Speaking of strip clubs... (Q for other women)

[Kristi can't sleep]

Okay, followed the whole strip club thread, (very entertaining btw, OP) and the subject of whether women get sexually turned on by visual stimulation came up a few times.

 

Since I am not currently getting any, MHO is that we ARE... Sort of. Men don't seem to mind phony: the bigger the boobs, the better the airbrushing, etc., but women need a touch of reality; those giant, waxed, muscle guys like Fabio would, I guess, be our equivalent of Pamela Anderson (?). But to most women, "Fabio" types just look stupid.

 

I don't know if Playgirl and strip clubs for women are run by guys or lesbians or what, but hairless, greasy, ridiculously muscle-bound men with blond mullets do NOT turn me on.

 

Now, I did buy a local fireman's calendar once (FOR CHARITY! LOL) and let me tell you, what a difference chest hair, sweat, and realistic proportions make!!!!

 

I think strip clubs for women suck and aren't popular because they're patterned after men's clubs. We don't want to see a man in a spangly thong dancing to techno.

 

Change the music, take away the pole, get some hair on those chests and we'd be in business.

 

PS - *sigh* is it obvious I'm not getting any? Yes, guys, we need it too, and those of us who wouldn't cheat have the time and interest in such burning questions as, "why the hell don't male strippers have body hair???" Crisco....Eeewwww.

[J200]

Hair on chest and "realistic" is not my thing. Why are Fabio type of guys not realistic? It's not unrealistic.

 

I don't like hairy guys. Just because you favor what you think is "realistic" doesn't mean all women do. Hairy does not equal realistic.

[dreamingoftigers]

I think that men say that they want "Variety" but they seem to have a type, if men wanted "Variety" then they would be acting like: "well, I slept with a super-thin girl last week, so this week I want an obese one. And last month I slept with an 18 year old so this month I wonder if her grandmother is available."

 

As for women, I do think that we are actually in general sexually and relationally more varietal and that's why things like male strip clubs are really not for most of us.

 

Plus, the sexual pursuance center of the brain in males is 2.5 times larger then ours, but that still would suggest that there would be about a quarter to a third as many male strip clubs as female ones.

 

Women as well tend to need to put sex "in context." Seeing Jerry the fireman is well, hilarious but not really "in context." By that I mean: is Jerry the fireman supposed to be that fantasy fireman husband coming to sweep us off of our feet and take us out to dinner, or is Jerry the fireman the fantasy player fireman?

 

Did that make any sense.

 

And yes I got your email OP, I have been a little overwhelmed lately and just trying to recover sense before I respond.

[threebyfate]

I can look at a guy aesthetically and say "Nice!". I can watch a movie and get hooked on the composition of the character, including the looks of the actor and say "Wow, uber hawt!".

 

Prancing men does not hawtness make even if you superglued a sheepskin rug onto his chest.

 

Show me a penis of some dude who I don't have any or strong feelings about and it makes me laugh.

 

Show me a man I care about in rampant desire and my, oh my, oh my!!

[dreamingoftigers]

Yeah, like hearing about guys throwing pictures of their penises on the net makes me laugh.

 

Like, seriously? LOL

 

They figure that because they like to see girl parts and it gets them going that we would be all hot over guy parts.

 

It's actually kind of gross to just be shown a cock shot (not that I can say that I have seen one in a lllooooonnngggg time, jeez, not even an "in-person" one.)

 

But yes, a picture of the whole guy would be better then just the parts in those situations.

 

I just thought of a little something, maybe it is because when we have sex, there isn't always visual stimulation for us. Like for instance doggie style. And most of us probably don't easily watch ourselves get penetrated because of the angle our parts open at.

 

But pretty much every sexual position would give a visual for the guy.

[starryeyed12]

I agree that the male strip club is done in a very cheesy way. I think some people like because it's the most male attention they have seen in a while, and I mean, you are getting some very sexual visuals, hairless or not (don't kid yourself, women are visual too. At least I am!). Overall though, it seems a bit hokey, which I think only flies with the older audience.

 

The female strip club, on the other hand, seems to be taken very seriously. They get right down to business and it doesnt seem light-hearted at all. Dark setting, extremely erotic music/choreography. Plus, they have all sorts of women--any body type, race, hair color, etc. you can think of. They tailor their women to the differing tastes of men.

