Those Darn Kids ;)

[Owl]

the quote was from WWIU "I always say it takes a big and special person, whether the BS is a BW or BH, to stay and work it out after the WS cheated. Some say the BS is weak or too afraid, too reliant on the WS. SO WHAT?"

 

I guess in some cases too reliant would refer to not being able to make it on their own. Or having a really hard time financially and emotionally to start over and do things for themselves.

 

Some people do fit that category...I'd agree. There are all kinds of dysfunctional relationships out there.

 

Now...how many people will admit (even to themselves) that they fall in that category?

 

If the definition of too reliant is like I assumed above, then there is a HUGE difference. Staying in the R and trying to work it out because there really is love there and its worth the fight, is greatly different that staying just out of fear of not doing things on your own and supporting yourself.

 

You're right..but like I said, who'd admit that they're staying for those reasons...even to themselves? Let alone to anyone else...

 

 

I'm glad that your M was good and worth the fight, and that you guys ended up doing what was best for your kids.

 

I like you Owl and so I don't mean for what I'm saying to sound rude or disrespectful.

Yes, you didn't "use" the kids, but you had them tell their mom their views about how they wouldn't spend time with the OM (and naturally that would be their initial view), of course they're not going to say "hey, awesome, 2 dads!!, sign me up".

 

I can see how my post might have sounded like that, but that wasn't what actually happened.

 

When my kids came home that day, my wife met them in the living room. I had gone for a walk, and came home a couple of hours later and waited out in the backyard while they finished up this entire discussion. I never spoke to them about the situation at all until AFTER her initial conversation with them...in which this all came out.

 

I didn't have them tell her anything. I told her that she needed to provide an explanation to the kids as to why she was moving out and going to live with OM...whom they'd 'met' via that online gaming that I'd mentioned.

 

Their response was their own reaction to her actions, and totally uncoached by me.

 

I know that what you did was take your children's views into consideration and make sure that their voices were heard, but I'm sure that you also knew that they would say what you hoped they would say.

 

You may not have done it in a manipulative calculating way, but you gotta admit that you knew what they would say would influence her decision greatly.

 

Again, I'm not trying to sound rude. So please don't take offense to my theory.

 

Either way, I'm glad that you guys did work things out and that your children's voices were heard.

 

And you're right...I did know what they'd say.

 

We'd always warned them not to trust people that they talked to on the internet...how in the heck could they have agreed to their mom's actions in light of that???

 

Regardless of my desire to save my marriage, I also had HUGE, HUGE concerns about my wife's welfare and safety...she truly "knew" very little about OM. She bought off on everything he told her...and completely ignored any and all of the concerns and risks that she SHOULD have had at the time.

 

My wife needed to hear what the kids were saying...not in order to save our marriage or our family...but because she was being completely foolish and placing herself in potential danger.

 

I also "exposed" the affair to our friends and family for the same reason...and to elicit the same responses from other people that cared for her and loved her.

 

Thank God that all of that finally started to sink into her before she got on the plane, and got her to start listening and thinking that day that I went to where she was staying.

 

And no offense taken in your views...to a degree you're right, and I absolutely don't regret my choices or actions.

[Fieldsofgold]

When my daughter was 7 y/o, my xH volunteered for military active duty, and was given orders to go to another state for training. When my daughter found out, she was distraught with grief and fear. I had never seen a child so upset. She asked me to take her to his house several times, which of course I did, so she could beg him to stay. She was just devastated with grief. As much as I hated the b@$tard, as violent and abusive as he had been, as sorry a daddy as he had been, when I saw the grief of my child, I would have done almost anything I could to get him to stay.

[Fieldsofgold]

the quote was from WWIU "I always say it takes a big and special person, whether the BS is a BW or BH, to stay and work it out after the WS cheated. Some say the BS is weak or too afraid, too reliant on the WS. SO WHAT?"

 

I guess in some cases too reliant would refer to not being able to make it on their own. Or having a really hard time financially and emotionally to start over and do things for themselves.

