Separated MMs

[maravilla]

I

Another approach may be the one i sometimes follow: "do what you would do if i wasnt in the picture" as you mentioned in one of your posts, you are A reason, but not THE reason of the divorce... If you are the only reason, then its better for him to go back and you to go on...(this includes advise for myself also)

 

Just some thoughts...

It is really nice meeting you,maravilla! you remind me of my way of thinking!!

 

It's really nice to meet you too. I totally get everything you just advised me of, and it's nice to be able to talk about it with someone who understands.

 

I do want him to do what he would do if I weren't in the picture. Unfortunately it feels like there's no way to know what they would be unless I actually get out of the picture. Which is so hard to do!

[Capris]

:rolleyes: oh brother! :rolleyes:

 

he will SAY anything to you to keep stringing you along.

 

step away until the divorce is FINAL! you will then have solid EVIDENCE that he actually is willing to DO anything and everything to be a man that is available for you.

 

until he DOES exactly that - he may NEVER be free.

 

 

if you step away and take care of yourself while he goes through this long drawn out process - you save yourself from getting on the wild roller coaster ride he's going to be on until it's all a DONE DEAL.

 

take care of YOU - no one else is going to do that for you - certainly not him... he will ALWAYS look out for HIS best interest... now YOU take care of YOU first and foremost!

 

See this is what i was talking bout on my previous post..

 

Hi sunny,

i agree with you on one thing, "take care of YOU!"

This guy has done steps, its not just a guy who promises and promises.

Why is it sooo negative around here when it comes to affairs?

Maybe its because everyone ends up here after a hard time? cause when they are happy no one is willing to write about how happy they are?

 

Well sometimes things work out well.Yes i do have hopes my A will turn out well, but my MM hasnt done any of the things maravilla's MM has done.

 

Maybe the story is always the same blah blah blah, but its not ALWAYS.

We dont even know the man.He might be a prick , he might be a marvelous man that just wants to end HIS WHOLE PREVIOUS LIFE well...

 

Sunny, i know your intensions are good, and i hope im not giving false hopes to people, but i just want to always try to be objective and not get my A aspects into other peoples affair.

 

Maybe someday, i will totally agree with you. Sorry if i was blunt, i just get frustrated in here sometimes and got all my nerves on you :/

 

Take care and again sorry if i was mean

[maravilla]

:rolleyes: oh brother! :rolleyes:

 

he will SAY anything to you to keep stringing you along.

 

step away until the divorce is FINAL! you will then have solid EVIDENCE that he actually is willing to DO anything and everything to be a man that is available for you.

 

until he DOES exactly that - he may NEVER be free.

 

 

if you step away and take care of yourself while he goes through this long drawn out process - you save yourself from getting on the wild roller coaster ride he's going to be on until it's all a DONE DEAL.

 

take care of YOU - no one else is going to do that for you - certainly not him... he will ALWAYS look out for HIS best interest... now YOU take care of YOU first and foremost!

 

You're right, I need to take care of myself. When he asked me if I could hang in there with him and said it can't be done in a day, or a week, I said, I understand that, but I have no idea when it will be done. He said that even if he were to rush it it would take at least four months. I said, again, I understand and I'm not talking about a complete and finalized divorce. I'm talking about getting to the point where we can be a public couple, and have everything that all couples have. He said 'tomorrow' and then he laughed. I said, no, seriously, I know you would like it to be tomorrow but then you would need to inform your wife and you've said you're not ready to do that. I said it would make it easier on me to have a timeline to know what is going to happen when, but that I realize that he would have to be willing and able to make a timeline in the first place and I don't want to rush him or force him, even if it was something I had the power to do, so I can't see any other way but to step out of the picture. He said he understands and he agrees he needs to set up some kind of a timeline, for himself too, but he just hasn't yet, for some reason it is hard for him to actually break the news to his wife and serve her with papers etc.