 

Imagine if you could go to a place and select from an assortment of different men--any shape or size you like (pun intended! ). Also, if they took it as serious as the women do, and chose music and moves that were actually erotic.

 

However, this scenario is probably not going to happen in the same mainstream way in which it occurs now for men. It would start off taboo, I'm sure. Also, it could just lead women into the same problems that female strip clubs lead for some men and some relationships. I read an article in Glamour magazine last month about the truth behind what goes on in today's strip club scene coming from the strippers themselves--a whole lot more than stripping, with surprising frequency. Do we really need to compound that behavior, which would likely result if we were to create the equivalent scene?

 

It could be done, but at what cost to today's relationships? I see it as a double edged sword.

[starryeyed12]

I was thrilled, until I heard him speak. It ruined everything. I can honestly say since that point, no man has ever turned me on just by looking good. He might catch my eye, but its a brief glance and I'm over it.

 

I think a lot of men would agree with this statement as well. These are people who appear to have matured past what a strip club has to offer.

 

I still think there could be an audience for the male equivalent strip club someday. It flies against "nature" and gender roles--being that women are the the emotional, relationship driven ones. But then again so does being a high powered career woman, and that hasn't stopped some women. This idea is so ingrained in our society that people would probably be fearful if male strip clubs got serious about being arousing/erotic and more women started frequenting them.

[StoneCold]

I think a lot of men would agree with this statement as well. These are people who appear to have matured past what a strip club has to offer.

 

I still think there could be an audience for the male equivalent strip club someday. It flies against "nature" and gender roles--being that women are the the emotional, relationship driven ones. But then again so does being a high powered career woman, and that hasn't stopped some women. This idea is so ingrained in our society that people would probably be fearful if male strip clubs got serious about being arousing/erotic and more women started frequenting them.

 

 

male strip clubs are just a place where women can go to act silly and not be judged. Generally speaking I doubt they go there to get juiced up

[starryeyed12]

Exactly. They're a joke.

[Feelin Frisky]

I couldn't glean the gist of the OP so I'll reiterate my position that I detest stips clubs and would not look favorably upon a female SO availing herself of one. My issue is not about the sexual aspects of it--it's about the "mob dynamics" of people doing things out of character because of perceived peer pressure and in turn goading others to do things they usually think is "not right". I won't buckle, so I never put myself in situations like that, and as such, I would want a mate with the same ethical standard. (I'm talking hypothetically about the potential mother of my children and it would rattle my trust and respect if I thought she were a "joiner" in scenes like that.) That's just me.

[LittleTiger]

Exactly. They're a joke.

 

100% agreed!

 

There is absolutely nothing sexy about a complete stranger dancing around with his 'bits' hanging out. IMO, male 'bits' are just not pretty to look at unless they're attached to a guy who appeals to me in other ways.

 

There's something very unattractive to me about men 'posing' in any way - it's just not 'masculine'.

 

I went to a strip 'show' about 15 years ago (not sure if that's the same as a modern strip club) with a bunch of girlfriends. None of us had ever tried it before and someone suggested it for a laugh. We were all grossed out by it. Two girls 'hid' in the toilets for most of it and one girl 'ran away' when she was approached by one of the strippers who slapped his penis on the table in front of her - the rest of us just couldn't stop laughing. Yes, we were a bunch of wimps!

 

We joked about it for months afterwards but not one of us has ever wanted to repeat the experience.

 

Women are clearly different from men - as if we didn't know that already!

[xxoo]

Imagine if you could go to a place and select from an assortment of different men--any shape or size you like (pun intended! ). Also, if they took it as serious as the women do, and chose music and moves that were actually erotic.

 

I still don't think it would be a turn on.

 

I'm straight, but would rather look at naked women (in general) than naked men. I love my partner's body to touch and smell....but, as for the visuals, I think the "jeans and a t-shirt" look is MUCH hotter than naked

[Kristi can't sleep]

OPB StaryEyed12:

I agree that the male strip club is done in a very cheesy way. I think some people like because it's the most male attention they have seen in a while, and I mean, you are getting some very sexual visuals, hairless or not (don't kid yourself, women are visual too. At least I am!). Overall though, it seems a bit hokey, which I think only flies with the older audience.

