

I am having trouble with as I do cherish this friendship.

Would it grow stronger or would it wither away.

 

A friendship can last indefinitely, but affairs are more often a dead-end for the mistress. They fade out and wither away, leaving behind a lot of emotional wreckage in their wake. And I worry that in your needy state, you will only get more emotionally attached to this man and want more from him. A committed relationship is out of the question for you because he already has a wife. Its likely that you will only a provide a temporary muse for him until the next lonely, vulnerable lady comes along.

 

Perhaps this advice, given by Jester on another thread should also be considered. I worry that if you continue down the path you’re on, this may be what the future has in store for you. And you’ve got it straight from the horse’s mouth!

 

The silver lining in this cloud is that now you know where the mm stands: He will not divorce his life (wife) for you.

 

That gives you two basic choices: continue in this holding pattern as his side dish for 10 more years or end all contact with him now and move forward.

 

Option No.1 all but guarantees continued regret, frustration and anger over your permanent other woman status. If you want more pain and heartache, choose this option.

 

Option No. 2 , while wrenching in the short term, would give you a chance of a new life, with new people and lovers. The future is uncertain but better an uncertain future that certain grief.

 

kkat, select Door No. 2. It's there where the hope of a happy life awaits you.

__________________

jester