Lorelei_Lane Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 I already responded but I feel I should reiterate my post, because it seems some people still don't understand. My husband's emotional affair was devastating, yeah. I won't lie about that part. But I didn't stay because I was scared, I didn't stay because I had no confidence (I didn't have any before the affair, so it doesn't matter either way). I stayed because I loved him and I wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt. He promised he would change, and although I was making arrangements to leave just in case he didn't, he delivered what he promised. He changed, he stopped his lies, became an open book with me. We relearned each other, and I fell in love with who he became, not who I thought he was. It IS possible to stay and the marriage be good. Be great even. Our marriage, aside from the financial bull crap we're facing, is wonderful. We have great communication. I'm not saying we never fight, we do, we're both hot heads, but it's not knock down drag outs like it used to be. We have our tiff, go cool off, talk about it like rational adults later. Just because someone cheats one time doesn't make them the worst person on the planet. Sometimes, it's a lapse in judgement. Not a character flaw.
alexandria35 Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 You talked about personal things that happened to your stepdad. Things between your son and his gf and what motivated her to be violent to him. I also see a LOT of posts where you 'translate' a posters narrative in to the 'truth'. i.e. "he's saying this, but this part of it is clearly a lie" and that kind of thing. It's from things I have read that she has written, her attitude on the phone, conversations she has had with her husband when she was trying to get him to stay, the way she lives her life, from talking with people who have known her a dozen years, her behaviour since he left, and all sorts of stuff... Enough to have a fairly good understanding. Not sure why it offends you, to be honest. Well I guess we could just go in circles about this. Yes I have recounted events about my stepfather and my childhood. This was MY childhood and MY stepfather. My stepfather whom I had a personal relationship with and whom lived in the same house as I did for years. And even though I have described him and some of his problems I have never, to the best of my recollection, spoken for him in regards to his thoughts, feelings and reasons. Although I lived with him for years and knew parts of him very well I don't know his reasoning behind most of his actions because he never told me. I can have an opinion but my opinions aren't fact. Same goes for my son's girlfriend. I had a personal relationship with her. Her and I were good friends for a couple of years. My son didn't love her for no reason, she had many qualities. She was fun, intelligent, loyal, and talented. Her and I became close and often spent time together without my son. I'm glad her and my son ended their relationship because I don't think it was healthy but I still think about her. Several days after she broke my sons nose she was at my place and they had an argument about the incident and she said it was because she was sick of being ignored. As for me being offended, well I wouldn't say I feel all that offended at the moment. However, I think I would certainly be offended if someone who I didn't know and who didn't know me, thought they were qualified to state, as fact, my reasons for being in my marriage. I don't understand why you don't get that. If somebody gossiped about you to your MM's wife would you be okay with her talking about you like she knew you personally and knew for a fact what your reasoning was?
Silly_Girl Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 Well I guess we could just go in circles about this. I agree. If somebody gossiped about you to your MM's wife would you be okay with her talking about you like she knew you personally and knew for a fact what your reasoning was? Well, she refused to allow me to be mentioned, yet still thinks she knows me, and my reasons for things. Doesn't bother me in the slightest. Might be some truth in what she says. Often being detached from something, being the onlooker, makes it clearer. But really she can say anything at all she likes.
crazycatlady Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 Why Stay? Because pleasure still outweighs the pain in this relationship. Because I love him. Because he loves me. Because sex is still out of this world amazing and only gets better every year. Because sexual fidelity isn't that big of a deal to me, honesty is bigger thus we could work it out. Because we have had other issues that were harder to deal with then this one and we got through them just fine. I love him. He loves me. History aside from that love, had nothing to do with it. Fear had nothing to do with it. Worry about being alone had nothing to do with it. Worry about supporting myself and kids had nothing to do with it (mainly because if I left, he got the kids and honestly that was the most tempting thing about leaving, to have single woman time again but it was only briefly tempting). It was all about the love and pleasure. Which the affair didn't kill for me.
aeh Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 I stayed because I love my husband. Initially, I also stayed because there was no way I was letting this woman come in and have my life-everything we had worked so hard for, sacrificed for, our kids, our friends, etc. I stayed because my husband had always treated me like a queen. I stayed because he was remorseful and begged and pleaded for another chance. In the end, I had a revenge affair. I'm glad I stayed and I am glad he stayed. We are very much in love. Our marriage is better than ever.
