Do the OW & BS "deserve" the same....

[greengoddess]

It was effective, that is true. For me the question is... do I want to be married like that? Is it about making my H toe the line, to keep him on a leash, to control him? Is it about ME doing everything possible to make sure he does not stray? Sorry too stressful for me. I would like to be married to a mature man, who can make his own choices. Who can decide that he wants to be faithful to me because he wants not because I make our whole environment of friends and neighbours control him.

 

LOl this makes absolutely ZERO sense to me coming from you. "your" married man lied to you from the very beginning. He didn't even tell you he was married and when you found out you still continued a relationship with him. The first interactions you and him had were all lies and you were fine with continuing with someone who lied to you from his very first words.

[Spark1111]

You keep repeating this. I hope it is not directed towards me as I in no way shape or form said or think that the BS should keep quiet.

 

Oh no HAL.

 

Many seem to equate exposure to trying to control the WS as if shame or embarrassment would force them to return to the marriage.

 

I exposed the affair because I thought my marriage was over and I would need the support of loved ones to survive a divorce.

[herenow]

I will say this though, I did not want to be the guy in town that everyone know his wife was running around on him. And this was not to protect her, it was to protect me. (a pride thing?)/

 

To any BS who may read this statement, you have nothing to be embarrassed about. You did nothing wrong and you are not at all responsible for the affair that took place.

 

If your pride keeps you from reaching out to others in time of pain, then that is your choice.

 

In my case, it was a time that I needed my closest family and friends the most. If telling those who were there for me damaged my H's reputation, then so be it, it's not my fault he did something embarrassing. However, he owned up to it and proved to everyone that he made a mistake and was willing to face the consequences and make amends.

 

To change my ways of dealing with issues in my life and keep such a huge problem from people who care about me would have been a lie. Why would I want to lie to those who only want to help me?

 

I didn't go screaming it in the streets. I just did what I always do in good times and bad. Share with family and friends. Isn't that part of the relationship we have with others. How sad for anyone who feels they can't be open in close relationships. Sad indeed.

Edited October 1, 2010 by herenow

[Owl]

I exposed the affair because I thought my marriage was over and I would need the support of loved ones to survive a divorce.

 

I think my reasons were about 50/50 between this and exposing the affair in order to protect my wife from making some potentially dangerous decisions for herself (she'd only met OM online and on the phone...had never actually even seen this guy in person...how could she truly know who/what he was???).

[herenow]

To any BS who may read this statement, you have nothing to be embarrassed about. You did nothing wrong and you are not at all responsible for the affair that took place.

 

If your pride keeps you from reaching out to others in time of pain, then that is your choice.

 

In my case, it was a time that I needed my closest family and friends the most. If telling those who were there for me damaged my H's reputation, then so be it, it's not my fault he did something embarrassing. However, he owned up to it and proved to everyone that he made a mistake and was willing to face the consequences and make amends.

 

To change my ways of dealing with issues in my life and keep such a huge problem from people who care about me would have been a lie. Why would I want to lie to those who only want to help me?

 

I didn't go screaming it in the streets. I just did what I always do in good times and bad. Share with family and friends. Isn't that part of the relationship we have with others. How sad for anyone who feels they can't be open in close relationships. Sad indeed.

 

Went to edit, but I was too late. I wanted to add that with recent public affairs (Sandra, Tiger...) we see the WS getting the brunt of the blame as they should. I don't see why a BS should fear public knowledge of their spouses affair. I can see why the WS would not want people to know, but it's not the BS responsibility to protect the WS.

[donnamaybe]

Went to edit, but I was too late. I wanted to add that with recent public affairs (Sandra, Tiger...) we see the WS getting the brunt of the blame as they should. I don't see why a BS should fear public knowledge of their spouses affair. I can see why the WS would not want people to know, but it's not the BS responsibility to protect the WS.

Yes, it is the responsibility of both spouses to protect EACH OTHER. Since the WS is obviously not protecting the BS, then they'll just have to be satisfied with whatever they get.

[herenow]

Yes, it is the responsibility of both spouses to protect EACH OTHER. Since the WS is obviously not protecting the BS, then they'll just have to be satisfied with whatever they get.

 

I agree that they should protect each other. But after an affair, the BS bears no responsibility for the consequences brought onto the WS (or OW/OM) because of the affair.

[HappyAtLast]

I agree that they should protect each other. But after an affair, the BS bears no responsibility for the consequences brought onto the WS (or OW/OM) because of the affair.

