Thoughts on fOW making peace with fBS...?

[Brokenlady]

Try as you will BL, you will never understand what this does to teenage kids. Counseling may help a little, but the thing that his kids need the most is a confident, responsible Dad. My mom tried to smooth the waters, but that just made matters worse. You are in a "catch 22", situation. The more concern you show for her kids , the more she will think you are trying to steal their affections. The kids, themselves, are in a vacuum, and desperately need their father for discipline and stability. Rather than compassion, he needs to show some backbone.

 

I think you're quite right on both points Joe, thank you. His IC and I have been been trying to support the backbone point.

 

What was it your mom did that made it worse, if I may ask? I haven't been through this myself, so I can only magine.

 

He called and made arrangements to have the kids see IC's, but I suspect his xW will thwart this as well.

[Snowflower]

Thank you for taking the time to reply to everyone, BL!

 

It will likely be a difficult road no matter what. Since you asked for advice, I would just urge caution in the filing for custody decision by your MM or whatever he is now. She is still their mother and yes, she appears that she has lost herself but in time she might find a new direction.

 

Take the high road, BL, as it sounds like you've been doing. I still think your MM is completely clueless about the sheer destruction he has caused to others and that is what worries me most about your situation.

 

Just try to be a good role model, a friend, and mentor to their children. They have been to hell and back with the acrimonious divorce. Try to be a calm, safe place for them, if possible. It might be difficult if the children see you as the cause for their parents' divorce though.

[Brokenlady]

BTW, you say that he is trying to be compassionate, but is trying to get primary custody? This is almost unimaginably cruel.

 

Cruel to who? Should he ignore what's happening to the kids in her inadequate care? Is that better, more compassionate?

[JustJoe]

Just keep on going the way you are going, I would just focus on your new family unit. Hopefully one day you all can get past this. Infidelity is awful, but life goes on and we have to keep moving. I feel for everyone in this situation. I hope his XW will realize she needs to be a good mother to her kids and let go of her anger and delusions. Sounds like maybe she needs a break and definitely serious counseling.

LD, "new family unit?" My mom said the same thing to us kids. Her AP had a birthday party for one of his kids and my mom took us there. She hugged us and said that this was her new family. I remember that I looked at her, my mom, and thought that she was a stranger, and wondered where my real mom was.

[ladydesigner]

LD, "new family unit?" My mom said the same thing to us kids. Her AP had a birthday party for one of his kids and my mom took us there. She hugged us and said that this was her new family. I remember that I looked at her, my mom, and thought that she was a stranger, and wondered where my real mom was.

 

God I'm so sorry JJ I didn't mean what I said to come off so calous. I'm sorry if it did. Really I feel for everyone in these situations, especially the kids. I'm not sure if there is a right answer.

[JustJoe]

Cruel to who? Should he ignore what's happening to the kids in her inadequate care? Is that better, more compassionate?

No, if she is abusive, then he should act. But who is to say that what he wants is any better? His decisions haven't been too good in the past, have they?

[Brokenlady]

LD, "new family unit?" My mom said the same thing to us kids. Her AP had a birthday party for one of his kids and my mom took us there. She hugged us and said that this was her new family. I remember that I looked at her, my mom, and thought that she was a stranger, and wondered where my real mom was.

 

I get what you're saying. "New" implies the other was "old"/deficient, etc. I don't think that wording should be used to the children, ever. He has taken great pains to show his kids that me, and my kids, are in no way "replacements" for them. Unfortunately their mother (his xW) continually tells them that if he loved them, he wouldn't have left her and that they've been replaced, etc. so it's hard. She has even implied that my kids are secretly biologically his (not my xH's) in order to ram this point home. It's cruel.

[Brokenlady]

No, if she is abusive, then he should act. But who is to say that what he wants is any better? His decisions haven't been too good in the past, have they?

 

Yes, he's made terrible decisions. Even so, he is easily the more stable of the two and I believe he is genuine about leading a better life now. I believe he will act in their best interests no matter what she, I, or anyone else says about it.

