This particular BS' point of view

[turnstone]

Ok you sound cross to me. So I'll bear that in mind.

Cross? Hmmm, ok.

 

To spell out the both ways thing, it makes no sense to say at one and the same time that:

 

the WS caused the hurt of the BS by their actions

 

and

 

the BS didn't cause the pain and hurt actions of their WS's infidelity by their actions

 

(if you believe the cause and effect of the former, you have no reason to disbelieve it in the latter)

 

either you believe in cause and effect in a fairly simple way, or you believe things are more beautiful and complex.

 

I go for beautiful and complex. But then I'm a fool I guess...

 

Nowhere did I contradict myself. Although my explanation was obviously too complex.

 

Let me spell it out in simpler terms -

 

A person's actions are purely voluntary. They are never caused by another person's actions.

 

A person's feelings can be caused by another person's actions.

 

So -

 

A BS's actions can hurt a WS.

 

Whatever a BS has done to their WS, however much they have hurt their WS, is no excuse for the WS's affair.

 

A WS's affair can hurt a BS.

 

A BS's actions are still voluntary.

 

If an affair was a caused by a WS being hurt by their BS, then it would be totally find if s/he murdered her/his WS once s/he found out about it.

 

Is that clearer?

[wheelwright]

I would feel bad if I cheated and my H was hurt as a result - even if I felt that the A benefitted me in some way. I would feel bad if I neglected some aspects of my homelife obsessing about my lover. All of this feeling bad about the actual or potential feelings of others is a problem for me. Takes time away from things I'd rather be doing, feeling, experiencing.

 

I guess I'm selfish in a different way than that used to typically characterize "cheaters". I see no point to borrowing trouble.

 

Seems quite a sound way of thinking to me.

[seren]

When, in the dim and distant past, H asked me to marry him, I took a long time to say yes. I din't necessarily feel the need for a marriage to agree to be with him - but he wanted us to show the world and it's dog that he loved me, I, he and so we married. I did not take my vows lightly, I meant each and every word, or I wouldn't have said them.

 

I stuck around through some pretty dark days, supported H in his career in the military, we brought up our son, made plans. You get the gist. I did this because I had his back, so to speak, and he mine, we were a team, a lovely, lovely team - so I thought. Then the awful days before the A, the second guessing what was going on, why it had all changed.

 

Then D Day, relief that I knew what was going on, relief that I had a choice - stay or go - forgive or walk? No hystronics, threats, nada, but I was finally in on the big secret that was making my day to day life so crap. I had a choice, H had a choice, we made the decision to stay and reconcile, which we have very nicely.

 

Was/am I bitter? Well no, I accept some of the responsibility for the erosion of our marriage before the A, I don't accept the responsibility for the big C, which added to the strain on our marriage or H's PTSD after Iraq, but not paying attention, yep, I will own some of that. Owning the A? You have to be kidding me! Having any part at all in the A, nope, to own a part of an action you have to be aware of the action you are agreeing to take part in -

 

I had no knowledge of the A, obviously, when I did, I had a choice. Levelling the playing field. The BS knowing is usually what prompts the results of a D Day, and not many of us knowingly share our marriage or husband's with another woman. It's why the WS works so hard to keep it all under wraps, fear of consequences.

 

Well if we all owned that our actions have consequences, maybe more OP would be a bit more demanding of the AP and say, either leave or find me when you have and not settle for being hidden - frankly it is disrespectful of the WS to even expect either to be at their beck and call. I would make such a crap OW as I sure wouldn't share. Now I might be a bitter OW in those circumstances.

[wheelwright]

Nowhere did I contradict myself. Although my explanation was obviously too complex.

 

Let me spell it out in simpler terms - OK

 

A person's actions are purely voluntary. They are never caused by another person's actions.

 

In law, a person might kill another to prevent a disaster. This would be both a voluntary and caused action. Just to show it's not so simple. Many other examples possible.

 

A person's feelings can be caused by another person's actions.

 

Yes

 

So -

 

A BS's actions can hurt a WS.

 

I think you mean pre A. Yep.

 

Whatever a BS has done to their WS, however much they have hurt their WS, is no excuse for the WS's affair.

 

Don't agree. May be true sometimes even often. Depends on the power R between, the extent of hurt, and the dynamic. I can think of so many exceptions.

 

A WS's affair can hurt a BS.

 

Yep.

 

A BS's actions are still voluntary.

 

If an affair was a caused by a WS being hurt by their BS, then it would be totally find if s/he murdered her/his WS once s/he found out about it.

 

No, but it would be fine if she had a revenge A, or something else legal.

 

And more than that, you are conflating here moral issues to do with feeling bad and taking actions to make your life better, and feeling bad and taking actions to make other's lives worse.

 

Anyway, as in many moral situations, depends on purpose.

 

If you meant to kill, well.

 

If you killed in passion, there may be lee way.

 

Is that clearer?

 

 

Hope I am clear. Answers in bold.

[turnstone]

No, but it would be fine if she had a revenge A, or something else legal.

Oh my God, I was being sarcastic! You didn't get that. You really think it would be fine if the BS had a revenge affair? What is revenge if its not " feeling bad and taking actions to make other's lives worse."?

 

Please, don't feel you have to answer, I'm out of the discussion as I utterly disagree with all of your stance and it seems that won't change.