don't know what I'm doing

[myname]

well, update, I saw my MM today, spent the day together as we have many times before, talking lots and making love.

 

I don't feel bad about it even though of course he's gone home and that home includes his wife, I had a nice day and I do believe he loves me, I do believe he wants to be with me.

 

not much more to say, I'm aware of how much what I say now could be turned around when I get upset, etc, but right now I'm getting more from seeing him than I am from not.

[jennie-jennie]

well, update, I saw my MM today, spent the day together as we have many times before, talking lots and making love.

 

I don't feel bad about it even though of course he's gone home and that home includes his wife, I had a nice day and I do believe he loves me, I do believe he wants to be with me.

 

not much more to say, I'm aware of how much what I say now could be turned around when I get upset, etc, but right now I'm getting more from seeing him than I am from not.

 

Good for you! And kudos to you for daring to share it on LS! I bet there are a lot of OW who don't.

[BB07]

well, update, I saw my MM today, spent the day together as we have many times before, talking lots and making love.

 

I don't feel bad about it even though of course he's gone home and that home includes his wife, I had a nice day and I do believe he loves me, I do believe he wants to be with me.

 

not much more to say, I'm aware of how much what I say now could be turned around when I get upset, etc, but right now I'm getting more from seeing him than I am from not.

 

Well it's up to you........to decide if what you have is enough or not.

 

Good luck!

[on a learning curve]

well, update, I saw my MM today, spent the day together as we have many times before, talking lots and making love.

 

I don't feel bad about it even though of course he's gone home and that home includes his wife, I had a nice day and I do believe he loves me, I do believe he wants to be with me.

 

not much more to say, I'm aware of how much what I say now could be turned around when I get upset, etc, but right now I'm getting more from seeing him than I am from not.

 

I am in a similar place, myname. I've kinda surrendered a bit, as in, I am not obsessing about the relationship, and simply letting things happen (for now, that is). I realized that I am just not ready to let go, and I have to accept that for the time being.

 

Best of luck to you.

[myname]

I am in a similar place, myname. I've kinda surrendered a bit, as in, I am not obsessing about the relationship, and simply letting things happen (for now, that is). I realized that I am just not ready to let go, and I have to accept that for the time being.

 

Best of luck to you.

 

yep, that's exactly where I am too.

 

good luck with your situation.

[Dexter Morgan]

 

Part of me thinks this is all bull****,

 

he's a married man cheating on his wife. EVERYTHING that comes out of his mouth is bull****

 

 

 

he just wants to keep his marriage safe and have me on the side

 

I'd say that is highly accurate.

 

 

 

and I don't want that so I need to break it off, but then when I try, I feel such a loss and he says how he misses me too and sometimes I even start to think while I've no one else and I'm lonely and feel a need for him why not carry on seeing him.

 

hes playing you...he's smooth. he knows exactly what he is doing and how to wrap you around his finger. wake up!!!!!!

 

 

 

I'm a mess, not sure if I'm asking for advice, or just somewhere to be able to discuss this that's relatively safe.

 

ok, he is a liar and a cheater.....why the hell would you want those qualities in a man? He must be real good looking or something, cuz you are settling for one lousy character in a man.

 

there are better men out there....he is a cheating, lying azzhole. find a good decent unattached man.

[sc58]

he's a married man cheating on his wife. EVERYTHING that comes out of his mouth is bull****

 

Very true. My friend told me something that really opened my eyes. My MM said he's only "pretending" to be happy with his wife. And my friend said to me, well if he's "pretending" with his wife, who he made a lifelong commitment to, what do you think he's "pretending" with you, who he has zero commitment to?

[jthorne]

OP- you keep saying you *think* he loves you and you *think* he wants to be with you, don't you know? Haven't you asked him?

 

Have you asked him what his plan is for leaving his wife and making a life with you? Or are you just at his beck and call?

[fooled once]

Well I advise you to hold out for -all- that you want- don't settle. No man is worth settling for or compromising what you really want for.

 

This is excellent - EXCELLENT - advice to ANY person in a relationship!

 

well, update, I saw my MM today, spent the day together as we have many times before, talking lots and making love.

 

I don't feel bad about it even though of course he's gone home and that home includes his wife, I had a nice day and I do believe he loves me, I do believe he wants to be with me.

 

not much more to say, I'm aware of how much what I say now could be turned around when I get upset, etc, but right now I'm getting more from seeing him than I am from not.

