Am I doing the right thing?

[Rap17]

Anyone?

[newrule]

Hi Rap,

 

I've been reading this thread for a while now. I'm not the best person to give advice or anything so I've never commented. But since you said 'anyone?' . Here's how I see it:

 

You've come so far with this NC thing. You're able to focus on yourself now. Don't break that yet, it's probably a good idea to wait for a little longer because, you MIGHT get over her soon. From the consistency of you missing her I'm not seeing that happening soon though, cause you never intended to let her go in the first place and you've had no closure. But I think that taking a big move to get together again might jeopardize the stability you've been able to found thanks to the NC. You were happy not to bump into her at the party, I think that shows the benefit of NC to your mental well-being.

 

Having said that, let me tell you another side of what I think.

 

From your stories, I don't disagree with someone's suggestion that she has BPD. I don't because she shows the symptoms, and I am also a sufferer of this disorder. I've sabotaged a lot of my relationships, both with boyfriends and with friends. I'm new to this forum so I'm not scared someone would judge me lol. Yeah we're scary, and demanding and can be downright cruel, but we also can't go through the disorder alone and need supportive people around us who try to understand. With me, usually when someone tries hard enough to show s/he still wants to be my friend, the pain of betrayal (or perceived betrayal) usually just vanish. If I was her and I still loved my ex-boyfriend, I would take the NC as you completely not caring/still blaming me for past mistake. But she might be different. I of course can't speak on her behalf. You seem like a really nice guy though and I really think she needs someone like you by her side. But of course this is a selfish side of me speaking because I know how BPD feels like.

 

Well anyway, I think you should keep focusing on yourself for now. If you're going to make a move, do it when you're not feeling any pain of missing her. Do it when you're really clear headed. Take care buddy.

[Rap17]

Hi Rap,

 

I've been reading this thread for a while now. I'm not the best person to give advice or anything so I've never commented. But since you said 'anyone?' . Here's how I see it:

 

You've come so far with this NC thing. You're able to focus on yourself now. Don't break that yet, it's probably a good idea to wait for a little longer because, you MIGHT get over her soon. From the consistency of you missing her I'm not seeing that happening soon though, cause you never intended to let her go in the first place and you've had no closure. But I think that taking a big move to get together again might jeopardize the stability you've been able to found thanks to the NC. You were happy not to bump into her at the party, I think that shows the benefit of NC to your mental well-being.

 

Having said that, let me tell you another side of what I think.

 

From your stories, I don't disagree with someone's suggestion that she has BPD. I don't because she shows the symptoms, and I am also a sufferer of this disorder. I've sabotaged a lot of my relationships, both with boyfriends and with friends. I'm new to this forum so I'm not scared someone would judge me lol. Yeah we're scary, and demanding and can be downright cruel, but we also can't go through the disorder alone and need supportive people around us who try to understand. With me, usually when someone tries hard enough to show s/he still wants to be my friend, the pain of betrayal (or perceived betrayal) usually just vanish. If I was her and I still loved my ex-boyfriend, I would take the NC as you completely not caring/still blaming me for past mistake. But she might be different. I of course can't speak on her behalf. You seem like a really nice guy though and I really think she needs someone like you by her side. But of course this is a selfish side of me speaking because I know how BPD feels like.

 

Well anyway, I think you should keep focusing on yourself for now. If you're going to make a move, do it when you're not feeling any pain of missing her. Do it when you're really clear headed. Take care buddy.

 

 

Thank you so much for that thoughtful reply.

 

You pretty much spoke what I´ve been feeling in my heart for a while now. The part in bold, thats exactly what I sense is going on. I dont know if she loves me anymore, thats not really the point, and honestly I´ve pretty much accepted that she doesnt, or at least thats shes not in love with me anymore. I do believe she still cares though, but I also believe that she resents me a lot for having avoided her at Uni, and in other situations. What I get from all of this is that she resents me for being the "victim" when she sees herself as one, although shes trying desperatly not to be. Also, me missing her. Well, I guess it isnt exactly that I miss her, more that I have a special place in my heart for her. Its hard to explain. I dont need to see her, the urge is not the same. But I do care and love her. Best way I can explain it really.

 

So, an update for you people. I went to Uni yesterday and she was there, and we attended class together. I was seated far away from her so we didnt have contact, but when the class was over I got up, went past her and said "hi" while giving her a smile. She returned the gesture and smiled back, and I went out the door.

 

When I got home, I thought about it for a few hours, then I texted her. It was upbeat and she asked why I was writing her. I told her that after having seen her today, I thought about her a bit and suggested that we meet up for that cup of coffee weve been talking about once in a while. She said that would be a good idea, also because she still has a suitcase of mine that she wanted to return. I joked around a bit, then said that I wanted her to tell her some stuff, and I put out a positive and light vibe.

 

This intruiged her from what I could tell. I dont know if curiosity got the better of her, but the next thing she did was to suggest that she could come by last night, and we could talk. She will be busy for the rest of the week with work and field studies, so otherwise she´d have to find a time next week. I told her that I had plans already, but that she should let me know when there would be room in her schedule next week, then we could see if our schedules matched up.

 

She agreed, said that she would get a new work schedule today, and then she would let me know. I said that was fine, then told her I needed to go, and then threw in a comment about how her new hair looks sexy on her

She didnt comment on this, but from what she wrote in between I could tell that my positive and happy mood surprised her.

 

A lot of you will probably think, why on earth did I break NC this way? Well, its quite simple really. First of all, if I hear from her and we end up meeting up next week, I will go into this with no expectations at all. She has already made clear to me she doesnt want to be in a relationship and I´ve acepted that. I have no illusions that this meetup will make her come back to me, not in the slightest.

 

But I need to do this for myself, and I believe she wants to hear what I have to say as well. Im going to make this meetup light and fun, and try and make her feel comfortable about the situation. Then, after a while, Im going to tell her what I want her to know. Im going to tell her that Im in a much better place, that I see things much more clearly, and then Im going to appologize for the things I did that made her unhappy in the latter part of our relationship. I will let her know that this is not an attempt at reconciliation, but to let her know that I now understand what its been like for her, and that I understand and accept her decision to do whats right for her. That I have been selfish in not giving her the break she needed when she asked for it, that I have forgiven her and myself for what has happened, and that I just want her to be happy in her life, and wish her all the best. Im gonna validate her, what I didnt have the insight to do before.

 

Then Im thinking about letting her know that I still do have some feelings for her, but that Ive now come a long way, and in order to heal fully Ill have to leave her alone for now, and that she should leave me alone too, so I can move on. (Well, shes been doing that anyway, but you never know). That Im going to defriend her on facebook, (at least for now), for my own healings sake, and that I want her to do it with me, so she wont misinterpret my reasons for doing so.

 

Basically, Ill just be myself and be honest. Its like I woke up from a coma. I harbor no ill will, and no resentment anymore. I just want to let go, for myself and put the negativity thats between us to rest. Its quite obvious she still has little respect for me, perhaps even angry with me. If she doesnt change her view of me after this, its her problem. I cant control her feelings. But I do want to find peace for myself, and I believe this is the best way I can do that.

