girlfriend had 4 year relationship with MM

[Mad Max]

As far as your ex, she's probably not going to mention this ever again to anyone. Then again, the truth always comes out at some point.

[TigerCub]

Yes. Love is a powerful thing. It can make people do crazy s**t that totally goes against their nature. Even murder. I think Chris Rock said once "If you haven't contemplated murder, you ain't been in love!"

haha - I love Chris Rock!!

 

 

 

I'm no therapist but I do believe you are right. Women who engage with MM do have some sort of "daddy issue." Because a truly healthy woman would tell a married man to "F" off, stop hitting on me, and go be with your wife.

That's the thing that bugged me, because I've always thought that " you're married, well then, F off, you made your bed, go be miserable in it", but with this guy it was different, because I met him when he was separated, I refused to date him but we became friends and that's how we connected, by then I loved him and when he went back to her, the daddy issues came up.

 

I'm definitely going to stick to my usual rule of telling any taken man who ever approaches me to "F" off and go with his wife

 

 

IMHO those thoughts were simply your heart fighting with your brain because deep down inside you knew it was all wrong.

I agree!

 

 

I find the term "baby momma" demeaning. It's an attempt to minimize the fact that a woman is the mother of his children... and it's soooo Jersey Shore!

OUCH!!!

I will not use that term again! (I'll do my best to remember that )

 

Yes. Real men have morals and integrity. You can count on them to be there for you when the chips are down. A real man doesn't bang OW on the side because he isn't getting something "at home.." Real men don't carry around mommy issues... Real men don't cheat/betray loved ones. Women deserve men who are chivalrous.. not some lying, cheating scumball.

So true!

I hope to end up with a man like that. Despite my mistakes, I think I can still get one.

 

Unless you've been a BS you never know the absolute pain and suffering that comes with finding out that your emotional and financial partner in life has thrown you under a bus for someone else. In my case she cheated with a "good friend" who was married.. with a pregnant wife at home. I still suffer from PTSD from having those two people in my life betray me and my son like that.

I remember reading about that in one of your posts. I may never fully understand the kind of pain you went through (because I haven't been there), but I am sorry that you went through that.

 

 

Worst part is she and MM exhibit no remorse for the pain and suffering they caused. None. Zero. Nada. She never even said sorry. Not once. In fact they - the EX and MM and his wife - all still party together to this very day like I never existed.

That must be really hard for you to know.

But just like you said "real men" don't cheat and will stand by their SO, the same goes for "real women". I know that you know that you're better off without her, but I understand how the hurt is still there.

(((YellowShark)))

 

 

 

Not in argument. I believe that too. It's the OW/OM who show no remorse, or are happy with their married affair partners I find so frikkin' scary.

I agree in the sense that we all make mistakes, but if there is no remorse, then something is wrong. But just like you said (with regards to my daddy issues comment) - that most people in these situations have self esteem or "daddy" or "mommy" issues. I think humans are all flawed and we all have our baggage and we've all been beaten down one way or another by someone else, and some of us rationalize "beating down" someone else because of that. I just think that A situations are really sad. I had a singular view on it before (ie. its wrong, the cheater and the person helping them do it are terrible people that deserve misery) but after being in that situation myself, I got a better look at my own flaws and what drove me to be in a position that I never thought I'd get into.

 

I think that remorse comes from self examination and figuring out why one does what they do and thinking about the people they've hurt with their actions.

 

I've gotten to that point for sure (and I had the guilt throughout), I don't think that makes me better than any other OW/OM, but I feel that dealing with my own issues has helped me by bringing me back to my senses.

 

 

I can agree to disagree with people. But I ascribe to the adage that I won't be so open minded that my brains fall out!

haha

[skywriter]

zasw,

 

So your girlfriend, felt she could bare her past mistakes to you and you decide, you have a right to judge her for her past.

 

Im with Pure In Heart on this one, she's the one who's better off.

[pureinheart]

As far as your ex, she's probably not going to mention this ever again to anyone. Then again, the truth always comes out at some point.

 

It shouldn't affect anything. It would not affect me, I would consider the source.

 

I can certainly understand "preferences", although the tone sounds like there are some serious unresolved issues to communicate the way the OPer has. I don't feel bad for her, although I do feel bad for OPer.

