Schizophrenia

[HeartShineGirl]

I have a friend that I believe has Schizophrenia. I am very concerned for her and her husband and children. She's also developed a very fond love of alcohol (to put it nicely) and this is what I believe led to the development or triggered the Schizophrenia.

Her husband and children are being patient, but daily they see her cry and see her mood swings.

I am in another state, she is a 6 hour airplane trip from me, so I can't just rush over to help. I've known her since we were children, and she was for over 22 years my very best friend in the world. However, that started to fall apart about 5 years ago when she started thinking that I was out to get her.

These days we talk, and it's a lot more apparent that there is something wrong. She thinks someone has done "this" to her. She hears voices telling her that she's a bad person or tells her off with curse words. She thinks the TV, the internet and everything electrical is controlling her. She doesn't believe I'm real when I chat to her online every day and on the phone. She just doesn't "Know what to believe anymore" (her words). She says that people are talking about her. Not directly but if she goes where others are they are talking about her. She says "Someone is trying to change me" and she cries and cries all day long that someone is doing it to her. We all have told her over and over that we love her, that we care, that we want her to be happy again and to see a doctor. I've told her myself what I thought she had and told her that medications can help and she's accused me of using reverse psychology on her to hurt her. She thinks I'm out to get her and then she screams at me that she's not crazy in type (I'M NOT CRAZY) she says when we chat. Our conversations are a bit strange. One time she thought her husband was with me, playing tricks on her, because he was a little late coming home from work. I explained that it would be impossible for him to get from the state they live in to the one I am in in such a short time and she said "There's always the internet" as if you can time travel through that. I really care about her and I really want her to get some help. I am not trying to hurt her, but she thinks I am, and I can't get through to her. No one can. Her husband says she will not go to the doctors, she refuses. I realize it's against the law to force anyone with a mental illness to get any kind of help, and if she refuses treatment there is nothing we can do. She has threatened to kill herself too. I'm so worried and I just want her to get some help. Can anyone please tell me what can we do if anything to get her evaluated, and hopefully treated so that she can lead a happy normal life again?

[DreamerGirl27]

I have a friend that I believe has Schizophrenia. I am very concerned for her and her husband and children. She's also developed a very fond love of alcohol (to put it nicely) and this is what I believe led to the development or triggered the Schizophrenia.

Her husband and children are being patient, but daily they see her cry and see her mood swings.

 

I am in another state, she is a 6 hour airplane trip from me, so I can't just rush over to help. I've known her since we were children, and she was for over 22 years my very best friend in the world. However, that started to fall apart about 5 years ago when she started thinking that I was out to get her.

These days we talk, and it's a lot more apparent that there is something wrong. She thinks someone has done "this" to her. She hears voices telling her that she's a bad person or tells her off with curse words. She thinks the TV, the internet and everything electrical is controlling her. She doesn't believe I'm real when I chat to her online every day and on the phone. She just doesn't "Know what to believe anymore" (her words). She says that people are talking about her. Not directly but if she goes where others are they are talking about her.

 

She says "Someone is trying to change me" and she cries and cries all day long that someone is doing it to her. We all have told her over and over that we love her, that we care, that we want her to be happy again and to see a doctor. I've told her myself what I thought she had and told her that medications can help and she's accused me of using reverse psychology on her to hurt her. She thinks I'm out to get her and then she screams at me that she's not crazy in type (I'M NOT CRAZY) she says when we chat. Our conversations are a bit strange. One time she thought her husband was with me, playing tricks on her, because he was a little late coming home from work.

 

I explained that it would be impossible for him to get from the state they live in to the one I am in in such a short time and she said "There's always the internet" as if you can time travel through that. I really care about her and I really want her to get some help. I am not trying to hurt her, but she thinks I am, and I can't get through to her. No one can. Her husband says she will not go to the doctors, she refuses. I realize it's against the law to force anyone with a mental illness to get any kind of help, and if she refuses treatment there is nothing we can do. She has threatened to kill herself too. I'm so worried and I just want her to get some help. Can anyone please tell me what can we do if anything to get her evaluated, and hopefully treated so that she can lead a happy normal life again?

 

It is not against the law to force someone with a mental illness to get help, if 1) they are a danger to others or 2) they are a danger to themselves.

 

If she has threatened to kill herself or is ever suicidal, you can petition her into an involuntary mental hospital, but you have to do it then, not later.

[betterdeal]

Blimey. That must be upsetting for you. I think this is a good resource for this situation:

 

http://www.schizophrenia.com/family/FAQgen.htm#whattodo

[HeartShineGirl]

I like your signature.

[Vesna]

I know how difficult this must be for you. It sounds like she has psychosis and she is in total denial of it. Is it possible for you to talk alone with her husband about it and get him to take her to a doctor?

[whichwayisup]

Actually, he can have her committed, or atleast assessed for 72 hours if he feels the kids are at danger, or she is dangering herself. He needs to talk to a lawyer and also do research on finding her a counsellor. she needs to be on meds.

[betterdeal]

I like your signature.

 

Thanks! That link I gave gives lots of solid advice on how to handle this situation. I suggest you pass it onto her husband.

