Through the Separation Jungle

[worldgonewrong]

I’ve been reading this forum for the past few weeks, and only now mustered up the courage to post here. It’s not so much that I have any burning questions, but just thought I would share.

 

The stats:

My wife & I have been separated 3 weeks.

We’ve been married for 13 years, but have been with each other for a total of 20 years.

We both met when we were young (me 21, she 19) (she had been a bit more ‘worldly’ in the way of relationships than me back then, before we met). We have been through our therapy & growing-up together for a helluva long time.

In addition, we have 2 small children (ages 7 and 11).

 

After 4 months of hellish cold-shouldering and separate beds, my wife pushed for a separation. The tipping point had occurred in the summer, when we had a bit of an argument and I threw a dish (NOT at her), which shattered and scared the kids. Really stupid, selfish, and actually out-of-character for me. After that moment, she tallied up isolated arguments (it’s not like we fought THAT much) from years past and added them all up and came up with a distorted composite of my personality, which actually betrays who I really am and the depth of our shared love over 20 years. This sounds like I’m being accusatory, but I have confessed my sins to all and sundry, and at this point, I feel like I’ve ‘done the time’ for the crime.

 

We had 2 marriage-counseling sessions prior to the separation. On the first one, I wept like a broken man and apologized; it was also a session in which she told me that this was a separation that would lead to divorce. That’s what killed me. But on the second session, days later, I kept my head together (no weeping) and told her that I would respect her request for separation, even if it devastated me.

 

The toughest parts were and are (a) breaking it to our kids and (b) me getting used to not living with my beautiful kids under the same roof. I will never get over that. It’s the one cold bit of reality that makes me damn near nauseous when I think about the loss.

That said, I try to make them happy still, and overall, they seem OK. They know they are loved by both of us and that neither mommy nor daddy will talk disrespectfully about each other to them. Ironically, the wife and I are a united front there. It took separation to become a united front in that aspect…

 

Anyway, so 3 weeks of separation have seen some positive changes in me, which I hope will become attractive to her…but in the end, I realize these changes will still remain even if our paths do not conjoin again and these changes will make me respect myself first and then maybe be beneficial to someone in the future. (Although, good God, I never want to marry again if the road leads to divorce… too much sorrow.) I’ve taken to exercising, not drinking like I used, I’ve lost my paunch and I actually have muscle tone and definition in my physique. I find myself walking with a bit more confidence and self-assurance. Also, I’m actually laughing again (I thought that would never happen after the weeks of gut-wrenching crying jags) and am thinking clearly for the first time in ages. I also consulted my psychiatrist and got off anti-depressant medication, which I’d been on for 3 years, as it had begun to have a retrogressive effect on me (and it was making me retain weight and water).

 

Yes, the roller-coaster of emotions is there. I find myself at turns quietly bitter and then filled with compassion towards her. I find myself dreaming of reconciliation, and at other times completely wondering how I could maintain my self-respect now if we were to get back together. One of the best aspects of this – and one of the toughest – has been the NC (No Contact) rule. It’s my nature to feel guilt and attempt to always make it better. I’ve learned, via NC, that there’s only so much you can do. You sometimes have to let go in order to maybe arrive at a better place with the dumper.

 

And yes, I read everything here. But I’ve learned that there’s no magical formula or solution when it comes to this stuff. Each couple – by virtue of each person and set of circumstances being wildly different – travels its own or parallel set of roads. Like anybody reading this, I’m guilty of coming here and trying to divine ‘the answer’ (e.g. “Hey, that person’s scenario is like mine!”) or to bolster my hope. Even not having ‘the answer’ is an odd source of comfort, because you’re faced with dealing yourself first – regardless of how the other person perceives you.

 

Cheers. And I look forward to future conversation on this and other threads.

 

p.s. I wanted to add, one of the benefits of the separation has been that - for the first time in ages - I am actually living in THE NOW.

 

**p.p.s. As long as I'm here, I'll piggyback onto my post with a question:

I'm not being sarcastic or funny in the least by asking this. Is it possible that women also go through "mid-life" crises too??? I suspect that's part of the equation with her (as it was with me, in my behavior and lack of respect).

Edited February 4, 2011 by worldgonewrong
addition

[willowthewisp]

Hi and welcome to LS, but so sorry for your reason for being here. I too know what it is like to lose someone you have been with for 20 years (just under for me and different circumstances but still...).

 

To answer your question, yes, women do go through mid life tranisition and some of them go into crisis. Everyone goes through mid life, male and female but only some have a crisis, others progress through with little difficulty. The concept comes from Jung is you are interested in reading about it. Most internet sites are focused more on the male crisis, but the principles are the same. Are you still seeing your MC alone? They will be able to provide you with more info and may I suggest IC is a really good idea for yourself right now, it helped me a lot and I only wish I had been able to to commence it earlier.

