fck, this really hurts

[spriggig]

Sorry to thread-jack, but I noticed this and it kinda jumped out at me. The idea of giving up the need for an explanation. Does anyone ever really do that? I mean, don't we all, when you cut it to the marrow, want answers, explanations? Isn't it our ego thats damaged, and our pride and sense of selves? Don't we need to know why the people we love have abandoned us like this? Does that longing to know the answer ever go away?

 

Remember the childrens' game of innocently asking "why?" to every response? Yeah, it's like that. There is no ultimate answer. Confounding that simple truth is the fact that as half of the relationship in question, we'll only ever have at most half of the "truth". If Jung is to be believed, there are parts of our own mind that will always remain unknown to us, so even getting our own half straight is unlikely. The other half resides in the SO's mind and getting at it in any meaningful way is impossible.

 

Yes, we want to know. Often that search is driven by a desire to relieve our own guilt, our own sense of responsibility. At the end of a relationship we are desperate and defensive and trying to find a reason why we must be right instead of how we might be wrong. So, there again, is another roadblock to knowing the "why"--we don't really want to know why, we just want to feel better.

[TheUnthoughtKnown]

I believe this is probably the most difficult and constructive step a person can take towards having a more sound understanding of living. I have been working on it since I became an adult.

 

But then again you were quoting me. Maybe I'm peculiar.

 

Also this goes much deeper than just love lost and romantic relationships. That's just an obvious example, and the one most germane to this forum. For me personally, on this romantic facet of the larger topic, I can confidently say yes to "Does that longing to know the answer ever go away."

 

No, I agree with you, I think a huge step is understanding that you don't need those answers. Maybe they won't help me even if I did get them. Lets put forth a scenario: I call my ex right now and arrange a meeting tomorrow to which she agrees. At this meeting the next day she gives me the exact reasons why she decided to end our relationship so abruptly. Would that make me feel better? I doubt it. The frustrating thing is that I crave those answers...or do I simply crave another chance to see her? Its confusing. If I was to have a meeting with her in which she said she wouldn't give me answers, but she'd be willing to go on a date, take it slowly from there...I'll be honest; I wouldn't be able to say yes fast enough.

[welikeincrowds]

I sense that you have unfinished business with your ex. Can you resolve that within yourself?

 

This is the impression I got; of course I think it's a rare breakup that does not conclude in unfinished business, especially not one that ends so abruptly.

 

The connection between this and death is genius. I know that the element of rejection makes a difference between the two, but the sadness, loss, anger surrounding someone close to you who has left your life -- it's all so much clearer when put into that context, that we have imaginary arguments with our exes just to let go of those feelings, those letters of unfinished business.

 

I'm not going to beat myself up for making one call when he just sent me a serious blow. That's stupid and isn't going to help me heal right now.

 

As well you shouldn't beat yourself up -- you've already punished yourself by doing it in the first place, so why throw salt in your own wounds?

 

But do listen to what you are implying. "I'm not going to examine my own actions -- because just look at this guy's!"

 

TaraMaiden gave you sound advice, directing you toward becoming a stronger and better person who takes good care of herself; yet you were quick to dismiss it, citing an emotional detail involving a mistake that you yourself made. Shadow, you have no right to be mad at him for changing his number, because you were the one who made the choice to find out -- all while you were plainly warned, from LS and from your ex himself, that no good would come.

 

That is one of the themes in this thread: that for whatever reason, you decided to keep the ex in your life when it was clear that pain would come. This was your decision. The sooner you realize that you too are accountable, and that, ultimately, this is your life and these are your feelings, the more will you learn, and the sooner will you heal.

[ingridh]

TaraMaiden gave you sound advice, directing you toward becoming a stronger and better person who takes good care of herself; yet you were quick to dismiss it, citing an emotional detail involving a mistake that you yourself made.

 

Absolutely, wholeheartedly, 100% agreed.

 

It is called tough love.

