How to stay sane while wife is making decision?

[2sunny]

2sunny are you having a bad day or something? Just gotta ask? The last 2 days you've stepped in to about 10 threads and in each one of them you almost always suggested divorce or were quite harsh towards the posters. Not trying to provoke you but your posting style hasn't usually been this raw.

 

Like I said earlier Surfer, if you want some, go get it... bite the pillow _____!

 

since you seem to know my style - it should be easy to understand that i don't encourage posters to put up with completely unacceptable and disrespectful behavior that completely disregards the posters best interest.

 

the written word is what we have here... and it really appears that surfers wife could use an adjustment period to get a sense of the chaos she keeps creating... and maybe that surfer isn't diggin' her entitled attitude. but she may never get that idea if there are no consequences for her bad behavior.

 

when it looks way out of balance - and the people involved aren't doing actions to change what's in the best interest for a healthy relationship - i don't encourage any poster to go back for more of the same (being treated like crap and expecting THAT to look normal).

 

in any case - i surely hope surfer is enjoying his special day - and celebrating the way that makes him happy!

[whguy]

Surfer, I feel compelled to respond to your thread. I generally tend to lurk on these forums more than post. I guess you could call me "recovered", but at this time, 3-4 years ago I wasn't too far from where you're at. I must be honest and say that I tend to look back at the forums to gauge how far I've come and to make sure I don't make the same mistakes in my past that got me in my own personal hell. Trust me - I know how you feel, being in limbo is not fun.

 

My story involves my XW / college sweetheart that I married in 2001. We were married for 5 years (together an additional 2) when she got involved with a guy at work (20 years her senior...YIKES). I had a few suspicions but went with trust and believed her that nothing was going on. She came clean of her own accord in January 2007. Very similar to you, she did all the right things and appeared to be doing all the right things for a while. Fast forward 4 months later, when the cell bill came and I realized she had spent the entire month of April calling him (2-3 times per day, don't think he answered - he had moved on). In hindsight, she had violated ALL of my criteria for us to move on - she had contacted him (which was my #1, "unbreakable" criteria), she continued to put her work first (which was what got her into this mess), and a few other things simlar to groundrules others mention.

 

Anyway - enough about those details - when I found out what was transpiring, I packed my bags and left. GREAT, right? Well, until 4 hours later when I got talked into coming back. From that point on, the marriage was dead, but get this - it took me another YEAR after that to get it. Now mind you, I was working full time and going to school 3/4 time, so I didn't have to "live" it at the time, and I found plenty to keep me busy because home life was MISERABLE!

 

But then, sometime in spring, 2008, something clicked. Told me that I was YOUNG (31 at the time) and living in limbo was keeping me from my potential. I walked out the door at that point, found a new place to live, and for the next year, she pursued me HARD. Really started doing what perhaps needed doing to win me back. I started getting the respect that I needed, and she did what needed doing.

 

So all was right, right? Nope. I was done. I walked away, and for the most part, never looked back (ok, one slip-up a couple months later). It was honestly too late for us by then, I knew it deep inside and too much damage had been done. As I had shared, I came to the realization that the marriage died in 2006 with the A, was on life support in 2007 until May, and then dead after that.

 

Why do I tell you all this? Because I get it. You're a good guy (as am I), you wanted to give it your best, you really care(d) about her, annd you can't walk away because of the dream of fixing and making things right. Throw logic out the window. Think about the saying - if you love it let it go, if it returns to you, its yours forever, if it leaves, it never was yours to begin with. Now, put yourself in an active role on this and let yourself go - I honestly think a trial separation is in order. As bizarre as it is, the person who cares the least has the most power in a relationship. CLAIM this power, buddy! Let her come back to you and then make the decision down the road. Don't throw your life away!!!

 

It sucks! For a time, and then you realize that there's a whole life out there and somebody to love you fully (maybe this will be your W). But, you'll never know until you make your move. Now, I suggest like everybody that this happens soon for you, but dude, it's going to happen on your time, just start thinking and planning and visualizing where you see yourself down the road and then take the steps to make this happen.

 

As for my happy ending, I started dating my now-fiancee in 2009. Maybe it was pretty soon after the "marriage" ended, but we're 2 1/2 years past that (and our friendship preceded that). Our wedding is next month and life is GOOD!

