So tired of this...

[worriedsick]

Ok, I posted this in another area, but figured I would try my luck here as well.

 

To make a long story short, I am married to a wonderful man and while I love him, I am not sure that I am still in love with him. He is my best friend and I can't imagine my life without him, but don't really feel "romantic" towards him. Meanwhile, I have left myself fall in love (maybe) with a friend of mine. I realize that having that friend in my life will only further complicate my marriage, and since I am having a hard enough time with it, I have decided to cut the OM out of the picture. Now, this is where I am left - totally depressed. I spend most of my day thinking about the OM and am so hung up on him and miss him so much that I can barely eat or sleep. Meanwhile, my H has no clue what is going on. He tries to initiate intimacy, but it's all I can do to even have a conversation with him without crying, so the intimacy is pretty much a no-go. When it does happen, my heart isn't in it at all and I just want it to hurry up and end. He hasn't done anything to deserve how I am behaving, but I just can't seem to "act normally" with him. He knows something's wrong, but not what. The more I pull away, the harder he tries to make me happy, which makes me feel like even more of an ********* than I already do. I have tried doing the reconnection stuff like making special time for us, going on "dates", etc, and nothing has helped. I am left feeling like I am losing something very important to me, and even resent my H sometimes for it (even though again, he hasn't done anything wrong). Any insight??

[An3maePhreek]

You are obviously not happy with things the way they are now, so why remain in this standstill? I think it's pretty obvious that you should let your H know so the both of you can move on to the next stage of your lives. It's not fair to yourself or to him that you stay silent, pining for the OM, but afraid to "lose" your H. At this point in time, you don't even realize that you've already lost it: your attachment to your relationship. Ignoring it is not going to fix it. You've said that you've tried to rekindle the passion and it's not working. This is not a case of the both of you losing sight of each other and you just need time to get to to know one another again, this is you already moved on but afraid of the unknown future without your failsafe: your H. For your happiness and for his, you need to let your H know that you are no longer in love with him, that you love him but no longer as one loves a lifetime partner. That you are aware that you've been distant and are regretful that it is so. That you've tried but can no longer deny. Only when he knows what the problem is with your lack of intimacy can he also have a choice in what to do: which is the right thing. Ultimately, it is a scary thing to have to acknowledge that a relationship has reached its end and LET GO. But you'll both be better off.

 

As for the OM, I would wait until your current relationship has ended and you've experienced being single again before engaging in any sort of relationship. I can't help but think of the 80-20 rule, and believe that any quick decisions to jump into another serious relationship would not be beneficial to yourself. Let yourself get to know what is it exactly that you were looking for but could not find in your marriage. When you're sure that this OM or any OM is everything that your H provided you AND what you were missing, then would it be a good idea to get back into the swing of relationships.

[SummersEve]

Worried, I have fallen in and out of love with my husband several times, I think it's normal. The cares of the daily drudge together have a way of killing off romance and couples are not told to expect it or how to bring it back so they sometimes think it's over when it's just in a slump.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if your strong feelings for new guy are really just a cheap trick. As in you projecting in what's missing in your marriage onto this guy when really it's not the truth. I think that is what affairs usually are. It's so intoxicating because it is filled in (in imagination) with whatever it is that's lacking in your marriage.

 

I think this is an emergency wake up call and you need to go to marriage counseling with your husband immediately. If he's a good man and you felt it before you can feel it again.

 

Other ideas, take that energy you are wasting on new guy and give it to your husband. Does not the one who is there in the trenches with you day in and out deserve it? Plan a weekend getaway, buy some nice lingerie and read some erotica at bedtime, go out on a date, do something different. Give him a compliment every day, do something really dirty (the good kind of dirty) to him, turn on the radio and slow dance, get out the photo albums and go through them, just watch him from a distance sometime like he's a guy you don't know. Small things, "fake it till you make it." Good luck.

Edited April 1, 2011 by SummersEve

[WutheringH]

Try not to beat yourself up about your feelings too much. If you've found yourself infatuated with another male, you will inheritly find yourself obsessing over the other them. It will also naturally be jadeing your compassion and feelings towards your Husband at this stage in the game. From a neurochemical stand point. Infatuation is possibly the most intense natural experience a Human can experience. Its akin to stuffing your face full of cocaine and actually utilises the same reward system that a vast amount of drugs target. Hence withdrawal and breakups of passionate affairs are so similar, both involving depression, craving and relapse. (yes the praises of NC really have scientific grounding)

 

Ifatuation or 'early romantic love' heavily targets the brain region called the VTA rich in dopaminergic neurons. Which to cut a long story short means that the OM right now will be producing a whole host of elated feelings and emotions (VTA is heavily connected to the amygdala which has a crucial role in processing emotions) The mind creates this intensity of feeling for a reason and it's certainly not because this man is the 'one'. Infact Sexuality and Love appear in brain terms involve some of the most primative structures. (in terms of long term attachment we appear to share a very similar system of responding to oxytocin and vasopressin to that of the Prairie Vole of all things) Thus despite what people on Love Shack often preach. It is incredibly difficult to use higher brain functions to combat Romatic love.