 

Keep posting, we're listening.

[worldgonewrong]

thank you, willowthewisp. will look into Jung's take on this!

 

I meant to underscore my original post:

I love my wife dearly with all my heart & soul.

My dream is grow old together with her.

 

That said, I have to be realistic, too.

 

[willowthewisp]

I hope that your wife comes to see the changes you are making and in time wants to try and reconcile. It sounds like she has freaked out when you threw the dish and maybe in time if she sees the change she may calm down. Having said that, I do not know your situation like you do and I think you are absloultely right to be looking out for you. One thing I do know is that you can't influence what they decide, you can't change their decision, so you are right to be realisitic, focus on you and your children and maintain NC/LC with kids.

[debtman]

worldgonewrong,

 

I know how you feel, 10 year relationship, 6 year marriage, 2 young kids. Wife found OM and decided (because of the state of our relationship, which was both of our faults) that she would be happier with him. So, now I get to deal with the loneliness, jealousy, separation, etc. while she has a new bf who focuses all of his attention on her because it's a new relationship. He has kids and a wife who he's in the process of getting separated from, so he can't give her the time she needs either, but, he is focused on her since they're still getting to know each other...

 

Anyway, that said, YES, women can certainly go through crisis and there's nothing you can do about it except let them do it and work on yourself. Be strong, get confident.

 

3 weeks is early, the hurt is still VERY new. Let me assure you, it gets better! I've been "in this" since October and things are finally starting to turn around. I'm getting active, getting into old hobbies and some new ones. Hanging out and doing things with my friends, making new friends and enjoying every second with my kids. The time I spend with them now is ENTIRELY about us and we just play and do things together. I miss every second I don't spend with them and resent the decision my wife made that has taken that time from me, but I have to let that go and enjoy what life has to offer.

 

Life is a wonderful thing. Enjoy every second. Work on making yourself the best person you can be, address YOUR issues from your relationship and work on fixing those so they don't get worked into your next relationship. Everything else will fall into place the way it should...

 

Good luck and keep posting...

[worldgonewrong]

I hope that your wife comes to see the changes you are making and in time wants to try and reconcile. It sounds like she has freaked out when you threw the dish and maybe in time if she sees the change she may calm down. Having said that, I do not know your situation like you do and I think you are absloultely right to be looking out for you. One thing I do know is that you can't influence what they decide, you can't change their decision, so you are right to be realisitic, focus on you and your children and maintain NC/LC with kids.

 

Thank you for the kind & supportive words.

I think there's a chance she will see the changes in me; there's a part of me that does remain optimistic about that, have to admit.

 

And you're darn right: "you can't influence what they decide". Spot on. You can only be who you are, and improve upon that; whether someone else recognizes it or not is NOT something that can be forced.

 

p.s. I think you meant maintain NC/LC with wife, as opposed to kids, right?

[worldgonewrong]

debtman-

 

Wow, you have been through the f#*king ringer! WORSE than me!

The fact that you're able to stand here now and offer me encouragement & support speaks so well to your strength and good character. My God, I really am in awe, man.

 

And y'know, apropos to your comments: I am remaining fiercely optimistic and hopeful about Life itself, with or without her. There is a lot of good and beauty in this world, and it's easy to let someone else's dogmatic perspective drag you down, if you let it. And I refuse to be dragged down. I already devoted a specific amount of time to crying my eyes out, and I can't revisit that place. That Old Self died a few miles back, and now the New Self has been reborn and has to keep walking (for my sake and the kids'). I hope that makes sense.

 

Thank you for reaching out, debtman. I really, really appreciate it.

 

It's amazing how - with all the accumulated pain in this forum - that people are really able to extend their spirits to one another. It gives me tremendous hope.

 

 

worldgonewrong,

 

I know how you feel, 10 year relationship, 6 year marriage, 2 young kids. Wife found OM and decided (because of the state of our relationship, which was both of our faults) that she would be happier with him. So, now I get to deal with the loneliness, jealousy, separation, etc. while she has a new bf who focuses all of his attention on her because it's a new relationship. He has kids and a wife who he's in the process of getting separated from, so he can't give her the time she needs either, but, he is focused on her since they're still getting to know each other...

 

Anyway, that said, YES, women can certainly go through crisis and there's nothing you can do about it except let them do it and work on yourself. Be strong, get confident.