 

Reason Im not sure Im going to tell her Im going NC yet, is because Im not sure its the best course of action to tell her. Perhaps its just better to do it silently, Ill have to think on that some more. As Newrule suggested, it could bring her to resent me even more, and thats not what I want. Btw, if I dont hear from her Im not going to do a thing. If its a late reply from her, say days or a week, Im not going to respond.

 

Thanks for reading all, and as always, any advice is most welcome.

[Rap17]

Update.

 

So, she said she would contact me tuesday but didnt. I didnt want to push her any further, so I decided to just be NC and see if any reaction would come from her side.

 

Logged in to FB tonight and posted an update. An hour later she came online, gave me a thumbs up and stayed in the chat. She posted an update that she was feeling ill, with a cold and a fever. So, after waiting 10-15 mins I decided to write her. "I have the cure. Nescafé Gold and Chokolate cake :)"

 

She responded and seemed very enthusiastic about the offer, and we had a very pleasant conversation. She immediatly started talking about the meetup next week, telling me how her schedule was and if I was available certain nights. I told her that Id get back to her regarding when I was available myself, then we proceeded to talk a little bit about our field studies, just for a few minutes. I cut the convo short, told her I had to go since I had to get up early. I kept everything nonchalant and upbeat, I gotta admit it really works.

 

I know, it doesnt mean anything regarding reconciliation, but Im fine with that. Like the above poster said, this is a girl who feels blame because I have ignored her. I know, its not my responsibility, but in order to say what I want to say to her, I had to reach out. Otherwise she would go silent on me and be afraid to contact me again, trust me shes like this. I might be played, I might not, but truth of the matter is that I dont care.

 

Im not gonna be friendszoned though. If our schedules doesnt collide next week Ill tell how I feel about everything with my new found clarity. Im going to validate her and then tell her that I want to be there for her, but that its not possible at this time because of my lingering feelings for her. Then its NC time for a month or two, unless something unexpected happens, (Not counting on it, no expectations).

 

Im finally my old self again. Away with the needy guy and bring on the strong, confident man. I believe I can do this without showing much weakness or breaking down. Its true what I read on this forum. We cant get closure from our ex, we bring closure to ourselves.

 

Reality is, she let a great guy go, the one guy who would never leave her. Right now, I feel like the winner.

 

 

Wish me luck.

Edited February 3, 2011 by Rap17

[newrule]

First of all, I have no doubt that you're a great guy. You're amazing. She's lucky to have you, even though she probably doesn't know that.

 

You seem to speak of the situation with an air of confidence, so there's really no advice I can offer. I hope you're doing the right thing. You've gone this far and have found stability in your life. I hope she won't ruin that for you.

 

If you do ever reconcile, I need you to know that things can go wrong very fast as long as she doesn't get help. I know you think you're ready to give her validation, but it's not that easy. My boyfriend tries so hard to validate me, but we (BPD sufferers) are a pain in the ass and we always need more attention, more validation than a normal person can give. Some days you will find it supremely hard to make her happy, and that could really tire and drain a person. But take my words with a pinch of salt. I'm speaking based on my own experience only.

 

Good luck Rap!

[Downtown]

Reality is, she let a great guy go, the one guy who would never leave her.

No, the reality is that the "great guy" inevitably will hurt her while she stays with him (due to her strong fear of engulfment) and also when she leaves him (due to her fear of being alone). Hence, your simple notion of her having made a mistake by walking away from a dependable, reliable "great guy" indicates that you are losing sight of the dilemma facing a BPDer: she loses either way.

 

If she has strong BPD traits -- as you started suspecting back in mid-November -- she will be unhappy and miserable being with you (from the painful engulfment) or without you (from the painful loneliness). As NewRule observes, the relationship cannot succeed unless she seeks treatment and stays with it -- and that likely means five years at a minimum. Unless she desperately wants to change herself and does so, all the validation in the world will not make a dent in her abusive behavior and tantrums. An exception would be her having only mild BPD traits to begin with. But, so far, you have not been describing mild traits.

[Rap17]

No, the reality is that the "great guy" inevitably will hurt her while she stays with him (due to her strong fear of engulfment) and also when she leaves him (due to her fear of being alone). Hence, your simple notion of her having made a mistake by walking away from a dependable, reliable "great guy" indicates that you are losing sight of the dilemma facing a BPDer: she loses either way.

 

If she has strong BPD traits -- as you started suspecting back in mid-November -- she will be unhappy and miserable being with you (from the painful engulfment) or without you (from the painful loneliness). As NewRule observes, the relationship cannot succeed unless she seeks treatment and stays with it -- and that likely means five years at a minimum. Unless she desperately wants to change herself and does so, all the validation in the world will not make a dent in her abusive behavior and tantrums. An exception would be her having only mild BPD traits to begin with. But, so far, you have not been describing mild traits.

 

Im with you man, I understand all of this. Ironically, the work now doing in the field, which is part of my education, is working with adults with mental issues. Theres a couple of borderliners there, and compared to my ex theres a world of difference. Basically, theyre full blown BPD´ers.

 

So, Im still doubting wheter she has it or if shes just a confused young woman. But yeah, she does have issues no doubt, and traits of mild BPD, but I think thats it.

 

And Im not seeking reconciliation relationship wise. I have accepted that it cannot happen at present time. She can only fix herself, same with me. Im doing pretty well these days, just doing stuff for myself and with my friends, while working in the daytime. I have my goals set on myself and I feel pretty confident.

 

But I do want to have this talk with her and meet up, and thats for me entirely. Perhaps its words she would like to hear, and that would be fine too. I want to stop burning the bridges and just create a somewhat normal atmosphere between us, so she doesnt have to feel uncomfortable around me and visa versa. It does seem like shes feeling heavy guilt and blaming me for avoiding her or something. Knowing her, I think the only possible solution is to actually reach out as a friend. She didnt feel validated, (she was but its from her prespective remember), so Im going to validate her.

 

Its a peace offering, nothing more. Im going to make it as comfortable and friendly as possible, no questions, no blaming, no drama. Its a cup of coffee, small talk and then Im going to tell her what I want to say. Thats it. Happy face and smiles all around. Ill just be myself.

 

If she still has some issues with me after that then its her problem. And at least I can say afterwards that I didnt burn my bridges and did all I could. Its an odd thing though, having reached this stage. She made some poor decisions, took me for granted as well, didnt communicate to me well enough. But Im not angry, bitter or resentful anymore. I just care, so sue me But most importantly, I care for myself again. Been a while

 

Not looking good at the moment though. She mentioned tuesday or wednesday night as possibilities for her this coming week, and I told her Id get back to her. I have band practice tuesday and have to work late wednesday, so seems it might not work out next week, unless she comes up with a different proposal. Im not going to cancel stuff to see her, Im living my life and doing my own thing now. So, will have to see what happens.