 

Yep, you are on a HIGH right now because you got your fix. He gave you just enough to keep you hooked until he can find some time for you in the future.

 

Only you can say when enough is enough. Right now you are saying you will take what crumbs he throws you. No man who loves one woman will skip on home to another woman. I will never believe that. I believe if a man wants to be with a woman, he will be with her. Right now, he has chosen to be with his wife. Good luck to you.

[jennie-jennie]

well, update, I saw my MM today, spent the day together as we have many times before, talking lots and making love.

 

I don't feel bad about it even though of course he's gone home and that home includes his wife, I had a nice day and I do believe he loves me, I do believe he wants to be with me.

 

not much more to say, I'm aware of how much what I say now could be turned around when I get upset, etc, but right now I'm getting more from seeing him than I am from not.

 

OP- you keep saying you *think* he loves you and you *think* he wants to be with you, don't you know? Haven't you asked him?

 

Have you asked him what his plan is for leaving his wife and making a life with you? Or are you just at his beck and call?

 

So what are you trying to say here, jthorne? Trying to sow those seeds of doubt?

[BB07]

Trying to sow those seeds of doubt?

 

Seeds of doubt don't need to be sown Jennie...it comes natural by just being in the position of being an OW. OW/OM doesn't get the whole enchilada, they get pieces here and there if they are lucky and if not lucky they get the leftovers and most live on hope of getting more.

It's a sea of doubt and questions............ex. is he going to leave, is he telling me the truth, when is he going to leave, why didn't he leave when he said he would, is he playing me for a fool, does he really love me, did he lie to me, was it all a lie and the list goes on and on and on.

 

Obviously the poster had some doubts or she most likely wouldn't have been posting here to start with. It's the rare woman who can be satisfied being in this position, most want more or else there wouldn't be a need for places like LS. Of course there are exceptions to the rule.........some women want no more than what a mm offers and it suits them just fine. You say you want more, but you are reasonably satisfied with what you are getting and you are OK with that. Notice I'm not one that continually beats you over the head with trying to get you to change your mind? IMO.......it's your choice and I don't see any point in trying to sway you to a different viewpoint but your acceptance of the situation is rare.

 

The question for any OW........is the pain greater than the pleasure and for most the pain begins to outweigh the pleasure so they come here in search of relief.

[on a learning curve]

Yep, you are on a HIGH right now because you got your fix. He gave you just enough to keep you hooked until he can find some time for you in the future.

 

Only you can say when enough is enough. Right now you are saying you will take what crumbs he throws you. No man who loves one woman will skip on home to another woman. I will never believe that. I believe if a man wants to be with a woman, he will be with her. Right now, he has chosen to be with his wife. Good luck to you.

 

I think it is possible to love more than one woman (or one man) at a time.

 

I agree that it is impossible to be committed to more than one person at a time, though. So, yes, right now he is choosing to be with his wife -why wouldn't he? That doesn't necessarily take away from the love he feels for myname, and if she is content in that knowledge, who is anyone to say she is accepting crumbs?

[bentnotbroken]

Seeds of doubt don't need to be sown Jennie...it comes natural by just being in the position of being an OW. OW/OM doesn't get the whole enchilada, they get pieces here and there if they are lucky and if not lucky they get the leftovers and most live on hope of getting more.

It's a sea of doubt and questions............ex. is he going to leave, is he telling me the truth, when is he going to leave, why didn't he leave when he said he would, is he playing me for a fool, does he really love me, did he lie to me, was it all a lie and the list goes on and on and on.

 

Obviously the poster had some doubts or she most likely wouldn't have been posting here to start with. It's the rare woman who can be satisfied being in this position, most want more or else there wouldn't be a need for places like LS. Of course there are exceptions to the rule.........some women want no more than what a mm offers and it suits them just fine. You say you want more, but you are reasonably satisfied with what you are getting and you are OK with that. Notice I'm not one that continually beats you over the head with trying to get you to change your mind? IMO.......it's your choice and I don't see any point in trying to sway you to a different viewpoint but your acceptance of the situation is rare.

 

The question for any OW........is the pain greater than the pleasure and for most the pain begins to outweigh the pleasure so they come here in search of relief.

 

 

Thank you for saying this.

[on a learning curve]

Seeds of doubt don't need to be sown Jennie...it comes natural by just being in the position of being an OW. OW/OM doesn't get the whole enchilada, they get pieces here and there if they are lucky and if not lucky they get the leftovers and most live on hope of getting more.