 

Maybe, your ex is doing the same thing. Maybe, after staying friends with you, he senses that you still have (romantic) feelings for him, that you have hopes for you two to be back together, that your 'actions' and 'words' are not just friendslike.... which are all natural, most of us do wish our exes back. However, that is not what he wants. And he cares too much to hurt you again. So the only way he has to do is to chop the cord and cease all communication so that you won't sink any deeper. TOUGH. LOVE.

 

After he told you to STOP. CONTACTING. HIM., what did you do? You called. And what would stop you from calling, again and again and again? Nothing. Except to change his number. He did the right thing, for your sake. TOUGH. LOVE.

 

He wanted you to move on, without him. The only way is for him to totally disappear from your life. He is doing this for you, because you can't do this yourself. Remember that song?

 

"If I should stay

I would only be in your way.

So I'll go.

But I know

I'll think of you every step of

the way.."

 

Maybe, that is just what he is doing.

[Jilly Bean]

He just changed his number. WTF. What is he going to do, put a restraining order on me next? What a bastard.

 

Why did you contact him, Shadow?

 

Sounds like he did the right thing, because even though he told you never to contact him again, you went and did just that. He knows you well, for sure.

 

But, I'm curious. Even after he tells you via text that he never wants to hear from you again, why oh why would you contact him? What did you have to say?

 

And I doubt he changed his number. He probably just blocked you. Which is actually a good thing, since this will prevent you from trying to reach him again.

 

Great takeaways from this painful episode, however.

[shadowplay]

Absolutely, wholeheartedly, 100% agreed.

 

It is called tough love.

 

Maybe, your ex is doing the same thing. Maybe, after staying friends with you, he senses that you still have (romantic) feelings for him, that you have hopes for you two to be back together, that your 'actions' and 'words' are not just friendslike.... which are all natural, most of us do wish our exes back. However, that is not what he wants. And he cares too much to hurt you again. So the only way he has to do is to chop the cord and cease all communication so that you won't sink any deeper. TOUGH. LOVE.

 

After he told you to STOP. CONTACTING. HIM., what did you do? You called. And what would stop you from calling, again and again and again? Nothing. Except to change his number. He did the right thing, for your sake. TOUGH. LOVE.

 

He wanted you to move on, without him. The only way is for him to totally disappear from your life. He is doing this for you, because you can't do this yourself. Remember that song?

 

"If I should stay

I would only be in your way.

So I'll go.

But I know

I'll think of you every step of

the way.."

 

Maybe, that is just what he is doing.

 

Yeah, and what he's doing is ****ty and cowardly because he has promised me over and over that he wouldn't (often he volunteered this himself). That he would tell me in person first if he ever wanted to cut off contact.

 

If that's your idea of tough love then I don't need it. In all due respect, fck off.

[shadowplay]

Look guys, I don't need a beating on contacting him once when I received that chilling text from him out of the blue. I'm find with receiving criticism on staying in touch with him for so long, but I think my reaction to his text was pretty natural given all the times he had promised me he wouldn't do something like that.

 

This thread is going in a nasty direction, and it's not helping me at all. Before I got some helpful advice that was improving my outlook. I don't need this.

[shadowplay]

 

As well you shouldn't beat yourself up -- you've already punished yourself by doing it in the first place, so why throw salt in your own wounds?

 

But do listen to what you are implying. "I'm not going to examine my own actions -- because just look at this guy's!"

 

TaraMaiden gave you sound advice, directing you toward becoming a stronger and better person who takes good care of herself; yet you were quick to dismiss it, citing an emotional detail involving a mistake that you yourself made. Shadow, you have no right to be mad at him for changing his number, because you were the one who made the choice to find out -- all while you were plainly warned, from LS and from your ex himself, that no good would come.

 

That is one of the themes in this thread: that for whatever reason, you decided to keep the ex in your life when it was clear that pain would come. This was your decision. The sooner you realize that you too are accountable, and that, ultimately, this is your life and these are your feelings, the more will you learn, and the sooner will you heal.

 

And I'm fine with examining and regretting staying in touch with him, but I don't need to be criticized for calling him in the heat of the moment when he send me a bruising blow, OK? And then told a restraining order would be expected or justified.