[Holly1986]

Wow, I have read your entire story over the past few hours. It is really touching. I feel your pain so much. I am going through a break up at the moment and I can understand everything you are going through. Like you, my mood changes daily. One day I am happy, excited, the next I want to hide in a hole! I notice you still really want to get back together with her. I feel the same with my ex. I know that if my ex and I did sort out our problems there would probably be a huge strain in our relationship. You have gone through so much heartache. Your heart is literally broken and maybe you feel getting back together will fix it. Will it? Will you just forget what she put you through? I think about this a lot.

 

I guess it can be a little like raising the dead. How do you know that everything will be the same again? Has your love actually died and you are trying to bring it back to life. It seems artificial at times. Well this is my opinion and how I feel. I love my ex with all my heart and would do anything to have him back in my life. But I wonder if I did get him back, would I be happy? Or would there be someone else out there for me that I passed on because I am so consumed with winning back my ex.

 

Anyway, I hope your meeting went well. I look forward to hearing how it went. Your story is so touching and when I read it I go through all the same emotions again that I felt. I even cried at one stage as it was so touching!! Good luck

[Rap17]

Wow, I have read your entire story over the past few hours. It is really touching. I feel your pain so much. I am going through a break up at the moment and I can understand everything you are going through. Like you, my mood changes daily. One day I am happy, excited, the next I want to hide in a hole! I notice you still really want to get back together with her. I feel the same with my ex. I know that if my ex and I did sort out our problems there would probably be a huge strain in our relationship. You have gone through so much heartache. Your heart is literally broken and maybe you feel getting back together will fix it. Will it? Will you just forget what she put you through? I think about this a lot.

 

I guess it can be a little like raising the dead. How do you know that everything will be the same again? Has your love actually died and you are trying to bring it back to life. It seems artificial at times. Well this is my opinion and how I feel. I love my ex with all my heart and would do anything to have him back in my life. But I wonder if I did get him back, would I be happy? Or would there be someone else out there for me that I passed on because I am so consumed with winning back my ex.

 

Anyway, I hope your meeting went well. I look forward to hearing how it went. Your story is so touching and when I read it I go through all the same emotions again that I felt. I even cried at one stage as it was so touching!! Good luck

 

Thank you from the bottom of my heart, you are truly a wonderful person for saying those words, and having the patience to read through my story, which is turning into a novel

 

I truly do believe that if I could get her back we could fix things between us, cause I have realised that Im as much to blame for the breakup as she is. I logged onto msn and read through our past chats together. It was like I was a completely different person. Funny, witty, confident and lovable. I lost all of those qualities, the very qualities that attracted her to me in the first place. I have forgiven her for her mistakes. Shes a young woman and inexperienced in life. She does have problems yes, but I do believe they can be worked through. Basically shes very insecure, and I couldnt give her what she needed anymore, because I was stressed. She made the wrong choice, acting on impulse and in desperation, and in her search for validation she made out with another guy. No excuses for her behaviour really, but I do know that she deeply regretted it. She was heartbroken over it.

 

Weve settled on meeting up wednesday next week, thats in 8 days. Had a quick chat over the phone and she didnt seem annoyed with me or anything. I hung up after 5 mins, but she was already telling me about how the work in the field was going well and that her councellor was impressed with her. Still the same insecure girl, easy to tell when the first thing she says to me is how others like her work.

 

But again, I have no expectations, she could even be seeing someone else that I dont know about. I was determined to make it on my terms so I asked about thursday, but she said she was busy. Didnt say what she was doing, could mean anything really, but the fact she doesnt tell me could mean somethings up. But hey, Ive been doing pretty much the same thing.

 

Yeah, I truly do love her. I dont need her to survive or live my life, I just want her. Im positive reconciliation will never have a chance at this time, I think shes happy about her new found freedom, even though shes hurting on the inside still. Besides, a reconciliation would only be possible if she still has feelings for me, and if shes still the same girl. I dont know, tonight was the first time we spoke on the phone for 1½ months, and we havent spoken face to face in over 2 months.

 

But Im going to go through with what I have planned, and possibly show her Im back to my old self again, and that I understand her decision to break up with me from her point of view, and hell, I really do. Most of all, I just want to spend some time with her again, talking like adults, not being awkward in eachothers company, if that is even possible. Will just be nonchalant and be fun, but caring at the same time. Basically just be myself. Then, depending on how it goes, Ill probably break all contact until we meet up at uni again, which will be late march.

 

Theres also a posibility that she will tell me shes seeing someone else now, and thats what I dread the most, but honestly I just want her to be happy. If however, she has hooked up with the "other" guy, then Im going to show her the door and tell her to leave.

 

I hope I can keep my cool, I was a bit stressed after having talked with her on the phone, hearing her voice. That small sharp pain the stomach returned for a little while. Its a pretty numb pain now, but it can still surface from time to time.

[Rap17]

No, the reality is that the "great guy" inevitably will hurt her while she stays with him (due to her strong fear of engulfment) and also when she leaves him (due to her fear of being alone). Hence, your simple notion of her having made a mistake by walking away from a dependable, reliable "great guy" indicates that you are losing sight of the dilemma facing a BPDer: she loses either way.

 

If she has strong BPD traits -- as you started suspecting back in mid-November -- she will be unhappy and miserable being with you (from the painful engulfment) or without you (from the painful loneliness). As NewRule observes, the relationship cannot succeed unless she seeks treatment and stays with it -- and that likely means five years at a minimum. Unless she desperately wants to change herself and does so, all the validation in the world will not make a dent in her abusive behavior and tantrums. An exception would be her having only mild BPD traits to begin with. But, so far, you have not been describing mild traits.

 

Downtown, I appreciate your post, its very accurate.

 

Just one problem though. In my field studies Im now working as a social worker with borderline patients. Their symptoms are quite easy to spot. Today, only four days after I started at work, I was idealized by a patient, and she immediatly startet hugging me when I was about to leave, and telling the other workers how she adores me and so forth. Ofc, these patiens also have symptoms of other illnesses, but still, its really really hard to compare my ex to these people. Its like my ex´s symptoms are almost invisible compared to these, thats why Im having doubts if she just a confused and immature girl, and not a mild BPD.

 

Honestly, when thinking back. I started to change in the relationship after the first year. I became increasingly distant and I didnt even realise it at first. I think the only way is for me to show her that Im returning to form, and even then I might not have a chance to reconcile at all. I still have a ways to go yet, but the things Ill tell her at the meetup, if shes hasnt got BPD, then at least theres a chance that she will accept my appology for my part of the breakup, and realise that Im not the pathetic, needy guy I turned into. I realise that I will take away a lot of the guilt shes been feeling towards me, but I think thats important if were ever gonna have normal relations again. I do think I can come to trust her again, because I really do feel like she wanted to make the relationship to work as much as I did, before things went downhill. I could not forgive a woman at my own age for doing what she did, but I am capable of forgiving a 22 year old woman. Once.

 

If she truly has mild BPD, then I dont want her anymore in the first place. No matter how much I love her. Trust me on that. This would be a woman I could probably never trust again, at least for many years.