 

 

If the definition of too reliant is like I assumed above, then there is a HUGE difference. Staying in the R and trying to work it out because there really is love there and its worth the fight, is greatly different that staying just out of fear of not doing things on your own and supporting yourself.

 

 

I'm glad that your M was good and worth the fight, and that you guys ended up doing what was best for your kids.

 

I like you Owl and so I don't mean for what I'm saying to sound rude or disrespectful.

Yes, you didn't "use" the kids, but you had them tell their mom their views about how they wouldn't spend time with the OM (and naturally that would be their initial view), of course they're not going to say "hey, awesome, 2 dads!!, sign me up".

I know that what you did was take your children's views into consideration and make sure that their voices were heard, but I'm sure that you also knew that they would say what you hoped they would say.

 

You may not have done it in a manipulative calculating way, but you gotta admit that you knew what they would say would influence her decision greatly.

 

Again, I'm not trying to sound rude. So please don't take offense to my theory.

 

Either way, I'm glad that you guys did work things out and that your children's voices were heard.

 

I am hoping what I am about to say does not sound rude, either.

 

So you have a husband, a wife, and several children. Let's say 3. So there are 5 people in this marriage. The children are people, too. The children are not possessions, to be packed up and shipped here and there. It's not 2 people and a bowl of goldfish. It's 5 people in very, very close relationship with each other. Five people with feelings and thoughts and needs, whose lives and closest relationships will forever be profoundly affected by the decisions of one or two. Yes, the children have a right to tell their parents what they think, and how they feel, and what they want out of their relationship. They have as much right as the adults to do that. In fact, BECAUSE they are children, their feelings and needs should carry more weight.

 

People sacrifice for their children all the time. Who hasn't driven the old beat up car for another year, or taken sack lunches to work, to save for their kids' college fund? What parent hasn't sat up all night with a sick child, and then gone to work all day. When money is scarce, a parent will forego medical care or new glasses, or a trip to the dentist, if the child has pressing needs. Sacrificing for the kids is just part of being a parent. Why should it suddenly be a non-valid point when an affair is involved?

 

As far as staying for finances: suppose mom has no job and little education or employable skills. Dad cheats. Mom has a choice. Tell the kids they are leaving their comfortable home and neighborhood to move into a cheap, cramped apartment on the bad side of town. They will have to find another home for the family dog because pets aren't allowed. Sorry kids, you'll have to forego music lessons, swim team, little league, your clothes will mostly come from the thrift shop now, you'll be eating noodles a lot more often for supper. Yes, I know your friends will be having lovely vacations, but we'll have fun at the city park. Sorry hon, but you may not be able to get braces or contacts this year. And if you all get jobs in tenth grade, it will help with college expenses. A car? Uh, no, sweetheart. These are just sacrifices you have to make because Mommy is not going to let that cheating daddy of yours move back home.

 

And this doesn't even consider the emotional toll on the kids. In some cases, not only do they lose a parent, but life as they know it is changed forever. Not a decision to be made lightly.

 

I know it's not always that bad when the man leaves, but sometimes it is. I have a friend whose husband left her and their 5 children for a year, and it was worse than that.

 

Why should an OW think it is selfish for parents to not want their children to be deprived? Why should they be surprised when a BS or WS wants the best possible life for their children. A parent who would literally fight a wild animal to protect their child, could surely consider continuing living with a person they once loved, for the best interests of their children.

 

Why would anyone criticize or fault them for this? Really, IMO, it is incredibly selfish of the AP to want someone to sacrifice their children for an affair.

 

Of course, not all parents love their kids that much. Or sometimes the spouse is so unacceptable that changes have to be made. But why would anyone criticize or think less of someone who stayed for their children????

 

I will tell you that for me, I would not have traded my daily life with my daughter for any man in the world. If being with the man I loved would mean i only saw my daughter every other weekend, I would not even have to think about it.

Edited October 15, 2010 by Fieldsofgold

[TigerCub]

I think the original question is a good one, and has subsequently resulted in a productive and interesting discussion.