 

The truth ALWAYS comes out...none of us are above reproach. Also want to add that I think it's interesting, the most judgemental people have the most to hide...they just sometimes don't know it.

[greengoddess]

This was the right thing to do. Respect goes both ways. Your true character was revealed also.

 

In the event that this is not a troll, or a reincarnate hater, I would say based on the verbage in this post, that she got the better end of the deal in the long run.

 

Had this been me, I know I would have picked up on selfrighteousness and would have been gone, based on the fact, that compassion and forgiveness is the key in any relationship. Tears of joy would have encompassed me, knowing that I dodged a very large bullet.

 

I bet she will find a really nice guy who is worthy of her:)

 

Wow you are really being harsh and judging zasw. Calling him names even, (self-righteous). There are certain things that are deal breakers for some people. Many people have very serious opinions of being involved in an affair. It is against his morals. Why judge him so harshly for putting the breaks on a relationship that he knows they do not have certain moral beliefs in sync.

[donnamaybe]

Wow you are really being harsh and judging zasw. Calling him names even, (self-righteous). There are certain things that are deal breakers for some people. Many people have very serious opinions of being involved in an affair. It is against his morals. Why judge him so harshly for putting the breaks on a relationship that he knows they do not have certain moral beliefs in sync.

I know, huh?

[greengoddess]

It shouldn't affect anything. It would not affect me, I would consider the source.

 

I can certainly understand "preferences", although the tone sounds like there are some serious unresolved issues to communicate the way the OPer has. I don't feel bad for her, although I do feel bad for OPer.

 

The truth ALWAYS comes out...none of us are above reproach. Also want to add that I think it's interesting, the most judgemental people have the most to hide...they just sometimes don't know it.

 

OMG now you are calling him judgmental again and even attacking him by insinuating that he has something horrible hidden in his past. Sheeesh don't you see it is you that is doing the judging. Would you like him to continue a relationship with her knowing that he does not respect her morals. Affairs would not be hidden if everyone agreed with them. Stop judging him for wanting to live by his principles.

[donnamaybe]

OMG now you are calling him judgmental again and even attacking him by insinuating that he has something horrible hidden in his past. Sheeesh don't you see it is you that is doing the judging. Would you like him to continue a relationship with her knowing that he does not respect her morals. Affairs would not be hidden if everyone agreed with them. Stop judging him for wanting to live by his principles.

And based only on assumptions because of her distaste of him NOT liking the idea of someone being involved with a married person.

 

Wow. At least he had an actual basis for his opinion. You may not all like his opinion, but he has a right to it. I'm sure, in his breakup with her, he didn't resort to name calling and the like. He just doesn't come across as that type.

[pureinheart]

OMG now you are calling him judgmental again and even attacking him by insinuating that he has something horrible hidden in his past. Sheeesh don't you see it is you that is doing the judging. Would you like him to continue a relationship with her knowing that he does not respect her morals. Affairs would not be hidden if everyone agreed with them. Stop judging him for wanting to live by his principles.

 

It's not the issue of living by a persons principles, it is how it's worded...there is a judgemental tone. Hummm not too shocked that you don't see that:rolleyes:

[donnamaybe]

It's not the issue of living by a persons principles, it is how it's worded...there is a judgemental tone. Hummm not too shocked that you don't see that:rolleyes:

EVERYONE judges. Even you. If you deem someone not good enough to be your child's (or grand child's) baby sitter, you've judged.

 

Everyone judges every day. So can we all get over the "judgmental" thing now?

[zasw]

This was the right thing to do. Respect goes both ways. Your true character was revealed also.

 

In the event that this is not a troll, or a reincarnate hater, I would say based on the verbage in this post, that she got the better end of the deal in the long run.

 

Had this been me, I know I would have picked up on selfrighteousness and would have been gone, based on the fact, that compassion and forgiveness is the key in any relationship. Tears of joy would have encompassed me, knowing that I dodged a very large bullet.

 

I bet she will find a really nice guy who is worthy of her:)

 

zasw,

 

So your girlfriend, felt she could bare her past mistakes to you and you decide, you have a right to judge her for her past.

 

Im with Pure In Heart on this one, she's the one who's better off.

