_For those who can't get dates in their late 20s, 30s and 40s

[goldengirl11]

Tips for classes which men would go to please? Was thinking golf and wine tasting...

 

Just read your tips re classes to try Fred. Too late to edit.

[goldengirl11]

Saw this ad while clicking on a weather website tonight.

Think you could change the words a little and apply it to trying to date someone.

 

 

Fishing.

Know what your fish want to nibble on.

If you have a certain fish in mind that you want to land, try to predict what they will be hungry for, and always bring at least five back-up plans.

 

Very witty! I would hate to be someone's back up plan though. Mind you, am pretty sure I was last time.

Edited May 6, 2012 by goldengirl11

[chphan]

Have more to say but the key is to get off the couch and move away from your "comfort zone."

If things are a bit too comfortable for you, and all you do is go to work and stay in your apt. at night or with your family (like I did in my early and mid-20s), things need to change.

 

 

I have to admit this is what I'm most guilty of and still am. Working 6 days a week doesn't give me much room and after work I'm always just tired and relax that I don't want to do much. Its like you want to go out and meet people and date but at the same time just don't want to because its much better to stay home and relax after work.

 

This is probably one of the few topics that are good and useful in this forum.

[FredRutherford]

Have you guys ever listened to women describing guys they know?

I hear women saying,

"...He's just a friend... There's no attraction. I can't see it going anywhere..."

 

A woman I dated, that 30 y.o. virgin I met @26 in a church singles group, asked her why she didn't ever go out with this other guy in that group. Casey, a neat-looking guy, looked like he had his act together and like he'd be a great guy for a Christian woman to date.

 

"...Oh... no... it could never be..." she said of him.

She really didn't have answer for me, and I assured her I was glad she was dating me (a newcomer to that singles group) instead of him, but was curious about her "selection" process.

 

If a woman doesn't sense interest from a guy pretty early, she feels like she's not attractive to her and it feels kinda offensive, so I read.

Maybe that's what happened with him. He'd been in that singles group a while, but maybe he was shy and hadn't asked any women, like my GF, out.

 

Have also read:

You have to approach a woman as a man, and not try to be her friend. Make your interest clear right away.

 

You do not want to try to be her friend, see how things develop, or wait to ask her out.

 

Guys that have posted on this say they've found that trying to be friends first or letting things develop rarely works for them, even in the most devout religious circles.

Action plan for someone who has never dated

 

Christian woman or not, she's still a woman and women have attraction needs.

If she thinks you're not "interested" in her, she places you in a friendzone, which I think I got locked into on occasion, but didn't know anything about this then.

 

Like the great 1970s Eagles song, Take It Easy, says,

Take It Easy has these great lines that are applicable to single guys asking women out:

 

 

Well I'm standin' on the corner in Winslow, Arizona, such a fine sight to see.

It's a girl my lord in a flat bed Ford slowin' down to take a look at me.

Come on baby, don't say maybe,

I gotta know if your sweet love is gonna save me...

We may lose and we may win,

But we will never be here again.

So open up, I'm climbing in, so Take It Easy.

 

 

Let's be careful out there guys and stay out of the friendzone.

[Dirk]

Well here is mine delightfull story. I'm shy, i get nervous around girls really nervous and i make al these stupid excuses why it's better that i didn't approach anyone. I always fall for the wrong type of girl. Just like recently i met this girl, i talked to her and we laught allot. Afterwards i added her on facebook, we talked i maked her laugh again and there was this great vibe. All of a sudden (the day after) she just starts ignoring me. She red my comment ("hi how are you?") and went offline. I really don't understand women, i really don't.

[Ross MwcFan]

Well here is mine delightfull story. I'm shy, i get nervous around girls really nervous and i make al these stupid excuses why it's better that i didn't approach anyone. I always fall for the wrong type of girl. Just like recently i met this girl, i talked to her and we laught allot. Afterwards i added her on facebook, we talked i maked her laugh again and there was this great vibe. All of a sudden (the day after) she just starts ignoring me. She red my comment ("hi how are you?") and went offline. I really don't understand women, i really don't.

 

**** those bitches. (Not literally).

[Necris]

I’ve seen many “I’m a shy guy and can’t get any dates!” type of threads by guys in their late 20s, 30s and 40s who need help.

 

Some of these guys have never asked a girl out or only dated sporadically.

