Forum Ettiquette?

[jennie-jennie]

Whereas I can not think of any incidents of OW gloating on LS, I can think of several incidents with BSs gloating. "Some of the lies told to the ow/om by the h/w" and "Reconciliation sex...the best ever!!!" are two threads that come to mind.

[Owl]

I can absolutely recall OW 'gloating' or posting demeaning comments about BS's, to include signatures along the lines of "I'll take your man"...

 

I can also say I've seen a number of BS posters who do little but insult OW that post here.

 

I've seen both sides fight tooth and nail to discredit other posters and their advice on "the other side" because of their different position on the triangle.

 

It absolutely goes both ways. I don't believe that either side has a greater incidence than the other.

 

Personally, I think that if people stop trying to discredit/insult other posters and focus instead on posting what they believe is the best advice they can give, we'd be doing alot better for all the posters who come here.

[jennie-jennie]

I can absolutely recall OW 'gloating' or posting demeaning comments about BS's, to include signatures along the lines of "I'll take your man"...

 

That was me! And it was a joke, not gloating. What was it I said now again? "The BSs' worst nightmare: I will take your man and your money!" Although sometimes I do feel like I am the BSs' worst nightmare.

[jennie-jennie]

That was me! And it was a joke, not gloating. What was it I said now again? "The BSs' worst nightmare: I will take your man and your money!" Although sometimes I do feel like I am the BSs' worst nightmare.

 

For those who are not familiar what context this signature arose in, it was in a thread about whether or not OW accept financial benefits of any kind from their MM.

[woinlove]

That was me! And it was a joke, not gloating. What was it I said now again? "The BSs' worst nightmare: I will take your man and your money!" Although sometimes I do feel like I am the BSs' worst nightmare.

 

Not exactly an original way to take a dig - say/write something mean and then say it was a joke.

 

While I don't find the digs on either side to be that big a deal - easy to ignore if you consider what is behind them, I also don't think the stance that all the digs are coming from one side is defensible.

[jennie-jennie]

Not exactly an original way to take a dig - say/write something mean and then say it was a joke.

 

While I don't find the digs on either side to be that big a deal - easy to ignore if you consider what is behind them, I also don't think the stance that all the digs are coming from one side is defensible.

 

I thought it was funny. Sorry if we don't share the same sense of humor.

[Owl]

That was me! And it was a joke, not gloating. What was it I said now again? "The BSs' worst nightmare: I will take your man and your money!" Although sometimes I do feel like I am the BSs' worst nightmare.

 

But it's a prime example of what we've been talking about.

 

You say you meant it as a joke. In reality, it was insulting to BS's...and we can debate whether you intended it that way or not until we're both blue in the face, but the bottom line is that kind of comment has only one use...to insult and create a combative atmosphere.

 

Same applies for discrediting posters...suggesting or implying to others that they should disregard advice given based on the fact that the poster giving the advice is a BS/fOW/whatever.

 

The same thing applies to BS's who imply or flat out call OW very insulting names (which I won't repeat, but we all know have been said).

 

I find those comments equally offensive.

 

I say post your advice and your viewpoint...feel free to tell others what your role in the triangle was if you like...but respect the rights of ALL of us to post here on LS, regardless of that role.

[jennie-jennie]

But it's a prime example of what we've been talking about.

 

You say you meant it as a joke. In reality, it was insulting to BS's...and we can debate whether you intended it that way or not until we're both blue in the face, but the bottom line is that kind of comment has only one use...to insult and create a combative atmosphere.

The thing is I feel all I have to do is exist and have the views I have and that in itself is perceived as an insult and creating a combative atmosphere.

 

Same applies for discrediting posters...suggesting or implying to others that they should disregard advice given based on the fact that the poster giving the advice is a BS/fOW/whatever.

But the information is relevant in judging where the poster is coming from. That is not discrediting, that is informing.

 

The same thing applies to BS's who imply or flat out call OW very insulting names (which I won't repeat, but we all know have been said).

 

I find those comments equally offensive.

