Trust issues - girl's number on phone and late calls

[mrsgump]

Hi

 

In a nutshell, I'm having trust issues with my husband.

 

I got really pissed off with him when he came home on sat morning at 5 am after going out clubbing. That was the second time in two months. I'm annoyed because I gave him an earful after the first time and he did it again. I'm also annoyed because I don't go out clubbing with my friends because I know he wouldn't like it, so I expect him to do the same for me. The latest I'll come home is on the last train and in bed by one.

 

It makes me feel really uncomfortable when he goes out dancing without me, particularly as we barely go out together for fun stuff like clubbing. Very rarely, probably twice in the past two years that we've been married.

 

I'm sure the trust issues stem from me finding out one week after our honeymoon that he had slept with someone while we were engaged. We were long distance at the time, he slept with this girl three times, had spent two nights with her, went out clubbing and for dinner with her.

 

You can't imagine how much that cut me up. As tempting as it was to get divorced I decided to stay, funny how it would have made all the difference if I'd found out before marriage, but after marriage it's like you've already made that official commitment and I wanted to give it a go. But believe me, it was really really hard and I did not take it well.

 

What made it worse is how much he lied about everything. He denied everything, lied about it all, it was so much hard work to get him to admit to anything. Luckily I was in touch with the girl he'd slept with and she told me everything I wanted and needed to know.

 

So, two years forward, I still don't feel I can trust him. At the back of my mind I worry that it will happen again, and if it will, I wish it would happen sooner rather than later, so I can put everything behind me and get on with life. He lies about little things, like watching porn (I think this is almost acceptable!) but also going out and drinking after work. There are things I find out months later like fights at work and drinking lots before he fell asleep on the train home and ended up far away (he led me to believe he was working SO late and hard, then later mentioned that actually he'd drunk SO much that night after work).

 

Yesterday, after the clubbing incident, I decided to check his phone. He deletes most of his messages so there was nothing incriminating there (I think this is a general tidy habit), but in his phone log there are calls to and from a girl that were at 3am and 5 am, probably a couple of weeks apart.

 

I don't know who this girl is... I tried calling from a blocked number just to check it's a girl but she didn't answer. I'm tempted to call with some stupid excuse like I found a phone to find out how she knows him. I feel actually making that call is really taking my suspicions to a whole new level. Of course he'd be pissed off if he realises I've been calling numbers from his phone... but I also don't want to ask him, we're still a bit sore from the loud arguments over this weekend.

 

We definitely have trust issues and he really doesn't help himself by lying about stupid things. If he can lie about stupid things then why would I believe he would tell me more important things? I've already explained this all to him and he says he understands but evidently he does not. No kids on the scene, but I know there won't be any until I can really believe everything this man tells me.

 

Another issue, probably linked to the cheating but also my own fault too, is that I always end up yelling and screaming when we argue. I know he really doesn't like that. He can accept that I am right to be upset with him, but we both agree that doesn't give me the right to scream at him. I just don't know how to control myself. It's not constructive and I really put him down and get really mean. I think it's because after he cheated I felt completely validated to scream and shout at him, but now when there are other things that upset me I just automatically bypass all the constructive ways of arguing and skip to screaming. It's not good for either of us.

 

I find this really difficult to discuss candidly with my friends. Maybe because I'm worried that they will all encourage me to leave, or at least think it, just for the cheating.

 

Obviously it's easy to talk about the bad stuff, but he has a lot of good qualities too, he knows how to take care of me, he's open with his emotions and how much he loves me, he's generous (although he doesn't have much money, his heart is in the right place), he goes out of his way for my family, he's a hard worker. We're both 28 and I was always anti-marriage before I met him, he completely won me over... so the cheating was a really big shock :-(

 

I'd like to think we can sort everything out longterm, but sometimes I do wonder if we are right for each other. Overall we are quite a good functional couple, but there are cracks.

 

And should I call the girl??

[Green]

Bottom line you have no TRUST for this man. You should just leave him. Your gut is most likely 100% spot on and he is some how cheating on you. You don't need proof other then he has done it in the past and that he continues to act shady and have ZERO respect.

[PegNosePete]

Welcome to the site, but sorry you find yourself here

 

There are certainly a lot of red flags flying in your relationship.

 

You mention that he deletes text messages, this is definitely NOT a good sign!!! A "reformed" cheater should do everything possible to reassure you that he can be trusted. This behaviour is bound to raise suspicion, especially in the context of his past.

 

He goes out clubbing without you, against your wishes, but will not allow you to do the same? Again, as a "reformed" cheater he should be doing everything he possibly can to reassure you. He should consider your feelings. He is clearly not doing this.

 

Calling girls late at night, now this is the biggest of the red flags! Someone who is supposedly a reformed cheater would never even consider doing this, without telling his wife first. Even if it's all innocent, it is so totally suspicious that he should not be making you feel this way.