[Holly1986]

I'm not sure if this is any help. But I am a 24 year old girl, 2 years older than your ex. I also had a really tough childhood and issues with my parents much like your ex. I have had a few boyfriends but only one really serious boyfriend. We broke up and I was devastated-I still am. But I know I have a long way to go before I can find myself. I know that even if he wants me back that I need to sort out my own head as it just didn't feel right with him towards the end. I also wanted my ''old'' boyfriend back as I felt he changed much like what your ex said. Its strange she would say that as that is how I felt too. If I look back at emails or letters I saw a difference in how he spoke to me and it broke my heart. Maybe this did play a part in her decision to leave.

 

So, this leads me to think maybe your ex just wants some time to be single and do things that other 22 year olds do. She really is so young and inexperienced in life. I believe she really did love you, and perhaps she still does but she is so young to know what she wants. I mean, at 22 marriage and kids are maybe the last things on her mind. Maybe she has to go out there in the big world, met more guys, have her heart broken again and really mend it alone and THEN if you really are the one it will work out.

 

It sounds like she really needs time alone and to be single or in a very casual relationship. I can see where she is coming from. She is pretty young and has a lot to learn. She needs to do it alone or she will never be able to last in a relationship. She seemed too dependent on you for confidence. However, confidence should come from within. She needs to find it alone. Otherwise, no relationship can ever last for her.

[Rap17]

I'm not sure if this is any help. But I am a 24 year old girl, 2 years older than your ex. I also had a really tough childhood and issues with my parents much like your ex. I have had a few boyfriends but only one really serious boyfriend. We broke up and I was devastated-I still am. But I know I have a long way to go before I can find myself. I know that even if he wants me back that I need to sort out my own head as it just didn't feel right with him towards the end. I also wanted my ''old'' boyfriend back as I felt he changed much like what your ex said. Its strange she would say that as that is how I felt too. If I look back at emails or letters I saw a difference in how he spoke to me and it broke my heart. Maybe this did play a part in her decision to leave.

 

So, this leads me to think maybe your ex just wants some time to be single and do things that other 22 year olds do. She really is so young and inexperienced in life. I believe she really did love you, and perhaps she still does but she is so young to know what she wants. I mean, at 22 marriage and kids are maybe the last things on her mind. Maybe she has to go out there in the big world, met more guys, have her heart broken again and really mend it alone and THEN if you really are the one it will work out.

 

It sounds like she really needs time alone and to be single or in a very casual relationship. I can see where she is coming from. She is pretty young and has a lot to learn. She needs to do it alone or she will never be able to last in a relationship. She seemed too dependent on you for confidence. However, confidence should come from within. She needs to find it alone. Otherwise, no relationship can ever last for her.

 

Thanks for that wonderful post Holly, what you are refering to is the conclusion I have come to myself. Regarding my ex and family, she told me after the breakup how she really wanted to have a child, that she became all eager and caring when shes around children. Perhaps shes not ready for this kind of thing, but I do believe that her biggest wish is to have children some day. I also believe she would make a wonderful mother, shes truly wonderful around children. Guess thats why she works with children as part of her studies. And totally agree on the confidence thing. See, how can I resent someone who feels this way? Ive healed a lot now, but still some road ahead. I dont dare to look at my older posts in this thread, Im positive I wont be able to recognize myself.

 

Btw, she was the one to bring up having children and future stuff at first. I think because she has a family thats a bit disfunctional, that she wants to make up for it in a way. I was always the one to say "lets see what happens" etc. until our relationship got solidified and I was truly in love with her. But I never pushed for it, always gave her space and let her do stuff she wanted to do on her own. Little did I know that she had a burning desire to do a lot of that stuff together with me, probably one regret I have left after the dust has settled, that I didnt see this. Im the guy she fell in love with, thats truly who I am, thats the guy I can feel inside again. I got weak and I have also realised where the stress stemmed from. I was in a band, making a record, expensive stuff with a lot of responsibility. That was on top of my studies, exams, jobs etc. Well, I could never live upto those expectations in that band, partly because I never really loved it, partly because I didnt have the skills needed for that particular genre, at least at such a professional level. One of my bandmates, a very serious guy, started taking potshots at me and it went on for a full year. Im never one to give up, so bit the bullet and it made my self esteem take a hit. Was playing concerts with them and I knew people with great expertise in this kind of music could tell I wasnt "right" for the gigs, even though I am skilled at what I do.

 

I never really talked about it, not to my ex either. I basically ignored what my gut was telling me in the name of living up to those expectations and it drove me half way into depression. Sadly, I quit that band in september. It took up a lot of my spare time, and I couldnt handle the stress anymore. I did it for myself and for the relationship, because I knew things would get better once this band thing was over with, I just needed some time to get well. Then exams struck, I chose not to be in her group due to my stress, and it ended up being the final straw.

 

Ironically, when the album got made, each of us did a "thank you" list in the album cover, to our friends, families and loved ones. I waited to thank her last and my message said "And last but not least, xxxx for your love, your kindness, and for always believing in me"

 

I showed her the cover when the album was done, but didnt tell her about what I wrote. When she read it she was so happy, so in love with me, and she told me that was the most romantic thing I had ever done for her then practically assaulted me with kisses. I will always remember that time. That day, the feelings I had in that moment with her, those are the same feelings I have in my heart for her now. Sadly she lost faith in me, and she did with good reason. She stopped believing in me.

 

Btw, I find it hard to express how deeply I feel for someone with words alone, even though Im told Im very well spoken nad articulate, (in my native language). But having been a musician for twenty years, nothing can convey those feelings like music. This one fits me like a glove: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTy4iOgpyZs

 

If Im not allowed to post links in here, I appologize in advance. Thank you.

Edited February 9, 2011 by Rap17

[Holly1986]

I know, from what I can see you have come on so strong and it is an inspiration for many people to read. I know that it was so difficult for you but I think that by writing it all down you will have helped and touched so many people with your posts.

 

I can see how hard it is for you, as she really doesn't seem like a bad girl. Just a broken, immature girl. In a few years, maybe when she reaches 25 or so she will be a fantastic and mature woman.

 

I have changed so much from 22 to 24. These years in a womans life are so important as they define who you are. I have come on so well from when I was 22. I guess I was confused like your ex at her age. I really do believe that she will grow up with all this time to heal herself.

 

Do you think that you can remain friends with her? I know you don't want to be her friend. You want more. But maybe let her know you will always be her friend and care for her no matter what decision she makes. This doesn't mean that you have to keep in contact but let her know you care for her. Tell her this, move on and maybe try date other women. I am sure this is the last thing you want right now but it could help you guys be friends. In a few years, if she is your soul mate she will realise this and come back to you. In the mean time try move on and see other people but you never know what will happen in years to come.

 

I know many girls who have met 'the one' but have been too young to realise it. In a few years, maybe she will see what see what she gave up after she realised that good, honest and loving men are actually harder to find than she thinks.

[Rap17]

I know, from what I can see you have come on so strong and it is an inspiration for many people to read. I know that it was so difficult for you but I think that by writing it all down you will have helped and touched so many people with your posts.