 

I was not in any way suggesting that the BS bears any responsibility. When I was a BS, my pride did not want people feeling sorry for me because of what my WS did. It had nothing to do with being embarrassed.

 

edited to add: felt compelled to clarify this because you directly quoted me when you posted that no BS should feel responsible.

[herenow]

I was not in any way suggesting that the BS bears any responsibility. When I was a BS, my pride did not want people feeling sorry for me because of what my WS did. It had nothing to do with being embarrassed.

 

edited to add: felt compelled to clarify this because you directly quoted me when you posted that no BS should feel responsible.

 

Yes I did as I don't want any BS to be discouraged from reaching out for help when the most need it. Thanks for your clarification.

[pureinheart]

No problem, Pure. You've in no way offended me.

 

I have to admit tho, I don't understand the reason you're shocked by my posts?

 

I'm not sure what it was about this that surprised/shocked you...that I exposed the affair?

 

Look at it from another viewpoint real quick.

 

We had (at that time) 16+ years of wonderful marriage...with that last year being very uncharacteristically bad. My wife had been avoiding dealing with undiagnosed depression, an addiction to online gaming, and then on top of that she got involved in an online EA with OM.

 

At d-day, my wife was making life plans with a man she couldn't have possibly known well enough to even consider doing so if she'd been thinking in any rational way. She was gambling everything, even (IMHO) risking her life to go live with someone she'd never even met in person.

 

In order to get her to stop and think rather than just react, I reached out to our friends and family that I KNEW she'd listen to, because she wasn't willing to listen to me (I had an obvious vested interest in her staying).

 

I didn't ask them to berate/belittle/pick on her. I asked them to get her to stop and think...I asked them to invite her to go live with them as a neutral third party rather than run to live with a guy she met online and couldn't really know. This wasn't done with any anger/hatred/revenge motives...it was done to help her, and to attempt to save our marriage.

 

Exposure (when done right) isn't a vindictive, revenge thing. It should be done as an active measure to end the affair and save the marriage.

 

As far as exposing to OM's friends and family...I didn't do so, but would have absolutely have considered it if it became nessacary. Why wouldn't I?

 

The fallout would have been his to deal with...as a direct result of his choices and actions concerning my wife. As we've seen here time and again, there's nothing "owed" between OM/OW and BS...he showed me no consideration during this. On top of that...what would have been any real fallout for him? His friends/family might have been upset with him, but that probably would have been the extent of it.

 

The bottom line is that this all worked to a degree too. She didn't go to see OM that day. She stayed, indecisively at first. But then she started talking with her sister, and with my sisters, and with her friends. Who all discussed this with her, and were able to do so because of my exposure.

 

End result...recovery.

 

And no action was taken in anger or with any intent to hurt anyone...exactly the opposite, everything was done out of love and concern for my wife.

 

I believe you that it was done in love...your special Owl. Really.

 

It sounds like an "intervention" (I watch that on TV BTW)...ya, I hear ya...and thank you for devulging this info, you didn't have to and could have told me to eef off...lol...Great big hugs ((((((((Owl))))))))...I'm sure your W knows you are on LS so give her great big hugs from me too....

 

I think what drove her to OM was her addictions...there is always a driver, most people don't just decide to have an A one day for the hell of it. I am so glad you guys worked out your M...I ALWAYS think that is the best senario if it is possible:D

[pureinheart]

Are you referring to the post about spirituality, and how Owl prayed for God's pure will in the course of his wife's affair?

 

If so, I don't see the contradiction. Can you explain?

 

Maybe Owl's decision to expose was guided by God's will.

 

I hope I can word this to make sense and actually explain where I'm coming from:)

 

I'm, not saying this to start a war, it is what I see and how I perceive some of the BS's...also I saw this in my own family. Also the BS I dealt with was not right in the head and still isn't.

 

Experience: the prime objective is to lash out, get revenge, hate, bitterness, hurt, you name it on DDay.

 

I have been a BS more so than not, I choose to keep my business to myself or with the party involved, I conduct all dealings in this manor, I consider it to be professional and you can tell me anything and it will not go further than me...I stake my life on that...I am loyal to a fault.

 

That was to paint a picture of my mindset.

 

I hate gossip, and I think it is wrong to tell anothers business regardless if I am involved or not.

