"Parenting issues" and NC

[debtman]

I dropped the kids off last night at my W's new rental house and everything went fine, we talked about the schedule for the rest of the week and my W told me (again) that our daughter "really wants us to all have dinner sometime." And I said that I'd have to wait until I got settled in my house (she moved out 3 weeks ago and I'm still unpacking my stuff because I have to pack up her stuff first and set it out on the porch for her to pick up...then I have to clean the rooms that she trashed before she moved out or had never cleaned when we were living here). However, I don't plan to have dinner with her and fill her week when OM can't be around for her. I'd rather spend that time with my kids by myself.

 

Anyway, tonight I got a message from her saying that we really need to talk sometime about parenting issues. And that she feels like our daughter is being so stubborn and rebellious because she's "getting away" with more when she is with me. She said she specifically wants to talk about manners and rough-housing.

 

Now, I've ALWAYS enforced good manners on our kids and I make sure they say "please" and "thank you" and ask to be excused, don't interrupt, etc. and that has never changed so I don't know what she's talking about there.

 

As far as the rough-housing, I let the kids climb on me, get on my shoulders, I "trap" them and they escape, we play "tickle monster", etc. just like we always have. That was never an issue until I heard her say that "some people" (OM) don't like it when the kids climb on them. I have NEVER had a problem with the kids climbing on ANYONE else but me and, if they ever tried I always told them that was not allowed. So, if OM can't say "no" or she can't say "no" when he's around, that's not my problem. And I don't see why I should have to give up that fun stuff with my kids just because she can't control them.

 

She suggested that we go to counseling with our daughter because "she's having a really hard time with this and is being very rebellious." She's not being that rebellious with me and, when she is, we just talk about it, discuss things and figure out how we can fix the problem or we get time out or something taken away if we can't behave.

 

I'm fine with going to counseling (although I don't think we need to bring our daughter with us) except that the one time we tried MC she HATED someone else telling her she might be wrong about something and she never went back.

 

I've talked with our daughter's school counselor on MANY occasions since this all started and got her enrolled in a kids "group" at school for "changing" families and she seems to be doing very well in the group.

 

I'm planning to call the counselor tomorrow and talk with her but am not sure what to say to my W when I talk with her. I'm fine talking with her about parenting, but am not going to change the way we did things before the D. I'm fine with going to counseling with her, but I don't think that's going to get us anywhere since she hates counseling.

 

Within the first few weeks that OM was spending lots of time with the kids they started telling me "poop" jokes. My W was always very strict about not joking about that stuff and not saying that word. When I told them they weren't supposed to joke about that and where did they hear that joke, they told me that they heard it from OM. So, I told them that I have no problem with poop jokes and we tell lots of poop jokes now. Funny how things are okay when it's OM doing something but not when it's me...

 

Anyway, anyone out there with any advice on discussing parenting while trying to remain as NC/LC as possible and not letting it turn into a big conversation, counseling sessions, etc.??

[Craig2425]

I don't have an answer but would she show you the same respect down the road?

We have a similar story and I know if it was to benefit my stbx in anyway she could easily just tell me to f off.

I mean look, they had not problem being selfish with the other stuff they've done.

I hope my stbx would never do anything like that but once you're split up it's your rules and it's their rules.

Good example. No poop joke while you were around and now there're cool?

Goodluck man!

I hope one day I'm as cool and collective as you are about all this.

[hopesndreams]

my W told me (again) that our daughter "really wants us to all have dinner sometime." And I said that I'd have to wait until I got settled in my house

 

If you had said yes to dinner, right away, with no hesitation, none of this below would have happened.

 

 

Anyway, tonight I got a message from her saying that we really need to talk sometime about parenting issues. And that she feels like our daughter is being so stubborn and rebellious because she's "getting away" with more when she is with me. She said she specifically wants to talk about manners and rough-housing.

 

I'd rather spend that time with my kids by myself.

 

Then do so. Tell her this. Isn't everything ironed out now about custody? Do you have something to lose if you are not nicey nice anymore? You are in the house now, so that can't be taken away from you, right?

 

Your daughter is rebellious while staying at her mums and your ex and OM can't handle her. Their problem. Not yours. Their happy little family life ain't happening and so soon too, what a shame. Sigh.

 

Your ex will be nice to you (all show) if she gets her way. Start bringing up the sh*t she does that you don't like and watch her transform into a major B. After she does this, and she will, go NC.

[BlindRage]

Hey Debtman, I always enjoyed reading your posts. You have a great positive outlook on life and it has rubbed off on me that you must enjoy it.

Thank you

[debtman]

I don't have an answer but would she show you the same respect down the road?

 

Good question. But, she has never taken my advice very well and, because of that, several years into the marriage, I just stopped offering it and stopped giving input. I wouldn't ever tell her "how" to parent. I didn't say anything about the "poop" jokes when they started because I never minded them, she did, until OM started them.

 

So, I'll certainly listen to what she has to say and will explain to her that I haven't changed anything about my parenting style (except that I'm much less stressed with the kids these days) and don't plan to.

 

If she wants to go see a counselor to talk about co-parenting, I'm fine with that. I'm going to talk to my daughter's school counselor today to see what she things about the rebellious behavior and if she sees anything like that going on.

 

I hope one day I'm as cool and collective as you are about all this.

