What did mm/mw tell you about BS?

[KarmasTestDummy]

I know the role I played for my MM was a shoulder to cry on and a sounding board. Many of our conversations centered around how horrible the M is and what a terrible person she is. I heard everything about her from being a druggie/alcoholic, cheater, pathological liar, abusive verbally and even occasionally physical, compulsive spender, and pretty much all around psycho.

 

If everything is true, they haven't shared a bed for 4 years or had intercourse for 6 months. I wonder how much is true and how much is embellished to somehow rectify his actions. Did you run into similar stories about the BS? Did you later find out they were full of crap? I have no desire to go to the W so I may never know, but I have to admit I'm curious if she's as awful as he makes her out to be. I'd feel horrible to later find out she was quite a lovely person just trying to make her marriage work like so many of us would be doing if the table was turned.

 

I only wonder I think because I used to be a BW. The things my H told his OW about me were so far from the truth. I supposedly emotionally closed him out. I stopped desiring him. He told her we hadn't had intercourse my entire pregnancy or the four months following my son's birth (despite the fact that we were up until the day he was born). I have a feeling that had he painted an honest picture of our relationship her feelings about him would have been entirely different.

Edited September 8, 2010 by KarmasTestDummy

[BB07]

Good thread and topic.

 

Wow, I don't know where to start. As you probably don't know since you are new, I thought I was dating a smm, but in fact he was very much married, but anyway......I was told that she had threatened his life, told that she was more interested in his money than him. She didn't really love him, loved him for what he could bring to the marriage, (material things), was told she was possibly mentally unbalanced, was told that she was trying to nail him to the wall concerning financial matters, oh there is more but right now I can't remember it all but there was an incredible amount of lies that he told me about her and he told her about me.

And........I did find out that it was NOT true, since I and the bs had many, many long conversations discovering all the many untruths he told to both of us.

[Fallen Angel]

He says that she is a nice person. That she is intelligent. That she has been a great mother to his children and a good wife. He says that he respects her as a person. He says that she has done nothing to deserve being hurt. He says that he loves her.

 

He says that they have grown apart. He says that they have spent most of their marriage living separately. (He was in the military for 22 yrs, often deployed to other states/countries where she did not follow).

 

He says that he loves me. He says that he is in love with me.

[KarmasTestDummy]

Well darn it, where did my reply go? I have to stop typing on my phone. Too many errors and my stuff just disappeared into thin air.

[siuys]

My MM never spoke badly of his W. Things just didn't work out, and of course they had issues but he never bad-mouthed her in any way. I find that respectful, and honest, and I think I'd be suspicious if he had told me that she was terrible, bla bla. If your MM's W is so terrible, why is he still in the M? My MM and his W have a decent relationship, and courteous and respectful to each other, just not working as a couple. Plus he said she is the mother of my children... if she was so terrible, he wouldn't want her near his kids I would imagine...

[Confused4Now]

Wow awesome topic....personally I think in the beginning my xMW painted this picture of her H. Started with the emotional abuse and verbal abuse. He got busted trying to setup up something with escorts...he was looking heavily at porn online. He would bring drugs into the bedroom. So she painted this picture of a horrible person and said how she felt she'd been living this lie in her marriage all this time. She knew this about him throughout the marriage.

 

But she's still there...I guess it can't be that bad right?

[KarmasTestDummy]

Wow awesome topic....personally I think in the beginning my xMW painted this picture of her H. Started with the emotional abuse and verbal abuse. He got busted trying to setup up something with escorts...he was looking heavily at porn online. He would bring drugs into the bedroom. So she painted this picture of a horrible person and said how she felt she'd been living this lie in her marriage all this time. She knew this about him throughout the marriage.

 

But she's still there...I guess it can't be that bad right?

 

Yes, it can be that bad and a person still stay. I speak from experience there. My 'ex' h and I were together for 10 years. He started abusing me 3 months in. I stayed. He was doing meth, unemployed for 90% of our relationship. He ignored our children, he brought his other woman into our home and hid the fact that her two children were his for 4 years while he let her pretend to have boyfriends and be my best friend. I suspected for a long time, yet I stayed. The final straw was the day I was told all the facts (undeniable facts) from a mutual friend, and I confronted OW. She got hysterical, attacked me, told me to just f'in leave and let her have what was rightfully hers once and for all. He woke up and came out to find us fighting. He pulled us apart and when I called her a whore he attacked me' too. It was my moment of pure clarity. I waited and calmed down. He took her in the other room to check on her and find out what it was all about, and I called the cops for the first time after 10 years. I moved out that day and said they were soulmates...without a doubt meant for eachother. A year later they are still together....despite the felony assault charges she has filed on him herself. But yes...we stay...until we hit rock bottom...but that moment...that one moment can make all the difference in the world.

