Cheating Husband that won't admit it

[jenny]

We have got 5 computers in this house with all kinds of back up tapes from the hard drive (forgive me, for I know little about computers, whereas he knows all kinds of info, which puts him at a HUGE advantage). That would be money WELL spent, to find a place that could search these hard drives, especially his lapdance, I mean laptop. He's got things saved on literally thousands of disks/CD's, and I've searched from time to time, but I don't even know how to begin knowing how or what to look for. I was just thinking yesterday that THAT is where there is a wealth of knowledge/info. IF ANYONE KNOWS ANY WAY I CAN FIND OUT INFO. ON THE PUTERS, MY GRATITUDE WOULD BE FOREVER YOURS!!!!

 

hmm. what you need is a geeky friend - i wish i could lend you one of mine . do you have any trustworthy friends around that can help you with this?

 

do you know how to search through files and open up hidden files? and can anyone recommend a program that tracks key strokes and such?

 

p.s. i. need. to. see. the. new. sopranos. i have every season complete. i am actually hurting to see the two tonys. evidently he is courting melfi. re:carmella's complicit but angry devotion: interesting.

[Fedup&givingup]

Jenny, nope no geeky friends. That would be the perfect thing, though. I have fantasized about this on many occasions...getting someone over here and knitpicking the crap out of all of these units. I would be SOOO willing to pay money for that. That would be a fruitful effort, not a private detective. I STRONGLY feel that I am surrounded with information that I cannot access due to ignorance. I found lots of things that are in a cabinet (?!?) What I mean is if I click on it, it says it cannot open it, and suggests finding how to open it online, and there is usually nothing available.

 

I guess that is what is important to me. Showing him I have found something that I've known that he can no longer deny. I have confronted, confronted, confronted. I have been VERY firm and pinpointed and laid it on the line. He still insists...

 

Oh, and here's something else I'd like to add.

 

Jenny, you mentioned the most incriminating things he's done that, and you said one of them was the night he went to his office. I just thought of something. Now, if he had to go and do that for real, that would have been the FIRST thing he would have told me when he met me at Chuck E. Cheese. He would have been stressed out because he had to go and tend to something work related, and he wouldn't have been all smooth and casual like he was. That's just not him, personally. I know him well enough to know, for sure. It would have been the focus of our conversation. He was so new there at that time, and he wouldn't have been sitting there smiling...he was acting like that because he was going to get some. He got angry with me when I asked him about it because I knew exactly what he was up to. "Do I smell like perfume?" GIVE me a break! He's so meticulous anyway. He makes me SICK.

[WWDDFD]

You know, I don't mean to sound insensitive or anything... but sometimes reading posts like these make me feel a ****load better about my life...

[Fedup&givingup]

And it's posts like yours and the rest that give me the confidence and motivation to ge the hell out! I now know I'm not making mountain out of mole hills.

[WWDDFD]

Yeah. Ditch the guy like a moldy sack of tangerines.

 

You can do better.

 

 

If he wants to get knocked up by sluts all day long, let him. Sooner or later he's going to catch something and pass it on to you, and then you'll never be able to forgive yourself.

[Fedup&givingup]

Believe you me, there is nothing I dream about more than just dropping him like you say, but I'm doing this rationally. There is no doubt that my husband is NO good, but I'm not going to be stupid and "just leave", although I WISH I could. I am going to take this as an opportunity. I am going to finish getting my degree. I will come out smelling like a rose while I leave a burning pile of garbage behind me. I've lived with it and him this long, I can cope and manage.

 

It was Jenny that pointed out how insecure my husband is and how my leaving him is going to wreck him...how true! That really hit home, because I never even looked at it like that. He IS insecure, and he's made me insecure. When he and I were first dating, he was hot, hot, hot for me. EVERY thing made him jealous, and he would pout when other men looked at me. One time when we were out somewhere, another guy bought me a drink. He stormed out of the place and threatened ME to go home. I told him to go ahead and go...there was a grown man acting like a child. He couldn't handle other men being attracted to me. He gets incredibly upset when I tell him I want out of this, and he does know that. Then, he refuses that, and he thinks he's smoothed everything over and changed my mind.