 

Again I'm back to then what am I doing in this situation because how do I know if he will ever get there or when. You're right 2sunny that he is not looking out for my best interests, nor could he at this time. He made it clear in the car that he's looking out for the best interests of his kids (understandable), his wife (also understandable) and even himself because he wants to keep things as peaceful as possible and not get tarred and feather. I understand all that and then I also must understand that since he can't put me first right now I need to put myself first and for me that means not seeing him at all. Because, try as I might, I can't just sit there and wonder what will happen and hope it will all turn out okay and just grin and bear the hard times of him going to hang out at home and talking about what his wife is thinking etc. I have to have my own life; I told him that and he said he understands. At times he seemed to be saying he thinks a break is the best thing too, even though he doesn't want to admit it. (And then at other times he talked about sitting his wife down this week-- which is what he said last week -- to let her know it's really over. He's just all over the map still, and even more so now that he is being more honest about what he's really thinking.) So at least now it feels easier to disentangle myself knowing that I'm not absolutely crushing him.

[Silly_Girl]

You're right, I need to take care of myself. When he asked me if I could hang in there with him and said it can't be done in a day, or a week, I said, I understand that, but I have no idea when it will be done. He said that even if he were to rush it it would take at least four months. I said, again, I understand and I'm not talking about a complete and finalized divorce. I'm talking about getting to the point where we can be a public couple, and have everything that all couples have. He said 'tomorrow' and then he laughed. I said, no, seriously, I know you would like it to be tomorrow but then you would need to inform your wife and you've said you're not ready to do that. I said it would make it easier on me to have a timeline to know what is going to happen when, but that I realize that he would have to be willing and able to make a timeline in the first place and I don't want to rush him or force him, even if it was something I had the power to do, so I can't see any other way but to step out of the picture. He said he understands and he agrees he needs to set up some kind of a timeline, for himself too, but he just hasn't yet, for some reason it is hard for him to actually break the news to his wife and serve her with papers etc.

 

Again I'm back to then what am I doing in this situation because how do I know if he will ever get there or when. You're right 2sunny that he is not looking out for my best interests, nor could he at this time. He made it clear in the car that he's looking out for the best interests of his kids (understandable), his wife (also understandable) and even himself because he wants to keep things as peaceful as possible and not get tarred and feather. I understand all that and then I also must understand that since he can't put me first right now I need to put myself first and for me that means not seeing him at all. Because, try as I might, I can't just sit there and wonder what will happen and hope it will all turn out okay and just grin and bear the hard times of him going to hang out at home and talking about what his wife is thinking etc. I have to have my own life; I told him that and he said he understands. At times he seemed to be saying he thinks a break is the best thing too, even though he doesn't want to admit it. (And then at other times he talked about sitting his wife down this week-- which is what he said last week -- to let her know it's really over. He's just all over the map still, and even more so now that he is being more honest about what he's really thinking.) So at least now it feels easier to disentangle myself knowing that I'm not absolutely crushing him.

 

I wish for you that your MM has similar levels of concern and care for you, as you do him. I hope he rates you as an equally high priority.

[Capris]

Wha-- he's fighting for custody-- what?? He's breaking up the marriage with his wife and he's going to try to take her kid away? What the heck??? What did the wife do to deserve this? From everything the OP has said she's a decent person, she helped him through a serious illness. Where did this custody thing come from? He hasn't even decided when he's going to file for divorce!

 

Well first of all, its me, not maravilla, so i may have understood something wrong, like "about the custody of his kids" may just mean how much time he gets etc etc and not the full custody so sorry if i jumped to conclusions.

 

Second, i dont find it weird for a cheting father to try to get full custody. Married to a cheating husband doesnt make the wife a saint. We see the "cheating husband" and we all throw rocks forgetting about anything else (and this has nothing to do with my A, its plain logic)

 

just a thought

[maravilla]

 

About his wife not knowing about you two...he is willing to fight for custody...isnt an affair a BIG thumbdown on that if he reveals it is still going on?Good reason to hide it if you ask me..

 

He told me his lawyer said that an affair or him being with me won't help or hurt his custody case. The courts don't look at infidelity when deciding custody. His kids are old enough that they have a big say in where they go. So really I think it is more about keeping peace with his wife so she doesn't turn the kids against him, and also about getting his kids to be comfortable with the situation so they want to stay with him sometimes. He said a court-appointed counselor is going to talk to them about where they want to live and their custody arrangements. Honestly he wasn't around much before he moved out and I think he is trying to rebuild his relationship with his kids so that they know he wants to see them and have shared custody and so that they want the same things. (He will automatically get joint legal custody but it's a matter of the physical custody, where they live).