[KarmasTestDummy]

My MM never spoke badly of his W. Things just didn't work out, and of course they had issues but he never bad-mouthed her in any way. I find that respectful, and honest, and I think I'd be suspicious if he had told me that she was terrible, bla bla. If your MM's W is so terrible, why is he still in the M? My MM and his W have a decent relationship, and courteous and respectful to each other, just not working as a couple. Plus he said she is the mother of my children... if she was so terrible, he wouldn't want her near his kids I would imagine...

 

I'm sadly comforted by the fact that their M is awful and on a one track course towards divorce. I think mine has nothing left to stay for. If he can get the custody issue resolved he could care less what happens to her. I think it has helped me' as well in my guilt of becoming an OW. Not that it is an excuse, or that I even have to justify myself or reasoning to anyone, but had I felt they had a future and he was going to tell me' he still loved her at any moment..I would have walked. The most good he has ever said was that he loved her at one time and that she will always be the mother of his children. I can respect that.

[Fallen Angel]

Yes, it can be that bad and a person still stay. I speak from experience there. My 'ex' h and I were together for 10 years. He started abusing me 3 months in. I stayed. He was doing meth, unemployed for 90% of our relationship. He ignored our children, he brought his other woman into our home and hid the fact that her two children were his for 4 years while he let her pretend to have boyfriends and be my best friend. I suspected for a long time, yet I stayed. The final straw was the day I was told all the facts (undeniable facts) from a mutual friend, and I confronted OW. She got hysterical, attacked me, told me to just f'in leave and let her have what was rightfully hers once and for all. He woke up and came out to find us fighting. He pulled us apart and when I called her a whore he attacked me' too. It was my moment of pure clarity. I waited and calmed down. He took her in the other room to check on her and find out what it was all about, and I called the cops for the first time after 10 years. I moved out that day and said they were soulmates...without a doubt meant for eachother. A year later they are still together....despite the felony assault charges she has filed on him herself. But yes...we stay...until we hit rock bottom...but that moment...that one moment can make all the difference in the world.

 

If I didn't know better I would swear you were married to my xH. He was very similar. (he didn't move them in or have kids with them, that i know of) Except the one time one of his OW attacked me when he and I were out together and she happened upon us, it was me he defended. Not that that makes him any different than yours except in that he knew I kept the bills paid.....

[Fallen Angel]

I'm sadly comforted by the fact that their M is awful and on a one track course towards divorce. I think mine has nothing left to stay for. If he can get the custody issue resolved he could care less what happens to her. I think it has helped me' as well in my guilt of becoming an OW. Not that it is an excuse, or that I even have to justify myself or reasoning to anyone, but had I felt they had a future and he was going to tell me' he still loved her at any moment..I would have walked. The most good he has ever said was that he loved her at one time and that she will always be the mother of his children. I can respect that.

 

I feel differently about this. I think the fact that he says he loves her is encouraging to me. It means to me that he is not taking a relationship with me lightly. If he despised her, it would have been easy for him to fall in love with someone else and move on. The fact that he does care about her means that when he loves someone it is not an "easy come, easy go" kind of love.

 

It means that he understands and values love. It means that his words and actions of love and commitment to me are valuable in that he knows that his love for me is possibly painful to someone else he truly cares about, but his love for me is important enough to him so that he is unwilling to give it up, even to possibly spare that someone else he cares for pain.

 

If that makes any sense to anyone but me.

 

Sometimes I even confuse myself.....

[KarmasTestDummy]

If I didn't know better I would swear you were married to my xH. He was very similar. (he didn't move them in or have kids with them, that i know of) Except the one time one of his OW attacked me when he and I were out together and she happened upon us, it was me he defended. Not that that makes him any different than yours except in that he knew I kept the bills paid.....

 

Haha..well I think that's exactly why they stayed so long with me' there. I'm certain he had her convinced that they needed me' around. I worked two jobs and supported all of us including her two kids for a year of that time, while they both went without working. When my suspicion started getting the best of me' I quit one and got her hired on at my primary place of employment. I figured it'd be easier on me, and I would make it harder on them to have a A if that was what was going on. I knew at least she was on the same schedule as me' everyday and if they were sneaking around they'd have to be really good at it...they were. But darn it if that wasn't a dumb idea because now I still have to see her face everyday at work.

[pureinheart]

I know the role I played for my MM was a shoulder to cry on and a sounding board. Many of our conversations centered around how horrible the M is and what a terrible person she is. I heard everything about her from being a druggie/alcoholic, cheater, pathological liar, abusive verbally and even occasionally physical, compulsive spender, and pretty much all around psycho.