[BB07]

BTW, you say that he is trying to be compassionate, but is trying to get primary custody? This is almost unimaginably cruel.

 

 

It's not cruel at all IF the kids are being put in REAL DANGER by emotional or physical abuse or neglect.

[JustJoe]

BB07, Nobody is saying that the kids should be placed in any danger. But the instability is far from being the exclusive fault of the EXW and she is being demonized for reacting to the loss of her husband by having emotional difficulties. Who is surprise by this? Everybody is saying what is best for the teenage kids, did anybody ask THEM? When my mom left, my Dad went to pieces too. He drank, ran around with various sl*ts, and really wasn't the best father in the world. But if my mom had tried to take us away from him, we would have hated her forever.

[JAGeezer]

Joe,

You completely miss the point. I honestly don't care if she likes me or hates me. I am concerned about her children (and what mine are seeing from hers). And if that means I have to hold my nose and do what has to be done to make it better, I will. Not because I want her to like me, just because it's the right thing to do, for the kids.

 

You are right that she owes me nothing, but I am not the enemy. There is no battle anymore. It's over. What is left now is to make the best of the bad situation until the kids are adults.

 

I'm sorry, but there are honest to god tears of laughter rolling down my cheeks right now. You're concerned about her children? NOW you're concerned about her children? After wrecking her marriage and stealing her husband, NOW you're concerned about her children? And she's the villain of the piece?? Hypocritical much?

 

Leave the woman alone. She's entitled to her hatred of you, and that's that. Perhaps she'll get past it, perhaps she won't, but they're her feelings and she has a right to them. I hope that she does, because in my experience, if you hate long enough and hard enough, you become that which you hate, and I really don't think the poor woman wants to be you. Ever.

 

You and your MM made this particular bed with no help from her. The pity of it is that the kids have to lay in it with you. There's an alternative. You and the MM can accept that the price tag attached to what you did to get what you wanted may include letting his children go. Stop trying to blend the unblendable. You'll be happier. Your kids will be happier. HER kids will be happier. And she'll finally have some peace. The only real loser here is your MM, and frankly I don't care about his feelings on the matter at all.

 

Leave the woman alone. You've done her more than enough damage for one human lifetime, and then some.

 

JAG

[Owl]

BL...I absolutely see where you're trying to do the right thing. It comes across well in your posts.

 

But with that said, I'd like to tell you what I told my wife when she was seriously considering leaving me and the kids to go explore a life with OM.

 

She honestly imagined that somehow eventually we'd all get along. That she'd live with OM, and they'd be a family with our kids, and the kids would come visit me and we'd all be like one big extended family.

 

I straightened her out.

 

If she left me for him, there would have been NO friendship, no extended family. The reality was that there'd be NO WAY that OM and I would ever be in the same room. Had that happened...someone would have gone to jail, or worse. I meant that completely...and my wife knew that.

 

I highly doubt our kids (all in HS at the time) would have ever accepted him. I wouldn't have been mad at them if they had...but I know that I'd have never accepted him...nor would I have had any interaction with my wife at all, other than what was needed for the kids.

 

I would have always been angry at my wife...and I would have hated OM forever.

 

I'm just being honest...that's what I felt at the time.

 

Thankfully for us, it didn't go that way. Our story turned out far different, and far better for everyone (hopefully, I've no idea how it turned out for OM...but I hope he found someone else and lives a happy life, as long as he's not in ours).

 

I don't have an answer for you. I don't believe that there's going to be any solution for your situation anytime soon. At least not while the kids are still minors and/or living at home.

[JustJoe]

God I'm so sorry JJ I didn't mean what I said to come off so calous. I'm sorry if it did. Really I feel for everyone in these situations, especially the kids. I'm not sure if there is a right answer.