It's a sea of doubt and questions............ex. is he going to leave, is he telling me the truth, when is he going to leave, why didn't he leave when he said he would, is he playing me for a fool, does he really love me, did he lie to me, was it all a lie and the list goes on and on and on.

 

Obviously the poster had some doubts or she most likely wouldn't have been posting here to start with. It's the rare woman who can be satisfied being in this position, most want more or else there wouldn't be a need for places like LS. Of course there are exceptions to the rule.........some women want no more than what a mm offers and it suits them just fine. You say you want more, but you are reasonably satisfied with what you are getting and you are OK with that. Notice I'm not one that continually beats you over the head with trying to get you to change your mind? IMO.......it's your choice and I don't see any point in trying to sway you to a different viewpoint but your acceptance of the situation is rare.

 

The question for any OW........is the pain greater than the pleasure and for most the pain begins to outweigh the pleasure so they come here in search of relief.

 

You are right, BB. I quoted your whole post, but this stands out for me.

 

It is a relationship built (for lack of a better word) on doubt. I wouldn't wish it on anyone. That said, we all take risks with our hearts. We fall in love and we recover - such is life.

 

I am thankful there is a place to discuss such things.

[jennie-jennie]

Seeds of doubt don't need to be sown Jennie...it comes natural by just being in the position of being an OW. OW/OM doesn't get the whole enchilada, they get pieces here and there if they are lucky and if not lucky they get the leftovers and most live on hope of getting more.

It's a sea of doubt and questions............ex. is he going to leave, is he telling me the truth, when is he going to leave, why didn't he leave when he said he would, is he playing me for a fool, does he really love me, did he lie to me, was it all a lie and the list goes on and on and on.

 

Obviously the poster had some doubts or she most likely wouldn't have been posting here to start with. It's the rare woman who can be satisfied being in this position, most want more or else there wouldn't be a need for places like LS. Of course there are exceptions to the rule.........some women want no more than what a mm offers and it suits them just fine. You say you want more, but you are reasonably satisfied with what you are getting and you are OK with that. Notice I'm not one that continually beats you over the head with trying to get you to change your mind? IMO.......it's your choice and I don't see any point in trying to sway you to a different viewpoint but your acceptance of the situation is rare.

 

The question for any OW........is the pain greater than the pleasure and for most the pain begins to outweigh the pleasure so they come here in search of relief.

 

There is more than one way to look at being the OW. You and I obviously do not agree. This is my view:

 

All unmarried mistresses have one attribute in common: they are strong and independent, because they have to be. Otherwise, they could just get married. Getting a man is not difficult but finding the right man, with the right chemistry, is. They are brave enough to seize happiness when it's there and to live their lives alone instead of taking second best.

(from A Guide to Surviving Life as a Mistress by King & Hayes)

[jennie-jennie]

Seeds of doubt don't need to be sown Jennie...it comes natural by just being in the position of being an OW.

 

I can't believe you said this. You know exactly what I mean. If a seed of doubt is already present in an OW's mind, LS is good at fertilizing it. And planting additional seeds. Loads and loads of them.

[jennie-jennie]

You are right, BB. I quoted your whole post, but this stands out for me.

It is a relationship built (for lack of a better word) on doubt. I wouldn't wish it on anyone. That said, we all take risks with our hearts. We fall in love and we recover - such is life.

 

I am thankful there is a place to discuss such things.

 

I am sorry you feel this way, OALC. If that is true, I would understand why you would not want to stay in your relationship.

 

My relationship is built on love and honesty. Not on doubt. So I choose to stay.

 

OW, trust the bond, trust the love between you!

[BB07]

There is more than one way to look at being the OW. You and I obviously do not agree. This is my view:

All unmarried mistresses have one attribute in common: they are strong and independent, because they have to be. Otherwise, they could just get married. Getting a man is not difficult but finding the right man, with the right chemistry, is. They are brave enough to seize happiness when it's there and to live their lives alone instead of taking second best.

 

(from A Guide to Surviving Life as a Mistress by King & Hayes)

You are right Jennie, we just don't agree.

The only problem I have with your quote above is that "most" of the ladies here do feel as if they are second best and that is where the problem lies and that is where the pain comes from. In my POV if someone feels the pain outweighs the pleasure then they need to do something different. Whatever their different might be.

 

You obviously don't feel that way and since you don't, then you are OK with things and I'm not here to change your mind nor argue the point and also I'd like to point out that I don't even respond to posts where someone is OK with their status of being the OW, well response in the sense of trying to change their mind or telling them to go NC. That's not my cup of tea.

