Separation - What a nightmare

[Jimmy64]

My wife and I separated 7 weeks ago after me sleeping in the spare room for 2months. It got so bad we were yelling and screaming at each other all the time and then just basically ignored each other. I didn't know how to handle it and she told me she "loved me like a brother". I was devastated and saw no option but to move out. My kids 19 and 21 came with me as they felt my wife was depressed. There are no other partners in the relationship, she says she is angry and hurt and that I suffocate her.

 

We are talking a bit and she has told me she wants some space, but not to close the book yet. I am reading all the books like "When Mars and Venus Collide" and the "Magic of Making Up". It all seems sensible, but I still have terrible days where I can't focus.

 

I want to give my wife time to think, but it is hard. Am I on the right track ? I still love her a lot.

 

Thanks for listening guys

[carhill]

Welcome to LS.

 

My sympathies. TBH, unless she (and you) want to try MC, I'd just go ahead and file for divorce. Right now she's holding you hostage while she makes up her mind. She can make up her mind on your timetable while she decides how to formulate a proper and legal response to the court.

 

If you read LS, most women who 'want space' are either having an affair or exercising a planned-out exit strategy. Sure, your case could be different. Most H's who post here feel that way.

 

Hopefully you'll get the support you need. My D was final a little over ten days ago.

[beachbum84]

For starters I am truly sorry for what you are going through.

 

For what its worth, I am a woman who told my H last year that I needed space, and we separated for a month, did MC for 8 weeks, and a year later we are still back at it again. We fought and still do all the time. From a woman's perspective, I had lost myself in the marriage and family, I felt ignored and passed by in life. I wanted, and now still do want space, so I can decompress and so he can figure out his life. I can't say your W and I mean the same thing b/c we said the same thing. But in my case, if my H would have just sincerely asked what has been so wrong that drove me away from him to the point I wanted space. And then corrected his behaviors that pushed me away, life would have gotten better.

 

Some here are going to say she wants space b/c she can't bring herself to tell you its over. She's making you an option B. But I say, she feels helpless, and at times stuck in life, stuck in her marriage, and whatnot. She's trying to figure out how to carry on, with you. She's probably waiting to see if you are going to swoop in with sincerity and attentiveness to help fix the problem(s). If she wanted to leave for good, trust me, she would have. If I didn't think there was something worth fighting for I would have cut and run.

 

Give her space. But during this time period soul search and try to remember what was different back in the days you weren't fighting all the time. Were you 2 going out more? Were you complimenting her more? Did you write her notes, show more affection? She most likely feels lonely and taken for granted. She probably feels lonely from not being wooed and pursued by you like in the earlier part of your relationship.

 

I don't think most guys realize that the early dating part of relationships are so exciting for us (women) b/c we are being pursued, and that validates us making us feel beautiful, wanted, needed, admired, adored, and thus happy. But somewhere along the road of marriage a lot of us stop being pursued by our husbands. From what I gather, a lot of them figure why chase something you have? Well its a deep emotional need for us to be desired, pursued, needed, and wanted. When our marriage stops fulfilling that need, we start feeling suffocated, lost, and at times like we need out.

 

I don't know if any of this pertains to your situation or not. I hope some of it may be helpful. But I just wouldn't overreact to her wanting space, I'd be more proactive than reactive.

[beachbum84]

oh and please please please don't discuss this with your adult children. My parents divorced 3 years back and they both just vented and ranted and shared way to much info about their divorce with me. It made it really hard on our relationships. And it really made my life screwed up and chaotic for that year it took them to get their divorce finalized. Whether you guys reconcile or not, your kids shouldn't be your or hers confidant through this.

 

Sorry, my soapbox rant is over now. :-)

[Woggle]

I don't know anybody here personally but do some women ever stop to think that whatever angst they are feeling is not the man's fault? Why is it that whenever a woman feels unhappy with life that their first instinct is to blame the man? Life is hard for both genders but it seems that all of that gets dumped on the husband's lap and he doesn't know what the hell hit him. I think that some women have a hard knowing what it feels like to feel you are doing everything but somehow it is still not enough for her. It is very discouraging.

[Jimmy64]

Thanks a lot for your advice. It has been a really tough couple of years for us. Lost a family business we had for 25 years, which lead to us losing our house, car, jobs, holiday house and left with debt.

 

In addition, my wife's uncle and best friend died last year and she was greiving for a full year.

