I don't know how I got here....

[east coast edward]

I’m mature enough and old enough to know better. But, let just say that I’m middle aged, but would recognise something in me that alludes to emotional immaturity. That said, I have had many fulfilling relationships, including a marriage. No kids though, infact no living relative at all. One factor in my like is that I’m comfortable with female company, and have had many very good and close female platonic friends.

 

 

 

Sandra, (names changed) was one of these friends. She was the partner of one of my best friends. We grew close, as she advised me over my marriage break-up and lhe death of my remaining family. Sandra has been a rock, not always there but usually right and always epithetical.

 

 

 

Sandra’s partner Hendrick was a bully, his relationship with her deteriorated until she threw her out three years ago. She simply couldn’t cope any more with his attitude to any of her associates, customers, family or friends. In particular she couldn’t cope with his bombastic and overwhelming treatment of her, of constantly being put down and disrespected, shouted at and castigated fro not being totally attentive to him, whilst she had a complex business to develop. Worse, he had never been faithful to her throughout the seven years of their relationship. He also had (and has) a long term partner in another country whom he was deeply involved with throughout his relationship with Sandra.

 

 

Sandra and I began to mutually support each other. Hendrick was a friend of mine, I put effort into helping their relationship to re-kindle, even though it was probably futile. They did come together, briefly. But apparently stopped having sex. Following on from my divorce, Sandra helped me by re-introducing me to Alice, a former partner of mine.

My relationship with Alice was a fraught and difficult as Sandra and Hendrick’s. Although, in this case it was me taking the abuse.

Sandra won a contract to manage a business. She determined that at this point Hendrick shouldn’t be part of her life, and prevented him from living with her at the new business. He did stay there though, and his periods of residence became increasingly fractious. Hendrick still came to stay with me occasionally, and on some occasions Sandra came too. Last summer the straw broke, I witnessed too often his reducing her to tears by shouting her down when she was clearly tired from overworking. His womanising around the (small) town became tedious, especially when his disrespect of the women that he was seeing became an issue of criticism from their families toward me.

 

 

So, I never saw either of them. Until, that is I went to stay with Sandra whilst on business in her are a last autumn.

 

 

In a moment of inspiration, or madness, I turned round to her and said “Sandra, I no longer see you as a married woman”

“I’m not a married woman, I’m a widow “, she replied.

“No, I meant that I don’t see yourself and Hendrick as a couple any more”

At which point she turned round and kissed me, very sexually.

 

Needless to say, nothing actually happened between us. Hendrick continued to stay when he wanted. She came to hate this, and took to telling me so. She was adamant though that they weren’t having sex, even though they slept together.

 

 

My work life changed, and I moved to a job within 50 miles of Sandra. She arranged accommodation through a friend, and promised to visit on a regular basis. We began to speak quite passionately and I became very affectionate toward her physically. The only difficult part of our conversations concerned Hendrick, I was adamant that I wouldn’t interfere in their relationship, but she was sternly adamant that there was no relationship and that she wanted him out of her life. To be honest I wasn’t so sure, until that is I had a chance discussion with him where he expressed hiss utter contempt or her and his desire to quickly clear up the remaining detritus of what had become for both of them a dead and painful association.

 

 

She continued to be very forthcoming to me, to accept my affection, although we never really progressed sexually beyond passionate kissing invoked by either of us.

 

 

But I was becoming frustrated. I had been seriously in love with her for some years, infact from when she first split with Hendrick. She never suspected, well I’m not sure. The hints and signals continued from her, but something was strange: there were always promises in the future based on “when this happens” , or “next week, perhaps”. She started to stand me up on dates , to the point where it became intolerable and was effecting my work.

 

 

At this point something cracked. We were due to meet up, but she stood me up. When she did ring me, she was in tears , actually very emotionally upset. The issue was that she was moving to manage a new business in another City, bad enough but she had resigned from the old one and something had clearly gone wrong, she admitted to making a big mistake. The danger of –course was that she was unemployed and homeless, and so was her daughter.

 

 

I found out where they had gone and did a very romantic thing. She flung her arms around me an cried, so I confessed my feelings. I shouldn’t have done, I know.

 

 

Well we agreed to properly date, and assured each other that this would lead to a relationship and that we could marry. Not as daft as you may think, we would actually be a good match. And it was clear at that point that we do (or did) love and trust each other.