 

It just bothers me to see other women hurting so badly and living in doubt and turmoil because they are involved with a man who isn't giving them what they need and want. In summary.......I agree with parts of your quote, a woman should be strong and independent and they should be brave enough to seize happiness. In my POV being strong and brave and independent means not settling for less that what you know your heart needs and wants and if you aren't getting it, it's about being tough and strong enough to walk away if the pain is greater than the pleasure.

[BB07]

I can't believe you said this. You know exactly what I mean. If a seed of doubt is already present in an OW's mind, LS is good at fertilizing it. And planting additional seeds. Loads and loads of them.

 

No one should be so blind and trusting that they don't have doubts about a relationship, doesn't matter if it's a relationship with a mm or any other relationship we have to keep our eyes and ears open. As I said before the dynamic and set up of a affair is of course going to have more doubts and confusion that most other relationships because there are more than two people in the circle. Most posters come here because of the doubts and confusion and they are not happy with the situation or else why would they come here to write their stories filled with pain?

Your statement above seems to say that posters can't find their own truth because of all the clutter of "planting doubts" in their mind........I disagree with that and I think that posters are intelligent enough to figure out what advice speaks to them and their particular situation and discard the rest. I also think they find their own footing and they decide for themselves if they need to get out of it, or if they aren't ready to get out of it at this time, or if they are going to stay in it because they are OK with it. I don't think anyone who contributes here has enough power to make someone do a 180 on what their inclination already is.

[myname]

ok, well I'm still here, and still appreciate all the responses.

 

I am aware that I may have merely set myself up for a nasty fall (again) in the future, but I'm not ready to go no contact yet, and trying to make myself when I wasn't ready was causing me more grief than just accepting this is the situation I've got myself in, and right now I am still involved even though I don't want this as a long term proposition.

[jennie-jennie]

No one should be so blind and trusting that they don't have doubts about a relationship, doesn't matter if it's a relationship with a mm or any other relationship we have to keep our eyes and ears open. As I said before the dynamic and set up of a affair is of course going to have more doubts and confusion that most other relationships because there are more than two people in the circle. Most posters come here because of the doubts and confusion and they are not happy with the situation or else why would they come here to write their stories filled with pain?

Your statement above seems to say that posters can't find their own truth because of all the clutter of "planting doubts" in their mind........I disagree with that and I think that posters are intelligent enough to figure out what advice speaks to them and their particular situation and discard the rest. I also think they find their own footing and they decide for themselves if they need to get out of it, or if they aren't ready to get out of it at this time, or if they are going to stay in it because they are OK with it. I don't think anyone who contributes here has enough power to make someone do a 180 on what their inclination already is.

 

I lost my footing when I first posted on LS and everybody else had a common view, coincidentally the view that society teaches us. I thought if everyone here who all seem to have more experience than me are saying the same thing, must I not be wrong then?

 

BB, you are underestimating the power of a strong view held by the majority. Especially in a situation where you might already be questioning things yourself.

 

So, as has been stated before, on LS you can learn how to completely destroy your relationship with your MM. There are plenty of posters who will help you with that.

 

But many OW are not ready or do not desire to leave their MM. If they trust their MM loves them, their self esteem does not have to take a hit even if they decide to stay with him. The attitude of the OW determines whether the relationship with the MM will strengthen or weaken her self esteem.

 

Some MM are trustworthy, some MM are not. Figuring out which category your MM belongs to is a good start.

 

Once you've decided whether to trust your MM or not, you can't go on questioning and doubting every move he makes. No relationship can survive such distrust, be it an extramarital relationship or a marriage.

 

Planting seeds of doubt in the mind of the conflicted OW is thriving on her insecurity. Show her the different options available instead. Strengthen her in her resolve to make a decision true to herself. Don't hand her ready made answers. Give her the benefit of believing she is able to make a decision without being swayed in one way or the other.

[myname]

Jennie has a point.

 

Of course hearing over and over again that whatever he says is bull****, he's playing you, you're on a high now, he's a lying cheating ******* makes you question whether you're just being a fool to believe anything he says, you're being manipulated, you don't know you're own mind etc.

 

Of course that's not to say these might not be the case!

[jennie-jennie]

Jennie has a point.

 

Of course hearing over and over again that whatever he says is bull****, he's playing you, you're on a high now, he's a lying cheating ******* makes you question whether you're just being a fool to believe anything he says, you're being manipulated, you don't know you're own mind etc.