 

Things are much better on the money front, as we both have good jobs, but I found out she douesn't really want to work fulltime and that I "just keep pushing" for more. In the business I did try to work hard to get a better life and it seems I have just pushed her too hard.

 

She told me she just wants an "easy life for a while" and that my constant drive is suffocating her.

 

I love her, but always find she talks in riddles and is never definate about her responses. She says I should just know what she is thinking.

 

So often we will do something - I ask her opinion and check that she is happy with the decision and once it is done she says I pushed her into it. I don't try to upset her, but I seem to have a knack for it.

 

I am trying to give her time and space, but it is difficult.

 

I really do want to try to reunite and she has said that she just needs to collect her thoughts. I do believe this and she has always been a person that thinks a lot before acting.

 

I am 99% positive there is no other man and she has been quite honest in stating this herself. I am not a fool and believe this is true.

[beachbum84]

I don't know anybody here personally but do some women ever stop to think that whatever angst they are feeling is not the man's fault? Why is it that whenever a woman feels unhappy with life that their first instinct is to blame the man? Life is hard for both genders but it seems that all of that gets dumped on the husband's lap and he doesn't know what the hell hit him. I think that some women have a hard knowing what it feels like to feel you are doing everything but somehow it is still not enough for her. It is very discouraging.

 

 

Well if what the woman needs to be happy is to be emotionally connected and feel vauled, and she isn't, then who's "fault" do you suggest that would be? Men on here get angry about women having EAs (and I totally agree with them), but have they ever stopped to think that if there was no lack of emotional connection, then they'd be no desire or need to find it elsewhere? I'm in no way condoing affairs. Just saying. Can't have it both ways. If we are silent and it eats us alive to the point we leave for someone else who is willing to fullfil our needs, then we are terrible. If we bring to light that we are unhappy and would like our H to be the one to fullfill those needs, we are blaming him. At times it feels like a no win situation.

 

In the end both sexes have needs. And there are numerous needs wives and husbands are only allowed to seek fullfillment of said needs from their spouses. But when that does not happen, how is one to cope?

[Woggle]

What exactly does emotional connection mean? I see men bending over backwards to please their wives when she says she is unhappy yet it is never enough. Many times the women are just closed up no matter what the man does. I am not trying to flame you but just trying to give you the man's perspective on this. Sometimes it feels that no matter what we do it is never good enough.

[beachbum84]

Thanks a lot for your advice. It has been a really tough couple of years for us. Lost a family business we had for 25 years, which lead to us losing our house, car, jobs, holiday house and left with debt.

 

In addition, my wife's uncle and best friend died last year and she was greiving for a full year.

 

Things are much better on the money front, as we both have good jobs, but I found out she douesn't really want to work fulltime and that I "just keep pushing" for more. In the business I did try to work hard to get a better life and it seems I have just pushed her too hard.

 

She told me she just wants an "easy life for a while" and that my constant drive is suffocating her.

 

I love her, but always find she talks in riddles and is never definate about her responses. She says I should just know what she is thinking.

 

So often we will do something - I ask her opinion and check that she is happy with the decision and once it is done she says I pushed her into it. I don't try to upset her, but I seem to have a knack for it.

 

I am trying to give her time and space, but it is difficult.

 

I really do want to try to reunite and she has said that she just needs to collect her thoughts. I do believe this and she has always been a person that thinks a lot before acting.

 

I am 99% positive there is no other man and she has been quite honest in stating this herself. I am not a fool and believe this is true.

 

 

Wow that is a lot of terrible things to happen in a short amount of time. May I suggest that you 2 try MC. I think it will help. She probably hasn't processed all those life changes, and is just still upset, scared, lost, and unsure of how to deal with all of that. That is a lot to hit you both.

 

I know that the riddle thing is most likely frustrating. But as a woman who says similar things. After being with someone daily, you just start to assume that they pick up on things. Not that they can read your mind. But that they pick up on details, even if they seem insignificant at times. To us it shows that they listen and that we matter. But most men don't store that kind of information for the long term b/c its not as important to them.

 

Sounds like you guys are just tackling a lot of differences between how men and women operate. I again think MC could be benefitial. It may give you and her some areas to work on specifically to benefit the other. What may seem trivial to you, may mean the world to her. With me its the little things that show me he cares. Anyone can buy me an expensive gift and get a wow factor from me. But that doesn't prove their love for me, that doesn't prove they care about me or understand me. But someone who can take me to my favorite restaurant, and order start to finish my entire meal just the way I like it w/o asking me. That shows that they care and are paying attention to my likes and dislikes.