 

It's kind of a backwards way of doing things but I do believe he's trying to be closer to his kids than he has been. Again while I understand all of this, I start to think, well what about me? How long will I have to wait in the background while he straightens things out with his kids to be able to tell them he is really getting divorced and for them to decide where they want to live and visit etc.? When I asked him when we could be a public couple and explained what that meant to me, which doesn't mean hanging out with his kids before his divorce is final, but does mean making it clear to his wife and kids that he is definitely getting divorced, he didn't have an answer for me. He doesn't know how long it will be until we reach that point. I guess a lot of it depends on how his wife and kids react and adjust, so, it's totally out of my control.

 

I dont know if im right or wrong, or just using your comeout to reassure my A(silly thing to do but it happens), but i just read a really nice and honest relationsip between you two under these circumstances.

 

 

Just some thoughts again..

 

Thanks for the thoughts capris. I do agree with have a very nice and honest relationship. That's what is so hard, I do know he loves me, he treats me well, he listens to and respects my wishes. Right now I think he's at the point of realizing that our wishes and needs are not lined up and that there's no way he can make me happy and also do what he thinks he needs to do for his family's well-being.

[maravilla]

What HAS he done or arranged? It's all a bit mysterious and this is one situation that has no place for mystery and secrets.

 

You were very upset, and said he handled it well. From here it looks like he handled nothing but calmed you down and smoothed things over. Is there more that I've missed? Apologies if so.

 

I guess I meant he handled it well because in the past he'd get upset or angry if I talked about taking a break. He would say he needs me here for him and I'm not listening to him or doubting him etc. This time he said he understands what I've been saying and he knows that he has to be okay with what I want (space, a break) because he loves me and wants me to be happy. He said he understands what I've been saying even though he doesn't like it and he thinks I have some good points.

 

He still hasn't done anything besides what he's already done, which are move out, talk to his lawyer, talk to his counselor, look at this place to rent long-term (which we just did in between my crying and our talking, LOL), spend a lot of time with me and go out with me etc. In the past he would say I wasn't giving him credit for those things and he would ask me to be patient while he did the other steps he needed to do to be with me for real. This time he said he would prefer that but he understands that this situation isn't making me happy and that if I need space, he must give it to me.

[Silly_Girl]

Thanks Maravilla, I see what you mean.

[NoIDidn't]

He told me his lawyer said that an affair or him being with me won't help or hurt his custody case. The courts don't look at infidelity when deciding custody. His kids are old enough that they have a big say in where they go. So really I think it is more about keeping peace with his wife so she doesn't turn the kids against him, and also about getting his kids to be comfortable with the situation so they want to stay with him sometimes. He said a court-appointed counselor is going to talk to them about where they want to live and their custody arrangements. Honestly he wasn't around much before he moved out and I think he is trying to rebuild his relationship with his kids so that they know he wants to see them and have shared custody and so that they want the same things. (He will automatically get joint legal custody but it's a matter of the physical custody, where they live).

 

It's kind of a backwards way of doing things but I do believe he's trying to be closer to his kids than he has been. Again while I understand all of this, I start to think, well what about me? How long will I have to wait in the background while he straightens things out with his kids to be able to tell them he is really getting divorced and for them to decide where they want to live and visit etc.? When I asked him when we could be a public couple and explained what that meant to me, which doesn't mean hanging out with his kids before his divorce is final, but does mean making it clear to his wife and kids that he is definitely getting divorced, he didn't have an answer for me. He doesn't know how long it will be until we reach that point. I guess a lot of it depends on how his wife and kids react and adjust, so, it's totally out of my control.

 

M

 

This is going to get complicated. He wants to establish a R with his kids who he admits to not spending much time with even though he lived in the same house with them all their life, but you want to solidify your R with him. These two things conflict, big time.

 

Its not that its insurmountable, but that it will be challenging. You've drawn your line in the sand (good for you, I might add) about not wanting to hang out with his kids as a third wheel all the time. He's told you he needs to re-establish a bond with them besides that of absentee parent. Doable, but tricky.