 

 

Interesting, now I can only speak for myself but I do actually at least try to ask a girl out but in my case women simply don't find me attractive or I'm missing "swag" or charisma so I'm always rejected. Now I do date only sporadically I guess its a combination of not asking enough women out (I heard you should ideally talk to 5 women a day or something, that's something I can't do) and being rejected most of the time before a single date has ever happened. In the rare case that I have been on a date it has never worked out I'm either rejected, played with, or in the best case scenario "friend-zoned".

[Necris]

As for myself I'm in my 20s I'm not very physically attractive, clumsy/goofy acting, never had a romantic relationship, never had sex, shy, gets nervous around people easily, nerdy, can't relate to and understand people that well especially women, I feel like I'm going a little crazy, and women seem cold and distant (hell I can relate more to anime women than real women which is pretty sad) so I don't think I'll be in a relationship anytime soon.

 

I am however tall, strong (I'm not shredded or really that buff but people seem to be able to tell that I'm a bit stronger than average), intelligent (people think of me as intelligent and highly imaginative I kind of come off as a walking encyclopedia so I guess I have a sort of genius presence around me unfortunately lately my brain power has gone down the toilet so I'm not to sure about being highly intelligent.), and I'm naturally a friendly nice guy.

[Badsingularity]

 

Aside from those mental walls above, my main issue is simply not knowing how to talk to women. Seriously, this has to be my biggest weakness ever. I lack the proper ability to approach a woman with confidence and actually have something interesting to say to them. Of course you can always be basic, but don't women consider that boring? I've read plenty of topics and excerpts from books on this, and I really feel lost at this point.

 

Is this something that can still be obtained....at 23? I never look at anything as impossible, but the more I think about it, the more I'm starting to feel that being a good communicator to women is unreachable for me. I don't really want to believe that. I really don't understand why I'm like this towards women. It just feels ridiculous. I really feel like this is destroying my social life before I even have a chance at experiencing it.

 

 

I know it's easier said than done, but the less you try to be interesting the more attractive and at ease you will be. You will find that when you are relaxed and not trying to sound interesting the words coming out of your mouth will flow much more freely and natuarally.

 

Don't worrying about being boring. Don't worry about what you are going to say. The less you worry and more you relaxed your are the more attractive you will be. Even if what you are actually saying may seem boring to you.

 

When you are talking to a women, it is more about how you feel while you are talking to her and less about what you are actually saying.

 

When you feel calm and cool and are not worried about what you are saying, you project confidence, conversation flows much more naturally and the women you are talking to will feel at ease and enjoy your presence.

 

At 23 you still have plenty of time to work on it. I was at the same spot you are now when I was 23.

 

How do you develope these skills and become calm and worry free while talking to women? Practice.

 

Talk to women. Approach women and talk to them, even when you are nervous and freaking out inside. It is the only way to get used to it. Go into it knowing that your probably going to bomb it and just understand that you are practicing. Doing this takes courage and you should be proud of yourself for stepping through your fear and doing it anyway. When it doesn't go well, wich many times it won't in the beggining don't be discouraged, give your self a pat on the back for doing what many guys can never bring themselves to do.

 

After practicing and puting yourself outside of your comfort zone for a while you will start to notice that you will get less and less nervous when talking to women and the sting of rejections will start to fade.

[Cracker Jack]

Thanks, bro. So much time has passed by since making that post, but I'm in a much better state of mind than I was when making it. I'm 24 now, but still learning the ways of communication. Not gonna lie, I'm still ass when it comes to straight up approaching women, but I've been better. One of my issues now is running out of things to say because I'm thinking too much. I really think when I stop trying to be so great, and actually relax, I'll be able to have more natural interactions with women. Right now, I kinda feel like I'm just....

 

I also have the tendency of putting myself on the spot to make an approach, only to (think of a ridiculous excuse) back off and feel a sigh of relief knowing I avoided a likely rejection. This is bad, but usually I laugh at how silly it is rather than let the regret consume me as much as I did before.

 

I think, as you said, I just have to do it more often. One approach once in a while is okay, but it's not....nearly enough if I want to meet my goals. Like anything, getting good at this will require practice. One of these days I'm just going to dedicate an entire day to this and see where it goes.