[shadowplay]

IngridH: He is not doing this for me. If he were, he would have talked to me in person, because he knows that would be much less painful for me. (we've discussed this.) Had he I would have respected his decision, and I wouldn't have been feeling nearly as crushed as I am now. What really stings is he did exactly what he said he wouldn't.

 

If I know anything about my ex it's that he's a selfish, cowardly person and this is all about him and has nothing to do with me.

[TaraMaiden]

Shadow, now you're being childish.

 

There's nothing respectful about profanities.

That's the kind of post that gets you infractions, and even banned, so watch your mouth.

I for one, am old enough to be your mother, and if you wouldn;'t talk to an older person like this in real life, think about how you approach all other people who after all, are here to try to give you some kind of support.

 

You're going to read things you don't like reading. That doesn't make them invalid, or untrue.

 

you went out with the guy for around 2 months, and here you are, four and a half months later, still paralysing yourself with this punishment.

 

Give him what is his to own, but you also have to own your part.

I took a look at your 18 pages of threads, and there's a lot of talk of insecurity, clinginess, neediness and broken NC.

 

Your major project is not this guy, or any other guy.

Your major project for repair, restoration and revival, is you.

Consider yourself a work of art, and treat yourself like the precious original you are.

 

Focus less on what's gone wrong, and focus more on what you need to put right.

 

because the more you stay stuck here, the deeper the swamp will suck you in.

And nobody will be able to pull you out.

 

Is that what you want?

[shadowplay]

This is the impression I got; of course I think it's a rare breakup that does not conclude in unfinished business, especially not one that ends so abruptly.

 

The connection between this and death is genius. I know that the element of rejection makes a difference between the two, but the sadness, loss, anger surrounding someone close to you who has left your life -- it's all so much clearer when put into that context, that we have imaginary arguments with our exes just to let go of those feelings, those letters of unfinished business.

 

 

 

As well you shouldn't beat yourself up -- you've already punished yourself by doing it in the first place, so why throw salt in your own wounds?

 

But do listen to what you are implying. "I'm not going to examine my own actions -- because just look at this guy's!"

 

TaraMaiden gave you sound advice, directing you toward becoming a stronger and better person who takes good care of herself; yet you were quick to dismiss it, citing an emotional detail involving a mistake that you yourself made. Shadow, you have no right to be mad at him for changing his number, because you were the one who made the choice to find out -- all while you were plainly warned, from LS and from your ex himself, that no good would come.

 

That is one of the themes in this thread: that for whatever reason, you decided to keep the ex in your life when it was clear that pain would come. This was your decision. The sooner you realize that you too are accountable, and that, ultimately, this is your life and these are your feelings, the more will you learn, and the sooner will you heal.

 

Given that he has promised me MULTIPLE times he would never suddenly cut me out of his life without talking to me about it first, and he knows I have huge abandonment issues. And that he promised me just this yesterday and also affirmed that he values our friendship and wants to stay my friend, I have ever right to be angry that he changed his number out of the blue.

[shadowplay]

look, I'm not on here to defend myself, and I resent that LS threads often diverge in a nasty direction.

 

I admit that I made a huge mistake in keeping him in my life and trusting him. Nobody's going to convince me that what he did to me today, breaking all my trust yet again, wasn't ****ty.

 

If people have advice about how to process this and move on I'm all ears. I've appreciated the positive input I've received so far, and it has helped me figure things out in my brain.

[anne1707]

If I know anything about my ex it's that he's a selfish, cowardly person and this is all about him and has nothing to do with me.

 

 

Based on what you have posted about your ex, I do get the impression that he is a no good piece of sh&t. However you are continuing to post about him and contact him when he asks you not to months after your relationship ended. In fact if my memory serves me well, your dating relationship with him was less than the 4.5 months that you have been posting about the break up.

 

For heavens sake woman! You complain about him putting himself first. Well so what - after all this, what does he owe you. How about YOU put YOURself first for a change and stop wasting YOUR time on him.

[WintersNightTraveler]

If people have advice about how to process this and move on I'm all ears.

