Once a slut, always a slut?

[TheLawmaker]

You made a valid point, steka.

 

A lot of people, men and women, sleep with other people just because they can. They never think about whether they should!

 

As a 28 year old virgin, I get a lot of weird remarks when I mention it. "Oh, you must be gay...oh, you must be asexual...oh, you must have something wrong with you..." As if someone who has slept with tons of people by age 28 don't have something wrong with them?!?!?!

 

I'm not including the people who get married, settle down, and have kids. I'm talking about the people who jump from relationship to relationship as if it's life or death!

 

Every religion out there has stated that sex outside of marriage is bad. Every parent doesn't want their kids to have sex until they're in college...hmm, why? Maybe, because sex has responsibility, and you shouldn't enter into it lightly?

 

I know people are going to criticize me for this post, but if sluts are so bad, why are virgins also considered as bad? Maybe because this society is messed up?

[stepka]

You made a valid point, steka.

 

A lot of people, men and women, sleep with other people just because they can. They never think about whether they should!

 

As a 28 year old virgin, I get a lot of weird remarks when I mention it. "Oh, you must be gay...oh, you must be asexual...oh, you must have something wrong with you..." As if someone who has slept with tons of people by age 28 don't have something wrong with them?!?!?!

 

I'm not including the people who get married, settle down, and have kids. I'm talking about the people who jump from relationship to relationship as if it's life or death!

 

Every religion out there has stated that sex outside of marriage is bad. Every parent doesn't want their kids to have sex until they're in college...hmm, why? Maybe, because sex has responsibility, and you shouldn't enter into it lightly?

 

I know people are going to criticize me for this post, but if sluts are so bad, why are virgins also considered as bad? Maybe because this society is messed up?

 

You'll get no criticism from me because I have a lot of respect for people who remain virgins till marriage. You have a greater likelihood of marrying a virgin yourself, for one thing, and a greater likelihood of having a happy marriage. And when you and she do get between the sheets on your wedding night, well call the fire dept, because it's going to be sizzling. And therein is the greatest harm in being indiscriminate--they/we never had to wait for it and long for her kiss and all that romantic stuff. They/we totally missed the romance and I'm guessing that's the best part. Nope, my argument here is men who benefitted from the sexual revolution and now they want to marry a virgin. Dream on. (and it really doesn't count if you didn't benefit from the sexual revolution due to lack of opportunity, but you would have if you could have. That's like a 90 yo judging young people for doing things that he can't do anymore)

 

And yeah, the truest thing you said is that society is messed up. But that's always been true--just in differing ways.

[Sanman]

Here's another thought for y'all, men and women. America is full of obese people--we have the highest rate of obesity in the world. The number of overweight people greatly outnumbers the number of normal weight people to the point that normal weight people often get accused of being anorexic. But, the interesting thing is that true gluttony is actually a rare condition. Most of us eat too much because we can. It's there all around us, constantly calling to us to partake of the feast, and we're always trying to diet. Well promiscuity is similar in many ways. A small percentage women are true sluts. The greater number of women who have behaved in a loose manner in the past did so because it was just too easy to be easy and like big burgers advertised on TV, they were fed the message that they could bang like men. They discovered it to be a lie and suffered from emotional damage from trying to be like men. But, once you've left that behind, you're not eager to return to it.

 

I agree with the analogy and was going to use it in the opposite direction. While there may be fewer compulsive gluttons or binge eaters, even casually eating to excess and being overweight/obese is unhealthy. Those with greater access to food need to develop the skills to discipline themselves and eat in a healthy manner, while those who may be starving are free to eat what they can get their hands on. Much like with food, some reform have that discipline, a few make mistakes and learn that discipline/lose the weight, and many continue to struggle with weight all their life, make excuses, and believe that medication will make up for their lack of self control.

[thatone]

I don't get it. Why would a woman go back to an unhealthy lifestyle, if she has support and health?

 

ask them. i grew up around a divorce attorney, watched them walk in off the street in droves.

 

as for the support, they can take that with them.

[Ouroboros]

Sluts? Yes, please. Yum yum yum I'd like sum.

