Don't even know how to begin.

[ItsNeverForever]

Curls...

 

Others have already said it, but I will, too:

 

Why does he want to keep the door open? Because he can. But he only wants it open far enough to get what he wants - this is "all your fault" after all, he never wanted it, blah blah blah...un-hunh, and he's completely void of free will? Nope, he's got it and he's attempting to continue to use it on you for his own selfish needs.

 

Prove him wrong, woman! Guess what? You're STILL a strong, successful, intelligent, attractive woman with the world at your feet...but this cruel R has blinded you from it.

 

I have the same abandonment/daddy issues as you do. It took me a loooong time and lots of therapy to recognize and work on them, and I still wouldn't call myself "healed" - the daddy stuff was easier than the abandonment part. Anyway, the therapist that helped me more than anyone ever has to this day, once told me to take a picture of the man who had "ruined my life" at the time, place it face up in the toilet and pee on it. I know, it sounds awful and ridiculous, right (and she made me SWEAR not to tell anyone she gave me the suggestion!)? But lemme tell you, it worked WONDERS for me.

 

So guess what else? YOU HAVE that teeny, little thing that belongs to him...is it a very valuable/expensive item? Is it something very easily replaceable? Because the first thing I'd do with it is CHUCK IT somewhere ridiculous...the toilet, a cow pasture, a porta-potty? It might only help you feel better for a little while, but sometimes a little is better than none, right? Little steps...get that thing out of your life...it will help.

 

I'm not a susbscriber to the "one size fits all", d*uchebag, cake-eating, jackhole MM...I do believe there are rare exceptions to the rule. But just based on what you've written about yours, he definitely doesn't sound like one of them.

 

Stop questioning why he does what he does - it doesn't really make a difference to your bottom line. I hurt for you, and I wish it was because he "can't let go of you"...but he's already said he wants to. And if you give him enough of your time and attention, he'll show you.

 

Love yourself. That's the kind of love that is absolutely ALL YOUR FAULT. <3

[ItsNeverForever]

Maybe he knows if he sees you now he will cave and want to be with you. Maybe he is not so much leeping the door open, but more waiting to get his property after some of the feelings have died down. Maybe he just can't handle seeing you.

 

OK, I can't lie - this is probably my second favorite theory here, cause...I might possibly...know a little...about a situation like this...eh-hem.

 

But that aside, even if this particular theory proved to be true, I still don't believe it changes redcurls' bottom line.

[redcurls]

So guess what else? YOU HAVE that teeny, little thing that belongs to him...

 

Um... How did you know this about my MM??? No, not going there... A lady never tells, right?

 

Thank you. Humor will be my salvation from this insanity.

[whichwayisup]

My point is: if this was such a mistake for him, if he never wanted any of this, why would he insist on keeping the door open

 

Ego feed. Remember this is all about him. How he feels, what makes him feel good..Selfish selfish selfish!!

[redcurls]

He's not your MM, anymore. He flat out said he doesn't want you. For starters you should get out of that "he is mine" mentality.

 

Personally I don't think he'll be asking for the piece of equipment back, but you should still get rid of it.

 

He was never MINE - he is MARRIED! And this post was in jest.

 

Actually, I'm pretty sure that he will ask for it and I bet it will be before the holidays. It is rather expensive (that's why I borrowed it in the first place, because I couldn't afford to by one myself) so I might just keep it and never give it back...

[carrie999]

Something must be SERIOUSLY and SEVERLY wrong with me.

 

Can I be totally honest? The sex isn't that great. The attraction is out of this world - the consummation? Not so much. We don't talk - mostly argue. He is a pathological liar - not just with me, in all his interactions, business and personal. He is a BAD communicator. He isn't giving me anything but pain.

 

Why can't I let go? I am a strong, successful, intelligent, attractive woman. I used to have the world at my feet. Now - I feel like such a failure as a woman and as a human being.

 

You're not a failure. You're just feeling really rejected and confused, possibly because you never intended for this to become a full-fledged affair, and maybe you thought you'd be the one to cut ties with him first. And then you fell for him. Maybe I'm projecting because when I got involved with my MM, I wasn't attracted to him and thought (for many reasons) that it would be lopsided in my favor, and that I would end up being the one to finally let him go.

 

You should listen to Hazy and everyone else here who is telling you to just let it go. He wants to let it go, for the right reasons, and despite his "strong" facade, he is weak and completely unable to let go of the possibility that you'll be there, somehow, in the future. He's leaving that tiny crack in the window open.