 

Your best bet really, would have been never to have acted on attraction. I know this seems hard to understand but part of the big old brain in their dosn't care about 'you', as you percieve of you. To some extent you are a slave to your feelings. We are wired for short term satisfaction by and large and thus your romantic drive is too. Passionate love in almost 90 percent of couples negatively correlates with time. Why? Especially as we can all perceive the ideal as being a life time of passion with one mate. Well in evolutionary terms. Not only is a heightened physiological state exhausting in the long term, (All drugs have a comedown) It also would stop you from producing further genetic variety (precisely why you've fallen for another male.) Of course humans face the pull of monogomy and cheating precisely because care giving was vital in bringing a child up well. Thus two opposing stratagies of survival are in our brains whether we like it or not.

 

Despite this, fMIRs studies suggest that around 5 to 12 percent of people can remain in passionate love long term. The guess so far however suggest its more of a genetic outcome than maintaing behaviours that can keep you 'in love' so to speak. Hence some people really we jump between relationships for life (Think Larry King). Past behiour is the best indication of future.

 

Still a depressing figure.

 

Im not suggesting that this inner biology keeps you off the line for claiming control over your actions. The reality is that peoples abiltiy to feel and act on long term love likely lies on a gradient. Some people simply will have less of a rewarding response to the flushes of Oxytocin and Vasopressin that are increasingly appearing to be so important in maintaining a long term interest with a mate. The first flushs of love are so intense becuase its a drive pushing you to have sex. The drive dies often dies when the deed is done. Although left unrequited infatuation can live for years. Akin to Scott Fitzgereld's, Hemingway's and Twain's life long obsessions with their first loves. Now a days sex is so prominate that this dosn't seem to be an issue anymore!

 

The crucial thing to remember is that your ability to 'feel' love is likely heavily influenced by genetics. Thus if you leave your partner at some stage you will be having the exact same fundemental emotional response (in regards to that 'romantic feeling') to the OM. However as a person he may be far less compatible. Hence friendship is really the core of a long term relationship if you want stability and serenity.

 

I can't overstate how some knowledge of the mental states of Love has informed and iluminated some of my past mistakes in 'Love'

Edited April 6, 2011 by WutheringH

[WutheringH]

So to cut a long story short, You situation seems to be pretty much the MOST common one in todays society in relation to marriage. Swap a satisfactory companiative relationship (and by the sounds of it you have a good one.) For a short term high in the pursuit of what science is increasingly dubbing the 'romantic myth'.

 

Generations back we didn't see more of this because. A) surving life was a big deal. Marriage to many was simply vital to survive, pleasure was a secondary. B) Social predijuce against divorce. C) No persistant romantic tales being shoved down the gullet by Pop-media.

 

Of course you may totally disagree with scientific method in principle or be skeptical about the merits of Neuroscience and Evo-Pyche theories. Understandably. In my eyes it does explain alot of the recent trends in relationships we see around us however.

[nezbo]

I truly like the science that has happened above me. I think it needs a thread of its own.

[WutheringH]

Ha thanks, all I can say is that it pays to have a mother whos spent the last twenty years of her life researching Romance.. (I really didn't get the fuss untill my first love came along!)

 

Worried, if you actually see any logic to what Im saying. Then listen up.

 

Twice in my life have I experienced the loss of something I was physically and mentaly hooked on. The significant one, would be when I was abusing opiates. Opiates became life itself.

 

Forget feeling anxious or down about considering life without the OM. When i first tried to live and consider life without opiates it considered of PHYSICALLY not being able to get out of bed, spasms of pain so bad i would faces urges to end life there and then. The mental addiction is even worse. I abused my life. Nothing but opiates mattered. It DESTROYED my moral code.

 

I lost my love for my nearest and dearest, resulting in lieing, stealing and cheating. Prior to the drugs in my normal mental state my sense of morality was as decent as the next mans. Iv'e been sober for 8 years and i still miss that 'high'. I can walk into favourite places i used to pop pills and my body and mind are STILL conditioned to get excited. In many ways my 'grass is greener' was life with opiates. However whilst the grass was green, juicy and practically melted in my mouth. I was so confused by the haze of euphoria from eating that grass that I forgot to see that on the other side of the fence the house was burning down and my entire life with it.