 

TigerCub, just so you know you're not crazy, I recall reading the posts you mentioned about wanting to work it out because of the kids, but there's also usually something about loving the WS as well. Still, I understand your curiosity about this.

 

I think it's natural for any parent who just learns of their spouse's A to think about the kids almost immediately. It's difficult to explain the love and concern for your own children, no matter how old they are, but it is a powerful instinct. When you have spent more than half your life loving their father to boot, then the desire to work on the marriage is that much greater.

 

With that said, my fWH's experience involved a short-term A (6 wks) with an old flame. He had, quite literally, lost his mind during that time. I was very ill, he wasn't sure if his job was stable, and along came an escape. After coming to me, asking for a divorce because he was leaving me for the OW, so much began to make sense. Yes, I thought of the kids, but mostly, I was thinking of him, how he wasn't himself. I also thought of myself briefly, but I somehow intuitively knew that when the reality of what he had done and what he had planned to do set in, it wasn't going to happen.

 

I was upset of course, but then I became very calm and clear-headed. I figured ONE of us had to be. LOL I asked for only two things from him:

 

1) that he not communicate with her for the next few days until I could wrap my head around the situation. I didn't do it in an effort to win him back, but because I deserved at least that much respect from him.

 

2) that he call his parents immediately and tell them, because I was not about to protect him from this or do his dirty work for him. (I have a great relationship with them, and have always talked with them more than he did, but this was his baby to rock.)

 

I would say one, or maybe two hours later (at the most), my fWH came to me and said, "I've made a huge mistake. This is just wrong, so very very wrong, and I don't want to do this." I'm thinking he's speaking only from the guilt he received from his parents. We spoke together rationally. I told him how much I loved and adored him, and helped him unravel where and how he began to distort our marital history (something I didn't realize was so common at the time).

 

That day, he decided he wanted us to meet with our pastor from church, and from there he became more and more remorseful, and I was there for him through his grief in what he had done to me and even the OW. No contact was established, and we began the hard work of building a new marriage, but on the foundation of the true love we shared all these years. Our children are a testimony to that love, and the more fulfilled we are in our marriage, the greater their security and contentment.

 

I know this was long, and some of it may have seemed to be a side track, but I meant to provide my story, what I was thinking and motivated by. It doesn't tell the whole story, how I struggled, how I dealt with the anger and rage, or many of the other ups and downs that comes with healing from such a betrayal. But I am healed, and I do trust my fWH again (although, with wisdom and not blindness).

 

There will not be a second chance, however, and I am neither weak nor fearful should he give me cause to leave him. There is a limit to my mercy and it's a solid boundary fixed in both our minds. He has been given a great gift, and he knows it and works joyfully to express his gratitude.

 

I am blessed, and I wish the same for so many here, whether they be BSs or OW/M.

 

WOW!

Thank you so much for sharing your story with me Fight4Me.

I think you give a hopeful outlook on how all can't be lost when an A happens.

I appreciate your understanding of my inability to fully grasp accounting for the children (since I have none).

 

I'm very glad that you and your H are back on track and that your M is a happy and healthy one.

I'm also glad that deciding to work on the M with your H is proving to be best for your children.

 

Thanks again

[TigerCub]

Some people do fit that category...I'd agree. There are all kinds of dysfunctional relationships out there.

 

Now...how many people will admit (even to themselves) that they fall in that category?

 

You're right..but like I said, who'd admit that they're staying for those reasons...even to themselves? Let alone to anyone else...

I think that's why I made this post in the first place though. I realize that a lot of people sometimes can't admit certain things - even to themselves, but I was wondering if there would be any at all, that would think about the issue honestly and be able to admit it here.

 

But honestly, what I've learned from this post is that:

a. Nothing is as cut and dried as it seems to be.

b. Kids change everything

c. If there is still love for the WS AND there are kids involved, then its worth it for both the WS and BS to swallow their pride (a little), and focus on trying to make the M work.

and finally...

d. There are some happy endings - some were able to fix the probs with the M and the couple/kids are in a happier place now.