 

He may or may not be completely in love with you and just completely shaken and terrified of losing his family. That's irrelevant. He has made his choice. I doubt you're reading it wrong when you think that he still has feelings and that's why he wants to "share" this equipment with you. But he's being selfish, and even controlling in the sense that you're holding on to something that is his that he can take back when he wants it. It's a pretty strong metaphor.

 

Just let him go, completely. If he wants the chance to re-open communication, and you choose to let him, he can do so in the future. Just don't give him the security of holding on to something for which he is "allowed" to contact you to use.

 

Move on, honey. Hugs! It gets easier once you decide it should.

[redcurls]

Talk to some of the OW on here and there mentality is very different in terms of he's mine, he loves me, we're soulmates, etc.

 

You don't have to tell us but for some reason I keep imagining your shared hobby to be photography...

 

First, I don't believe in "soulmates." I do believe in love, however.

 

Second, my eyes were wide open from the first moment I met him. He is married. There was never ANY talk about him leaving. W has a VERY strong hold over him and total control - not judging - he seem to like it so who am I to criticize it, you know? So I never had any illusions about happily-everafter.

 

And, no. Not photography...

[KarmasTestDummy]

Something must be SERIOUSLY and SEVERLY wrong with me.

 

Can I be totally honest? The sex isn't that great. The attraction is out of this world - the consummation? Not so much. We don't talk - mostly argue. He is a pathological liar - not just with me, in all his interactions, business and personal. He is a BAD communicator. He isn't giving me anything but pain.

 

Why can't I let go? I am a strong, successful, intelligent, attractive woman. I used to have the world at my feet. Now - I feel like such a failure as a woman and as a human being.

 

It sounds like you're not grieving him but the way he made you feel. The risks he took to be with you were undeniably attractive and made you feel like a powerful goddess. It's not him you need, it's self worth...and that can be found on your own through friendships, family, career, and future relationships. Believe him when he says it's not you and walk away with dignity as if u believed it yourself, knowing ur worth more. You are beautiful and kind and generous and loving and if u need me to pm that to u everyday until u believe it I will.

[KarmasTestDummy]

So sorry ((Red)). I have no idea why MM like to keep the door open. If I had to guess it's because he might want to knock on that door at a later time. But IMO he will never give you more than he has already given you.

 

Again I'm sorry you are hurting.

 

My best guess is she was as good for his ego as he was to her, and even if he doesn't want the R it makes him feel good to maintain the upper hand and keep her wishing and wanting him for his own gratification. Because he'd hate to see her move on and one day not give two $hits about him anymore. Give it back. Get the last word, saying u have no reason to want him coming around for anything once it's over. You'll leave him speechless and have the last say. It will be such a relief to you to do so. It's not rejection if ur doing the rejecting.

[ItsNeverForever]

Um... How did you know this about my MM??? No, not going there... A lady never tells, right?

 

Thank you. Humor will be my salvation from this insanity.

 

LOL! I got it, Curls! Tee heeeee! I might have once said the same thing about my "MM". But of course, I didn't just say that bc you're right, a lady never tells. *wink*

 

Now, chucking that teeny tiny 'thing'...what a visual!!! HA! And I thought putting a face in the toilet was nuts... I'm glad we could find a little humor here. It doesn't solve too many problems, but it sure serves as some much needed relief, doesn't it?

 

Here for ya...

[ItsNeverForever]

It sounds like you're not grieving him but the way he made you feel...Believe him when he says it's not you and walk away with dignity as if u believed it yourself, knowing ur worth more.

 

...it makes him feel good to maintain the upper hand...he'd hate to see her move on and one day not give two $hits about him anymore...Give it back. Get the last word, saying u have no reason to want him coming around for anything once it's over. You'll leave him speechless and have the last say. It will be such a relief to you to do so. It's not rejection if ur doing the rejecting.

 

Re: the first part I've bolded above - darlin', it's SO not you, Curls... "and you KNOW this, mannn!" (bonus points if you can name the movie!) Seriously, like I said before, it doesn't matter what his true intentions are here, we know that you're not ultimately happy with the outcome, and YOUR happiness is paramount. It's certainly not what HE is considering right now, is it? By leaving that item with you, IMHO, he's trying to guarantee a re-do with you. Uhm, what does a man full of regret and desperation to keep his family in tact need a possible re-do for? Sellllfissssshhh.

