House is SOLD! A fresh start as planned? Or the end of my marriage?

[Kay]

Some of you might remember my story, although I have not posted in quite a while.

 

A little background ... I am 44, H is 43, married 21 years. In the past 4 years, I have lost both of my parents, my H lost his sister (suicide), we bought our "dream house," H lost his job, H started a new business, began having an emotional affair with my best friend, I suggested putting our house on the market to make a fresh start (E.A. is over). Things actually begin to improve slowly, we start going out together again as a couple, (although most of the past year and a half my H has been sleeping in our guest room) our children are happy and our family feels right again. Far from perfect, but better than things have been in almost 3 years of "limbo land." H and I start looking at houses, I'm cautiously optimistic ...

 

Fast forward to today. After over one and a half years, the house is finally SOLD. Fresh start, here we go, right?

 

H goes into a tailspin, major seller's remorse and an about-face back into the guest room.

 

Two nights ago, he tells me he really wants "to make this/our marriage work," but he wants me to know that it is important to him that we maintain separate bedrooms. He also still does not say/feel that he loves me.

 

In previous posts, several of you told me to be prepared for this to happen. Believe me if you will, that I really thought that I knew what I would do if this happened. That I would not allow him to move with us and expect to stay emotionally and physically disconnected. That this was a deal breaker.

 

I am facing the most difficult decision of my life. I no longer have the luxury of time on my side. We close on the house next month, we do not have another one and now I am facing the reality of needing two houses, instead of our "fresh start." My husband is barely functioning, he keeps telling me how sorry he is, how messed up he knows he is, what an *#@@ he has been to me and our children (16 & 14), how he wants to figure out a way to stay together, on and on and on ...

 

PLEASE, can someone offer me words of advice, comfort or support? So many of you have been so helpful, kind and caring. I've never needed help more than right now. (Bark? Lester? Moimeme? Hokey?)

 

Thank you from the bottom of my heart for your thoughts. Kay

[moimeme]

Forgive me Kay, after reading so many stories I can't keep them all straight but is your H depressed? Sure as heck sounds like it to me.

[midori]

Hi Kay,

 

I'm so sorry you're in this position. I don't know what to suggest specifically because my circumstances are nothing like yours and I don't think I can fully appreciate all of the nuances and implications, the priorities you must have because of your children, and the significance of a shared history with your husband. I would not tolerate this anymore, and I think at this point I would tell hubby that he can look for a studio apartment to rent because you and the kids can't live with someone who's only a partial participant in your life. I understand that you may not be able to do that though.

 

My instinct is that it's time for you to insist on changes from your husband. Moimeme may well be right, he sounds like he's depressed. He needs to seek treatment. In your immediate circumstances, I think that would be a bare minimum. He needs to be under the care of an experienced, trained professional who can determine an appropriate treatment. If your husband isn't willing to get that help, I think you need to give serious thought to the likelihood that things aren't going to get better with him anytime soon. As difficult as such a choice would be I think you owe it to yourself, your kids, and your husband to be realistic. If he's not going to step fully into his life with you, there isn't a place for him in your life at all.

 

Clinical depression or not, you cannot afford to keep giving him time and space. The man has had plenty of that, and he hasn't seemed to benefit from it. So regardless of whether he feels he must have it, I think you're right in not wanting to go along with him anymore. It's decision time. If he's still wracked with doubt and angst and depression, he needs to get treatment for that, whatever that treatment should be. If he's not willing to seek treatment, he needs to snap out of it NOW, or you need to start severing ties.

 

Good luck. Let us know how you are.

 

-midori

[Kay]

Thank you both for your replies. I absolutely believe my husband is depressed but as you probably know, that means nothing unless HE believes he is. He refused marriage counseling and does not see a therapist himself. He is always reading books, trying to figure himself out, to "cure" himself. He is the classic "emotional distancer" while I play the part of the "emotional pursuer." When I realized, through my own individual therapy with a wonderful therapist, that this type of relationship was not working, I backed off completely. I started working on myself, focusing on what I wanted and needed, got on antidepressants (I suffered serious depression 2 1/2 years ago - about the time of my husband's midlife crisis)

 

The more I backed off and gave him space, the more he moved closer to me. It really changed the dynamics of our relationship when I started emotionally distancing myself, while continuing to be supportive, kind and loving.