 

I found all the responses here gave me so much to think about, stuff that I never could really consider on my own, having never been married, and never having any children.

 

 

 

I can see how my post might have sounded like that, but that wasn't what actually happened.

 

When my kids came home that day, my wife met them in the living room. I had gone for a walk, and came home a couple of hours later and waited out in the backyard while they finished up this entire discussion. I never spoke to them about the situation at all until AFTER her initial conversation with them...in which this all came out.

 

I didn't have them tell her anything. I told her that she needed to provide an explanation to the kids as to why she was moving out and going to live with OM...whom they'd 'met' via that online gaming that I'd mentioned.

 

Their response was their own reaction to her actions, and totally uncoached by me.

 

Thanks for explaining things further.

Honestly Owl, I never meant to imply that the responses were coached by you. You don't strike me as the type to do that.

I know that the things your kids said to their mom was from their heart, that was their true reaction to the whole thing.

 

I'm really glad that things worked out for the best in your case.

I think, if anything, your post taught me that its worth it to have patience, to be completely honest, and to demand accountability.

I think (personally), that a 2nd chance wouldn't be worth giving, if those things weren't part of the equation.

 

Thanks again for taking the time to help me understand all these different feelings, problems and how to deal with them.

 

I appreciate it

[TigerCub]

I am hoping what I am about to say does not sound rude, either.

 

So you have a husband, a wife, and several children. Let's say 3. So there are 5 people in this marriage. The children are people, too. The children are not possessions, to be packed up and shipped here and there. It's not 2 people and a bowl of goldfish. It's 5 people in very, very close relationship with each other. Five people with feelings and thoughts and needs, whose lives and closest relationships will forever be profoundly affected by the decisions of one or two. Yes, the children have a right to tell their parents what they think, and how they feel, and what they want out of their relationship. They have as much right as the adults to do that. In fact, BECAUSE they are children, their feelings and needs should carry more weight.

In the post you quoted - my post to OWL.

I said to him that I'm glad that his kid's voices were heard.

I don't know why you're acting like I said that they kids and their feelings don't matter.

That's never what I said or even implied.

 

People sacrifice for their children all the time. Why should it suddenly be a non-valid point when an affair is involved?

Again, I never said it wasn't valid.

 

As far as staying for finances: suppose mom has no job and little education or employable skills. Dad cheats. Mom has a choice. Tell the kids they are leaving their comfortable home and neighborhood to move into a cheap, cramped apartment on the bad side of town. They will have to find another home for the family dog because pets aren't allowed. Sorry kids, you'll have to forego music lessons, swim team, little league, your clothes will mostly come from the thrift shop now, you'll be eating noodles a lot more often for supper. Yes, I know your friends will be having lovely vacations, but we'll have fun at the city park. Sorry hon, but you may not be able to get braces or contacts this year. And if you all get jobs in tenth grade, it will help with college expenses. A car? Uh, no, sweetheart. These are just sacrifices you have to make because Mommy is not going to let that cheating daddy of yours move back home.

 

See, this I have a hard time totally understanding because:

There is Alimony

There is child support

that the cheating daddy would have to pay.

Its not like the kids are going to be moving from a mansion to shack.

Sure, maybe the house will be smaller and there may not be as much money for luxury items, but its not like betrayed mom and her kids are going to be living in a box eating noodles and suffering from crooked teeth.

 

If that was the case - then fine, by all means, take the cheater back and live in the lap of luxury and know that he'll do it again, because BW and kids are too dependent to leave.

 

The other thing, if the BS was that dependent on the WS and KNEW that they had to put up with his crap no matter what because they have no other means of supporting themselves (apparently alimony/child support are non existent in this scenario), the wouldn't the WS just have so much anger and resentment and feelings of hopelessness and helplessness?

What kind of atmosphere is that for the kids to grow up in?

If that were a real case, I would feel terrible for those kids.

 

I just think its a really sh*tty lesson to teach kids - put up with crap and let people treat you like garbage as long they can put a roof over your head - then its ok.