[beachbum84]

What exactly does emotional connection mean? I see men bending over backwards to please their wives when she says she is unhappy yet it is never enough. Many times the women are just closed up no matter what the man does. I am not trying to flame you but just trying to give you the man's perspective on this. Sometimes it feels that no matter what we do it is never good enough.

 

I can't speak for all women here. But for me, emotional connection means...

 

Being treasured. Much like he treasures his x-box. He can't wait to play that damn thing. What about making me feel that way? If I came out to my car with a rose and letter on my windshield from my H, I'd feel completely special. Which would make me want to do something special for him. I see a lot of men bending over backwards too. But have they ever stopped to see what their spouse is asking for? B/c if I'm hungry for kiwi and all I get thrown at me is squash I'm still feeling unsatisfied.

 

More on this emotional connection. If when in public he would reach for my hand, or sit next to me in a booth at a restaurant instead of across from me. If I got out of the blue surprises to just let me know he's thinking of me (doesn't have to be expensive).

 

A lot of men want women, but don't know exactly how to take care of them, and instead of asking how they'd like to be taken care of and providing that. They often take care of them the way they themselves would like to be taken care of. In that case, why don't they marry men? Just kidding on that one. But I think you get my point. :-)

[carhill]

Wogs, our MC described it (emotional connection) as empathy and caring and sharing of feelings, and, in our case, reversed, since I was having an EA because my exW showed me little to no empathy or caring or sharing of feelings. You'd have to watch me with women and I've had enough EA's as a OM to be pretty sure of how it works. It's not acts of service; it's not 'bending over backwards'. It's being open emotionally; able to feel and empathize and listen and accept and support.

 

BTW, most of the MW's have been cake eaters, so no panacea, hence my advice to the OP. Being a receptacle hardens one's psyche. Hopefully his path will be different and fruitful for him.

 

OP, reading your last post, your wife sounded a lot like my exW prior to my EA. I finally had my fill, disconnected and found someone else to emotionally connect with. Wrong choice, but there it is.

[Woggle]

Men like to be treasured as well but we rarely get that from our wives and if we do ask for it we are accused of wanting stepford wives. I know this sounds but can you honestly say that if your husband did these things you wanted that you woudn't still resent him or have a too little too late attitude? Can you honestly say it would turn things around?

[Jimmy64]

Thanks for your info and advice guys. I have been feeling really down and this really does let me get it out a bit.

 

I have asked my wife to go to MC with me, but she says I'm the one with the problems - when I sort myself out then maybe she will.

 

I think that we would both benefit, but will really need to take it easy on this so she comes of her own free will. I know it would help her, not just with her issues from me, but with the detahs and other issues as well.

 

One of my isseus is that I rush at everything at breakneck speed. She has told me she wants to keep talking, but to slow down my approach a bit. It is one thing I really need to work on in my own life.

[Jimmy64]

I think you are right to a certain extent Woggle. Men today really don't know where to turn.

 

I must admit I find it really difficult to understand exactly how a man should be in today's society.

 

I try to balance my masculine/feminine side, but seem to screw it up all the time.

[Woggle]

Just be you and let things fall where they may. If worst comes to worst divorce will not kill you.

[carhill]

I have asked my wife to go to MC with me, but she says I'm the one with the problems - when I sort myself out then maybe she will.

 

Great time to practice acceptance. Make a MC appointment and go by yourself. No rancor, no fanfare, just do it. After you leave the MC, go to a lawyer's office for a consult on divorce proceedings. *Do* things. Take charge. Don't sit around waiting for your wife's stilettos to pierce your balls.

 

If she questions what's going on, simply repeat what she told you and that you're 'sorting myself out'. That can be done without her, for sure

[Jimmy64]

Yeah - I know you are right, but I am an old fashioned guy and after 25 years of marraige, want to give it my best shot.

 

I think broken families always suffer and if I end up wlaking away I will do so with my head held high knowing I tried and didn't just think it was all too hard.

[beachbum84]

Men like to be treasured as well but we rarely get that from our wives and if we do ask for it we are accused of wanting stepford wives. I know this sounds but can you honestly say that if your husband did these things you wanted that you woudn't still resent him or have a too little too late attitude? Can you honestly say it would turn things around?

 

To answer your question, I would be happy, and in time I would shed my resentment. It didn't build up over night, so it won't go away with one good day either. But if things truly changed, so would my perspective. And if I felt it was a little to little to late, then I would not have stayed this long.