 

 

She moved to the city where I was working. I helped her to move. On the day she moved in Sandra, her daughter and partner an myself went for a meal. She was so relaxed, and later said that having me around wa like having her late husband back. Her daughter was clearly keen to have me around. Actually the daughter, and all of Sandra’s friends and family hate Hendrick with a vengeance.

 

 

At the end of the evening I went home to where I was staying, I wasn’t expecting to be invited back and wasn’t looking to make love with her. It was just that the parting was I though a little pre-emptory after such a lovely evening. Oh, something I hadn’t explained; before we went out to eat Hendrich had rung her, and invited himself to stay the next night. Whilst on the phone, sge lost her confidence, shook and began to cry. Her daughter slammed the door in her face, and accused her mother of having broken a promise.

 

 

Hendrick, who was supposingly a spent ex, did come and stay. Slept with her, but got thrown out after two nights. I went to see her a couple of nights later, we went for a meal and ended-up discussing me going down on her. Actually not that strange, she’s aware from our years of friendship that my attitude to sex is that it is for a man to give a woman pleasure. Well, needless to say we didn’t and we waved goodbye at the station.

The association continued, and we continue to go on dates, usually with a lot of affection some intimacy, but no sex. I have to say that it is clear that she has not had a man giving her affection for a decade, and probably is confused as to how to handle it.

 

 

Given that her ex has again become a factor, I’ve clearly ended out friendship saying that I can no longer cope with his disrespect for women, and that in any case I have affections for Sandra.

 

 

The trouble is that I’ve come to realise that He’s actually not the problem; its her and me. She’s a very busy person and has one day off a week. I usually get to see her then, and we go somewhere. But the ex just turns up when he wants and stays there. She won’t talk to me about this, and is still adamant that she is not in a relationship with him. I have forced the issue and expressed displeasure at effectively finding myself involved with a married woman. She reacts angrily to this, and infact this exchange seems to have damaged our relationship, I have lost trust and she has in part lost respect.

 

 

Still, when we are on our own it is tha most magical time of my like, she states that ske loves and wants my company, and “I do wont to be with you, I don’t want to be with him”

 

 

But, she won’t return calls, often doesn’t answer and has thrown herself into work.

 

 

I have gat so fas as to ask her what she wants’ me to do. Should I remove myself from her life? I just get accused of being negative, and I rather thing that she now sees me as jealous and weak.

 

 

Truth is of course, I am jealous and week. This has impacted my work, probably now terminally. All the aspects of a relationship with her that I would value most, he has. Or rather he doesn’t have, because he detests them. His idea of sex (they’ve both told me) is a quick shag and a blow job! Whereas I want to passionately make love to someone that I deeply love. He wishes that her family would go away, and regards them as spongers, whereas I crave such a wonderful family, would be honoured to support them and want my (not inconsiderable) assets to be the daughter’s inheritance.

 

 

The truth is that I have interfered in someone else’s relationship and therefore deserve all the hurt that I get. And, boy it does hurt. But in my mitigation, I did only get involved on the statements of both of them that their relationship was over, and after numerous signals from her, some obscure some direct.

 

 

But what on earth is going on. She feels guilty for dumping him, he won’t let her go even though she wants to. I actually believe that they are not having sex, not because I want to (actually I don’t care about that) but because the evidence is that she is devoid of anything that looks like fulfilment.

 

 

I’m sorry for the long essay, but believe this to be a relatively straight rendition of the facts, alright from my perspective, but I’ve tried to be fair.

 

I’d love to receive any comments, especially from a female perspective. I really can’t get my head around this.

 

 

My best wishes to you all........

[east coast edward]

I'm sorry that my post was such a severe rant. Just a dump really, but there we are, that's how my emotions have gone.

 

I guess the advice that I'm trying to look for is, how do you let someone know that you care without being too much of a burden to them.

[TigerCub]

Hey ECE,

 

Your post kinda annoyed me, to be honest.

 

This woman that you're so into is just using you and the "ex"

I don't even know why you call him an "Ex" when he is clearly still involved with her.

 

She can tell you till the cows come home that they don't sleep together, but if he's constantly there, why wouldn't they?

 

Also, she can tell you that sex with him is bad and that he's not a passionate and giving lover, so what?? - that's her problem to deal with.

 

You're asking how you can tell her your care without being a burden?

She knows you care, and she's taking advantage of it - you're the one there for her when she wants to cry and play the victim.

Oh, she knows you care and she's using that.