 

Thanks, but believe me, I have my "un" cool moments as well. I just know that it won't do me any good to let her know that.

 

hopesndreams, you are VERY correct and I KNOW that, had I accepted her dinner offer, she would NOT have called about this.

 

We've "finished" mediation but haven't signed the separation agreement yet. We were waiting on her last round of medical exams to come through in case she needed to stay on my insurance plan (which it looks like she will since we've almost met my high deductible with all her appointments and tests). We've got to get that signed soon, but yes, I'm back in the house, the details are pretty much worked out and we agree on them. HOWEVER, I do realize that it is in my best interest (and the kids) if we can stay civil and not angry because we can determine the details of custody and child support at any time as long as we "agree" on them and they seem to be fair.

 

So, as much as I'd like to not have to be friendly to her ever again, it's not the best thing for me to do, so, I just remind myself that there's a difference between being friends and being friendly.

 

My daughter asked me the other night when I dropped them off why I don't ever come into the house when OM is there and I told her that I just had things I needed to take care of at home. She said that someday she wants me to come in and say 'hi' to him and I told her that someday (once the papers are signed) that I would.

 

BlindRage, thanks, and yes, life IS wonderful and I try to enjoy every minute of it. Whenever I feel myself getting down, getting angry, frustrated, etc. I just try to look at all the amazing friends, families, memories, kids, etc. that I have in my life and remind myself how incredibly lucky I am and have been and know that the future has amazing opportunities in store.

 

Thanks!

[starting2wakeup]

My W told me just the other day that our oldest daughter had been acting out when she was with her. She was being very mean to her little sister and was just generally being difficult. This was all rather surprising as she very rarely acts out when she is with me, and when she does, it is almost always very easy to get her to calm down or understand what it is she has done wrong. So, much like in your situation debtman, I asked myself, why is she acting one way with me and another around my wife?

 

I think the reason is because we are the stable parents. Think back to high school. When ever there was a substitute teacher, did you act the same around them as you did your regular teacher? Heck no. You acted up. You goofed off. He or she was just a sub. You had no senses of stability or respect with them because you knew they were not going to be there but for maybe one or two days. Children are very perceptive, more so than I ever thought imaginable. They can tell in a co-parenting situation which is the stable parent. Which parent generally seems to be invested in their time and their care. Which parent presents a constant patter of behavior.

 

debtman, we are the teachers and, at least for the moment, our spouses are the subs. We are fully invested in the life's of our children. We want nothing but the best for them and we have the desire to better ourselves, not only to become better people but to become better fathers. While I'm sure that our W's love their children, for the moment, they are acting different and to a degree selfish. They may not realize it, but it shows in their behavior and our children can see this. You have to remember, they see things that we will never see, as scary as that is.

 

Whether you decide to go to counseling with your W or not, the best advise I could give you would be to keep doing what your doing. Clearly your kids see you as the stable parent and they need that. Honestly, I don't know where I would be or what I would be doing with out my children right now. They are my world. I know you feel the same way. You are doing great debtman. Your a great father and your kids see that.

 

Good luck to you my friend and all the best to your children.

[yessy21]

So, I'll certainly listen to what she has to say and will explain to her that I haven't changed anything about my parenting style (except that I'm much less stressed with the kids these days) and don't plan to.

 

 

your daughter doesnt need counseling. who is this woman u married? why is she trying to make u miserable? she wants u to still want her... honestly... this is all an excuse that if it doesnt work out with OM u will still be clinging to her every word....

 

my cousin does this to her husband (theyre currently seperated). U keep being a good parent. u do what u have to do. NO dinner with her. just ur kids. ur noones second choice! do u understand? u dont need to stop doing anything... i would be scared if the OM wife was making allegations towards him and their kids... u dont know who that man is and how he is with ur children... U SOUND LIKE A GREAT PAPA.

[Yasuandio]

With regards to the monsterous climbing behavior in which you are encouraging your youngters to engage, it appears that you are not the only fellow with boundery issues. If he remain concerned with the Prehistoric physical, maybe you can suggest he try the questioning technique I posed on the subject.

 

In light of concerns YOU WELL KNOW your wife has about "poop jokes," I certainly do not understand why you haven't been a big-asses tattle tale by now, as this was a perfect opportunity. Debtman, why would you want to encourage "excrement conversations" and/or "joking about excrement" with your children, especially when you are well aware of your wife's position of this "fecal" matter?

 

I urge you to serious consider the potential consequences of what you have reduced to "poop jokes:"

 

Do you want the kids to have the childhood of Salvidore Dali, an artist that was completely fixcated on such bodily functions as a child? Don't you think the children will be educated enough in the area of gastrointestinal functioning at school? Did it ever occur to you that the OM's obsession (and your further encouragement) could actually be the cause of a disturbance in the classroom when the human body is the subject? Suppose the children discuss these "excrement" topics on the playground and say, "Daddy and OM told us this stuff!" have you considered the impact this type of dicsiccusion might influence other impressionable youngsters? How would you like to get some calls from concerned parents, or Heavens forbit, the Principal? Debtman, I can surely understand why your wife doesn't appreciate this sh_t.

Edited April 2, 2011 by Yasuandio

[debtman]

Yas & OpenRoad, thanks for the laugh, but those were some crappy jokes.