 

I shudder to think about where I would have been if I hadn't made some hard choices, so I just encourage you strongly to do what you need to do. Seriously, think long and hard. Take a trip solo and get away from the situation. I had the benefit of a 2 week overseas trip as part of my schooling to think my life over and it was literally a week after that that I made my move. You got this!

 

And, a very HAPPY BIRTHDAY!

 

These people here know their s***, seriously, listen to them. I offer you two stories for people who played it right, with two different endings. You know What Next, who I have a great deal of respect for. This one ended different, but was played damn near perfectly: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t223103/

 

Good luck surfer. Empower youself buddy. Nice and strong are not exlusive words!

[Surfer203]

Thanks all - birthday was good. Had a nice dinner and drinks.. had a MC session prior to the dinner actually. My therapist went for 1.5 hours because we were getting deep into stuff. Which was nice. We have addressed some issues.. and discussed the need for balance in both of our lives. We are way out of balance. Lots of things to think about and work on. Wife treated me great for my birthday. Sex did not happen.. wife began to cry when I started making moves. She is still stuck since having that procedure, the thought of it upsets her and it never happens. She has apologized because we have not been intimate for a while. I told her that it's okay, I will be patient but she needs to figure out how to become comfortable again - I think she just has to jump in and do it. Anyway, it was a good day all in all - weekend should be alright too. I will probably not post until next week, nothing eventful going on. Hopefully next week we will have some sort of action or interesting update. Thanks again all.

 

whguy: Thanks for sharing your tale. I hear you loud and clear.. sounds like you came out on the other end even better! That is great news. It is inspiring for me to read, gives me confidence that if I choose to end it then I will be fine. Still undecided but time is ticking. Thanks man.

[2sunny]

what procedure?

 

what would keep her from showing you love and affection? is she not capable of a back rub? a bj? kissing? doing errands for you? cleaning the house/doing laundry/making meals?

 

how about a warm, long hug? a connected conversation?

 

are those things she's incapable of?

 

fwy - INTIMACY is completely different than the act of sex!

[turnera]

I have to agree. As someone who's done my share of taking care of H when I didn't want to because I know it's a strong need for him, it's not always ABOUT what you 'feel' like doing. And if it becomes a habit, then she is becoming selfish. Face that in MC.

[Surfer203]

About two months ago she had an abnormal pap smear.. they had to biopsy three parts of her cervix.. turned out to be an abnormality - nothing really. Since then, she is upset about being intimate. She tried to please herself but couldn't. Her therapist thinks it may have affected her like a sexual assault would. Now the question is how can she get over this?

 

We did make out last night for a bit and were quite affectionate. We do hug.. there is some emotional/romantic connection but it is considerably less than it used to be.

 

I did mention this to my IC he thinks I should try and be gentle and patient.. which I am trying to do. No luck so far.

[2sunny]

two months? hmmmm, even major surgery allows six weeks for healing time... she should be totally healed at this point.

 

is it possible she's avoiding this for some other reason?

 

do you feel she's being honest with you?

Edited July 1, 2011 by 2sunny

[Surfer203]

Yes I do believe her. She was not supposed to have sex for 1 week. Then we began fighting about other stuff. So that soured the mood for sex for a while. Now that things have toned down a bit I have tried to initiate a few times and she just won't go for it. She broke down crying 2-3 times when I tried. I totally believe her. I just don't know what I can do to help her. I think that aspect is really missing and hindering our relationship.

[2sunny]

Yes I do believe her. She was not supposed to have sex for 1 week. Then we began fighting about other stuff. So that soured the mood for sex for a while. Now that things have toned down a bit I have tried to initiate a few times and she just won't go for it. She broke down crying 2-3 times when I tried. I totally believe her. I just don't know what I can do to help her. I think that aspect is really missing and hindering our relationship.

 

so - one week turned into two months.

 

sounds like guilt may be playing a big part of it - especially since she can't "get there" on her own. the main thing that keeps most from getting there on their own - is stemmed in the mind. often guilt... or betrayal of some sort...

[Mr.Harris]

All the more reason why you should divorce her. It doesn't take two months. She should be healed by now. And she's the one getting upset. She continues to be selfish to no end. Many cheaters are known to use medical as a "reason" to escape sex. She will not change. Soon this rejection will turn into months. Don't be like all of these other husbands who only get sex twice a year.