 

THANK YOU! LOL, said much better than I did - my original thought was not pro-strip club, anti-strip club, or a jab at spangly man-thongs. It simply crossed my mind while reading the other thread that women don't really have a comparable activity and what we DO have, Chippendales or WTF they're called, are not remotely attractive to any woman i personally know... which seems odd given that's their job.

 

Plus, we may not be AS intensely visually stimulated as men, but we do get visually stimulated - so why isn't anyone tapping into that? I think the whole argument of whether it's "cheating" for men to go to strip clubs would be eliminated if there was a female alternative. All things being equal, I think couples would choose whether or not they're comfortable with EACHOTHER participating in that kind of sexually charged atmosphere as opposed to only the man.

 

AND - I certainly didn't think body hair would take on a life of it's own - and i didn't mean "hairy" as a must for an attractive guy, by any means; I meant the fact that those men have no hair whatsoever - arms, legs, even their ARM-PITS for the love of God - and I find that strange given that the vast majority of men have SOME hair SOMEWHERE on there! LOL. It wasn't the point of the post, I swear! MEN don't shave their legs and arms, period. So why do "our" strippers? It's was just a bizarre observation, nothing more.

 

OPB J200:

Hair on chest and "realistic" is not my thing. Why are Fabio type of guys not realistic? It's not unrealistic.

I don't like hairy guys. Just because you favor what you think is "realistic" doesn't mean all women do. Hairy does not equal realistic.

 

Nowhere did I say the SOLE criteria for "realistic" = "hairy"

 

Yet you feel Fabio type guys ARE realistic? Uh, ok... about as realistic as Barry Bonds maybe (Psst, that was sarcasm: not many people know this, but they have to stick syringes full of steroids in their **ses to look that way...)

 

And ok, you don't like hairy guys. I've never personally met another woman who prefers their man to be so aerodynamic as to shave his entire body, but each to their own, I always say!

 

I'm not sure where the hostility comes from - if I upset you by dissing, ummmm, what exactly did I say? Hairless, greasy, ridiculously muscle-bound guys with blond mullets in spangly thongs dancing to techno, well, I am truly sorry. I didn't think there were any listening.

 

BTW, should be in a better mood - you're the one person they were apparently designed for.

 

DreamingOfTigers, don't worry about it! Thank you so much for your posts, you've already been more of a help than you know!!!

[pyroguy]

I think the ladies here are being a bit hypocritical. Surely you jest, and you have heard of what goes on at some of these male strip clubs. Just because you haven't experienced it, doesn't mean it's not happening.

 

You can find these clips right on the web. Women making out, giving hand jobs and even oral to male strippers...all while their guys are at home watching the kids and the yankees game:laugh:. And, no, their all not staged. Many male strippers can tell you similar stories.

 

At the very least I've seen plenty of real clips of batchelorette party's, where the bride to be is having sex acts simulated on her..all to the great delight of her friends and onlookers. The bride seems ok with it too. I wonder if any of those brides will appear here one day proclaiming her need to feel desired by her husband;)

 

Don't get me wrong, I hear women's arguments regarding strippers loud and clear, and I agree. It's not a great way to make your woman feel good about her self, at least pysically. Also, I personally think it's stupid for a grown man to spend a bunch of money to drink alcohol and watch a girl strip down to a G-string and get a peak of some boobies,WOW:rolleyes:.

 

However, make no mistake, women have their equal. If it's not the male strippers it's all the male heartthrobs they shove down our throats. You know, the one's who's shirts have to be removed in as many scenes as it can. Or, when they make these guys out to be the greatest human beings on earth, in addition to their looks.

 

If it's not hearing all about cougars and young guys (they now have a website to link the two together), it's radio commercials for male enlargement/enhancement, where the most recent one insists that "men your problem wont fix itself"..as loudly as she can.

 

Honestly,ladies, you have your equivalents. It;s just that when any man brings up the slightest issue with it, he's an immediate candidate for the dreaded I word..yes...shhh insecure. See, when men and society make women feel ****ty, men and society are terribe. When society and women POSSIBLY make men feel a bit less than....somehow, it's still the man's fault...he's insecure and that's unattractive. See, you don't have it as bad as you thought.

Edited April 25, 2011 by pyroguy

[starryeyed12]

You can find these clips right on the web. Women making out, giving hand jobs and even oral to male strippers...all while their guys are at home watching the kids and the yankees game . And, no, their all not staged. Many male strippers can tell you similar stories.