 

 

So you feel shes better off? Your right, after somthing like this comes to the fore I would never look at her the same way. It would always be in the back of my mind. There also would be no trust, she would trust me but I would not trust her. It was extremely fair to let her go. It would have been unfair to her to pretend I was unaffected by this.

[pureinheart]

EVERYONE judges. Even you. If you deem someone not good enough to be your child's (or grand child's) baby sitter, you've judged.

 

Everyone judges every day. So can we all get over the "judgmental" thing now?

 

Bold...no, I've made a choice based on current evidence, or a gut feeling. If I observe unusual behavior, or if the individual tells me of a past indiscretion that might directly/indirectly affect me.

 

Judgemental/judging IMO is running something/someone down and catagorizing every person into a particular "group".

 

Please read the second (I believe) post of the OPer...if that is not judgemental, and you do not see this then I do not know what to say.

 

Being angry with his ex is one thing, although the OPer catagorizes all into not deserving respect, unredeemable, etc.

[pureinheart]

I was never was one to give a pass to the OW/OM. Even before my previous relationship. Anyone who has an affair with someone whos married reveals their true character. They may never do it again but anyone who has done such a dispicable thing is forever tarnished. They dont deserve my respect or anyones for that matter. What is respectable in breaking up a family. Even if the innocent spouse never finds out, they know that they were part of somthing that could have caused much sorrow. Now true my girlfriend told me that she deals with guilt everyday over what shes done, well she should feel guilty and I say it serves her right. And yes she told me because she felt i needed to know this about her past. Im glad she did tell me because if she didnt i wouldnt have known about who she really is. Shes a despicable person.

 

Despite all the crying she did and how terrible I feel about doing it I cut her loose last night.

 

 

This wording (above quote) communicates judgemental to all.

 

So you feel shes better off? Your right, after somthing like this comes to the fore I would never look at her the same way. It would always be in the back of my mind. There also would be no trust, she would trust me but I would not trust her. It was extremely fair to let her go. It would have been unfair to her to pretend I was unaffected by this.

 

This wording communicates a personal preference.

[donnamaybe]

Bold...no, I've made a choice based on current evidence, or a gut feeling. If I observe unusual behavior, or if the individual tells me of a past indiscretion that might directly/indirectly affect me.

So it's okay for YOU to make an observation of some behavior and make a decision whether it might directly or indirectly affect you, but not the OP?

 

He has a right to his opinion regarding whether a certain behavior is indicative of a personality type, just as you have.

 

We ALL judge. Yes. ALL of us.

[YellowShark]

Here's my take...

 

The TSA doesn't hire ex-terrorists to be Sky Marshals. Banks don't hire ex-cons to be Bank Tellers. Schools don't hire ex-pedophiles to be Teachers. In fact many employers require background checks before they will hire you. And if you fail to meet the criteria you are not hired. Period. End of story.

 

So why should relationships be any different? Why should anyone be forced to date someone who has a history of infidelity? Seems like a risky proposition to me.. (dating someone who has a history of infidelity.) I certainly don't want someone to be my emotional and financial partner in life who has a history of infidelity.

 

To each his own I say, and sure forgiveness and kindness are absolutely wonderful and desirable traits. But the people who generally disagree with me are people with a history of infidelity.

 

So how have I made it 40+ years on this Earth without ever cheating? I'm certainly no superman..

[donnamaybe]

Here's my take...

 

The TSA doesn't hire ex-terrorists to be Sky Marshals. Banks don't hire ex-cons to be Bank Tellers. Schools don't hire ex-pedophiles to be Teachers. In fact many employers require background checks before they will hire you. And if you fail to meet the criteria you are not hired. Period. End of story.

 

So why should relationships be any different? Why should anyone be forced to date someone who has a history of infidelity? Seems like a risky proposition to me.. (dating someone who has a history of infidelity.) I certainly don't want someone to be my emotional and financial partner in life who has a history of infidelity.

 

To each his own I say, and sure forgiveness and kindness are absolutely wonderful and desirable traits. But the people who generally disagree with me are people with a history of infidelity.

 

So how have I made it 40+ years on this Earth without ever cheating? I'm certainly no superman..

You get it.