 

The other parts above in bold have worked wonders for me in the past...worth considering.

[Rose1977]

Something must be SERIOUSLY and SEVERLY wrong with me.

 

Can I be totally honest? The sex isn't that great. The attraction is out of this world - the consummation? Not so much. We don't talk - mostly argue. He is a pathological liar - not just with me, in all his interactions, business and personal. He is a BAD communicator. He isn't giving me anything but pain.

 

Why can't I let go? I am a strong, successful, intelligent, attractive woman. I used to have the world at my feet. Now - I feel like such a failure as a woman and as a human being.

 

 

Redcurls, I am a BGF, but don't worry, I am not here to bash. I haven't finised reading this whole thread, but there is NOTHING wrong with you, and you are NOT a failure. You clearly have a lot to offer in a loving relationship, and you deserve someone who can give you back the same love and devotion you bring to the table. I truly think once you get some distance from him you will see him for what he truly is. Everyone deserves to be happy, and no woman wants to be in a LTR/M with a pathological liar and a bad communicator. The only thing going thru my mind reading this is you deserve so much better. And you are not a failure! You're in a crappy situation, but you can use your positive traits to get yourself out of it. Sounds like you know what to do, you're just doubting yourself. I'm not saying all of this b/c I am so anti-affair, I am saying it b/c I honestly believe this is an unhealthy situation for you and I truly believe you deserve better.

 

Oh and as far as the equipmemt, I would send him a text, email, whatever saying that you are leaving it on your porch/ in your driveway/ whatever, and that if he doesn't come pick it up by trash day you are putting it out or donating it/ whatever. You need to cut ties, and having that lingering in the back of your mind will drive you insane.

[redcurls]

Thank you, lovely people. You are all giving me so much strength.

 

I was feeling pretty good last night, after reading all the good advice here and after a wonderful conversation with a good friend of mine who is herself an xOW.

And then this morning - the guilt-ridden, remorseful, devoted husband and father, the one who doesn't want to be in a R with me, the one who wants to forget we ever met, the one who wants to have absolutely no contact - yes, he called. I answered the phone asking if he is needs his equipment. He told me that no, he just wanted to talk. Ugh. I said I was busy and hung up. Actually felt really good to do this.

 

Its progress, right?

[scatterd]

Good Job now you are in control I know this is hard but later you will look at him in a different way.This is the most venerable time and doing that is a good start.He is selfish and you deserve someone who has something to offer you and once you are over this you will know not to except seconds.

Even if you was with him would you really trust him as soon as he was bored and another girl put out he would do it.If you guys got caught he would throw you under the bus and say it was your fault he has already blamed you for him cheating what a nice guy. New phases are scary no body likes change but this will be for the better.No more waiting,no more wondering,and no more .Hold your head high click your heals for today is the start of better times coming.Good Job!

[phillyfan]

I am certain that he wants me out of his life. I am certain that he does NOT want to be in a R with me. I am certain that he is FULLY committed to his wife and kids. So why would he want to leave the door open like this? Please help me understand.

 

Girl sorry but he bailed and let u keep whateva of his u had, just to avoid havin to meet up wit u again to collect it. He is avoiding drama, that is what men do. He wants it over between u, so he willin to lose his property if it means endin it rite now, and not havin to meet wit u. Hes bein sensible, it means it isnt dragged out.

[phillyfan]

Something must be SERIOUSLY and SEVERLY wrong with me.

 

Can I be totally honest? The sex isn't that great. The attraction is out of this world - the consummation? Not so much. We don't talk - mostly argue. He is a pathological liar - not just with me, in all his interactions, business and personal. He is a BAD communicator. He isn't giving me anything but pain.

 

Why can't I let go? I am a strong, successful, intelligent, attractive woman. I used to have the world at my feet. Now - I feel like such a failure as a woman and as a human being.

 

WOAHHH there girl. U split with a guy u liked,thats all. Happens to us all. No need to crank up the drama 20000 notches. No more self pity u have a good life go out there any enjoy it, u said urself hes a loser, go n find a winner.

[ladydesigner]

Thank you, lovely people. You are all giving me so much strength.

 

I was feeling pretty good last night, after reading all the good advice here and after a wonderful conversation with a good friend of mine who is herself an xOW.