 

To me (Owls 2 posts) did contradict each other....now he has explained that it was intervention due to his W having multiple issues. His motives I believe were led by God, he did need help and it was not vindictive...it was truely love...it's about the motive behind the motive.

 

To run around and tell others I think is uncalled for. I don't buy the support thing because there are too many other means of support available than to air your business, and others, to the neighborhood. To me it is vindictive and no better than the A itself.

 

Xxoo, I feel this way about most things, with the understanding there are exceptions (like Owl, who's heart was in the right place)...I just hate vindictive, with a passion...

 

I really hope this made sense:D

[HappyAtLast]

After re-reading Owl's post as quote by Pureheart about, I realized what a good man he really is. I honestly believe that Owl was truly concerned, not only about his marriage, but really and truly concerned about his wife's safety (rightfully so, certainly. She could have been headed into a very dangerous situation). His disclosure of her situation to key people certainly helped to avoid her potentially getting harmed.

 

After reading so many of his posts, it is apparent to me that Owl would have done exactly what he did to ensure the safety of his wife, whether or not his marriage was able to be saved.

[xxoo]

To me (Owls 2 posts) did contradict each other....now he has explained that it was intervention due to his W having multiple issues. His motives I believe were led by God, he did need help and it was not vindictive...it was truely love...it's about the motive behind the motive.

 

To run around and tell others I think is uncalled for. I don't buy the support thing because there are too many other means of support available than to air your business, and others, to the neighborhood. To me it is vindictive and no better than the A itself.

 

Xxoo, I feel this way about most things, with the understanding there are exceptions (like Owl, who's heart was in the right place)...I just hate vindictive, with a passion...

 

I really hope this made sense:D

 

It makes sense to hate vindictiveness.

 

The interesting thing is that I assumed Owl exposed with the motive of love from the start

 

I assume that most BSs who expose, while hoping to reconcile, are largely motivated by love. Exposure is one tool available to DO something that might save the relationship (and it seems to be effective at least some of the time). Sure, there may be other motivations mixed in...but is that enough reason NOT to expose, if it is 50% motivated by love of the spouse, and desire to fight for the relationship?

[xxoo]

To run around and tell others I think is uncalled for. I don't buy the support thing because there are too many other means of support available than to air your business, and others, to the neighborhood. To me it is vindictive and no better than the A itself.

 

Xxoo, I feel this way about most things, with the understanding there are exceptions (like Owl, who's heart was in the right place)...I just hate vindictive, with a passion...

 

I really hope this made sense:D

 

I'm curious that you say it is no better than the A itself, but you have a lot of compassion and understanding for the people in the A. It sounds to me like you have less compassion for the BS who lashes out vindictively, which, while wrong, is no WORSE than the A, imo.

 

I hate betrayal with a passion, so I can relate to your feelings on vindictiveness. I can't promise that I would rise above vindictive behavior if I were ever betrayed by the person I most trust

[pureinheart]

After re-reading Owl's post as quote by Pureheart about, I realized what a good man he really is. I honestly believe that Owl was truly concerned, not only about his marriage, but really and truly concerned about his wife's safety (rightfully so, certainly. She could have been headed into a very dangerous situation). His disclosure of her situation to key people certainly helped to avoid her potentially getting harmed.

 

After reading so many of his posts, it is apparent to me that Owl would have done exactly what he did to ensure the safety of his wife, whether or not his marriage was able to be saved.

 

Totally agree, and both you guys are really good guys, among the others that post at LS. I'm sure there are other ladies out there that will agree that there are times a person could wonder WTH, are there any good ones out there?

 

You guys are such an asset, not hateful and mean ....very cool to see:D

[pureinheart]

I'm curious that you say it is no better than the A itself, but you have a lot of compassion and understanding for the people in the A. It sounds to me like you have less compassion for the BS who lashes out vindictively, which, while wrong, is no WORSE than the A, imo.

 

I hate betrayal with a passion, so I can relate to your feelings on vindictiveness. I can't promise that I would rise above vindictive behavior if I were ever betrayed by the person I most trust

 

I think you would do fine, not saying that it will ever happen, that you would be tested to such a degree, although many have been vindictive where I was concerned and I didn't retaliate.

 

I have a great deal of compassion for all three (WS/AP/BS). I can completely understand hurt and pain, although can also understand failure, messing up, screwing up and making BIG mistakes/bad choices.

[pureinheart]

It makes sense to hate vindictiveness.