[Badsingularity]

Thanks, bro. So much time has passed by since making that post, but I'm in a much better state of mind than I was when making it. I'm 24 now, but still learning the ways of communication. Not gonna lie, I'm still ass when it comes to straight up approaching women, but I've been better. One of my issues now is running out of things to say because I'm thinking too much. I really think when I stop trying to be so great, and actually relax, I'll be able to have more natural interactions with women. Right now, I kinda feel like I'm just....

 

I also have the tendency of putting myself on the spot to make an approach, only to (think of a ridiculous excuse) back off and feel a sigh of relief knowing I avoided a likely rejection. This is bad, but usually I laugh at how silly it is rather than let the regret consume me as much as I did before.

 

I think, as you said, I just have to do it more often. One approach once in a while is okay, but it's not....nearly enough if I want to meet my goals. Like anything, getting good at this will require practice. One of these days I'm just going to dedicate an entire day to this and see where it goes.

 

Sounds like you already know how to get better at talking to and approaching women, like you said you've just got to start doing it more often and doing it even when you feel that fear that your going to get rejected.

 

A couple of tips that may help you when you feel like your running out of things to say.

 

First. If you are alone with a woman don't be afraid of those silent moments. They are natural. If you just try to relax when you run out of things to say and let it go quiet for a moment without panicking, your brain will usually come up with something easier and pretty quick. Especially if you are able to not worry too much about what your saying.

 

Second. Don't be afraid to change the subject and talk about something goofy or just anything realy. What I would do sometimes when I ran out of things to say, I would just look around at the walls of whereever I was and would just talk about something on the wall, like a painting, or picture, or anything in a room, like a couch, or the paint. Sounds goofy but it actaully works.

 

Third. I'm sure you already know this, but if you run out of stuff to say just keep asking her questions and don't worry about whether they are boring or not. Like I said before. How you feel while you are talking to her is more important than what you are actually saying. If you can feel relaxed, she will feel relaxed. If you feel calm, she will feel calm.

 

 

This stuff took me several years of practice to learn and it's something I still work on. So don't get discouraged if it doesn't come too quickly. From what you just posted and what I've seen of your past posts you should be doing fine in a few years.

[FredRutherford]

 

I also have the tendency of putting myself on the spot to make an approach, only to (think of a ridiculous excuse) back off and feel a sigh of relief knowing I avoided a likely rejection. This is bad, but usually I laugh at how silly it is rather than let the regret consume me as much as I did before.

 

I think, as you said, I just have to do it more often. One approach once in a while is okay, but it's not....nearly enough if I want to meet my goals. Like anything, getting good at this will require practice. One of these days I'm just going to dedicate an entire day to this and see where it goes.

Plan to post later my first "cold call" experience @27-28 which resulted in her accepting my dinner date invitation and a 1.5 yr. dating relationship.

Yes, it seemed a little scary and TBH, didn't do a lot of cold calls.

Saw her and just felt I had to try something...

 

 

 

If you are alone with a woman don't be afraid of those silent moments. They are natural.

Good advice.

Silence is good and natural. Just like there's a break between sentences in conversation or verses in a song or a break between songs on the LP (or CD).

Silence is Golden, as they say.

Of course, TOTAL silence would be bad, but it's good to not seem like you're dominating the conversation.

 

You certainly don't want her to later tell her friend, "Gosh... he was such a chatterbox, rarely letting me get a word in edgewise..."

 

 

If you just try to relax when you run out of things to say and let it go quiet for a moment without panicking, your brain will usually come up with something easier and pretty quick. Especially if you are able to not worry too much about what your saying.

Good tip.

That may also give the lady a chance to say something or think of something to say.

 

Don't be afraid to change the subject and talk about something goofy or just anything realy.

Make the transitions seem natural.

Say you're talking about music and a particular group.

If it flows, ask, "Do you like the Beatles?"

If you're talking music don't suddenly shift the conversation to some unrelated topic...

 

This is one reason I suggest "activity" dates like dinner dates, visits to museums, visits to community fairs, arts and crafts fairs, etc., places and things where you two can see things and comment on the things you see.

 

Say... you see an interesting piece of artwork. Or a nice antique or craft at the Memorial Day city festival.

Dinner dates are good for the first date or so, but then can move to an activity date which also includes a meal.

 

Third. I'm sure you already know this, but if you run out of stuff to say just keep asking her questions and don't worry about whether they are boring or not. Like I said before. How you feel while you are talking to her is more important than what you are actually saying. If you can feel relaxed, she will feel relaxed. If you feel calm, she will feel calm.