 

You mention he lies about "stupid things"... do you mean in the past, or is it ongoing behaviour? What kind of things? Lying is a really really bad sign, especially for a so-called reformed cheater.

 

After discovering your spouse cheated, what has he done to put your mind at rest that it won't happen again? There are certain steps that are often recommended, have you implemented any of these? They would be:

1) No contact ever again with the other woman.

2) He will commit 100% to your marriage, whatever you ask of him he will do without question.

3) He will be totally transparent in all his communications, all emails, text messages and phone calls will be open to your eyes, you will have all of his passwords.

4) You will go to marriage counselling.

 

Those rules should be totally non-negotiable. If he breaks them or won't agree to them, then he is not as remorseful as he seems, and your marriage is doomed to failure.

[quankanne]

frankly, this guy doesn't seem to be mature enough to handle the challenges of marriage if he's still acting like he's single. And it's not going to stop unless he's willing to leave that lifestyle behind to focus on the marriage.

 

I totally get not wanting to shxt-can a relationship you feel can still work, but honey, it doesn't look good at this stage. He can be the best person in the world to you, but there are certain elements of a marriage that cannot be messed with, like putting self before "us" by continuing to live the life of a single person, like having secret relationships ...

 

your best recourse is to get into a marital counseling or enrichment program so that BOTH of you are on the same page about what your marriage relationship entails. Maybe he just needs educating ... or maybe it's time to cut him loose ... and the program will help y'all figure that out.

 

best of luck to you, I know how frustrating it is to get your little donkey in line, I went round and round with mine until he finally offered to go for a marriage enrichment weekend through my church. And it made a HUGE difference in our outlook.

[mrsgump]

He did point out during our recent argument that he hasn't said anything when I went on holiday without him, and I did go out clubbing without him and to a bar with my friends. I told him about these nights out and he's right, he didn't give me a hard time about it at all. But back at home and 'real life' I wouldn't go clubbing without him. Admittedly his late nights out were one-offs, but I dislike it enough to confront him about it.

 

Just to point out, it was never my intention to go on holidays without him, but I've always been a seasoned traveller (that's how we met) and after over a year of no holidays because he couldn't afford it, I told him that if he still hadn't saved enough for the following summer then I was going without him, which I did.

 

He has been on holiday without me to visit his family which was fine by me.

 

He has been relatively transparent, I have his hotmail password, but not his facebook password. There is no password on his phone but it's an unspoken rule that we don't check each other's phone.

 

That reminds me, I should request his fb password.

 

He did cut off contact with the other woman. Annoyingly for me, she was on his facebook as a friend. He also had her number on his phone and had kept loosely in touch with her by email afterwards but that had all fizzled out by the time I found out (she confirmed this).

 

He lies about stupid things. After finding out he cheated, I was really sensitive about him watching porn. Particularly when sometimes I would check the history to see he'd been browsing porn for up to three hours at a time! I pretty much banned him from watching any. That was a long time ago. I checked his phone a few months ago and saw he'd been watching porn on his phone. That doesn't bother me so much now, particularly as long as it's not on the laptop. So I asked him casually if he watches porn on his phone, and I told him it's fine if he does. He started with yes and that was fine, I was happy that he was telling me the truth. Then he changed it to no, because we'd blocked that setting on his phone. I questioned why he said yes, then no. Could I check his phone? Sure, but then actually, no he said angrily, why should I get to check his phone? He got really defensive and angry about it. It was really obvious he was lying even if I didn't already know it! I asked him about it days later too, and he insisted he hadn't watched porn on his phone. I never admitted that I already knew he did.

 

On sat when he went out, he said it was a workmate's stag do. He's only been there for a few weeks so I know it's not a close friend. He said they're meeting at the work place, then going somewhere else. He was tired so he was only going to the drinks and leave at about midnight. I didn't hear anything else from him that night. I woke up at 4am and called him, it rang but no answer. I only heard from him at 4.30 when he was on the bus home. It also pisses me off that he didn't think to let me know about his change of plans, another thing we have previously discussed.

 

Anyway, when we discussed/argued about it later, he said that they stayed at the same place the whole night. Then he later accidentally mentioned that he's only been clubbing without me twice. I asked if he went clubbing on sat night, he said not exactly, he was referring to the same bar they were at as a club. Details details, I don't know. I asked him where he went exactly, he said 'oh let me think... we met there, we went to another place, then we went back to that place'. I don't know, I get the feeling he's lying. There's not much point in me asking a million questions because I'm not going to get any proof.