 

Ultimatums scare the heck out of me. I have learned not to ask someone a question unless I was prepared to hear the answer. I will not threaten, manipulate or force something to happen that I'm not sure I want. In the past, I used all of those techniques and ended up very unhappy with the person I'd become.

 

Would anyone suggest a separation for us? Or is this just postponing the inevitable? I am physically sick, mentally overwhelmed and emotionally drained beyond anything I've ever experienced.

 

I am so grateful for anything any of you can suggest. Kay

[abc]

Why don't you rent a house for the time being and let H rent one too. A little space and distance will allow you to think. It would also give you a chance to see what life on your own would be like.

 

I was a single mom with 2 children for a many years and I was terrified at first. As time went on and I got a job, developed new friends, etc. I was very happy. Financially be prepared to take a dive. But $ does not equal true happiness. Knowing yourself and being proud of who you are and being a great mom is such a wonderful boost.

Good luck!

[midori]

Originally posted by Kay

Would anyone suggest a separation for us? Or is this just postponing the inevitable? I am physically sick, mentally overwhelmed and emotionally drained beyond anything I've ever experienced.

 

Yes, Kay, I would. With the aforementioned caveat that I'm not in your shoes, it seems to me that it's time for tough decisions. You cannot continue as you have been, yet your husband seems poised to do just that. If he won't seek help, you can't make him. But you can refuse to maintain what is untenable.

 

I don't know how separations work legally, or in any other sense to be honest. What I'm suggesting you could do if you're unwilling to file for divorce right away, is tell your husband that you want to separate, and that in four months you intend to file for divorce. I suppose that's kind of an ultimatum, with the implication that he's got four months to convince you to not file for divorce. But I would look at it rather as a gradual extrication from the marriage. You don't want to start divorce proceedings with your head spinning. You need some time to adjust and regain your balance. That's what the separation time would be for. And if, during that time, your husband did finally make some substantial and promising changes, you could decide based on how realistic they seem, instead of making decisions about him based in part on your reluctance to rock the boat.

 

I think you should consult a lawyer before doing anything. Just to make sure you're not setting yourself up for headaches down the road.

[meanon]

My husband is barely functioning, he keeps telling me how sorry he is, how messed up he knows he is, what an *#@@ he has been to me and our children (16 & 14), how he wants to figure out a way to stay together, on and on and on ...

 

When people are this ill they find it hard to feel, never mind express love. I think you are in a really difficult situation. Last time you started a thread you thought that things were improving but that you needed to be emotionally prepared for a separation when the house move came. Now it's here and he wants to stay with you but is still refusing to take responsibility for his problems.

 

You have endured so much - it's clear you can't allow the situation to continue. I think you need to be clear what the minimum is that you can live. Then stick to it, without guilt, helping him to adjust to whatever changes are needed. It may well be that talk of a separation will make him seek help. I would avoid presenting this as an ultimatum. He at least acknowledges the effects of the way he has treated you - that's the basis for the discussion.

 

Do you have the emotional resources left at this stage to continue to support him if he seeks therapy? He can't make himself well straight away, even with therapy. He may well remain disconnected for some time yet (many months) - can you cope with that? These are the things you need to consider, in my view, before making a decision. I'm sure you'll make the choice that best balances the needs of all your family.

[jester]

Kay, the past 4 years of your life have been hell. You have experienced overwhelming loss--so much to tax the strength of any human.

 

You have persevered where a lesser spouse would have unloaded her dysfunctional husband and ended her loveless marriage.

 

You are now poised to start anew in a new house and all that implies in terms of life renewal and new beginnings. You are greeting the new dawn.

 

I strongly recommend that you begin this renewal without the deadweight of your barely functioning spouse. It is time for you to unload him in every sense of the word--physically, emotionally and legally.

 

I would refuse to continue to carry a spouse who, for years, sleeps in a separate room and never condescends to tell me, by word or gesture, that he loved me, appreciated me, desired me.

 

You're a young 44 with two competent and capable children on the verge of adulthood. Get your family out of this Twilight Zone episode by re-making yourself and your family without your cold, but clinging, spouse.

 

Divorce him and start dating, partying, socializing with fun, interesting and fully functional men. I want your next Thread to be about this great guy you meant and how he took the sadness from your eyes...