LD, you have nothing to be sorry for, and you are right. There isn't a "right way", to handle an affair, divorce, or "new", extended family. I've read several books on the subject, and most of them are full of ****. There isn't some psychological magic formula that will ease the trauma the kids are going through. The bottom line is that they ( the kids) will find their own way to deal with their issues..... or not. My mom did everything humanly possible to maintain a positive, stable environment. The pain she suffered was horrible, and it took years for any of us kids to have a decent relationship with her. My sister has never forgiven her and never will. All BL and her MM can and should do is provide for their physical well-being and basichousehold stability. The kids themselves will adjust at their own pace.

[Brokenlady]

BB07, Nobody is saying that the kids should be placed in any danger. But the instability is far from being the exclusive fault of the EXW and she is being demonized for reacting to the loss of her husband by having emotional difficulties. Who is surprise by this? Everybody is saying what is best for the teenage kids, did anybody ask THEM? When my mom left, my Dad went to pieces too. He drank, ran around with various sl*ts, and really wasn't the best father in the world. But if my mom had tried to take us away from him, we would have hated her forever.

 

I hear you. you mom leaving probably made you feel protective or your dad, and it would have seemed malicious for her to take you with her. But if your experience was one of despair at your Dad's treatment of you, would you not have blamed her more for doing nothing to intervene?

 

And I think we should draw a distinction between being "not the best" parent in the world, and being an actively abusive one.

[Brokenlady]

For context, I should mention that DM's xW had some serious issues before they got D, the A and the D just magnified them a million fold. The kids once told him before talk of D that if they Divorced, please take us with you and don't leave us with her. Even now, his daughter disparages her mother in front of me and I tell her to stop and that it's disrespectful. I think there is a level of despair in them in that they are "stuck" with her and her behaviors.

[Brokenlady]

BL...I absolutely see where you're trying to do the right thing. It comes across well in your posts.

 

But with that said, I'd like to tell you what I told my wife when she was seriously considering leaving me and the kids to go explore a life with OM.

 

She honestly imagined that somehow eventually we'd all get along. That she'd live with OM, and they'd be a family with our kids, and the kids would come visit me and we'd all be like one big extended family.

 

I straightened her out.

 

If she left me for him, there would have been NO friendship, no extended family. The reality was that there'd be NO WAY that OM and I would ever be in the same room. Had that happened...someone would have gone to jail, or worse. I meant that completely...and my wife knew that.

 

I highly doubt our kids (all in HS at the time) would have ever accepted him. I wouldn't have been mad at them if they had...but I know that I'd have never accepted him...nor would I have had any interaction with my wife at all, other than what was needed for the kids.

 

I would have always been angry at my wife...and I would have hated OM forever.

 

I'm just being honest...that's what I felt at the time.

 

Thankfully for us, it didn't go that way. Our story turned out far different, and far better for everyone (hopefully, I've no idea how it turned out for OM...but I hope he found someone else and lives a happy life, as long as he's not in ours).

 

I don't have an answer for you. I don't believe that there's going to be any solution for your situation anytime soon. At least not while the kids are still minors and/or living at home.

 

DM had this fantasy too of friendship. He realizes now that was naiive at best. At this point he just hopes they can at least manage working civility, and I stay out of it. I don't forsee an occasion where I'd need to be in the same room with her in the near future, so that's sort of a moot point. I don't expect the kids to ever really embrace me - it would be nice, but I don't expect it. I might hate me too if I were in their shoes, hearing all that they hear. Honestly though, they seem fairly comfortable with me.

[ladydesigner]

DM had this fantasy too of friendship. He realizes now that was naiive at best. At this point he just hopes they can at least manage working civility, and I stay out of it. I don't forsee an occasion where I'd need to be in the same room with her in the near future, so that's sort of a moot point. I don't expect the kids to ever really embrace me - it would be nice, but I don't expect it. I might hate me too if I were in their shoes, hearing all that they hear. Honestly though, they seem fairly comfortable with me.