 

If he's offered you space, take it. Divorce is extremely hard on parents with children AND the children. For him, things will get much more difficult before he starts to breathe again. His children will either run to him since he hasn't been around much, or they will reject his attempts to bond again - because he hasn't been around much. During this time, it will seem like you are on the back burner and that he doesn't have much time for you. It will seem like you are considering his feelings all the time and that yours are neglected.

 

Have a plan. That will help some.

[maravilla]

Wha-- he's fighting for custody-- what?? He's breaking up the marriage with his wife and he's going to try to take her kid away? What the heck??? What did the wife do to deserve this? From everything the OP has said she's a decent person, she helped him through a serious illness. Where did this custody thing come from? He hasn't even decided when he's going to file for divorce!

 

Ok- hopefully to clear up some confusion. He is not fighting for FULL custody. He just wants shared custody. He prefers for his kids to stay with him three nights a week but has been told by his lawyer that they have a lot of say in that part and can't be forced to do anything.

 

From what I understand (I wasn't at the meeting with the lawyer of course ) both parents get legal custody, as in both have to give permission for the kids when it comes to medical issues, travel, etc., whatever decisions parents normally make for the kids' best interest, and then at his kids' age the court takes into account the kids' consideration and makes the parents go to mediation and set up a shared physical custody arrangement.

 

His daughter is 16 and, he says, in her own little world. He hasn't had much interaction with her and he says she seems fine about the divorce. His son is 14 and seems to be having a tough time, getting into arguments with the mother and doing badly at school. His son has been wanting to spend a lot of time with him and he thinks he may want to live with him. He said his son told him he understands why he doesn't want to be at home and says that mom is a nag and he just wants to spend time with dad, if mom and dad can't get along enough for dad to live at home with mom.

 

Please keep in mind that this is all coming from what MM tells me of course. I don't have any interaction with his kids.

 

He has always said that his wife is a great mother. She is dedicated to the kids and was always dedicated to him. She did help him through his illness. When I ask what is wrong between her and the son he says that she is very naggy and controlling and won't ever let up on him, or his son, and that she and the son have always had issues. She and the daughter have always gotten along and still do.

 

I think he is just not compatible with his wife and he avoided the issues while the kids were little and now he is afraid to death of being alone with her while the kids are doing their thing. He hates being around her, he says. When I ask what is so bad he says she's controlling and OCD and stubborn and everything always has to be her way and she can never be wrong. He also says she isn't intelligent and he can't talk to her about things because she doesn't understand.

 

I'm not trying to rip on her, just give his perspective as best I can. This is definitely not a situation of a bad mother or even a bad wife. I've tried to understand why he is so unhappy with her (selfishly, because I wonder if he will just stop being happy with me!) and I think they are just incompatible. He says she used to have a lot of fun and now she can never let loose and relax, she is always cleaning or doing something or nagging. She is no longer able to enjoy sex after menopause. Well I know sex isn't everything, but he and I have sexual drives and desires that match each other and he and she do not. (I'm not saying this, or any of this, is a good reason to cheat, just trying to explain the situation). He says they don't share the same interests and that she is not interested in any of his interests and she doesn't listen to him when he talks. He says he thinks she likes being 'Mrs. MM' a lot better than she likes being his wife, and that there is a difference. He feels resentful of her because she likes their lifestyle and spends a lot of 'his' money. I honestly don't like this attitude because I think she has obviously helped him be able to make all that money and she has supported him. So I don't like when he says that but what I get from it is that she has been happy being his wife and he hasn't been happy being her husband but he just coasted along thinking, I've got a beautiful wife (she is beautiful), a beautiful family, a good business, I'm supposed to be happy, so I'm telling myself I'm happy.

 

You know, from everything he says I think she has been a very good wife and mother and that if anything maybe she should have been a little more affectionate with him and into him more than just the family aspect of things. To me it doesn't look like there's anything unfixable, except maybe his affair, or anything they can't work on, and that's why I start to feel guilty and bad (it would make me feel better if she was some monster or a bad mother). But he says he just doesn't have it for her anymore and he's not happy and it's never going to be able to come back, especially not after his affair and after what he knows he and I have together.

[Capris]

Uhh, yeah, but unlike other OW on this board Maravilla has given no indication whatsoever that the mother is bad. In fact, she has implied the opposite.

 

First of all, my MM's wife is teriffic.