 

You say that you're weak, maybe just a little bit.

I think she's very weak as well - I mean, if she really didn't want anything to do with this Hendrick, she wouldn't let him stay at her place, she wouldn't let him "invite himself" to dinner with you.

 

Point is, if she wanted to be done with him, she would be.

 

No one is where they don't want to be.

 

Which also holds true for you, you're still around, hoping that something can work out with you 2. Why?

 

Fine, there are feelings (I certainly can understand that), but other than that, what does she give you?

How does she make you feel - especially when she's acting so weak and acting like this "ex" has all the control over her.

 

Please, she's a mother! she's grown enough to know how to make her own choices and to do what's best for her and her daughter - so why the hell is she acting like some poor helpless cry baby?

 

My advice to you is: don't bother!

Just tell her that its obvious that you care for her, but if she can't be done with Hendrick, then you're out.

 

Or else, you're going to be wasting a lot of time and suffering from a lot of heartache - I know, I've been there. Thankfully, I've learned my lesson

 

Good luck

[Confused4Now]

Hey ECE,

 

Your post kinda annoyed me, to be honest.

 

This woman that you're so into is just using you and the "ex"

I don't even know why you call him an "Ex" when he is clearly still involved with her.

 

She can tell you till the cows come home that they don't sleep together, but if he's constantly there, why wouldn't they?

 

Also, she can tell you that sex with him is bad and that he's not a passionate and giving lover, so what?? - that's her problem to deal with.

 

You're asking how you can tell her your care without being a burden?

She knows you care, and she's taking advantage of it - you're the one there for her when she wants to cry and play the victim.

Oh, she knows you care and she's using that.

 

You say that you're weak, maybe just a little bit.

I think she's very weak as well - I mean, if she really didn't want anything to do with this Hendrick, she wouldn't let him stay at her place, she wouldn't let him "invite himself" to dinner with you.

 

Point is, if she wanted to be done with him, she would be.

 

No one is where they don't want to be.

 

Which also holds true for you, you're still around, hoping that something can work out with you 2. Why?

 

Fine, there are feelings (I certainly can understand that), but other than that, what does she give you?

How does she make you feel - especially when she's acting so weak and acting like this "ex" has all the control over her.

 

Please, she's a mother! she's grown enough to know how to make her own choices and to do what's best for her and her daughter - so why the hell is she acting like some poor helpless cry baby?

 

My advice to you is: don't bother!

Just tell her that its obvious that you care for her, but if she can't be done with Hendrick, then you're out.

 

Or else, you're going to be wasting a lot of time and suffering from a lot of heartache - I know, I've been there. Thankfully, I've learned my lesson

 

Good luck

Perfect Post....I couldn't have said it any better word for word. It's actually obvious that you are willing to settle for this crap...how is this relationship reciprocal?

 

This comment says it all... "No one is where they don't want to be."

[east coast edward]

Confused and Tiger Club, thanks I appreciate your replies.

 

I doesn't look good does it. I'm afraid that she's dangling me on a thread, and knows exactly the minimum to do/say to keep me involved. As I said, she's a long term close friend, so I don't really know how to react. Logic says to press the nuclear button, but she senses that and has stopped me going that way

 

 

The daughter is wanting me to stay around, and whilst it isn't an obligation, I am touched.

 

The real problem is that this hurts so badly, its totally dragging me down.

 

But thanks for the advice, you are right. I just need a square talk with her, but all I get is obfuscation over being busy.

 

Why wont she let me close it down, she must know the damage this is doing?

[Gentlegirl]

Sorry to be so blunt about it. Get yourself disentangled from this messed up couple.

 

You sound like such a sweet man. There are plenty of lovely totally available women in the world. There are plenty who know who they are and what they want.

 

This woman will only continue to mess you around and make you unhappy.

 

Good Luck

Gentlegirl

[fooled once]

She isn't done with him and she enjoys your attention and pampering.

 

But she is using you.

 

For some reason, she won't let go of this Hendricks, who you claimed was your Best friend in your opening post. How could you be friends with someone who allegedly abuses a woman?

 

You have to ask yourself - why does she keep answering his calls? She has the option to not answer. She has the option to change her number so he has no idea where she is or how to contact her. She won't.

 

That speaks volumes.

 

You have to walk away. She refuses to end her relationship. She needs counseling You can't be her white knight come to save her. She has to learn to save herself and she needs to respect herself. I am sure her daughter has no respect for her and she is actually endangering her daughter. That to me implies crappy parent.