 

I can see how hard it is for you, as she really doesn't seem like a bad girl. Just a broken, immature girl. In a few years, maybe when she reaches 25 or so she will be a fantastic and mature woman.

 

I have changed so much from 22 to 24. These years in a womans life are so important as they define who you are. I have come on so well from when I was 22. I guess I was confused like your ex at her age. I really do believe that she will grow up with all this time to heal herself.

 

Do you think that you can remain friends with her? I know you don't want to be her friend. You want more. But maybe let her know you will always be her friend and care for her no matter what decision she makes. This doesn't mean that you have to keep in contact but let her know you care for her. Tell her this, move on and maybe try date other women. I am sure this is the last thing you want right now but it could help you guys be friends. In a few years, if she is your soul mate she will realise this and come back to you. In the mean time try move on and see other people but you never know what will happen in years to come.

 

I know many girls who have met 'the one' but have been too young to realise it. In a few years, maybe she will see what see what she gave up after she realised that good, honest and loving men are actually harder to find than she thinks.

 

Thanks Holly. Actually, thats exactly what I want to tell her and what I want to do. I know I have been a little bit pushy by initiating contact with her, then been trying to set up a meeting several times, having her say she will talk to me soon and not really getting a response. But its alright, I feel better and more confident, and I truly believe that we should follow our hearts. I have been playing games after the breakup, thinking up scenarios for getting her back, all that silly stuff. This meeting and the "talk", yeah you could say its a "plan" as well, but truthfully its more something I have to do for me. I dont plan on being her friend, but I will tell her that Im grateful for having been in a relationship with her, for the good times, and that Im grateful for having had the experience of feeling so strongly for a woman. No other woman has ever come close, although I have tried being heartbroken before.

[Rap17]

Its odd. I was out last night, played a concert and had a few beers with my bandmates. Was great fun and had good time. My ex has been on my mind quite a bit this past week, and Im trying to mentally prepare for our meetup this wednesday. Then this weird feeling just struck me out of the blue and it lingered for a little while.

 

I felt like I didnt want to meet her. I dont know if its because Im scared of her being distant and cold, or its because Im simply tired of having her in my thoughts. I am gonna go through with it though. When I asked her the first time, more than a week ago, (when we couldnt find day to meet because of our conflicting schedules), her first reply to me asking to meet for a cup of coffe was "Sure, then I can also give you back the suitcase I borrowed from you". The later convos we had she didnt make "excuses" for the meetup, was just casual and nice. But hmm, if she wants to meet up just to unload some stuff then whats the point exactly? Would be nice if she at least wanted to meet to catch up, and perhaps she wants that as well. I cant know whats going on in her mind, and Im not trying to figure it out like a lost drug addict, but still.

 

I dont know, something feels off. I think I will be quite capable of handling this in a nonchalant way, the hurt isnt so bad anymore. But I cant deny that she still has some kind of influence over me, and that I still love her.

 

Wednesday coming up soon. If anyone has any advice on how to go about this it is much appreciated. I think I have most of it covered, just being myself and all that. But always nice to hear people chime in.

 

Thanks everyone.

[pollylolly]

Hey, best of luck with the meet up...I can see why you are nervous!! I would be too!! Very very nervous...

 

I guess it would be hard to see her if she has made it so clear she has moved on. You sound like you are coping really well? Are you sure it is vital you see her? Maybe wait another few weeks. I feel you will recover so much more in the space of a few weeks. That way you will be stronger.

 

What if u meet her and you feel you are still in love with her? That might make all the time you have spent getting over her a waste of time if you go back to square one.

 

Protect yourself!! You deserve better than to let her control your emotions:)

[Reisender]

Raps,

 

I read through your posts over the weekend and noticed that the time span of your break has been nearly the same as my own (Nov. 2 to current). I've been asking a lot of the same questions and wondering about NC and the proper use of it. It's nice to remember you're not the only one with those feelings and worries.

 

I'm 27, the ex is 25. We had the most solid relationship I have ever had, lasting 1 year and 10 months exactly. We were an incredible match. On Nov. 2, she asked for space after a talk from 6:45AM to 8:30AM, making me 30 minutes late for work. I teach English in China.

 

There's the big difference. I chose to teach in China for a year, starting in August. It's something I've wanted to do for years to see the country, learn the language, and possibly open options for the future The girl is in a PhD program for cancer research, so we couldn't (that's relative) take our relationship further for another two years anyway. She was very supportive of this decision, although naturally wanted me to stay. We had made plans for her visit, in early March, after her orals.

 

She went to the mountains one weekend with a good friend of mine for lunch, a trip to the winery, and she bought ski pants (oddly, this is what my friend does with girls when he likes them). I passed it off, but when I asked her if we'd be able to Skype that night (my morning, 13hr time difference), she said she was on her way back from the mountains and wouldn't be back in time. But, she could email using her Blackberry. So, we have a short email talk while she is driving.

 

The next day when I spoke to her, she told me that my asking her if she would be on skype that night and saying I wanted to talk to her, made her feel really bad. "You can go places and I can't?" I had gone to the Shanghai Expo the day before. I told her I had meant nothing by "I've wanted to talk to you" other than making a statement. It wasn't to make her feel bad.

 

Of course, sirens, flags, and lights are going off in my head at this point. We had an odd, but not bad following two weeks. Then on Halloween, I say "Happy Halloween, hope you did something fun, knowing that my friend was going to come to town to see his friend's band play and she would probably go along with him. This is one of my good friends, so I suggested that he stay on her couch instead of driving 3-4hrs back home. In response to my email she says "(His name) and I just got up, it was a long night. Sylvester (her oldest cat who loves me) really likes (His name). That was all.

 

It struck me as a statement worded to make me jealous. She doesn't do that normally, so I passed it off. I didn't react and said "That cat! His loyalties change so quickly". I really thought nothing of this, since the guy is such a friend of mine, I passed it as a silly insecurity of my own. I still don't worry about her and the guy, but his friendship may be enough to help her question "us." She didn't respond to what I said.

 

Then on Nov. 2 I had confirmation of a growing worry of my own. My company was not going to offer the visa that they promised. They were just yahking me around. I had a week before my visa expired. I tell her about this in an email and about how, if I can't get another visa on my own, I will have to come home. I said "maybe I should just plan on coming home anyway". Three months into my time in China and BOOM!

 

I woke up early the next morning and sent her a message on Skype telling her that my computer was finally working well again. I had gotten a virus from a Chinese pirated program and had to reinstall MS XP using a Chinese copy version that had tons of incompatibility issues due to the fact that you can't update it. So I had to find all of the old drivers and older versions of software. It was a pain - did I mention I'm in China?

 

She calls me, right away, and says "What's going on with the Visa?" I tell her about the company's inaction and such. Then she asked my plans if I were to come home, to which I replied "first I'd have to find a job." Then she drops bomb #1: "I think it's only fair to tell you, if you come home, you can't stay here." I lived with her for four months before I came to China. I had not simply planned on moving back in with her, I would have needed to find a job and, in the town where we lived, there weren't many of those to go around. I simply say "why not?", since I knew there was a lot behind her simple statement.