 

 

And this doesn't even consider the emotional toll on the kids. In some cases, not only do they lose a parent, but life as they know it is changed forever. Not a decision to be made lightly.

THAT - I can certainly agree with.

I do think that it is very sad and unfortunate that kids don't have much control over their home environment and they don't sometimes get a say in whether their parents are together or not. I do agree that that would be very tough on them, and its shame that some kids have to go through with that.

It certainly isn't and shouldn't be a decision that's made lightly.

 

 

Why would anyone criticize or fault them for this? Really, IMO, it is incredibly selfish of the AP to want someone to sacrifice their children for an affair

I'm not sure if the AP you're referring to is me or just APs in general.

But in my case, I never wanted xMM to sacrifice his kids for me. I never even wanted to be the ONLY reason he left baby momma.

I would NEVER in my life want that on my conscience.

If he can make things work with her - fine, he should do so and be there for his kids. I never told him to leave his kids for me.

Or to even be happy with shared custody, just for me.

I think that parents should put their kids before anyone else.

But at the same time, they have to provide a happy and healthy home environment for those kids.

Just being with the other parent aint it. If there is so much tension and anger in the house - IMO that's worse.

 

 

Of course, not all parents love their kids that much. Or sometimes the spouse is so unacceptable that changes have to be made. But why would anyone criticize or think less of someone who stayed for their children????

Again - not criticizing.

But what I said in the part above also counts - staying together for the kids is only good for the kids IMO as long as their environment is healthy, and as long as they don't have to witness fights, feel the tension or feel that they are in a loveless home. These things I don't say as a parent (cuz I got no kids), but I say this as someone that was once a kid, who at times felt the tension, knew of the anger, and knew that people were generally unhappy.

 

I will tell you that for me, I would not have traded my daily life with my daughter for any man in the world. If being with the man I loved would mean i only saw my daughter every other weekend, I would not even have to think about it

I think that's great.

That's what I think I would be like if I had a kid - no one would come before them. PERIOD.

[Fight4Me]

WOW!

Thank you so much for sharing your story with me Fight4Me.

I think you give a hopeful outlook on how all can't be lost when an A happens.

I appreciate your understanding of my inability to fully grasp accounting for the children (since I have none).

 

I'm very glad that you and your H are back on track and that your M is a happy and healthy one.

I'm also glad that deciding to work on the M with your H is proving to be best for your children.

 

Thanks again

 

You are very welcome, and I hope it also brought you hope for a joyful expectant future should you ever choose to have children. Even greater is the joy when it is with a man who loves you enough to put you first.

[2sure]

I absolutely do not think any family should suffer the consequences of an unhappy marriage. Many many many couples divorce and continue to raise their children successfully. I did it.

 

If the situation is such that a divorce is for some extenuating circumstance, out of the question...

 

Then the couple either has to repair the marriage, come to an agreement that will make them happy, or find a way to make divorce possible.

 

All difficult courses of action but paths that many people take every day .

 

Having an affair while staying in the marriage is easier.

Thats all.

[TigerCub]

You are very welcome, and I hope it also brought you hope for a joyful expectant future should you ever choose to have children. Even greater is the joy when it is with a man who loves you enough to put you first.

Thanks

Gotta find that man first - then I'd be more likely to change my mind about kids

[TigerCub]

I absolutely do not think any family should suffer the consequences of an unhappy marriage. Many many many couples divorce and continue to raise their children successfully. I did it.

 

If the situation is such that a divorce is for some extenuating circumstance, out of the question...

 

Then the couple either has to repair the marriage, come to an agreement that will make them happy, or find a way to make divorce possible.

 

All difficult courses of action but paths that many people take every day .

 

Having an affair while staying in the marriage is easier.

Thats all.

 

I completely agree with you 2Sure.

Thanks for your input to this discussion

[Fieldsofgold]

In the post you quoted - my post to OWL.

I said to him that I'm glad that his kid's voices were heard.