 

I say post your advice and your viewpoint...feel free to tell others what your role in the triangle was if you like...but respect the rights of ALL of us to post here on LS, regardless of that role.

And respect that those of us who have been in a particular position have deeper knowledge than those who have never been in that position. Just think of the Twelve Step program, it is built entirely around sharing the same experience.

[NancyBotwin]

Same applies for discrediting posters...suggesting or implying to others that they should disregard advice given based on the fact that the poster giving the advice is a BS/fOW/whatever.

Thank you for posting this, Owl. This is the most frustrating thing I've encountered on this forum. I was not required to submit credentials for posting here when I registered. I was unable to find any notification that only certain people can post in certain forums.

 

One does not have to be a drug addict to know that drugs cause harm. One does not have to be in an affair to know that affairs can hurt people.

That's common sense irrespective of one's experiences.

[Owl]

The thing is I feel all I have to do is exist and have the views I have and that in itself is perceived as an insult and creating a combative atmosphere.

 

You may feel that way...but that doesn't change the fact that the comments like what was in your signature are what cause others to respond to you the way that they do.

 

Perhaps its not your views...but how you express them?

 

But the information is relevant in judging where the poster is coming from. That is not discrediting, that is informing.

 

If the person who posted the advice felt it was relevent, they would have mentioned it. And the WAY that it's mentioned...often IMPLIES that they should be disregarded. It also makes it easier for you to try to deny that you meant for that to happen...but when it's seen repeatedly, it forms a pattern that 'resident' posters notice.

 

And respect that those of us who have been in a particular position have deeper knowledge than those who have never been in that position. Just think of the Twelve Step program, it is built entirely around sharing the same experience.

 

I agree with showing that respect. But it's a two way street. That would imply that you should also show that same respect to the fOW posting here who have been in that position and gone through it. Or to the BS who's also been through it. But instead you point out that the advice being given comes from "that kind" of poster, and imply that it should be disregarded because of that.

 

Or some of us who have been posting on these forums for several years now...and have a different level of experience than you have just based off of that.

 

Respect is a two way street for sure.

 

And I'm of the opinion its the key element that all of us need to try to keep in our posts.

[jennie-jennie]

Thank you for posting this, Owl. This is the most frustrating thing I've encountered on this forum. I was not required to submit credentials for posting here when I registered. I was unable to find any notification that only certain people can post in certain forums.

 

One does not have to be a drug addict to know that drugs cause harm. One does not have to be in an affair to know that affairs can hurt people.

That's common sense irrespective of one's experiences.

 

I thought I knew what it was like to be a parent before I had kids because I was daily and often at nights too taking care of my best friend's child (she was a single mother with no other backup). I realized how wrong I was when I got my first own child.

 

You can know that drugs cause harm even when not abusing them, but there is so much more to know that non-addicts never realize. (I know, because I have abused drugs.)

 

And so on.

 

I can tell you I had zero knowledge of what it meant to be a long term OW until I was one. And yet I had been the BS to two serial cheaters for decades. You have to live it to understand it.

 

I find it really frustrating that when you come as a new OW to LS you do not realize that many of the posters are BSs. You wrongly suppose that most posting on the OW/OM forum are OW/OM. This is an important piece of information to be had when interpreting the knowledge base of the posters replying to you.

[jennie-jennie]

You may feel that way...but that doesn't change the fact that the comments like what was in your signature are what cause others to respond to you the way that they do.

 

Perhaps its not your views...but how you express them?

 

Yeah, unapologeticly.

If the person who posted the advice felt it was relevent, they would have mentioned it. And the WAY that it's mentioned...often IMPLIES that they should be disregarded. It also makes it easier for you to try to deny that you meant for that to happen...but when it's seen repeatedly, it forms a pattern that 'resident' posters notice.

I find it relevant, therefore I post it. I can't help that other posters think my words imply more than they do. Sounds a bit paranoid to me, to tell the truth.

I agree with showing that respect. But it's a two way street. That would imply that you should also show that same respect to the fOW posting here who have been in that position and gone through it. Or to the BS who's also been through it.