However, make no mistake, women have their equal. If it's not the male strippers it's all the male heartthrobs they shove down our throats. You know, the one's who's shirts have to be removed in as many scenes as it can. Or, when they make these guys out to be the greatest human beings on earth, in addition to their looks.

 

Honestly, ladies, you have your equivalents. It;s just that when any man brings up the slightest issue with it, he's an immediate candidate for the dreaded I word..yes...shhh insecure. See, when men and society make women feel ****ty, men and society are terribe. When society and women POSSIBLY make men feel a bit less than....somehow, it's still the man's fault...he's insecure and that's unattractive. See, you don't have it as bad as you thought.

 

I agree with the bolded, but not so much with the rest.

 

I do think there are some ladies out there that go wild and do some inappropropriate stuff during a cheesy, hokey male show. There's always gonna be that girl (usually 30s-middle aged woman in my experience, no offense, just observation) who is going to get too drunk, or what have you, and take it too far. I see this even when I go out to bars and clubs in my area. This past St. Patty's day, I saw a middle aged woman actually get on her knees on the dance floor and start biting at my guy friend's crotch and rubbing him...until her husband came and dragged her away! My friend was laughing his ass off, needless to say, but others were like WTF.

 

Anyway, that still doesn't really address what I saw as the issue at hand, i.e. what can we do to make a more male equivalent to the female strip club?

 

I personally still think it could be done, but it won't look like what we have now or what men have with women. To be successful it would probably have to be more fantasy driven; i.e. you pick from an assortment of men and get to choose to act out a fantasy of your choice in some staged room. IDK!!! lol Just saying that there could be a market for that if someone took the time to research what would drive a woman wild within the boundaries of a strip club.

 

There's certainly a large population of women who would not be turned on by this. I chock that up to personal preference, but also to decades of being brain washed into thinking that the nude male body is not sexy. I find this to be untrue. I loved watching my ex walk around naked and thinking about giving him a BJ (TMI sorry). Just as some men get turned on by the idea of messing around with female’s parts, I too get this way towards an attractive man in a fantasy.

 

Alas, the media is a powerful source and has trained us (even more so in recent decades) to be more accepting of women being the main source of beauty and sexuality in this world, and also more accepting of girl/girl relations, and I'm not talking real lesbians, more so the ones doing it for solely for male attention. I'm also not saying that’s bad, but just that I believe the media has played and continues to play a large role in getting straight people on the bandwagon.

 

I think we kind of have equivalent in the media today. We do have our heart throbs, and sexy shirtless men. But when a guy shows full frontal in a movie, for example, it's usually done in a funny-ha-ha way. There are exceptions I'm sure, but those movies probably don't get the same kind of views that the full frontal and partial female nudity movies do. You can watch a movie and see 5 different naked women and 1 bare ass of a man. That's equivalent?

 

Ok, I'm done with my ramblings, but to the matter at hand-- I stand by my idea that sexy male shows could be done. If the media got on that bandwagon I guarantee in 20 years we'd be sitting here talking about how the male strip clubs have gone too far and is it cheating or not, and men upset about their women blowing through cash and blah blah. Think about it. Stranger things have happened….......

[Kristi can't sleep]

Pyroguy

Honestly,ladies, you have your equivalents. It;s just that when any man brings up the slightest issue with it, he's an immediate candidate for the dreaded I word..yes...shhh insecure. See, when men and society make women feel ****ty, men and society are terribe. When society and women POSSIBLY make men feel a bit less than....somehow, it's still the man's fault...he's insecure and that's unattractive. See, you don't have it as bad as you thought.

 

I can't tell if you're serious or making fun of us, lol. If you are serious, in no way, shape or form would I think you or any man was insecure for saying such a thing; if anything, I'd think the opposite - and i agree with you about people calling you insecure if you express the teensiest hint of discomfort with such a situation: "do you have low self-esteem" has become a low-blow tactic to excuse marginal behavior - ie., What? You don't like me flirting with that guy? Why? Do you have low self esteem?

 

Lol - Its actually really nice to hear men occasionally feel the same way - I honestly thought men didn't even register shirtless actors in movies...