 

If everything is true, they haven't shared a bed for 4 years or had intercourse for 6 months. I wonder how much is true and how much is embellished to somehow rectify his actions. Did you run into similar stories about the BS? Did you later find out they were full of crap? I have no desire to go to the W so I may never know, but I have to admit I'm curious if she's as awful as he makes her out to be. I'd feel horrible to later find out she was quite a lovely person just trying to make her marriage work like so many of us would be doing if the table was turned.

 

I only wonder I think because I used to be a BW. The things my H told his OW about me were so far from the truth. I supposedly emotionally closed him out. I stopped desiring him. He told her we hadn't had intercourse my entire pregnancy or the four months following my son's birth (despite the fact that we were up until the day he was born). I have a feeling that had he painted an honest picture of our relationship her feelings about him would have been entirely different.

 

Hi KTD,

 

I would say a lot of the time if a WS communicates abuse, it usually is the truth.

 

ExDM never said anything unkind about his ex until the D...he had every reason to communicate the actual negativity that was going on. Everyone else talked about the way he was being treated (He didn't treat them well either). Many people made comments of their disgust to me as they had known exDM for many years.

 

I was a BS also, and I didn't care what anyone thought or said about me, especially a H. I was too up in my own business, and what others say and think is none of my business.

 

In bold, KTD, IMO you were you, you were being genuine, if he wasn't then that's his problem...you continue being you!

[KarmasTestDummy]

Hi KTD,

 

I would say a lot of the time if a WS communicates abuse, it usually is the truth.

 

ExDM never said anything unkind about his ex until the D...he had every reason to communicate the actual negativity that was going on. Everyone else talked about the way he was being treated (He didn't treat them well either). Many people made comments of their disgust to me as they had known exDM for many years.

 

I was a BS also, and I didn't care what anyone thought or said about me, especially a H. I was too up in my own business, and what others say and think is none of my business.

 

In bold, KTD, IMO you were you, you were being genuine, if he wasn't then that's his problem...you continue being you!

 

Thank you. I know I gave him all of me. I never led him to think I was anything but sincere, honest and loving. I think he gave me' the same. I may never know. But if it was enough then we shall see what the future holds. I wonder if they take longer than a couple of months they resolve not to make contact anyway, even when it's fixed, maybe for fear of finding you happy and involved in another relationship, and fearing they would stir up things and feel disappointed if that were the case. Is sometimes the fantasy more enjoyable than risking your pride and popping back in unwanted and unloved.

[TinaniT]

He said very little in the beginning other than she was a good woman, but he didn't love her romantically and never would, and they hadn't had sex for years. More came out as we got more and more involved about her depression, ignoring of basic responsibilities, etc. He moved out to a separate bed shortly after we got together, and not long after initiated the divorce. As we've moved forward, everything he told me was the absolute truth.

 

 

On the alternate side, as a WS, everything I told him was true. I held back some early on because it's embarrassing and claimed my exH was better than he was, but never lied.

 

You definitely hear of people lying about BS, but it just wasn't my experience, or that of my friends (who have an unusually high percentage, judging from here, of the WS leaving for the OP, so maybe there is a correlation in the honesty.)

[Lizzie60]

We don't talk about the BS most of the time.. but, ALL of my MMs have good things to say about their wives.. their only complaint is the lack of sex... for the rest, everything is great. They have absolutely no reason to lie to me.. because I often advise them on how to get more sex..

[jj33]

I have to say if someone went on and on about how awful the M was I would wonder why they hadnt packed their bags long ago. If its that bad, people leave subject to very special circumstances (like OWomans) but there are so many bad Ms and a 50% divorce rate so that would not wash with me.

 

He said never said anything particularly nice about her and never maligned her character. There were things he mentioned which made me think why are you two even married for example, he admitted to being very lonely in the marriage, but we never dwelled on it as it wasnt my business. Their marriage their deal. For various reasons he stays.

[Moanin]

On the alternate side, as a WS, everything I told him was true. I held back some early on because it's embarrassing and claimed my exH was better than he was, but never lied.

 

I did the same thing. I made my marriage sound better than it actually was/is. I think I was too ashamed to be completely honest.