 

Hey you never know. Years from now they may have a different feeling about things. My uncle married his OW and the kids from his previous marriage treat her respectfully and they all have respect for each other. It didn't start out that way but ended up that way. But I agree if I were you I would just stay out of it too and let them deal with it, hopefully, as civilly as possible. Not much you can really do.

[wicar1]

Many of you know my story, which I'll summarize in an extremely short way here, and I hope you can provide me with some helpful wisdom.

 

In short - I was an OW to a MM for a couple years and then left him because it seemed to me that he was intent on staying with his W. He has two kids (teens) and I have two (primary school age). My leaving apparently triggered him to want to leave his M, but he waffled a lot and did so slowly. After he moved out over 2 years ago, he was uncertain and flipflopped, lied, and tried to keep the door open with both of us. It was an extremely hurtful time for me. I finally out my foot down awhile back and in time, he has shown me that it is truly over with his xW and has appropriate boundaries in place. He has been treating me better and I get along with his kids. Things are good - except:

 

That his xW is still having a lot of trouble letting go. Although there was well over a year between their divorce and the kids meeting me (and more years still since the seperation), she seemed shocked and became very vindictive. It was as if the reality of the divorce came crashing down on her upon my meeting the kids. (She apparently never told the schools or anyone official anywhere that they divorced and represented that they were still M and living together). xW has been messing with his visitation ever since the kids met me, despite the court order.

 

The kids are lying to xW, telling her they are mean to me because that is what she wants them to do. It's sad, and the toll on the kids that she is exacting is tremendous. I have never, and would never say an ill word of the xW to or around their children, but that courtesy is obviously not returned (not that I expected any differently, given the A). She appears to actively campaign to say things - the kids volunteer that they are told I am "evil", a "whore", that their father will go to hell for leaving her and that she still prays he will come back to her, etc. It makes me sad for the kids.

 

She (xW) has some significant mental health issues, and I try to remember that when I get angry. She really believes that if I died tomorrow, her life would go back to the way it was and she'd be happy. She really believes they aren't truly "divorced" in the "eyes of God", so she doesn't have to acknowledge it as having happened even though it was she that filed.

 

In this context, I often wonder if there's anything I can do. I know she thinks I am trying to take over her life and replace her a the kid's mother, which I would never endeavor to do. I wonder if it would help to try to have a calm and sane conversation with her to address her concerns with me, but then I think it would make it worse.

 

I know most of the BS's here are still with their H's and haven't had her exact experience, but if you have some thoughts to share on what I might be able to do to make things better, I'm all ears.

 

 

I think the ex-wife should leave her cheating husband alone because she deserves a better person not a cheater.

 

Anyway did anyone tell the kids why their parents got divorced...? DO they know that their father is to be blamed for his affair and divorce, I think they should know that.....

 

Anyway the kids are better off without their father. I can understand why the mother wants to keep the kids away from their father ... SHe doesn't want her kids to have EA nor affiars with married people in their future. What else can they learn from you too???

[HappyAtLast]

Forgive me for not knowing your story and I don't intend for this to come across as harsh, but unless you are married to this man and these children are your step children, there is very little that you can (or really should) do.

 

This is his issue to resolve. As Owl said, it really does sound like you have the best interest of the children in mind. But, and this is just my very respectful and humble opinion, they are not your children and this is not your issue.

 

That said, I would just continue to be a positive influence in their life when you see them, but completely stay out of the rest.

[JustJoe]

Forgive me for not knowing your story and I don't intend for this to come across as harsh, but unless you are married to this man and these children are your step children, there is very little that you can (or really should) do.

 

This is his issue to resolve. As Owl said, it really does sound like you have the best interest of the children in mind. But, and this is just my very respectful and humble opinion, they are not your children and this is not your issue.

 

That said, I would just continue to be a positive influence in their life when you see them, but completely stay out of the rest.