 

Second, this is how i see it in general:

 

Im with the MM, my friends know about the MM, i know about his family only throught my MM. Me and my friends (plus you guys in here) talk about my relationship with the MM based on my expirience with him and the things he has told me.

Where does it say that there isnt another girl in another forum talking about her affair with another man, while being married to my MM?

 

I know its a long shot story, and dont jump on me now, but getting to the opposite side makes you realise the inbetween stages.

 

Bottom line is the classic, it takes two to tango, so no i cant believe the Wife is always a saint just cause she is being cheated on.

 

Note that i still believe that my MM's wife is a pretty cool woman.So my above thoughts are plain logic, not based on my story about a horrible wife or anything.

[mustmoveon]

He says he hasn't told her about me because he's afraid of hurting her.

 

 

He's afraid of hurting her? What about YOU, the woman he claims to want to spend his life with? What about hurting YOU?

[maravilla]

See this is what i was talking bout on my previous post..

 

Hi sunny,

i agree with you on one thing, "take care of YOU!"

This guy has done steps, its not just a guy who promises and promises.

Why is it sooo negative around here when it comes to affairs?

Maybe its because everyone ends up here after a hard time? cause when they are happy no one is willing to write about how happy they are?

 

Well sometimes things work out well.Yes i do have hopes my A will turn out well, but my MM hasnt done any of the things maravilla's MM has done.

 

Maybe the story is always the same blah blah blah, but its not ALWAYS.

We dont even know the man.He might be a prick , he might be a marvelous man that just wants to end HIS WHOLE PREVIOUS LIFE well...

 

Sunny, i know your intensions are good, and i hope im not giving false hopes to people, but i just want to always try to be objective and not get my A aspects into other peoples affair.

 

Maybe someday, i will totally agree with you. Sorry if i was blunt, i just get frustrated in here sometimes and got all my nerves on you :/

 

Take care and again sorry if i was mean

 

I understand what you mean capris. Not all situations are the same and I thought mine was different because he left. Well maybe if I can hang around through all this drama, we will end up together. Or maybe if we take a break he can sort all of this out on his own and we can re-start on the right foot. But in reading other threads where the MM has left home or separated, it seems mine is not very different. He hasn't gone back home or given any indication of this but he's also not taking proactive steps to get divorced and the ones he's taken have been more for my benefit than some well-thought-out plan, so it sometimes feels like a haphazard deck of cards we've both stacked and are holding up, but which could fall at any minute. I guess the common thread in As, whether MM is living at home or separated, is that they are still connected to someone else, and there is no guarantee they will ever really be only ours. I'm just trying to figure out if I can handle the risk.

 

I do agree with you that people tend to paint As all with the same ugly color and sometimes people make it seem like there is no hope when sometimes there is. On the other hand I feel that everyone on my thread is just trying to give their honest opinion to help me, and not just to poo poo my situation because it started off as an affair (and still is an affair). I get what you mean and I appreciate your input.

[BB07]

bb07, I don't know if it makes a difference in terms of what you're saying, but, his wife does know about our affair. She doesn't know he is continuing to see me. I would think she would wonder or assume but he says he doesn't say one way or the other and she doesn't ask. Now in the past he has told me she's asked and he's denied so as not to make the divorce ugly and not to hurt her.

 

I could see her getting really mad once she finds out we've been together this whole time. Or just assumes that if he tells her or she finds out that we're together now. He's trying to avoid this but I don't see how it's possible to avoid it. I don't know whether this would make him scamper back home... he left after she found out about our affair, and she still wants to be with him. I think he is just really afraid of hurting her but that's rather inevitable and he's obviously hurting her slowly instead of all at once!

 

I agree it's not fair to drag me down his road of uncertainty, especially pretending all the while he's certain (which I'm sure he is, when he's talking to me).

 

I apologize that I had forgotten that she did know about the affair.......duh on me. Anyway......I still think him wanting to not tell her the truth (that's it's over) is cowardly of him and I'm also afraid that he is keeping his options open.

 

About hurting her.........he has already done that and I would bet that she rather have the WHOLE truth instead of partial truth now. (Wow I sound like a BS uh.......lol)

 

Anyway.......it's already messy and hurtful to everyone and he is minimizing it with his wife and kids and imo that isn't the right path, it's just the path of least resistance, but what goes around comes back around and usually bites hard when it does.