 

3 weeks is early, the hurt is still VERY new. Let me assure you, it gets better! I've been "in this" since October and things are finally starting to turn around. I'm getting active, getting into old hobbies and some new ones. Hanging out and doing things with my friends, making new friends and enjoying every second with my kids. The time I spend with them now is ENTIRELY about us and we just play and do things together. I miss every second I don't spend with them and resent the decision my wife made that has taken that time from me, but I have to let that go and enjoy what life has to offer.

 

Life is a wonderful thing. Enjoy every second. Work on making yourself the best person you can be, address YOUR issues from your relationship and work on fixing those so they don't get worked into your next relationship. Everything else will fall into place the way it should...

 

Good luck and keep posting...

[debtman]

Thanks for the nice words worldgonewrong. I used this site a lot when this all started and have gotten some wonderful advice, perspective and experienced growth and self-realization from the other posters in here and just want to try to pass that on whenever possible.

 

You're in a tough spot. The emotional roller coaster is a tough ride. Just remember, in the times when you're on the downhill drop, you WILL get back up, things WILL get better and the situation you're in is TEMPORARY.

 

Focus on the kids, that's the things that has allowed me to stay as rational in all of this as I have. If it weren't for them, it would have turned into a much nastier situation because I would have given in to the emotions I felt when I interacted with the stbx. I owe my sanity to an amazing support group of friends, family and forums.

 

Lots of hope here...lots of stories that end up very positive, whether the couple works out or not..

 

Keep posting and good luck!

[worldgonewrong]

thanks, debtman.

 

and one last question: is there a glossary of all these abbreviated terms I keep seeing popping up? I sussed out NC and LC, but "stbx" is one I've yet to crack. help!

[worldgonewrong]

thanks, debtman.

 

and one last question: is there a glossary of all these abbreviated terms I keep seeing popping up? I sussed out NC and LC, but "stbx" is one I've yet to crack. help!

 

Update: HA! OK, so I cracked the code all by myself: soon-to-be-ex.

 

Where's my gold star?

[willowthewisp]

 

p.s. I think you meant maintain NC/LC with wife, as opposed to kids, right?

 

Yes, I meant go NC if someone doesn't have kids or LC with the wife with only communication about the children and nothing else. My aplogies, I am in the midst of postgrad exams at the moment and fairly tired

[worldgonewrong]

UPDATE:

 

well, I'm keeping in the spirit of the 180's.

Because there are kids involved, of course I have to keep LC on that front.

 

But I'm proud of myself because today is the 1 month anniversary of our separation. I sat down, started writing an email to her about how I still loved her and saw things as repairable, how the kids would love nothing better than to have mommy and daddy together again, and then... I deleted the email without sending it.

 

It hurts, it stings - this day. But I gotta lean into the discomfort.

Reminding myself that I've already been dumped, and the next move/overture (if ever) is hers. But I ain't gonna hold my breath waiting.

 

p.s. have to confess, the urge to reach out is strong. It's worse than quitting cigarettes. If I reach out though, I'm worried about being ignored. And then having laid my heart on the line, after a month, I'm concerned that I would be at square one again.

Edited February 15, 2011 by worldgonewrong

[debtman]

Glad to hear you didn't send it. I have a variety of love and hate emails that I drafted and never sent. I like to save them so I can go back later and look at them and remember how I got here and the road that she put me on with her decisions.

 

I still see or talk to her everyday because of the kids and I try to keep it as LC as possible, but she is big into long conversations. Some interesting things came up yesterday that I'm going to start a new thread about, but, one thing I want to suggest to you that was VERY helpful to me. Write up a list of all the things about her that drove you crazy and look back at that every time you start feeling wistful or sad. You may not have as big a list as mine, but, after 20 years I'm sure there are some things to put on there.

 

Stay strong, work on yourself, keep posting!

[Yasuandio]

WGW, i've read yr thread over a couple of times. What strikes me odd are the dimension of the consequences you are suffering for that particular crime. Yes, throwing and breaking a plate on the wall is not good, and could be viewed as a violent gesture. But the death penility? The proportions of the outcome just seem outta wack to me, like a huge "GOT-CHA."

 

Every single piece of literature I read speaks to both spouses contributions to marital problems. It can't all be on you, with the plate incident serving as the partial reason and/or catalyst. Otherwise people would have to walk on pins and needles. Who of us has not thrown an object in anger? OK, it made a lot of noise. Some cultures break plates all the time. Per the kids, Daddy can explaination and apology, they will get over it. Take them to a Greek restaurant. Can not a wife forgive a good man for this trespass?

 

WGW, you are clearly a kind sensitive person, but you only have guts inside. As debtman points out, resentment sticks around. I have researched the topic myself, there are not many solutions offered out there. If this woman values her marriage, she'd best factor that in. [sometimes it's a good idea for the dumper to "look down the road" and try to project the possible consequences of their decision, just in case.]