This is probably the best advice, yet. Bl, yes, be a positive influence, make it crystal clear to the kids AND your MM that you will listen to NO disparaging remarks about the EXW, of any kind. Then deal with your own children and leave this issue to your MM and his kids. Under no circumstances contact the EXW, nor respond to any attempted contacts by her. You don't exist for her, she doesn't exist for you, then let time pass.

[woinlove]

I also agree that HappyAtLast has given great advice.

 

In earlier posts, you mentioned that the parents hid their divorce from their children. It hasn't been very long since the children have known about you and you also mentioned that the daughter blamed you when she found out. A parent's infidelity can be extremely difficult for teens, as they are learning about relationships and sex and rely on having some role models. Just understand how traumatic this is for them and be kind to them, but recognize, as HappyAtLast explains, that you do not currently have a role in parenting them.

[SidLyon]

Many of you know my story, which I'll summarize in an extremely short way here, and I hope you can provide me with some helpful wisdom.

 

In short - I was an OW to a MM for a couple years and then left him because it seemed to me that he was intent on staying with his W. He has two kids (teens) and I have two (primary school age). My leaving apparently triggered him to want to leave his M, but he waffled a lot and did so slowly. After he moved out over 2 years ago, he was uncertain and flipflopped, lied, and tried to keep the door open with both of us. It was an extremely hurtful time for me. I finally out my foot down awhile back and in time, he has shown me that it is truly over with his xW and has appropriate boundaries in place. He has been treating me better and I get along with his kids. Things are good - except:

 

That his xW is still having a lot of trouble letting go. Although there was well over a year between their divorce and the kids meeting me (and more years still since the seperation), she seemed shocked and became very vindictive. It was as if the reality of the divorce came crashing down on her upon my meeting the kids. (She apparently never told the schools or anyone official anywhere that they divorced and represented that they were still M and living together). xW has been messing with his visitation ever since the kids met me, despite the court order.

 

The kids are lying to xW, telling her they are mean to me because that is what she wants them to do. It's sad, and the toll on the kids that she is exacting is tremendous. I have never, and would never say an ill word of the xW to or around their children, but that courtesy is obviously not returned (not that I expected any differently, given the A). She appears to actively campaign to say things - the kids volunteer that they are told I am "evil", a "whore", that their father will go to hell for leaving her and that she still prays he will come back to her, etc. It makes me sad for the kids.

 

She (xW) has some significant mental health issues, and I try to remember that when I get angry. She really believes that if I died tomorrow, her life would go back to the way it was and she'd be happy. She really believes they aren't truly "divorced" in the "eyes of God", so she doesn't have to acknowledge it as having happened even though it was she that filed.

 

In this context, I often wonder if there's anything I can do. I know she thinks I am trying to take over her life and replace her a the kid's mother, which I would never endeavor to do. I wonder if it would help to try to have a calm and sane conversation with her to address her concerns with me, but then I think it would make it worse.

 

I know most of the BS's here are still with their H's and haven't had her exact experience, but if you have some thoughts to share on what I might be able to do to make things better, I'm all ears.

 

I haven't read all the responses yet so I don't know if there's additional information.

 

I was immediately reminded of a situation where parents broke up and the father started an open relationship with an OW. The only child was 6 or 7 at the time and he made his father's new partner's life hell.

 

He was incredibly mean to her (over a period of about 7 years) by repeatedly telling her what his mother had said about her, how his mother had behaved when her name was mentioned. The trouble is most of it was fantasy, at least at first, clearly designed to destabilize the father's new relationship. He would report back to his mother anything negative said about her by the new girlfriend too. We saw it because the boy was very good friends with our son and he was in a shared custody arrangement so we continued to have contact with and socialise with all parties.

 

He used to plot with my son about what he would do and I eventually spoke to both his parents about what he was doing. Normally I wouldn't interfere, but at one stage he got my son involved in calling the OW (as she had been) despicable names. My boy had no idea what the names even meant, but at 6 or 7 he found it puzzling because he asked me what a "slut" was.