silktricks Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 I stayed for love. I loved him, but that wouldn't have been enough. I stayed because he fought for me and worked for me and showed every day in every way that he loved me and wanted me every bit as much as I loved and wanted him. I didn't stay for money, as finances are not a problem for either of us. I didn't stay for kids as they were grown and gone. I didn't stay out of fear of being alone as I've never been afraid of being alone. I like myself and my own company just fine. I didn't stay because of a lack of self-confidence, as I have a bit of an overabundance of that. If I had even once seen a breath of a possibility in any way that he pined for the AP I would have been gone in an instant. I'm glad I stayed. We have a wonderful relationship, and both of us are much happier and more satisfied in our marriage than either of us were before the affair. We communicate better and solve problems when they arise rather than attempting to ignore them. Working through the pain of the affair was very difficult. Working through what led up to the affair was also very difficult, as it was years of issues for both of us. I completely understand people who choose to make a clean break and start anew. I also completely understand people who choose to stay and work things out. I will never understand people who choose to stay but leave things as they were, never working out the problems or dealing with the issues.
Silly_Girl Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 I completely understand people who choose to make a clean break and start anew. I also completely understand people who choose to stay and work things out. I will never understand people who choose to stay but leave things as they were, never working out the problems or dealing with the issues. I agree. Very much so. I find it extremely hard to get my head around why people would stay despite knowing it is unhealthy or causes permanent unhappiness. It must take the very highest form of denial. Or laziness. Perhaps even fear. I find those situations to be tragic.
drifter777 Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 I completely understand people who choose to make a clean break and start anew. I also completely understand people who choose to stay and work things out. I will never understand people who choose to stay but leave things as they were, never working out the problems or dealing with the issues. Sounds simple but those that choose the "stay and work things out" path are in for a long struggle that may end in breakup. I can't even imagine anyone who would stay and "leave things as they were". I mean, isn't that simply indifference?
Silly_Girl Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 I can't even imagine anyone who would stay and "leave things as they were". I mean, isn't that simply indifference? People DEFINITELY do that.
silktricks Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 Sounds simple but those that choose the "stay and work things out" path are in for a long struggle that may end in breakup. I can't even imagine anyone who would stay and "leave things as they were". I mean, isn't that simply indifference? Believe me, it is anything but simple. Working things out is probably the hardest choice of the three, but was for us the most rewarding. It was a long struggle, and could easily have ended in breakup, but that's true of a new relationship as well, isn't it? There ain't no guarantees in this life, after all. As for the choice to stay and "leave things as they were", I cannot claim omniscience, so have no real idea if it is indifference or the lack of self-confidence proposed by the OP, or something else entirely. It's probably different things for different people. I only know that it's not something I could do.
HappyAtLast Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 People stay in marriages after having been betrayed for a variety of reasons. I never forgave my ex-wife, but was not going to be in the position of being a weekend father. For that reason, I stayed. And, my boys are grown up and in healthy, happy marriages of their own. I have no regrets, and very good self-esteem
jstobo Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 I stayed because leaving would have said I was perfect. I never stopped loving my Wife, but for two years I stopped showing her my love. She finally broke down and found what she needed elsewhere. When I found out about her EA, I didn't suddenly realize how much I loved her, I realized how terrible I was over the last few years showing her. We're separated, so I don't know yet if we'll divorce or stay together. But given a choice, I would stay and show her the love she deserved to be shown. I think she is realizing slowly how much I actually do love her, but she is taking it slow to make sure it is real.
datura_noir Posted April 29, 2011 Posted April 29, 2011 I stayed because I was and am still in love with my H. I moved away after DDay, and it was hard.... He thought he had love with the OW, he looked for material,spiritual and financial approval from her, and got it. But it was not meant to be. Otherwise, it would have happenned. He is hard to love, as am I, but together, we make a hell of a couple...
Steadfast Posted April 30, 2011 Posted April 30, 2011 There are a couple of points no one has made here yet...like getting 'up to speed' with the wayward spouse whose been planning a getaway for a period of time. I'd like to think I'm fairly observant, yet my ex hit me out of the blue. Looking back I can now see the signs, but everyone knows how accurate hindsight is. Mix in two jobs, a house, kids and all that comes with just surviving, and it seems unfair to blame when you're so occupied doing what you know is the right thing. Teamwork is underrated, but communication isn't. What is one supposed to do? Jump right in? Agree with everything? Twist the knife that's been jammed into the heart of your family? I say, unless you've been there, it's really hard to comment. It really is. Just because someone cheats one time doesn't make them the worst person on the planet. Sometimes, it's a lapse in judgement. Not a character flaw. That's throwing a bucket of polish on it. Still, I'm happy you made it through. If this thread is any indication, there's more survivors here than I originally thought.