[HeartShineGirl]

I know how difficult this must be for you. It sounds like she has psychosis and she is in total denial of it. Is it possible for you to talk alone with her husband about it and get him to take her to a doctor?

 

He's tried, she wont go. She keeps saying she's not going to let anyone change her. She thinks if she goes to a doctor they will tell her she has to stop drinking and take her kids away. I know that they will tell her she should stop drinking so much but they are not going to take her kids away. She is just unaware that the problem she has really is a chemical problem in her mind, she honestly believes that everyone, including her husband is out to get her, and she doesn't trust doctors.

 

I feel like there has to be some way to get her to talk to a psychiatrist but the thing is, when you have this kind of problem you even think your own family are out to get you, she is having major trust issues with believing that any of us are really trying to help her.

[HeartShineGirl]

Actually, he can have her committed, or atleast assessed for 72 hours if he feels the kids are at danger, or she is dangering herself. He needs to talk to a lawyer and also do research on finding her a counsellor. she needs to be on meds.

 

I agree. But she hasn't hurt anyone yet, or threatened anyone, she has told me that she was gonna kill herself but she's never even cut her wrist or done anything that a doctor can use as proof to have her put in a 72 hour watch.

 

If the day comes that she does attempt it, then yes... they can do that. I'm just scared to death she will actually be successful that very first attempt since she wants to use pills and alcohol to do it. It's so sad, really. I wish the laws were different that way people who do need help could get it because sometimes these people have no idea they really need it they're so far gone and so sure the world is out to get them.

[HeartShineGirl]

Thanks! That link I gave gives lots of solid advice on how to handle this situation. I suggest you pass it onto her husband.

 

 

Thank you, I will.

[Feelin Frisky]

My sympathies in having to face this. What you describe sounds like classic paranoiac schizophrenia. And it's so typical for people so afflicted to deny that they have a problem. You may just have to let go. I recommend doing what you can to help everyone stay safe in this situation but then just draw a line and stick to it. The afflicted person has to want to recover and pressure often causes them to be even more resolute in their denial. Good luck and be careful.

[jonpeter001]

Diagnostic Features This disorder, at some point in the illness, involves a psychotic phase (with delusions, hallucinations, or grossly bizarre/disorganized speech and behavior). This psychotic phase must last for at least one month (or less if successfully treated). Schizophrenia also causes impairment in social or vocational functioning which must last for at least 6 months. The psychotic phase is not due to a medical condition, medication, or illegal drug.

Complications Individuals with this disorder may develop significant loss of interest or pleasure. Likewise, some may develop mood abnormalities (e.g., inappropriate smiling, laughing, or silly facial expressions; depression, anxiety or anger). Often there is day-night reversal (i.e., staying up late at night and then sleeping late into the day). The individual may show a lack of interest in eating or may refuse food as a consequence of delusional beliefs. Often movement is abnormal (e.g., pacing, rocking, or apathetic immobility).

[pie2]

You seem like a really great friend for sticking by her side, and looking for a solution. It must be pretty scary seeing a loved one descend into these delusions.

 

I think the symptoms your friend is displaying could be a sign of Delusional Disorder rather than Schizophrenia...

 

“The essential feature of Delusional Disorder is the presence of one or more non-bizarre delusions that persist for at least 1 month.” (4th ed., text rev.; DSM-IV-TR; American Psychiatric Association, 2000, p. 323) Bizarreness is mostly subjective since it is contingent on socio-cultural norms and expectations. Bizarre delusions (as in schizophrenia) are “clearly implausible, not understandable, and not derived from ordinary life experiences.” (4th ed., text rev.; DSM-IV-TR; American Psychiatric Association, 2000, p. 324) In contrast, non-bizarre delusions (as in delusional disorder) involve situations that could conceivably happen in real life… like being followed, poisoned, etc. Subtypes of delusional disorder are categorized based on the content of the delusions or the theme thereof. They include erotomanic, grandiose, jealous, persecutory, somatic, mixed, and unspecified types.

 

http://try-therapy.com/2010/09/03/paranoid-schizophrenia/

[Taramere]

I really want her to get some help. I am not trying to hurt her, but she thinks I am, and I can't get through to her. No one can. Her husband says she will not go to the doctors, she refuses. I realize it's against the law to force anyone with a mental illness to get any kind of help, and if she refuses treatment there is nothing we can do. She has threatened to kill herself too. I'm so worried and I just want her to get some help. Can anyone please tell me what can we do if anything to get her evaluated, and hopefully treated so that she can lead a happy normal life again?

 

I'm not an expert in psychiatric illnesses, but I've represented clients in mental health tribunals quite often - so I know the difficulties in trying to communicate with people who have these difficulties. It's the norm (if that's the right word) for people who have a severe psychiatric disorder to believe there's nothing wrong...and that others are out to get them. Because they're resistant to believing that anything is wrong, sometimes they'll tend not to get treatment until a serious incident occurs. A suicide attempt is a frequent one. You can't keep a person locked in a mental health ward purely because they don't want to live, but if the suicidal desire is combined with a psychiatric disorder and accompanying delusions/irrationality, then you can.