 

Also, as I mentioned in the first post, he told me that his last workplace would close at about 3am, but then his boss asked him to stay and do a lot of work and he left work at 8am. That's why he was tired and fell asleep on the train home. 'Really?' I asked 'you had to stay until 8??' yes he insisted. Months later, after he'd been drinking, he mentioned how much he used to drink after work, they'd close the restaurant and they'd all drink as staff could drink as much as they want and they would all drink SO much. That would also explain why he came home puking one morning, when he insisted he'd only had 4 foreign beers after work that didn't go down well with him - me admitted that he'd drunk SOOO much that night. I thought as much, but at the time he insisted otherwise. Thinking back, that would also explain another night when he'd gone out with a friend and was sick after drinking 'bad beers'. The thing is, I'm never harsh on him after he's been drinking too much, I always take care of him even when he tells me that he's drunk a lot. Obviously he knew I wouldn't be happy about him regularly leaving at 8am after drinking... but if it's pretty obvious, why doesn't he just say so???

 

Hm. I think overall he didn't seem as remorseful as he should have been after cheating on me. He'd still kept in touch with her for a while. We did go to counselling, but that was on my insistence. I cried many hours when I went to counselling for myself as well.

 

He doesn't know I've seen these late night calls yet...

[BellaBellaBella]

I am sorry I think your both a bit mature. If you want to have a marriage you don't make him save for the holiday, you save togather. Why have a marriage if your not going to travel togather. Working as a couple to spend off time togather makes sense.

 

As for the yelling, a thing that works for me who can be a yeller. Is to listen fully to my SO"s answers and then wait 10 seconds and form a calm answer.

This is called active listening.

 

It seems like there is a basic lack of respect on both sides. Have you considered counseling on your own and togather.

 

Also check out the emotional needs tests over at http://www.marriagebuilders.com.

 

If you truly want to be married to this man.

[chocha_mocha]

OP, its no wonder you feel insecure when he goes out till the earlier hours if he cheated on you previously. However, how can you be in a relationship with someone who you don't trust? I think you have valid reasons not to trust him, but that doesn't really help your relationship.

 

What do you like doing together? You say you don't go out much together, so maybe this is another reason why you feel uncomfortable about him going out. I think if me and my partner never when out yet he would often go out till 3am with others, I would probably feel somewhat jealous/envious. Plus you're not going out much yourself. I think a healthy social life in a relationship is so important, otherwise you run the risk of putting all you eggs in one basket and you become more focused on your partner than your own life.

 

So you're not going out much, going through his phone, phoning numbers to see if they are women etc - this behaviour is going to take a serious bashing to your self-esteem honey, you're worth more than that. Once your self-esteem goes, its very difficult to be happy in any relationship.

[hoping2heal]

Hi

 

In a nutshell, I'm having trust issues with my husband.

 

I got really pissed off with him when he came home on sat morning at 5 am after going out clubbing. That was the second time in two months. I'm annoyed because I gave him an earful after the first time and he did it again. I'm also annoyed because I don't go out clubbing with my friends because I know he wouldn't like it, so I expect him to do the same for me. The latest I'll come home is on the last train and in bed by one.

 

It makes me feel really uncomfortable when he goes out dancing without me, particularly as we barely go out together for fun stuff like clubbing. Very rarely, probably twice in the past two years that we've been married.

 

I'm sure the trust issues stem from me finding out one week after our honeymoon that he had slept with someone while we were engaged. We were long distance at the time, he slept with this girl three times, had spent two nights with her, went out clubbing and for dinner with her.

 

You can't imagine how much that cut me up. As tempting as it was to get divorced I decided to stay, funny how it would have made all the difference if I'd found out before marriage, but after marriage it's like you've already made that official commitment and I wanted to give it a go. But believe me, it was really really hard and I did not take it well.

 

What made it worse is how much he lied about everything. He denied everything, lied about it all, it was so much hard work to get him to admit to anything. Luckily I was in touch with the girl he'd slept with and she told me everything I wanted and needed to know.

 

So, two years forward, I still don't feel I can trust him. At the back of my mind I worry that it will happen again, and if it will, I wish it would happen sooner rather than later, so I can put everything behind me and get on with life. He lies about little things, like watching porn (I think this is almost acceptable!) but also going out and drinking after work. There are things I find out months later like fights at work and drinking lots before he fell asleep on the train home and ended up far away (he led me to believe he was working SO late and hard, then later mentioned that actually he'd drunk SO much that night after work).

 

Yesterday, after the clubbing incident, I decided to check his phone. He deletes most of his messages so there was nothing incriminating there (I think this is a general tidy habit), but in his phone log there are calls to and from a girl that were at 3am and 5 am, probably a couple of weeks apart.

 

I don't know who this girl is... I tried calling from a blocked number just to check it's a girl but she didn't answer. I'm tempted to call with some stupid excuse like I found a phone to find out how she knows him. I feel actually making that call is really taking my suspicions to a whole new level. Of course he'd be pissed off if he realises I've been calling numbers from his phone... but I also don't want to ask him, we're still a bit sore from the loud arguments over this weekend.