 

This is not the full story but the end result is that the former OW gave the man an ultimatum (when the boy was about 13) and said she was no longer going to be with him unless the boy returned to live virtually full time with his mother. I had never realised before how much havoc one small child could wreak in the lives of the adults around him even extending to our family because of the friendship with my son.

 

What reminded me of this was your comment that the children tell their mother they are mean to you when you say they are not. My experience tells me that they are being mean if they tell you about bad things their mother has supposedly said about you, and what's more it could be made up or embellished.

[crazycatlady]

BL - ((HUGS)) You need them.

 

I am saddened at the posters here who seem to be cheering on the mother for her extremely poor behavior. If she is so mentally unstable she can not control her actions she has no business being primary caretaker of the children. If she is not so mentally unstable she should be horsewhipped for what she is doing to her children. Yes her exH behaved liked an A&&. But that does not excuse her behavior. I believe it actually makes it worse.

 

A mother's job is to help her children move through life, learn how to navigate the bumps in the road, to be better people. Instead she is showing them that being nasty is acceptable, that vengence is a good way to solve life's disappointments, that if you make a complete and utter a&& of yourself maybe you will get what you want.

 

Its wrong. Children should never be weapons in a battle between adults. There is absolutely no excuse for this. I don't care if he put her through hell. Those poor kids.

 

I don't get people and the idea that bad behavior is acceptable and sometimes even admirable and when it concerns children it is even more unacceptable. I admit I have I sometimes have my own failings in this matter, but I really do try. I would think most parents would do so.

[wheelwright]

BL...I absolutely see where you're trying to do the right thing. It comes across well in your posts.

 

But with that said, I'd like to tell you what I told my wife when she was seriously considering leaving me and the kids to go explore a life with OM.

 

She honestly imagined that somehow eventually we'd all get along. That she'd live with OM, and they'd be a family with our kids, and the kids would come visit me and we'd all be like one big extended family.

 

I straightened her out.

 

If she left me for him, there would have been NO friendship, no extended family. The reality was that there'd be NO WAY that OM and I would ever be in the same room. Had that happened...someone would have gone to jail, or worse. I meant that completely...and my wife knew that.

 

I highly doubt our kids (all in HS at the time) would have ever accepted him. I wouldn't have been mad at them if they had...but I know that I'd have never accepted him...nor would I have had any interaction with my wife at all, other than what was needed for the kids.

 

I would have always been angry at my wife...and I would have hated OM forever.

 

I'm just being honest...that's what I felt at the time.

 

 

Hi BL.

 

My H's response after DDay was exactly like Owl's. This made me despair, and I can see xMOM was probably facing the same.

 

My thoughts at the time, when it was still not clear to me that xMOM and I would not end up together, were that there was no way I could put my H through xMOM being around his kids. It would have been a nightmare for him that would do none of us any good.

 

It made me sad, because I had thought of a blended family previous to DDay.

 

So, I thought I would live separately from xMOM even if we were together, and see him outside of kids time. Until either H recovered, or they were grown.

 

Is there no way you could go down this route? It would seem fairer to the kids, and to his xW. And in time, she may face her pain and move on from it.

 

I can see this has been a traumatic time for you, and you just want to move on with everyone happy. But his xW is NOT happy, so that is not possible.

 

I do not know the situation, but would she be capable of being a stable, more balanced mother in such a revised scenario? Would you or your partner be able to countenance this? Perhaps it is only a small price to pay for the peace and happiness it might bring people who were hurt by the A and the MM's behaviour?

[bentnotbroken]

I think she's having a hard time seeing past my OW status. So the idea that I might be good to her kids (as opposed to someone else he could be dating) isn't going to mean much. I really hope it doesn't come to a battle too. I guess that why I wonder if there's anything I can do to help her with whatever her concerns are about me so that we can calm all this down.

I can agree with this. It wouldn't mean a thing to me. Just the way one entired their lives would tell me whether they were good for my children or not. If she hasn't come to terms with that then she won't really care if you might be good for her children.