Edited February 19, 2011 by Yasuandio

[worldgonewrong]

If this woman values her marriage, she'd best factor that in. [sometimes it's a good idea for the dumper to "look down the road" and try to project the possible consequences of their decision, just in case.]

 

 

First of all, thank you for your supportive and wise words.

 

I do not think she values the marriage. She values being right and her own sense of being wronged. I've done my penance 100 times over, so I do not feel guilt anymore. Just sad for our kids.

 

But yes, she's jerking me around on basic stuff.

We have to share a vehicle, and I suggested an easy plan: I eat dinner over at their house, while she's working, and then get the car upon her return.

 

She replied with, "I am not really comfortable with you eating here right now because we have so many monetary and legal issues."

Utter crazy horsesh*t.

I had to remind her that we've only been separated a month & 1 week. We're not 'embroiled' in some heavy situation; such nonsense.

She really lit my fuse with that one.

 

Now I have to spend the next day or two decompressing and trying not to take the bait. deeeeeep breaths....

[Yasuandio]

Worldgonewrong, you made a logical proposal bc of the family budget and limitations with transportation. She did not respond to the question. Instead, she used a good suggestion as an opportunity to stick to you. Re-affirming her newfound sense of reign over you. That's gotta be pretty emasculating.

 

How did you like the book? Let's face it, you are not entirely doing the 180 by the looks of your suggestion to her. It looks to me like you want to also keep hold of the home you that is so dear to your heart. That could be an ulterior motive that she suspected.

 

WGW, you gotta totally do the 180. And I would throw in a side of the "Last-Resort" once in awhile (see last chapter).

 

I got second book by her today, and have been receiving informative news letters from her as well. I wish I was tech-i enough to give you a link to the one today - it was on Middle-Aged-Crisis. I had already read it in her second book today, the Divorce Remedy. This book has the seven step program, but it is pretty much spelled out on her site and the regular emails that come in. Go to her blog and read ever short article from start finish. And sign up for the email thing.

 

I have also learned so much from the Marriage Builders website. Tons of free reading material. Keep posting.

[worldgonewrong]

Yasuandio-

 

You are absolutely right.

This past week and a half has seen me not doing well with the 180s.

I'd been terrific for a month, but I reasoned that things went awry partly

because she noticed how strong I've been AND she's taken pains to try and bring down my armor. It hit me last night how stupidly simple it was: that she has started to react to me being stronger.

 

That said, I'm back on the 180 horse!!

 

I really thank you for your support and wisdom, Yasuandio. Thanks for cheerleading/pep-talking me back to normalcy. Have a really good day.

 

p.s. Russell: if you're reading this: see? I backslide too. Guilty!

[russell1968]

Yasuandio-

 

You are absolutely right.

This past week and a half has seen me not doing well with the 180s.

I'd been terrific for a month, but I reasoned that things went awry partly

because she noticed how strong I've been AND she's taken pains to try and bring down my armor. It hit me last night how stupidly simple it was: that she has started to react to me being stronger.

 

That said, I'm back on the 180 horse!!

 

I really thank you for your support and wisdom, Yasuandio. Thanks for cheerleading/pep-talking me back to normalcy. Have a really good day.

 

p.s. Russell: if you're reading this: see? I backslide too. Guilty!

 

I am, hey been there done that! My situation was far more complex than

[Yasuandio]

WGW, is there any way for you to establish your own territory with public transportation? It may not be a good idea for you to be any where near that house. It prevents your wife from experiencing the feeling of loss. If she's to keepl the wheels, she can drop off and pick up the kids on your days.

 

Im sensing she may have a pretty confident, if not snappy attitude. She got to make the decision to put you out. If there is any thing required for your comfort or mental well being, the next rather than "ask" - I would either "tell" or better stll just "do it " - as the latter does not involve convo with her.

 

If she says anything about your personal decisions, its a great opportunity to ignore her. Do you have family that can help you? What I'm envisioning OSS you setting up a nice bacholar pad near your work, with bunkbed, toys for the kids, a place to cook, etc. No more reliance on her. Whatta ya think about that?

[worldgonewrong]

WGW, is there any way for you to establish your own territory with public transportation? It may not be a good idea for you to be any where near that house. It prevents your wife from experiencing the feeling of loss. If she's to keep the wheels, she can drop off and pick up the kids on your days.

 

Oh yeah, I'm no stranger to walking, buses, and bumming a ride.

Point is, she will have to get used to sharing the car (in my name, btw).