 

The interesting thing is that I assumed Owl exposed with the motive of love from the start

 

I assume that most BSs who expose, while hoping to reconcile, are largely motivated by love. Exposure is one tool available to DO something that might save the relationship (and it seems to be effective at least some of the time). Sure, there may be other motivations mixed in...but is that enough reason NOT to expose, if it is 50% motivated by love of the spouse, and desire to fight for the relationship?

 

In Owls case there were other factors to be considered, she had many "vices" and OM was just another vice, and if I may add he didnot tell the OM's side, he only told those who he knew his W would listen to...everything he did was out of love and nothing was vindictive.

 

He sat down and was rational and very mature concerning the whole matter. Most act entirely on emotion, this is never good, in fact that is where I get into trouble on LS, I let my emotions get away with me and react to a mean or rude comment.

[pureinheart]

I was not in any way suggesting that the BS bears any responsibility. When I was a BS, my pride did not want people feeling sorry for me because of what my WS did. It had nothing to do with being embarrassed.

 

edited to add: felt compelled to clarify this because you directly quoted me when you posted that no BS should feel responsible.

 

I feel the same way, support and undertanding is one thing, and this will be given from a person(s) that are objective. The "oh poor me" thing just doesn't cut it. I also have a lot of family and friends that think a lot of me, it has been this way all of my life, so I've always had to be careful about what I say, as they will hurt someone if they gain knowledge that I have been hurt.

 

You are good people HAL and I know the concept of "tell all" seems to be the most popular, and that's fine for them, although these are my standards and I have viable reasons for them:)...and you do too...BTW, your SO is very fortunate as you seem very sound...

[HappyAtLast]

You are good people HAL and I know the concept of "tell all" seems to be the most popular, and that's fine for them, although these are my standards and I have viable reasons for them:)...and you do too...BTW, your SO is very fortunate as you seem very sound...

 

Thanks for your kind words Pure, they are very much appreciated. The last statement though? Nope I have to say I am the lucky one in my relationship with my beautiful wife of 40 years. She remains, to this day, the most amazing woman that I have ever met and I the luckiest man on the planet.

 

I thank the good Lord everyday for allowing me to have this woman in my life.

Edited October 2, 2010 by HappyAtLast
embarrassing typo

[2themoon&back]

2themoon....

 

I would have applauded an OW like you who wanted to force the truth of the situation, who wanted to break free from the secrecy and actually resolve the secrecy and deception.

 

I never blamed her for falling for the same man I fell in love with. I thought that made us both human.

 

But she protected him and his lies at all costs: Never returning a phone call and then claiming to him I had been "vicious."

 

As if that would win him away from me. All it did was show her level of desperation in trying and doing anything to keep him. Even lying to him about me.

 

Because he had been standing right next to me when I placed the call offering an olive branch and seeking closure if there was anything she wanted to talk to me about, and it was kind and concerned and nothing near vicious.

 

So I personally applaud your reasons for why you did what you did. I would have welcomed that above the scenario I had to deal with.

 

 

 

you are so kind to say that to me ... again it validates that i am still human and not just a crazy OW, because people think i am for my actions.

 

I too would have welcomed someone like you in my situation. The BS, is very mean and vindictive person, and not just to me but even to her child, she involved her 12yr old. she had the child read text's between me and MM and told the child that MM was not her real father, she pulled out all the stops, a lot of mind games and hurtful stunts.

 

i am sorry for what kind of bs you must have went through, i am sure you had enough to deal with and you did not owe any one the olive branch but that you ever offered it makes you a very big person, and mostly in my book decent!! Thank you for the kind words they do mean more than I can say …it goes to prove you do have a pure kind heart !!! (and that is rare in these situations)

[Spark1111]

you are so kind to say that to me ... again it validates that i am still human and not just a crazy OW, because people think i am for my actions.

 

I too would have welcomed someone like you in my situation. The BS, is very mean and vindictive person, and not just to me but even to her child, she involved her 12yr old. she had the child read text's between me and MM and told the child that MM was not her real father, she pulled out all the stops, a lot of mind games and hurtful stunts.

 

i am sorry for what kind of bs you must have went through, i am sure you had enough to deal with and you did not owe any one the olive branch but that you ever offered it makes you a very big person, and mostly in my book decent!! Thank you for the kind words they do mean more than I can say …it goes to prove you do have a pure kind heart !!! (and that is rare in these situations)

 

And using a young child to exact revenge on a WS is just despicable. And destructive to the child. And it makes my skin crawl.....