[denise_xo]

I generally agree with Frisky on this. I've seen a male stripper once at a birthday party back when I was at uni, and there was absolutely nothing about that experience that attracted repetition. Even a revised concept of strip clubs for women would have to go without my financial contributions.

[Woggle]

Twilight movies are sort of the female equivalent to strip clubs and porn.

[thatdog]

It's hard to have legitimate strip clubs for women because women aren't generally as visual as men. Men therefore find it easier to blow of steam by just sitting in a club and watching a woman take her clothes off cos that can turn them on. Women on the other hand usually need more emotional investment to build enough attraction to be turned on the same way.

[Woggle]

I would take the same stance that I take with male strip clubs. Look but don't touch if you are involved with somebody.

[Eeyore79]

Male strippers are not sexy. When a guy strips, I am in the dominant position of control and authority, and he's submissive and is doing my bidding for money. Submissive men are totally unsexy to the majority of women, regardless of what they look like naked. A male strip show is a good laugh, but it's most definitely not a turn-on.

 

I also don't find it sexy when a man primps and preens, uses fake tan and shaves his chest, and prances around in a g-string flexing his muscles. It just seems a bit effeminate to me; I don't want a man who spends more time in front of the bathroom mirror than I do! I want a real man; someone masculine and confident and ruggedly handsome, not some girly boy who spends hours doing his hair.

[Far&Away]

Male strip clubs exist out of revenge, but have failed miserably, because MOST women if they are honest, value people and do not treat men like f^%k objects. They have more respect for them than that.

 

Society however tells men all the time through just about every medium possible that women are sex objects, that it's their right to view women that way, and that they do not have to respect them and treat them as human beings first and foremost. Sad really.

 

It isn't the same thing and never will be unless women lose more compassion and humanity and are told by society that's it's cool to do so, even expected.

 

I really hope not.

[xxoo]

It's hard to have legitimate strip clubs for women because women aren't generally as visual as men. Men therefore find it easier to blow of steam by just sitting in a club and watching a woman take her clothes off cos that can turn them on. Women on the other hand usually need more emotional investment to build enough attraction to be turned on the same way.

 

How does getting turned on help men blow off steam? Isn't it frustrating? I know when I get turned on, but have no outlet for "release", that frustrates me...

 

Male strippers are not sexy. When a guy strips, I am in the dominant position of control and authority, and he's submissive and is doing my bidding for money. Submissive men are totally unsexy to the majority of women, regardless of what they look like naked. A male strip show is a good laugh, but it's most definitely not a turn-on.

 

The bolded is true for me. If I'm dressed, and the man is naked, that is generally not a hot scenario for me. He just seems ridiculous and vulnerable with all his unprotected junk out.

 

Maybe a strip club for women would be one where hot guys pay attention to us while we strip, lol!

[pyroguy]

How does getting turned on help men blow off steam? Isn't it frustrating? I know when I get turned on, but have no outlet for "release", that frustrates me...

 

 

 

The bolded is true for me. If I'm dressed, and the man is naked, that is generally not a hot scenario for me. He just seems ridiculous and vulnerable with all his unprotected junk out.

 

Maybe a strip club for women would be one where hot guys pay attention to us while we strip, lol!

 

 

Women sell themselves short. There are lots of women that look good enough to strip for their man. You don't have to look exactly like a stripper. It's all in the atitude. unless, you don't want to strip because you don't consider your guy hot, thus not part of the fantasy?

 

Back to the OP, I just resign myself to the fact that women will always deny that it's equal:) no matter what the guy says. I play a little devils advocate here, but again, I ask, if your guy has some issues with some of what I posted about earlier, how is not equal? why would his unhappiness have less vaidity? If he told you flat out that some of these things and your participation made him feel just like you did when faced with strip clubs or porn, why would this not be the same? I'm not saying it would or should, but what if it did? Why do women think that their insecurity is valid and has no equal, despite what their man may say?

[pyroguy]

Oh, and let me add that I think some of you are making my point. No matter what the guy says, the women keep stating that no, it's not the same or equal....to YOU! but the man may think otherwise.

 

How come no ah ha moment? where women may actually listen to the man, consider his feelings without saying he's wrong and/or insecure. We are conditioned that way. Women can be insecure, men cannot, even if they have good reason. It simply is not allowed, and maybe that's why women see no equal in societal pressures and activities that may make men not feel so great about themselves and their relationship. Just a crazy thought.