 

- When people break trust repeatedly, it's all about them, not about you

- ****ty events that happen later with someone don't devalue the meaningful events that happened before

- Personally I just go do the most intense exercise I can at such times

 

Good luck...

[shadowplay]

However you are continuing to post about him and contact him when he asks you not to months after your relationship ended. In fact if my memory serves me well, your dating relationship with him was less than the 4.5 months that you have been posting about the break up.

 

For heavens sake woman! You complain about him putting himself first. Well so what - after all this, what does he owe you. How about YOU put YOURself first for a change and stop wasting YOUR time on him.

 

It's not that simple. He wanted a friendship with me and was often initiating. We did things together. He took me out on my birthday and bought me gifts. He frequently told me he valued our friendship, still loved me, etc. etc. This is stuff he volunteered, and I stupidly thought I could trust him as af riend.

 

If he genuinely wanted a friendship as he said, and I believed, then yeah he does owe me some respect.

[TaraMaiden]

look, I'm not on here to defend myself, and I resent that LS threads often diverge in a nasty direction.

Why swear at people and use profanities? The best way to handle insults is to ignore them. And nobody here has insulted you.

Including me, whatever you may think.

I'm just going by your 18 pages of threads, which as I say, give an incredible whole picture of what drives you....

 

I admit that I made a huge mistake in keeping him in my life and trusting him. Nobody's going to convince me that what he did to me today, breaking all my trust yet again, wasn't ****ty.

Nobody's tried to. Nobody has said that what he did was right, justified, reasonable or correct.

 

If people have advice about how to process this and move on I'm all ears. I've appreciated the positive input I've received so far, and it has helped me figure things out in my brain.

 

I take it you've read my posts?

You drop focus on him, completely, and focus entirely on building a better, all-new-and-improved you.

And you do that by putting yourself first, realising that 'abandonment issues' are just two words which pull you under, and understanding that the only person who can put one foot in front of the other towards making yourself whole again - is you.

We can talk until we're blue in the face. if you don't put words into actions, our positive input is worth diddly-squat.

[anne1707]

But even when you were dating, he proved that you could not depend on him. I remember you posting on here in the hours after you had your abortion and he was not with you. That should have told you all you need to know about this man yet even now you continue to idealise him. If he was not there for you then, why on earth should he be there for you now.

[WintersNightTraveler]

If he genuinely wanted a friendship as he said, and I believed, then yeah he does owe me some respect.

 

Someone can genuinely want something, and at the same time act in ways that completely sabotage that. People with addiction problems are the most obvious example. They often genuinely want to improve, while at the same time act erratically, lie without even realizing it, etc. I think some of the self destructive behavior related to relationships is similar (but typically much less extreme).

 

So if you're getting caught up on the notion of reconciling how he could say he genuinely wanted a friendship, and then do all kind of things that worked against that goal, maybe this will help to not get so caught up on that notion. Likewise how he could be so disrespectful when he seemed to want to maintain civil terms.

 

Or put simply, maybe he really did want that, but couldn't pull it off, and it's not something you could have overcome on your end.

[Jilly Bean]

Shadow - you owe yourself respect FIRST before you can expect it from anyone else.

 

You're pissed he was a dick, again, because deep down, you know you're to blame for this.

 

He's a sadist, and you're a masochist. Truth. This comes up in all of your relationships. Once it's over, you become a mess and try to maintain some type of contact, as if your self-worth depends on it.

 

IT DOESN'T.

 

Everything you need is WITHIN you, Shadow. It doesn't reside in what you perceive to be validation from someone else. Particuarly someone who has already shown you who he is.

 

The real fault here, and probably why posters are frustrated, is that you brought this on yourself.

 

The first breakup - you got, and received, total sympathy. But this go-around, sorry my friend, you brought this into your world SHEERLY by the fact you still allowed him in your world.

 

He told you and showed you exactly who he is. Problem was, you didn't want to listen or see.

 

Honestly, if someone did me like he did you - he would be dead to me. Similarly, if someone told me to never contact them again, I wouldn't.