 

 

This stuff took me several years of practice to learn and it's something I still work on. So don't get discouraged if it doesn't come too quickly. From what you just posted and what I've seen of your past posts you should be doing fine in a few years.

Prime advice.

Focus the conversation on her.

Ask her about her interests, her career, job, where she works, what got her interested in that field, what college she went to, what she does in her spare time, what she likes to do, would like to do, her family, where she's traveled, what music she likes, etc.

 

People don't like to talk only about themselves so naturally, she'll ask you some questions and you can build rapport from there.

Edited June 8, 2012 by FredRutherford

[mortensorchid]

I think the best advice you can give anyone is "Don't be afraid to take a risk". There are no absolutes in life despite the best laid plans, this is one of them. There is no such thing as a person who has never been burned in their lives, but we always give it another try. Those who have truly given up, give up. You CAN do whatever it is that you want, you just have to test your own limits and take chances. All the person can do or say is no. And, this is a numbers game as well. If it doesn't work with one, try the next one.

[Cracker Jack]

I totally understand where you're coming from. The awkward moments of silence are usually the momentum killers, so to speak. I'm usually thinking I have to come up with something very quickly if I'm going to maintain the interaction, and that usually does nothing but build tons of unneccessary presure, and we know that does no good.

 

There have been plenty of times where I'd want to change the subject, but was often worried that it would probably bore or annoy them. Constantly worrying about how I might affect the girl, honestly, is one of my biggest weaknesses here. If I simply did not give a fluke, I'd be in a much better position than I am now, but it's all good.

 

The main thing that comes to mind when running out of things to say is to just leave. This is really lame, because I know, even if I have a tough time keeping my composure, that I still have a fighting chance as long as I keep pushing myself. It's funny because when I often interacted with (in the distant past) girls on the phone, it was quite easy.

 

What I wasn't able to do in person came natural while on the phone; and I always knew if I was able to utilize this type of approach when in direct contact with them, things would go much smoother. I know I can make girls laugh, and this really is key. Heck, some girls would often playfully laugh at the silliest things I'd say, or how I'd answer them.

 

It always seemed like my shyness would intrigue them even more, but often that same shyness did more bad than good, because when I didn't keep up the interaction as much as I should've, they often thought it was because I didn't like them. Whenever I'd find this out later, I'd often kick myself constantly because I knew it was my fault.

 

But yeah, man, I really couldn't agree with you more. Stuff like this needs constant refining, and while it feels good making an approach every now and then, when you get away from it, you drop back to square 1, and it's kinda difficult to improve if you're not doing what you can to get better. There's no magical potion, or some special shortcut.

 

You just have to work hard and not only develop thick skin, but also change your mindset. I feel like once that's done, you'd really be on the road to success. While most would be afraid at the idea of needing to practice for a long period of time to get better, it actually excites me. I'm more afraid at doing nothing and getting nowhere, if anything.

 

Besides, my brain is logical enough to understand where my issues lie. Not just that, but the fact that it's FRIGGIN SUMMER!!!! Beautiful women are out, the sun is shining beautifully. That should be enough reason to get off my ass and make a woman's day by approaching them and making their day! I know constantly waiting for the perfect moment to approach only prolongs the day you'll actually approach a woman.

 

I mean, at the end of the day, this isn't life or death, this is meeting women and improving yourself constantly. I started to lose track of what the meaning of my goal was, but now, I feel a better sense of what needs to be done from here on in. Thanks again for waking me up, singularity!!

Edited June 8, 2012 by Cracker Jack

[Floridaman]

***** Bumping to keep from expiring or locking up *****

[Floridaman]

upon request, opening again to "bump" the thread...

[Floridaman]

bumping to keep alive...

[ThaWholigan]

I totally understand where you're coming from. The awkward moments of silence are usually the momentum killers, so to speak. I'm usually thinking I have to come up with something very quickly if I'm going to maintain the interaction, and that usually does nothing but build tons of unneccessary presure, and we know that does no good.

 

There have been plenty of times where I'd want to change the subject, but was often worried that it would probably bore or annoy them. Constantly worrying about how I might affect the girl, honestly, is one of my biggest weaknesses here. If I simply did not give a fluke, I'd be in a much better position than I am now, but it's all good.