I have never been in a position of going against my morals and yet staying in an affair - that is true. Just like the fOW you are referring to have never been in an affair without going against their morals. So when they try to apply their experiences to my situation or one like mine I object.

 

I have been a BS, so I know a lot about that.

 

But instead you point out that the advice being given comes from "that kind" of poster, and imply that it should be disregarded because of that.

Would you stop making up what I imply. Take my posts for what they say.

 

Or some of us who have been posting on these forums for several years now...and have a different level of experience than you have just based off of that.

Sorry, just reading about affairs does not equal being an OW/OM.

 

Respect is a two way street for sure.

 

And I'm of the opinion its the key element that all of us need to try to keep in our posts.

True. Edited October 12, 2010 by jennie-jennie

[greengoddess]

I thought I knew what it was like to be a parent before I had kids because I was daily and often at nights too taking care of my best friend's child (she was a single mother with no other backup). I realized how wrong I was when I got my first own child.

 

You can know that drugs cause harm even when not abusing them, but there is so much more to know that non-addicts never realize. (I know, because I have abused drugs.)

 

And so on.

 

I can tell you I had zero knowledge of what it meant to be a long term OW until I was one. And yet I had been the BS to two serial cheaters for decades. You have to live it to understand it.

 

I find it really frustrating that when you come as a new OW to LS you do not realize that many of the posters are BSs. You wrongly suppose that most posting on the OW/OM forum are OW/OM. This is an important piece of information to be had when interpreting the knowledge base of the posters replying to you.

 

 

Why is it that as you learn more about the other woman they all seem to have one issue in common? PROBLEMS baggage foo issues. As you learn more you learn these women were drug abusers, abused wives, married to alcoholics, come from broken homes, abused as children etc etc etc. I wonder if there are ANY ow on here that have lived nice normal happy childhoods and happy lives. Honestly I can't think of one. It's really sad and really makes you wonder if allowing yourself to become an ow comes from self esteem problems. It also makes you wonder if most married men are looking for the broken woman to have as an ow. They can be the knight in shining armor.

[jennie-jennie]

Why is it that as you learn more about the other woman they all seem to have one issue in common? PROBLEMS baggage foo issues. As you learn more you learn these women were drug abusers, abused wives, married to alcoholics, come from broken homes, abused as children etc etc etc. I wonder if there are ANY ow on here that have lived nice normal happy cjildhoods and happy lives. Honestly I can't think of one. It's really sad and really makes you wonder if allowing yourself to become an ow comes from self esteem problems. It also makes you wonder if most married men are looking for the broken woman to have as an ow. They can be the knight in shining armor.

 

Similar children play the best. Most likely if the OW is from a dysfunctional family of origin, so is the MM, and so is the BS.

 

Being the knight in shining armor is just another version of dysfunctionality.

[Owl]

Yeah, unapologeticly.

I find it relevant, therefore I post it. I can't help that other posters think my words imply more than they do. Sounds a bit paranoid to me, to tell the truth.

I have never been in a position of going against my morals and yet staying in an affair - that is true. Just like the fOW you are referring to have never been in an affair without going against their morals. So when they try to apply their experiences to my situation or one like mine I object.

 

I have been a BS, so I know a lot about that.

 

Would you stop making up what I imply. Take my posts for what they say.

 

Sorry, just reading about affairs does not equal being an OW/OM.

 

True.

 

 

Fair enough...this all illustrates my point exactly. Thank you.

[JamesM]

I find it really frustrating that when you come as a new OW to LS you do not realize that many of the posters are BSs. You wrongly suppose that most posting on the OW/OM forum are OW/OM. This is an important piece of information to be had when interpreting the knowledge base of the posters replying to you.

 

This is one of the truest and most necessary comments to be made here.

 

The assumption that like posts in like forums is false.

 

The BSs come here to berate and criticize OWs and OMs as a way to vent about their own situation, but if a OW or OM (if they dare) posts in the Infidelity forum, then they would be "torn apart." Read some of the vents against "cheatin' scumbags." One poster admitted that he would forgive a murderer before he would forgive a cheater.