I don't know why you're acting like I said that they kids and their feelings don't matter.

That's never what I said or even implied.

 

 

Again, I never said it wasn't valid.

 

 

 

See, this I have a hard time totally understanding because:

There is Alimony

There is child support

that the cheating daddy would have to pay.

Its not like the kids are going to be moving from a mansion to shack.

Sure, maybe the house will be smaller and there may not be as much money for luxury items, but its not like betrayed mom and her kids are going to be living in a box eating noodles and suffering from crooked teeth.

 

If that was the case - then fine, by all means, take the cheater back and live in the lap of luxury and know that he'll do it again, because BW and kids are too dependent to leave.

 

The other thing, if the BS was that dependent on the WS and KNEW that they had to put up with his crap no matter what because they have no other means of supporting themselves (apparently alimony/child support are non existent in this scenario), the wouldn't the WS just have so much anger and resentment and feelings of hopelessness and helplessness?

What kind of atmosphere is that for the kids to grow up in?

If that were a real case, I would feel terrible for those kids.

 

I just think its a really sh*tty lesson to teach kids - put up with crap and let people treat you like garbage as long they can put a roof over your head - then its ok.

 

 

 

THAT - I can certainly agree with.

I do think that it is very sad and unfortunate that kids don't have much control over their home environment and they don't sometimes get a say in whether their parents are together or not. I do agree that that would be very tough on them, and its shame that some kids have to go through with that.

It certainly isn't and shouldn't be a decision that's made lightly.

 

 

 

I'm not sure if the AP you're referring to is me or just APs in general.

But in my case, I never wanted xMM to sacrifice his kids for me. I never even wanted to be the ONLY reason he left baby momma.

I would NEVER in my life want that on my conscience.

If he can make things work with her - fine, he should do so and be there for his kids. I never told him to leave his kids for me.

Or to even be happy with shared custody, just for me.

I think that parents should put their kids before anyone else.

But at the same time, they have to provide a happy and healthy home environment for those kids.

Just being with the other parent aint it. If there is so much tension and anger in the house - IMO that's worse.

 

 

 

Again - not criticizing.

But what I said in the part above also counts - staying together for the kids is only good for the kids IMO as long as their environment is healthy, and as long as they don't have to witness fights, feel the tension or feel that they are in a loveless home. These things I don't say as a parent (cuz I got no kids), but I say this as someone that was once a kid, who at times felt the tension, knew of the anger, and knew that people were generally unhappy.

 

 

I think that's great.

That's what I think I would be like if I had a kid - no one would come before them. PERIOD.

 

I have to apologize for the way the tone of my post sounded to you. Actually, while I was posting, I was not thinking of you at all (sorry). I was thinking about all the posts I have read, here and on other boards, about "why is he staying for the kids?!!!" I have always thought you sounded like a nice and reasonable person, and have sympathized with your situation. I respect you for starting this thread to learn more about the subject. That is the mark of a caring, intelligent and open-minded person.

 

When I was writing my previous post, I was thinking about the pain I have seen kids, mine and others close to me, go through because of their parents. Thinking about that stirred up a great deal of anger in me. I wrote this post from a place of pain, anger and bitterness. I'm sure that bled over in the tone of my post. Sorry.

 

When I was writing, I was thinking about all the BS bashing I have read on various boards, for taking him back "for the kids," all the snarky criticism that BS only cares about the money, criticizing a man who wants to make the marriage work because of the kids, etc. I was writing to "them." I don't recall a single one of your posts that would fit into those categories.

 

I was just explaining why I think if there is anything to salvage in a marriage, there are lots of good reasons to give it another try. And "for the kids" is one of those very good reasons.

 

As for the alimony and child support, although there are laws, they are difficult to enforce IF the father REALLY doesn't want to pay. I probably collected $1,000 all told, and it probably cost me that much in legal fees to collect it. There is a child support enforcement agency that will collect it for you, but they take a huge percentage of what they collect. I can't remember exactly how much, but it seems it was something like 75%-85%. It was just an absurd %. There are a lot of women and children who live at subsistence level because the man won't pay. My daughter and I went through a time when he first left - I got one meal a day at work because it was free, I didn't eat on weekends - just water, had to borrow money to get my baby's prescription filled. We were homeless for a little while, actually lived on the street. A loveless marriage in the short term IS better for the children than that.