 

When I talk and tell him about these incidents he raises his voice much higher than mine and talks over me, cutting me off. He says I'm causing trouble. I doesn't see that the few things that are NOT debatable are that big of a deal. He does not see how he's been dishonest. Basically, he is in NO way accountable or responsible for his actions. For this alone, I have no reason to think that he's full of bull and ultimately guilty. <sigh>

[Benedict]

Can't add much here, but some solidarity...

 

Been cheated on, but we're working it out pretty successfully. But your guy is a much worse problem.

 

I have to agree with Dyer... Why go to the added expense, heartache, trouble and distraction of learning what he's "really up to"? Does it even matter at this point? You know pretty much what you will find. It ain't gonna save your marriage either way. You need to focus on getting the hell out and making sure you and your son are going to be OK.

 

Haste thee to an attorney's office!

[Fedup&givingup]

You are correct. I guess my strong desire to provide my husband with the evidence of his "suspected" actions will show him that my inner voice, conscience, and gut feelings were NOT wrong.

 

It's true though, that putting that energy in trying to find things about him are a major distraction from the things I should be doing in order to get out of here.

[brashgal]

Fedup - I found 'evidence', love notes and email from women and actually did catch him one time in our motorhome, both of them in various states of undress. The difference here was that he admitted to me that he was cheating but kept telling me it was because of things that I did or did not do - he needed support from these other women. We were in and out of counselling three separate times. He kept waffling, he wanted to make the marriage work but he never succeeded in cutting off contact with these other women. He was very convincing when he wanted to be and since I had children, I did not want to be hasty in making a decision to split.

 

I made myself crazy with my investigative work - I was obsessed and all it did was upset me when I uncovered things. Found out that his married GF's husband filed for divorce and simultaneously found them leaving one another one day (when they had no good reason to be where they were found) and I snapped, kicked him out.

 

A couple people mentioned that judges do not consider infidelity and that is true in many states (like the one I live in). You might want to do some research to see if that is true where you live, why spend a lot of effort and money to establish adultery if it won't get you anywhere? The biggest issue here is trust, you don't trust him, he doesn't do anything to try to regain your trust. It's no basis for a marriage.

 

Take care of yourself!

[NotaBadGuy]

Fedup,

 

I find it noble that you want to seek out the ultimate truth in your situation with the husband. However, it may not be worth the time and effort of doing so. You have made it clear to myself and others that he is up to no good, that he will not accept responsibility, and that he is adept at thinking he smooths things over until the next episode. You have clearly indicated that you are unhappy in this situation. And I can't blame you there.

 

Investigative work such as this tears at you and eats you alive. It consumes you thoughts and invades everything you stand for. I took the initiative to start looking into my wife's(at the time) actions and behaviors. All the signs were there (as in your case). At first I denied, denied, denied what was so obvious. Then I let my instincts take over. What I found and what I saw shook the foundation upon which I stood. Even though I basically knew what was going on, I was then thrown into the raging river of deciet. I still have issues with the way things went down. In the end, the ex-wife said she could not live with someone like me who did no more than search for the truth. I have never stepped out on any woman I have ever been with, nor have I ever even thought about it. I would, however, be lying if I said I never have looked at other women in passing - but I am human.

 

As I mentioned before, get your degree. That is something no one but you yourself can take away from you. That is something that is more than the mere paper your name and degree name is on. That is your accomplishment that you managed to obtain throughout the trials and tribulations of your marraige. You will be able to look on the wall at that degree and understand the significance of the blood, sweat, and tears that went into that accomplishment. You will see beyond the ink and paper. You will see the story behind the degree. Stay strong, stay on course, and let the wind guide your sail. I'm pulling for you and so is everyone else.

[Fedup&givingup]

Yes, for some reason I feel compelled in finding what I can't get my hands on. To me it's affirmation.

 

The BIGGEST regret I have is presenting him with everything each time. I wonder if I had kept my mouth shut he would have been a WHOLE lot sloppier, and that would have been it.