[Surfer203]

2sunny: Yeah.. one week of "no sex" she was told. But the fighting started around then and that turned things nasty.

 

You are right, she is feeling massive guilt. I am sure it all ties on to her infidelity.

 

How to help her?

 

Mr.Harris: We know she is healed, she is not saying she is not healed yet. She is saying she is uncomfortable with it for some reason. Maybe she felt violated in a sense and does not know how to deal with those feelings. I won't let it go on forever, I am going to have her talk to her therapist or our MC about this.. maybe even her Doctor who performed this procedure.

[turnera]

Yes I do believe her. She was not supposed to have sex for 1 week. Then we began fighting about other stuff. So that soured the mood for sex for a while. Now that things have toned down a bit I have tried to initiate a few times and she just won't go for it. She broke down crying 2-3 times when I tried. I totally believe her. I just don't know what I can do to help her. I think that aspect is really missing and hindering our relationship.

Normally, I tell the husband to ramp up his work in making it a great marriage, because the woman has to feel emotionally connected to you to want to do it. But in your case, I think she's just gone down into a sinkhole of selfishness and "I deserve what I want," and you're never going to get her out of that without you willing to walk, to snap her out of it.

[Surfer203]

turnera: I am sure that is a big part of it at this point. I am doing my best. May not be good enough though. Last night we were both drunk and still, no go. Makes me feel pretty awful.. and I am sure it feeds into my anger and bad moods.

[FreeNow]

How to help her?

 

You can't. She has to seek help and do all that is required to work through things.

 

The more you try to help her, the more you set her back.

 

 

It looks like a good ol' positive feedback system to me. She draws away/behaves less than ideal, you try to help her even more, she pulls further away/escapes more. The product is driving production.

 

Ever notice that when you stop trying to help and simply do your own thing that she starts to behave better? That's a huge clue right there. Review your thread (just your own posts) and it might be evident.

[2sunny]

The more you try to help her, the more you set her back.

 

 

It looks like a good ol' positive feedback system to me. She draws away/behaves less than ideal, you try to help her even more, she pulls further away/escapes more. The product is driving production.

 

Ever notice that when you stop trying to help and simply do your own thing that she starts to behave better? That's a huge clue right there. Review your thread (just your own posts) and it might be evident.

 

yep, making her comfortable just keeps her bad behavior looking acceptable.

 

once she gets the idea that you aren't going to take her crappy behavior anymore - the sooner she'll stop acting so entitled... and the sooner you stop handing all your power to reacting and over reacting to how she is behaving badly.

 

sometimes - doing nothing is something. don't do a thing for her - stay neutral and unaffected - stay in a place of not having any expectations.

 

pretend as if she doesn't exist... see how that works out... you can be at peace if you stop handing her so much power with your expectations.

[worldgonewrong]

2sunny is spot on.

Whenever I pull it together enough to be 'indifferent' and all business-like,

my wife becomes more "please" and "thank you" and deferential, in baby steps.

(not that I'm holding my breath, re my situation.)

[2themoon&back]

2themoon: Yikes.. thanks for those reminders, reading that I envision everything you typed.. it was upsetting but you know what? I have made peace with all of that already - I took her back knowing all of that, giving her a chance. She is not living up to it this time around. So.. we go from here

 

Sorry Surfer,

 

 

I know my post seems and is explicit and harsh:eek:… there was a reason for that.

 

It just seems that the OM still sleeps between you one way or the other; you might as well see him there.

 

I know you may think you have made peace with it by taking her back, but I feel you may have done this prematurely, before you really processed it in your mind, because you were blinded by the need to have her in your life.

 

One thing I know for sure about the things I have said … the images you may have seen in your mind as you read my post …have not made peace with you (you lack of being able to control your temper :mad:or control the situation that keeps handling you:confused:) and from what you are saying nor has your wife made peace with them (ie-the large amount of guilt :ono sexual contact—to me this is also a sign she is disconnecting from you).

 

Some one here said something that needs repeating and I hope that if I bugger it up they will come and fix it….. (I believe it was Untouchable Fire that said this … but not sure)

 

It goes something like this…” after infidelity it seems hard to leave but with time gets easier.

 

On the other hand it seems easy to stay but with time that gets harder”!!!!!

 

These words are soooooo true and should be repeated often on this site. I believe resentment and guilt being two of the major factors in the above statement along with a lot of other things.