 

Sometimes the things you do seem to be designed to hurt yourself, and that is just painful for us all to witness.

 

In the meantime, how to move on? You learn from this. You don't try to think of how to talk with him again, and you don't villify him for basically being him. You accept responsibility for your part in allowing this to happen, because if you don't, you will repeat this over and over. And NO ONE wants to see you do that...

 

Is Bart's still open? Maybe it's time for a triple scoop hot fudge sundae.

[shadowplay]

And nobody here has insulted you.

Including me, whatever you may think.

I'm just going by your 18 pages of threads, which as I say, give an incredible whole picture of what drives you....

 

You say you're not insulting me, yet the bolded sentence certainly sounds like an underhanded insult...unless I'm misunderstanding you.

 

Nobody's tried to. Nobody has said that what he did was right, justified, reasonable or correct.

Check out ingrid's post on the previous page. She was implying he was justified in his actions.

 

 

I take it you've read my posts?

 

Yeah, I read them, and I did and still do find it insulting that you implied a restraining order might be on its way for me. I think anyone would find that comment insulting, and you have yet to apologize, or, if I misunderstand you, clarify what you meant. It was a bad idea to maintain contact with him, but I'm not a freakin' stalker. And I've never harassed him in any way. Edited August 15, 2010 by shadowplay

[threebyfate]

I read the first few pages and didn't bother with the rest, so if this is a repetition of anyone else's advice, oh well.

 

Shadow, as another member coined, your ex is a "nancy boy". You gave him the responsibility of your emotional well-being and he's ducked it twice. But to be fair, it's a helluva' responsibility and one he should never have agreed to take on in the first place. Had he pushed you back at the onset, none of this would have happened.

 

Yes, you have a right to be royally pissed off at him for his proven weakness and inability to express himself.

[shadowplay]

Jilly, there isn't anything you've written that I don't agree with. Just for the record, my comments weren't directed at you.

[shadowplay]

I read the first few pages and didn't bother with the rest, so if this is a repetition of anyone else's advice, oh well.

 

Shadow, as another member coined, your ex is a "nancy boy". You gave him the responsibility of your emotional well-being and he's ducked it twice. But to be fair, it's a helluva' responsibility and one he should never have agreed to take on in the first place. Had he pushed you back at the onset, none of this would have happened.

 

Yes, you have a right to be royally pissed off at him for his proven weakness and inability to express himself.

 

How did I give him the responsibility of my emotional being when we were in a relationship, though? I did have some insecure moments, but overall he probably relied on me emotionally a lot more than I did on him.

[threebyfate]

How did I give him the responsibility of my emotional being when we were in a relationship, though? I did have some insecure moments, but overall he probably relied on me emotionally a lot more than I did on him.

You relied on him for both the romantic and social aspects of your life. He was your best friend and lover, to a degree where he had discomfort since it caused dissonance between his need to please his family and also to be there for you.

 

A stronger man wouldn't have buckled. But a stronger man would have pushed you back on your needs. Let's say at the beginning of your romantic relationship, he pushed you back and stood firm on time allocated and relationship boundaries. Would you have respected him for it or would you have kept pushing or lost respect for him?

 

Keep in mind that you do need to be in control of the relationship.

 

Hopefully you know that I'm not trying to attack you.

[shadowplay]

You relied on him for both the romantic and social aspects of your life. He was your best friend and lover, to a degree where he had discomfort since it caused dissonance between his need to please his family and also to be there for you.

 

A stronger man wouldn't have buckled. But a stronger man would have pushed you back on your needs. Let's say at the beginning of your romantic relationship, he pushed you back and stood firm on time allocated and relationship boundaries. Would you have respected him for it or would you have kept pushing or lost respect for him?

 

Keep in mind that you do need to be in control of the relationship.

 

Hopefully you know that I'm not trying to attack you.

 

Yeah, I would have respected that. If anything, it would have increased my respect for him. Of course I can't say with certainty how I would have reacted, since it's never happened before, but I feel confident that I would have responded positively. It was the lack of communication and shock of the break up that got to me.