 

So things like suicide attempts, attacking others, wandering the streets in a dressing gown and being picked up by police will often get the authorities involved. Often the contact with the police will happen at the initiative of the person themselves, when they report their delusions to the authorities as matters which require police/secret service agency investigation (though they'll commonly view the authorities as part of a conspiracy behind the delusions). In this case, taking the matter to the attention of the authorities is simple, and it's also necessary. She has children, and therefore you should be contacting your local social services department. Ask to speak to a child protection worker and alert them to your concerns about her health in case the delusions reach a point where the children are seriously at risk.

 

Reading up about some of the psychiatric disorders people have listed here might help you to identify the most concerning aspects of her behaviour that you can then pass on details about to her local community mental health team (ask to speak to a duty worker). That way you've covered both bases - ie her condition, and the safety of the children. If she's deemed to be at/posing serious risk then she might need to spend time in hospital. Nothing you've said gives me the sense that that's a likely outcome. While her behaviour will be alarming to friends and family, in the context of how people with psychiatric disorders can behave it actually sounds pretty mild. So far, at least. That said, involving the authorities might be a trigger for her symptoms to worsen.

 

If you really don't want your friend to know that you've alerted the authorities to the problem, then make the calls anonymously. When all's said and done, her husband probably won't if it's left to him. Or at least not until it goes so far that she or somebody else gets hurt (with one client I had several years back, it wasn't until she tried to set fire to the house, with the entire family in it, that the father alerted the authorities). Better to alert professionals at this stage where it still all sounds quite mild...even if it doesn't seem very mild to you.

 

It's not like depression, anxiety or other common mental health problems. You can't reason with somebody who is suffering from delusions and irrationality as a result of an illness. A psychiatric disorder needs proper treatment and medication.

Edited July 26, 2011 by Taramere

[HeartShineGirl]

I'm not an expert in psychiatric illnesses, but I've represented clients in mental health tribunals quite often - so I know the difficulties in trying to communicate with people who have these difficulties. It's the norm (if that's the right word) for people who have a severe psychiatric disorder to believe there's nothing wrong...and that others are out to get them. Because they're resistant to believing that anything is wrong, sometimes they'll tend not to get treatment until a serious incident occurs. A suicide attempt is a frequent one. You can't keep a person locked in a mental health ward purely because they don't want to live, but if the suicidal desire is combined with a psychiatric disorder and accompanying delusions/irrationality, then you can.

 

So things like suicide attempts, attacking others, wandering the streets in a dressing gown and being picked up by police will often get the authorities involved. Often the contact with the police will happen at the initiative of the person themselves, when they report their delusions to the authorities as matters which require police/secret service agency investigation (though they'll commonly view the authorities as part of a conspiracy behind the delusions). In this case, taking the matter to the attention of the authorities is simple, and it's also necessary. She has children, and therefore you should be contacting your local social services department. Ask to speak to a child protection worker and alert them to your concerns about her health in case the delusions reach a point where the children are seriously at risk.

 

Reading up about some of the psychiatric disorders people have listed here might help you to identify the most concerning aspects of her behaviour that you can then pass on details about to her local community mental health team (ask to speak to a duty worker). That way you've covered both bases - ie her condition, and the safety of the children. If she's deemed to be at/posing serious risk then she might need to spend time in hospital. Nothing you've said gives me the sense that that's a likely outcome. While her behaviour will be alarming to friends and family, in the context of how people with psychiatric disorders can behave it actually sounds pretty mild. So far, at least. That said, involving the authorities might be a trigger for her symptoms to worsen.

 

If you really don't want your friend to know that you've alerted the authorities to the problem, then make the calls anonymously. When all's said and done, her husband probably won't if it's left to him. Or at least not until it goes so far that she or somebody else gets hurt (with one client I had several years back, it wasn't until she tried to set fire to the house, with the entire family in it, that the father alerted the authorities). Better to alert professionals at this stage where it still all sounds quite mild...even if it doesn't seem very mild to you.

 

It's not like depression, anxiety or other common mental health problems. You can't reason with somebody who is suffering from delusions and irrationality as a result of an illness. A psychiatric disorder needs proper treatment and medication.

 

Yes, I think it is mild, you are right. However, it is really affecting her.

She used to be so fun and laughing and happy all of the time. She's nothing like she once was. It's so sad. I just miss the old version of her, the one before. These days she wont leave the house, she even said that she can no longer drive a car. She stays in the house and has mixed feelings about the activities that she does. She wants to do certain things, but it is those certain things that make her episodes of paranoia flare, like watching tv or going on the internet. She drinks what I consider to be a lot of alcohol, even though she says not... I think it is. It's daily, and it's heavy enough to make her speech slurred and to make it quite hard to understand her when she's had her fill.

Since I'm not in the same state as her, I'm hoping that people that are there with her take care to watch and care for her. Her husband, kids and in-laws. I've decided to back off from her since she is no longer my best friend, and has not been in a long time. Besides that, she believes I may be one of the causes of it all, since she thinks it is someone doing this to her, and she really believes it might be me. Therefore, I have decided backing away may actually help. Thanks for advice.