 

I do not believe that all BSs who come here act that way (ie Owl is a good example of good posts here), but for the most part it is true. And the newbie is blown away by the anger directed at him or her. He or she assumes that advice will be given from others who have walked or are walking the same path. He or she did not come here to be judged. There are definitely other places for that.

 

Isn't the purpose of this forum simply so that OWs and OMs can seek help from others with a very similar perspective? While I can appreciate that some OWs and OMs do benefit from a differing viewpoint, do they need to hear over and over that they are "cheating scumbags" or similar language?

 

I certainly understand why some would feel that way. I am neither a BS or an OM, but I can feel for them. Most know that the affair they are in hurts the BS. Most know that the affair they are in is far from being the best situation. But many are in the affair out of love and many didn't realize that they were with a MM until after they had fallen in love. And yet others believe that they are the best thing for their MM and MW.

 

Most also believe (right or wrong) that this affair will turn into a long term relationship.

 

The point is...everyone coming here should be treated respectfully. And TBH it would be best that only those with the same perspective or those who can post from that perspective should post here.

 

If I were an OW or OM, then I doubt that I would keep posting here.

 

Can you imagine if the OWs and OMS went to the Infidelity forum and pointed out the many reasons why those people have been betrayed? Do you believe that they could handle such criticism without getting angry? Personally I doubt it. My guess is that they would be crying "Infraction!" over and over to the mods.

 

BSs (for the most part) seem to believe that they are only the victim in an affair and believe that their WS is the only one at fault. For some reason they believe that a marriage takes two people, but when it falls apart, then it is only the fault of one person.

 

So...let those who post here, be treated respectfully.

[greengoddess]

Similar children play the best. Most likely if the OW is from a dysfunctional family of origin, so is the MM, and so is the BS.

 

Being the knight in shining armor is just another version of dysfunctionality.

 

I do not agree with this at all. Plenty of people love to help others. it certainly does not make them dysfuntional.

[JamesM]

Why is it that as you learn more about the other woman they all seem to have one issue in common? As you learn more you learn these women were drug abusers, abused wives, married to alcoholics, come from broken homes, abused as children etc etc etc. I wonder if there are ANY ow on here that have lived nice normal happy childhoods and happy lives.

 

I suspect that a similar survey of BSs would reveal how many of them also come from broken homes, etc., which would explain why they are in a bad marriage with a spouse who feels the need to cheat.

 

One sees what one looks for.

[jennie-jennie]

Similar children play the best. Most likely if the OW is from a dysfunctional family of origin, so is the MM, and so is the BS.

 

Being the knight in shining armor is just another version of dysfunctionality,

 

My MM didn't even realize he was from a dysfunctional family of origin until I pointed out the drug abuse, gambling and incest that went on.

[donnamaybe]

I do not agree with this at all. Plenty of people love to help others. it certainly does not make them dysfuntional.

Thing is, there is a WORLD of difference between "helping" and "enabling." You have to know said difference.

[greengoddess]

I suspect that a similar survey of BSs would reveal how many of them also come from broken homes, etc., which would explain why they are in a bad marriage with a spouse who feels the need to cheat.

 

One sees what one looks for.

 

 

wow so you are blaming the BS for the married man's choice to cheat?

[jennie-jennie]

I do not agree with this at all. Plenty of people love to help others. it certainly does not make them dysfuntional.

 

But needing to be the knight in shining armor does.

[donnamaybe]

wow so you are blaming the BS for the married man's choice to cheat?

I've noticed an awful lot of this lately for some reason.

[greengoddess]

Thing is, there is a WORLD of difference between "helping" and "enabling." You have to know said difference.

 

ahhh yes good point.

[jennie-jennie]

wow so you are blaming the BS for the married man's choice to cheat?

 

I didn't interpret James' post like that. I suspect that he meant that not only the BSs but also the WSs in a bad marriage most likely come from broken homes, etc. If anything, he was blaming the dysfunctionality of the bad marriage. Just look at his other post where he was talking about "a marriage takes two people".