 

I too have also lost people iv'e been passionate about. Know that this is a human drive you are trying to battle. It will not be easy. Just like drugs, in reality its often useless to pretend you can just taper down the connection. Its all or nothing. The sooner you break off totally from this man the sooner your brain can return to homeostasis and you will be able to perceive thing with greater clarity.

 

To the inner and darkest parts of the brain. There is no difference between the OM and a pill. Both will offer pure raw hedonistic pleasure. For a while... but you will be trading EVERYTHING for that brief high.

 

Life is tough. No one promised you eternal romance in a long term relationship. You have a good person in your life, consider yourself lucky. Serenity and stability can be a blessing. Take it from me. As someone that has truely experienced the highs and lows of a hedonistic approach to living.

 

Good luck with whatever choice you make. Truth be told I think if your in the mental place you are. It might take going with the otherman and getting burned (falling out of infatuation again) to make you appreciate what you have. If you were young I would actually recommend it so you could observe and understand the differing levels of love. Your married however, so pick one and except responsibility.

 

Ha I would love to make a thread all about the science of relationships. Its still a relativly new field obviously. Never the less lots of interesting stuff has been investigated. Not sure where would be appropriate to make one though?!

Edited April 6, 2011 by WutheringH

[WutheringH]

Seeing as Im on a rant...

 

IF YOU HAVE ANY CONCERN ABOUT SAVING YOUR MARRIAGE MAKE A VOW TO TRY THE BELOW BEFORE GIVING UP! SCIENCE CAN AND WILL HELP YOU!

 

 

DANGEROUS DATES!!

1) Everyones heard of date nights and the such. However, its NOT enough. There was an interesting experiment done a while bac., A woman was asked to collect an equal number of phone numbers from males. This was done in two differing environments, one was a stable bridge over a small river the other a wobbly one high over a gorge. The numbers the woman collected from the wobbly bridge were FAR more likely to call her. Why? (no they weren't less attractive!) Well the basic premise is that novelty and adrenaline spark dopamine production in the brain as a natural response. To be on edge around your mate. Literally makes them more attractive.

 

Whilst it may not be your style. Activitys that stimulate this kind of response.. Shared time at an amusment park, mountain biking, rock climbing, working out or Salsa dancing for example. All will go someway to getting this 'buzz', the basic premise is that all this self expansion spills over into your affiliation with your SO and thus the 'buzz' translates to wanting your SO again.

 

BONDING BEHAVIOURS!

2) Whilst I hear you out on the intimacy thing. Again, wouldn't you really love to find your husband irresistable again? Arguably in your situation your sexuality and desire is linked to another man. Thus even your desire for intimacy is linked with the otherman. You need to get those Oxytocin levels flowing for your SO again. If you look at tamarins the amount of physical grooming and connection they have is amazing. They don't 'think' about doing this, its inate behaviour. Its outcome however is that Oxytocin levels stay high and they stay together.

 

Whilst you may not feel like being intimate right now. If you FORCE yourself to engage you will get those Oxytocin regulators up-regulating. Start small, hugs, massages etc. Then try actually gazing deep into each others eyes. Then proceed to sex. Gentle, long intercourse is best. Bonding behaviours need to be maintained. You can't just do it once and then declare it ineffective. Give it ATLEAST two months and it needs to be daily! Notice how all these activities come naturally when driven by desire. Desire drives you to be physical. However it is the actually physical acts that produce Oxytocin Regardless of premeditated levels of desire. (hence one nights stands often spark REALLY wanting the other both emotionally and physically) Oxytocin is like natures glue. Its what bonds mothers to their children and activly promotes empathy, love and that sense of connection. This is the stuff of deep love.

Talking things out does nothing to stimulate Oxytocin, physical touch will effect you on a subconcious level and then your desire and thoughts in the concious will gradually begin to reflect this. This is why so many sex therapist tell woman and men to activly engage with sex even if they don't feel like it. Even if the therapists often don't understand the mechanics behind it they've noticed the corellation that it has a positive overspill.

 

COLERIDGE EFFECT!

3). Now this is a bit more controversial, but bare with me. I don't know if you know of the Coleridge effect but I'll give a little explaination. Scientists yonks ago observed that if you put a rat in a cage with a female and the male mated. It would do the deed, then refuse to mate again. Instinctively choosing to conserve energy and feed as being the more important biological necssities to carry out. A rat can't 'think' but its mind and body instinctively know its passed its genetic material onto that female.