 

And it is what my FWS's OW did with her young son, against her xH who left her for his last AP.

 

And it is why, my fWS, in his depression, wanted to save her and her son, at a time he could not save himself.

 

Aye yay yay! WHY do some people believe they do not DESERVE real love? From a fully engaged partner? Or they need to exact revenge to feel powerful? What made them feel so powerless?

 

And thank you for your kind words. I am here putting one foot in front of the other, and it is all good.

[pureinheart]

And using a young child to exact revenge on a WS is just despicable. And destructive to the child. And it makes my skin crawl.....

 

And it is what my FWS's OW did with her young son, against her xH who left her for his last AP.

 

And it is why, my fWS, in his depression, wanted to save her and her son, at a time he could not save himself.

 

Aye yay yay! WHY do some people believe they do not DESERVE real love? From a fully engaged partner? Or they need to exact revenge to feel powerful? What made them feel so powerless?

 

And thank you for your kind words. I am here putting one foot in front of the other, and it is all good.

 

I'm right there with you Spark, I have seen it more times than I care to have, from all parties, R's where there was no A's and in people who have been D'ed for years STILL carrying on this way, even when the kids are grown....for Gods sake there has got to be another way if they want revenge that bad:sick::sick:

[Spark1111]

I'm right there with you Spark, I have seen it more times than I care to have, from all parties, R's where there was no A's and in people who have been D'ed for years STILL carrying on this way, even when the kids are grown....for Gods sake there has got to be another way if they want revenge that bad:sick::sick:

 

Some people never gain the maturity to be a GOOD parent.

 

Anyone can have a child, but parenting?

 

There should be mandatory classes on how to the job well, IMHO.

[porter218]

And using a young child to exact revenge on a WS is just despicable. And destructive to the child. And it makes my skin crawl.....

 

And it is what my FWS's OW did with her young son, against her xH who left her for his last AP.

 

Thats despicable. I am proud to be way more mature then that. When I finally left my M and handed my H on a silver platter over to his OW I would never have allowed the kids to be affected by it. I was so gracious as to go take the kids to visit their oldest brother and invited the OW to come with me. I took her and enjoyed a Sunday afternoon playing with the kids and my Hs OW. H couldn't come because he was out of town(probably screwing his OOW:rolleyes:). I must admit though my daughters reaction was priceless. She was only about 6 months old but she gave the OW an evil glare, looking her up and down with obvious disdain. It was so obvious that it nearly made the OW cry. I laughed because my daughter is just full of attitude and this was something she did having no clue who this woman really was:laugh:. And trust me...this wasn't elicited from me. I never had a bad word to say about the OW to my kids because what was between me, her, and my H was grown people business.

Edited October 3, 2010 by porter218

[Owl]

After re-reading Owl's post as quote by Pureheart about, I realized what a good man he really is. I honestly believe that Owl was truly concerned, not only about his marriage, but really and truly concerned about his wife's safety (rightfully so, certainly. She could have been headed into a very dangerous situation). His disclosure of her situation to key people certainly helped to avoid her potentially getting harmed.

 

After reading so many of his posts, it is apparent to me that Owl would have done exactly what he did to ensure the safety of his wife, whether or not his marriage was able to be saved.

 

That's the thing...I honestly had no idea if my marriage was going to be saveable or not. Had some doubts (who wouldn't, after that last year, and then dealing with her EA), but regardless of that I still loved her, and was absolutely scared about what could happen to her.

 

That's a huge part of why I begged her to talk to her sister...and ultimately ended up calling her sister to get her engaged. If my wife wouldn't/couldn't stay with me, then I'd rather she went to stay with her sister than the other guy, given how little she knew of him really.

 

But I also have to own up to not being a "nice guy". Just like that other guy my wife was talking to on the internet, there's a lot about me that ya'll couldn't know either.

 

I absolutely considered taking action against OM at first. The day after d-day I started "doing my homework". I'm ex-military... I spent about 2-3 hours gathering intel..starting with the little bit of information I had on him, doing some internet searches, and then making some phone calls and doing some cross-reference type stuff I went from having a name and email address to having pretty much any info you could want.

 

I didn't do anything, mind you. But there was a lot of thought given to it for a while for sure.

 

At the end of it all...I decided it was better to forgive and drive on, rather than do anything stupid. But I'm by no means a saint.