I think it would make it easier.........on YOU, her and his children and himself if he would come clean and stop playing part time hubby. If he is done........then he is done but he needs to act like it.

[maravilla]

Thanks Maravilla, I see what you mean.

 

Thanks sillygirl for your help.

[BB07]

I wish for you that your MM has similar levels of concern and care for you, as you do him. I hope he rates you as an equally high priority.

 

 

YES..........Marvilla seems to be trying her best to look at all things objectively and I get the feeling that she wishes that she hadn't got herself into a situation like this in hindsight, but now that she is, she is trying to do what is best for everyone. It's dang hard to make yourself a priority when you love someone......we want to give 150%, but it's not always the wise thing to do.

Marvilla...........I think you are going to sort this out and be OK.......I really do.

[maravilla]

M

 

This is going to get complicated. He wants to establish a R with his kids who he admits to not spending much time with even though he lived in the same house with them all their life, but you want to solidify your R with him. These two things conflict, big time.

 

Its not that its insurmountable, but that it will be challenging. You've drawn your line in the sand (good for you, I might add) about not wanting to hang out with his kids as a third wheel all the time. He's told you he needs to re-establish a bond with them besides that of absentee parent. Doable, but tricky.

 

If he's offered you space, take it. Divorce is extremely hard on parents with children AND the children. For him, things will get much more difficult before he starts to breathe again. His children will either run to him since he hasn't been around much, or they will reject his attempts to bond again - because he hasn't been around much. During this time, it will seem like you are on the back burner and that he doesn't have much time for you. It will seem like you are considering his feelings all the time and that yours are neglected.

 

Have a plan. That will help some.

 

Yeah, this is a new complication that I hadn't realized before. He had asked me if I could handle the fact that he has kids, and I honestly told him that while I have no experience in that regard, I love him and hence I will love his kids and I understand that they come first and he needs to spend a lot of time with them and make them his top priority. I meant and still mean all of those things. (And, just to be clear, I don't mean I don't want to hang out with him and his kids as a third wheel. I meant that I don't want to be introduced to his kids or around his kids until he is clear with them that he is getting a divorce and he is done with their mother for good. He has made strange comments about watching a movie or going out to eat with his son and I said, no way, that will just confuse the poor kid more. If his mother doesn't know the marriage is over, and if he doesn't know that you are getting divorced rather than just leaving for awhile which is what they told the kids, then I don't want to be around him. It's not fair to him, and he'll likely hate me from the start, or God forbid we form a bond and then MM decides to go home... it just looks like a walking time-bomb to involve the kids in our relationship before he's divorced. After he's divorced, or after it is very clear to everyone involved that divorce is imminent and he's with me, then, I would love to get to know his kids). But what I didn't understand about the kid issue was that his relationship with his kids hasn't been so great, and so this separation is just complicating things further (some ways good, some ways bad), which makes it very hard for us, as you point out.

 

You are so right when you say "His children will either run to him since he hasn't been around much, or they will reject his attempts to bond again - because he hasn't been around much." It seems to me that his son is taking the first path and his daughter is taking the second path. I don't mind supporting him through this if he is actually in the process of divorcing, but I'm just realizing that he's not going to be okay about getting divorced until he feels more sure about where he stands with his kids.

[maravilla]

He's afraid of hurting her? What about YOU, the woman he claims to want to spend his life with? What about hurting YOU?

 

Good point. I guess I understood it because I thought he owed her more, since they've been married so long and have kids etc. But that leads me back to the issue of having to put myself first since he can't. I guess getting involved with him was just asking to be in a relationship where I can't be put first, at least not for a very long time. But I didn't see that at first, he was (and still is) so into me, as in, head over heels in love, and I had never experienced that level of passion and chemistry. When he said he wanted to be with me I took it at face value, but now I see that he meant it at the time, and he still does, but he has other obligations that make it hard to carry out what he really wants.

[maravilla]

I apologize that I had forgotten that she did know about the affair.......duh on me. Anyway......I still think him wanting to not tell her the truth (that's it's over) is cowardly of him and I'm also afraid that he is keeping his options open.