And then this morning - the guilt-ridden, remorseful, devoted husband and father, the one who doesn't want to be in a R with me, the one who wants to forget we ever met, the one who wants to have absolutely no contact - yes, he called. I answered the phone asking if he is needs his equipment. He told me that no, he just wanted to talk. Ugh. I said I was busy and hung up. Actually felt really good to do this.

 

Its progress, right?

 

Ahh so he called. The 'ol fishing expedition. Glad you didn't take the bait. You go girl. Take your power back! Stay NC. You are doing great!

[redcurls]

Ugh. I'm a stupid, stupid woman.

 

I was doing so well all last week. I hung up on him when he called. I felt so in control. I didn't contact him at all, though I must admit that it wasn't easy. But I was determined to get out of this crazy situation. I started therapy and it was VERY enlightening, to say the least.

 

But I knew that he will come fishing. I just knew it.

 

 

Early Saturday morning I got a text from him asking if he could "borrow" the equipment (that belongs to him...) as he really needs it. Of course all my resolve went down the drain and I went to meet him and give it to him. I managed to hand it to him and without a word jumped back in my car and drove off. He called me to ask why I was in such a hurry and I told him that I was busy, blah, blah, blah. Before I knew it we were having a conversation about "us" and it was very emotional for both of us. We had several more conversations throughout the day and it felt good and bad at the same time. He called the last time right before he headed home to say that he will give me back the equipment sometime this week, and then.... THEN - I asked if he could bring it to me and we can spend some time together (you all know what "spending time together is" right?) he asked me if I thought it will be a good idea and said that he isn't sure we can both handle the let down afterwards. I just kept asking him to say "yes." it was like I could think of nothing else but having his arms around me again. It was like by brain went silent and all I could hear was my stupid heart.

 

I know. I know. I know. I feel like a complete fool. But this man is my weakness. I can't think clearly when I hear his voice. I KNOW NC is my only answer. I'm sure of it now more than ever. But this is so effing hard. I feel like my heart is exploding.

 

Bring on the 2x4's. This couldn't possibly hurt anymore that it already does.

[redcurls]

I want out. I want it to be over. I just feel like I'm possessed or something. Like I have no self-control at all. Like he has taken over my will power. I know this sounds insane. I feel insane.

[ItsNeverForever]

Aw, curls. I know what you're doing, how you're feeling. It's like being under a spell. You're so clear-headed when he's out of sight, even able to imagine yourself meeting someone new & fabulous & AVAILABLE...getting your mojo back, so to speak. Then one little interaction & his voodoo's got you daydreaming of encounters...then some sweet nothings from his charming mouth & you're actually BEGGING to see him again, wanting to do things that would dig you another foot (or ten) into the ground when he goes back home to forget about you again. Please don't beat yourself up for this...you love him, & you're just not "done" yet. You are NOT alone. I'm not "done" yet either, apparently, bc I responded to his syrupy texts last nite. His voodoo was in full effect, so much so that by the time I went to bed, I was dreaming up an invitation for us to meet up this week & "spend some time together"...seeee? It's not just you...

 

And this post just saved me from hurting myself.

 

All we can do, dear red, is resolve to start again and make more & better progress this time. Feel foolish for a minute, process the mistake & put it behind you. It does get easier with every consecutive time you relapse. Trust me, I've had more relapses than I care to admit. One of these days it's gonna stick. I have faith!

[Carrot2000]

"Can I be totally honest? The sex isn't that great. The attraction is out of this world - the consummation? Not so much. We don't talk - mostly argue. He is a pathological liar - not just with me, in all his interactions, business and personal. He is a BAD communicator. He isn't giving me anything but pain."

 

Print this out and tape it to your bathroom mirror. Keep reading this whenever you think about this man's arms around you. You also need to depend on your good friends and ask them to slap you upside the head when you think about contacting this man! :-)

 

If you want this to be over, you need to give him his equipment and get it out of your possession permanently. Don't take it back, otherwise you're leaving the door open for more communication, more interaction and more pain.

[Fieldsofgold]

Ugh. I'm a stupid, stupid woman.

 

I was doing so well all last week. I hung up on him when he called. I felt so in control. I didn't contact him at all, though I must admit that it wasn't easy. But I was determined to get out of this crazy situation. I started therapy and it was VERY enlightening, to say the least.

 

But I knew that he will come fishing. I just knew it.