 

We definitely have trust issues and he really doesn't help himself by lying about stupid things. If he can lie about stupid things then why would I believe he would tell me more important things? I've already explained this all to him and he says he understands but evidently he does not. No kids on the scene, but I know there won't be any until I can really believe everything this man tells me.

 

Another issue, probably linked to the cheating but also my own fault too, is that I always end up yelling and screaming when we argue. I know he really doesn't like that. He can accept that I am right to be upset with him, but we both agree that doesn't give me the right to scream at him. I just don't know how to control myself. It's not constructive and I really put him down and get really mean. I think it's because after he cheated I felt completely validated to scream and shout at him, but now when there are other things that upset me I just automatically bypass all the constructive ways of arguing and skip to screaming. It's not good for either of us.

 

I find this really difficult to discuss candidly with my friends. Maybe because I'm worried that they will all encourage me to leave, or at least think it, just for the cheating.

 

Obviously it's easy to talk about the bad stuff, but he has a lot of good qualities too, he knows how to take care of me, he's open with his emotions and how much he loves me, he's generous (although he doesn't have much money, his heart is in the right place), he goes out of his way for my family, he's a hard worker. We're both 28 and I was always anti-marriage before I met him, he completely won me over... so the cheating was a really big shock :-(

 

I'd like to think we can sort everything out longterm, but sometimes I do wonder if we are right for each other. Overall we are quite a good functional couple, but there are cracks.

 

And should I call the girl??

 

My mind is a bit boggled.

 

Firstly, why does he go out clubbing with you? Why do you not go with him?

Secondly, you mention that you do not go out clubbing as it would bother him. So, he knows it would bother him to have you go out clubbing, yet he goes ahead and does it? Red flag

 

Thirdly, honesty is clearly not a value of his. If he is running around lying about little things all of the time, that is an indicator of a big problem, not just little lies.

 

I find myself utterly bewildered by you. You are like two people in this post. There is the one person who wants an honest and faithful relationship and if he can't provide it - you aren't taking his crap.

 

Then, there is the doormat who makes excuses for his behavior and doesn't want anyone to find out what is going on.

 

If he disclosed cheating on you and the two of you decided to move past it and keep the relationship then hey, that is your business and your decision. However, it is pretty clear that you haven't moved past it and neither has he. You admit you still have lingering trust issues, and he really isn't helping is he? Lying all of the time, taking off clubbing, phone calls at all hours of the morning to other women? No, I don't think he has moved past it either.

 

You could call the other woman if you wanted. Why is he not being asked about her?

[mrsgump]

Thanks for comments

 

I do go out with my friends, for dinner mainly or to their houses. He works in a restaurant so he always finishes late, and he usually doesn't want to go out on his days off, not to restaurants or clubbing. But he does go out late sometimes with his friends to drink at theirs or to pubs, I've never kicked up a big fuss when he gets home at 3 after drinking at a pub. The main reason we don't go out together is time clashes, and I appreciate that he wants to see his friends when he finds the time, I just don't want him to go clubbing without me. Clubs are different to dinner or drinking at a friend's place or pubs.

 

I do want to go with him, especially to clubs because I enjoy it. The most recent time was a stag do, so guys only. The time before that he went out with a married friend and his wife, and I was annoyed that he didn't invite me as I would have loved to join them.

 

Hopingtoheal - yes exactly, he's started doing things that he knows will upset me but he does it anyway. Not good. Even worse is that he does it without letting me know how late he'll be back.

 

Yes, I've begun to realise that he lies about lots of little things. But where to draw the line? Everyone tells little lies to some extent. It's only know that I'm seeing the buildup of the little lies in to some really big. I don't know how much else I don't know.

 

And you're right, I am like these two people. I do want a loving honest relationship... but I need to know the whole story. I'm not going to divorce him because he came home at 5am and lies about drinking too much (not yet anyway). I need to know the extent of his lies before I can know if it's time to get him out of my life. There's a big difference about him lying about drinking after work because he was afraid I'd be annoyed he was drinking so late or if he was actually sleeping with someone else!! If it's minor then he should be able to tell me this stuff so I stop worrying about what it could be, but if it's major then obviously it's time to call it quits.

 

We did want to move on from the cheating, but it's easier said than done, and it is NOW that I'm realising that we still have trust issues. Major ones.

 

The girl - you'd think it's easier just to ask him, and then I could tell from his reaction if he's lying or not. But if he's lying (which I expect he will if there was something going on), I'm never going to find out the real truth from him. I already know this from all the denial and lies when he cheated on me.

 

I have called the number but it's switched off now. Probably didn't like all the calls from private numbers! I've sent a text message from my real number asking them to call me back because it's urgent.