 

I tend to believe things would have turned out differently if you would not have moved your wife back in your home immediately after the affair, but that has already happened.

 

To me it’s like buying a horse and putting him in the living room until you build the barn …. He is going to mess up some sh^#... so has this affair… no need to bring it home until you can deal with it properly.

 

One day (and I for one hope it is soon) I hope you see how many people you have never met care more how you are treated than you do or your wife for that matter and it will click and you will act in a way that is not comfortable for you or your wife, so that change can take place and will take place.

 

I realize nothing will change until you’re ready, and I think you are closer than you are willing to admit… but don’t let that stop you, we are not judging you … just trying guide you in areas we have all been and help you get off to a good start at taking better care of surfer.

 

Remember one must be uncomfortable to change…. No one ever took off a pair of shoes because they felt too good.

Edited July 2, 2011 by 2themoon&back

[LifesontheUp]

The more this goes on I keep thinking of the saying "doing the same thing over and over expecting different results is insanity."

 

So when are you going to change?

 

Like I said before, your wife is doing just enough to keep you sweet whenever you lose it with her or raise what you're not happy with. Its a pattern Surfer. Why not break that pattern?

 

You can do it, deep down you know you can. Take control Surfer, take control.

[2sunny]

maybe she's still having sex with her OM? ask Pierre... his GF wasn't interested and acted guilty and he swore she couldn't be cheating... until he found out she absolutely was cheating.

 

it happens... a lot of gals won't have sex with the man because they are doing someone else.

 

they feel guilty - like they are betraying the OM by having sex with hubby.

 

it's possible... ask her!

[John Michael Kane]

maybe she's still having sex with her OM? ask Pierre... his GF wasn't interested and acted guilty and he swore she couldn't be cheating... until he found out she absolutely was cheating.

 

it happens... a lot of gals won't have sex with the man because they are doing someone else.

 

they feel guilty - like they are betraying the OM by having sex with hubby.

 

it's possible... ask her!

 

Of course she's still cheating. Look at his posts describing how utterly selfish she is. If it were up to me I'd file for divorce, rip up her Green Card and send her packing back to where she came from.

 

Return to Sender.

[What_Next]

The sex thing, I mean come on, what a complete and utter pile of horse___. Lord man, even if there was a health reason she could give you a BJ or 30... For god's sake.

 

It's done man. She has ZERO respect for you, she has no intentions of showing any remorse, hell has she even mentioned getting a job recently? sorry bud, I have tried to support you as best as I can, but you seemed destined to continue this torture this evil (yes I think she is acting that way) woman is putting you through.

 

Kick her a$$ out, tell her to get lost and don't come back until she straightens the hell up. She must have lots of 'friends' because she seems to like going out with them and partying on your dime.

 

Enough is enough, stand up STRAIGHT and deal with this crap. Stop the insanity.

[John Michael Kane]

He's been gone for a few days. Maybe he's finally standing up for himself.

[Surfer203]

Well.. before addressing any comments, I will say this was a F'ed up weekend. Horrible. I can't even type it all out. The majority of it was fighting, actually Sunday was spent fighting until after midnight. I told her to put all of her effort in to this marriage or to pack her s*** and get out. Her attitude has seemed to change quite a bit already, but only time will tell.

 

I am so upset that I don't even want to talk about it on here. This could be a turning point. Let's see... that was my last effort, that was it.

 

Tonight I have therapy.. I also talked to the first person outside of therapy, one of my brothers. It was good to finally tell some one.

 

I am at work now and need to buckle down a bit.. I will try to post more later on.

[Surfer203]

2sunny: She is not having sex with anyone especially OM. We live over an hour away from the city where this loser lives. She has not gone to the city with out me also, he has threatened her in the past, she wants nothing to do with him and admits he was a huge mistake.

 

Regarding what every one else is saying.. You guys are right, I put my foot down and mentioned other things that need to change. This is her last chance, let's see if she follows through. I did make plans for myself for this coming weekend, she was not included in them.

[debtman]

Nice job surfer. Sorry the weekend turned out bad, but, if you don't lay all your cards out, she'll never know how you really feel and what your expectations and needs really are.

Sounds like you're taking some of the advice you've gotten on here. However it works out, you'll come out of this fine and will be a better person because of it.

 

Good luck and keep posting...