 

However, immediently aftet mating if the scientists swapped females the male was randy as ever and priority number 1. Was to pass those genes on again. The science being, that rest and feeding come second in the ball game of nature to lust and the desire to pass those genes on. You could say everytime a new rat was presented, it fell in love all over again. Funnily enough one of the most common occurences of Humans recently falling in Love is increased energy, lowered appetite and increased creativity. This was startling for me to read as i distinctly remember falling in love for the first time in school. Suddenly lunch at lunch time didn't matter my priority was finding HER. Endless evenings in bed talking till the small hours of the morning, sleep didn't exist. In between school days i suddenly found myself creating all manner of art,drawing, music production etc. Everybody observes these behaviours but only recently have we found the science behind it. The drive to love is energy. The poets where only doing what came naturally.

 

Back to the rats.. The male rat if presented with an ever changing group of females in captivity would actually almost mate himself to death. No suprises here, the drive to create life (love) is just as important if not more then maintaining life. This shouldn't come as a suprise as humans have killed themselves over infatuation gone awry for years..

 

Heres the interesting stuff however. When mateing is complete with the individual and orgasm has occured the male losses interest. A rat dosn't 'think' it just happens. Thus its lead many people to speculate that Orgasm actually has some negative side effects. In its aftermath it creates sexual distance and lack of interest. This can expressed via humans in a mass of forms on all levels of the relationship.. Males rolling over and going to sleep for instance. Remember Sex equals feelings of love in natures terms. We love so we reproduce. No matter how philispohical you want to get. Now when orgasm occurs in both sexs a massive spike of pleasure occurs (Your friend Dopamine again there). However directly after a hugh amount of Prolactin rises in the blood stream. This is whats responable for the lack of sexual desire towards your mate in the aftermath.

What you don't relise is that after a single orgams it takes the brain two weeks to return to having a normal hormonal balance and thus a 'normal' libido and sexual desire towards your mate.

 

So my suggestion. If you actually get around to having sex with your husband. Lay off trying to orgasm if you usually do. This my seem counterintuitive to the western sense of sex. Aka goal driven towards orgasm. But you may find yourself suprisingly desiring the touch and 'presence' of your husband more, because sexual tension won't die with the orgasm.

 

Lastly. If you watch porn in any extreme fashion. DON'T!! Your actually laying down neural pathways and streghtening them. Solely to associate what your seeing with sexuality and desire. I can't even begin to explain the the number of Japanese men that currently appear to have NO interest in a physical member of the opposite sex because the cultures obsession with the net has conditioned men to associate sex and arousal with the extreme side of things via an unbridled and extreme porn industry. ANY normal female simply dosn't do it for them anymore.

 

On a side note to any other woman readers if your man suffers with E.D this is a good area to look into. He may not even make the connection as to what hes doing to himself.

 

Spiceing it up too much in the bedroom could actually be counterintuitive to what any couples end game is. ie long term love. The moral being that nature dosn't play by the rules of human ideals and desires.

[GorillaTheater]

To make a long story short, I am married to a wonderful man and while I love him, I am not sure that I am still in love with him.

 

Meanwhile, I have left myself fall in love (maybe) with a friend of mine.

 

Any insight??

 

Only that you've officially become a stereotype. Congrats.

[WutheringH]

"Only that you've offically become a stereotype. Congrats."

 

Shes offically become.... Human.

 

To be fair she claims that shes cut off connection which is more than alot manage. And shes obviously at least considering trying. Hopefully she can at least make a plan of action from some peoples responses.

[blueeyes74]

I feel like I could have written this post except for the part about falling in love with someone else. I can only suggest this. Make a list of all the things you love about your husband. If you had to write his Eulogy, (I know it sounds morbid) but what would you say?

I question if I am in love with my husband as well. I haven't told him that exactly, but I have opened up about feeling differently about him. I will be meeting with a marriage counselor by myself first and then we are to go as a couple. we have 3 kids involved, so I am feeling bad for not being attracted to him anymore! It's a very confusing and difficult situation to be in. I haven't read everyone's else's replies, but it sounds like you need some help (the professional kind). They may be able to help you streamline your thoughts and feelings better.

good luck

[robf1971]

Definitely a common story. The op could be my wife minus the OM. I've had the not attracted to/ not in love with you thing shoved in my face for the last 2 years by her. Mind you at least she had the decency to tell me. She made all these plans to leave that never materialised,

 

We then went to MC, I made some changes, pretty much accepted it was over, started to enjoy my life again. A few weeks ago her behaviour towards me started becoming very affectionate like the old days, we began to get intimate again. Quite honestly I was stunned, very happy though. She has started to get romantic feelings back, mentioning it to our MC , talking about our future etc.

 

Anyway, point being we both worked damn hard on ourselves. I think we both found the people who fell in love with each other 8 years ago. We are also best friends, which helped keep us together. These things can and do come back.