[fooled once]

Hey ECE,

 

Your post kinda annoyed me, to be honest.

 

This woman that you're so into is just using you and the "ex"

I don't even know why you call him an "Ex" when he is clearly still involved with her.

 

She can tell you till the cows come home that they don't sleep together, but if he's constantly there, why wouldn't they?

 

Also, she can tell you that sex with him is bad and that he's not a passionate and giving lover, so what?? - that's her problem to deal with.

 

You're asking how you can tell her your care without being a burden?

She knows you care, and she's taking advantage of it - you're the one there for her when she wants to cry and play the victim.

Oh, she knows you care and she's using that.

 

You say that you're weak, maybe just a little bit.

I think she's very weak as well - I mean, if she really didn't want anything to do with this Hendrick, she wouldn't let him stay at her place, she wouldn't let him "invite himself" to dinner with you.

 

Point is, if she wanted to be done with him, she would be.

 

No one is where they don't want to be.

 

Which also holds true for you, you're still around, hoping that something can work out with you 2. Why?

 

Fine, there are feelings (I certainly can understand that), but other than that, what does she give you?

How does she make you feel - especially when she's acting so weak and acting like this "ex" has all the control over her.

 

Please, she's a mother! she's grown enough to know how to make her own choices and to do what's best for her and her daughter - so why the hell is she acting like some poor helpless cry baby?

 

My advice to you is: don't bother!

Just tell her that its obvious that you care for her, but if she can't be done with Hendrick, then you're out.

 

Or else, you're going to be wasting a lot of time and suffering from a lot of heartache - I know, I've been there. Thankfully, I've learned my lesson

 

Good luck

 

Just saw this...excellent post Tiger! Excellent.

[east coast edward]

She isn't done with him and she enjoys your attention and pampering.

 

But she is using you........... She has to learn to save herself and she needs to respect herself. I am sure her daughter has no respect for her and she is actually endangering her daughter. That to me implies crappy parent.

 

Yes, I'm sorry for my long original post. I'd tried to give as much information as I dare, and to make it as accurate as possible. Inevitably some of the replies are so accurate. You are spot on with this, she has little self respect and has received no affection or encouragement from a man in probably a decade. This is surprising because she is actually an awesome, beautiful and powerful individual who has a sharp and focused business mind.

 

Her daughter dislikes Hendrick because he is disrespectful and bullying, she has moved to a position where she thinks that her mum, Sandra feels guilty over dumping him (or trying to). I rather think that its more manipulative than that. The daughter is an adult and works in the same business as the mum, so she's probably not in danger, but will move away with her husband at some stage.

 

He was a close friend of mine, yes he was. Why, well most people can have two sides and I saw the other one. Infact Sandra saw the other one, after all they were together for seven years, probably three of them happy. Over time it is clear that she found out about his unfaithfulness and stopped loving him, because she stopped being the doting wife he started to bully her to get the things that he wanted. I only really lost it with him when it became clear (about a year ago) just how much mental cruelty he was inflicting on her.

 

My trouble is of course that I love this lady very much, and she knows it. Yes, I'm sure that she is using me, and to an extent she is aware of the pain it is causing. I have tried to end the friendship and to walk away, but that's not so easy. I've tried having a conversation with her where we part company, but she just sees that coming and deals with it.

 

Thanks for the reply. Your words are pretty accurate, thanks.

[TigerCub]

Confused and Tiger Club, thanks I appreciate your replies.

 

I doesn't look good does it. I'm afraid that she's dangling me on a thread, and knows exactly the minimum to do/say to keep me involved. As I said, she's a long term close friend, so I don't really know how to react. Logic says to press the nuclear button, but she senses that and has stopped me going that way

I think that's a big part of the problem.

You see her as a close long time friend, and so in your mind, you tell yourself "well, we've been friends for so long, there is no way that she could actually be using me - that's just not her, that's not what a close friend does - so there must be real feelings there"

 

But the thing you need to realize is that people who try to fill their voids by using multiple people for validation and attention are broken.

 

So I don't think she's doing things to hurt you ON PURPOSE, but she is aware that she is hurting you, but she's so broken that she's doing whatever it is she needs to do to fill her voids.

 

 

The real problem is that this hurts so badly, its totally dragging me down.

That's the thing with relationships like this, they are so destructive. They make you doubt your own worth, they become all consuming to the point where its suffocating.