 

I have also known women, myself included, who took a jerk back long enough to stash away a little emergency cash, or to finish school.

Edited October 15, 2010 by Fieldsofgold

[2sure]

I have also known women, myself included, who took a jerk back long enough to stash away a little emergency cash, or to finish school.

 

I took mine back long enough to modify the post nup in my favor. He would have signed anything during that period. And he did.

[TigerCub]

I have to apologize for the way the tone of my post sounded to you. Actually, while I was posting, I was not thinking of you at all (sorry). I was thinking about all the posts I have read, here and on other boards, about "why is he staying for the kids?!!!" I have always thought you sounded like a nice and reasonable person, and have sympathized with your situation. I respect you for starting this thread to learn more about the subject. That is the mark of a caring, intelligent and open-minded person.

 

When I was writing my previous post, I was thinking about the pain I have seen kids, mine and others close to me, go through because of their parents. Thinking about that stirred up a great deal of anger in me. I wrote this post from a place of pain, anger and bitterness. I'm sure that bled over in the tone of my post. Sorry.

 

When I was writing, I was thinking about all the BS bashing I have read on various boards, for taking him back "for the kids," all the snarky criticism that BS only cares about the money, criticizing a man who wants to make the marriage work because of the kids, etc. I was writing to "them." I don't recall a single one of your posts that would fit into those categories.

 

I was just explaining why I think if there is anything to salvage in a marriage, there are lots of good reasons to give it another try. And "for the kids" is one of those very good reasons.

 

Thank you for explaining more about your thoughts when you were writing.

And thanks for the nice things you had to say about me.

 

I do completely understand that you are a person who has a child and actually had to LIVE through the stuff I'm just discussing. You are justified in feeling the way you do.

And because I haven't been in your shoes, I can never truly relate, I can only try to understand and imagine the scenarios you put before me.

 

I am sorry for your pain and all the crap you had to suffer through. That I can definitely appreciate, even if I've never lived it.

 

As for the alimony and child support, although there are laws, they are difficult to enforce IF the father REALLY doesn't want to pay. I probably collected $1,000 all told, and it probably cost me that much in legal fees to collect it. There is a child support enforcement agency that will collect it for you, but they take a huge percentage of what they collect. I can't remember exactly how much, but it seems it was something like 75%-85%. It was just an absurd %. There are a lot of women and children who live at subsistence level because the man won't pay. My daughter and I went through a time when he first left - I got one meal a day at work because it was free, I didn't eat on weekends - just water, had to borrow money to get my baby's prescription filled. We were homeless for a little while, actually lived on the street. A loveless marriage in the short term IS better for the children than that.

The bolded stuff are the facts that I actually had no idea about.

I've heard before about how some deadbeat dads don't pay child support right away, but that there are consequences for that, and that the law does come after them. I thought that they get threatened with jail and then they pay up.

But I guess if that were the case even, the lawyer fees for the moms would be crazy as well.

But definitely, thanks for explaining these facts to me, because I didn't think it was quite so bad.

I think that's a HUGE flaw in the legal system, and I sure hope that there are better laws in the works for enforcing child support payments / alimony.

 

But until then - yes, that's definitely a huge hurdle for the single parents that I had very little idea about.

 

 

I have also known women, myself included, who took a jerk back long enough to stash away a little emergency cash, or to finish school.

haha - now THAT's clever!!

 

Thanks again for the explanations and telling me so much more about a world that I have no clue about

[TigerCub]

 

I took mine back long enough to modify the post nup in my favor. He would have signed anything during that period. And he did.

 

aaah, so that explains what you meant in the other thread about how you fought dirty and he's bitter

 

Good for you 2Sure - that is very clever!!