 

 

Im sensing she may have a pretty confident, if not snappy attitude. She got to make the decision to put you out. If there is any thing required for your comfort or mental well being, the next rather than "ask" - I would either "tell" or better stll just "do it " - as the latter does not involve convo with her.

 

1. you nailed her attitude. It's blinders. She put me out with virtually zero discussion. It was all no-no-no, then she got to spill her guts with confidence to a therapist, in my presence, without ever addressing anything to my face previously. Insane.

 

2. I will be ALL business. My follow-up email to her yesterday was basically "this is how it's going to be done on the days when I have the car."

 

Do you have family that can help you? What I'm envisioning OSS you setting up a nice bacholar pad near your work, with bunkbed, toys for the kids, a place to cook, etc. No more reliance on her. Whatta ya think about that?

 

I have lots of family and friend support. I am truly blessed in that regard. I'm also blessed in that I live close to work and have a great space for my children.

 

Bottom line is, you're right. I have to mentally break free or else I will be dragged down by old (warm and faded) memories and the "what if's". A person can drown in that stuff and never have a life.

[debtman]

I have to mentally break free or else I will be dragged down by old (warm and faded) memories and the "what if's". A person can drown in that stuff and never have a life.

 

You are correct. Just remember, the person you made those warm memories with is NOT the person who you are dealing with. That person has left. I call it the Jekyll/Hyde switch and I have to occasionally remind myself that I'm dealing with Hyde...ALL the time. Even if she's acting like Jekyll, I have to remember that Hyde is lurking back there.

 

Then I take out my list of things that she did that drove me crazy and I smile and feel that OM will someday get what he deserves and that they are perfect for each other.

 

I remind myself of what I need to remember from this failed relationship, look forward to the next time I get my kids and start planning something to do for ME right now.

 

Life is good and it's only getting better...once I move back into my house, it will be wonderful!!

[worldgonewrong]

You too speak the truth, debtman.

 

Here's the thing I find so...disturbing or unsettling:

 

A Life change like this IS a 180 from one's previous life.

Which is traumatic enough.

And THEN, we have to try and adhere to the principles of the 180's.

It's a 180 on top of a 180.

It's a wonder we all don't have emotional whiplash!

[Yasuandio]

Why don't cha' throw a couple monkey wrenches into the double 180 martini? Some examples:

 

1. Blonde highlights (professionally done at a salon)

 

2. New Lambskin Biker Jacket.

 

3. A Harley would be nice.

 

4. You can afford to have an ear pierced!

 

5. A new cologne - I like Armani Black Code. It's pretty cheap on Ebay. Or you get a grouping of sample sizes for a good price on Ebay also.

 

6. Grow a tidy go-tee, or whatever looks good on you.

 

7. Some new really kick ass jeans and boots.

 

8. Stylish and tight leather britches (only if you look smashing in them otherwise forget it).

 

These are just off the top of my head, and most are affordable. Can you think up some better stuff?

 

When asked about such aesthetic transformations (and it's very likely that inquiring minds will want to know), here is your standard broken record response: "Oh, that?" (pause, - then touch or look at thing in question for a moment). Then say, "Yeah, right!" You then go on to next topic.

Edited February 23, 2011 by Yasuandio

[worldgonewrong]

Yasuandio-

 

I love your list! Pure awesomeness!

 

Here are some good 180's I've done so far:

 

1. Cut way down on drinking

2. I have LOST my paunch -- for the first time in years, my abs/stomach/whatever actually looks darn good

3. Dyed my hair its natural color (I went grey way too early)

4. I've become insanely fiscally responsible, which is a terrific feeling

5. add to that, I finally became a stock-market investor

 

Yeah, I have taken some bold, confident steps. Gotta keep on stepping!

[Yasuandio]

I had fun making the list for you! LS is helping to take my mind off my own issues. Just wish I could take my own advice. Maybe you should make it a point to continue incorporating a new monkey wrench every week!

 

Since you are a big time Stock Market Investor now, maybe a couple of snazzy suits are in order.

 

You gotta get a leather or steel briefcase, or some kinda man bag.

 

Oh, yeah, big stock market investor, make sure you're up-to-date with all your tech devices: (ear-gear, belt attachment, car accessories, and don't forget the apps -- "Fake Call" is a must; then there's another that provides selected backround sounds such as a club, bar, supermarket, chirping birds, basketball game, etcetera. You can even program your own background sound. Iimagine, the wife calls, and she hears the New York Stock Exchange Market in the background while you happen to be outta town!)

 

Congrats! That is impressive progress! I wonder what's been holding you back on such accomplishments?

Edited February 23, 2011 by Yasuandio