 

About hurting her.........he has already done that and I would bet that she rather have the WHOLE truth instead of partial truth now. (Wow I sound like a BS uh.......lol)

 

Anyway.......it's already messy and hurtful to everyone and he is minimizing it with his wife and kids and imo that isn't the right path, it's just the path of least resistance, but what goes around comes back around and usually bites hard when it does.

I think it would make it easier.........on YOU, her and his children and himself if he would come clean and stop playing part time hubby. If he is done........then he is done but he needs to act like it.

 

I agree with everything you wrote here and that's what I've been telling him. I just told him today that the more he tells me one thing and his wife the other, the less I know who he really is and how to believe him. He claims that he hasn't told his wife anything, that he doesn't even know what's up with them. But I know that he has denied still being with me to her in the past and that he clearly hasn't told her he wants divorced or that he is with me, so, as you say, he is slowly hurting her. Giving her hope even if not with words.

 

And I don't buy (as I doubt you do either ) that it's only about not wanting to hurt her. I also think it's about keeping the door open and not being totally sure he wants to slam it shut forever.

[maravilla]

YES..........Marvilla seems to be trying her best to look at all things objectively and I get the feeling that she wishes that she hadn't got herself into a situation like this in hindsight, but now that she is, she is trying to do what is best for everyone. It's dang hard to make yourself a priority when you love someone......we want to give 150%, but it's not always the wise thing to do.

Marvilla...........I think you are going to sort this out and be OK.......I really do.

 

Aww thanks bb07. I'm glad someone thinks I can sort this all out, because right now it feels like such a mess! On the one hand I totally regret ever getting involved with him and on the other hand I love him. Thank you for understanding.

[maravilla]

I don't believe every BW is a saint, either, but Maravilla up until this point had given no indication that she was a mother who deserved to not have custody of her children. I just didn't understand why the MM would seek full custody if the mother has been the primary caregiver the whole time, but that has been clarified now.

 

Joint custody makes more sense, but from my understanding joint is NOT automatic. Why do you say he will automatically get joint, Maravilla? He can file for divorce requesting joint, but she can turn around and demand full custody and thus the custody battle ensues. In the end if either party cannot come to an agreement it will be up to a judge to decide (please, someone correct me if I'm wrong).

 

Maravilla, you also have to consider how the kids will accept you, and how much are you ready to be step-mom to children who are not that much younger to you? And while we are on about evil BS it may be in your best interest to continue on the down low, because I imagine the wife will not be singing your praises to the children.

 

Oh, and that crap about the BS spending "his" money. Nice guy.

 

I don't know much about it but it seems from what MM's lawyer said and from my general understanding of family law that joint legal custody is usually preferred. The courts like to see both parents remain parents and a parent cannot lose their legal rights as a parent unless they sign their rights away or do something horrible to have the kids removed into state custody. Physical custody is usually where the legal battle ensues, from my understanding, but again, I'm no expert.

 

I don't know if the kids would accept me, I would guess that the son would and the daughter wouldn't, but I'm not sure. I feel like I could be a step-mom but I know that would also bring a whole host of issues. Still I would do it because it is what being with him calls for.

 

Yeah his comments about her spending his money bug me. It sounds like the wife does like to spend a lot of money but he never seemed to complain about it until now. He said she handles the finances and it's not like he sat her down and said, we need to have a discussion about how much money you're spending. It also doesn't sound like she was spending money they didn't have; they have plenty of money. So to me it sounds rather passive-aggressive, which he accuses her of being. I do know that if we end up together I am going to spend only my own money because he obviously has an issue with it. I mean, she stays home to raise the kids for him and then he resents her spending his money? Ewww.

[2sunny]

soooo, we seem to understand a few things about your MM -

 

he says he doesn't want his W - yet he stays with her.

he says he wants you - but he hasn't yet been divorced.

he says he doesn't want to hurt his kids yet he is willing to introduce them too soon.

he says he wants you - yet he's unwilling to tell his wife that.

i could go on and on...

 

what he SAYS and what he DOES are two totally separate things.

 

WHEN he actually DOES get divorcED (past tense) is when it may be even worth considering another conversation with a man that says one thing and DOES something else.

 

either that - or just make it easier on him = tell his wife everything that he should be telling her.