[jthorne]

Ok, I was going to stay out of this thread, but I have a question:

OP, you dumped her, and I respect your choice, but did you even ask her if she was doing anything to fix what was broken within her that lead her to that really poor choice? I'm just wondering if you cared enough about her to ask, or if you just chalked it up to low morals and washed your hands of it.

 

You broke up with her, and that's your choice. What I'm more concerned about is how this woman is dealing with her issues of self esteem, etc. Because if she doesn't deal with her issues, she will continue, IMO, to choose unhealthy relationships.

 

I respect that you have boundaries and this was a deal breaker for you, but I also wonder if maybe there isn't more to the story, and you were looking for an excuse to "cut her loose"? Maybe it's my perception, or maybe youre much younger than I, but you didn't seem (from your few posts) too invested in the relationship.

 

Either way, I hope you both learn something and grow as people because of it. Good luck!

Edited January 7, 2011 by jthorne

[pureinheart]

So it's okay for YOU to make an observation of some behavior and make a decision whether it might directly or indirectly affect you, but not the OP?

 

He has a right to his opinion regarding whether a certain behavior is indicative of a personality type, just as you have.

 

We ALL judge. Yes. ALL of us.

 

Yes we do. I try to refrain from it, and we all lie, cheat etc....on the rest...I give up:D

[Ellin]

EVERYONE judges. Even you. If you deem someone not good enough to be your child's (or grand child's) baby sitter, you've judged.

 

Everyone judges every day. So can we all get over the "judgmental" thing now?

 

There is a substantial difference between judging someone's suitability for a certain job, like in your above example, or like in saying "she's too short to be a model" and dishing out moral judgements and condemnations.

 

Don't you get that difference?

[greengoddess]

There is a substantial difference between judging someone's suitability for a certain job, like in your above example, or like in saying "she's too short to be a model" and dishing out moral judgements and condemnations.

 

Don't you get that difference?

 

This is a man choosing who is suitable to be his life partner. He found someone having been involved with an extra marital affair for FOUR years to be unworthy of someone for that position. He doesn't want his wife and possible mother of his children to be someone who was capable of lying and sneaking around for four years. Suitability for a mate is even more important than a job.

[YellowShark]

this is a man choosing who is suitable to be his life partner. He found someone having been involved with an extra marital affair for four years to be unworthy of someone for that position. he doesn't want his wife and possible mother of his children to be someone who was capable of lying and sneaking around for four years. Suitability for a mate is even more important than a job.

 

Exactly.

[Ellin]

This is a man choosing who is suitable to be his life partner. He found someone having been involved with an extra marital affair for FOUR years to be unworthy of someone for that position. He doesn't want his wife and possible mother of his children to be someone who was capable of lying and sneaking around for four years. Suitability for a mate is even more important than a job.

 

How do you know she lied and sneaked around for four years? He was the one who lied, that's for sure, but not necessarily her. Unless you consider not making her way to the W and telling her everything lying.

[Ellin]

Are you implying that you don't making moral judgments or condemnations?

 

I try to refrain from it as much as possible, meaning whenever I realise that I do it.

 

"Don't judge lest you be judged" is what MY morals are based on.

 

And to all the rigid people with "strong morals", not willing to accept anyone who made any sort of more serious mistakes in their past, "good luck" as there seems to be few people around who are good enough for them.

 

Those moral preachers rarely sound happy, anyway.

[Ellin]

This is a man choosing who is suitable to be his life partner. He found someone having been involved with an extra marital affair for FOUR years to be unworthy of someone for that position. He doesn't want his wife and possible mother of his children to be someone who was capable of lying and sneaking around for four years. Suitability for a mate is even more important than a job.

 

Cool.

 

I wouldn't like to be chosen by someone who sounds like a recruitment manager when deciding about a loving relationship, anyway.

 

Not my cup of tea.

[Ellin]

So basically you are saying:

 

You would let a suspected pedo babysit a 5 year old because you don't judge based on morals.

 

You would trust a known thief with your money because you don't judge based on morals.

 

There is nothing wrong with people clubbing baby seals, or poaching tigers for profit because you don't judge based on morals.

 

An already WS should be ok alone in a room with a wo/man eating AP because you don't judge based on morals.

 

How did you come to these conclusions??