 

The main thing that comes to mind when running out of things to say is to just leave. This is really lame, because I know, even if I have a tough time keeping my composure, that I still have a fighting chance as long as I keep pushing myself. It's funny because when I often interacted with (in the distant past) girls on the phone, it was quite easy.

 

What I wasn't able to do in person came natural while on the phone; and I always knew if I was able to utilize this type of approach when in direct contact with them, things would go much smoother. I know I can make girls laugh, and this really is key. Heck, some girls would often playfully laugh at the silliest things I'd say, or how I'd answer them.

 

It always seemed like my shyness would intrigue them even more, but often that same shyness did more bad than good, because when I didn't keep up the interaction as much as I should've, they often thought it was because I didn't like them. Whenever I'd find this out later, I'd often kick myself constantly because I knew it was my fault.

 

But yeah, man, I really couldn't agree with you more. Stuff like this needs constant refining, and while it feels good making an approach every now and then, when you get away from it, you drop back to square 1, and it's kinda difficult to improve if you're not doing what you can to get better. There's no magical potion, or some special shortcut.

 

You just have to work hard and not only develop thick skin, but also change your mindset. I feel like once that's done, you'd really be on the road to success. While most would be afraid at the idea of needing to practice for a long period of time to get better, it actually excites me. I'm more afraid at doing nothing and getting nowhere, if anything.

 

Besides, my brain is logical enough to understand where my issues lie. Not just that, but the fact that it's FRIGGIN SUMMER!!!! Beautiful women are out, the sun is shining beautifully. That should be enough reason to get off my ass and make a woman's day by approaching them and making their day! I know constantly waiting for the perfect moment to approach only prolongs the day you'll actually approach a woman.

 

I mean, at the end of the day, this isn't life or death, this is meeting women and improving yourself constantly. I started to lose track of what the meaning of my goal was, but now, I feel a better sense of what needs to be done from here on in. Thanks again for waking me up, singularity!!

Dude, WHERE ARE YOU?!?!?

[FredRutherford]

I’ve seen many “I’m a shy guy and can’t get any dates!” type of threads by guys in their late 20s, 30s and 40s who need help.

 

Some of these guys have never asked a girl out or only dated sporadically.

Interesting, now I can only speak for myself but I do actually at least try to ask a girl out but in my case women simply don't find me attractive or I'm missing "swag" or charisma so I'm always rejected.

 

Now I do date only sporadically I guess its a combination of not asking enough women out (I heard you should ideally talk to 5 women a day or something, that's something I can't do) and being rejected most of the time before a single date has ever happened.

 

In the rare case that I have been on a date it has never worked out I'm either rejected, played with, or in the best case scenario "friend-zoned".

Curious, Necris, how are things going?

 

Are you actively engaging women in conversation?

 

but I do actually at least try to ask a girl out but in my case women simply don't find me attractive or I'm missing "swag" or charisma so I'm always rejected.

Good... you should always at least try.

You won't get anything by not askin'.

 

Now I do date only sporadically I guess its a combination of not asking enough women out (I heard you should ideally talk to 5 women a day or something, that's something I can't do) and being rejected most of the time before a single date has ever happened.

Yes, probably a good idea to talk with as many girls as you can, but 5 a day may be a bit much for a shy guy.

Focus on a couple.

 

In the rare case that I have been on a date it has never worked out I'm either rejected, played with, or in the best case scenario "friend-zoned".

Can only advise you to keep trying.

And yes, try to avoid the friend-zone.

 

but I do actually at least try to ask a girl out but in my case women simply don't find me attractive or I'm missing "swag" or charisma so I'm always rejected.

I've been where you've been so know what it's like.

 

Not sure what the problem was as people did tell me I was good-looking, but I considered myself "average" in terms of looks.

Still, I don't think looks are the big factor in getting women.

 

Can say more but wanted to get an update from you.

Edited January 23, 2013 by FredRutherford

[pbjbear]

Your view may change - or you may need an "attitude adjustment" as you get older.

When you get closer to 30, you'll find you're not attracting those young 20-year-olds and when you do date them, you may find they really don't have that much depth anyway and you may look to women closer to your own age or go for women older than you.

 

I avoided the young girls who didn't seem to have eyes for me and went for the more attainable.

 

During my late 20s and early 30s- I purposefully dated women who were a 3-5 years older than me, figuring I'd have a better chance of finding one of them as a life partner, which is what I was desperately seeking at that lonely time in my life.