 

I'm just sick of being lied to! I mean, for every point I made on my original post his rebuttals are weak. Take for instance the day I stopped by to take him out to lunch...he claims to have been laying down resting/sleeping, and he claims that he actually saw me leave the parking lot. IF that had been the case, he would have called me and told me he saw me, or it would have been HIM that brought it up first when he got home that night. Neither happened. AND, why in the world would he have just looked up and glanced over for no apparent reason? When bringing this incident up to him, he says I should have put a note on his car, and then I would have seen him. I'm thinking, he would have come up with another lie.

 

The incident with the sheets...what I failed to mention that I didn't was that not only had he changed the sheets, the "dirty" ones were in the machine, washed. He didn't bother to put them in the dryer even, because he simply doesn't do laundry. He didn't do any other laundry, and he didn't do anything else around the house.

 

I'm curious as to what you found out about your wife. You mentioned the behaviours, and I know exactly what you mean there...Mine starts fights and arguments.

 

Here's something that is happening currently, and this might be my subconscience bringing it all up again...he has a full time job, but he and another guy are interested in starting their own business. Well, he had to do a job at a doctor's office. Keep in mind this is computer network stuff...he dressed in his "dry clean" clothes LOL. I mean, the shirt, tie, and pants. I remember him dressing like that when we first started dating. I also thought it was strange when he goes to work (at his regular job) in jeans and a golf shirt. He said he wanted to dress like that because it was a doctor's office. Now I'm thinking I don't buy it. The next time he went there, he dressed the same way, and said he didn't want to wear the same outfit twice. He oftend does that when he goes to his regular job...not the same set of clothes two days in a row, but I wash every day, and he wears what is ready, clean, and last put away (lazy on his part LOL). The last time he had to go over there, he wore jeans and a gulf shirt, like he would when he goes to his job. I'm wondering did he dress like that to try to bait and hook/impress someone. From time to time, he goes on job interviews but nothing ever comes from them. He's always looking for something better, etc. I'm thinking I should somehow follow him when he goes to this doctor's office or on his next interview...just casually ask where it is (I already know where the doctor's office is), and leave about 15 minutes after he has. The thought of doing that makes me sick! What if he catches ME spying on him????

 

Like I've said, I think the most valuable source of evidence is going to be on his laptop and main computer. I don't even know if you can permanently delete things from the hard drive, etc. or how any of that works. He does...

[SoleMate]

Fed Up -

 

You know for 100% certain that he is cheating on you. You eyes, ears and brain are telling you the truth. So take it as given. The details are only to torture yourself with. He's lied to you again and again until he can't even open his mouth without lies coming out. Can you wall yourself off from him emotionally while you finish your degree and get ready to leave? Can't you do your best to stop caring about him? He has ceased to be a real husband to you. I would divorce him in my head and consider him as just someone who rents a room in your house, and does not need to account to you for his time.

 

Oh, I would definitely stop sharing my bed and my body with him, and I would also stop doing his laundry. He can eat with you, just like a roomer would.

 

When you finally announce your departure, after you have worked everyting out first with your own lawyer, he will break down, cry, and want you back. You will need to keep your soul steely and remember all this pain. Good luck!

[Fedup&givingup]

Thank you, Sole Mate. I was looking forward in hearing what you had to say. I basically have to chalk it up for the time being and not dwell on this and his crap so I can focus on what I need to do for me and my son.

 

I almost feel like just saying to heck with it and going back to being self employed and trying to manage everything on my own. It would be a struggle, and I wouldn't be as financially comfortable as I am now, but I wouldn't be living in this nightmare, either. He even points that out to me when I mention divorce...how he's taken care of me (I have always worked, up until we moved here...I had a business that took a while to establish), and how I wouldn't be able to manage independently. I KNOW what that smells like! Truthfully, I am scared to leave for that reason.

 

If I stay and work on the degree, I would be here another 2 years, three if I get my masters, which would be the way to go. I would be ready to take the CPA exam. I just don't know what to do.

 

I will say how amazed I am that not ONE single person posted that he might be telling the truth. That's good to know. The more I think about it, the more I think I should just go back to doing what I was doing before I moved here with him. I don't regret the move here, either....I knew it would be an opportunity to come here, but I don't have any family here either.