Lorelei_Lane Posted April 30, 2011 Posted April 30, 2011 That's throwing a bucket of polish on it. Still, I'm happy you made it through. If this thread is any indication, there's more survivors here than I originally thought. What do you mean exactly?
Breezy Trousers Posted April 30, 2011 Posted April 30, 2011 (edited) Hi kim, I see that you are a new poster and welcome to LS! I think the lack of self-confidence/self worth of a BS is a misinformed assumption. Agree on both counts. Welcome! Our assumptions are often self-serving. We see something the way we want to see it from where we're standing. OW? Blame the BS for everything...... Never experienced infidelity (that you know of, anyway)? Blame BS as a means of saying to yourself, "It won't happen to me. If I can find fault with her, I'm smarter than her and don't have to acknowledge my own vulnerability." I've walked on both sides of the equation, so I know. Many assumptions I made 15 years ago proved to be (cultural) illusions I bought into As a BS, I stayed because my husband was good and kind to me on a daily basis for many years, never distant or abusive. I loved him when he was a "nobody," and he knew that. The affairs happened years later. The first time I learned of an OW, I blamed myself. I worked very hard to "fix" myself, even though my husband always told me the affair had nothing to do with me. (I was codependent back then!) I also naively believed it would never happen again..... The second time I showed him the door. I loved him, but I didn't deserve a serial cheater. He choose to stay and got into Sex Addicts Anonymous and began working hard on himself. Ten years later, he is still helping himself and other men. We've been in therapy, too. I recently was tempted with an affair -- didn't do it -- and my husband is helping me sort through the lessons I've learned from that. If you stay together for 22 years, as we have, it's inevitable you're going to have to experience some challenges. Some people face challenges through raising children together, others through medical or financial crisis, and still others through infidelity. Sometimes people have no choice but to end relationships over the issue, but it seems others of us are supposed to go through our lessons together. Everyone's spiritual curriculum takes different forms, which is why assumptions are futile and usually self serving assessments. Edited April 30, 2011 by Breezy Trousers
Steadfast Posted April 30, 2011 Posted April 30, 2011 That's throwing a bucket of polish on it. What do you mean exactly? I have a problem describing even a one time fling as a 'lack of judgment'. I reserve that phrase for slightly less involved practices like losing your temper, running a yellow or buying shoes you don't need. You and I both know it takes weeks, if not months for a relationship to turn sexual. Unless you're liberated/desensitized to the practice of casual sex. If that's the case, you're not likely to care much, agree? In harmony with physical abuse, nothing is more damaging to a marriage than infidelity. I see no reason to white-wash what is essentially calculated betrayal.
Lorelei_Lane Posted April 30, 2011 Posted April 30, 2011 (edited) Ah, I see what you mean now. I guess my view on what my husband did is just a bit different based on the circumstance. He had a month long, emotional affair with my "best friend". It was online only, and I caught them fairly early on because, lets face it, emotional affairs are pretty easy to spot. He was spending a lot of time talking to her, and although his attitude towards me didn't change much, it did toward her. He used to not like her and she initiated conversations in order to try to "get along" for my sake. At least that's the BS she told me. Now, I'm not saying what my husband did wasn't damaging as hell, but in the end, our marriage is a lot better than it ever could have been had this stupid affair not happened. Now, I can't say for sure if she had actually lived in our state if this affair would have went sexual, but it easily went emotional because we known her for years and it just sort of got out of hand. Again, I would never say what he did wasn't damaging as hell, but I also can't lump him into the category of a habitual cheater, either. Not based on the circumstances in our lives at the time. He and I had both lost our jobs, we were both depressed as hell, and she "brightened" his day. Like I said, he was still loving and affectionate with me, but it was like he was two people. One that was madly in love with me, and one that had fallen in love with her. When I caught them, and we talked things out after I left for two weeks, some days I was talking to the one that seemed in love with her, other days I was talking to the one that was madly in love with me and felt so stupid for what he had done. I don't think that all affairs fall under the same category. Each one is different, just like each BS is different, each WS is different, each OW is different. I would never make excuses for what he did, he has been remorseful and has been wonderful with my recovery as well. I'm pissed off? He lets me rant. I want to ask questions about ****? He answers them honestly. What he did was a stupid mistake on his part. It doesn't change the fact that it was damaging to me, to us, but it was still a mistake. That's the reason I was able to forgive him. I know, because of how close we are now, exactly