They make you like a crazy addict, you hate yourself for what you're willing to settle for and the lows you sink to, but you do it all for that "high" for that stolen moment of gratification, and when its over, you're back to the crappy feelings.

 

But thanks for the advice, you are right. I just need a square talk with her, but all I get is obfuscation over being busy.

 

Why wont she let me close it down, she must know the damage this is doing?

 

That part in bold makes it so that she has all the power.

The is no difference between that sentence and her statements that Hendricks wont let her go.

 

You need to be careful. Get you strength back and realize that you control what you do and how far you go down this road.

 

Believe me, I completely sympathize with you. I've been there. It hurts like hell to let them go - you honestly go through withdrawal, but being strung along, wasting so much time, having your self esteem go in the gutter because you're never "chosen", its so not worth it.

 

Don't let her control what you do. Don't let her manipulate and guilt you.

Its your life, be stronger than she's being with Hendrick, be stronger than you're being right now - take control.

 

You deserve so much more than the crumbs she's throwing your way.

[skywriter]

My Mother always told us kids throughout our childhood, "You will know many people throughout your life, however, you will have very few friends".

 

She would correct me many times growing up for referring to an individual as, "friend". She would always, very lovingly ,tell me that it was someone I liked from school, and someday, maybe I could call them friend.

[east coast edward]

Tiger Club - thankyou. Your words are making a lot of sense to me and are helping a great deal.

[2sunny]

Yes, I'm sorry for my long original post. I'd tried to give as much information as I dare, and to make it as accurate as possible. Inevitably some of the replies are so accurate. You are spot on with this, she has little self respect and has received no affection or encouragement from a man in probably a decade. This is surprising because she is actually an awesome, beautiful and powerful individual who has a sharp and focused business mind.

 

Her daughter dislikes Hendrick because he is disrespectful and bullying, she has moved to a position where she thinks that her mum, Sandra feels guilty over dumping him (or trying to). I rather think that its more manipulative than that. The daughter is an adult and works in the same business as the mum, so she's probably not in danger, but will move away with her husband at some stage.

 

He was a close friend of mine, yes he was. Why, well most people can have two sides and I saw the other one. Infact Sandra saw the other one, after all they were together for seven years, probably three of them happy. Over time it is clear that she found out about his unfaithfulness and stopped loving him, because she stopped being the doting wife he started to bully her to get the things that he wanted. I only really lost it with him when it became clear (about a year ago) just how much mental cruelty he was inflicting on her.

 

My trouble is of course that I love this lady very much, and she knows it. Yes, I'm sure that she is using me, and to an extent she is aware of the pain it is causing. I have tried to end the friendship and to walk away, but that's not so easy. I've tried having a conversation with her where we part company, but she just sees that coming and deals with it.

 

Thanks for the reply. Your words are pretty accurate, thanks.

 

she CAN control what she ALLOWS! she allows crap around her. you still like that.

 

why do you want a woman that chooses such chaos?

 

she's very unhealthy. why do you want such an unhealthy woman?

 

you have better choices - yet you continue to spend energy on an unhealthy woman.

 

she's not into you. she's into the man that treats her badly...

 

he's still involved in her life because she encourages him to be involved.

 

there's no room for you. spend your time and energy finding a woman who deserves you.

[TigerCub]

Tiger Club - thankyou. Your words are making a lot of sense to me and are helping a great deal.

 

You're very welcome ECE.

I'm glad to help

 

Stay strong and keep posting.

 

All the best

[east coast edward]

Being strong and keeping the faith, or a faith, seems to be the key. When I originally posted, I was in despair. My friends were fed-up with my constant wimperings over my lack of a relationship with Sandra. I should have been fired fired, in fact I did miss out on a contract extension, and have lost nearly a month's work as a result of my inattention to completing work.

 

But last week was a pick-up week. Work turned round, my positivity returned, I resolved a couple of intermediate issues. Sandra an I met and agreed that we didn't want to make love with each other, not never, but not now. A bad thing? No, a good thing. It has removed a barrier to physical intimacy and hence I've now had the ultimate joy of experiencing her having an orgasm as I held her closely. I know how to please a woman, and to give a woman pleasure is for me the ultimate pleasure.

 

The difficulty has I think actually been me. I've been impatient, and to in her face at times. What I should have grasped is that she's a friend, she's open to the concept of being a lover but wants to be in love first. Whilst she was prepared to see if this could happen, I've come over all jealous over Hendrick, and spoilt it.