[brashgal]

You had too many examples with too many inconsistencies for it all to be the truth. Those of us who have lived with cheaters see the patterns.

[Fedup&givingup]

Thank you, Brashgal.

[peakey]

Originally posted by Fedup&givingup

I guess my strong desire to provide my husband with the evidence of his "suspected" actions will show him that my inner voice, conscience, and gut feelings were NOT wrong.

 

It's true though, that putting that energy in trying to find things about him are a major distraction from the things I should be doing in order to get out of here.

 

FedUp, I know where you're at! My H moved out three days ago, and I'm STILL spying. I didn't mean to, but I came across some stuff that truly upset me. And what for? Why did I continue to spy? It became like an addiction. I had to get my "fix" of "being right". I still can't figure out why. The relationship wasn't worth it. It didn't help fix it, and it won't make things better when it's over.

 

I truly understand your need to find evidence, but hope that you can work yourself out of it, for your sake. Concentrate on your son, on your future, on what you need to do. Don't waste time.

 

Take care of yourself.

[Fedup&givingup]

Peakey,

 

What exactly did you find (if you don't mind sharing)? Is what you found what provoked your husband to move out, and up until you finding things had he vehemently denied any/everything?

[Fedup&givingup]

"Southside" started a thread about how he cheats on his girlfriend. This guy just described the behavior(s) of my husband!

 

Here's what's what...when I told my husband I was going to get a copy of his cell phone activity for the month that strange phone called occurred, he was fine with that. He was confident, no problem. THEN, I told him I was also going to get a copy of the phone bill/activity for the land line I was at that had all the outgoing calls on it (I had called him from a friend's house when that happened, and you can get a list of outgoing calls made from a landline phone). THAT sort of shook him up. He said, "IF for some reason my number was on there..." That's because I DID dial his number, and it was HIM in the conversation that he denies!!!! He probably took a longer lunch than normal and went somewhere and picked this chick up. They went back to her place, and they were in her car. She then drove him back to wherever it was that they met and hooked up, and that's when I called and heard her say, "Is that the car?" then a hesitation, and then he said as though her were straining his eyes looking to see, "yyyeeeaaahhhh"

 

So, I need not bother to dig on that incident. Out of all the times he's "striked" it's been when I've been out of town or he has been. He's rarely gone out of town with me on family related issues, he even didn't come with me to my grandmother's funeral! He's always used work as his excuse.

 

I honestly feel that this is a pathological issue...he's totally whacked in the head, that's for damned sure.

[NotaBadGuy]

Fedup,

"I'm curious as to what you found out about your wife. You mentioned the behaviours, and I know exactly what you mean there...Mine starts fights and arguments."

 

You asked me for behaviors my wife displayed. Here is what I remember. She began by leaving at 5pm (right after I got home from work or before I got home from work) and would be gone for 5 to 6 hours at a time. She would never answer her phone (which at one time she would answer or immediatley call me back) when I called. She would always have a study group that ran late into the evening (never before had happened and she was not a big studier). She began to be very secretive about her phone calls and who had called. When I was around for the phone calls, she would either not answer or would be very brief and very short with her words. She totally stopped touching me, talking to me, or really having anything to do with me. And she was a very touchy person, affectionate, and always wanted to talk. She would come in late at night and would change into bed clothes, get in bed, say nothing, and go to sleep without a word. This became a pattern. She began to buy skimpy underwear but I would never see her wear them around me. She would hide specific items of clothing that had been worn the night before. She would wash certain items of her clothes when I was not home. She was caught by myself and a frined 2x at 1am at this other guys house (but he was just a friend though). She would always argue with me about minor insignificant things. This guys phone number appeared everywhere. She would ask me if I cared if she met up with him. She totally dissed me on out 6 month aniversary when I had gone out of my way to make it a special night. She began to say she never should have gotten married to me because she never loved me. She said she wanted to say no when I asked her, but she did not want to hurt my feelings. She said she went through with the marriage because of all the time that had been invested in preparing for it. She would say the whole relationship was a big mistake. This all began after 4 months of marriage - left after 6 months. Hopefully you get the idea. In the end, I was a manipulator, controlling, and an a**hole. In fact, so was my family according to her.