[stepka]

ask them. i grew up around a divorce attorney, watched them walk in off the street in droves.

 

as for the support, they can take that with them.

 

Sure and every one of those "poor guys" is 100% innocent. I still don't think cheating is justified but those men were probably doing things they shouldn't have either.

[Woggle]

Sure and every one of those "poor guys" is 100% innocent. I still don't think cheating is justified but those men were probably doing things they shouldn't have either.

 

Why is the man always to blame no matter what? This is what angers men so much. It's the idea that no matter what a woman does or how she treats a man that it must somehow still be his fault. Why is it so hard to accept that there are good guys who get screwed? This idea that the man must always be at fault is what really makes men bitter.

[ASG]

Why is the man always to blame no matter what? This is what angers men so much. It's the idea that no matter what a woman does or how she treats a man that it must somehow still be his fault. Why is it so hard to accept that there are good guys who get screwed? This idea that the man must always be at fault is what really makes men bitter.

 

No, but saying that every woman who has ever slept with more than the one or two guys is gonna cheat. after she has kids, it's pretty out there, as well!

 

Some women are bitches just like some men are jerks. Usually though, the fault is split 50/50.

[Woggle]

No, but saying that every woman who has ever slept with more than the one or two guys is gonna cheat. after she has kids, it's pretty out there, as well!

 

Some women are bitches just like some men are jerks. Usually though, the fault is split 50/50.

 

I don't agree with that either but this idea that a man is always to blame for anything a woman does to him is what turns men into these bitter guys who look for any sign that a woman is going to cheat. How else does a man prevent ending up in a marriage where a woman does exactly that? I don't think that women in this thread understand how paranoid many men are of ending up like that.

[ASG]

I don't agree with that either but this idea that a man is always to blame for anything a woman does to him is what turns men into these bitter guys who look for any sign that a woman is going to cheat. How else does a man prevent ending up in a marriage where a woman does exactly that? I don't think that women in this thread understand how paranoid many men are of ending up like that.

 

I don't agree with that either. Men treat women badly just as women treat men badly! It goes both ways and if you cheat, you can't blame it on the other person!

 

But I have to stand up for the "sluts" out there. I've NEVER cheated. Sure, the "if I were single" thought may cross my mind, but I'm sure a lot of men think the same and don't act on it.

[Woggle]

I don't agree with that either. Men treat women badly just as women treat men badly! It goes both ways and if you cheat, you can't blame it on the other person!

 

But I have to stand up for the "sluts" out there. I've NEVER cheated. Sure, the "if I were single" thought may cross my mind, but I'm sure a lot of men think the same and don't act on it.

 

I understand that but men are standing up for those who gave a woman with a past a chance and ended up getting royally screwed over. I think pretty much every man has a story like that. I don't agree with what most of the men in this thread are saying but I wish there was a little bit more empathy for where it comes from. They are not just taking this stance so they can be sexist for the sake of being sexist.

[thatone]

Why is the man always to blame no matter what? This is what angers men so much. It's the idea that no matter what a woman does or how she treats a man that it must somehow still be his fault. Why is it so hard to accept that there are good guys who get screwed? This idea that the man must always be at fault is what really makes men bitter.

 

all they have to do is justify in their own minds that what they're doing is ok.

 

that's where those out of the blue divorces came from. stereotypical divorce that the attorney friend of mine saw from women...

 

a) man/woman married in their 20s/early 30s, had kids soon after marriage.

b) as soon as kids are in school woman gets bored, because man is working 60 hour weeks to pay for all of their sh*t

c) woman goes on six month spending binge of clothes, hair, makeup, plastic surgery, etc.

d) woman files for divorce, drops kids off at her parents' house, goes back to dating

 

and they justify it by saying "they never cheated on him" they just demanded divorce out of the blue so it's "ok".

 

this was in a small, religious town. there was rarely any proven cheating going on in the divorces that women initiated in the above way. the men were typically happy about the fact that the women were getting back in shape after having kids and taking more pride in their appearance, actually, right up until the day they got served with the papers.