 

She unloads with all of her worries about me, about us, her insecurities, so many things. I was taken by it and being so early it was quite alot to process. The things that hurt the most were bomb #2: "I'm a sucker, I'm a sucker, you used me, you used me Jake, you used me!" She feels, and rightly so it seems in some cases, that she has been used by many guys that she has dated. I lived with her rent free (at least with no assumed rent, I helped where I could), for four months. She asked me to, she wanted me there and we talked about it because I had been very worried that she would one day turn around and say I used her if I had stayed with her. This was a mistake on my part - as much as we talked about it and she assured me she wanted me there, I knew better - we were not engaged or married. Which she later brought up. Of course we had been dating for a year and 4 months at the point when I lived with her. She knew I was going to China in August. I had also told her, that once things get settled there, I would send her "rent" money because I thought it was only fair. She always told me she didn't want it - but she said exactly what I worried about, "You used me."

 

She said that she thought my visa problems were somehow my fault, that there was something I wasn't doing. She tells me that she doesn't think that I do want her, that we have been dating this long and haven't said I love you (which we, yes we, had decided to skip over - another stupid mistake on my part), and that she deosn't want to get married tomorrow, but she wants the option. All of this comes from seemingly nowhere. In the weeks and months before, she would call each night and I would wake up early in the morning to talk to her. Her nights are my mornings and vice-versa. We were doing great, until these doubts crept in and she started focusing on insecurities and worries rather than things we talked about.

 

She finally says "Jake, you're in China but, I guess what I am saying is I need space." To this I say, with a small laugh, "Well, you can't get much more space than this". She apologizes for dropping all of that on my in the morning before class. I say "I'm glad you did, you had to say it sometime. I'm not going to get angry and yell at you. I get what you're saying. I really do. I have to go to class." Just before saying this she says "I've never asked this of a guy that I've dated, but I want you to change. Change Jake!" I ask, "how so?" She says, "Grow up, be a man." Something I hate hearing, since it is such a copout/ambiguous statement. I beleive her when she says she's never asked a guy that before, but it's not something that happens overnight, plus you should not feel pressured to fit another person's mold. I take it more as she wants me, or a guy, to put himself into her, take care of her love her fully. My crux, is that I was good to her, but I have beenh so focused on my goals and setting up the right situation for my future family as I see it, a hypothetical, rather than right not, in this moment, tell her how much I love her and want her. had I done that before coming to China, things may have been very different.

 

Anyway, you can see how this still gets to me. I don't know why she said nothing of this before I left for China and it all comes out now. It's in stark contrast to how she was for the first three months, supportive, happy, always excited to talk. If I were at home it would be easy to go see her and talk to her and repair a lot of this, but I am in China. Skype is only good when the other person signs on. An email is no place for such a description of feelings. She received flowers the day after we talked, as I had ordered them the day before. To this, she responded with "Thank you for the flowers, I would have thanked you sooner, but I left my computer at the lab." Then, for Thanksgiving, I sent her a Swarovsky crystal squrrel from Suzhou China (she collects them) and five Disney DVDs (she wants to build her collection, but Disney only releases the old animations at certain times of year). She replied "I got your FedEx last week. I really liked the Squirrel and DVDs. I assume all went well with your visa and you are not legal in China. I hope al is well with you. It felt cold and it probably was.

 

During this time I had been travelling from Suzhou, near Shanghai, to Beijing, Hong Kong, and Shanghai to try to find an option to stay. Each of these cities is a major visa hub. I went to clubs and bars in search of people with more experience in China who could point me in the right direction. I fnally met a guy who worked with the US Department of Defense who told me what to do. I'm not pseudo legal, quit the old company, and have a much better job with growing prospects. I worked from 9AM to 9PM each day, since I had to make enough money to pay for my own apartment (In China it's 3 months rent, plus 1 month security deposit, and a half month's rent as a finder's fee when starting a lease). The original school had called me, while on a train to Beijing, to tell me that I would have to change apartments. The landlord wanted to move his family into mine. That was the last straw with that company and that situation. I was going mental.

 

So, all of December and all of January, I work every day from 9AM-9PM, six jobs of varying teaching degree, all over the place. I heard nothing from the girl beside the two "Thank you" emails. To the second, I replied telling her just a bit about the Visa and about the housing situation. The last thing I want is for her to feel like this is somehow her fault or I blame her, but she needed to know a little of what had been going on. I then said the only personal thing I've said to her, "If there is any reason for you to think any of the things that you were thinking when we last talked, then there is something I should be doing differently. I can't let you think that I am not thinking and I don't care. So, let me be clear, I am thinking and I do care. I do miss you."

 

I sent her a small Christmas tree for Christmas. We normally go to cut our own tree in the mountains. It's a full day event with hot cider and her getting excited about the biggest tree and me having to carry it. Then I sent her a set of LUSH bathbombs to relax with before her orals in early February. I heard nothing from either of these gifts - No "Happy Thanksgiving" and no "Merry Christmas." Not only am I away from family on the holidays (I had the money saved to make a surprise Christmas visit, but had to spend it due to the housing and Visa problems), but there's all this as well.

 

We are going on 3.5 months of NC, or maybe LC given the gifts I sent while travelling around. I've heard nothing from her. I just returned from a trip to Guilin, Yongshou, Kunming, Lijiang, Tiger Leaping Gorge, and the border with Myanmar to help reset myself a little. I still think about my ex a lot and we didn't have a proper break up at all. There has been nothing but her two cold emails and my short quip about what is going on here. "Spiace", the final frontier. From China, I hardly know what to think about it. I won't email her over and over. If I were at home, I'd go talk to her. The most important things must be her research and orals. December to February were to be her most difficult times with her grad program. She has to finish her research project and present it, or else she will have to extend her stay in the program for another full year. Just like she says "I will not be the reason you leave China (her first statement in the "space" talk). I will not push her during a time where she must focus on her orals.

 

This is the most difficult a relationship has ever been in my life. I love this girl incredibly. Distance in very difficult and it is made more difficult when you're dealing with a country that is a world away from your own and things are so different yet frustratingly similar. I am now stable in China, know the system and how to get things done - all of which I had to learn on my own, the safety net I had with the company was faulty. No more 12 hour work days, so I can study Chinese properly. A bomb went off in November.

 

I have no idea what will happen with my situation, as it is made different with me being in China, but NC and LC are extremely tough. I hope reading my story will help you take your mind off things. These things are incredibly tough, no matter where you are. I've enjoyed your posts. They've helped me calm down a bit, reminding me that others are going through things as well.

 

I wish the best and will check up on your posts from time to time.

[GoingInsane]

Hey Rap. Hpw did it go on Wed?

[Rap17]

Hey all and sorry Im taking my time. Ill post an update later tonight, and thanks for all the replies people

[Rap17]

So, this is what it all has come down to. Update after the meetup this wednesday.