 

I get that men have the need to be treasured too. But just the same as I explained earlier, lets reverse it. If women don't know or don't care to know what her husband's needs are, then she is breeding resentment and helping build up walls of steel. It does go both ways.

 

For me, my husband doesn't ever open up to me as to what is true needs are. I assume he wants me to make him feel like the Man in my life, that he matters most to me above all others (especially my dad), that he wants to be sexually desired and satisified, and he wants good food. As to what his emotional needs are exactly I'm in the dark. Whenever I ask, I get, "I'm a man, I don't have feelings". So its kinda hard to meet needs you don't know exist.

 

 

I know for me there are plenty of needs I have, as do many people. Some I can take care of, some I can get other people to take care of, and then there are some that would be inappropriate to have anyone other than my H to take care of. Its those needs that go unmet that breed resentment. IMO of course.

[carhill]

Yeah - I know you are right, but I am an old fashioned guy and after 25 years of marraige, want to give it my best shot.

 

Absolutely you should give it your very best shot, and so should she. You can't control in any way shape or form what she thinks, how she feels, what she says or what she does or does not do. *Accept that*

 

Conversely, she has no control over you. You do what you want. You feel how you want. You say what you want. Embrace the power you have over you.

 

Here's two questions, one you can ask your wife and one to ask yourself:

 

1. For her - Do you respect me?

 

2. For you - What's my biggest fear?

 

There, that's tomorrow's work. Starting the clarity process, which begins with *listening*. One positive step each day. No need to slay Rome in a day. Take your time

[The-Zen-Warrior]

I have asked my wife to go to MC with me, but she says I'm the one with the problems - when I sort myself out then maybe she will.

 

Wow, that statement right there, that right now she's unwilling to seek out and accept marriage counseling, because she seems to think that you have all the problems, that for me my friend would be a deal breaker!

 

And then she puts a spin on it, that only after you seek out and accept counseling, as to work on you, then she might be more opt to get and receive the help that your marriage needs. Wow, this woman is a real piece of work!

 

Don't you think that common sense would dictate that she also requires help, for her problems. After all she is feeling angry, confused, needs time to think, the uncle and friend dieing all the while she feels suffocated, don't those sound like problems, they do to me!

 

I wish you luck, all my hopes and please keep posting here on L.S., we are listening!

[Jimmy64]

This is really good advice guys. I like the 2 questions. I will find out about those.

 

I also really do wonder what is holding my wife back from confronting these issues. Regardless what happens between us, she will carry them forward unless she deals with them.

 

I hope I'm not coming over as a wimp, because I like to think of myself as a strong man. It is just that when you feel your emotions have been shattered, it is difficult to adjust.

 

I rarely talk about this sort of stuff, but had to do something. This seemed like a really good way to talk to people and it is great you guys actually take the time to respond.

[carhill]

I rarely talk about this sort of stuff, but had to do something.

 

To effectively recover and rebuild your M, you will not only have to become comfortable talking about 'this sort of stuff', you'll have to be brave enough to act on your talk, even in the face of adversity and anger and your own fear. Get comfortable with fear. It's coming; that is, if you have a good MC.

[Jimmy64]

Hey Cahill

 

What do you mean? The type of questions and probing they do? I start next week, so I am hoping to really get some positive results for myself from it. Understand myself a lot better.

[carhill]

IME, a good psyche starts at the beginning, with probing questions about socialization, role modeling, family dynamics and prior relationships. We all think we have everything handled; packaged neatly and properly for consumption. Ha, ha...

 

Then the marriage questions start, obviously one-sided since your wife isn't there. A lot of 'why?' and a lot of 'how do you feel about that?'

 

Our psych never took notes and remembered *everything* even after a year of work. Purely photographic memory. In fact I asked him if he recorded sessions.

 

A good MC will push for your spouse to join you. S/he may refer you out for IC since a MC's focus tends to be couple-centric. IMO, if you want to recover your M, the goal is to get your wife in there.

 

Task the MC where you want to direct the work. We did that often, tabling prior session work for an issue which came to light in the interim. The process is flexible. Be proactive. Engage.

 

Be open to change. If it's effective, you will begin to see things in completely new ways and be able to change behaviors you thought immutable. It's all up to you.

[Jimmy64]

Hey thanks - it sounds like a really positive experience and very enlightening.

 

I haven't really gone through a process like this, so it is probably the best thing I can do as a person.

 

Sometimes a new persective really does open your eyes.