 

 

jester (a friend of bark's)

[sherell]

Kay I am really sorry for what you are going through, and for what you have been through, but really enough is enough how much pain can one endure for so long and keep their sanity, dignity & self esteem. You must separate from this barely functioning person, and only then can you start to see things with more clarity. When you are living in this nightmare it is impossible to see your way clear. You sound like a great person with so much to offer, now is the time for you and your children. I wish you the best of luck.

[meanon]

I don't think you can expect substantial changes while he is depressed. If it were me as well as considering how much more I could cope with, I'd be trying to assess how things would be when he's recovered - what potential there is left in the marriage longer term.

 

Two things would bother me:

 

The more I backed off and gave him space, the more he moved closer to me. It really changed the dynamics of our relationship when I started emotionally distancing myself

 

To me this indicates that he has difficulties with emotional intimacy generally, or is unable to cope with change and these are problems that may well persist even when he is well.

 

It sounds as though there were major problems for a long time before the onset of the depression.

 

As I said earlier, you are best placed to make this decision for your family but it is in no-one's interest for you to take on more than you can cope with, particularly when the outlook is uncertain to say the least. If it was me I'd cut my losses and get a divorce.

[Errol]

Everyone else said pretty much what I would say.

 

See a lawyer about your husbands financial responsibility to you and your children, and about custody.

 

See a financial planner if you need some help with your finances - sometimes it helps to have someone else work with you to set up a plan. Do this right away to make sure you can afford the house you are buying or to get out of the deal before you sign anything and then rent a house or an apartment as a transational space until you have your plan worked out.

 

Don't tell your husband you are doing all of this until you have already set things in motion. I say this not as a ploy to manipulate or as an ultimatum, but as a way to ensure you make your decisions without undue emotional influence from him.

 

Once you have started the ball rolling on these issues it will hopefully be easier to stick with your decisions.

 

Even if you separate or divorce now, it does not mean that he will never be part of your life again. It may be the shock he needs to get help and at some point you two may be able to build a new and healthy relationship.

[Kay]

Thank you so much for your replies.

 

I really thought my husband and I could avoid becoming an all too common statistic. The thought of divorce makes me so sad, especially for my children. I think about my daughter, graduating from high school next year, visiting colleges, her senior year, my 14 year old son poised on the brink of manhood ... The hardest thing to accept is that I wil always believe that we could have salvaged our marriage.

 

 

I'm toying with the idea of moving into a house with my kids and having my husband rent an apartment - at least initially - for a few months. To feel what really "separated" means. Not seeing me or the kids every day, not coming home to dinner with all of us, not seeing them off to school in the morning, etc. I would give myself a time limit (3 months?) and unless he began getting help for his depression and/or agreed to marriage counseling, I would begin divorce proceedings.

 

 

Any thoughts about trying this?

 

 

Again, my very sincere thanks to all of you! Take care. Kay

[Errol]

It does sound like a good plan.

 

Try to think of it this way - you don't want to salvage a marriage that wasn't working anyway -- what you want is to improve yourself and possibly build a new relationship and marriage that will be healthy and happy for all concerned.

 

Giving yourself a time limit for him to get help and meet your requirements, may work for you, but I would suggest that you make several goals and follow through on each goal as you reach it so that if/when you do reach your 'times up' mark you will also follow through on that and not keep pushing it back because you don't feel ready to let go.

[meanon]

I understand your desire to keep your family together but will you be happy without love and do you think love will return if he gets treatment for depression? Given the long history of lack of intimacy I wonder if he is capable of making you happy. The kids may suffer from a divorce but as long as they are loved they will be OK and your happiness is important not just to you but for their well being too.

 

If you think there is a realistic chance of salvaging the marriage I suggest marriage counselling is essential as well as treatment for depression. If you take this route you should hope for the best but also be prepared (emotionally, financially) for the possibility that his recovery will result in him leaving.

 

Good luck.

[abc]

I think your plan is good, however, I personally would never give a time frame. As you reach the end of it you may panic and do something foolish. Give it time so you can really think things through and adjust to your new life. 3-4 months isn't enough time in my book.

 

You may find that you really like being on your own. I was quite surprised at myself. And when I say I was terrified, I really was. The weirdest thing was, as the days rolled by, I could actually feel myself growing...emotional and spiritually. My self- esteem sky rocketed.

 

My final words... Give yourself the time you need. You don't know how much you will NEED at this point. You can be separated for a very long time if you need to be.

 

Good luck, hon.