 

She texted me wednesday afternoon. A snowstorm had been raging the night before, so the streets were covered in snow. She let me know that she would take an early bus because of the weather and she actually showed up earlier than expected, by half an hour. I had prepared a lot, fixed up and rearranged the furniture in my appartment a bit, put on some nice clothes, lit candles and put on some nice music. Nothing to "date" like, just casual, to create a nice environment. So, she showed up and things were fine. She was still a bit sick with a cold. I made some coffee and told her I was going to do some stuff in the kitchen. She was in the living room, and I came in with this huge, nasty chocolate cake that I got from the bakers shop. When we talked online the week before, I mentioned to her that I was going to serve her coffee and chocolate cake, and I took her completely by surprise. She was very happy and told me how sweet a gesture that was, and man it might have been the best chocolate cake in the world hehe.

 

Anyway, I played it calm and collected, threw a few jokes and smiles, and things were off to a good start. We chatted about our field studies, her family and other small talk stuff. After a few minutes she was talking about being stressed out, that work and school was rough, that she wasnt feeling at home in her field study place, and that there was some problems with her brothers love life. I just sat there and listened, commenting on what she said from time to time. I threw in some of my own experiences and gave her some small tips. This went on for a few hours, (yeah time went by fast and I was surprised she stayed that long). Then the first dreaded question came.

 

"You mentioned you wanted to tell me something?" she said. This was the first time I felt my heart sink in my chest. I told her that I wasnt sure how to put it in words, that I needed to think on it for a moment. She asked if it was positive, I assured her it was. Then she asked if it was personal, I said yes. Then I bit the bullet and spoke. I told her how I had gotten way better, that I had come to the clarity that, while I still didnt find I had done anything wrong, I could see from her point of view how it had been tough on her. That I now understood how I hadnt been there for her in the way she needed me to be in the latter part of the relationship, that I should have agreed to the break, and that I had been too selfish and desperate during the breakup to realise these things, since I had my own issues to deal with. I told her I wasnt saying these things with any expectations, but just that I wanted to say it, and that perhaps she would like to hear it as well. She nodded and seemed quite happy to hear the stuff, even though she was sad and a bit depressed. Basically validated her and took responsibility for my role in the breakup, saying how a breakup takes two people. I told her that I was sorry to have hurt her, and that it was never my intention and she told me she knew this. I told her that I understood how she wanted to "find herself" and experience things on her own. I also told her that Ive come to realise that I became clingy and needy and a bit pathetic, and not the man I used to be, while being with her in the last part of our relationship. That I could barely recognize the guy I had become, but that I was feeling much better and much stronger now. I also told her that I was very happy for having been in the relationship, and that I was grateful for having had the chance to feel so strongly for a woman, something I thought not many people would experience.

 

I mentioned how she numerous times had said that she missed the "old" me. That I now understood what she meant, because I was back to being that guy. She could tell, and she let me know. She felt the change in me. Then things went into even scarier territory.

 

She talked about how she had needed me the past months, that she still wasnt over the breakup and that it was still affecting her, and that she thought I was mad and angry at her and that had been the reason I had avoided her. I told her I wasnt, not anymore, and that I hadnt been afraid to confront her, but merely was looking out for myself, that it hurt to be around her too much after we broke up. She also mentioned the phonecall where she bit my head off, saying that she understood I didnt want to hurt her and that I did it for the right reasons, but that she still had lost some respect for me after that, since the timing was off. I agreed, it was ok. Brushed it off as water under the bridge. She told me she was feeling incredibly guilty still, that she thought it would take a long time to forgive herself for what she did, that she had never hurt anyone like she hurt me. That I was such a good person blah blah. She let me know that it was about her issues and so on, same old.

 

Then she began crying. She was emotionally struck by how everything was hard on her, how she didnt have any confidence in her abilities and so on. I wrapped her in a warm blanket, then motioned her to come closer. Then I put my arms around her and she leaned into me. I think she had really been missing me. She told me how she had needed me so much since I had known her for so long, that I was one of the few that knew her well, and that I understood her. (Pretty selfish of her I have to admit).

 

Then another question came up. "So, how do you feel in regards to me?"

It felt like an exam or something, but I was prepared for this. I asked "How do you want me to feel?". She told me that she still cared a lot for me and stuff, a bit wishy washy, but conveyed somewhat that she was interested in friendship, I cant remember what was said exactly. Then I said. "Well, Im not going to lie to you. I still have feelings for you". This took her by surprise and she told me that it had been four months, that she thought I was completely over her by now. (I guess my approach hadnt been too desperate, perhaps I just imagined as much). I told her that I was in a much better place now, but that it didnt mean I didnt have romantic feelings for her. That I had been devastated by the breakup, but that I was "over" that part, that I had put it behind me. But feelings were still there, regardless. I asked her the same question back, then she told me she was over me, but she still wanted me as a friend etc. This killed me a little on the inside, but I still played it calm and cool, didnt let my guard down. She was behaving a little bit defensivly at this point, then the million dollar question came. The one where you know you have to pass the test or fall down the chasm of doom.

 

She asked "If I asked you to reconcile, would you agree to?" My answer was that if she had asked me two months ago I would have said yes. She quickly rephrased the question, mentioning it being a hypothetical one, that she wasnt asking for a reconciliation. Then I said that hypothetically, had she asked me two months ago I would have said yes, but if she were to ask me now then I would say "no". The reason being that it would have to take some consideration, and that we would have to talk about issues to make it right. That it would be one step at a time, and that we would have to see how things developed in time. She also said something about "those damn men...I just want them to go away" Hinting that guys were still hitting on her, but that there was noone else at the moment, at least not that I was made aware of. Cant know for sure though. I didnt give her many detailed answers about what I had been upto, kept it a bit of a mystery.

 

Then we talked about where we stood now. I told her that I didnt know, that I wanted to be there for her as a friend, but that I wasnt sure it would be fair for either of us, since I had romantic feelings for her and she only had plartonic feelings for me. I could tell she wanted my friendship, but she also doubted it, since I had told her my feelings still lingered. In the end I said "I can agree to a fresh start....as friends....but we will have to take one step at a time, then see what happens. Just take it slowly from here". Then I took her hand and shook it, like a buisness deal hehe. We agreed on it, and things went a bit light again.

 

Then we talked about the upcoming exams in august. She told me there was noone she wanted to study wth more than me, and its true what she said, that we work very well together. I had this interest too, so in the end we made a pact that we would make the upcoming exam projects together, (realise that for this we will be studying together for four months). I did this because I truly want her in my group, but also because it will give me a chance in the future to show her the new me, and also because its in half a year. A lot can happen in that time. But mostly, to show her that I care for her and Im there for her like I said I would be. If she needs me like she says she does, she will have to prove it, but she might be scared because of my feelings, I dont know.

 

At this point we had been talking for more than four hours, and it went past midnight. I told her that she could stay the night if she wanted to, that if she felt weird about it I could sleep on the couch. She declined politely because she didnt bring any of her stuff and had to get up early for work, but that she would call a cab. She had stayed far longer that I had thought she would, and she wouldnt be able to get much sleep before work, perhaps five hours or so. So, I guess at least thats a positive.