[Ellin]

Yes, it can be that bad and a person still stay. I speak from experience there. My 'ex' h and I were together for 10 years. He started abusing me 3 months in. I stayed. He was doing meth, unemployed for 90% of our relationship. He ignored our children, he brought his other woman into our home and hid the fact that her two children were his for 4 years while he let her pretend to have boyfriends and be my best friend. I suspected for a long time, yet I stayed. The final straw was the day I was told all the facts (undeniable facts) from a mutual friend, and I confronted OW. She got hysterical, attacked me, told me to just f'in leave and let her have what was rightfully hers once and for all. He woke up and came out to find us fighting. He pulled us apart and when I called her a whore he attacked me' too. It was my moment of pure clarity. I waited and calmed down. He took her in the other room to check on her and find out what it was all about, and I called the cops for the first time after 10 years. I moved out that day and said they were soulmates...without a doubt meant for eachother. A year later they are still together....despite the felony assault charges she has filed on him herself. But yes...we stay...until we hit rock bottom...but that moment...that one moment can make all the difference in the world.

 

I know what you're talking about KTD.

 

I was in abusive M for 11 years. When I look back I can't believe what I put up with. And before I got involved with my xH, I could never understand how any woman would stay with this type of man. Until it happened to me.

 

Someone who's never been there won't understand.

 

You managed to become stronger and get yourself out of that destruction. Hope you're in much better place now.

 

I managed to do the same and there was no one else involved in my life at the time. I just wonder what it would be like if, whilst in the middle of the abuse and craziness, I had met someone who would give me so much love and support - would I have found it easier to end the M sooner? I just don't know as I haven't been in this situation, but I know of some people who stay for the abuse to continue, even though they have someone else willing to make them happy.

Edited September 8, 2010 by Ellin

[Silly_Girl]

I managed to do the same and there was no one else involved in my life at the time. I just wonder what it would be like if, whilst in the middle of the abuse and craziness, I had met someone who would give me so much love and support - would I have found it easier to end the M sooner? I just don't know as I haven't been in this situation, but I know of some people who stay for the abuse to continue, even though they have someone else willing to make them happy.

 

I used to wish I'd meet someone, I had a day about 18 months before the end of my 8yr stretch (!) where I gave myself permission to cheat, if the opportunity arose. Because I thought it was the ONLY way I'd ever escape. I never met anyone else, deep down didn't want to and reality sunk in that my ex would probably kill anyone I became involved with. But it's amazing how black and white things look from the outside, and just are not when you're actually living it.

[Tsm]

nothing really, we have never discussed her, i guess both never thought it was necessary

[Ellin]

I did the same thing. I made my marriage sound better than it actually was/is. I think I was too ashamed to be completely honest.

 

This is my experience too, but from the other side.

 

Once I got briefly re-involved with my First Great Love after not seeing him for years. The meeting made me realise that my feelings for him were still alive. We talked about how our lives had been and he told me initially that he had great M. With time, as we got closer and more comfortable with saying things as they were, I found out that his M was anything but great.

 

But when he eventually told me that he didn't love her (although they were still having sex, but he said it was on his part out of duty, so to speak, and didn't really enjoy it), I was suspicious and though it was just so classic - what all MM say about their W to OW. Time verified his words later and it was indeed true, his W was unbearable to live with and some years later he D her.

 

Similar things happened in my life recently - another man told me he was happy with the woman in his life, but it was far from the truth. He was embarrassed to say it the way it was and was minimising the bad parts until we got to know each other more and he started to trust me.

 

Thinking about it, I did the same thing when I was in abusive M, I was ashamed to reveal to some people (don't mean AP) the way things were at home.

[Silly_Girl]

Ellin, same for me with my MM "things are not 'bad' at home', "things could be worse", "she's a really good person"; all turned out to be vague ways of ignoring deep-seated issues, unhappiness, even control issues. It took ages for things to be talked about on an instance by instance basis.

 

He was ashamed. He felt he'd 'allowed' things to happen and therefore had no right or place to subsequently to complain about them; least of all to someone outside of the M.

[someday]

As a former BW one of the things that absolutely ticked me off was the thought of my H sharing information about me with her. She's no business knowing me on any level unless I shared that info with her.

 

My guy friend and I don't talk about our spouses. He wants to bring up how much he hates my H but I stop the conversation because my H is not his business unless I share that info with him, which I won’t. I will not listen to him try to do the 'poor me' thing because 1) I like his W and 2) I've no patience for that nonsense.

 

Besides, my R with H is exclusive from my R with my friend….at least that’s the way I see it.

[jj33]

I think there is a big difference between a marriage where there is abuse and a "bad" marriage. Whole different set of circumstances regarding leaving.

[TigerCub]

My guy never talked trash about his baby momma. I liked that about him.

Basically:

 

9 year relationship (on and off a few times)

 

had a kid,

she changed,

sex life sucks,

they have a history together so there is some love there.

 

She had their 2nd child although he didn't want any more kids

he suspected the kid wasn't his, so they broke up until the paternity test

 

She is a good mom

he's there with her because of the history and that he can't leave his kids.