 

I don't know what to tell you. It is painful as heck to go through as you know. I am still trying to recover from the tailspin. I never expected it to go down the way it did in my situation. It was very difficult at the time. I am better now, but there are still some lingering effects. I too, was and continue to be in school. It was very diffucult last semester because she filed for divorce the day before my first final. Calculated? I have no idea. But it was pretty sorry of her to do then. I had to tell myself that I was not going to let her take my education away from me. I had worked too hard to get where I am. In May, I graduate form grad school.

 

You will overcome this as will I. It takes time. I still get down and out. I push and move on though. You will do the same. I guess it is better to have loved and lost it than to never know what it is like at all. But I have faith this happened for a reason. I sure as heck don't know the reason, but one day I might. Hopefully I answered your question before I began to ramble on and on. Sorry.

[Fedup&givingup]

I am SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO sorry. That was horrible. I think the reason it happened was to make you stronger and jump hurdles for your degree. Grad school, good for you! She's a piece of dirt that isn't worthy.

 

The thing I REALLY don't understand is the guy that she was cheating on you with. I mean, these people that get involved in all this...do they not realize that they are playing with fire themselves? He deserves your ex.

 

You can go to sleep each night rest assured that NO matter what, under ANY circumstance that their relationship is completely flawed and impure. There is no way it will survive, and if it does, it will be completely dysfunctional. She will get burned and hurt just as badly. Fate has a funny way of doing things like that. What comes around goes around.

 

Another reason this happened is because she wasn't the right one for you. You didn't deserve her doing that to you, as no one does. People that can just do that to someone else has no soul, period. You are better off without her. I hope writing all that was therapeutic. That which doesn't kill us only makes us stronger!!!!

[peakey]

Originally posted by Fedup&givingup

The thing I REALLY don't understand is the guy that she was cheating on you with. I mean, these people that get involved in all this...do they not realize that they are playing with fire themselves?

 

Fedup, that's something I've pondered about myself many a time. My H brought his OW to our house, she would have seen pictures of our son, she would have seen my things - ie, the fact that this was a family-man she was playint with. Didn't it bother her??? Or did it just add to the excitement? Or did he tell her we were separated and she believed it? I know he did tell her that at one stage. Was she stupid? Did she just have no morals? I also know that he once asked her to marry him (I saw it in writing) - did he promise her they'd get married after he separated/divorced me? Or did it thrill her to be with a married man so there would be no strings attached for her?

 

What goes on in the heads of the OW/OM? Do they believe they can make a relationship work with a person who has cheated on their existing spouse? I know it can work sometimes, but the stats are actually against them. So, what the..........???????

 

Another thing you said "I honestly feel that this is a pathological issue...he's totally whacked in the head, that's for damned sure" - is right in lots of cases. Probably in yours, and I'm sure in mine.

 

Fedup, I stayed in my relationship for years, despite how often this happened, despite all the evidence. I hoped against hope that we could work things out, I hoped against hope that he would change. Instead, I got more heartache. I did it because we had a small son and I was scared of being able to support him on my own. And I stayed because he had a knack for sweet-talking me into staying. Saying all the right things, saying he'd do anything, absolutely ANYTHING to work things out. He talked the talk, but never walked the walk.

 

I can't be sorry that I gave him a second chance (or third or fourth), but I am sorry he didn't live up to the challenge. Now I am working to be free of him and feel better about myself and life than I have in years.

[NotaBadGuy]

Fedup and Peakey,

 

It has been tough to realize why or how this could make me stronger. It has been pretty emotionally draining, but I am getting stronger and stronger every day. The hurdles have been there as they are with anyone. Either you leap over them, you let them knock you down only to get right back up, or you lay there. I chose to go right through them. Sometimes it is more of a challenge than others, but I make it.

 

I can't figure out why people get involved in this mess. Some give reasons, but there is no logical or moral reason for stepping out on your spouse. Divorce is always an option. And I don't understand those who do step out with the married person. The red flags and flashing lights should be going off in thier mind. If this person is going to do it to them, then are they going to do it to me kind of rational. Maybe it is a commitment issue in some instances.