 

That's a critical mistake you're making.

The "hot" ones have lots of choices and guys always going after them.

 

In supply & demand, Less supply = more demand = higher prices (more competition).

 

The other woman, the one you may call plain, she likely doesn't have so many opportunities and therefore might be more receptive to you asking her out.

 

These women may be "plain" looking, but I don't think they'd be ugly. Some of them may have trouble dating too.

Who knows, you could form some relationships. Looks aren't everything you know.

 

Recently met again the 27 y.o. daughter of a client during a call on this client's office. This guy is big in the industry I work in.

I think most would consider his daughter rather plain in terms of looks, but she seems to be a sweet, nice quiet girl. Was pleasantly surprised to hear she had married.

 

Don't want to be mean here, but if you consider yourself "average" or "not a great-looking guy," why would you waste your time trying for the so-called "hot" girls?

 

They're not likely to give you the time of day. Why subject yourself to that kind of abuse? Wouldn't that be like hitting a brick wall?

 

I wasn't average or anything near "ugly," so I'm told- even in my 40s - but long had trouble getting women interested in me. My problem may have been more on self-confidence. It happens to all.

 

Adjust your 'specs and look towards the more attainable. There may be more of those available anyway.

 

I didn't date many "hot" girls and truth be told, didn't want to. Many don't have a lot of depth. Many are horrible at relationships and not that loyal, IMHO, and have pasts you may not be interested in.

 

This. Ive posted so many times about men settling and there always being a discrepancy between what they want and what they have. You summed up everything from a male point of view...one of the reasons I think relationships/marriage with men is a joke.

 

I dont want to be with a man who settles for me

[FredRutherford]

This. Ive posted so many times about men settling and there always being a discrepancy between what they want and what they have. You summed up everything from a male point of view...one of the reasons I think relationships/marriage with men is a joke.

 

I dont want to be with a man who settles for me

"Settles?"

I didn't mean that.

 

If a guy in his late 20s and early 30s gets frustrated by the ambivalence of the young 20-somethings, logically, it's best he try for women closer to his own age.

 

That's not "settling."

 

If a guy wants a loving, committed relationship, one leading to marriage (like I did), it's more likely those never-married women who are approaching or past 30 may be more receptive to that... and looking for a good guy too.

 

Will admit age is only one factor and love and a good relationship are needed.

And yes, women in their 30s can be irresponsible too, but there may be more that want a relationship. Speakin' in general here.

[pbjbear]

These men are talking about picking an average woman out because she has less options even though in reality he really desires the hotter one.

 

He picks the average girl out of fear

[FredRutherford]

These men are talking about picking an average woman out because she has less options even though in reality he really desires the hotter one.

 

He picks the average girl out of fear

I don't necessarily advise that, "settling.'

 

And yes, I see what you mean here.

 

But... if a guy's not good@dating (like I wasn't through all my 20s)... and you meet an "average" woman... you two fall in love... what's wrong with that?

 

Am sure it works the other way around...

...the "plain" or "average" gal "settles" for what she can get??

As long as they love each other and one's not marrying for other reasons...

 

 

Lemmee tell you about a gal I could have asked out...

She sat next to me in a college class. Was always striking-up conversation.

Most would call her "plain" or "average."

 

But I was shy... and didn't pick-up on the signals she sent.

 

Only in the last year did it hit me that I could've asked her out.

Now, there's no guarantee she'd have accepted and no guarantee any relationship would've come out of it... but still... could've been "the one" for me (then).

 

And... as I dated but wasn't very good at it... look what she could've offered had it did work out...

Looks aren't everything, you know.

As it turns out, I didn't meet future wife until I turned 30....

[GoodOnPaper]

These men are talking about picking an average woman out because she has less options even though in reality he really desires the hotter one.

 

He picks the average girl out of fear

 

So what? If things work out, all the better. To a certain extent, attainability is attractive and if an "average" girl actually expresses interest, that alone would likely make her stand out -- at least compared to other "average" girls.

 

Now, would there be the same uninhibited carnal passion that we typically associate with very good looking people being drawn together for purely physical reasons? My experience makes me skeptical but some people say yes.

[FredRutherford]

***Bumping *** (again)

 

Plan to add some other material, some information regarding a guy in his late 20s who's almost given-up on trying to get a date.