 

since he INTENDS to divorce her - she may like to know that important tidbit of info he keeps leaving out.

 

he's not trying to protect anyone but himself. that is for sure. take the lies and secrecy out of the equation and see where he goes with it.

 

call her now. then tell him today. tell him you have told her all that he's been hiding from her. then see how much he's willing to be with you. if he loves you like he says he does - he won't mind a woman that speaks her truth.

 

as long as he continues with the cover up (yes, i know she knows of the past - but not really what is happening NOW) there is no real indicator that he's planning to leave.

 

until he shows solid evidence that the D is final - there is no reason to continue putting yourself through the pain he is willing to inflict upon everyone he SAYS he "loves"

 

that is not loving behavior to anyone in his little web that he's weaving.

[maravilla]

soooo, we seem to understand a few things about your MM -

 

he says he doesn't want his W - yet he stays with her.

he says he wants you - but he hasn't yet been divorced.

he says he doesn't want to hurt his kids yet he is willing to introduce them too soon.

he says he wants you - yet he's unwilling to tell his wife that.

i could go on and on...

 

what he SAYS and what he DOES are two totally separate things.

 

WHEN he actually DOES get divorcED (past tense) is when it may be even worth considering another conversation with a man that says one thing and DOES something else.

 

either that - or just make it easier on him = tell his wife everything that he should be telling her.

 

since he INTENDS to divorce her - she may like to know that important tidbit of info he keeps leaving out.

 

he's not trying to protect anyone but himself. that is for sure. take the lies and secrecy out of the equation and see where he goes with it.

 

call her now. then tell him today. tell him you have told her all that he's been hiding from her. then see how much he's willing to be with you. if he loves you like he says he does - he won't mind a woman that speaks her truth.

 

as long as he continues with the cover up (yes, i know she knows of the past - but not really what is happening NOW) there is no real indicator that he's planning to leave.

 

until he shows solid evidence that the D is final - there is no reason to continue putting yourself through the pain he is willing to inflict upon everyone he SAYS he "loves"

 

that is not loving behavior to anyone in his little web that he's weaving.

 

True. I think the most honest and simple thing he's told me is that he's not ready to pull the trigger on the divorce (not his exact words, but, he's not ready to hurt his wife and he has to move at his own pace, blah blah), but that he doesn't want to lose me.

 

I have a feeling he'd like it if I called his wife. As capris said (I think it was) he seems to be the type that wants her to know but doesn't want to be the one to tell her. That's how she found out about our affair - he basically 'let' her find out about it by making it painfully obvious.

[maravilla]

You are right, the courts do want the children to have access to both parents, but the custody makes no difference. The wife can be granted sole custody and the father will have just as much access to the child. The courts do not automatically favor joint custody, but they do favor the children being able to see his kids. I can be wrong, it may be different in your state, but I have never heard of joint custody being "automatic" or favored. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

 

It is very ewww, but people are funny with money, I guess. Still, he needs to understand that as long as they are married what he earns is technically just as much hers as it is his... whether he likes it or not. Is he prepared to possibly pay alimony on top of child support (that is assuming the children stay with the mom)?

 

Also, my boyfriend was 16 years old when he said that he wanted to go live with his dad (this is Michigan). He eventually got his wish, but not before there was a long drawn out court battle.

 

Ok I think the confusion might be that I'm talking about joint legal custody (who gets to make decisions about what the kids are allowed to do) and joint physical custody (who the kids live with).

 

His lawyer said he'll have to pay his wife alimony for seven years. He seems okay with that but who knows. His lawyer said his child support obligations lessen with the amount of time he has custody of the kids. So if they stay half the time with him, he doesn't have to pay that much in child support, but if they stay mostly with the mom, he does. It's my understanding that the courts actually prefer for kids to have a primary residence/ one parent have the majority of physical custody so they're not shuffled back and forth... but then again I think that's usually for younger kids. His are more in a position to adjust and the house he's looking at is blocks away from his kids' school so it would be easier.

 

That's interesting about your boyfriend - I guess a court battle can ensue even if the kids state their wishes.

[maravilla]

Today we looked at the house he's interested in renting, which I heard of through a friend, and he just emailed my friend and said he's interested and asked about the lease terms and which appliances stay. That's some sort of progress, I guess.