 

The person messing with the married person knows there are no strings attached outside getting a piece of tail every now and then. From there it may move into more. But either party in those situations can have each other. And like it was mentioned, they deserve each other. What comes around does go around. I subscribe to that belief myself. I may never see it, but it does eventually work out that way.

 

In my situation, I do not want to see my ex get hurt, but she will be if she continues down the road she has chosen. That is her choice though. I know I am better off now without her. Luckily, I ended up getting out of this mess pretty unscathed. Damage to my pride and my trust were costly, but it could have been a heck of a lot worse. I just wish I could have seen the signs from the beggining. It would have saved me alot of time and heartache.

[Fedup&givingup]

That's what has dawned on me...my husband is a chronic sweet talker, but his actions are worthless. I think about our circumstances, and it's so apparent that it makes me want to throw up.

 

The actions are what count. I don't know if this makes any sense, but him having me with him is VERY much a part of his selfish, narcisstic way. He wants me for his reasons, but they aren't pure reasons.

 

We've been discussing a lot over these past few days, and WOW, do I have alot to share! The more he tries to explain himself and defend himself, the more he gives away. He was saying how everyone likes him, how he's a "good guy"...that's the image he wants and craves from others. In his mind, no one would believe that he's treated me the way he's done, and that I will look like some raging lunatic.

 

Also, I pressed the issue of having him take a polygraph. He said he would do it, but that afterwards, no matter what the outcome is he was leaving me! LOL As if that's not a dead give away. I said to him, "Well, if you have been telling me the truth, and taking a polygraph test could put an end to my suspicions, wouldn't that be the right way to go in our marriage and continue?" He's such an idiot. He says how humiliated he would be...like I'm not humiliated that he's been carrying on like he has with God knows who for 6.5 years.

 

Wouldn't you know it....he confessed to having cheated on the one girlfriend he had for 9 years because she had cheated on him. I asked him did he tell her, and how did HE know that she had cheated on him...it's a boring story, and the details are needless, really. This is the ex girlfriend that he's been keeping touch with-the one that I found the e-mail he had sent to her, etc.

 

He doesn't care about me getting call activity for his cell phone, yet he made sure he chimed up when I said I was going to get the call activity for the land line I made the call to him from...that bothered him. That indicates that he met up with this woman somewhere, and there was no phone contact made from his cell phone.

 

I could go on and on, but there's no point...I know what I need to do, and it's time I did it. It's a dead end, and as long as you stay in this type of relationship knowing about it, you ask what you get for.

[jenny]

have you looked any books or sites on narcisstic disorder? i've seen some great ones, but also some irresponsible ones. i'll try to send you some good links later, and i'm betting that people here might have some good book suggestions as well. you can goggle it for checklists, or dynamics to watch for, if i remember correctly.

 

i obviously don't know if you husband is a narcisst himself, i don't know too much about the disorder, but your story seemed sort of familar in terms of its emotional pattern - anyway, if nothing else, reading about other women who have 'survived and thrived' this kind of thing might help.

[jenny]

sorry, i should footnote my last comment. that's the kind of thing that makes for bad karma; i'd come back as a badly edited version of the king james. anyway, i was using the term narcisstic quite erroneously until another poster here - blockhead - clued me in one the proper use. so, anyway, the preceding perspective is not one i should imply credit for.

 

i think the following site is pretty good, but i don't really know. this forum has a ton of people who are better versed in this stuff; but this is a place to start, anyway.

 

http://www.mentalhealth.com/dis/p20-pe07.html

 

and maybe

 

http://www.narcissistic-personality-disorder.com/

 

now, again, i'm not sure how useful these sites will be to you. you certainly cannot diagnose this sort of thing, but maybe reading about it will help *you*.

 

i'm always a little wary of these kind of things, because i'm always pretty sure i've dated someone with whatever disorder i'm looking up; the guidelines are sometimes a wee bit er...encompassing. but anyway, the do sometimes help. i used to have a *lot* of anger at my upcoming mother in law until i read through some sites on mental illness; they can help.