 

 

Early Saturday morning I got a text from him asking if he could "borrow" the equipment (that belongs to him...) as he really needs it. Of course all my resolve went down the drain and I went to meet him and give it to him. I managed to hand it to him and without a word jumped back in my car and drove off. He called me to ask why I was in such a hurry and I told him that I was busy, blah, blah, blah. Before I knew it we were having a conversation about "us" and it was very emotional for both of us. We had several more conversations throughout the day and it felt good and bad at the same time. He called the last time right before he headed home to say that he will give me back the equipment sometime this week, and then.... THEN - I asked if he could bring it to me and we can spend some time together (you all know what "spending time together is" right?) he asked me if I thought it will be a good idea and said that he isn't sure we can both handle the let down afterwards. I just kept asking him to say "yes." it was like I could think of nothing else but having his arms around me again. It was like by brain went silent and all I could hear was my stupid heart.

 

I know. I know. I know. I feel like a complete fool. But this man is my weakness. I can't think clearly when I hear his voice. I KNOW NC is my only answer. I'm sure of it now more than ever. But this is so effing hard. I feel like my heart is exploding.

 

Bring on the 2x4's. This couldn't possibly hurt anymore that it already does.

 

I have caught up reading this thread now. I'm pretty sure it's not your above-referenced heart you are listening to. Because your heart would tell you,'"this guy doesn't love you, and H€ll, you don't even really like him, you dont even REALLY want him! He will break your heart, make you feel weak and spineless and stupid. That's not love. Love yourself." THAT's what you would be hearing if you were listening to your heart.

 

No, what you are listening to is a very young child's neediness. Which, btw, he will never fill. (I think) what you are listening to is a voice coming from a very damaged place in you that tells you "you don't deserve good things. You deserve to be deprived, hurt, jerked around. You're bad. You don't deserve to have your needs met. That's why they've never been met in this area. There's something wrong with you!"

 

THIS is the voice I think you and I listen to, and we order certain aspects of our lives accordingly. We hold on to the painful, hurtful things in our lives that validate that voice. And since we don't have a name for that place, and since it is a stroooooong feeling, we call it love, and we think it just be our hearts.

 

Don't be discouraged. Recognize it for what it is, a slip-up. Pick yourself up and start again. Baby steps. (always makes me think of Bill Murray's movie!) You can start over, again and again, til you get it right. When I quit smoking, I quit a half-dozen times, at least. Til I finally really did it. Sort of the same thing. I have an issue I am dealing with, probably coming from that same voice, same place as your bondage to him; because I don't feel deserving of all that is good. It's like I'm holding on to this one little area that's painful to me, much like you are holding on to him, I'm having a hard time letting go and replacing the bad with better. So I am babystepping it. Some days I do better than others. Sometimes I regroup my resolve and make a fresh start several times a day.

 

I'm making progress. So are you. I think we both get impatient. We want to change a lifetime of deeply ingrained feelings/habits/conditioning in a few days. It's not likely to happen. If you can, go NC, make it impossible for him to call you.

 

I noticed one thing in your previous posts. When he called, you told him you were busy. That's not taking control of your life. That's avoidance. Make a decision. Either this is what you want for your life, or it is not. I know you already know it is not, bit make it a conscious decision, that he/this relationship is not what you really want. Then take a stand. Take charge of your life. Just tell him you don't want to talk to him, you don't want to see him, you don't want his crap piece of equipment. Set some standards for what you will not put up with, and then honor yourself with that.

 

Here is a link that says it better than I do:

 

http://christinekane.com/blog/you-teach-people-how-to-treat-you/

[BB07]

Oh Fields.........what an excellent, excellent post!

I think you are spot on and so much of what applies to this situation applies to a lot of my past.

 

Curls...........fields is right, saying I'm busy is not really closing the door. Slam that door curls........slam it so hard that it echos and echos and even shakes the house.

 

You said it yourself, this man is no good. Let him go.......let yourself be free of him.

[Fieldsofgold]

Sorry, duplication

Edited December 19, 2010 by Fieldsofgold

[Fieldsofgold]

About that expensive little piece of equipment that he is using like blood bait - why not just buy yourself one. If it's that expensive, get a part-time job on the side for a few weeks, sell some stuff on eBay, skip eating out once or twice a week, and buy your own.

 

That way, you wont need him OR his gear. It will be freeing for you. It will show him that your mindset is you can provide what you need for yourself. (and it will give you something to keep you busy in the meantime.)