 

Of course that's not to say these might not be the case!

 

I'd rather be fooled by a man not worthy of my love, than not trust a man worthy of my trust.

 

I love my country's version of Better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all:

It is better to listen to the string that burst than to never draw a bow.

Edited October 19, 2010 by jennie-jennie
spelling

[BB07]

I lost my footing when I first posted on LS and everybody else had a common view, coincidentally the view that society teaches us. I thought if everyone here who all seem to have more experience than me are saying the same thing, must I not be wrong then?

 

I see some common things said here, but as you state below everyone has to make up their own mind.

 

BB, you are underestimating the power of a strong view held by the majority. Especially in a situation where you might already be questioning things yourself.

 

Jennie.....I'm not the majority. My POV is uniquely my own and come on......it's good to question, you did, the other posters are, that is why they are here.

So, as has been stated before, on LS you can learn how to completely destroy your relationship with your MM. There are plenty of posters who will help you with that.

 

But many OW are not ready or do not desire to leave their MM. If they trust their MM loves them, their self esteem does not have to take a hit even if they decide to stay with him. The attitude of the OW determines whether the relationship with the MM will strengthen or weaken her self esteem.

 

As I said before......there is NO ONE here who has enough power to make someone do a 180. Regarding self esteem, if the OW is good with things as they are, she most likely won't be posting here and hell I'm not powerful enough to change anyone's mind regarding the outcome she decides on. What am I supposed to say to someone Jennie, am I supposed to not say what I think, what I feel? Am I supposed to cheer them on when they post about how much pain they are in? Am I supposed to say ahhh it's OK hon, just keep doing what you are doing, never mind the pain, never mind the uncertainty you feel.

Some MM are trustworthy, some MM are not. Figuring out which category your MM belongs to is a good start.

 

I agree with the above and if the posters MM is not one of the trustworthy ones, then they need to get out of it, right? And.......it's not for me to tell them one way or the other, I really don't think I do this. I just give my POV that comes from my experience and it's only my opinion. Most people get that opinions are like azzholes, everyone has one.

Once you've decided whether to trust your MM or not, you can't go on questioning and doubting every move he makes. No relationship can survive such distrust, be it an extramarital relationship or a marriage.

 

Planting seeds of doubt in the mind of the conflicted OW is thriving on her insecurity. Show her the different options available instead. Strengthen her in her resolve to make a decision true to herself. Don't hand her ready made answers. Give her the benefit of believing she is able to make a decision without being swayed in one way or the other.

 

Again.........I'm not planting anything Jennie, it's already there due to the dynamics and again I'll repeat myself because I don't think you are getting what I'm saying, I nor other posters here have enough power to make someone make a choice. Everyone knows the choice to stay in or get out is THEIR choice, it's not mine or yours. They can take what they get here or leave it.....posters are smart enough to know this.

[Silly_Girl]

ok, well I'm still here, and still appreciate all the responses.

 

I am aware that I may have merely set myself up for a nasty fall (again) in the future, but I'm not ready to go no contact yet, and trying to make myself when I wasn't ready was causing me more grief than just accepting this is the situation I've got myself in, and right now I am still involved even though I don't want this as a long term proposition.

 

That's where I was. I went NC. It was one of the hardest things I have ever done because I wasn't ready. I used those 6/7 weeks to work on myself. Then I broke NC (the initial contact was accidental, but I needn't have followed it up), and continued to work through how I felt, and lots of other stuff. I was not READY to call it a day. Not in the circumstances, not with him still saying he loved me and wanted to be with me. I got myself to a place where I felt I would be fine and dandy (and then some) if he DID leave her, and fine and dandy (after initial heartbreak!!) if he didn't.

 

That's where I am now. If he suddenly runs back to her I'll be angry as hell and I'll move on. Previously, when we went NC I wasn't really angry, I was confused, spaced out, anxious, upset, trying to work out what had happened etc etc. I would deal differently now. And I'm happy with where I'm at. I was not ready to break ties, even though some fantastic well-meaning people here were 100% sure it was the right thing for me. It was ME who wasn't 100% sure, and that's why it didn't work out.

 

You know YOU. You know you need to protect yourself, and be wary, but if you know you are not ready to draw a line under it (but that one day you will be) then go with your instinct. You have to live the rest of your life after this. I knew I'd always regret not trying harder if i walked away. If I have to walk away now, I know I won't regret anything. Good luck