when the lightbulb came on over his head about her, and when he realized she was nothing but trouble. Someone who likes to toy with men because she can. I also have to take responsibility for allowing her into my life, when I knew what kind of woman she was. My husband was and still is adamant that nothing about his affair was my fault, but letting her stay in my life when I knew what kind of person she was IS my fault. I had watched her, many times, cheat on her boyfriend, lead guys on and generally bathe in male attention. That's just who she is. The attention from men is what fuels her, gives her confidence. My husband has realized, with her actions after the affair, and the NC, that's all she was using him for. She made it a point during the NC until I flipped out on her, to only tell me she missed me. She ignored him otherwise, it was like he didn't exist to her. As her friend, I saw her do that to many men. I'm angry at her most of the time, but I find that lately, I pity her. She will never know the real joy of just one person being your knight in shining armor. She will never have female friends, or if she does, they will never let her get close once they see the kind of person she is. My husband has made up for what he does, he still continues to do so. It was a one time lack of judgement. Not everyone is a bad person. Edited April 30, 2011 by Lorelei_Lane
Pillow Posted May 3, 2011 Posted May 3, 2011 Not to bash the BS but one of the things I have noticed is that during reconciliation all the BS talks about is how great and remorseful and sad and forgiving and human their WS is and then when divorce hits, it's all about how WS is conniving, manipulative, narcisstic etc. So, it seems to me the BS comments for why they should or should not stay can be a little self-serving, if not naive.
bentnotbroken Posted May 3, 2011 Posted May 3, 2011 Not to bash the BS but one of the things I have noticed is that during reconciliation all the BS talks about is how great and remorseful and sad and forgiving and human their WS is and then when divorce hits, it's all about how WS is conniving, manipulative, narcisstic etc. So, it seems to me the BS comments for why they should or should not stay can be a little self-serving, if not naive. Is that in general or do you have specifics in mind?
John Michael Kane Posted May 3, 2011 Posted May 3, 2011 Not to bash the BS but one of the things I have noticed is that during reconciliation all the BS talks about is how great and remorseful and sad and forgiving and human their WS is and then when divorce hits, it's all about how WS is conniving, manipulative, narcisstic etc. So, it seems to me the BS comments for why they should or should not stay can be a little self-serving, if not naive. Yet who cheated in the end.
tami-chan Posted May 3, 2011 Posted May 3, 2011 Not to bash the BS but one of the things I have noticed is that during reconciliation all the BS talks about is how great and remorseful and sad and forgiving and human their WS is and then when divorce hits, it's all about how WS is conniving, manipulative, narcisstic etc. So, it seems to me the BS comments for why they should or should not stay can be a little self-serving, if not naive. As opposed to "a little altruistic"? . I think altruism is not natural for human beings. Everything we do is self-serving to some degree. Nothing wrong with that.
Lorelei_Lane Posted May 3, 2011 Posted May 3, 2011 Not to bash the BS but one of the things I have noticed is that during reconciliation all the BS talks about is how great and remorseful and sad and forgiving and human their WS is and then when divorce hits, it's all about how WS is conniving, manipulative, narcisstic etc. So, it seems to me the BS comments for why they should or should not stay can be a little self-serving, if not naive. You're talking about two different types of BS. Those that try to work it out, and it fails, and those that DO work it out with success. My husband is wonderful and forgiving. We HAVE worked it out. There is nothing else to fix in the relationship (just me and my issues of hating the OW). We have moved past the affair and onto the next problem in our lives. We work together on things now, what we never did before. There are BS that do change their mind and end up hating the WS, ending in divorce, but a lot of those comments were because they were deceived. The WS still had affairs, etc. I don't like it when people try to lump everything into one category. Not all BS are the same, not all WS are the same and not all OW/OM are the same. I can't say this enough.
Memphis Raines Posted May 3, 2011 Posted May 3, 2011 How does one "honestly posed" a question like this? posed because they are truly curious, as opposed to posting it to take a jab at betrayed wives.
Memphis Raines Posted May 3, 2011 Posted May 3, 2011 this is for the people that want to truly know, not for kimmy. I pondered staying. And if I would have it would have been for 3 reasons. money, not wanting to go through a divorce, and so my kids home didn't get uprooted. in the end, I decided I didn't care about the money, I'll take the pain of a short term divorce for longer term happiness, and as to my kids, I realized that I didn't do this to them. She did. and in the end, the finances recover, the divorce only lasts so long, and the kids will be fine, as mine are.
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