[Woggle]

I bet these guys still had to pay for all her stuff after the divorce as well.

[stepka]

Why is the man always to blame no matter what? This is what angers men so much. It's the idea that no matter what a woman does or how she treats a man that it must somehow still be his fault. Why is it so hard to accept that there are good guys who get screwed? This idea that the man must always be at fault is what really makes men bitter.

 

Woggle I did not say that the man is to blame no matter what. I agree with the poster who said that it goes 50/50. We all screw each other over, but often in different ways. If you go back and read what I said, I was being sarcastic about the viewpoint that in 100% of the cases, the woman was to blame. I have no doubt that good guys get screwed all the time, but I wish you would realize that at least half the time the women get screwed too.

 

I did not think that the woman of my acquaintance who had an affair did the right thing. I said it was no excuse. But! I am very well aware of the fact that she has no respect for her husband. Take that how you wish--many times men deserve much more respect than they get, but if you're looking to affair-proof a relationship, it's a thing to keep in mind. Just because I mentioned it does not mean that I think it's ok. My own opinion is that if it gets that bad, she should break it off--but then we get a version of thatone's scenario. Sometimes people fall out of love with each other and don't try hard enough to make it work and I don't know what to say to that, b/c I did try very hard to make my marriage work and it was no use.

[stepka]

Percentage of marriages where one or both spouses admit to infidelity, either physical or emotional: 41%

 

Percentage of men who admit to committing infidelity in any relationship they've had: 57%

 

Percentage of women who admit to committing infidelity in any relationship they've had: 54%

 

From: http://www.infidelityfacts.com/infidelity-statistics.html

 

So, the numbers aren't much different for men or for women. But here's the thing: if it's so much easier for women to find sex than it is for men, my guess is that more men are seeking to be unfaithful. Turns out we're not all so horrible after all. These are not marriage statistics though.

[Queen Zenobia]

From: http://www.infidelityfacts.com/infidelity-statistics.html

 

So, the numbers aren't much different for men or for women. But here's the thing: if it's so much easier for women to find sex than it is for men, my guess is that more men are seeking to be unfaithful. Turns out we're not all so horrible after all. These are not marriage statistics though.

 

Well I think part of the problem is that some of these guys get married without truly being happy with their partner, thinking they can't get anyone else so they might as well "settle". So then a few years later when they get more comfortable and secure in their relationship they get some confidence and then women start noticing them, thus creating opportunities to cheat.

 

The only way around this of course is to make sure you marry someone who has options and isn't marrying you because you're the first/only woman to give him any attention. Of course I know the more inexperienced male members of this forum might not like hearing that, but it is what it is.

[Woggle]

Just because she has no respect for husband does not make it right. Men who cheat on their wives have no respect for them either.

[Sanman]

Well I think part of the problem is that some of these guys get married without truly being happy with their partner, thinking they can't get anyone else so they might as well "settle". So then a few years later when they get more comfortable and secure in their relationship they get some confidence and then women start noticing them, thus creating opportunities to cheat.

 

The only way around this of course is to make sure you marry someone who has options and isn't marrying you because you're the first/only woman to give him any attention. Of course I know the more inexperienced male members of this forum might not like hearing that, but it is what it is.

 

I think that this goes both ways as there are women who will marry the first guy that meets their criteria and they believe is a good man, can support them, or a variety of other reasons. Changes and transitional processes related to aging or life can also affect this (he got bald and fat; she never lost the pregnancy weight again). There are many people who have other options who like to avail themselves of both (the secretary/gardener/pool boy to something pretty to sleep with and the spouse for support). What happens when you don't look good anymore and your partner still has those good looking options? While there may be no definitive way to do this, you do need to take the time to judge the character of the person you are with and determine if they are the type of person who will stick with you and grow with you in a healthy long-term relationship. Which brings us right back around to being judged for your decisions....