 

She was very impressed with the changes I had made to my living space and myself, my change in attitude and so on. A couple of times I even gave her a glance and a smile. One time she turned away from me after I did this. I told her with a laugh that I liked her reaction, she replied that I very well knew that she couldnt help herself. I dont know, she got turned on by it, so I guess shes still attracted to me, but I didnt make her unconfortable or overplayed it. Just kept it nonchalant and cool, while showing that I still cared for her. Smiled and made some silly remarks etc. Even though I had prepared for this meeting, I just tried to be myself as well as I could and I think it worked quite well.

 

I might have made a mistake in telling her that I still have feelings for her, but I figured I didnt want to play too many games. Just be honest and real, but at the same time not show too much weakness. It seems she friendszoned me quite a bit, but little does she know that Im going full NC now. I will study with her in august, so I will get to see her again for a long period of time. In the meantime I can work on myself some more. I will have to see her some days at Uni the coming months, when we go back to school for a couple of days, but I think its ten days in all in the next 5-6 months, so not much.

 

I did one last gesture though, and I promise its my last if she doesnt initiate any contact with me. I phoned her late the following evening, but she was asleep. She texted me friday morning at 6 am and asked me what I wanted. I told her that it was great to see her again and that I wanted to hear if she was feeling better. She told me she was, but she was stressed and so on. I told her that I had anjoyed our talk and that I hoped we could do it again sometime. She told me in response that she liked it too, despite all of her sobbing and crying. I told her it was perfectly fine, and that I would cheer her up if she invited for coffee next time and threw in a smiley. She replied "Ok, super :)" And that was it.

 

So, there you have it. Full NC, or NIC I guess, and will see what happens. Initiative is on her, I made up for a lot of the mistakes I made, (from her perspective mind you), but I have a feeling shes still not convinced. I sense that shes still confused, but when she tells me shes over me thats what I have to stick by. Im not giving up however, Im too stubborn and dumb to do that. No matter if shes seeing someone or not, or whatever is going on, Im going to work on myself some more and try to have fun. Its out of my hands, at least for the moment.

 

It was a long convo, and this post is already very long. But I think I got most of the important stuff in there, Ill add more when I remember it.

 

Thanks for reading. Id like to hear what you think, but positives and negatives. Im still trying to wrap brain around this thing, and I do admit I got a minor setback, but its not too bad. I was prepared for this as well. Most importantly, I just cemented to myself that I really love her. Not in a needy way, I can take care of myself. Just that I want her, no matter what has transpired. Its all in the past now.

 

 

Thanks all you wonderful people at LS. What a journey it has been, and it continues. Please chime in if you have anything to add. Lots of love.

 

-Rap

[Rap17]

Anyone? Just curious what you think

[Reisender]

Sounds like you are doing the right thing and that her responses have been as good as you can hope for. Being honest is the best thing. Honesty; however, does not mean divulging all of your thoughts in their entirety, so keep your filter active and tell her the "key points" of what you are thinking. You sound good thus far.

 

We never know what will happen, but establishing a new ground for contact is always a first major step. I'm glad you have that.

[imyuinny]

I just read the last few pages but from the sounds of it, you did so well and in parts I wished I was that calm about my breakup when I spoke to my ex. It sounds so peaceful, loving and caring and it was what I would have liked for my after breakup as my ex was the love of my life.

 

To be honest, just be careful as it sounds like your ex is still very confused and is trying to sift all the confusions. On your part, you performed a selfless act which shows confidence and maturity.

 

Then she began crying. She was emotionally struck by how everything was hard on her, how she didnt have any confidence in her abilities and so on. I wrapped her in a warm blanket, then motioned her to come closer. Then I put my arms around her and she leaned into me. I think she had really been missing me. She told me how she had needed me so much since I had known her for so long, that I was one of the few that knew her well, and that I understood her. (Pretty selfish of her I have to admit).

 

Unfortunately, she still sounds like she needs a lot more time on her own to figure out her own self, wants and needs. She is still young and it sounds like me when I was younger and didn't know a lot about myself. It is a very confusing state to be in because suddenly there is no-one to depend on. However harsh it is, she needs to learn to love herself first, realized the self-limitations we put onto ourselves for no reason and most importantly to be comfortable with herself.

 

Most importantly, I just cemented to myself that I really love her. Not in a needy way, I can take care of myself. Just that I want her, no matter what has transpired. Its all in the past now.

 

It's great to know that you know what you want and you know what to do. I'm sincerely happy that you got through it with such compassion and love. Keep it up dear your doing fabulous!

[Rap17]

Sounds like you are doing the right thing and that her responses have been as good as you can hope for. Being honest is the best thing. Honesty; however, does not mean divulging all of your thoughts in their entirety, so keep your filter active and tell her the "key points" of what you are thinking. You sound good thus far.

 

We never know what will happen, but establishing a new ground for contact is always a first major step. I'm glad you have that.

 

 

Thank you. Yeah I tried to not divulge too much information on what Ive been doing, and I held back for the most part, although I think I could have held back a bit more in certain contexts. Ah well, its emotions were talking about, hard to restrain yourself completely. Thankfully, I never got need weak or caved in or anything like that, I kept my demeanor pretty confident and calm.

[Rap17]

I just read the last few pages but from the sounds of it, you did so well and in parts I wished I was that calm about my breakup when I spoke to my ex. It sounds so peaceful, loving and caring and it was what I would have liked for my after breakup as my ex was the love of my life.

 

To be honest, just be careful as it sounds like your ex is still very confused and is trying to sift all the confusions. On your part, you performed a selfless act which shows confidence and maturity.

 

Unfortunately, she still sounds like she needs a lot more time on her own to figure out her own self, wants and needs. She is still young and it sounds like me when I was younger and didn't know a lot about myself. It is a very confusing state to be in because suddenly there is no-one to depend on. However harsh it is, she needs to learn to love herself first, realized the self-limitations we put onto ourselves for no reason and most importantly to be comfortable with herself.

 

t's great to know that you know what you want and you know what to do. I'm sincerely happy that you got through it with such compassion and love. Keep it up dear your doing fabulous!

 

Well, then you should read the thread from the beginning to see what a pathetic and clingy mess Ive been Im really glad I did this, even though it has made me think of her constantly ever since. A minor setback, but nothing I cannot handle. Kinda makes me sad that Im going NC all over again, or NIC I guess it is. It was the first real positive contact Ive had with her in months, so I guess its natural to want to reach out more. I would think she´d want me to and expect me to, but I have to keep my dignity and self respect and let it be her move. The biggest worry is that she will find someone else if she hasnt already, I was careful not to ask about other guys. But nothing I can do about it anyways if thats the case.

 

Maybe you guys can give me some advice if NC is the bext course of action at this point, or if perhaps so much time has passed that I could go LC and contact her once in a while, casually. Its been four months since the breakup, and for the first time I dont feel NC will make that big a difference in my healing really. Still, its imperative that I dont come across as desperate or needy, no matter how well Im doing. Its all about the dignity now.