 

The thing is that a friend, even an intimate friend can be anything you like. They can hit rock bottom, and still have the same friends. That's the test of a true friendship.

 

But for a potential lover/partner its different. Biologically for women there's a lot at stake, a lover is potentially the farther of their children. He has to be strong, fend off enemies, protect and sustain and above all trust and be dependable. The other guy was worse than me, but it wasn't a one-on-one contest. He was residual, I was transitional, the two are totally different.

 

This journey has taught me a lot, and is teaching me a lot more. I'm being a wimp. Being a wimp as a friend is acceptable, she's very maternal and helps. But as a potential husband, boy its a failure. Big fail.

 

Posting here has helped me with my sanity. In fact, from the moment that I made my initial post on Monday afternoon I felt the gause of depression lifting from behind the eyes. Thank-you ever so much to those who read and responded to this thread.

 

Oh, and guess what. I'm not blindly in love with Sandra any more. I think that we are probably what you call intimate friends now. I hope it develops, but now appreciate that this can only happen naturally and that I just have to be true to a faith, and let nature take its course.

Edited April 22, 2011 by east coast edward

[east coast edward]

i do not believe you know all sides to the relationship between her and her boyfriend. you know what she tells you and what he tells you. i would guess neither of them told you of the less than nice behavior they have had with each other...

 

 

Agreed totaally. I can see now that I didn't have a complete picture. Both of them spun to me the most negative case of the other one that they could. I did know better because I knew them both so well, but what threw me was the definitive claim from both that it was all over....for good.

 

i ........friends normally do not give friends an orgasm. i am not understanding where you and she stand. are you saying you are now no longer in love with her because you two decided to not have intercourse for now?

 

We'd been affectionate for months already but there were limits, but it stopped short of the point where you'd suffer from sexual frustration if you didn't go on. We didn't make love, because we agreed not to. The orgasm was caused by me going down on her.

 

I'm just as much in love, but have matured a little (oh come on a lot). I suspect that we'll carry on as we are for now, and see where it takes us. As long s there's a fair chance, that side of the love is satisfied. The pent up passionate component is satisfied, so I'm cooler, so's she.

Edited April 24, 2011 by east coast edward

[Bigsmoke]

Ed, you need to get a grip and start acting like a normal person. Your life is way too complicated with all this bullcrap.

[carrie999]

Ed, you need to get a grip and start acting like a normal person. Your life is way too complicated with all this bullcrap.

 

Totally agreed. Tiger said it well before, and Ed, you seem to have missed the point. Open your eyes...your acts (and they ARE sexual) only solidifies how much you are blind to this situation. A relationship, sexual or not, involves TWO partners taking care of one another EQUALLY. Whatever you have with her is not only unbalanced, but not honest, either. Get a grip and move past this.

[east coast edward]

Carrie and others, thanks.

 

Your points are well made and I welcome them. Yes, love is blinding but I am also wary. The way that I am reading it is that she is open to the possibility of something developing between us and doesn't want to be wit the OM. Wishful thinking, well yes and no. Our no love making pact wasn't very successful, as the resultant intimacy caused her to bring it to an abrupt end. So, we became lovers, and in a way that you can judge these things it is clear that she hadn't experienced that for a couple of years.

 

The other guy, he's still in contact buy not viably around. But there is something that appears to be residual in nature, almost guilt or sorrow. She knows that she has to move on, the issue might be, to where? I'm now such a presence in her life, that its possible that she finds this overbearing.

 

She's so work focused now that any social arrangement she makes is going to be broken, and she has no sympathy with the person who has to wait - "lok, can't you see how busy I am?" Yes, she is, its nearly 18 hours a day, and is breaking her. I'm doing what I can to help, and to be fair what spare time she does get, she spends with me.

 

Thanks for reading and replying, and letting me indulge in this crap.

[east coast edward]

Excuse me for posting again. I got what was said in the earlier replies, but rather innocently thought that things were beginning to work out OK. After all the OM seems to have at least diminished, and I spent the last weekend with Sandra. Unfortunately, she had planned to stay this week with me, even though it messes my work plans up. Result, she's become uncommunicative and won't tell me what's happening. So do I do my weekly commute, or work from home. Its actually a big planning deal and she knows this.

 

Why is she messing about?

[east coast edward]

Here's a link to a new thread the take off where this one consolidated.....

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t279931/