[Queen Zenobia]

I think that this goes both ways as there are women who will marry the first guy that meets their criteria and they believe is a good man, can support them, or a variety of other reasons. Changes and transitional processes related to aging or life can also affect this (he got bald and fat; she never lost the pregnancy weight again). There are many people who have other options who like to avail themselves of both (the secretary/gardener/pool boy to something pretty to sleep with and the spouse for support). What happens when you don't look good anymore and your partner still has those good looking options? While there may be no definitive way to do this, you do need to take the time to judge the character of the person you are with and determine if they are the type of person who will stick with you and grow with you in a healthy long-term relationship. Which brings us right back around to being judged for your decisions....

 

Oh absolutely it goes both ways, I was merely responding to a specific post. Both parties need to be on the same page in many respects before they decide to get married. I have no sympathy for people who think they can just play the field and then settle down with someone who's as pure as the freshly fallen snow.

[TheLawmaker]

Men want sluts, but ones that will be their slut.

[Sanman]

Oh absolutely it goes both ways, I was merely responding to a specific post. Both parties need to be on the same page in many respects before they decide to get married. I have no sympathy for people who think they can just play the field and then settle down with someone who's as pure as the freshly fallen snow.

 

 

Agreed! Though, there is not simple answer to picking the right partner. I do believe that basing these choices largely on more enduring qualities (personality, sense of humor, generosity) rather than those that eventually fade or are not a given (looks, money) is important for both parties with they want to give themselves the best chance at success in the long term. Not to say that sex appeal and financial stability are not important, but I would venture to guess that relationships based primarily on these attributes fade as the attributes do.

[thatone]

Well I think part of the problem is that some of these guys get married without truly being happy with their partner, thinking they can't get anyone else so they might as well "settle". So then a few years later when they get more comfortable and secure in their relationship they get some confidence and then women start noticing them, thus creating opportunities to cheat.

 

The only way around this of course is to make sure you marry someone who has options and isn't marrying you because you're the first/only woman to give him any attention. Of course I know the more inexperienced male members of this forum might not like hearing that, but it is what it is.

 

i agree completely. if anything it seems that younger men get attached to women far easier than younger women get attached to men.

 

and unless those men have a bit of confidence to start with, they are easily 'caught' by the first woman to show interest. after all, it's work to approach women, arrange dates, initiate contact all the time, etc. and there's not likely going to be any woman to chase you as a man. when you get tired of the game and decide to take a break, you're just gonna sleep alone for awhile.

 

i would say it's a fair assumption that men who are not 100% self sufficient will wind up with bad women.

[stepka]

Just because she has no respect for husband does not make it right. Men who cheat on their wives have no respect for them either.

 

I said that Woggle. More than once.

[stepka]

i agree completely. if anything it seems that younger men get attached to women far easier than younger women get attached to men.

 

and unless those men have a bit of confidence to start with, they are easily 'caught' by the first woman to show interest. after all, it's work to approach women, arrange dates, initiate contact all the time, etc. and there's not likely going to be any woman to chase you as a man. when you get tired of the game and decide to take a break, you're just gonna sleep alone for awhile.

 

i would say it's a fair assumption that men who are not 100% self sufficient will wind up with bad women.

 

The bolded part is the part that goes both ways. Because if a woman doesn't want to be a slut, she's going to be sleeping alone for awhile too. What's really depressing is when you reach a certain age and realize that you might be sleeping alone for the rest of your life unless you crack and go pick someone up. When I was in Egypt a few years ago I had a couple of men approach me at different times and offer to do it for baksheesh and believe me, that felt strange.

 

And you guys might get tired of doing all the work but sometimes we get tired of waiting too. And trying to figure out how to encourage you and how to get the point across that we're interested w/o making a fool out of ourself. And when I was younger it was figuring out how to let a man know I wasn't interested without being hurtful, which can be hard sometimes. Dating is no piece of cake for any of us.

[Houndsoflove]

So women having and acting on their humanistic sexual desires is still this controversial?

 

everyone chill out and accept the fact that women will do things for themselves. they don't need to keep themselves "pure" for their imaginary prince charming(which i'm guessing most of the males in this thread imagine themselves to be).

 

also, not all women/people have sex because they have personality disorders or because their mommy/daddy issues, it's called having a sex drive. Why do women masturbate? because we're damn horny.